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Why can't we all just jerk off and be happy? 
You'll find a girl eventually, no need to rush it. Most of the PUA guys admit it's not good for building relationships. You don't need any "tricks" to get into a serious relationship other than the obvious "just be yourself".
If your only concern is to satisfy that immediate need to cum on something, then there are many websites that will provide you that for free in 3 or 5min. Do that once or twice a day and you'll never worry about picking up women and can then focus on doing better stuff on your life ^^
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On June 03 2011 04:19 Delerium wrote:I'm sure if you tell a girl "You don't have free will, and neither do I, and I'm going to use psychology to get you to sleep with me tonight" it will have fine results Show nested quote +
I'm just good at quickly and accurately judging the type of troll.
It's a necessary skill in life imo.
true dat, boo
How confident are you that you won't get results with that? Sounds like a winner to me.
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On June 03 2011 04:19 Delerium wrote:I'm sure if you tell a girl "You don't have free will, and neither do I, and I'm going to use psychology to get you to sleep with me tonight" it will have fine results Show nested quote +
I'm just good at quickly and accurately judging the type of troll.
It's a necessary skill in life imo.
true dat, boo
surprisingly enough, you could probably deliver that line and have great results.
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On June 03 2011 04:44 scorch- wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2011 04:19 Delerium wrote:I'm sure if you tell a girl "You don't have free will, and neither do I, and I'm going to use psychology to get you to sleep with me tonight" it will have fine results
I'm just good at quickly and accurately judging the type of troll.
It's a necessary skill in life imo.
true dat, boo How confident are you that you won't get results with that? Sounds like a winner to me.
the best lines are the ones that sound the shittiest upon reflection, the worst lines the ones you think about and never deliver.
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As someone who struggled with success with women due to lack of confidence and focusing on school/sports success for most of my younger years I eventually happened upon the PUA community in college. After trying and seeing what they offered I realized they are mostly fucked up in the head.
Through other means in life I have become far more alpha and successful/confident than I ever would have become if I stayed on the PUA path. It is a facade in every since of the word. The PUAs try to mimic what it means to become an alpha male when they go out at night but never actually become anything substantial in their every day life. They then get stuck in this mindset that girls are a video game that needs to be cracked and try to press all the right buttons to do so but it isn't really their actual personality that is pressing those buttons. They are basically actors.
A much more fulfilling way to go about this journey is to first improve yourself as a man. If you mature and become more outgoing, better dressed, more successful in your job and stay well-groomed. You will eventually be ready to start winning over the type of women that you feel you deserve and are on your level. PUA is popular because it is a quick-fix and actually fixing yourself is much harder. However, I will argue that fixing yourself is the much more rewarding and confidence-instilling experience 100% of the time.
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On June 03 2011 04:39 W2 wrote:
Guys just be yourself, there's girls for everyone, you don't have to memorize a script and wear makeup and piercings. Getting to know girls isn't something that a guy should put extra effort into doing. Plus it's also more satisfying when girls come to you because of who you are, not what books you read or tutorials you viewed. Also, if you happen to really like this girl and end up in a relationship... The "how we met" becomes a big part, I don't think I need to explain any further...
I think that all of us, are always, being "ourselves".
Man I hate this fucking line, man I fucking hate it.
A few months ago I was suffereing from clinical depression, pretty much every day I thought for 5 hours straight about killing myself, I had problems communicating with other pepole so I had being going out with friends something like once every 6-8 weeks, and every day before I went to sleep I hoped to die sleeping, so that my parents won't feel that they failed, or that it was their fault or whatever.
Would you told me back than to still "be myself"? No. no you wouldn't.
I can extrapolate this to smaller problems like - having trouble with women.
If you tell someone to "be himself" is telling him "act exactly as you had, until this very moment", I believe that every human being would realize what an idiotic statement that is, because if he has problems, it's because he's being "himself"
I tell pepole to change, I don't tell them to change their hobbies, or friends, or preferances in life, but I tell them that if they want to be better with women, they should work on their self-esteem and self-confidence, to try and talk with pepole for the sake of talking to them, to improve their social skills, to write interesting stuff that happened to them during the day, and think about funny ways to tell them to others, to develop conversational skills etc etc.
If pepole want to fix their problems, being themselves is the worst thing to do, I didn't get better with guitar by "being myself", but by practicing.
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On June 03 2011 04:50 dreamsmasher wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2011 04:19 Delerium wrote:I'm sure if you tell a girl "You don't have free will, and neither do I, and I'm going to use psychology to get you to sleep with me tonight" it will have fine results
I'm just good at quickly and accurately judging the type of troll.
It's a necessary skill in life imo.
true dat, boo surprisingly enough, you could probably deliver that line and have great results.
Seems pretty solid. You state your intentions clearly, and take a hard-to-ignore stance on a contentious issue. Likely to spark discussion with its intended target... which, near as I can tell, is the point of a pickup line.
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On June 03 2011 04:42 VIB wrote:
You'll find a girl eventually, no need to rush it. ^
Do you believe that every guy, no matter his difficulties and problems, will eventually find a woman that he would really, really like to live with (and not just settle down with what life offers you)?
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On June 03 2011 05:12 Severedevil wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2011 04:50 dreamsmasher wrote:On June 03 2011 04:19 Delerium wrote:I'm sure if you tell a girl "You don't have free will, and neither do I, and I'm going to use psychology to get you to sleep with me tonight" it will have fine results
I'm just good at quickly and accurately judging the type of troll.
It's a necessary skill in life imo.
true dat, boo surprisingly enough, you could probably deliver that line and have great results. Seems pretty solid. You state your intentions clearly, and take a hard-to-ignore stance on a contentious issue. Likely to spark discussion with its intended target... which, near as I can tell, is the point of a pickup line.
Yeah, could work on the right type of girl. In my experience, though, even well educated people look at you weirdly if you suggest that free will may not exist.
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Kind of late to the party here. I rarely ever chime in on TL forums about anything anymore but it's a slow day at work and I have been reading over PUA things for a few months now but not the 'purchased material' that people put forth as a quick fix to your societal shortcomings. I actively follow the reddit subforum for seduction and it's a shame what people think of the PUA community. As has been stated by quite a few people, it's more about self improvement than anything else. Try following that subreddit for a week and you will see what the average person from this demographic is using pick up for. For improving their ability to talk to women, to be more confident and to (hopefully) find a long term relationship. Some people will rebuttal this saying 'but you don't need these things, just be yourself'. This is not true if you live outside of a Disney film. If you want something you should go for it, PUA teaches you to go for the kind of woman you want without shame and with the confidence to achieve your goals. Waiting for things to happen like this just makes it easier to blame the world for not giving you what you feel you deserve. PUA helps you take charge of your life if you are in a position where you feel that you aren't in control of it. Find the right community and you will quickly realize this.
The normal view of PUA? Feathered hats, douchey looking guys who try and sleep with women and then don't call them and manage to get with them through deception and lies in the first place. This is a small part of the PUA community and it's an unfortunate and visual part of the community that is a side effect. It's the Westboro Baptist church of the PUA community. Real studiers and purveyors of game want you to be the best person that you can be, simply put. It's a lot about overcoming social conditionings that tell us to subdue our sexuality as males (since male sexuality is threatening and violent by nature) and that's where the backlash from the feminism community is rooted. Instead of telling you to bow down to women, put them on a pedestal, it teaches confidence and to treat women as being on your level. They are just people too, no need to go into a panic when you walk up and say "hey, I'm Pride, you look like you need someome to talk to". This doesn't mean that you can't be nice and chivalrous and all of the other things that we would all like to consider ourselves, all it means is that we can have BOTH.
We can be the nice guy who opens doors for their girl, we can talk about our nerdy hobbies with enthusiasm with women who we would have thought out of our league and we can turn them on while doing so. I really wish people would look into this more before lambasting it based on previous assumptions that are largely false. It's not about cheesy lines, it's not about delivering backhanded compliments, it's about gaining confidence, pride (heh) in your accomplishments, and realizing that any woman you may be interested in is LUCKY to have the time to talk you because you have a lot to offer them, whether you realize it now or not.
"Why do you need PUA to do this? Everyone should know this.". If you think that, then you are lucky in that you don't need pick up most likely. Some people you can tell 'just be confident and go up and talk to her' and their is a huge mental disjunct there. They either lack confidence or get horribly nervous when they go to talk to a woman or their purveyed confidence is incongruent with their actual confidence and the conversation stagnates because women sense that very readily. When it's all said and done, PUA is a great tool but like any tool it can be misused. I urge you to, if you have the time or the want, to check out the seduction forums on reddit. Never have I seen a more level-headed and helpful community of men talking about self improvement unabashedly.
To those trying to stave off the lynch mob in this thread, I wish you good luck.
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On June 03 2011 04:05 Daigomi wrote:
Just a question to people who have read books on PUA, is there any scientific evidence to support it? Specifically, are there scientific studies published in respectable journals supporting it? From what I've read (mostly on TL), PUA seems to be based on evolutionary psychology which, at its best, is borderline scientific (most claims aren't falsifiable). If this is the case, it wouldn't necessarily mean that the books are ineffective. Giving people confidence in their ability to attract the opposite sex and telling them its ok to approach lots of women can only increase their chances to get laid. I'm just wondering if the actual methods they employ help.
Short answer is no. The seduction community includes a minimal number of academics, and to my knowledge, there hasn't been a publication that has explicitly went out and tested the information provided by PUAs. Rather, the appeal of PUA gurus is that they more or less have a monopoly on the (good) dating advice market; mainstream dating advice is often pretty useless if not downright counter-productive.
However, I would point out that the seduction community tactics generally draw support from existing scientific research in psychology, sociology, and sexuality/gender studies. For example, the study found here provides scientific evidence that in many cases, merely having the courage to ask an attractive stranger girl out will succeed about half the time for typical college guys (and secondarily, opening with a proposition for sex fails almost all the time). Although the methodology is slightly questionable (in that I suspect that some of the 'yes's' weren't going to be followed up), the general idea seems accurate and matches up with real people's experiences.
On June 03 2011 02:53 Jibba wrote:First, insecurity is a normal human emotion. Second, and more importantly, you've tied it directly to getting laid. If you have low self esteem, don't practice feigning confidence so you can get women. Find stuff that makes you feel good and improves your life, like going to the gym, reading books, volunteering, etc.
Game isn't about faking confidence; it's about gaining enough experience and success that you actually become legitimately confident with women. When you've approached hundreds of hot women and dated/slept with dozens, it's difficult to be feel nervous or insecure around girls. Additionally, confidence with your life doesn't always translate directly into confidence with women (though I agree that it often does).
When new Starcraft players are scared to ladder, do you tell them that they should practice other competitive games so that they aren't so insecure anymore? Or do you try to teach them to get over it, as well as provide concrete strategies and tactics so that they know what to do in a game and won't be so afraid? Just like with pick-up, you can't fake confidence and skill in a Starcraft game, but if you do some homework and practice, then you can have those for real.
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I've delved into the PUA community when I was a teenager. I arrogantly and ignorantly believed that my good looks (at the time I thought I was a stud ahaha) was all I needed back in high school to pull the babes ( i am very picky). Suffice it to say that I didn't have the kind of consistent results I was looking for (occasionally landed a cute chick but only once in awhile) because I didn't know how to tease, flirt, and interact with the opposite sex in an attractive way. So I started to study the PUA info on the interwebs. It is basically what a previous poster stated, you can take the material and skills you learn from this specific community and be a sleazy abusive manipulative d-bag or you can take the information that you feel is morally proper and classy and use it to help you grow as a person. It IS all psychology...understanding females and what is and isn't attractive to them generally speaking.
For some socially inept guys, memorizing a script is necessary to push them out of their comfort zone, to go out and gain experience but any veteran "pua" will tell you that the more positive experiences you have the more your confidence grows and you no longer need to rely on scripts and gimmicks to meet women. For the socially inept being good with women starts out as tricks and strategies but over time when used properly and when solid growth occurs just becomes who you are. I've learned a lot from the community but like any community there is bad people and bs. Be critical and don't become a mindless drone eating up everything out there. Understanding people and confidence is everything. You cannot be scared of rejection, you cannot be insecure and put yourself down, you cannot be negative. An alpha male is not necessarily the stereotypical jock but a man who knows who he is, is very comfortable regarding who he is, and is not easily controlled emotionally-speaking . He is confident, positive, and knows how to give value instead of taking it. A man who has self-esteem and is in control of himself. Plus having a good sense of humor goes a long way as well 
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On June 03 2011 05:46 sunprince wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2011 04:05 Daigomi wrote:
Just a question to people who have read books on PUA, is there any scientific evidence to support it? Specifically, are there scientific studies published in respectable journals supporting it? From what I've read (mostly on TL), PUA seems to be based on evolutionary psychology which, at its best, is borderline scientific (most claims aren't falsifiable). If this is the case, it wouldn't necessarily mean that the books are ineffective. Giving people confidence in their ability to attract the opposite sex and telling them its ok to approach lots of women can only increase their chances to get laid. I'm just wondering if the actual methods they employ help.
Short answer is no. The seduction community includes a minimal number of academics, and to my knowledge, there hasn't been a publication that has explicitly went out and tested the information provided by PUAs. Rather, the appeal of PUA gurus is that they more or less have a monopoly on the (good) dating advice market; mainstream dating advice is often pretty useless if not downright counter-productive. However, I would point out that the seduction community tactics generally draw support from existing scientific research in psychology, sociology, and sexuality/gender studies. For example, the study found here provides scientific evidence that in many cases, merely having the courage to ask an attractive stranger girl out will succeed about half the time for typical college guys (and secondarily, opening with a proposition for sex fails almost all the time). Although the methodology is slightly questionable (in that I suspect that some of the 'yes's' weren't going to be followed up), the general idea seems accurate and matches up with real people's experiences. Show nested quote +On June 03 2011 02:53 Jibba wrote:First, insecurity is a normal human emotion. Second, and more importantly, you've tied it directly to getting laid. If you have low self esteem, don't practice feigning confidence so you can get women. Find stuff that makes you feel good and improves your life, like going to the gym, reading books, volunteering, etc. Game isn't about faking confidence; it's about gaining enough experience and success that you actually become legitimately confident with women. When you've approached hundreds of hot women and dated/slept with dozens, it's difficult to be feel nervous or insecure around girls. Additionally, confidence with your life doesn't always translate directly into confidence with women (though I agree that it often does). When new Starcraft players are scared to ladder, do you tell them that they should practice other competitive games so that they aren't so insecure anymore? Or do you try to teach them to get over it, as well as provide concrete strategies and tactics so that they know what to do in a game and won't be so afraid? Just like with pick-up, you can't fake confidence and skill in a Starcraft game, but if you do some homework and practice, then you can have those for real.
Well shit, looks like sunprince beat me to it, but let me expound on his post a bit.
I could go on and on about the community, but essentially what it comes two is that there are two people. Those who think that seduction is about getting girls (guys, w/e) to sleep with you, and those who know seduction is about becoming a person that girls (again, guys w/e) want to sleep with.
People that tie how successful of a PUA they are to how much action they get are doing it wrong. The real goal of how well you do as a PUA is not just how well you can manage yourself and others in groups, but also how much fun people around you have. I get laid perhaps once or twice a month, but it is not something I focus on. I focus on having fun. While other PUAs I am friends with add more notches to their headboard, they do it mechanically. They leave with the girl while I am still at the party having fun.
Seduction is a tool. How you use it and what you use it for is up to the individual.
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On June 03 2011 05:11 RageBot wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2011 04:39 W2 wrote:
Guys just be yourself, there's girls for everyone, you don't have to memorize a script and wear makeup and piercings. Getting to know girls isn't something that a guy should put extra effort into doing. Plus it's also more satisfying when girls come to you because of who you are, not what books you read or tutorials you viewed. Also, if you happen to really like this girl and end up in a relationship... The "how we met" becomes a big part, I don't think I need to explain any further... I think that all of us, are always, being "ourselves". Man I hate this fucking line, man I fucking hate it. A few months ago I was suffereing from clinical depression, pretty much every day I thought for 5 hours straight about killing myself, I had problems communicating with other pepole so I had being going out with friends something like once every 6-8 weeks, and every day before I went to sleep I hoped to die sleeping, so that my parents won't feel that they failed, or that it was their fault or whatever. Would you told me back than to still "be myself"? No. no you wouldn't. I can extrapolate this to smaller problems like - having trouble with women. If you tell someone to "be himself" is telling him "act exactly as you had, until this very moment", I believe that every human being would realize what an idiotic statement that is, because if he has problems, it's because he's being "himself"I tell pepole to change, I don't tell them to change their hobbies, or friends, or preferances in life, but I tell them that if they want to be better with women, they should work on their self-esteem and self-confidence, to try and talk with pepole for the sake of talking to them, to improve their social skills, to write interesting stuff that happened to them during the day, and think about funny ways to tell them to others, to develop conversational skills etc etc. If pepole want to fix their problems, being themselves is the worst thing to do, I didn't get better with guitar by "being myself", but by practicing.
You're taking it too literally and extrapolating it to completely different things. "Just be yourself" is a classic saying you tell people before a date or meeting women. You don't hear this from a counselor or therapist. And you definitely won't hear it from a guitar instructor, or at least a competent one .
Hope you are recovering well. I taught myself guitar too during college, but now I only play once in a while and my sturdy fingertips have turned soft. Hit me up in pm if you want to talk or play some sc2 games!
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On June 03 2011 06:43 W2 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2011 05:11 RageBot wrote:On June 03 2011 04:39 W2 wrote:
Guys just be yourself, there's girls for everyone, you don't have to memorize a script and wear makeup and piercings. Getting to know girls isn't something that a guy should put extra effort into doing. Plus it's also more satisfying when girls come to you because of who you are, not what books you read or tutorials you viewed. Also, if you happen to really like this girl and end up in a relationship... The "how we met" becomes a big part, I don't think I need to explain any further... I think that all of us, are always, being "ourselves". Man I hate this fucking line, man I fucking hate it. A few months ago I was suffereing from clinical depression, pretty much every day I thought for 5 hours straight about killing myself, I had problems communicating with other pepole so I had being going out with friends something like once every 6-8 weeks, and every day before I went to sleep I hoped to die sleeping, so that my parents won't feel that they failed, or that it was their fault or whatever. Would you told me back than to still "be myself"? No. no you wouldn't. I can extrapolate this to smaller problems like - having trouble with women. If you tell someone to "be himself" is telling him "act exactly as you had, until this very moment", I believe that every human being would realize what an idiotic statement that is, because if he has problems, it's because he's being "himself"I tell pepole to change, I don't tell them to change their hobbies, or friends, or preferances in life, but I tell them that if they want to be better with women, they should work on their self-esteem and self-confidence, to try and talk with pepole for the sake of talking to them, to improve their social skills, to write interesting stuff that happened to them during the day, and think about funny ways to tell them to others, to develop conversational skills etc etc. If pepole want to fix their problems, being themselves is the worst thing to do, I didn't get better with guitar by "being myself", but by practicing. You're taking it too literally and extrapolating it to completely different things. "Just be yourself" is a classic saying you tell people before a date or meeting women. You don't hear this from a counselor or therapist. And you definitely won't hear it from a guitar instructor, or at least a competent one . Hope you are recovering well. I taught myself guitar too during college, but now I only play once in a while and my sturdy fingertips have turned soft. Hit me up in pm if you want to talk or play some sc2 games!
I think he's trying to seduce you
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The PUA community taught me a lot in a roundabout way. There are better ways that I could have found these things out, and I honestly think that it's probably the least efficient way of learning how to "be confident", lol. It's like telling someone to build a skyscraper with no foundation.
However :
It pushed me out of my comfort zone, which was great.
It made me realize that there were no results from the negative feedback of others, which was good.
It allowed me to meet many new (And sometimes crazy) people, which was very enlightening.
It facilitated the discovery of a lot of things that I hid from myself, which was needed.
One of Day9's quotes will stick with me forever - I think there's more to be learned from this 1 quote that the whole of PUA together.
"There's nothing cooler than being proud of the things you love"
You just need to live a balanced life to be able to find all those things
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Another thing to add as well is that alpha males either instinctively or knowingly understand concepts such as building sexual tension, being a man of action (behavioral), and escalating when it comes to "courting" or "seducing" a woman. The average guy does not understand or instinctively carry out these concepts smoothly so it's harder for them attract women easily. The most successful guys when it comes to attracting women also are great at reading, displaying, and interpreting body language and knowing what to do from there.
My objective when I see a beautiful woman I want to meet is not some creepy entirely selfish one such as "I want to take that chick home and rail her...and then never talk to her again." My goal when I approach a beautiful woman is , "hey, I want to meet her...she could be a great and interesting person...I wanna have an enjoyable experience and if she meets my standards...I would rock her world!" The former objective/mindset is coming from "value-taking" perspective while the latter is a "value-giving" mindset. I know I am a solid dude and that I am a worthwhile person to know and that I can improve her life, make her happy, and I hope she can do the same for me. It's not coming from a place of need/desperation/validation but a sense of adventure/excitement/ and curiosity! I don't hide my sexuality either. I don't try to hide my intentions. I don't try to deceive. If she is cool and she is digging me, awesome. If she is cool but she doesn't dig me, whatever life goes on! etc.
I will escalate sexually but gradually depending on the situation (if it's appropriate or not) and if she is feeling it and ready. A perfect metaphor for this is about boiling frogs. You throw a frog in a boiling pot of water and it will immediately jump out....but if you put a frog into a pot of cold/lukewarm water and gradually heat it up, it will stay (to get boiled alive ). I don't need to get with every beautiful woman I approach to validate my ego or to prove to myself that I am a great person. I already believe it. I don't believe I need further proof. Success becomes a habit and who we are. Overall, in the grand scheme of things...being a type of guy that can effortlessly attract high value women doesn't necessarily prove or make you a great person specifically. I draw upon other things to strengthen my self-worth and thus when you don't come from a place of desperation or need, you are no longer attached to the outcome and you no longer subconsciously sabotage yourself or get hung up on not "scoring" every time.
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Most of the stuff that the PUA community advocates that actually works can be divorced from the jargon and misogyny.
Self improvement is a big part of being attractive. This applies in terms of attractiveness to self (confidence), attractiveness to friends (fraternity) and attractiveness to potential mates. Self improvement isn't wholly objective, as societal indicators for what goals one should have in improving oneself change over time. Still, contemporarily acceptable goals for self improvement are generally easily grasped by able-minded individuals.
TL;DR: You don't need the PUA community to tell you to lose a few pounds, wear some nice clothes and develop a couple of mainstream interests.
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the other night i negged a hb8 so hard she creamed her panties right there on the barstool.
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On June 03 2011 09:00 nozh wrote:
the other night i negged a hb8 so hard she creamed her panties right there on the barstool.
LOL misc talk to the max.. neg train inc..
seriously pua fad died already let it rest
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EPT
