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Stop saying "I'm rank 5 platinum". - Page 3

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ccdnl
Profile Joined April 2010
United States611 Posts
May 07 2010 18:11 GMT
#41
On May 08 2010 02:41 grubal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2010 02:40 Kashll wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:36 FortuneSyn wrote:
It's a much better indication, but 1400 plat div54 still does not equal 1400 plat div1.


Yes it does...



This is correct. I approve.


LOL. This is accurate. I approve of your approval.

And so it begins...
civil cervixes || Kang Min Fan || I like TLO, TLO= German, I like Germans..?
Iwbhs
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States195 Posts
May 07 2010 18:11 GMT
#42
No big deal but I hit



NUMBER 1 GOLD TODAY

Everyone loves Milano cookies.
selboN
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States2523 Posts
May 07 2010 18:11 GMT
#43
On May 08 2010 03:09 Alou wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2010 03:04 selboN wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:41 grubal wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:40 Kashll wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:36 FortuneSyn wrote:
It's a much better indication, but 1400 plat div54 still does not equal 1400 plat div1.


Yes it does...



This is correct. I approve.

How would you know? You don't even have the beta, just read your key-begging thread.


Grubal is on my friends list in beta. He has beta, assuming it is the same one.

Orly?
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=124089&currentpage=last
"That's what happens when you're using a mouse made out of glass!" -Tasteless (Referring to ZergBong)
ManiacTheZealot
Profile Joined December 2009
United States490 Posts
May 07 2010 18:12 GMT
#44
People have this pathological need to be ahead of whoever they perceive to be in front of them. In reality there's always a bigger fish. You're being controlled and you don't even know it. Relax a little bit.
FortuneSyn
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
1826 Posts
May 07 2010 18:13 GMT
#45
On May 08 2010 03:04 BroOd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2010 02:52 FortuneSyn wrote:
No it does not.

Next time you play someone thats "even" with you, go check and see if his rating equals your own. Most of the time / 50% of the time it does not.

the rating is basically there to show you how "good" you are relative to others in your division, not between divisions. If you are 200 pts below somebody in your division, that person is 200 pts better than you. That does not apply if you are in separate divisions.

edit: proof (found by shinosai)
http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=23766800567&sid=5000&pageNo=2


I think the Blizzard poster in there may have mis-spoken.

Can you explain why they would be different? I can't figure it out. The only thing I can think of that would separate the divisions would be the length of time one player has over another in accruing bonus points. Apart from that, why wouldn't their rankings be basically relative to one another? Everyone plays outside his own division, so why would 1400 points earned in division 53 not be similar to 1400 points earned in division 54?

Your point about whether you are "even" with your opponent is irrelevant, as the favored system is almost certainly broken at the moment.


I don't know the correct answer. All I know is that when you play somebody "even" with you, you often dont have similar points.

I don't know exactly what you mean about "even" with opponent being irrelevant. "Even" implies you lose/win equal amount of points (12), so if a 1400 and 1600 guy play each other infinite times, they will always have a 200 pt difference between each other despite being "even".
BroOd
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
Austin10833 Posts
May 07 2010 18:18 GMT
#46
On May 08 2010 03:09 shinosai wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2010 03:04 BroOd wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:52 FortuneSyn wrote:
No it does not.

Next time you play someone thats "even" with you, go check and see if his rating equals your own. Most of the time / 50% of the time it does not.

the rating is basically there to show you how "good" you are relative to others in your division, not between divisions. If you are 200 pts below somebody in your division, that person is 200 pts better than you. That does not apply if you are in separate divisions.

edit: proof (found by shinosai)
http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=23766800567&sid=5000&pageNo=2


I think the Blizzard poster in there may have mis-spoken.

Can you explain why they would be different? I can't figure it out. The only thing I can think of that would separate the divisions would be the length of time one player has over another in accruing bonus points. Apart from that, why wouldn't their rankings be basically relative to one another? Everyone plays outside his own division, so why would 1400 points earned in division 53 not be similar to 1400 points earned in division 54?

Your point about whether you are "even" with your opponent is irrelevant, as the favored system is almost certainly broken at the moment.


I don't see why we would assume the Blizzard poster would be wrong. They usually give us pretty accurate information, and if they don't, they generally correct it.

They would be different if every division existed in its own bubble, and gave points based on how well you were doing in comparison to your division rather than comparing yourself to the player base as a whole. Which is precisely what the blue poster implies when he says that points are not directly comparable between divisions.


I wasn't suggesting he was wrong, but that he may have explained it incorrectly. Why would every division exist in a bubble? It seems so non-sensical.

Basically, if I have 1400 points, and someone else has 1400 points, and we both beat identically ranked players, I might get more points than him because I'm in a different division (disregarding any bonus)? What possible purpose could that serve? (I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just saying that it makes no sense for that to be the case)
ModeratorSIRL and JLIG.
BroOd
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
Austin10833 Posts
May 07 2010 18:20 GMT
#47
On May 08 2010 03:13 FortuneSyn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2010 03:04 BroOd wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:52 FortuneSyn wrote:
No it does not.

Next time you play someone thats "even" with you, go check and see if his rating equals your own. Most of the time / 50% of the time it does not.

the rating is basically there to show you how "good" you are relative to others in your division, not between divisions. If you are 200 pts below somebody in your division, that person is 200 pts better than you. That does not apply if you are in separate divisions.

edit: proof (found by shinosai)
http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=23766800567&sid=5000&pageNo=2


I think the Blizzard poster in there may have mis-spoken.

Can you explain why they would be different? I can't figure it out. The only thing I can think of that would separate the divisions would be the length of time one player has over another in accruing bonus points. Apart from that, why wouldn't their rankings be basically relative to one another? Everyone plays outside his own division, so why would 1400 points earned in division 53 not be similar to 1400 points earned in division 54?

Your point about whether you are "even" with your opponent is irrelevant, as the favored system is almost certainly broken at the moment.


I don't know the correct answer. All I know is that when you play somebody "even" with you, you often dont have similar points.

I don't know exactly what you mean about "even" with opponent being irrelevant. "Even" implies you lose/win equal amount of points (12), so if a 1400 and 1600 guy play each other infinite times, they will always have a 200 pt difference between each other despite being "even".

When I said it's irrelevant, I meant because as far as I can tell, it's functioning incorrectly at the moment. Opponents who are ranked lower than me in lower divisions have been "favored" or "slightly favored" vs me often, when they clearly shouldn't be.
ModeratorSIRL and JLIG.
FortuneSyn
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
1826 Posts
May 07 2010 18:22 GMT
#48
On May 08 2010 03:11 selboN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2010 03:09 Alou wrote:
On May 08 2010 03:04 selboN wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:41 grubal wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:40 Kashll wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:36 FortuneSyn wrote:
It's a much better indication, but 1400 plat div54 still does not equal 1400 plat div1.


Yes it does...



This is correct. I approve.

How would you know? You don't even have the beta, just read your key-begging thread.


Grubal is on my friends list in beta. He has beta, assuming it is the same one.

Orly?
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=124089&currentpage=last


wow, Grubal uses his mother's death to beg for a key. Then a couple hours later he validates somebody's claim, thereby telling us that you indeed have had a key for a long time already.

So we have basically established that your word means shit around here huh.
selboN
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States2523 Posts
May 07 2010 18:24 GMT
#49
On May 08 2010 03:22 FortuneSyn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2010 03:11 selboN wrote:
On May 08 2010 03:09 Alou wrote:
On May 08 2010 03:04 selboN wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:41 grubal wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:40 Kashll wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:36 FortuneSyn wrote:
It's a much better indication, but 1400 plat div54 still does not equal 1400 plat div1.


Yes it does...



This is correct. I approve.

How would you know? You don't even have the beta, just read your key-begging thread.


Grubal is on my friends list in beta. He has beta, assuming it is the same one.

Orly?
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=124089&currentpage=last


wow, Grubal uses his mother's death to beg for a key. Then a couple hours later he validates somebody's claim, thereby telling us that you indeed have had a key for a long time already.

So we have basically established that your word means shit around here huh.

That was my thought process.
"That's what happens when you're using a mouse made out of glass!" -Tasteless (Referring to ZergBong)
FortuneSyn
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
1826 Posts
May 07 2010 18:29 GMT
#50
On May 08 2010 03:20 BroOd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2010 03:13 FortuneSyn wrote:
On May 08 2010 03:04 BroOd wrote:
On May 08 2010 02:52 FortuneSyn wrote:
No it does not.

Next time you play someone thats "even" with you, go check and see if his rating equals your own. Most of the time / 50% of the time it does not.

the rating is basically there to show you how "good" you are relative to others in your division, not between divisions. If you are 200 pts below somebody in your division, that person is 200 pts better than you. That does not apply if you are in separate divisions.

edit: proof (found by shinosai)
http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=23766800567&sid=5000&pageNo=2


I think the Blizzard poster in there may have mis-spoken.

Can you explain why they would be different? I can't figure it out. The only thing I can think of that would separate the divisions would be the length of time one player has over another in accruing bonus points. Apart from that, why wouldn't their rankings be basically relative to one another? Everyone plays outside his own division, so why would 1400 points earned in division 53 not be similar to 1400 points earned in division 54?

Your point about whether you are "even" with your opponent is irrelevant, as the favored system is almost certainly broken at the moment.


I don't know the correct answer. All I know is that when you play somebody "even" with you, you often dont have similar points.

I don't know exactly what you mean about "even" with opponent being irrelevant. "Even" implies you lose/win equal amount of points (12), so if a 1400 and 1600 guy play each other infinite times, they will always have a 200 pt difference between each other despite being "even".

When I said it's irrelevant, I meant because as far as I can tell, it's functioning incorrectly at the moment. Opponents who are ranked lower than me in lower divisions have been "favored" or "slightly favored" vs me often, when they clearly shouldn't be.


I don't know it's suppose to be functioning this way. But the fact is that because of these inconsistencies, 1400 div1 does not equal 1300 div59. But hey, it's the best we got right now.
BabaBlackSheep
Profile Joined April 2010
United States29 Posts
May 07 2010 18:29 GMT
#51
So if my ranking doesn't matter, then at least being in Division 69 does, right?
What does this field mean?
byobong7
Profile Joined February 2010
United States207 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-07 18:47:03
May 07 2010 18:43 GMT
#52
If you played WoW arenas the system blizzard uses for the SC2 ladder is not drastically different. They have added the idea of leagues and divisions, but their point system is almost exactly the same. A Few facts: 1) The rank in your division is not at all comparable to other divisions, as most people know. 2) The points people have is a better indication to compare people across divisions but its still rough if people haven't played 75-100+ games. These points you have change relatively slowly over time from 1-30 points based on how close the match-up is. 3) There is a hidden 'skill level' blizzard has of every player. This rating changes drastically from wins and loses, and if compared to the shown point system jumps around a lot to try and better determine your skill in a short window.

Blizzard uses the points I describe in #3 to match people up, and its how they determine who is favored or not. The idea behind this hidden fast changing points system is if you are in a slump (or doing really well) the system wants to quickly match you up to people of your current skill level. Using the slow changing points system from #2 wouldn't do that as it changes very slowly over time. When people have played 100+ games though the points from #2 and #3 will be close to each other. This is because the system will start really learning your true 'skill level' (which may slowly change) and #3 will start changing very slowly, and #2 will eventually catch up and they will even out.

Blizzard uses this exact same point system in WoW, they also 'hid' this true skill number for a long time but eventually made it available to see. The biggest difference between WoW and SC2 is that SC2 has everyone split up into divisions and leagues. WoW is split up in a different way in which people can't be compared at all because they have completely different player pools.

SHORT VERSION: If both players have played 100+ games on the ladder, the rating points shown in game is probably a very good comparison across divisions, otherwise it can be quite off.

EDIT: Also over time because of BONUS points that will cause inflation a 1400 points early in a season is a lot more impressive than 1400 points at the end of a season.
CEVO SC2 Official
HeyheyLBJ
Profile Joined April 2010
Sweden160 Posts
May 07 2010 18:47 GMT
#53
Not that rating means anything anyway. You win like 30-50 points if you win and lose 5? Whoever plays most and isn't completely retarded will lead the rankings.
BlasiuS
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
United States2405 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-07 19:01:40
May 07 2010 18:48 GMT
#54
On May 08 2010 03:13 FortuneSyn wrote:
I don't know the correct answer. All I know is that when you play somebody "even" with you, you often dont have similar points.


That is because every player has 2 ratings: a public rating that is shown to everyone, and a hidden AMM rating. The hidden rating is what is used to determine who's favored in a match.

This has nothing to do with the points system. The points system works the same across all divisions.

Winning a game against a favored opponent gives the same amount of points whether that opponent is in division 2 or in division 479.

Same for slightly favored, same for you being favored, same for you being slightly favored, same for even teams.

What division you are in has no bearing on the points system.

On May 08 2010 03:08 zealing wrote:
lol i love how many noobs on here are like "divisions mean nothing kekeke, div 1 is the same as 100"

no its not, stop saying it is, your wrong accept it and F10 S.


rofl you know that new divisions are created only as current divisions fill up right?

so you if you did your placement matches within 2 or 3 hours after a reset (putting you in division 1 or 2), and NonY decided to wait a week before doing his placement matches (putting him in division 100), you would say you're better than NonY?

No.
next week on Everybody Loves HypnoToad:
roemy
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany432 Posts
May 07 2010 18:49 GMT
#55
alas next week, 1700 will be the new 1500
rock is fine.. paper could need a buff, but scissors have to be nerfed
byobong7
Profile Joined February 2010
United States207 Posts
May 07 2010 18:50 GMT
#56
On May 08 2010 03:47 HeyheyLBJ wrote:
Not that rating means anything anyway. You win like 30-50 points if you win and lose 5? Whoever plays most and isn't completely retarded will lead the rankings.


This isn't really true. At first you may experience something like this, but as you play more games you will find that losses will mean more. You have to really play a lot of games (probably 100+ range) to really start 'evening' out.
CEVO SC2 Official
Skyze
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Canada2324 Posts
May 07 2010 18:51 GMT
#57
.. This has NOTHING to do with WoW.. Point totals are the EXACT same in different divisions. 1400 in div 1 is equal to 1400 in div 163, because you play EVERYONE in platinum, not just in your division.

I am in some shitty division, like 70 or something, and ive played Incontrol, LZgamer, etc etc where most of my division isnt even above 1200 yet.

And to show how pointless this rank system is.. For me, I am about 200 pts above 2nd place, so its not even a challenge really, and I find I play less games because I have no competition in this shitty division, where if there was a REAL ladder, I wouldnt even be ranked 100 on US east right now, which would make me want to play more to get it. (part of that is due to time constraints, but still, its not as desirable to play when you are so far ahead of a weak division)
Canada Gaming ~~ The-Feared
zizou21
Profile Joined September 2006
United States3683 Posts
May 07 2010 18:51 GMT
#58
im kind of sad platinum has come to mean nothing
i hope it wont be this way during retail
its me, tasteless,s roomate LOL!
Foreplay
Profile Joined May 2008
United States1154 Posts
May 07 2010 18:52 GMT
#59
they really need to implement a ladder system where rank actually means something.
Better than Pokebunny
Snowfield
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
1289 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-07 18:57:41
May 07 2010 18:54 GMT
#60
On May 08 2010 03:08 zealing wrote:
lol i love how many noobs on here are like "divisions mean nothing kekeke, div 1 is the same as 100"

no its not, stop saying it is, your wrong accept it and F10 S.


So, because you got placed in platinum faster / sat up all night waiting for the reset patch to come out to instantly play your games means your better then a guy who has teh same W/L and same points as you that did his placement matches a couple of days later or a player who started in copper but has played and played much more then you and eventually become a platinum player?

yeah ok, makes sense :S

I just wish everyone would be placed in gold and had to make your way to plat, because right now, theres some really bad players in plat
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