Watch Live If your stream is behind other's, use the hotkey "c" to speed up your GOMplayer and when you've caught up, press "z" to normalize the playback speed.
On July 26 2009 18:02 AttackZerg wrote: Why would you restream a stream that is present solely because of the large numbers of people who tune in outside of korea?
I use linux, cant really watch GOM normally, my windows isnt actually connecting to the network either so I cant watch GOM any other way.
On July 26 2009 18:02 AttackZerg wrote: Why would you restream a stream that is present solely because of the large numbers of people who tune in outside of korea?
yeh, it is such a stupid concept to restream GOM on livestream, especially when there are VLC streams given there -_-
On July 26 2009 18:02 AttackZerg wrote: Why would you restream a stream that is present solely because of the large numbers of people who tune in outside of korea?
I use linux, cant really watch GOM normally, my windows isnt actually connecting to the network either so I cant watch GOM any other way.
good enough =).
I just literally couldn't think of a good reason !
On July 26 2009 18:02 AttackZerg wrote: Why would you restream a stream that is present solely because of the large numbers of people who tune in outside of korea?
Why does everyone keep saying that SC will die when SC2 comes out ? It dependts on how popular it gets in Korea . If it sucks for the spectators SC will continue strongly . Maybe in the foreign seen everyone will play SC 2 , but in Korea its the most successful e - sport so far .
On July 26 2009 18:16 FearDarkness wrote: omg GOM or SDM musta been desperate... Randomer Commentating... Prepare for some fail commentary or surprise epic package.
On July 26 2009 18:12 raga4ka wrote: Why does everyone keep saying that SC will die when SC2 comes out ? It dependts on how popular it gets in Korea . If it sucks for the spectators SC will continue strongly . Maybe in the foreign seen everyone will play SC 2 , but in Korea its the most successful e - sport so far .
it will take some time for sure to balance out SC2, till then there probably will be no leagues and stuff.So SC surely is not going to die, people just tend to get overexcited.
lol he's not any more or less clueless than tasteless about the actual players, but I imagine when the games actually start he won't know what's going on
I wonder where the counterstrike forums are and what they had to say about tasteless/artosis casting that, lol... it was probably pretty brutal
On July 26 2009 18:19 integral wrote: lol he's not any more or less clueless than tasteless about the actual players, but I imagine when the games actually start he won't know what's going on
I wonder where the counterstrike forums are and what they had to say about tasteless/artosis casting that, lol... it was probably pretty brutal
On July 26 2009 18:19 integral wrote: lol he's not any more or less clueless than tasteless about the actual players, but I imagine when the games actually start he won't know what's going on
I wonder where the counterstrike forums are and what they had to say about tasteless/artosis casting that, lol... it was probably pretty brutal
On July 26 2009 18:19 integral wrote: lol he's not any more or less clueless than tasteless about the actual players, but I imagine when the games actually start he won't know what's going on
I wonder where the counterstrike forums are and what they had to say about tasteless/artosis casting that, lol... it was probably pretty brutal
On July 26 2009 18:19 integral wrote: lol he's not any more or less clueless than tasteless about the actual players, but I imagine when the games actually start he won't know what's going on
I wonder where the counterstrike forums are and what they had to say about tasteless/artosis casting that, lol... it was probably pretty brutal
can't really rip on the substitute caster, probably a lot of pressure on him
haha, most everyone in that thread was bashing the OP.
Though really that thread was super short lived, only like 14 posts or something. I'm kind of sad taht I actually missed the CS cast from them... was curious to see how much they knew about CS
Maybe Jessie will actually show his abillity to do commentaries when the games are actually up. I doubt tasteless and SDM could've made any better discussion.
On July 26 2009 18:19 integral wrote: lol he's not any more or less clueless than tasteless about the actual players, but I imagine when the games actually start he won't know what's going on
I wonder where the counterstrike forums are and what they had to say about tasteless/artosis casting that, lol... it was probably pretty brutal
can't really rip on the substitute caster, probably a lot of pressure on him
haha, most everyone in that thread was bashing the OP.
Though really that thread was super short lived, only like 14 posts or something. I'm kind of sad taht I actually missed the CS cast from them... was curious to see how much they knew about CS
Well...almost nothing. But to be honest, I don't know what eStars were thinking letting them cast ALL games, including CS and WC3, without any guest commentators who knew the game.
It's kind of disappointing that the commentators don't even appear to be fans like the people here at TL... they don't seem to follow proleague very much at all. I think someone who actively browsed TL could do a better job. Aren't they paid, at least in part, to keep track of the players they're casting about? SDM and tasteless are unquestionably entertaining, and certainly have a depth of insight into the game, but I don't think it'd hurt for them to intentionally sharpen up a bit before they commentate.
On July 26 2009 18:29 integral wrote: It's kind of disappointing that the commentators don't even appear to be fans like the people here at TL... they don't seem to follow proleague very much at all. I think someone who actively browsed TL could do a better job. Aren't they paid, at least in part, to keep track of the players they're casting about? SDM and tasteless are unquestionably entertaining, and certainly have a depth of insight into the game, but I don't think it'd hurt for them to intentionally sharpen up a bit before they commentate.
That came off more critical than I intended it to, but it's been bothering me for a while and I haven't said anything about it.
Come on this guy is not THAT bad, you can hear in his voice that he is under a lot of stress, and you know how stress works when you have to talk anything logical, don't you?
@ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
On July 26 2009 18:29 integral wrote: It's kind of disappointing that the commentators don't even appear to be fans like the people here at TL... they don't seem to follow proleague very much at all. I think someone who actively browsed TL could do a better job. Aren't they paid, at least in part, to keep track of the players they're casting about? SDM and tasteless are unquestionably entertaining, and certainly have a depth of insight into the game, but I don't think it'd hurt for them to intentionally sharpen up a bit before they commentate.
That came off more critical than I intended it to, but it's been bothering me for a while and I haven't said anything about it.
you are right, they often seem to lack knowladge of most recent stuff, definately a thing to improve
On July 26 2009 18:29 integral wrote: It's kind of disappointing that the commentators don't even appear to be fans like the people here at TL... they don't seem to follow proleague very much at all. I think someone who actively browsed TL could do a better job. Aren't they paid, at least in part, to keep track of the players they're casting about? SDM and tasteless are unquestionably entertaining, and certainly have a depth of insight into the game, but I don't think it'd hurt for them to intentionally sharpen up a bit before they commentate.
That came off more critical than I intended it to, but it's been bothering me for a while and I haven't said anything about it.
you are right, they often seem to lack knowladge of most recent stuff, definately a thing to improve
Yeah thats why Artosis+Tasteless casting Gom would be soooooo amazing
Honestly, this guy is only a little worse than Tasteless at recent knowledge and pointing things out. It's just he and Daniel have no chemistry, and he doesn't have the booming voice the works for radio-esque commentaries.
Okay, this cast was wrong, muting this isn't a bad idea - something like: "great defence by Effort" "oh no its not Effort, It's Jaedong, ohhh he didnt defend too well, now he's gonna die" LOL :|
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
On July 26 2009 18:29 integral wrote: It's kind of disappointing that the commentators don't even appear to be fans like the people here at TL... they don't seem to follow proleague very much at all. I think someone who actively browsed TL could do a better job. Aren't they paid, at least in part, to keep track of the players they're casting about? SDM and tasteless are unquestionably entertaining, and certainly have a depth of insight into the game, but I don't think it'd hurt for them to intentionally sharpen up a bit before they commentate.
That came off more critical than I intended it to, but it's been bothering me for a while and I haven't said anything about it.
I think ,what you said is entirely true, I mostly enjoy the casts like you. But especially Tasteless knowledge about the proscene seems to be extremly poor and the cast does suffer from it.
why did they decide that the token white guy who brings them water and sometimes goes to gom games would be a good idea as a co caster? I mean what the fuck are the people running this thinking...Did they have to find someone in 5 minutes?
Seriously, if we can't have Tasteless or Day[9], can we at least get artosis or...or even SUSIE? Fuck, get IDRA to commentate it. I don't care. Just not this guy.
On July 26 2009 18:40 CaptainPlatypus wrote: Seriously, if we can't have Tasteless or Day[9], can we at least get artosis or...or even SUSIE? Fuck, get IDRA to commentate it. I don't care. Just not this guy.
Oddly worded considering artosis is the best commentator mentioned
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Not knowing who players are or what they're known for, not being familiar with a recent map change, not knowing the latest proleague results... I can't remember his funny quotes either, sorry I can't give specific examples.
On July 26 2009 18:40 CaptainPlatypus wrote: Seriously, if we can't have Tasteless or Day[9], can we at least get artosis or...or even SUSIE? Fuck, get IDRA to commentate it. I don't care. Just not this guy.
Oddly worded considering artosis is the best commentator mentioned
WHy is artosis and tasteless casting for the final and they didnt cast all the other games?
they did the quaters., maybe they couldnt get there for group stage due to other stuff, dunno. its a perfect commentating duo, yesterday's cast were one of the best i've seen so far, hoping today will be the same.
On July 26 2009 18:39 TheFoReveRwaR wrote: why did they decide that the token white guy who brings them water and sometimes goes to gom games would be a good idea as a co caster? I mean what the fuck are the people running this thinking...Did they have to find someone in 5 minutes?
SDM updated his twitter status from 'i am going solo' to 'i have a co-commentator' like 10 minutes apart.
It is quite amusing to see how these hardcore communities like TeamLiquid and Gotfrag gets very defensive when they feel some outsider intrude on their territory.
Yes, the commentating could be better, but nothing to get up in arms over.
On July 26 2009 18:39 TheFoReveRwaR wrote: why did they decide that the token white guy who brings them water and sometimes goes to gom games would be a good idea as a co caster? I mean what the fuck are the people running this thinking...Did they have to find someone in 5 minutes?
SDM updated his twitter status from 'i am going solo' to 'i have a co-commentator' like 10 minutes apart.
So that should give you a good idea
lol xD
On July 26 2009 18:39 Oystein wrote: So did the players just not show up in time for the game and they are waiting for them?
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Not knowing who players are or what they're known for, not being familiar with a recent map change, not knowing the latest proleague results... I can't remember his funny quotes either, sorry I can't give specific examples.
basically he doesn't go to any effort AT ALL to follow the rest of the progaming scene it's like he just goes to GOM, casts with the knowledge he has acquired from playing, and just leaves to live his 'baller lifestyle' for the rest of the week.
On July 26 2009 18:42 integral wrote: Not knowing who players are or what they're known for, not being familiar with a recent map change, not knowing the latest proleague results... I can't remember his funny quotes either, sorry I can't give specific examples.
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
He is a nice guy, but what does he tell you in his casts that you don't already know? In addition, what does he not tell you in the casts that you do already know.
I think it is pretty obvious by now that Tasteless, for as much love as he gets for going over there, does not keep up on what is going on in pro starcraft.
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Well, it is always hard to give specifics. But Tasteless never refers to any specific games in PL/OSL/MSL. His normal phrases are "Yeah, Jaedong is a monster man", "Yeah Flash is so good, I can't believe it" and so on. But he never says anything to back this stuff up. He never mentions how these players do in any other leagues. It really looks to me as he simply does not know.
On July 26 2009 18:39 TheFoReveRwaR wrote: why did they decide that the token white guy who brings them water and sometimes goes to gom games would be a good idea as a co caster? I mean what the fuck are the people running this thinking...Did they have to find someone in 5 minutes?
SDM updated his twitter status from 'i am going solo' to 'i have a co-commentator' like 10 minutes apart.
So that should give you a good idea
Well I dont check twitter but that would explain a lot...lol.
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Well, it is always hard to give specifics. But Tasteless never refers to any specific games in PL/OSL/MSL. His normal phrases are "Yeah, Jaedong is a monster man", "Yeah Flash is so good, I can't believe it" and so on. But he never says anything to back this stuff up. He never mentions how these players do in any other leagues. It really looks to me as he simply does not know.
It's expect he isn't going to mention any other leagues. He is working for GOM TV after all, not proleauge, MSL, etc.
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Not knowing who players are or what they're known for, not being familiar with a recent map change, not knowing the latest proleague results... I can't remember his funny quotes either, sorry I can't give specific examples.
basically he doesn't go to any effort AT ALL to follow the rest of the progaming scene it's like he just goes to GOM, casts with the knowledge he has acquired from playing, and just leaves to live his 'baller lifestyle' for the rest of the week.
Well, he does have a girlfriend in Korea now, so yes, his lifestyle does seem all that "baller." And I would imagine that for him, she does take precedence over religiously following every development in the SC scene.
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Well, it is always hard to give specifics. But Tasteless never refers to any specific games in PL/OSL/MSL. His normal phrases are "Yeah, Jaedong is a monster man", "Yeah Flash is so good, I can't believe it" and so on. But he never says anything to back this stuff up. He never mentions how these players do in any other leagues. It really looks to me as he simply does not know.
It's expect he isn't going to mention any other leagues. He is working for GOM TV after all, not proleauge, MSL, etc.
? do you think korean commentators only concentrate solely on mentioning results in the MSL when casting MSL only? of course not, they HAVE to reference the other leagues if a player is slumping/dominating or whatever in their analysis.
On July 26 2009 18:44 7mk wrote: Pft we all saw Chill vs Combat-Ex. But as entertaining as it was, what day9 did had nothing to do with serious proffessional commentating
And Artosis' knowledge of progaming >>> Tasteless knowledge
If you want to here day[9] being serious, listen to his podcasts - which are also fucking excellent.
Also, agreed on the second point, but I hugely prefer Tasteless' style.
On July 26 2009 18:43 Eury wrote: It is quite amusing to see how these hardcore communities like TeamLiquid and Gotfrag gets very defensive when they feel some outsider intrude on their territory.
Yes, the commentating could be better, but nothing to get up in arms over.
are you serious?becouse GOM isnt, getting a clueless guys to commentate such important match. I am watching WC3 now becouse of him ~.^
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Not knowing who players are or what they're known for, not being familiar with a recent map change, not knowing the latest proleague results... I can't remember his funny quotes either, sorry I can't give specific examples.
basically he doesn't go to any effort AT ALL to follow the rest of the progaming scene it's like he just goes to GOM, casts with the knowledge he has acquired from playing, and just leaves to live his 'baller lifestyle' for the rest of the week.
Well, he does have a girlfriend in Korea now, so yes, his lifestyle does seem all that "baller." And I would imagine that for him, she does take precedence over religiously following every development in the SC scene.
"he's just not one of those players that really sticks out"
edit: THIS WOULD BE SO MUCH BETTER IF YOU WOULD JUST STOP PRETENDING THAT YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT
like, it'd be fucking hilarious if they got some truly admittedly clueless guy who was just like "what's a zergling, oh hey that's pretty neat it humps other units to death really fast"
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Not knowing who players are or what they're known for, not being familiar with a recent map change, not knowing the latest proleague results... I can't remember his funny quotes either, sorry I can't give specific examples.
basically he doesn't go to any effort AT ALL to follow the rest of the progaming scene it's like he just goes to GOM, casts with the knowledge he has acquired from playing, and just leaves to live his 'baller lifestyle' for the rest of the week.
Well, he does have a girlfriend in Korea now, so yes, his lifestyle does seem all that "baller." And I would imagine that for him, she does take precedence over religiously following every development in the SC scene.
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Not knowing who players are or what they're known for, not being familiar with a recent map change, not knowing the latest proleague results... I can't remember his funny quotes either, sorry I can't give specific examples.
basically he doesn't go to any effort AT ALL to follow the rest of the progaming scene it's like he just goes to GOM, casts with the knowledge he has acquired from playing, and just leaves to live his 'baller lifestyle' for the rest of the week.
Well, he does have a girlfriend in Korea now, so yes, his lifestyle does seem all that "baller." And I would imagine that for him, she does take precedence over religiously following every development in the SC scene.
Ah so having a girlfriend means you can't put more effort into your job? uhhuh...
Random guy: 'um.......... um....... to be honest I havent seen many of his games, he doesnt stick out to me as a player that is very good, but i know he's good because of that game where he beat jaedong'
On July 26 2009 18:38 GTR wrote: Korean Stream for those that can't bare English at the moment http://live.gomtv.com/submain.gom?grpid=160 click on 일빈화질 for LQ or HQ+ 고화질 for HQ
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Well, it is always hard to give specifics. But Tasteless never refers to any specific games in PL/OSL/MSL. His normal phrases are "Yeah, Jaedong is a monster man", "Yeah Flash is so good, I can't believe it" and so on. But he never says anything to back this stuff up. He never mentions how these players do in any other leagues. It really looks to me as he simply does not know.
It's expect he isn't going to mention any other leagues. He is working for GOM TV after all, not proleauge, MSL, etc.
So? It is all related. I expect a tennis broadcaster at Wimbledon to tell me what was going on in the French Open 3 weeks ago.
I think Mani sums it quite nicely a page before this. What does he tell you that you do not already know? What Tasteless does not appear as a professional broadcaster sometimes, and since that is his job, it can be critiziced.
On July 26 2009 18:48 HuskyTheHusky wrote: SDM: 'Lets talk more about effort'
Random guy: 'um.......... um....... to be honest I havent seen many of his games, he doesnt stick out to me as a player that is very good, but i know he's good because of that game where he beat jaedong'
hahahahha
omg
"and while I DO know his name.... " wow good fucking job
On July 26 2009 18:49 HuskyTheHusky wrote: Why so much criticism for Tasteless? He is highly entertaining and has brought a ton of new fans to the Starcraft scene. Give a brother a break.
I think the concern is the historical importance of his position, and how seriously he takes it.
So basically tasteless isn't up to date, sdm don't know whats going on half of the time(that I did notice) and now there's a random guy who is as appealing as a smack in the face doing commentary
The fault is not in this white dude. I cant believe the people from GOM, who have such big aims and sponsors and everything would make such unprofessional decision and put this guy to commentate.
On July 26 2009 18:33 Manifesto7 wrote: @ integral: It isn't too critical. I think it is embarrassing that Tasteless seems to not know what goes on in the pro scene. -- Looks like the new guy is good at figuring out colours.
I haven't really noticed or thought about this. Can you give an example of tasteless being clueless etc
Not knowing who players are or what they're known for, not being familiar with a recent map change, not knowing the latest proleague results... I can't remember his funny quotes either, sorry I can't give specific examples.
basically he doesn't go to any effort AT ALL to follow the rest of the progaming scene it's like he just goes to GOM, casts with the knowledge he has acquired from playing, and just leaves to live his 'baller lifestyle' for the rest of the week.
Well, he does have a girlfriend in Korea now, so yes, his lifestyle does seem all that "baller." And I would imagine that for him, she does take precedence over religiously following every development in the SC scene.
Anyway, hoping for game excitement (and streaming a few seconds behind some people in here, so don't be too put off if I'm a bit late on making sarcastic comments).
On July 26 2009 18:51 mdb wrote: The fault is not in this white dude. I cant believe the people from GOM, who have such big aims and sponsors and everything would make such unprofessional decision and put this guy to commentate.
True enough, but still, it hurts to listen to him.
On July 26 2009 18:51 mdb wrote: The fault is not in this white dude. I cant believe the people from GOM, who have such big aims and sponsors and everything would make such unprofessional decision and put this guy to commentate.
True enough, but still, it hurts to listen to him.
It burrrrrrnsssssss usssss.
yeah... but if the guy is actually gonna read this thread, I feel sorry for him ^^
On July 26 2009 18:51 mdb wrote: The fault is not in this white dude. I cant believe the people from GOM, who have such big aims and sponsors and everything would make such unprofessional decision and put this guy to commentate.
Yeah, seriously. If GOM really wants to be recognized as a legitimate league, then they better shape up. Of course, no one gives a damn about the foreign community.
the more this guy talks, the more I have to wonder: who the fuck do they think is watching a stream in english at 6am? it's not like this guy is a color commentator or something, it's some absolutely clueless guy who presumably is getting paid to pretend he knows what he's talking about... to entertain who, exactly?
Effort getting raped by a weird build, wraiths to snipe ovies mixed with old fantasy drop into straight up SK, really powerful opening. Vults with tons of kills too. Lurks die almost gg.
On July 26 2009 19:00 VorcePA wrote: SDM commenting if he was ref he would restart the match.
That would be some SERIOUS bullshit.
He means that if the game was no longer playable, not if they were able to continue. He was just saying that the game wasn't clearly over and he wouldn't have just handed the win to Iris, which is smart given that it seems like things are evening up again.
On July 26 2009 19:00 VorcePA wrote: SDM commenting if he was ref he would restart the match.
That would be some SERIOUS bullshit.
why are you still on the english stream =/
when I clicked on the link you gave I couldn't figure out what to click from there to get to the korean stream, since it didn't load automatically... I don't read korean at all
On July 26 2009 19:00 VorcePA wrote: SDM commenting if he was ref he would restart the match.
That would be some SERIOUS bullshit.
why are you still on the english stream =/
when I clicked on the link you gave I couldn't figure out what to click from there to get to the korean stream, since it didn't load automatically... I don't read korean at all
open it in IE
find the buttons next to the pictures of Effort and Iris, Top is HQ, The one under it is LQ and the bottom one is English.
On July 26 2009 19:00 VorcePA wrote: SDM commenting if he was ref he would restart the match.
That would be some SERIOUS bullshit.
why are you still on the english stream =/
when I clicked on the link you gave I couldn't figure out what to click from there to get to the korean stream, since it didn't load automatically... I don't read korean at all
open it in IE
find the buttons next to the pictures of Effort and Iris, Top is HQ, The one under it is LQ and the bottom one is English.
Lyn ggs.Cast is really fun, main guy knows his shit, Nick trys to pretend like he does too, but admits that he does not, so switches to jokes instead:D.Artosis in the back laughing at Nick from time to time.
Iris tries to take 1. EffOrt sacrifices lings piecemeal and they accomplish nothing. He has lings taking out Iris's mineral only while EffOrt is in the middle of the field with a few lings and a defiler trying to stop Iris from taking out his third. Not sure he can do it though.
On July 26 2009 19:10 CaptainPlatypus wrote: Expansion trade? Last I saw this was like 20 minutes ago, and Effort was getting raped. He looks nearly ahead at this point.
On July 26 2009 19:16 Scaramanga wrote: YES IRIS, if he wins flash will take this season easily and at least take a starleauge this season
I was gonna answer by saying something like this:
On July 26 2009 19:17 Plexa wrote: If iris doesn't get a huge advantage early game in subsequent games, i dont know how iris can beat effort... that was damned impressive from effort
On July 26 2009 19:17 Plexa wrote: If iris doesn't get a huge advantage early game in subsequent games, i dont know how iris can beat effort... that was damned impressive from effort
On July 26 2009 19:16 Scaramanga wrote: YES IRIS, if he wins flash will take this season easily and at least take a starleauge this season
you forget that iris has (or had) some of the sickest tvt in all of korea
yeah but still, flashs TvT right now is so ridiculous.
flashes everything right now is ridiculous.
I kind of disagree. Even though I usually hate people bitching about flash being "weak" his TvT is clearly better than anybody elses TvT. The same can definitely not be said about his TvZ or TvP
sometimes I wonder if they're just as dumb (like that one commentator that makes those weird sounds, wtf?) but I really doubt it, and remain happily ignorant
On July 26 2009 19:20 toopham wrote: This jesse guy aint all that bad guys. he's just new to commentatin and aint doing that bad of a job at all.
Yeah, he's a little clumsy (but so is tasteless). Honestly my only problem is he sounds kind of nervous and his voice is a bit too soft. Other than that he's doing a fine job pointing things out and bouncing what's happening in game off Daniel. I mean he's not Tasteless or Artosis but he's doing fine for a schmuck pulled out of the studio. XD
On July 26 2009 19:21 integral wrote: ahhhh korean commentating, thanks so much gtr
sometimes I wonder if they're just as dumb (like that one commentator that makes those weird sounds, wtf?) but I really doubt it, and remain happily ignorant
well they are professional casters and actually are mentioned to be the worst casters out of ogn/mbc/gom trio, but who cares.
On July 26 2009 19:21 integral wrote: ahhhh korean commentating, thanks so much gtr
sometimes I wonder if they're just as dumb (like that one commentator that makes those weird sounds, wtf?) but I really doubt it, and remain happily ignorant
On July 26 2009 19:21 integral wrote: ahhhh korean commentating, thanks so much gtr
sometimes I wonder if they're just as dumb (like that one commentator that makes those weird sounds, wtf?) but I really doubt it, and remain happily ignorant
well they are professional casters and actually are mentioned to be the worst casters out of ogn/mbc/gom trio, but who cares.
On July 26 2009 19:21 integral wrote: ahhhh korean commentating, thanks so much gtr
sometimes I wonder if they're just as dumb (like that one commentator that makes those weird sounds, wtf?) but I really doubt it, and remain happily ignorant
what on earth you meant by that
?
I'll say it differently: If I understood korean, I wonder if korean commentating would bother me just as much as english commentary does. I doubt it though.
I'm surprised Iris didn't thumbs down God's Garden. Guess he finds the "CJ strat" on Outsider (mass Sunken into tons of gas, all three Hive tech beasts) to be harder than playing TvZ on God's Garden.
thanks.... but its laggy as hell, guess I got to stick with the shitty commentating. English VODS are just not the same without a plott ( <--- excuse spelling)
Wow some combination of substandard play by Effort and really good play by Iris thus far this series... I hope Flash is watching and learning though Iris might actually take this series!
Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Effort probably feeling like "hey you said we weren't going to practice for this"
Now he's going to win the remaining games like that time Savior won the first three games of the skins match against Flash and then gets rolled four straight.
I'd be happy with Iris advancing. Effort (I think he's more of a lock against July than Iris is), Iris, Savior and Flash at Blizzcon would just be incredible.
I did not expect this. Maybe Effort is tired after all those games? Or perhaps it's like one of those inner team battles like ForGG vs Jaedong where the lesser player wins.
On July 26 2009 19:39 darktreb wrote: hahahahahahahaha is Flash really going to catch the luckiest break a gamer has caught in a long time???
Not saying it's a sure thing Flash beats Iris but given that it's all he has to play for and a BO5, he has to be considered a heavy favorite.
Effort and Savior were also heavy favorites over iris Iris can pull out miracles against his team mates apparently so maybe he might be able to conjour up something against flash
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
This is exactly what I was thinking. Totally finding an epic way to celebrate if he does indeed win. I may have liquibetted for Effort but I'm cheering for Iris.
I'd love to see him at Blizzcon. Effort will be raping face and winning titles for a long time to come I think.
That first push was very good. Killing the entire expansion areas of drones and following up with good defense and thus delaying tech and then a nice contain.. Wicked game tbh, GG
On July 26 2009 19:42 darod2007 wrote: I did not expect this. Maybe Effort is tired after all those games? Or perhaps it's like one of those inner team battles like ForGG vs Jaedong where the lesser player wins.
Not the best example. More like ForGG just choked Jaedong with the map Line up more than him exploiting Jaedong's weaknesses. Also ForGG was, similar to Mind and Luxury when they won, destroying everything in that MSL. Apparently anyone who wins an MSL who isn't a Bonjwa or Bisu ends up sucking. :>
Effort seems to have trouble with Iris's crazy aggression and pushes. The maps aren't that bad.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
SC2 wont be out for at least 6 months. Knowing Blizzard probably longer.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
What are you talking about Yes SC2 is coming, but in all likelihood it won't be marketable as an esport product properly until the last expansion. SC will atleast live until then
Effort has been pretty good with using his overlords / lings to scout in Proleague, but he's been caught off guard by a vulture drop and MnM push against Iris in GOM.
As a Flash fan, I'd rather have Effort get to final
Why? Simple really.
1) Nobody argues Flash's TvT is the best in the world right now. 2) Flash has to prove his TvZ isn't total shit 3) If this ends up as a Flash vs Iris Final and Flash does win, chances are people will still say stupid shit along the lines of "NOPE FLASH IS STILL A BAD TERRAN LOL" "HAHA FLASH FLASH IS BAD LOL"
On July 26 2009 19:39 darktreb wrote: hahahahahahahaha is Flash really going to catch the luckiest break a gamer has caught in a long time???
Not saying it's a sure thing Flash beats Iris but given that it's all he has to play for and a BO5, he has to be considered a heavy favorite.
Effort and Savior were also heavy favorites over iris Iris can pull out miracles against his team mates apparently so maybe he might be able to conjour up something against flash
Iris' style + brains means you can never count him out. He's one of the best out there (and probably the best Terran) at playing a build where you count on your opponent to leave you ONE window of opportunity and then seizing it. Such a valuable skill to have.
But, TvT BO5 seems like the hardest matchup to steal a series in (no ForGG 14CC jokes here please ... it's not happening this time). And is there any doubt a fully rested Flash who hasn't played in two weeks and hasn't been in a final for a whole year would win any game against Iris that didn't have its outcome decided in the first ten minutes?
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
SC2 wont be out for at least 6 months. Knowing Blizzard probably longer.
Yes, but do you honestly think SC1 will last for 2+ years after SC2 comes out? Face it, all the current SC pros don't have many more OSL's/MSL's/ProLeagues for SC.
There won't be many more SC titles to win, period. Blizzard is going to pump so much money into SC2 and so will Korea especially with the reactions at E-Stars Seoul for SC2 and the upcoming Blizzcon...
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
What are you talking about Yes SC2 is coming, but in all likelihood it won't be marketable as an esport product properly until the last expansion. SC will atleast live until then
I personally think SC2 will explode on release. I don't think we will have to wait for an expansion. Just my opinion, this is whole different beast then your typical RTS.
On July 26 2009 19:39 darktreb wrote: hahahahahahahaha is Flash really going to catch the luckiest break a gamer has caught in a long time???
Not saying it's a sure thing Flash beats Iris but given that it's all he has to play for and a BO5, he has to be considered a heavy favorite.
Effort and Savior were also heavy favorites over iris Iris can pull out miracles against his team mates apparently so maybe he might be able to conjour up something against flash
Iris' style + brains means you can never count him out. He's one of the best out there (and probably the best Terran) at playing a build where you count on your opponent to leave you ONE window of opportunity and then seizing it. Such a valuable skill to have.
But, TvT BO5 seems like the hardest matchup to steal a series in (no ForGG 14CC jokes here please ... it's not happening this time). And is there any doubt a fully rested Flash who hasn't played in two weeks and hasn't been in a final for a whole year would win any game against Iris that didn't have its outcome decided in the first ten minutes?
Honestly, I don't see anyone beating a full rested Flash, with exception to when Flash decides "today I will pretend to be Fantasy!"
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
On July 26 2009 19:45 MrHoon wrote: As a Flash fan, I'd rather have Effort get to final
Why? Simple really.
1) Nobody argues Flash's TvT is the best in the world right now. 2) Flash has to prove his TvZ isn't total shit 3) If this ends up as a Flash vs Iris Final and Flash does win, chances are people will still say stupid shit along the lines of "NOPE FLASH IS STILL A BAD TERRAN LOL" "HAHA FLASH FLASH IS BAD LOL"
4. We are denied an iris v july series to decide 3rd place. 5. Effort is a heavy heavy favorite against july and will kill his chances of going to blizzcon .
- You have to play GomTV Classic very soon. ▲ I have so many things I want to say to Iris. There is the playoffs and yet, he practiced alone for the GomTV Classic (laugh). But still, it was the day before the match so I am slightly disappointed that he didn't focus completely on the Proleague (laugh). I was worried whether he might lose, so I am very thankful that he won his match today.
On July 26 2009 19:45 MrHoon wrote: As a Flash fan, I'd rather have Effort get to final
Why? Simple really.
1) Nobody argues Flash's TvT is the best in the world right now. 2) Flash has to prove his TvZ isn't total shit 3) If this ends up as a Flash vs Iris Final and Flash does win, chances are people will still say stupid shit along the lines of "NOPE FLASH IS STILL A BAD TERRAN LOL" "HAHA FLASH FLASH IS BAD LOL"
Yeah I agree with you. Flash has probably been thinking about a finals against Effort for the past week (he basically insinuated as much in his interview) and doesn't have to do anything right now. Effort on the other hand has been extremely busy. This is literally the first time in TWELVE months that Flash has had anywhere near this amount of free time with no other obligations whatsoever to prepare for a series. I want him to have to play TvZ and to figure out how to win again, not ride a matchup (TvT) that was basically made for him given his strengths.
It's not like Flash has no hope to step up his game again ... amazingly enough he is actually 18 months younger than Effort.
On July 26 2009 19:45 MrHoon wrote: As a Flash fan, I'd rather have Effort get to final
Why? Simple really.
1) Nobody argues Flash's TvT is the best in the world right now. 2) Flash has to prove his TvZ isn't total shit 3) If this ends up as a Flash vs Iris Final and Flash does win, chances are people will still say stupid shit along the lines of "NOPE FLASH IS STILL A BAD TERRAN LOL" "HAHA FLASH FLASH IS BAD LOL"
4. We are denied an iris v july series to decide 3rd place. 5. Effort is a heavy heavy favorite against july and will kill his chances of going to blizzcon .
And yes that too, July NEEDS TO BE in Blizzcon. Seriously.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
You are the one delusional if you think the "classicness" of SC1 has anything to do with the reason it will stick around. Esports is a business just like anything else.
On July 26 2009 19:48 FearDarkness wrote: The answer to why Iris is doing so well + Show Spoiler +
- You have to play GomTV Classic very soon. ▲ I have so many things I want to say to Iris. There is the playoffs and yet, he practiced alone for the GomTV Classic (laugh). But still, it was the day before the match so I am slightly disappointed that he didn't focus completely on the Proleague (laugh). I was worried whether he might lose, so I am very thankful that he won his match today.
Woah, thanks for this! Interesting to see, especially since its so new.
On July 26 2009 19:45 MrHoon wrote: As a Flash fan, I'd rather have Effort get to final
Why? Simple really.
1) Nobody argues Flash's TvT is the best in the world right now. 2) Flash has to prove his TvZ isn't total shit 3) If this ends up as a Flash vs Iris Final and Flash does win, chances are people will still say stupid shit along the lines of "NOPE FLASH IS STILL A BAD TERRAN LOL" "HAHA FLASH FLASH IS BAD LOL"
Yeah I agree with you. Flash has probably been thinking about a finals against Effort for the past week (he basically insinuated as much in his interview) and doesn't have to do anything right now. Effort on the other hand has been extremely busy. This is literally the first time in TWELVE months that Flash has had anywhere near this amount of free time with no other obligations whatsoever to prepare for a series. I want him to have to play TvZ and to figure out how to win again, not ride a matchup (TvT) that was basically made for him given his strengths.
It's not like Flash has no hope to step up his game again ... amazingly enough he is actually 18 months younger than Effort.
On July 26 2009 19:45 MrHoon wrote: As a Flash fan, I'd rather have Effort get to final
Why? Simple really.
1) Nobody argues Flash's TvT is the best in the world right now. 2) Flash has to prove his TvZ isn't total shit 3) If this ends up as a Flash vs Iris Final and Flash does win, chances are people will still say stupid shit along the lines of "NOPE FLASH IS STILL A BAD TERRAN LOL" "HAHA FLASH FLASH IS BAD LOL"
4. We are denied an iris v july series to decide 3rd place. 5. Effort is a heavy heavy favorite against july and will kill his chances of going to blizzcon .
It's true ... Flash would likely crush Iris and Effort would definitely crush July. Takes the fun out of both matches....
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
What are you talking about Yes SC2 is coming, but in all likelihood it won't be marketable as an esport product properly until the last expansion. SC will atleast live until then
What? It's going to be the biggest E-Sport in the world when it releases. Money speaks.
I'll say this again. SC Pro scene started up when the game was fairly new still. Balance wasn't at its peak and it flourished. You don't need the extreme sort of balance of current SC1 to have a competitive thriving Pro Scene.
On July 26 2009 19:46 Aegraen wrote: If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
I completly agree.
There probably still will be a SC/BW league for some time, as there is/was for WC3... But in the end SC2 or SC/BW will vanish.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
tbh i'd rather iris win because i care far more about PL Playoffs than a GOM title
as plexa said, iris deserves another shot at a title, his TvT is very good -- yeah he's an underdog for sure against Flash, but not as huge as people think
On July 26 2009 19:45 MrHoon wrote: As a Flash fan, I'd rather have Effort get to final
Why? Simple really.
1) Nobody argues Flash's TvT is the best in the world right now. 2) Flash has to prove his TvZ isn't total shit 3) If this ends up as a Flash vs Iris Final and Flash does win, chances are people will still say stupid shit along the lines of "NOPE FLASH IS STILL A BAD TERRAN LOL" "HAHA FLASH FLASH IS BAD LOL"
Yeah I agree with you. Flash has probably been thinking about a finals against Effort for the past week (he basically insinuated as much in his interview) and doesn't have to do anything right now. Effort on the other hand has been extremely busy. This is literally the first time in TWELVE months that Flash has had anywhere near this amount of free time with no other obligations whatsoever to prepare for a series. I want him to have to play TvZ and to figure out how to win again, not ride a matchup (TvT) that was basically made for him given his strengths.
It's not like Flash has no hope to step up his game again ... amazingly enough he is actually 18 months younger than Effort.
??????????????????????
Wait Flash is YOUNGER than Effort?
WHAT THE FUCK
I don't think any notable progamer other than Baby is younger than Flash. It's absolutely unbelievable how young Flash was when he exploded onto the scene.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
What are you talking about Yes SC2 is coming, but in all likelihood it won't be marketable as an esport product properly until the last expansion. SC will atleast live until then
What? It's going to be the biggest E-Sport in the world when it releases. Money speaks.
I'll say this again. SC Pro scene started up when the game was fairly new still. Balance wasn't at its peak and it flourished. You don't need the extreme sort of balance of current SC1 to have a competitive thriving Pro Scene.
SC already has established sponsors and an established reputation which makes it more attractive to sponsors whereas SC2 is an untested product and you could get another WC3 map altering incident to fix balance happening again
Money speaks, and that money probably isn't leaving SC in korea for quite some time.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
GG Rofl Iris 3-0 Effort, Effort gets glory but Iris gets ltos of money. Weird thing is, his sick builds, he didnt even show them to skyhigh, greedy greedy player Iris is.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
WC2 battlenet was perfectly balanced too.
Orcs >>> Human
BLOODLUST IS OP MAN
Yeah, unless you were a Computer and can spam mass heal, Bloodlust was just pure ownage.
On July 26 2009 19:52 konadora wrote: Wow can't believe after 3-0 in Proleague, EffOrt's going 0-3 in GOM lol
But GOM has always been a tournament of upsets...
i knew this was going to happen when effort played so many matches in PL lol
not surprising, given its inter-team
happy though, means more time for effort to practice for PL, which is far, far more important than GOM
While he skips the pressure of a final, he still have the 3rd/4th to practice for. Given that there is a trip and more $$ on the line I hope he doesn't completely ignore it.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
WC2 battlenet was perfectly balanced too.
Orcs >>> Human
BLOODLUST IS OP MAN
Honestly I think if War2 was a brand new game today, it might be more balanced than we remember. Invisibility just has so much potential.
Also Humans dominated sea games in War2 ... the Invisible Transports were basically unstoppable.
haha haters. You can't underestimate the Terran who surprised us all and went toe-to-toe with savior in his prime. I really hope Iris can take a title. He deserved that daum one so much
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
WC2 battlenet was perfectly balanced too.
Orcs >>> Human
BLOODLUST IS OP MAN
Honestly I think if War2 was a brand new game today, it might be more balanced than we remember. Invisibility just has so much potential.
Also Humans dominated sea games in War2 ... the Invisible Transports were basically unstoppable.
You guys are SOOO underestimating how good heal was.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
WC2 battlenet was perfectly balanced too.
Orcs >>> Human
BLOODLUST IS OP MAN
Honestly I think if War2 was a brand new game today, it might be more balanced than we remember. Invisibility just has so much potential.
Also Humans dominated sea games in War2 ... the Invisible Transports were basically unstoppable.
You guys are SOOO underestimating how good heal was.
Wasn't it 6 Mana per HP? Full mana Paladin could only heal like 42 HP or something. Bloodlust cost 50 Mana so you always had it on all your Ogre Magi, didn't have to micro spells in battle (just Bloodlust up beforehand by B doubleclick B doubleclick B doubleclick ...) and it did like 2X or 3X damage I don't even remember.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
WC2 battlenet was perfectly balanced too.
Orcs >>> Human
BLOODLUST IS OP MAN
Honestly I think if War2 was a brand new game today, it might be more balanced than we remember. Invisibility just has so much potential.
Also Humans dominated sea games in War2 ... the Invisible Transports were basically unstoppable.
You guys are SOOO underestimating how good heal was.
Wasn't it 6 Mana per HP? Full mana Paladin could only heal like 42 HP or something. Bloodlust cost 50 Mana so you always had it on all your Ogre Magi, didn't have to micro spells in battle (just Bloodlust up beforehand by B doubleclick B doubleclick B doubleclick ...) and it did like 2X or 3X damage I don't even remember.
Dude you could totally 300 style bottleneck in that game. After that orc wouldn't be able to bloodlust up fast enough on D
On July 26 2009 20:00 Axidboy wrote: Iris originally came up as monster TvT befor proving he can play other matchups too, i think finals will be a lot closer than it seems on paper!!
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
What are you talking about Yes SC2 is coming, but in all likelihood it won't be marketable as an esport product properly until the last expansion. SC will atleast live until then
What? It's going to be the biggest E-Sport in the world when it releases. Money speaks.
I'll say this again. SC Pro scene started up when the game was fairly new still. Balance wasn't at its peak and it flourished. You don't need the extreme sort of balance of current SC1 to have a competitive thriving Pro Scene.
SC already has established sponsors and an established reputation which makes it more attractive to sponsors whereas SC2 is an untested product and you could get another WC3 map altering incident to fix balance happening again
Money speaks, and that money probably isn't leaving SC in korea for quite some time.
So, when the whole of Korea is playing SC2 and there is no more young blood for SC you think SC pro scene will survive? You also think that sponsors and corporations are going to pass up an opportunity to be the leaders of the largest, most successful international E-Sport?
SC2 is going to be massive, simply massive. Blizzard is going to pump hundreds of thousands of dollars into SC2. Theres a good chance that Blizzard will try and jumpstart the American E-Sports revolution and its quite possible for an American Proleague. Secondly, GOM will be heavily invested in the International and National Scene and when the corporations and sponsors see the massive success they will instantly jump on board.
Face it, SC1 has at most 2 more years of shelf life. There won't be many more titles to win.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
WC2 battlenet was perfectly balanced too.
Orcs >>> Human
BLOODLUST IS OP MAN
Honestly I think if War2 was a brand new game today, it might be more balanced than we remember. Invisibility just has so much potential.
Also Humans dominated sea games in War2 ... the Invisible Transports were basically unstoppable.
You guys are SOOO underestimating how good heal was.
Wasn't it 6 Mana per HP? Full mana Paladin could only heal like 42 HP or something. Bloodlust cost 50 Mana so you always had it on all your Ogre Magi, didn't have to micro spells in battle (just Bloodlust up beforehand by B doubleclick B doubleclick B doubleclick ...) and it did like 2X or 3X damage I don't even remember.
Dude you could totally 300 style bottleneck in that game. After that orc wouldn't be able to bloodlust up fast enough on D
Theoretically one can just spam Rune onto the Chokepoint instantly killing all paladins
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
WC2 battlenet was perfectly balanced too.
Orcs >>> Human
BLOODLUST IS OP MAN
Honestly I think if War2 was a brand new game today, it might be more balanced than we remember. Invisibility just has so much potential.
Also Humans dominated sea games in War2 ... the Invisible Transports were basically unstoppable.
You guys are SOOO underestimating how good heal was.
Wasn't it 6 Mana per HP? Full mana Paladin could only heal like 42 HP or something. Bloodlust cost 50 Mana so you always had it on all your Ogre Magi, didn't have to micro spells in battle (just Bloodlust up beforehand by B doubleclick B doubleclick B doubleclick ...) and it did like 2X or 3X damage I don't even remember.
Dude you could totally 300 style bottleneck in that game. After that orc wouldn't be able to bloodlust up fast enough on D
I don't remember bottlenecks working that well ... by the time you get Heal, Death and Decay wasn't too far away and that singlehandedly eliminated the concept of a "contain" in every way.
On July 26 2009 19:45 Itachii wrote: [quote] you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
WC2 battlenet was perfectly balanced too.
Orcs >>> Human
BLOODLUST IS OP MAN
Honestly I think if War2 was a brand new game today, it might be more balanced than we remember. Invisibility just has so much potential.
Also Humans dominated sea games in War2 ... the Invisible Transports were basically unstoppable.
You guys are SOOO underestimating how good heal was.
Wasn't it 6 Mana per HP? Full mana Paladin could only heal like 42 HP or something. Bloodlust cost 50 Mana so you always had it on all your Ogre Magi, didn't have to micro spells in battle (just Bloodlust up beforehand by B doubleclick B doubleclick B doubleclick ...) and it did like 2X or 3X damage I don't even remember.
Dude you could totally 300 style bottleneck in that game. After that orc wouldn't be able to bloodlust up fast enough on D
Theoretically one can just spam Rune onto the Chokepoint instantly killing all paladins
God Rune Spam was so gay
Ohh yeah haha almost forgot about Rune! The grandfather of Spider Mines haha!
Ogre Magi definitely rocked Paladins. But Mages were way better than Death Knights because of Invis and the lack of Exorcism.
On July 26 2009 19:45 Itachii wrote: [quote] you are delusional,balancing SC2 will take months, till then there will be no true pro stuff in it.And keep waiting for it to come, this "soon" is since like 4 months. Some of you are acting like as soon as this SC2 comes out, SC1 will dissapear.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
WC2 battlenet was perfectly balanced too.
Orcs >>> Human
BLOODLUST IS OP MAN
Honestly I think if War2 was a brand new game today, it might be more balanced than we remember. Invisibility just has so much potential.
Also Humans dominated sea games in War2 ... the Invisible Transports were basically unstoppable.
You guys are SOOO underestimating how good heal was.
Wasn't it 6 Mana per HP? Full mana Paladin could only heal like 42 HP or something. Bloodlust cost 50 Mana so you always had it on all your Ogre Magi, didn't have to micro spells in battle (just Bloodlust up beforehand by B doubleclick B doubleclick B doubleclick ...) and it did like 2X or 3X damage I don't even remember.
Dude you could totally 300 style bottleneck in that game. After that orc wouldn't be able to bloodlust up fast enough on D
I don't remember bottlenecks working that well ... by the time you get Heal, Death and Decay wasn't too far away and that singlehandedly eliminated the concept of a "contain" in every way.
Well, regardless this went from Orge Mag v Paladin to meta game theory crafting and I don't want to start that shit. The point is, I think pros will go to where the money is.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
What are you talking about Yes SC2 is coming, but in all likelihood it won't be marketable as an esport product properly until the last expansion. SC will atleast live until then
What? It's going to be the biggest E-Sport in the world when it releases. Money speaks.
I'll say this again. SC Pro scene started up when the game was fairly new still. Balance wasn't at its peak and it flourished. You don't need the extreme sort of balance of current SC1 to have a competitive thriving Pro Scene.
SC already has established sponsors and an established reputation which makes it more attractive to sponsors whereas SC2 is an untested product and you could get another WC3 map altering incident to fix balance happening again
Money speaks, and that money probably isn't leaving SC in korea for quite some time.
So, when the whole of Korea is playing SC2 and there is no more young blood for SC you think SC pro scene will survive? You also think that sponsors and corporations are going to pass up an opportunity to be the leaders of the largest, most successful international E-Sport?
SC2 is going to be massive, simply massive. Blizzard is going to pump hundreds of thousands of dollars into SC2. Theres a good chance that Blizzard will try and jumpstart the American E-Sports revolution and its quite possible for an American Proleague. Secondly, GOM will be heavily invested in the International and National Scene and when the corporations and sponsors see the massive success they will instantly jump on board.
Face it, SC1 has at most 2 more years of shelf life. There won't be many more titles to win.
If you didn't notice SC1 Pro scene didn't start up when SC hit its balance peak. A lot of you seem to be forgetting this. Also, money speaks. Players will go where the money is, and that will be SC2.
How do you know where money will go?Blizzard became GOM sponsor few weeks ago.Sure pro scene didnt start when SC was perfectly balanced like now, but you need this balance to get SC1 pros to SC2.Why move over to inbalanced game when you have all the leagues and set scene for SC?Becouse of better graphics? You are very enthousiastic about SC2 and thats understandable, but dont expect it to take over SC1 like nothing, especially in korea.
WC2 battlenet was perfectly balanced too.
Orcs >>> Human
BLOODLUST IS OP MAN
Honestly I think if War2 was a brand new game today, it might be more balanced than we remember. Invisibility just has so much potential.
Also Humans dominated sea games in War2 ... the Invisible Transports were basically unstoppable.
You guys are SOOO underestimating how good heal was.
Wasn't it 6 Mana per HP? Full mana Paladin could only heal like 42 HP or something. Bloodlust cost 50 Mana so you always had it on all your Ogre Magi, didn't have to micro spells in battle (just Bloodlust up beforehand by B doubleclick B doubleclick B doubleclick ...) and it did like 2X or 3X damage I don't even remember.
Dude you could totally 300 style bottleneck in that game. After that orc wouldn't be able to bloodlust up fast enough on D
I don't remember bottlenecks working that well ... by the time you get Heal, Death and Decay wasn't too far away and that singlehandedly eliminated the concept of a "contain" in every way.
Well, regardless this went from Orge Mag v Paladin to meta game theory crafting and I don't want to start that shit. The point is, I think pros will go to where the money is.
Haha ok fair enough. As my parting comment, I did actually play Human primarily and liked it more. But man, Bloodlust was good....
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
What are you talking about Yes SC2 is coming, but in all likelihood it won't be marketable as an esport product properly until the last expansion. SC will atleast live until then
What? It's going to be the biggest E-Sport in the world when it releases. Money speaks.
I'll say this again. SC Pro scene started up when the game was fairly new still. Balance wasn't at its peak and it flourished. You don't need the extreme sort of balance of current SC1 to have a competitive thriving Pro Scene.
SC already has established sponsors and an established reputation which makes it more attractive to sponsors whereas SC2 is an untested product and you could get another WC3 map altering incident to fix balance happening again
Money speaks, and that money probably isn't leaving SC in korea for quite some time.
So, when the whole of Korea is playing SC2 and there is no more young blood for SC you think SC pro scene will survive? You also think that sponsors and corporations are going to pass up an opportunity to be the leaders of the largest, most successful international E-Sport?
SC2 is going to be massive, simply massive. Blizzard is going to pump hundreds of thousands of dollars into SC2. Theres a good chance that Blizzard will try and jumpstart the American E-Sports revolution and its quite possible for an American Proleague. Secondly, GOM will be heavily invested in the International and National Scene and when the corporations and sponsors see the massive success they will instantly jump on board.
Face it, SC1 has at most 2 more years of shelf life. There won't be many more titles to win.
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
What are you talking about Yes SC2 is coming, but in all likelihood it won't be marketable as an esport product properly until the last expansion. SC will atleast live until then
What? It's going to be the biggest E-Sport in the world when it releases. Money speaks.
I'll say this again. SC Pro scene started up when the game was fairly new still. Balance wasn't at its peak and it flourished. You don't need the extreme sort of balance of current SC1 to have a competitive thriving Pro Scene.
SC already has established sponsors and an established reputation which makes it more attractive to sponsors whereas SC2 is an untested product and you could get another WC3 map altering incident to fix balance happening again
Money speaks, and that money probably isn't leaving SC in korea for quite some time.
So, when the whole of Korea is playing SC2 and there is no more young blood for SC you think SC pro scene will survive? You also think that sponsors and corporations are going to pass up an opportunity to be the leaders of the largest, most successful international E-Sport?
SC2 is going to be massive, simply massive. Blizzard is going to pump hundreds of thousands of dollars into SC2. Theres a good chance that Blizzard will try and jumpstart the American E-Sports revolution and its quite possible for an American Proleague. Secondly, GOM will be heavily invested in the International and National Scene and when the corporations and sponsors see the massive success they will instantly jump on board.
Face it, SC1 has at most 2 more years of shelf life. There won't be many more titles to win.
someone is really going to be dissapointed
Someone is totally going to eat his words.
send me pm with this post 2 months... hell even half a year after SC2 is out and lets see how pro scene set in it
On July 26 2009 19:40 Plexa wrote: Iris winning one more game would mean so much more than effort. Let's face it, effort is a fucking monster and will win many more titles and have many more chances at making a title. This is pretty much iris's last chance. After Shinhan 3/Daum he really fucking deserves another crack at a title.
Eh? SC2 is coming out shortly. At best, there is only 2 more years for pro SC1. There is going to be so much money in SC2, its going to be ridiculous.
What are you talking about Yes SC2 is coming, but in all likelihood it won't be marketable as an esport product properly until the last expansion. SC will atleast live until then
What? It's going to be the biggest E-Sport in the world when it releases. Money speaks.
I'll say this again. SC Pro scene started up when the game was fairly new still. Balance wasn't at its peak and it flourished. You don't need the extreme sort of balance of current SC1 to have a competitive thriving Pro Scene.
SC already has established sponsors and an established reputation which makes it more attractive to sponsors whereas SC2 is an untested product and you could get another WC3 map altering incident to fix balance happening again
Money speaks, and that money probably isn't leaving SC in korea for quite some time.
So, when the whole of Korea is playing SC2 and there is no more young blood for SC you think SC pro scene will survive? You also think that sponsors and corporations are going to pass up an opportunity to be the leaders of the largest, most successful international E-Sport?
SC2 is going to be massive, simply massive. Blizzard is going to pump hundreds of thousands of dollars into SC2. Theres a good chance that Blizzard will try and jumpstart the American E-Sports revolution and its quite possible for an American Proleague. Secondly, GOM will be heavily invested in the International and National Scene and when the corporations and sponsors see the massive success they will instantly jump on board.
Face it, SC1 has at most 2 more years of shelf life. There won't be many more titles to win.
someone is really going to be dissapointed
I know, as much as you would love SC to survive for a hundred years, it simply won't. You can either get with the future or die with the past. Choice is yours.
@ Aegraen: Every prediction you made about SC's demise might as well be verbatim from the discussion pre-WC3. SC will last more than 2 years after SC2's release.
On July 26 2009 20:12 NovaTheFeared wrote: @ Aegraen: Every prediction you made about SC's demise might as well be verbatim from the discussion pre-WC3. SC will last more than 2 years after SC2's release.
On July 26 2009 20:12 NovaTheFeared wrote: @ Aegraen: Every prediction you made about SC's demise might as well be verbatim from the discussion pre-WC3. SC will last more than 2 years after SC2's release.
WC3 is a completely different game. WC3 is also not the successor to SC. When you bring something relevant to the discussion then I might be interested.
On July 26 2009 20:12 NovaTheFeared wrote: @ Aegraen: Every prediction you made about SC's demise might as well be verbatim from the discussion pre-WC3. SC will last more than 2 years after SC2's release.
WC3 is a completely different game. WC3 is also not the successor to SC. When you bring something relevant to the discussion then I might be interested.
@Nova, thats exactly the same as saying pre-Diablo II will kill SC.
On July 26 2009 20:12 NovaTheFeared wrote: @ Aegraen: Every prediction you made about SC's demise might as well be verbatim from the discussion pre-WC3. SC will last more than 2 years after SC2's release.
WC3 is a completely different game. WC3 is also not the successor to SC. When you bring something relevant to the discussion then I might be interested.
@Nova, thats exactly the same as saying pre-Diablo II will kill SC.
If you're going to make analogies, you should at least try to keep them in the same genre, dude.
On July 26 2009 20:12 NovaTheFeared wrote: @ Aegraen: Every prediction you made about SC's demise might as well be verbatim from the discussion pre-WC3. SC will last more than 2 years after SC2's release.
WC3 is a completely different game. WC3 is also not the successor to SC. When you bring something relevant to the discussion then I might be interested.
@Nova, thats exactly the same as saying pre-Diablo II will kill SC.
If you're going to make analogies, you should at least try to keep them in the same genre, dude.
You missed the point. Congratulations. Ill be in [e-stars] final thread. Enjoy your small brain.
The fact that keV. and Aegraen weren't around for the legions of posts screaming that Blizzard's new RTS (WC3) will kill SC, and failing to do so, makes their opinions on the subject that Blizzard's next newest RTS (SC2) will kill SC, all the less convincing.
Don't try to flame, either, keV. or you'll have a short stay here.
On July 26 2009 20:26 NovaTheFeared wrote: The fact that keV. and Aegraen weren't around for the legions of posts screaming that Blizzard's new RTS (WC3) will kill SC, and failing to do so, makes their opinions on the subject that Blizzard's next newest RTS (SC2) will kill SC, all the less convincing.
Don't try to flame, either, keV. or you'll have a short stay here.
Because we all know that legions of posts screaming things are historically important and well thought out. If you are going to argue based on team liquid's (as much as like it) history instead of the history of e-sports globally, then your opinions on the subject are the ones that truly don't matter.
Try and read a little bit. Your post count and join date don't hold any value, in my eyes, when in the realm of reasonable argument. Embarrassing fall back if you ask me.
On July 26 2009 20:26 NovaTheFeared wrote: The fact that keV. and Aegraen weren't around for the legions of posts screaming that Blizzard's new RTS (WC3) will kill SC, and failing to do so, makes their opinions on the subject that Blizzard's next newest RTS (SC2) will kill SC, all the less convincing.
Don't try to flame, either, keV. or you'll have a short stay here.
Because we all know that legions of posts screaming things are historically important and well thought out. If you are going to argue based on team liquid's (as much as like it) history instead of the history of e-sports globally, then your opinions on the subject are the ones that truly don't matter.
Try and read a little bit. Your post count and join date don't hold any value, in my eyes, when in the realm of reasonable argument. Embarrassing fall back if you ask me.
Which is more relevant to a discussion of whether Blizzard's new RTS will kill SC: WC3, a Blizzard RTS which was hyped to kill SC and didn't, or D2 which is an RPG game in a different genre? It seems to me you are the one who is having trouble making a coherent argument.
On July 26 2009 20:26 NovaTheFeared wrote: The fact that keV. and Aegraen weren't around for the legions of posts screaming that Blizzard's new RTS (WC3) will kill SC, and failing to do so, makes their opinions on the subject that Blizzard's next newest RTS (SC2) will kill SC, all the less convincing.
Don't try to flame, either, keV. or you'll have a short stay here.
Because we all know that legions of posts screaming things are historically important and well thought out. If you are going to argue based on team liquid's (as much as like it) history instead of the history of e-sports globally, then your opinions on the subject are the ones that truly don't matter.
Try and read a little bit. Your post count and join date don't hold any value, in my eyes, when in the realm of reasonable argument. Embarrassing fall back if you ask me.
Which is more relevant to a discussion of whether Blizzard's new RTS will kill SC: WC3, a Blizzard RTS which was hyped to kill SC and didn't, or D2 which is an RPG game in a different genre? It seems to me you are the one who is having trouble making a coherent argument.
The point that I was making (that you missed) was that: D2 is just as much like SC as WC3. ie; not at all. Even though its by the same dev.
The fact that it was "hyped to" doesn't mean anything. The only similarities were that it is a real time strategy. If those legions of posters knew just how different it was, they wouldn't have posted that stupid shit. Now if WC3 had been called SC2 and promised by the developers themselves that it would play exactly like SC, then I could see you using this as evidence, because the legions of idiots, would have had a point.
When you have the factual history of e-sports in one hand and the legions of rants by idiots in the other, it isn't hard to make an informed decision.
It's because no one gives a shit about this tournament
I don't care if GOM is less prestigious, if you don't give a fuck about a tournament with like.. 40 000$ for first place, then you are kind of an idiot (as a progamer) :S
I mean, that's a loooot of money, I refuse to believe they don't practice for it.
It's because no one gives a shit about this tournament
I don't care if GOM is less prestigious, if you don't give a fuck about a tournament with like.. 40 000$ for first place, then you are kind of an idiot (as a progamer) :S
I mean, that's a loooot of money, I refuse to believe they don't practice for it.
According to Effort's post-proleague win interview, Iris was practicing hard for this series instead of for PL, which is pretty funny.
Perhaps Iris is hearing the music now ... this really is probably his last, best shot to win any league. Yeah he's still got MSL, and I'm rooting for him hard, but I still can't see him beating Bisu even with a 1-0 lead.
On July 26 2009 20:26 NovaTheFeared wrote: The fact that keV. and Aegraen weren't around for the legions of posts screaming that Blizzard's new RTS (WC3) will kill SC, and failing to do so, makes their opinions on the subject that Blizzard's next newest RTS (SC2) will kill SC, all the less convincing.
Don't try to flame, either, keV. or you'll have a short stay here.
Because we all know that legions of posts screaming things are historically important and well thought out. If you are going to argue based on team liquid's (as much as like it) history instead of the history of e-sports globally, then your opinions on the subject are the ones that truly don't matter.
Try and read a little bit. Your post count and join date don't hold any value, in my eyes, when in the realm of reasonable argument. Embarrassing fall back if you ask me.
Which is more relevant to a discussion of whether Blizzard's new RTS will kill SC: WC3, a Blizzard RTS which was hyped to kill SC and didn't, or D2 which is an RPG game in a different genre? It seems to me you are the one who is having trouble making a coherent argument.
The point that I was making (that you missed) was that: D2 is just as much like SC as WC3. ie; not at all. Even though its by the same dev.
The fact that it was "hyped to" doesn't mean anything. The only similarities were that it is a real time strategy. If those legions of posters knew just how different it was, they wouldn't have posted that stupid shit. Now if WC3 had been called SC2 and promised by the developers themselves that it would play exactly like SC, then I could see you using this as evidence, because the legions of idiots, would have had a point.
When you have the factual history of e-sports in one hand and the legions of rants by idiots in the other, it isn't hard to make an informed decision.
I agree that it isn't hard to make an informed decision, but I disagree about the conclusion. Sucessors in RTS are often guaranteed commercial success, but they are not guaranteed e-sports sucess. Only great gameplay and fine balance can upset a titan like SC. SC2 isn't going to be shipped out of the box with 1.09-esque balance, and it shouldn't be expected to. It will take many patches before SC2 becomes balanced enough and builds enough of a base, from both gamers and sponsors, to replace SC. That is why a 2 year kill timer on SC is quite laughable.
I think so many people are going to ignore the fact that the game needs to mature, and throw a ton of money at it. Which is a shame, cause that is one way to make the game less successful.
On July 26 2009 22:57 ret wrote: could anyone give a quick recap of each game?
Game 1, Iris walls off, builds a rine, then builds a tank, and a wraith faking a 2port wraith build, then proceeds to go fantasy build with dship, puts a couple of vults in a dship, drops, kills at least 15 drones, and is way ahead, and keeps his position the entire game while killing Effort expos, Effort does some fancy stuff and then proceeds to give up.
Game 2, Effort goes 2hat muta, Iris goes 1rax FE, IRis gets the 2nd rax and academy very early and proceeds for a timing push exactly when spire finishes, Effort had 1 sunk, Iris proceeds to break the sunks and kill 6-7 drones off a 2hat muta build killing efforts econ completely, Iris defends vs the muta harass, then proceeds to push out abusing the map and Efforts lack of lurks, and makes a Tank/MnM/Bunker/Turret line and slow pushes into effort's nat and effort couldnt do anything.
Game 3, Effort goes 9pool turbo zvz 2hat muta, Iris walls off ling proof, and proceeds to mine the back door, however that was not really necessary as the sunk itself was late and iris gets a few drones, then it turned out as the sunk was not in range of the larvae, Iris proceeds to kill 2 larve, leaving effort with 4 mutas instead of 6, while this is going on, Iris goes fast armory while adding another fac to prepare for muta, masses up Goliaths, defends vs the muta harass, moves out right when he takes his first expo with around 8 goli/5 rine and busts effort with ease while continuing to rally units into effort's nat.
Iris's builds were really sick and well prepared this series. You should definetly look into them as some sick TvZ builds, as icc Ts will definetly be copying them and using them against you.
I have so many things I want to say to Iris. There is the playoffs and yet, he practiced alone for the GomTV Classic (laugh). But still, it was the day before the match so I am slightly disappointed that he didn't focus completely on the Proleague (laugh). I was worried whether he might lose, so I am very thankful that he won his match today.
On July 27 2009 00:17 Scaramanga wrote: Flash has gotta be so happy now, he should take this 3-0 If he dose, he won't have lost a game in gom rofl
Doubtful. People keep underestimating Iris, but he's easily in the top tier of Terran players in the league. He's a seasoned veteran and a great player, and Flash's arrogance could be his downfall here.
Most of the guys saying Flash > Iris ez probably are new to the SC scene. Iris is one of the greatest TvT players of all time. I doubt anyone forget his old TvT streaks where he just ABUSED everyone. I remember that interview where he said something along the lines of "how can I lose a matchup where we have the same units?"
On July 27 2009 01:20 Ace wrote: Most of the guys saying Flash > Iris ez probably are new to the SC scene. Iris is one of the greatest TvT players of all time. I doubt anyone forget his old TvT streaks where he just ABUSED everyone. I remember that interview where he said something along the lines of "how can I lose a matchup where we have the same units?"
lol fucking own
LOL he really said that? Wow that is ownage right there
Flash being arrogant? If this was an year ago I'd wholehearted agree but Flash being Arrogant now? The kid hasn't been passing RO16 in MSL and OSL for months now, his team is in total shambles and is being called a "Washed Up Player" already in Korea. I highly doubt he can be arrogant at this point.
Xellos/Casy/Iris have all been great (AWESOME) TvT'r, hell Flash has even admitted he wanted to start his Progaming career because of how brilliant Casy was at TvT and respects top top TvTrs like the 3 I mentioned above.
But right now as I read these posts from members, all I see is blatant fanboism.
Just because one is a 'Seasoned Veteran' does not automatically qualify them as a great player. Both Flash and Iris had their "omg im so good i can do anything and get away with it" past and I for one am happy to see 2 of the greatest TvTrs duke it out in a BO5 final.
It's because no one gives a shit about this tournament
I don't care if GOM is less prestigious, if you don't give a fuck about a tournament with like.. 40 000$ for first place, then you are kind of an idiot (as a progamer) :S
I mean, that's a loooot of money, I refuse to believe they don't practice for it.
According to Effort's post-proleague win interview, Iris was practicing hard for this series instead of for PL, which is pretty funny.
Perhaps Iris is hearing the music now ... this really is probably his last, best shot to win any league. Yeah he's still got MSL, and I'm rooting for him hard, but I still can't see him beating Bisu even with a 1-0 lead.
Lol this reminds me of why I don't like proleague ;p
I miss the days when the individual leagues were #1 and people practiced for that.. I hate when there's a big individual league final or something and the players say "well I had to practice for proleague.. so I didn't get to practice for this very much".
SC is so much more fun in a BO5 setting between the same players
On July 26 2009 22:57 ret wrote: could anyone give a quick recap of each game?
Game 1, Iris walls off, builds a rine, then builds a tank, and a wraith faking a 2port wraith build, then proceeds to go fantasy build with dship, puts a couple of vults in a dship, drops, kills at least 15 drones, and is way ahead, and keeps his position the entire game while killing Effort expos, Effort does some fancy stuff and then proceeds to give up.
Game 2, Effort goes 2hat muta, Iris goes 1rax FE, IRis gets the 2nd rax and academy very early and proceeds for a timing push exactly when spire finishes, Effort had 1 sunk, Iris proceeds to break the sunks and kill 6-7 drones off a 2hat muta build killing efforts econ completely, Iris defends vs the muta harass, then proceeds to push out abusing the map and Efforts lack of lurks, and makes a Tank/MnM/Bunker/Turret line and slow pushes into effort's nat and effort couldnt do anything.
Game 3, Effort goes 9pool turbo zvz 2hat muta, Iris walls off ling proof, and proceeds to mine the back door, however that was not really necessary as the sunk itself was late and iris gets a few drones, then it turned out as the sunk was not in range of the larvae, Iris proceeds to kill 2 larve, leaving effort with 4 mutas instead of 6, while this is going on, Iris goes fast armory while adding another fac to prepare for muta, masses up Goliaths, defends vs the muta harass, moves out right when he takes his first expo with around 8 goli/5 rine and busts effort with ease while continuing to rally units into effort's nat.
Iris's builds were really sick and well prepared this series. You should definetly look into them as some sick TvZ builds, as icc Ts will definetly be copying them and using them against you.
I have so many things I want to say to Iris. There is the playoffs and yet, he practiced alone for the GomTV Classic (laugh). But still, it was the day before the match so I am slightly disappointed that he didn't focus completely on the Proleague (laugh). I was worried whether he might lose, so I am very thankful that he won his match today.
From effort
Hm.
Iris is just an older fella hungry for a first individual win that's barely escaped him so far, duh effort
You'd think he would support his older teammate instead of half baked bitter whining like this
I have so many things I want to say to Iris. There is the playoffs and yet, he practiced alone for the GomTV Classic (laugh). But still, it was the day before the match so I am slightly disappointed that he didn't focus completely on the Proleague (laugh). I was worried whether he might lose, so I am very thankful that he won his match today.
From Effort's post-pl interview it's obvious that Effort did not practise at all for GOM whereas for Iris Grom was on top of his priority list. Besides teammate battles always produced interesting/surprising results. bisu-fantasy, jaedong-forgg, iris-savior, etc
I have so many things I want to say to Iris. There is the playoffs and yet, he practiced alone for the GomTV Classic (laugh). But still, it was the day before the match so I am slightly disappointed that he didn't focus completely on the Proleague (laugh). I was worried whether he might lose, so I am very thankful that he won his match today.
From effort
Hm.
Iris is just an older fella hungry for a first individual win that's barely escaped him so far, duh effort
You'd think he would support his older teammate instead of half baked bitter whining like this
I was disappointed that EffOrt didn't 3-0 and continue his hot streak, but Iris is on a hot streak of his own now, and as boring as TvT can be I hope Iris v Flash is a close/action packed final
Kinda interesting looking back. Out of a bracket half that included Jaedong, Nada, Luxury, Mind, Effort, Zero, Free, and Stork, it was Iris that made it through. Amazing what a few upsets can do to tournament results.
On July 26 2009 21:32 Manifesto7 wrote: I think so many people are going to ignore the fact that the game needs to mature, and throw a ton of money at it. Which is a shame, cause that is one way to make the game less successful.
doesn't the extra money help it mature faster though?
On July 26 2009 21:32 Manifesto7 wrote: I think so many people are going to ignore the fact that the game needs to mature, and throw a ton of money at it. Which is a shame, cause that is one way to make the game less successful.
doesn't the extra money help it mature faster though?
It's unfortunate that Iris only had to practice for his one TvT match, when Effort clearly had to practice both ZvZ and ZvP in anticipation of his ace and superace matches. Effort takes one for the team, like a real champ.
Great job Iris! I can't wait for the TvT finals, I'm sick of seeing zerg left and right. Where was the last time we saw a TvT BO5? Flash vs ForGG in MSL probably...
While I like gom and it produces good games, I feel it would be better if the later parts of the tournament was played in the downtime between the all the other tournaments. So it would be like Ro128-Ro8. Break time! Teams go on vacation! Ro8-onwards.
Who would have thought... Iris played really well in the series..
You can't really blame Iris for practicing more for this one. Effort had obviously to carry his team while Iris job was just to win his two games. That left him with much more time for GOM.
Anyway, I am really happy to see TvT in the finals. We haven't really TvT series between two top T players in a loooong time.
I think by recent results noone should underestimate Iris. Flash is right now on 10 win streak against T. Let's see how far he can push it.
It's because no one gives a shit about this tournament
BULLSHIT, Its because umm well lets see Flash is way better than Backho and was in god mode back then same for JD and shuttle. Free sucks pvp relatively so getting 3-0d isnt a suprise. Bisu was in rape mode and skyhigh was still green and you had maps like Medusa thus 3-0. Flash 3-0ing july isnt that suprising, but it was julys late game that cost him games. Effort vs Iris is only suprise 3-0, Personally I thought Iris had a great shot, lifetime TvZ 59.1% coming into the match is nothing to scoff at, not to mention hes playing great SC and effort is his teammate, the experience factor and good builds/timing lead to his victory.
But yea really plays dont give a shit about a large cash prize yea that must be right. Though its funny how when everyone's player loses all of a sudden the guy didnt give a shit about GOM. LOL its all about the $$$$$$.
It's because no one gives a shit about this tournament
BULLSHIT, Its because umm well lets see Flash is way better than Backho and was in god mode back then same for JD and shuttle. Free sucks pvp relatively so getting 3-0d isnt a suprise. Bisu was in rape mode and skyhigh was still green and you had maps like Medusa thus 3-0. Flash 3-0ing july isnt that suprising, but it was julys late game that cost him games. Effort vs Iris is only suprise 3-0, Personally I thought Iris had a great shot, lifetime TvZ 59.1% coming into the match is nothing to scoff at, not to mention hes playing great SC and effort is his teammate, the experience factor and good builds/timing lead to his victory.
But yea really plays dont give a shit about a large cash prize yea that must be right. Though its funny how when everyone's player loses all of a sudden the guy didnt give a shit about GOM. LOL its all about the $$$$$$.
It's not that they don't care, it's that they are contractually obligated to put Proleague first, individual leagues second. Also, OSL > MSL > GOM in terms of prestige, and therefore practice time.
Players on teams not in the playoffs or not in other leagues can practice more for GOM.
On July 26 2009 20:00 Axidboy wrote: Iris originally came up as monster TvT befor proving he can play other matchups too, i think finals will be a lot closer than it seems on paper!!
Yeah the TvT lineage was like this
Xellos Casy Iris Flash
You're missing Goodfriend and Canata, both of who were considered 'Best' for awhile.
It's because no one gives a shit about this tournament
BULLSHIT, Its because umm well lets see Flash is way better than Backho and was in god mode back then same for JD and shuttle. Free sucks pvp relatively so getting 3-0d isnt a suprise. Bisu was in rape mode and skyhigh was still green and you had maps like Medusa thus 3-0. Flash 3-0ing july isnt that suprising, but it was julys late game that cost him games. Effort vs Iris is only suprise 3-0, Personally I thought Iris had a great shot, lifetime TvZ 59.1% coming into the match is nothing to scoff at, not to mention hes playing great SC and effort is his teammate, the experience factor and good builds/timing lead to his victory.
But yea really plays dont give a shit about a large cash prize yea that must be right. Though its funny how when everyone's player loses all of a sudden the guy didnt give a shit about GOM. LOL its all about the $$$$$$.
It's not that they don't care, it's that they are contractually obligated to put Proleague first, individual leagues second. Also, OSL > MSL > GOM in terms of prestige, and therefore practice time.
Players on teams not in the playoffs or not in other leagues can practice more for GOM.
Yes, that point is probably true depending on the team and the specific players contract, but Effort said Iris was still practicing like a mad man even until the day before proleague, thus splitting some of the time he was practicing for proleague with gom practice. The prestige thing is nice but thats irrelevant to the original statement, because shuttle wasnt in any other league nor where most of the other losers who lost 0-3. And logically the player is gonna devote their time based on their odds of winning only makes financial sense.
Either lets stop trying to John for Effort, Iris outplayed(and apparently outpracticed) him. GG.
On July 26 2009 20:00 Axidboy wrote: Iris originally came up as monster TvT befor proving he can play other matchups too, i think finals will be a lot closer than it seems on paper!!
Yeah the TvT lineage was like this
Xellos Casy Iris Flash
You're missing Goodfriend and Canata, both of who were considered 'Best' for awhile.
On July 26 2009 20:00 Axidboy wrote: Iris originally came up as monster TvT befor proving he can play other matchups too, i think finals will be a lot closer than it seems on paper!!
Yeah the TvT lineage was like this
Xellos Casy Iris Flash
You're missing Goodfriend and Canata, both of who were considered 'Best' for awhile.
On July 26 2009 20:00 Axidboy wrote: Iris originally came up as monster TvT befor proving he can play other matchups too, i think finals will be a lot closer than it seems on paper!!
Yeah the TvT lineage was like this
Xellos Casy Iris Flash
You're missing Goodfriend and Canata, both of who were considered 'Best' for awhile.
Canata doesn't really count, the only person who argued for him was JWD and JWD (very convincingly) argued that he was the best for a very slim 1 month period.
Goodfriend is probably missing. I don't know TvT lineages very well because these peoples "reigns" probably interfere with the Nada/Oov's bonjawa times.
Yeah GoodFriend destroyed TvT he's 2:0 against BoxeR, 6:6 with iloveoov. He's 0:4 vs Casy and 2;7 vs NaDa so I guess one of them was the terrans, who he kept losing to :D
I am not trying to take away from Iris' win, but there are two factors that I'm sure played a role in this: 1.) Battles between teammates always tend to be unpredictable. Does anybody remember Reach going 3-2 over Chojja in MSL semi-finals? Back then Chojja was considered to be the #2 ZvP player in the world behind only Savior (July wasn't playing so well at that time...) and PvZ has always been Reach's worst MU. But Reach won... 2.) Effort said in his interview after PL that Iris had been practicing for this match while he was focusing on PL. Iris came into this match better prepared. For Effort, it was a match between teammates; for Iris it was a chance to restore his former glory.
As I said, I don't mean to belittle Iris. You simply do not win against an S-class Zerg by playing like shit. But I just wanted to say that while Iris winning 3-0 is a surprise, it's not an unimaginable result, nor does it indicate that Effort is worse than we think or thatIris is necessarily better than we think.
Can people stop making stupid arguments like "Iris used to be the best TvT player he'll show you what's up" and "Flash is not what he used to be"? That's an awful argument since Flash is currently clearly the best TvT player and has won 10 straight in TvT. Since when is the old best "XvY" player considered to be comparable to the current best "XvY" player? That's ridiculous ... almost as ridiculous as the "Flash's arrogance will doom him" claim. Like MrHoon said, Flash is being considered washed up (or close to it) now ... how cruel progaming is for a guy who is:
- 12 months younger than Fantasy - 12 months younger than Skyhigh - 32 months younger than Leta - Over 9000 months younger than Canata
Age really is just a number....
Here's a REAL argument for a close series: Iris has always been very smart at TvT and has an aggressive style that he might be able to parlay into early game wins (or huge advantages) against a late game focused Flash. There's very little chance of Iris (or any Terran currently) beating Flash in a TvT that's nearly even after 10 minutes. Luckily, that's not how Iris rolls and as his series against Effort showed, he is still more than capable of crafting excellent builds that quickly end (or decide) games against an opponent considered to be superior. Consider Hiya's build on Medusa (Flash's last TvT loss) or Leta's build on Byzantium ... that's how you beat Flash short of 14CC versus 8Rax (which there's no way Flash will do against Iris) or BBS.
That's why this has the potential to be a good series. Not all that other garbage people have been spewing.
On July 27 2009 09:07 darktreb wrote: Can people stop making stupid arguments like "Iris used to be the best TvT player he'll show you what's up" and "Flash is not what he used to be"? That's an awful argument since Flash is currently clearly the best TvT player and has won 10 straight in TvT. Since when is the old best "XvY" player considered to be comparable to the current best "XvY" player? That's ridiculous ... almost as ridiculous as the "Flash's arrogance will doom him" claim. Like MrHoon said, Flash is being considered washed up (or close to it) now ... how cruel progaming is for a guy who is:
- 12 months younger than Fantasy - 12 months younger than Skyhigh - 32 months younger than Leta - Over 9000 months younger than Canata
Age really is just a number....
Here's a REAL argument for a close series: Iris has always been very smart at TvT and has an aggressive style that he might be able to parlay into early game wins (or huge advantages) against a late game focused Flash. There's very little chance of Iris (or any Terran currently) beating Flash in a TvT that's nearly even after 10 minutes. Luckily, that's not how Iris rolls and as his series against Effort showed, he is still more than capable of crafting excellent builds that quickly end (or decide) games against an opponent considered to be superior. Consider Hiya's build on Medusa (Flash's last TvT loss) or Leta's build on Byzantium ... that's how you beat Flash short of 14CC versus 8Rax (which there's no way Flash will do against Iris) or BBS.
That's why this has the potential to be a good series. Not all that other garbage people have been spewing.
Calm down with the logic there you might hurt some of the forum members with it >>>
Man GOM has been so dissappointing to watch. Iris played well and Effort looked like he hadn't played in a month. Completely owned. Shows you how important practice time is for pros. Effort can look completely unstoppable and then gets destroyed hours later.
Does anyone else think it's a little lame that Effort talked about Iris 'not practicing for PL, instead practicing for GOM, putting our team at risk'?
He didn't say those exact words, but that was his implication. Sort of a way to feel even better if he won the GOM match ("I won and I didn't practice for GOM at all!") or excuse it if he lost ("Iris isn't a team player, he was practicing for GOM while I was practicing for PL!").
I think it's pretty lame. Even if it's true, it's not something you should say, especially about a veteran like Iris who has put his time in and is hungry for an individual title in the twilight of his career. I feel for Iris, and I thought Effort's shot at him was uncalled for and childish.
That said, I'm absolutely DREADING watching the GOM finals! My two favorite Terran players fighting eachother, what a nightmare! On one hand, I want Iris to finally grasp gold, it would be a great moment for him. On the other hand, Flash has been playing under his potential (I think) lately, and I think he gets a lot of undeserved hatred among foreign fans (I still don't know why), I'd love to see him take a title since he's out of OSL/MSL now.
I'm gonna be really happy for whoever wins, but at the same time have to feel terrible for whoever loses, since I love them both.
Flash has always been an undeserved player among ALL Fans around the world ever since his lost to Stork in the 3rd/4th place match where he got raped by Carriers.
When he 3:2'D Stork in Gom Invi, he started getting some respect But then lost all respect when he 3:1'd Bisu and 3:0'd Stork. Then everyone claimed Flash is a boring (14cc) cheesy (BBS) player Then when Flash kept dropping leagues, everyone was laughing But when the 6 dragons rose and Jaedong fell into the biggest slump he ever had (srsly) Flash was the only remaining 'Top Player' left to face the dragons, AND THEN SUDDENLY IT SEEMED LIKE "Protoss Hate" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Flash Hate" Flash defeated the dragons except Bisu, whom he lost to, in the highest level of PvT BO3 played on this age Then people started calling him washed up and praised leta and fantasy saying "I am ADD and do not play starcraft so I'm going to shout random shit about how Flash is a A-Class player instead of S-Class"
I remember I posted up a 30 questions Flash interview and all you fuckers wrote in my goddamn thread was "This interview sucks, Flash laughs too much he is a shitty terran go fantasy" I remember every single one of you. I COME TO YO HOUSE
Edit: And don't you dare write "Calm down MrHoon" as a reply or I will sodomize you with a stick
How is this fair Iris... how could you do this! Now you have to face Flash, who's probably going to practice TvT like 20 hours a day while you have to prepare for TvP in proleague..
It's because no one gives a shit about this tournament
tell that to july who asked his manager to not put him on the pl entries for god knows how long.
I was so sure it was because he was 5pooling vs great in his last PL match, and the manager got pissed thinking he did it because he hadnt practiced or he was giving the message "if you put me in the lineup when i tell you not to, this is what im going to do". July just went backstage after the match, like he was embarrased for doing it.
On July 28 2009 11:52 MrHoon wrote: Flash has always been an undeserved player among ALL Fans around the world ever since his lost to Stork in the 3rd/4th place match where he got raped by Carriers.
When he 3:2'D Stork in Gom Invi, he started getting some respect But then lost all respect when he 3:1'd Bisu and 3:0'd Stork. Then everyone claimed Flash is a boring (14cc) cheesy (BBS) player Then when Flash kept dropping leagues, everyone was laughing But when the 6 dragons rose and Jaedong fell into the biggest slump he ever had (srsly) Flash was the only remaining 'Top Player' left to face the dragons, AND THEN SUDDENLY IT SEEMED LIKE "Protoss Hate" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Flash Hate" Flash defeated the dragons except Bisu, whom he lost to, in the highest level of PvT BO3 played on this age Then people started calling him washed up and praised leta and fantasy saying "I am ADD and do not play starcraft so I'm going to shout random shit about how Flash is a A-Class player instead of S-Class"
I remember I posted up a 30 questions Flash interview and all you fuckers wrote in my goddamn thread was "This interview sucks, Flash laughs too much he is a shitty terran go fantasy" I remember every single one of you. I COME TO YO HOUSE
Edit: And don't you dare write "Calm down MrHoon" as a reply or I will sodomize you with a stick
Preach brother... Flash is the Final Protype of the Ultimate Terran, none are better, they worked out all the "nerves" and "choking" from the previous Sea[shield] model. NO TERRAN is better than Flash, a few come close or may come close in the future, but Flash is undeniably better than those jokes Fantasy and Leta(jokes is an overstatement but im on a roll).
That being said Berserker is on fire I think hell put up a good fight. Though itll probably end up 3-1 Flash, 3-2 wouldnt surprise me either. I wonder if the winner will face Bisu and/or Jaedong in some super match.
I predict a FlaSh 3:0.. Yeah Berserker is great at TvT, but FlaSh is unstoppable in a bo5 TvT unless he gets cheesed like against ForGG or Lomo or Fantasy :p. So yeah it is possible for Berserker to win, but I think FlaSh will dominate most likely.
On July 28 2009 11:52 MrHoon wrote: Flash has always been an undeserved player among ALL Fans around the world ever since his lost to Stork in the 3rd/4th place match where he got raped by Carriers.
When he 3:2'D Stork in Gom Invi, he started getting some respect But then lost all respect when he 3:1'd Bisu and 3:0'd Stork. Then everyone claimed Flash is a boring (14cc) cheesy (BBS) player Then when Flash kept dropping leagues, everyone was laughing But when the 6 dragons rose and Jaedong fell into the biggest slump he ever had (srsly) Flash was the only remaining 'Top Player' left to face the dragons, AND THEN SUDDENLY IT SEEMED LIKE "Protoss Hate" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Flash Hate" Flash defeated the dragons except Bisu, whom he lost to, in the highest level of PvT BO3 played on this age Then people started calling him washed up and praised leta and fantasy saying "I am ADD and do not play starcraft so I'm going to shout random shit about how Flash is a A-Class player instead of S-Class"
I remember I posted up a 30 questions Flash interview and all you fuckers wrote in my goddamn thread was "This interview sucks, Flash laughs too much he is a shitty terran go fantasy" I remember every single one of you. I COME TO YO HOUSE
Edit: And don't you dare write "Calm down MrHoon" as a reply or I will sodomize you with a stick
On July 28 2009 11:52 MrHoon wrote: Flash has always been an undeserved player among ALL Fans around the world ever since his lost to Stork in the 3rd/4th place match where he got raped by Carriers.
When he 3:2'D Stork in Gom Invi, he started getting some respect But then lost all respect when he 3:1'd Bisu and 3:0'd Stork. Then everyone claimed Flash is a boring (14cc) cheesy (BBS) player Then when Flash kept dropping leagues, everyone was laughing But when the 6 dragons rose and Jaedong fell into the biggest slump he ever had (srsly) Flash was the only remaining 'Top Player' left to face the dragons, AND THEN SUDDENLY IT SEEMED LIKE "Protoss Hate" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Flash Hate" Flash defeated the dragons except Bisu, whom he lost to, in the highest level of PvT BO3 played on this age Then people started calling him washed up and praised leta and fantasy saying "I am ADD and do not play starcraft so I'm going to shout random shit about how Flash is a A-Class player instead of S-Class"
I remember I posted up a 30 questions Flash interview and all you fuckers wrote in my goddamn thread was "This interview sucks, Flash laughs too much he is a shitty terran go fantasy" I remember every single one of you. I COME TO YO HOUSE
Edit: And don't you dare write "Calm down MrHoon" as a reply or I will sodomize you with a stick
Flash has always been an undeserved player among ALL Fans around the world ever since his lost to Stork in the 3rd/4th place match where he got raped by Carriers.
When he 3:2'D Stork in Gom Invi, he started getting some respect But then lost all respect when he 3:1'd Bisu and 3:0'd Stork. Then everyone claimed Flash is a boring (14cc) cheesy (BBS) player Then when Flash kept dropping leagues, everyone was laughing But when the 6 dragons rose and Jaedong fell into the biggest slump he ever had (srsly) Flash was the only remaining 'Top Player' left to face the dragons, AND THEN SUDDENLY IT SEEMED LIKE "Protoss Hate" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Flash Hate" Flash defeated the dragons except Bisu, whom he lost to, in the highest level of PvT BO3 played on this age Then people started calling him washed up and praised leta and fantasy saying "I am ADD and do not play starcraft so I'm going to shout random shit about how Flash is a A-Class player instead of S-Class"
I remember I posted up a 30 questions Flash interview and all you fuckers wrote in my goddamn thread was "This interview sucks, Flash laughs too much he is a shitty terran go fantasy" I remember every single one of you. I COME TO YO HOUSE
Edit: And don't you dare write "Calm down MrHoon" as a reply or I will sodomize you with a stick
Well, maybe the bigger they are, the harder they fall. When Flash got the Ultimate Weapon nickname, all his fans went wild "omg, greatest terran everrrr, and its not even debatable (added by artosis), flash will win everything !", but when you look at his and Nada's shirts, you see where is the difference. Flash got huge hype, but he is not playing alone this game. Everyone was laughing, not exactly at him, but the idea that "the omfg greatest player ever!" is dropping leagues left and right. Yes, his playing style is making him hateable from time to time, but this is not the main problem with him.
This kid is getting endless credit by the community and I disagree with you when you say, that ppl are demoting him from S to A class. For many seasons now, Flash is being favored by the majority of the community here to win every starleague he is in. Flash needs to win 5 games on a row and suddenly "omg flash for #1 in PR, he is raping shit". We all know the badges and the titles will eventually come, because he is so talented, but the seasons are going by and he is still with this single OSL badge, which following the plexa logic is making him more accomplished than Bisu. So you have nothing to worry about
On July 28 2009 11:52 MrHoon wrote: Flash has always been an undeserved player among ALL Fans around the world ever since his lost to Stork in the 3rd/4th place match where he got raped by Carriers.
When he 3:2'D Stork in Gom Invi, he started getting some respect But then lost all respect when he 3:1'd Bisu and 3:0'd Stork. Then everyone claimed Flash is a boring (14cc) cheesy (BBS) player Then when Flash kept dropping leagues, everyone was laughing But when the 6 dragons rose and Jaedong fell into the biggest slump he ever had (srsly) Flash was the only remaining 'Top Player' left to face the dragons, AND THEN SUDDENLY IT SEEMED LIKE "Protoss Hate" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Flash Hate" Flash defeated the dragons except Bisu, whom he lost to, in the highest level of PvT BO3 played on this age Then people started calling him washed up and praised leta and fantasy saying "I am ADD and do not play starcraft so I'm going to shout random shit about how Flash is a A-Class player instead of S-Class"
I remember I posted up a 30 questions Flash interview and all you fuckers wrote in my goddamn thread was "This interview sucks, Flash laughs too much he is a shitty terran go fantasy" I remember every single one of you. I COME TO YO HOUSE
Edit: And don't you dare write "Calm down MrHoon" as a reply or I will sodomize you with a stick
Well I think that everone needs someone to hate. When a player gets dominant you get tired of seeing him win all the time, and you start roting for the underdogs. This is what makes a game interesting, that an old player or someone new could have a chance against the best in the world. It was the same when Savior was ruling the universe, everyone wanted to see him detroned.
Also it dosnt help that flash often plays very defencive since he got souch an advantage in late-game. This makes for boring matches where flash defends the first 10 minuits and then rolls the enemy.
Too bad Nick didn't show up in this thread during the set. He'd have told everyone to stfu about the sub commentator already and the LR might not be so hard find among the rest of the garbage...
On July 28 2009 11:52 MrHoon wrote: Flash has always been an undeserved player among ALL Fans around the world ever since his lost to Stork in the 3rd/4th place match where he got raped by Carriers.
When he 3:2'D Stork in Gom Invi, he started getting some respect But then lost all respect when he 3:1'd Bisu and 3:0'd Stork. Then everyone claimed Flash is a boring (14cc) cheesy (BBS) player Then when Flash kept dropping leagues, everyone was laughing But when the 6 dragons rose and Jaedong fell into the biggest slump he ever had (srsly) Flash was the only remaining 'Top Player' left to face the dragons, AND THEN SUDDENLY IT SEEMED LIKE "Protoss Hate" >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "Flash Hate" Flash defeated the dragons except Bisu, whom he lost to, in the highest level of PvT BO3 played on this age Then people started calling him washed up and praised leta and fantasy saying "I am ADD and do not play starcraft so I'm going to shout random shit about how Flash is a A-Class player instead of S-Class"
I remember I posted up a 30 questions Flash interview and all you fuckers wrote in my goddamn thread was "This interview sucks, Flash laughs too much he is a shitty terran go fantasy" I remember every single one of you. I COME TO YO HOUSE
Edit: And don't you dare write "Calm down MrHoon" as a reply or I will sodomize you with a stick
Exactly!
(I've originaly planned to write a long post how Flash is the most hated and least respected top BW player, but the striking injustice would just piss me off, so I'll leave it at that.)
EPT
![[image loading]](/staff/Tadzio/GOMS3/aiclassic3w.png)
Iris vs 
EffOrt
![[image loading]](http://destinybuilding.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/train-wreck-big.png)
)
Too bad Nick didn't show up in this thread during the set. He'd have told everyone to stfu about the sub commentator already and the LR might not be so hard find among the rest of the garbage...
