EPT[WL] Samsung KHAN vs SKT T1 - Page 46
| Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments |
|
KnightOfNi
United States1508 Posts
| ||
JWD
United States12607 Posts
On February 04 2009 16:30 Lamentations wrote: I was referring to the second sentence, perhaps I can bold it for you next time now that I know you lack the critical skills to identify that 'Fantasy was using 2 units at a time" is in response to "JangBi was using 6 units at a time". I acknowledge your point, and still don't see why it has anything to do with my original statement. JB still countered with 6 units and won the game, and I still think it was sad to watch. Also note that you quote yourself as saying something you never did. | ||
|
Vasoline73
United States7801 Posts
| ||
|
Lamentations
Australia211 Posts
On February 04 2009 16:43 jwd241224 wrote: I acknowledge your point, and still don't see why it has anything to do with my original statement. JB still countered with 6 units and won the game, and I still think it was sad to watch. Also note that you quote yourself as saying something you never did. Your inability to correctly infer what I am saying astounds. How is "sending in two 75-mineral vultures at a time" not similar to "Fantasy was using 2 units at a time". It wasn't sad to watch, it was intense. JangBi deserved the victory for fighting that off after losing so many and dragoons. One tank and 2-3 goliaths is a mismatch for 6 goons and a shuttle reaver any way you look at it so it is not so that his 6 units are overpowered or whatever you are insinuating. Does it not make sense to you that JangBi, having 2 nexus, could reproduce his probes very fast and that in making the expansion Fantasy was lower on units for it? It was a good move by JangBi and showed solid game sense to know he could effectively counter with the small number of units. Since when should the 1150/500 or so resource cost of JangBi's countering army NOT beat the handful of resources that Fantasy had left in terms of units? Also 2 factory vs 4 gateways + robo bay. I am not sure what you are complaining about. | ||
|
baubo
China3370 Posts
On February 04 2009 16:26 OneOther wrote: Well, 2 fact is still a counter to 14 Nex, even on Medusa. I agree it's not as good as it would be on other maps, but that doesn't change the fact it's a counter. 14 Nex is certainly not way AHEAD of 2 fact, because there's always that timing window where one tiny micro mistake will result in a loss. (3 Tanks + vultures running) Of course, if Protoss defends successfully, he will be ahead. The Terran can win with micro. It is definitely NOT a rock paper scissors situation where 14 Nex is automatically ahead of 2 fact. No, no, no. 14 Nex is always a risk vs 2 fact. Also, if you look at it from Fantasy's perspective, he went 2-Fact AFTER scouting the 14 Nex. If 14 Nex is a counter to 2-Fac, then Fantasy is the most idiotic progamer to grace this world. It seems that Jangbi can't win. He takes down Bisu playing basically Bisu's style, and then defended so well against a very strong build from Fantasy, and still no one would give him credit. The hate is irrational. | ||
|
ambit!ous1
United States3662 Posts
after reading this thread i guess Jangbi played really well gj Jangbi! | ||
|
Mokinono
United States19 Posts
| ||
|
.risingdragoon
United States3021 Posts
On February 04 2009 16:28 gk_ender wrote: But i do have to say this, with the damage fantasy caused to jangbis economy, i think instead of the continuous pressure, he coulda built some tanks, turtled up, and pushed into late game with some advantage bc of his economy, and waited for a good timing push to finish the game. That's what he was trying to do, he turreted up and got siege. That's why jangbi's counter attack was so brilliant, he got in there just as siege finished and together with reaver micro took out the terran nat. It was so sweet. 10 seconds longer and fantasy's would've had an ironclad defense. | ||
OneOther
United States10774 Posts
On February 04 2009 16:55 .risingdragoon wrote: That's what he was trying to do, he turretted up and got siege. That's why jangbi's counter attack was so brilliant, he got in there just as siege finished and together with reaver micro took out the terran nat. It was so sweet. Also, people seem to be forgetting the part where Jangbi went into Fantasy's main and took out TWO Tanks guarded by Goliaths. That's where he won the game. His reaver micro is beyond human. On February 04 2009 16:52 baubo wrote: Also, if you look at it from Fantasy's perspective, he went 2-Fact AFTER scouting the 14 Nex. If 14 Nex is a counter to 2-Fac, then Fantasy is the most idiotic progamer to grace this world. It seems that Jangbi can't win. He takes down Bisu playing basically Bisu's style, and then defended so well against a very strong build from Fantasy, and still no one would give him credit. The hate is irrational. Yeah, no matter what map it is, 14 Nex is never a counter to 2 Fact. 2 Fact always provides the Terran an opportunity to win the game with micro, or get a comfortable lead at least. He just needs to deal enough damage to the P's economy and defend his own expansion. | ||
MrHoon
10183 Posts
On February 04 2009 16:57 OneOther wrote: Also, people seem to be forgetting the part where Jangbi went into Fantasy's main and took out TWO Tanks guarded by Goliaths. That's where he won the game. His reaver micro is beyond human. man I said this like 3 times, but everyone ignored me | ||
|
OneOther
United States10774 Posts
| ||
|
Nick_54
United States2230 Posts
| ||
|
Rostam
United States2552 Posts
On February 04 2009 16:55 .risingdragoon wrote: That's what he was trying to do, he turreted up and got siege. That's why jangbi's counter attack was so brilliant, he got in there just as siege finished and together with reaver micro took out the terran nat. It was so sweet. 10 seconds longer and fantasy's would've had ironclad defense. I agree that Jangbi played really impressively, but Fantasy had siege long before the counter attack; would've taken a really long time to make any threatening attack on the temples otherwise. Also I think that nex first is plenty common enough on Medusa that Fantasy must not have thought 2 fac was going to put him at a horrendous disadvantage. | ||
|
.risingdragoon
United States3021 Posts
In the end, like those above have said: the reaver counter killed the defending tanks and forced late sieging for the dragoons to get in there and dominate. I'm so impressed with JangBi's crisis management. In the future his 2shuttle harass will be the shit to watch for. | ||
|
Matoo-
Canada1397 Posts
On February 04 2009 17:01 MrHoon wrote: man I said this like 3 times, but everyone ignored me It's because you switched back to KTF. On a more serious note, I hate Jangbi but I have to admit his reaver micro was seriously sick and consistent throughout both his games today. PS: Each time I watch Jangbi, he plays so standard. Does he lack creativity or do I just watch the wrong games? If the correct answer is the latter, some suggestions of games to watch would be greatly appreciated, thanks. | ||
|
muramasa
Canada1299 Posts
| ||
|
AttackZerg
United States7454 Posts
On February 04 2009 17:29 Matoo- wrote: It's because you switched back to KTF. On a more serious note, I hate Jangbi but I have to admit his reaver micro was seriously sick and consistent throughout both his games today. PS: Each time I watch Jangbi, he plays so standard. Does he lack creativity or do I just watch the wrong games? If the correct answer is the latter, some suggestions of games to watch would be greatly appreciated, thanks. hmm I don't know if he is esp creative or flashy, but his games vs yellow from the last msl were pretty exciting (although I was rooting for yellow)... I think the reason he is boring is because he knows that if he gets 3-4 templar/ upgrades and a huge army there is no army of any race that won't melt under his blankets of storm! | ||
|
MrHoon
10183 Posts
| ||
|
baubo
China3370 Posts
On February 04 2009 17:29 Matoo- wrote: PS: Each time I watch Jangbi, he plays so standard. Does he lack creativity or do I just watch the wrong games? If the correct answer is the latter, some suggestions of games to watch would be greatly appreciated, thanks. What do you define non-standard PvT? The matchup is so defined from the protoss side that all the "openings" are already set. Jangbi does play standard, but leans towards the aggressive side like Bisu, as opposed to more macro-oriented like Stork or Best. As risingdragon mentioned, his mid-game break where he goes in with 2 shuttles is pretty fun to watch, and something I don't believe I've seen from other protoss nearly as much(if at all). | ||
|
Baddieko
Singapore855 Posts
In medusa, 14nex is auto for those toss who can micro reavers and macro. Going 2 gate robo is almost of no difference for them but will not get as much advantage as 14nex. P is almost certain to win the game regardless what T goes. Fantasy knows that and 2 fac is the best chance. He was very close but the reaver just stay alive in red life that was sick. The rest was just counter attack when the next 4 goons pop out. Even if no counter also win, the counter makes the win much faster. 4 gates vs 2 fac and 3rd nexus coming up is gg. I suppose the fast rax snipe is very instrumental b/c in 2 fac rush T will add to 4 facs to kill the game. | ||
| ||
