On May 20 2012 21:46 Ryo wrote: Overall, I really miss those long macro games we had in 2010-2011. I don't really like the current BW map pool. Haven't seen carriers in ages.
Would have been so good, if they bring back some fan favorite old school maps instead of this map pool
On May 20 2012 21:57 alffla wrote: why isn't bogus taking his natural
I can only assume he isn't used to playing vs expansion builds other than 1gate expands and is probably being over defensive because he's worried about some cheese.
On May 20 2012 22:04 Surili wrote: I love watching broodwar occasionally, even though i never really followed the scene at all, but these guys are making SC2 look terrible
PS no wonder flash said he thought protoss was op, the BW terrans are terrible in TvP :/
This is what happens when you have to practice for 2 games.
On May 20 2012 22:06 baubo wrote: Bogus with some god awful play. I think the only terran who played like a pro today was Reality. Everyone else look just horrible
yaeh word
but still in that game it was basically just one big fight and gg >_>
I have been trying really hard to get into watching BW, and i have been really enjoying it, but i am just so sad that every time BW players get a reason to watch SC2, there is a reason why the games look terrible, like the Boxer Yellow stuff, where yellow was awful, and now this. Also the stuff at anahiem i am sure will be god awful too, and i am gonna be so sad, because it is a really good game. Nowhere near as hard as broodwar, but it is still really good and great to watch.
On May 20 2012 22:06 baubo wrote: Bogus with some god awful play. I think the only terran who played like a pro today was Reality. Everyone else look just horrible
yaeh word
but still in that game it was basically just one big fight and gg >_>
That seems to be how terran wins in TvP though, at least based on my limited understanding of the MU at the pro level. Reality pressured in the front, dropped in the back, and got himself a good solid lead. Then he attacked from the front before the protoss death ball can form, and won.
It's pretty boring play, yes. But then again I really only like TvZ in SC2, since it bores some resemblance to BW's large scale engagements.
On May 20 2012 22:06 baubo wrote: Bogus with some god awful play. I think the only terran who played like a pro today was Reality. Everyone else look just horrible
yaeh word
but still in that game it was basically just one big fight and gg >_>
From my understanding the snowball effect is huge hence big fight into gg happens. The way I see it, things were "nerfed" in order to prevent early game all ins in small maps, so when there is a huge fight and stuff dies, it is usually hard (in the sense that things take a long time to build) to replenish your army. That leads to one big figh -> win because you can't defend when the eventual snowball comes. You win a battle and are ahead because there is no time to have a new army back at home to defend, so even with a small number of units left from the big battle, those are enough to start dealing damage and then both defenders and offensive reinforcements arrive almost at the same time (warp gates and fast running units).
That's what I always tought was the problem that made these blob into gg fights more common than they should.
Then again, I watch a lot of SC2 but I dont play it so my observation isn't valid, idk, that's what the most logical justification I see for it.
On May 20 2012 22:06 baubo wrote: Bogus with some god awful play. I think the only terran who played like a pro today was Reality. Everyone else look just horrible
yaeh word
but still in that game it was basically just one big fight and gg >_>
That seems to be how terran wins in TvP though, at least based on my limited understanding of the MU at the pro level. Reality pressured in the front, dropped in the back, and got himself a good solid lead. Then he attacked from the front before the protoss death ball can form, and won.
It's pretty boring play, yes. But then again I really only like TvZ in SC2, since it bores some resemblance to BW's large scale engagements.
This was true for a long time, but it really has been developing for a long time. Here is an example of a really fantastic PvT, obviously it is a REALLY good one so not that representative of most games, but it is really getting better and better.
Sorry bad link.
PS again, i won't mention things that aren't proper LR stuff again. Seriously if you wanna give SC2 a chance check out that game.
On May 20 2012 22:06 baubo wrote: Bogus with some god awful play. I think the only terran who played like a pro today was Reality. Everyone else look just horrible
yaeh word
but still in that game it was basically just one big fight and gg >_>
That seems to be how terran wins in TvP though, at least based on my limited understanding of the MU at the pro level. Reality pressured in the front, dropped in the back, and got himself a good solid lead. Then he attacked from the front before the protoss death ball can form, and won.
It's pretty boring play, yes. But then again I really only like TvZ in SC2, since it bores some resemblance to BW's large scale engagements.
This was true for a long time, but it really has been developing for a long time. Here is an example of a really fantastic PvT, obviously it is a REALLY good one so not that representative of most games, but it is really getting better and better.
PS again, i won't mention things that aren't proper LR stuff again. Seriously if you wanna give SC2 a chance check out that game.
Sorry, I live in China so no access to youtube or twitchtv vods from outside China. If you tell me the game I'm most likely able to find it on a Chinese youtube-type site though.
I do watch a decent bit of SC2. And I play a little too, although quite badly. I like playing the game well enough, but 200/200 deathball armies just don't really do it for me. I mainly watch more for the strategies more than anything else. For example, players like MVP or Polt interest me because they play smart.
On May 20 2012 22:06 baubo wrote: Bogus with some god awful play. I think the only terran who played like a pro today was Reality. Everyone else look just horrible
yaeh word
but still in that game it was basically just one big fight and gg >_>
That seems to be how terran wins in TvP though, at least based on my limited understanding of the MU at the pro level. Reality pressured in the front, dropped in the back, and got himself a good solid lead. Then he attacked from the front before the protoss death ball can form, and won.
It's pretty boring play, yes. But then again I really only like TvZ in SC2, since it bores some resemblance to BW's large scale engagements.
This was true for a long time, but it really has been developing for a long time. Here is an example of a really fantastic PvT, obviously it is a REALLY good one so not that representative of most games, but it is really getting better and better.
PS again, i won't mention things that aren't proper LR stuff again. Seriously if you wanna give SC2 a chance check out that game.
Sorry, I live in China so no access to youtube or twitchtv vods from outside China. If you tell me the game I'm most likely able to find it on a Chinese youtube-type site though.
I do watch a decent bit of SC2. And I play a little too, although quite badly. I like playing the game well enough, but 200/200 deathball armies just don't really do it for me. I mainly watch more for the strategies more than anything else. For example, players like MVP or Polt interest me because they play smart.
Okay, well it was in the IGN proleague Fight Club, The first game of the Best of 9 between MC and Polt. The rest of the series was pretty good too, but that first game was mind blowing.
The 1 engagement stuff doesn't do it for me either, which is why i really enjoy aggressive early game PvT, and then find the late game pretty mediocre unless one (or both) of the players is (are) hyper aggressive (like in this game).
He just didn't build units to defend, instead of maxing out and teching out and refilling his supply with higher tech when he loses roaches, he kept like a 50 food cushion for infestors/broods but if the protoss attacks before 18 min or so you just die cos you have nothing to defend, pretty dumb
On May 20 2012 22:36 BLinD-RawR wrote: lol all the crowd is gone.
Did they show the audience during the KT match?
there was still quite some audience in the KT match. they were doing crowd shots, but the games in that series were not bad, I mean all BW sets were good at least.
On May 20 2012 22:38 cLicK wrote: Toss seems to have the most interesting unit compositions. Terran and Zerg just seem to mass bio/roaches...from the few games I saw today :/
If there were more TvZs, you'd see some more unit variation. That said, terran mech is kind of limited in its use unlike its BW counterpart.
On May 20 2012 22:38 cLicK wrote: Toss seems to have the most interesting unit compositions. Terran and Zerg just seem to mass bio/roaches...from the few games I saw today :/
Every race has interesting compositions, it's just Z and T haven't discovered them yet. For example, the last game would have gone differently if he had zerglings, roaches, and infestors. Pure roach pretty much dies, unless you do Stephano style 11 min max
Well so far Effort, Reality and maybe FBH seem good at sc2 (I didnt watch the skt game so cant comment on that and Im not counting motive as idk if he is/was actually a BW player or a rookie pick up with sc2 in mind already).
Jangbi also didn't look that bad but then again iris failed hard I think.
The blunt and brutal fact is while most of these players are good mechanically they are 2 billion miles away from understanding the game at all. So much passive play, no harass, nothing. SC2 is a much better game than is being displayed here and i hope everyone understands that. I look forward to when these players catch up to the current metagame.
On May 20 2012 22:38 cLicK wrote: Toss seems to have the most interesting unit compositions. Terran and Zerg just seem to mass bio/roaches...from the few games I saw today :/
They are really bad games to make you like Sc2. By far the matchups without Protoss are the most entertaining, just current Kespa players dont have enough experience yet. No ghosts, no burrowed infestors, baneling drops etc
On May 20 2012 22:38 cLicK wrote: Toss seems to have the most interesting unit compositions. Terran and Zerg just seem to mass bio/roaches...from the few games I saw today :/
They are really bad games to make you like Sc2. By far the matchups without Protoss are the most entertaining, just current Kespa players dont have enough experience yet. No ghosts, no burrowed infestors, baneling drops etc
I think most people would agree the best matchup in Starcraft 2 right now is TvZ.
On May 20 2012 22:41 Rainfall7711 wrote: The blunt and brutal fact is while most of these players are good mechanically they are 2 billion miles away from understanding the game at all. So much passive play, no harass, nothing. SC2 is a much better game than is being displayed here and i hope everyone understands that. I look forward to when these players catch up to the current metagame.
this is true, they need to learn the game, they can't just play on mechanics alone and win.
On May 20 2012 22:38 cLicK wrote: Toss seems to have the most interesting unit compositions. Terran and Zerg just seem to mass bio/roaches...from the few games I saw today :/
They are really bad games to make you like Sc2. By far the matchups without Protoss are the most entertaining, just current Kespa players dont have enough experience yet. No ghosts, no burrowed infestors, baneling drops etc
I think most people would agree the best matchup in Starcraft 2 right now is TvZ.
True. TvZ is the most exciting and intense MU. But you were quoting a P player, so it is understandable he thinks that :p
On May 20 2012 22:43 hitthat wrote: This is exacly as bad as I expected. As we say this in my homeland: uncle traded axe to stick.
the KT series was not bad, I think the only good game of the entire game is the stats vs Horang2 game on jade, everything else were onesided, although the wooki vs leta game was great from wooki's perspective.
On May 20 2012 22:38 cLicK wrote: Toss seems to have the most interesting unit compositions. Terran and Zerg just seem to mass bio/roaches...from the few games I saw today :/
They are really bad games to make you like Sc2. By far the matchups without Protoss are the most entertaining, just current Kespa players dont have enough experience yet. No ghosts, no burrowed infestors, baneling drops etc
I think most people would agree the best matchup in Starcraft 2 right now is TvZ.
I feel like TvZ is the most entertaining in both BW and SC2.
On May 20 2012 22:38 cLicK wrote: Toss seems to have the most interesting unit compositions. Terran and Zerg just seem to mass bio/roaches...from the few games I saw today :/
They are really bad games to make you like Sc2. By far the matchups without Protoss are the most entertaining, just current Kespa players dont have enough experience yet. No ghosts, no burrowed infestors, baneling drops etc
I think most people would agree the best matchup in Starcraft 2 right now is TvZ.
True. TvZ is the most exciting and intense MU. But you were quoting a P player, so it is understandable he thinks that :p
I said "matchups without Protoss are the most entertaining". TvZ by far the most fun, definitely right behind BW's TvZ
On May 20 2012 22:38 cLicK wrote: Toss seems to have the most interesting unit compositions. Terran and Zerg just seem to mass bio/roaches...from the few games I saw today :/
They are really bad games to make you like Sc2. By far the matchups without Protoss are the most entertaining, just current Kespa players dont have enough experience yet. No ghosts, no burrowed infestors, baneling drops etc
I think most people would agree the best matchup in Starcraft 2 right now is TvZ.
I do quite like TvP right now - TvZ has gotten kinda stale imo.
On May 20 2012 22:38 cLicK wrote: Toss seems to have the most interesting unit compositions. Terran and Zerg just seem to mass bio/roaches...from the few games I saw today :/
They are really bad games to make you like Sc2. By far the matchups without Protoss are the most entertaining, just current Kespa players dont have enough experience yet. No ghosts, no burrowed infestors, baneling drops etc
I think most people would agree the best matchup in Starcraft 2 right now is TvZ.
True. TvZ is the most exciting and intense MU. But you were quoting a P player, so it is understandable he thinks that :p
I said "matchups without Protoss are the most entertaining". TvZ by far the most fun, definitely right behind BW's TvZ
I feel like all matchups with Terran in are the most entertaining, for example i think TvT is the best matchup after TvZ In SC2
I really hope for a banshee opening... Can't stand another no gas cc into headbump against forcefields =/ Also I think banshee-play might be a really powerful instrument in the hand of these players.
On May 20 2012 22:38 cLicK wrote: Toss seems to have the most interesting unit compositions. Terran and Zerg just seem to mass bio/roaches...from the few games I saw today :/
They are really bad games to make you like Sc2. By far the matchups without Protoss are the most entertaining, just current Kespa players dont have enough experience yet. No ghosts, no burrowed infestors, baneling drops etc
I think most people would agree the best matchup in Starcraft 2 right now is TvZ.
I do quite like TvP right now - TvZ has gotten kinda stale imo.
I feel that TvZ offers more chance for encounters all over the map due to drops and the speed of Zerg. I do like TvP right now though.
For now these games are pasive as f***ck. So now we have a mediocre game with mediocre level of play instead of exelent game with master level of play.
*terran tries to drop mm into natural and gets owned protoss mass collosi stalker templar and wins
They playing really bad. They got a build older, but they not punishing the protoss at all. Look at FBH's games, he gets just a single harass, and it is already enough advantage to get beat him in a straight up fight
SC2 Protoss has to look so imbalanced to the people watching SC2 for the first time. Altough I guess it would be similar if SC2 players were starting to play BW.
On May 20 2012 23:06 ShadeR wrote: Sonovabitch i had to allow sc2 events to see sayles stream.
I just went into incognito mode and loaded up TL, loads all the streams by default
Well done stars
Great idea. PORN MODE HAS ITS USES!
slow clap.
well not all the games were terrible, well as a viewr of SC2, all the SC2 games were bad(as expected).
BW games were pretty much like last season which is weird since they didn't play SC2 last season at all, I guess BW is so drilled into them that they can never really be worse than that, or maybe i'm optimistic.
Gonna repeat myself from the other thread, but I'm extremely disappointed that Zero and Soulkey basically threw their games away, when they were capable of winning them. That's not the attitude that I expect from Woongjin Stars this season. Glad about Light and free though, last season they were underperforming.
was in the main thread in the sc2 forum, really couldn't understand making four threads and then a separate one in sc2 where we were discussing everything
missed half of the light game due to ogn starting early, but got back to clam losing most of his drones to vultures, rofl
disappointed by zero, thought that after he'd held the two gate he couldn't really lose
pleased for free, glad to see him in the winners' enclosure again
sk's game was weird but it's good that we seem ok at sc2 from what limited information we have
Good to see mini doing well (although the game was sloppy and Zero has been slumping, mini does continue to show promise). I don't remember the last time I saw 1 base reaver against zerg.
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/CwMwZ.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/teams/5.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/teams/6.jpg)
Calm «Neo Ground Zero » LighT
mini « New Sniper Ridge » 
Last «Neo Jade » 
