EPTsair/goon pvt?
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
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Resonate
United Kingdom8402 Posts
but then if you're way ahead you could do any unit combo and be fine | ||
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CommanderCheng
China68 Posts
But when I think about it Macro is a very important factor in the TvP game and it might just hurt your ground unit count pretty badly. But then Disfunctional tanks will really help you and lots of Terran players don't spread their tanks out so I think you could pull it off. | ||
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NovaTheFeared
United States7232 Posts
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RiSE
United States3182 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
Obviously it can be put to great use if you have excess stargates, since you have the fleet beacon up anyway, but is it possible to play sair/goon straight through? | ||
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Dantak
Czech Republic648 Posts
I also suggest it on R point where almost all Terrans go out with 200/200 all in. | ||
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rpf289
United States3524 Posts
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ubergamer15
United States645 Posts
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[X]Ken_D
United States4650 Posts
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rsvp
United States2266 Posts
On February 02 2006 14:53 PetrBlaha wrote: This strategy is only viable on maps like lune, where terran don't have antiair like turrets. Also note that time of this spell is really short so you must really hurry I also suggest it on R point where almost all Terrans go out with 200/200 all in. I agree. As a T player, I've only had sair/goon done on me twice in a real game, both of which were on Luna. It worked better than I thought it would, since the P was able to stop many of my attacks, but he never really was able to outmass me and control the map. Eventually, I just outmassed him. | ||
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Night[Mare
Mexico4793 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
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lIlIlIlIlIlI
Korea (South)3851 Posts
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boongee
United States967 Posts
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WhatisProtoss
Korea (South)2325 Posts
Vultures will speedily zoom out of the disruption webs and can deal lots of damage, as microing the dragoons against vult/mine is hard to do while controlling the corsairs too. Corsair/d-web just in general takes too much micro its difficult to pull off. Nal_rA\'s reaver/corsair/d-web is so hard in that sense as well. | ||
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SchOOl_VicTIm
Greece2394 Posts
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ygor
Slovakia246 Posts
If there is a point in the game, when you see terran rolling towards you, you have to attack him in that moment, because he will just siege his tanks close to each other very fast. Webs will own these tanks If you see teran slowly pushing towards getting his 2nd expo with tanks spread out, mining fields and turrets, you should abandon corsairs and concetrate on macro, getting more expos and getting carriers later. Webs will just not help you a lot. | ||
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SuperJongMan
Jamaica11586 Posts
So I still don't get the purpose besides good laughs at whoever gets humiliated.. rofl@sync's assrape from Ddong | ||
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alphaentity
United States525 Posts
On February 03 2006 03:26 ygor wrote: This strategy worked for me lots of times. I think it's important to get 2nd expo a little bit later a prefer massing goons and one stargate corsairs to 110/200. If there is a point in the game, when you see terran rolling towards you, you have to attack him in that moment, because he will just siege his tanks close to each other very fast. Webs will own these tanks If you see teran slowly pushing towards getting his 2nd expo with tanks spread out, mining fields and turrets, you should abandon corsairs and concetrate on macro, getting more expos and getting carriers later. Webs will just not help you a lot. Massing goons and corsairs till 110/200 off of one base ? I don't think that's possible cause terran will steam roll u with the better econ off 2 bases. | ||
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mcmascote
Brazil1575 Posts
On February 02 2006 14:12 GrandInquisitor wrote: I'm not thinking just like as part of a super late game start, I'm thinking like midgame primary strat. Obviously it can be put to great use if you have excess stargates, since you have the fleet beacon up anyway, but is it possible to play sair/goon straight through? no On February 02 2006 14:53 PetrBlaha wrote: This strategy is only viable on maps like lune, where terran don't have antiair like turrets. Also note that time of this spell is really short so you must really hurry I also suggest it on R point where almost all Terrans go out with 200/200 all in. at noob level? yes. On February 03 2006 00:46 WhatisProtoss wrote: Yeah, it isn\'t really possible against somebody at the same level as you. If you have the game all wrapped up, then it\'s probably a fun little strategy that shows off a little skill. Otherwise, it could cost you the game if you lack good micro/macro. thats it. | ||
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Into.Love
China172 Posts
On February 03 2006 03:56 alphaentity wrote: Massing goons and corsairs till 110/200 off of one base ? I don't think that's possible cause terran will steam roll u with the better econ off 2 bases. I think you missed what he said. "second expo" means the SECOND expo. That means 2 bases. | ||
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mAx_CoMaNdEr
United States2 Posts
On February 02 2006 21:22 GrandInquisitor wrote: do mines work under dweb? Thats a realy good question, has anyone tested that? | ||
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Cadical
United States469 Posts
Some reps. http://s6.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=3JLDE0T6S7TNS39U621J0S0JNT And No, mines won't react under the web | ||
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Dantak
Czech Republic648 Posts
You know what is your problem? And what is problem of nearly entire BW gaming community. Self-non-adaptness. Almost all ppl (you are included) are too chained to typical strategy. Typical BOs. Who can perform them better, or who has more luck, that wins. That's it. No exceptions. If you would try to "learn" something new , to invent your own style, not copying all these 8/9pylon 11/17 gate 12/17 gas etc etc., then you could see that these strategies could be performed on same skill level, it's just matter of using brain, not only game-after-game mode. pls see these reps. they are not perfect but there is way how it can be done. Thank you http://replays.orik.org/replays/050715 ErOs_Fros-Lumen[z-z.rep http://replays.orik.org/replays/050715 ErOs_Fros-KT.MGW)Pl.rep http://replays.orik.org/replays/050723 FrostY-Crow.rep | ||
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Kami5909
United States157 Posts
On February 04 2006 08:49 PetrBlaha wrote: You know what is your problem? And what is problem of nearly entire BW gaming community. Self-non-adaptness. Almost all ppl (you are included) are too chained to typical strategy. Typical BOs. Who can perform them better, or who has more luck, that wins. That's it. No exceptions. If you would try to "learn" something new , to invent your own style, not copying all these 8/9pylon 11/17 gate 12/17 gas etc etc., then you could see that these strategies could be performed on same skill level, it's just matter of using brain, not only game-after-game mode. pls see these reps. they are not perfect but there is way how it can be done. Thank you http://replays.orik.org/replays/050715 ErOs_Fros-Lumen[z-z.rep http://replays.orik.org/replays/050715 ErOs_Fros-KT.MGW)Pl.rep http://replays.orik.org/replays/050723 FrostY-Crow.rep That's kinda like telling people that there's no use studying classical physics because it doesn't work at the quantum level. We're not all good enough or patient enough and most of us don't have the practice partners worth inventing new strats with. The reason we use these strategies (note: NOT build orders) is because they're PROVEN to be efficient and better unit combos than any random unit combo (i.e. reaver/obs, dt/arbiter, goon/sair, etc.). | ||
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[X]Ken_D
United States4650 Posts
and Dark Archon? or when TvT use to be wraiths only. | ||
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Tossim1
714 Posts
late game it doesnt work | ||
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Tossim1
714 Posts
On February 04 2006 08:49 PetrBlaha wrote: You know what is your problem? And what is problem of nearly entire BW gaming community. Self-non-adaptness. Almost all ppl (you are included) are too chained to typical strategy. Typical BOs. Who can perform them better, or who has more luck, that wins. That's it. No exceptions. If you would try to "learn" something new , to invent your own style, not copying all these 8/9pylon 11/17 gate 12/17 gas etc etc., then you could see that these strategies could be performed on same skill level, it's just matter of using brain, not only game-after-game mode. pls see these reps. they are not perfect but there is way how it can be done. Thank you http://replays.orik.org/replays/050715 ErOs_Fros-Lumen[z-z.rep http://replays.orik.org/replays/050715 ErOs_Fros-KT.MGW)Pl.rep http://replays.orik.org/replays/050723 FrostY-Crow.rep no, its just he's right... t's arent that stupid to just sit there and not do anything about the sairs, if the t is 200/200 he's going to see the sairs and get something to counter them | ||
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cuteFayth
Canada1167 Posts
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Return
Ivory Coast859 Posts
On February 02 2006 15:10 [X]Ken_D wrote: What game is the one where ForU did sairs/goon? ForU vs SynC(Blaze) on lt 12v6 | ||
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Dantak
Czech Republic648 Posts
On February 07 2006 17:08 Kami5909 wrote: That's kinda like telling people that there's no use studying classical physics because it doesn't work at the quantum level. We're not all good enough or patient enough and most of us don't have the practice partners worth inventing new strats with. The reason we use these strategies (note: NOT build orders) is because they're PROVEN to be efficient and better unit combos than any random unit combo (i.e. reaver/obs, dt/arbiter, goon/sair, etc.). but you don't get that point, i'm only saying that it's viable strategy, not denying "good-old" strategies, I'm just saying that this kid with his "1 word answers" don't have any clue what can or can't be done On February 10 2006 17:22 Tossim1 wrote: no, its just he's right... t's arent that stupid to just sit there and not do anything about the sairs, if the t is 200/200 he's going to see the sairs and get something to counter them what is that something on luna? turrets? where? Or do you suggest goliaths? Look at those replays and tell me if protoss's army would be countered by goliaths+tanks combo, and even... do you think that corsairs won't shoot disruption web? they are fast enough and have great range for web | ||
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LastWish
2015 Posts
Arbiter: Arbiter low on mineral cost, consumes lot of gas 100m 350g, 4 supply. Abilities cloak,statis,recall. Statis cost 100 mana = 2.5 statis per full mana. Corsair: Corsair average mineral and low gas cost. 2 supply = 2 sair per 1 arbiter. 2 sair cost 300m 200g Abilities disruption web. Web costs 125 mana = 2 web per 1 sair. So this makes 4 web per 2 sair. Considerably 2 sair can be compared to an arbiter, though the mineral cost is higher but lategames it can do. If u use arbiter for statis it mostly dies to goliaths because there is like 1 second casting time. Corsair won't die so easily. Imho sair is a better companion to carrier than arbiter. | ||
CTStalker
Canada9720 Posts
arbiters give you cloaking, stasis, and recall. sairs give shitty tiny dweb that costs 125 mana, and are pretty good against wraiths. stasis lasts longer than dweb, units can easily move out from under dweb... arbiters are a way better choice | ||
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Tossim1
714 Posts
On February 11 2006 05:30 PetrBlaha wrote: but you don't get that point, i'm only saying that it's viable strategy, not denying "good-old" strategies, I'm just saying that this kid with his "1 word answers" don't have any clue what can or can't be done what is that something on luna? turrets? where? Or do you suggest goliaths? Look at those replays and tell me if protoss's army would be countered by goliaths+tanks combo, and even... do you think that corsairs won't shoot disruption web? they are fast enough and have great range for web umm how about valks/wraiths? lol just shut up you dno what you're talking about =[ | ||
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LastWish
2015 Posts
On February 11 2006 09:15 CTStalker wrote: i have to disagree. arbiters give you cloaking, stasis, and recall. sairs give shitty tiny dweb that costs 125 mana, and are pretty good against wraiths. stasis lasts longer than dweb, units can easily move out from under dweb... arbiters are a way better choice On the other hand 4 webs are more than 2,5 statis. Their mobility is higher and therefore won't die so easily. Statised units cannot be attacked, webbed units may be easily stormed or crushed by goons/carriers. Sairs own wraiths and also may kill flying buildings or vessels. | ||
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Dantak
Czech Republic648 Posts
On February 11 2006 10:23 Tossim1 wrote: umm how about valks/wraiths? lol just shut up you dno what you're talking about =[ so you, "Master of the known and unkown universe known as THABIGGESTGOSU, suggest valkyries and wraiths for TvP combat right? You are D- right? | ||
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Cambium
United States16368 Posts
On February 03 2006 16:45 mAx_CoMaNdEr wrote: Thats a realy good question, has anyone tested that? | ||
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Shauni
4077 Posts
Look at that rep, Satanik makes an 1exp vs 1exp fight PvT and wins with this strategy. Sure, perhaps the POL-B player is under his level, but still. I don't think this strategy is worse than anything else PvT, you just need really good timing. Ok,I know he already had a big advantage since he got an earlier exp, maybe that is why it worked so well =P . http://www.wgtour.com/upload/tournament/broodwar/5459NWPolB2.rep | ||
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Tossim1
714 Posts
On February 11 2006 11:27 PetrBlaha wrote: so you, "Master of the known and unkown universe known as THABIGGESTGOSU, suggest valkyries and wraiths for TvP combat right? You are D- right? wow retard, you obviously support the strat of sairs/goon when the game is 200/200, that alone says that youre a newb. and if toss is going sair goon, WHY IS IT BAD TO GO TANK/VALKS OR TANK WRAITHS? you dont know wtf youre talking about so please suck my balls. | ||
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Tossim1
714 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On February 12 2006 11:43 Tossim1 wrote: ...and if toss is going sair goon, WHY IS IT BAD TO GO TANK/VALKS OR TANK WRAITHS?... Yes, because NEITHER goons NOR sairs rape wraiths. -_- | ||
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Tossim1
714 Posts
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Tossim1
714 Posts
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LastWish
2015 Posts
On February 12 2006 13:29 Tossim1 wrote: lol ok try out 200/200 sair goon vs my 200/200 tank wraiths lets see whotf wins newb. you wouldnt be able to use dweb effectively ANYWAY because you're too slow to cast it so dont even talk like its a viable strat for you to use. my tanks would rape the shit out of your goons, your sairs would be too busy fighting my wraiths to even cast enough dwebs for it to be effective. I wonder how many wraiths would it take to kill 10 sair.... hmmm maybe like hundred... | ||
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GsOne
Poland164 Posts
AND scanning a fleet beacon going up may cause terr to overmass golies and get raped by goons. I think it's nice to learn how and when to pull this off, cause it's a nice alternative to arbiter ending. | ||
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CloudTime
80 Posts
On February 12 2006 13:37 Tossim1 wrote: THE ONLY TIME ITS GOOD IS IF YOU CATCH THE T OFFGUARD EARLY MIDGAME. stfu noob | ||
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Kami5909
United States157 Posts
On February 11 2006 10:23 Tossim1 wrote: umm how about valks/wraiths? lol just shut up you dno what you're talking about =[ Excuse me, did you just suggest that the terran counters mass goon sair with wraith valk? Come again? Look, I don't think goon/sair is a great build or even really viable, but it's really hard not to make fun of the idiot trying to counter it with terran air. Get a few vessels for emp, some gols, and fight without siegeing the tanks. | ||
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Tossim1
714 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
Wraiths, the counter to sairs. This is Tossim1's advice, everyone -_- | ||
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Locked
United States4182 Posts
On February 13 2006 17:54 GrandInquisitor wrote: Please, don't spell it out. Before we only thought you were dumb - now we *know* you are. Wraiths, the counter to sairs. This is Tossim1's advice, everyone -_- it's what the prima guide says! although they also list corsairs as the counter to wraiths | ||
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RuNei
United States30 Posts
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kP_cHoBo
United States439 Posts
On February 12 2006 11:44 Tossim1 wrote: and btw if you think otherwise id be happy to install bw again after not doing so for 10+ months and play you for some moolah via rek + fayth Are you sure u haven't been playing for 10+ months? I sware someone named "Tossim" joined my game "1:1 LT GOSU toss come!!" That wasn't you? My screenname was Marine23.... | ||
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GroT
Belgium3003 Posts
On February 13 2006 15:53 Tossim1 wrote: i was saying wraiths OR vaulks could counter sairs k. i thought it was obvious enough that you would need tanks to counter the goons but i guess i need to spell everything out for you guys are you trolling or what? | ||
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maleorderbride
United States2916 Posts
how bout a close. | ||
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
I think the topic is fine, just not Tossim's advice on how to counter it. | ||
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mcmascote
Brazil1575 Posts
On February 04 2006 08:49 PetrBlaha wrote: pls see these reps. they are not perfect but there is way how it can be done. Thank you http://replays.orik.org/replays/050715 ErOs_Fros-Lumen[z-z.rep http://replays.orik.org/replays/050715 ErOs_Fros-KT.MGW)Pl.rep http://replays.orik.org/replays/050723 FrostY-Crow.rep I won't watch your replays.. do you know why? Cause if you beat someone using corsair/dweb, you should've raped him without corsairs/dweb IMO Macro+Scan >>>>>>>>> 2stargates + fleet + reasearch dweb + 4-6 corsairs + wait for mana + great unit control + corsair micro. again, its just my opinion. But I think you're 6-8 years later in theorycraft | ||
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decafchicken
United States20159 Posts
I'm 2 -0 using it, its quite fun strat to use. | ||
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Dantak
Czech Republic648 Posts
On February 14 2006 13:09 mcmascote wrote: I won't watch your replays.. do you know why? Cause if you beat someone using corsair/dweb, you should've raped him without corsairs/dweb IMO Macro+Scan >>>>>>>>> 2stargates + fleet + reasearch dweb + 4-6 corsairs + wait for mana + great unit control + corsair micro. again, its just my opinion. But I think you're 6-8 years later in theorycraft then you, my friend, just own yourself because saying this without looking at replays in not worthy answer | ||
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decafchicken
United States20159 Posts
On February 13 2006 20:00 kP_cHoBo wrote: Are you sure u haven't been playing for 10+ months? I sware someone named "Tossim" joined my game "1:1 LT GOSU toss come!!" That wasn't you? My screenname was Marine23.... You're Marine23? I think i've played you a couple times in the past. Are you on USEast? | ||
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RaGe
Belgium9950 Posts
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mcmascote
Brazil1575 Posts
Is good to do mass queens and esnare scvs time to time to just slow his eco? I think ITS GOOD!!!!! Theorycraft > all. | ||
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SuperJongMan
Jamaica11586 Posts
So i responded nothing | ||
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kP_cHoBo
United States439 Posts
On February 15 2006 08:20 decafchicken wrote: You're Marine23? I think i've played you a couple times in the past. Are you on USEast? Yes, I'm Marine23 and yes I play on USEast BUT it's only becuz in PGT so many protosses just CHEESE me(as in zealot/cannon rush or block wall with pylon and send zeals in etc,etc,)and I don't learn anything out of it. YES I should play on US West but to me US East is like my "home" cuz that's the first server I started playing SC on and it's difficult for me to play on any other servers unless I'm playing PGT or something. Besides I know many gosu's in east anyways so it don't matter. I play on east but EVERY game I make I make sure to put the name GOSUS ONLY or soemthing like that and pretty decent skill level protosses come....east players aren't ALWAYS newbies....Oh, and BTW decaf what's ur name on east? And I'm not on right now gotta do hw first =/ | ||
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Dantak
Czech Republic648 Posts
On February 15 2006 11:25 mcmascote wrote: Pethblaha, can you clarify something to me? Is good to do mass queens and esnare scvs time to time to just slow his eco? I think ITS GOOD!!!!! Theorycraft > all. it is good, for casual terran expansion it will slow him down for about 300 minerals. | ||
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Tossim1
714 Posts
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uhjoo
Korea (South)1740 Posts
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