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On May 08 2026 08:57 Highways wrote:
The main reason why Protoss don't win titles is not because of Terran, it's because of PvZ is hard
And yet zergs win tournaments despite PvZ and TvZ imbalance in terms of winrates by high elo being about equal, while protoss do not.
You cannot only blame PvZ here for the inability of protoss to win anything, as if PvT were as imbalanced in favor of protoss as the other two matchups, then surely we would have equal tournament winrates, right?
Currently, its T>Z>P with T>P instead of P>T.
Y'all should blame ASL for these terran maps and terrans for the inability of winning anything these pasts ASLs despite the imbalance being in favor of terrans.
This could have been the most hype ASL but it is ruined by these maps.
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On May 05 2026 21:13 Peeano wrote:
Light vs Flash into Leta vs T would be one of the worst things this great ASL can end like.
Not when Wraith Flaming Skull takes the trophy!!!
Hey, a man can dream...
EDIT @ Previous Poster: How the fuck has this ASL been "ruined"?! It's been great!
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On May 08 2026 13:05 doktordingerdonger wrote:
Currently, its T>Z>P with T>P instead of P>T.
Snow has been destroying Terrans last few seasons
He lost because Flash countered the same reaver build he does every game with 2 base all in's.
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On May 08 2026 15:24 Highways wrote:Show nested quote +On May 08 2026 13:05 doktordingerdonger wrote:
Currently, its T>Z>P with T>P instead of P>T.
Snow has been destroying Terrans last few seasons He lost because Flash countered the same reaver build he does every game with 2 base all in's.
I think it’s fair to say that Flash is a higher caliber player than Snow. Snow has obvious weaknesses. His macro is not great compared to that of his rivals, his optimization is often described as poor. And yes, his micro is unbelievable and his game sense is superb.
Flash has no real weak point. He is the best or close to the best at everything among terrans.
The fact that the match was so close tells us that the matchup is really fairly balanced at their level.
Generally, it’s in the qualifiers that terrans have been a bit too strong. Past the group stage, balance has looked fairly good imo.
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And we also have to consider the weakest terran got a walkover this round given his opponent's low level of play in the games.
Put JD in leta or tulbo place and you get 2z and 2t in semis instead of 3 T. Sometimes its just the luck of the draw.
Also having a bunch of new posters sign up and complain about balance is always the same old bait routine.
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If StarCraft was any other game that gets balance patches, we would see changes making protoss better. Games are balanced at the top level, and if at the top there is lack of balance between races, then a patch gets released. Arguments that protoss players are less talented or work not hard enough don't matter.
Of course StarCraft is not going to get any balance patch and I'm just saying this so people accept that this game isnt perfectly balanced at the top and move on.
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Netherlands5631 Posts
Alternatively: Just watch BSL and watch Protoss win.
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On May 08 2026 13:05 doktordingerdonger wrote:Show nested quote +On May 08 2026 08:57 Highways wrote:
The main reason why Protoss don't win titles is not because of Terran, it's because of PvZ is hard Currently, its T>Z>P with T>P instead of P>T.
I wonder what happened to the PvT matchup? Back in the KeSPA era, it leaned slightly in Protoss’s favor, if I recall correctly. There certainly wasn't a massive disparity like in TvZ or ZvP, but it was still considered a tough hill to climb for Terrans.
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On May 08 2026 20:00 Maks wrote:Show nested quote +On May 08 2026 13:05 doktordingerdonger wrote:On May 08 2026 08:57 Highways wrote:
The main reason why Protoss don't win titles is not because of Terran, it's because of PvZ is hard Currently, its T>Z>P with T>P instead of P>T. I wonder what happened to the PvT matchup? Back in the KeSPA era, it leaned slightly in Protoss’s favor, if I recall correctly. There certainly wasn't a massive disparity like in TvZ or ZvP, but it was still considered a tough hill to climb for Terrans.
Some of it is due to map changes and some of it is due to Terran optimizations' improving faster than Protoss can manage, given that Protoss is vulnerable:
-before robotics facility
-before Dragoon range
-before Zealot speed
-before High Templars + Psionic Storm.
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I mean, nothing happened really. Every terran on earth except for Flash would be a massive underdog against snow in a prolonged series. It is just that Flash is that far ahead of every other terran. But he is also that far ahead of every other player in every other race. Heck, Flash plying protoss is good enough that he would probably qualify for almost every ASL. I don't know of any other player who is even remotely that good plying off race.
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On May 08 2026 22:28 jmk12 wrote:
I mean, nothing happened really. Every terran on earth except for Flash would be a massive underdog against snow in a prolonged series. It is just that Flash is that far ahead of every other terran. But he is also that far ahead of every other player in every other race. Heck, Flash plying protoss is good enough that he would probably qualify for almost every ASL. I don't know of any other player who is even remotely that good plying off race.
Light is considered, by pros, almost equal to snow in PvT. And presently Speed is considered 3rd best TvP after FlaSh and Light.
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I think Snow is a bit off his game but I woudl 100% take him on Light. He was decent this series.
PvZ is a problem and it's going to require serious mapwork to fix. The information edge and ability to rush at no cost is a huge problem. Incredbile the matchup is so competitive as it is.
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[B]Light is considered, by pros, almost equal to snow in PvT. And presently Speed is considered 3rd best TvP after FlaSh and Light.
I haven't spoken to any pros so I can't comment on that, but their head to head statistics certainly do not support this claim. Whichever range you look at on the Liquipedia head to head counter, Snow comes out significantly ahead.
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On May 08 2026 16:29 KobraKay wrote:
And we also have to consider the weakest terran got a walkover this round given his opponent's low level of play in the games.
Put JD in leta or tulbo place and you get 2z and 2t in semis instead of 3 T. Sometimes its just the luck of the draw.
Also having a bunch of new posters sign up and complain about balance is always the same old bait routine.
I don't think he means to do it so I wouldn't call him a troll but 90% of doktordingerdonger's posts are balance whines... there is another guy or 2 who are similar... :/.
Gets old! PvZ is tough but we don't need to hear about Tesagi every LR thread...
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On May 09 2026 10:41 RJBTVYOUTUBE wrote:Show nested quote +On May 08 2026 22:28 jmk12 wrote:
I mean, nothing happened really. Every terran on earth except for Flash would be a massive underdog against snow in a prolonged series. It is just that Flash is that far ahead of every other terran. But he is also that far ahead of every other player in every other race. Heck, Flash plying protoss is good enough that he would probably qualify for almost every ASL. I don't know of any other player who is even remotely that good plying off race. Light is considered, by pros, almost equal to snow in PvT. And presently Speed is considered 3rd best TvP after FlaSh and Light.
Precisely. And flash offrace being by far the best? Lol please
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[QUOTE]On May 09 2026 19:21 Vasoline73 wrote:
[QUOTE]On May 08 2026 16:29 KobraKay wrote:
Gets old! PvZ is tough but we don't need to hear about Tesagi every LR thread... [/QUOTE]
That’s a fair take. I do complain a good amount about balance, but it’s mostly a response to people saying the game is super balanced when it’s clear P is a tier below the other two.
I try to post about it less, but mostly i just watch and engage with BW stuff less and less so I’ll be out of your hair soon enough.
We all know if flash spent his career playing Protoss he would be considered a top tier Protoss. However he would only have 1-2 titles.
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When all the protoss get eliminated by terrans but we still complain about zvp
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On May 09 2026 22:08 Rainalcar wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2026 10:41 RJBTVYOUTUBE wrote:On May 08 2026 22:28 jmk12 wrote:
I mean, nothing happened really. Every terran on earth except for Flash would be a massive underdog against snow in a prolonged series. It is just that Flash is that far ahead of every other terran. But he is also that far ahead of every other player in every other race. Heck, Flash plying protoss is good enough that he would probably qualify for almost every ASL. I don't know of any other player who is even remotely that good plying off race. Light is considered, by pros, almost equal to snow in PvT. And presently Speed is considered 3rd best TvP after FlaSh and Light. Precisely. And flash offrace being by far the best? Lol please
The best offrace, obviously not the best overall... unless there is someone else who is better at playing offrace than Flash that you know of?
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So many dead reavers to staggering/target firing. Very enjoyable series! I'm not sure if I get why Snow showed his carriers when he only had two, though, however that might've been discussed and explained earlier in this thread.
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EPT![[image loading]](https://meme.app/templates/bad-bunny-crying-at-the-grammys.gif)
