My APM has come to a stop at around 150-170 APM and i can't seem to increase it no matter what i do, before this it had been steadily increasing , along with my skill level, from <100 to 150~, i feel like i'm at my peak and i can't even begin to imagine what 300+ would look like, both physically and mentally.
I play Protoss, I'm using custom hotkeys (close to grid hotkeys), hotkey gateways and produce armies predominantly off hotkeys alone as well as camera hotkeys on bases (F2 - F4) , watching Pro replays and when it shows their hot keys in real time, they always hot keys workers or larva in early game, seems like the only reason for this is to spam HK(hotkey)1 and HK2 and they hit 300-400 APM, does this transition to army hotkeys mid to late game and they are just spamming HKs 1/2/3/ etc maintaining high APMS
So considering the above, if you were to take out spamming HKs would their APM drop to 150-250~ which i can realistically see myself reaching about 200~, to me i can;t see how anything above 300 is possible without spamming useless hotkeys that doesn't add any value into the game, aside from high APM
I think you are at the level of apm where to go up, you'd need to actually multitask more
People spam the hotkeys early because there just isn't enough to do to ramp up to 300+ apm, the justification was I believe 'to keep the fingers warm'.
Pro players aren't spamming hotkeys anymore past tthe early game, their apm stays high because they are doing more. There is just too much to do, every extra thing they are doing costs clicks and keypresses and attention.
It's useful to look at old FPViews of progamers, especially from the prohouse days. Aside from the usual large army control + micro while not faltering on macro (including expanding on time even if there is a lot of big clashes), I notice they spend a lot of time repositioning their army's, even when not actively in a fight. Making sure they cover the important parts of the map and units stay in good spread/ arc.
If you find your apm is no longer going up just being more fluent in the way you play, it's usually a sign to be multitasking more. Could be keeping more on top of mine clearing, scouting more with corsairs, moving your army back and forth to threaten their expo's or defending yours, and making them also reposition their army in response, there is always something else you can be doing to give yourself an advantage, and doing more naturally demands higher apm
On March 26 2026 13:00 doubleupgradeobbies! wrote: I think you are at the level of apm where to go up, you'd need to actually multitask more
People spam the hotkeys early because there just isn't enough to do to ramp up to 300+ apm, the justification was I believe 'to keep the fingers warm'.
Pro players aren't spamming hotkeys anymore past tthe early game, their apm stays high because they are doing more. There is just too much to do, every extra thing they are doing costs clicks and keypresses and attention.
It's useful to look at old FPViews of progamers, especially from the prohouse days. Aside from the usual large army control + micro while not faltering on macro (including expanding on time even if there is a lot of big clashes), I notice they spend a lot of time repositioning their army's, even when not actively in a fight. Making sure they cover the important parts of the map and units stay in good spread/ arc.
If you find your apm is no longer going up just being more fluent in the way you play, it's usually a sign to be multitasking more. Could be keeping more on top of mine clearing, scouting more with corsairs, moving your army back and forth to threaten their expo's or defending yours, and making them also reposition their army in response, there is always something else you can be doing to give yourself an advantage, and doing more naturally demands higher apm
Thanks, that makes a lot of sense, will focus on improving my multitasking and macrol.
How are people hot keying production buildings (gate/fact/hatch) eg. 5-0 with the ability to build units and set rally points without screen switching or is using the camera F2-F4 hotkeys and then selecting structures individually more efficient?
hotkeying workers early game is needed to keep track of the workers you are mineral boosting at the start of the game
300+ is absolutely needed when you muta micro, you need to be playing at that tempo to pull off m-con snipes and still pull off fast enough to minimize damage from marines. plus the more move commands you input, the better your mutalisks will stack. best example is soulkey, who cruises at 270-290 apm early game but it ramps up to 350 during muta micro. larva also produce twice as fast as protoss gateways, and unlike how terran or protoss barracks/gateways show the progress of marines/zealots, zerg hatcheries show no progress bar of larva production so zergs pretty much have to blindly spam 5sm6sm7sm to macro while muta harassing
as for protoss, i’d imagine the same the same is true to properly reaver micro while simultaneously macroing at home. I’d look at snow’s fpvods pvt, since like soulkey he generally cruises at sub 300 apm, but i imagine it shoots up into the mid 300s during reaver micro
On March 26 2026 13:00 doubleupgradeobbies! wrote: I think you are at the level of apm where to go up, you'd need to actually multitask more
People spam the hotkeys early because there just isn't enough to do to ramp up to 300+ apm, the justification was I believe 'to keep the fingers warm'.
Pro players aren't spamming hotkeys anymore past tthe early game, their apm stays high because they are doing more. There is just too much to do, every extra thing they are doing costs clicks and keypresses and attention.
It's useful to look at old FPViews of progamers, especially from the prohouse days. Aside from the usual large army control + micro while not faltering on macro (including expanding on time even if there is a lot of big clashes), I notice they spend a lot of time repositioning their army's, even when not actively in a fight. Making sure they cover the important parts of the map and units stay in good spread/ arc.
If you find your apm is no longer going up just being more fluent in the way you play, it's usually a sign to be multitasking more. Could be keeping more on top of mine clearing, scouting more with corsairs, moving your army back and forth to threaten their expo's or defending yours, and making them also reposition their army in response, there is always something else you can be doing to give yourself an advantage, and doing more naturally demands higher apm
Thanks, that makes a lot of sense, will focus on improving my multitasking and macrol.
How are people hot keying production buildings (gate/fact/hatch) eg. 5-0 with the ability to build units and set rally points without screen switching or is using the camera F2-F4 hotkeys and then selecting structures individually more efficient?
I'm pretty out of the loop now, but last i heard (this was a decade ago), usually for protoss numbers for army, F keys for production buildings. some of the larger numbers get used for important units but not mass produced units like observers/shuttles/reavers.
On March 26 2026 18:19 Crimson)S(hadow wrote: hotkeying workers early game is needed to keep track of the workers you are mineral boosting at the start of the game
300+ is absolutely needed when you muta micro, you need to be playing at that tempo to pull off m-con snipes and still pull off fast enough to minimize damage from marines. plus the more move commands you input, the better your mutalisks will stack. best example is soulkey, who cruises at 270-290 apm early game but it ramps up to 350 during muta micro. larva also produce twice as fast as protoss gateways, and unlike how terran or protoss barracks/gateways show the progress of marines/zealots, zerg hatcheries show no progress bar of larva production so zergs pretty much have to blindly spam 5sm6sm7sm to macro while muta harassing
as for protoss, i’d imagine the same the same is true to properly reaver micro while simultaneously macroing at home. I’d look at snow’s fpvods pvt, since like soulkey he generally cruises at sub 300 apm, but i imagine it shoots up into the mid 300s during reaver micro
Also yes, from what i remember of older FPVods there is a lot of movement spam in the early midgame. Not so much on reaver/shuttle (shuttles don't turn that fast and often you need to keep momentum, and reavers don't respond well to attack spam). But things like scouting probes, corsairs, small numbers of speedlots often there is movement spam to get sorta moving hit on zealots and make dragons go closer than their maximum range so they can actually get their attacks off.
On March 26 2026 13:00 doubleupgradeobbies! wrote: I think you are at the level of apm where to go up, you'd need to actually multitask more
People spam the hotkeys early because there just isn't enough to do to ramp up to 300+ apm, the justification was I believe 'to keep the fingers warm'.
Pro players aren't spamming hotkeys anymore past tthe early game, their apm stays high because they are doing more. There is just too much to do, every extra thing they are doing costs clicks and keypresses and attention.
It's useful to look at old FPViews of progamers, especially from the prohouse days. Aside from the usual large army control + micro while not faltering on macro (including expanding on time even if there is a lot of big clashes), I notice they spend a lot of time repositioning their army's, even when not actively in a fight. Making sure they cover the important parts of the map and units stay in good spread/ arc.
If you find your apm is no longer going up just being more fluent in the way you play, it's usually a sign to be multitasking more. Could be keeping more on top of mine clearing, scouting more with corsairs, moving your army back and forth to threaten their expo's or defending yours, and making them also reposition their army in response, there is always something else you can be doing to give yourself an advantage, and doing more naturally demands higher apm
Thanks, that makes a lot of sense, will focus on improving my multitasking and macrol.
How are people hot keying production buildings (gate/fact/hatch) eg. 5-0 with the ability to build units and set rally points without screen switching or is using the camera F2-F4 hotkeys and then selecting structures individually more efficient?
if all your gateways fit on 5-0, it is definitely way more efficient to use 5-0 switch rallies; example: f4 to go to choke, then 5RC(right-click),6RC,7RC,8RC,9RC,0RC
however late game when you have too many gateways to fit on 5-0, getting fast at using f2/f3/f4 to switch rallies becomes crucial. here's an ancient clip demonstrating how fast you can get at using f2/f3/f4 to switch rallies
BW hotkey data is outdated anyways cus they don't count camera key movement etc., if u spam unit movement u raise ur EAPM and if u spam ur regular hotkeys u raise ur APM
You don't need to stress a lot regarding your APM. As a protoss player you can achieve a lot with 200 apm, and by a lot I mean you can go S rank literally. So in a way you aren't that far with 170 apm. There was a time I had 175 apm and 200 apm felt like I was playing on amphetamine. It comes with automatism, I would suggest you spend more time microing and harassing while macroing. Focus on build orders that promote this type of play like one gate opening vs zerg. Once you get used to that your APM will increase without you noticing it because you will accomplish these 'basic' tasks without thinking about it. Hotkey might also play an important role, try to rely on them as much as you can because you will buy a lot of time which you can use to do something else.
But anyway, the most important is doing the right thing at the right moment.
On March 27 2026 16:54 iFU.pauline wrote: You don't need to stress a lot regarding your APM. As a protoss player you can achieve a lot with 200 apm, and by a lot I mean you can go S rank literally. .. Hotkey might also play an important role, try to rely on them as much as you can because you will buy a lot of time which you can use to do something else.
dont worry about apm, but do worry about hitting s-rank? ladder rank is important. and hotkeys might be important? s-rank is a lot. a lot of what?
I don't really understand what you are trying to say. Of course ladder rank is more meaningful than APM do you think otherwise? Low APM doesn't imply good or bad habits; it doesn't imply that you are building strong fundamentals either if it is high, it doesn't imply much in fact. It is how you use them that matters. 200APM is plenty enough to become very good already when playing Protoss that was I meant by "a lot". And focusing on that aspect to me is a better approach. All you need is a proper hotkey management for a good start and APM will follow as you improve, it doesn't have to be a goal.
ps: I said "might" because I am not a protoss player to begin with.
Collect knowledge about what you should have at X time in the game, when you should do Y etc. Make sure you know responses to X,Y,Z. Don't worry about playing flawless or high apm. Learn what to do in X, Y , Z. When you don't have to think about what to do in X,Y, Z scenario, your APM will increase because you are not using any brainpower thinking what to do, mostly only to react to opponent or what is happening in the moment. Study the game enjoy it, don't feel like you have to win. Draw knowledge. Your APM will increase eventually
On March 27 2026 16:54 iFU.pauline wrote: You don't need to stress a lot regarding your APM. As a protoss player you can achieve a lot with 200 apm, and by a lot I mean you can go S rank literally. .. Hotkey might also play an important role, try to rely on them as much as you can because you will buy a lot of time which you can use to do something else.
dont worry about apm, but do worry about hitting s-rank? ladder rank is important. and hotkeys might be important? s-rank is a lot. a lot of what?
i dont mean any disrespect but in my opinion this is the worst possible way to improve at the game. this player will just plateau again at 200apm. so he might hit s-rank. so what? flash is s-rank. and so is artosis. ladder ranks are totally meaningless. this player will need to go back and un-learn everything and re-learn good habits if he ever wants to break this new plateau.
but yes that part about focusing on "doing right thing at right moment" is definitely huge.
edit. nevermind, ignore everything in my post above. especially the part about closely studying the mechanics of a 350apm protoss OSL champion. just listen to the all the perma-plateau non-korean "a/s-rankers" on TL. they definitely know what they're talking about. i mean flash is s-rank so they are basically flash. forget about learning to play like someone good at the game. you too can learn to play like pauline and scvrn. it will be great to lose to 90-150 apm zergs year after year. imagine how much fun you'll have learning to enjoy losing at starcraft. and dont worry. you'll still have a glorious s-rank badge. it will be great. you got this! remember: good mechanics and good apm are meaningless.
Bro calm down lol it's not that serious. People disagreed with you on a gaming forum, no need to crash out and throw a tantrum. SCRVN is a perennial idiot but Pauline at least tries to support others and give good advice. You can disagree without crying about it. Yes, congratulations, you set an impressive goal and achieved it after years of dedication, congratulations. That doesn't mean that's everyone's goal or that everyone learns/improves the same way. Do you think your attitude makes it more or less likely that your advice is taken seriously?
it just sucks that there's no way to integrate camera key actions into APM in order to have a complete "mechanics picture", right now mechanics in BW aren't fully captured in any actions metric, also the way APM/EAPM info is compiled is a bit misleading
if you kb spam to increase your APM the game registers the extra actions as spam, if you spam move command your protoss ball, vults/bio or mutas around the map (1a2a3a group of units around the map) then your EAPM will skyrocket even tho you're just moving ur army around the map, however a lot of these actions could be wasted actions/spam as well (in the sense that you're doing those actions over more important actions, however the game doesn't recognize that), for example you'll always see Z with a ton of EAPM in early/midd game ZvT just cus they're constantly moving their mutas around while just macroing out of 2-3 hatches (basic macro)
if you move your army around for 1 min without macroing you end up with super high EAPM while floating a ton of mins, just moving ur army around without macroing isn't what i'd call "effective apm" but for some reason that's how it's labelled, BW lacks a lot of these small improvements cus the code is so archaic
at very high levels your multitask/the amount of time u spend on a screen is what separates players apart, for example knowing when you have to allocate a lot of your time to 1 screen (for example during a fight) vs screen switching fast during attacks/defending/macro segments of the game
so in order to increase your apm/speed (throughout the game) you need to multitask faster, in order to multitask faster u need a good hotkey and camera key setup/layout, that'll vary for every player tho (everyone has different postures, ie: kb and hand positioning, desk/chair height etc.)
you should first figure out what works for you while having a general understanding of the basics (i.e: your goal is to prioritize hand movement speed so focusing on ergonomics is important), if you have ur SCV hotkey on P but you hotkey your CC on 3/4 then that's not very efficient movement, another example is when u wanna build something, if ur build hotkey and the building hotkey is the same.. so let's say your build hotkey is S and your racks hotkey S, going S > S is gonna be slower than going S > D for example, cus u can press those keys almost simultaneously etc.
TLDR: first map out how you wanna hotkey all your stuff (unit hotkey/buildings/abilities etc.), then figure out how u wanna setup your production hotkeys (early game units on 1/2/3, CC on 4/5, rax/fact on 6/7/8, scans etc.) then think about how you wanna use your fkeys
ofc all this depends on how serious u wanna be, for most ppl they just wanna play casually so they just stick to the absolute basics, it just depends on ur goals
I remember the times where I wanted to improve my speed and would mainly focus on that goal. The immediate gain was a better mech indeed since your units production is faster but the decision making remains the same. So I made the same mistakes just with more units. They were less visible because I was putting a better fight but still, as soon as I would face a player with mech of that level the loses were the same. Past a certain level you need good mech anyway, you won't reach S rank without having good mech regardless of having 200 or 350apm. Strong decision making is much more rewarding than winning on sheer mech aspect. It should always be prioritised from my perspective.
tankgirl is talking about the 'worst approach'. Well, I have experienced the worst approach which is to focus on mech playing instinctively being super agressive expecting my level to improve 'naturally'. That's the worst approach imo. And gosh seeing my rapid improvements with a mindset that focuses on game knowledge and decision making, if only I could rewind time back to 2001 and apply that method, holy hell...
well apm is a good feedback but what is matter a lot thats the mechanic skill. If u have have high apm (mostly eapm) then u have opportunity for good mechanic. Example back in the Fish days when was good apm count program every progamer had around 200++ eapm mostly 220-230 ( even protoss ) every foreigner had around 180-200. I played against every progamers at that time so i have to say its a good feedback u cant be top-top if not have high apm. + if u check SC2, Aoe2 every top players have 350-450 apm in SC because they are old they are not a monsteres like back in the days but the most of them still using very high apm.
just do more if you engage in battles or roam with your army, you cannot just 1a2a3a-left click, you need to manually adjust the movement of your units to counter AI pathing bugs and maximize your efficiency. If you sit back and just macro, then 150apm is enough i guess. As someone has already suggested, multitasking is also key. Attack from two sides, macro while attacking, produce probes continuously, all this jazz the more you move your units (which is essential for controlling the game flow) the more apm you will need I used to be stuck in 150-180apm for ages, these days i'm between 230 and 260 depending on the game length and Im more efficient than i used to be. Im 43yo btw
General korean wisdom I've heard a long time ago was that you need at least 170 APM to play the game on a high level. This is ballpark true, but protoss can get away with even less.
There are multiple top forgeigners in this range, but the slowest is GoOdy who often played bw with 120-130 APM in top tournaments. He switched from T to P precisely for this reason.
This illustrates very well that what matters the most is game knowledge and smart strategy, multitask, mouse precision and ability to micro, but speed is also important. And a good hotkey setup. All top pros have very sophisticated and active hotkey usage.
What has not been mentioned here is "Action distribution" (can be checked in bwchart), which is showing the composition of the APM, especially regarding hotkeys. The other big value is the move command. While for Goody this may be like 15-20% hotkeys, it is common that pros play with 35-60% of their actions as hotkeys. Generally, the more APM someone has, the more they spam. So: 200 APM players - 35% hotkey usage 250-280 - 40% 300-350 - 50% 400+ 60% Some players spam the move command more than others instead of the hotkeys, but this is less useful. Spamming hotkeys is actually useful if you can pay attention to it (multitask ability), because you can check production and macro better this way. If you don't use it, just spam mindlessly, then of course it can be even hindering.
There are multiple ex-pros or semi pros around 200 apm. The slowest top level pro is Movie (OSL 2nd place), with 200-230 APM. The fastest top level pro is EffOrt (OSL winner) with 430 APM+ when he feels like it The "fastest" pro is By.Cola with close to 500 APM, sometimes over it.
I think you can increase your apm to certain degree, but unfortunately not without limits. Some people can just think and (re)act faster.
I don't know if you notice but the average player gets slower as the game goes past the 8-10 minute mark. Pros generally stay the same all through the game, not much of a dip even after 20 minutes. It's easy to get 300 APM in the first 5 minutes because you're just spamming and there isn't too much thinking involved but as the game goes on, there are more decisions to make so the lag between these decisions causes the APM to dip.
Having your APM curve up as the game goes on is much more important than the actual APM (unless it's something insanely low like 130). You should be performing more actions as there are more actions to perform and if your APM is decaying as the game goes on then you might be fast tracking yourself to carpal tunnel for nothing.
Keep your hot keys to what works for you and is comfortable. Absolutely no reason to wreck your wrists trying to copy someone else. I will add the caveat that f2 f3 f4 is mandatory for bases to mineral walk probes away from harass, but eventually you need to put these on gateways so its not a longterm solution.
Focus on army positioning, spending your resources, keeping production smooth (not queuing up 3 zealots at a time or supply blocking yourself) and your APM will be whatever it has to be. There's been terrible pros and foreign streamers with high apm and legends with comparatively low apm (oov, flash).
APM is meaningless without actually watching someone's FPVOD to see where the APM goes. I average close to 350 apm playing TvZ, and around 300 playing TvP and TvT. But my actions aren't the most precise/efficient, so lots of that APM comes down to spam, along with the actual critical moments of games where my control may fail me like TvP army engagements. There's so many factors to consider when merely trying to view APM as a way of gauging player skill.
Is it something people should work on if they want to improve? 100%. Learning to play aggressive builds while still managing your macro at home is a very important skill, and at a certain point, is mandatory (playing bio vs muta and needing to watch your bio army on the map while macroing at home). Practicing builds like 8 rax or fact-cc-fact 3 tank stabs TvP for example are good ways to practice taking fights while trying to macro at home.
APM is apparently important with the new kids, i was watching videos about Tyler1/Hera/Grubby on Warcraft3, and the term "APM mogging" is mentioned by grubby and the chat lol
EPT
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