On December 04 2018 05:09 badpenny wrote: does the banned gas walk still exist in brood war, and if so how is it done?
Yes, you hold down shift + spam right click on a vespene geyser (one with no refiner/assimilator/extractor on it) and then shift+right click/move/attack to wherever you want to go.
ah i was trying this yesterday and not getting it, but i was only clicking the geyser once, then spamming the move command turns out its banned in cpl anyway, but thanks for answering me
Watching ZvP pro games I see sometimes where the Zerg will make it well into the midgame playing with only Hydra-Lurker and practically no Spire units. What is this strategy called? And when is it good to play in the midgame while still on Hydra-Lurker only? I’ve seen Soulkey do it in some ASL games vs Protoss.
In general zerg will always rely on mass hydra in mid game (exception is if zerg goes for quick 4 base, then its mass sunken + scourge/muta/ling + lurker defence). So that mass hydra you either add muta if protoss is low on corsairs or you add lurker if its high on corsair. (you can of course still do mind games like try to invest heavy in scourge/muta to eliminate air and ambush with mass hydra, but its more risky)
Later when you get to hive tech your natural transition will always be mass ling / hydra / lurker + delifer
Any good terrans out there: What is your view on sharp doing the classic FD vs protoss? Artosis' seems to think its a decent b0x build since it can do damage if your really greedy or defend if your too aggro. Anything else to it? Builds its good vs, or anything artosis isnt seeing?
On December 07 2018 08:30 Dazed. wrote: Any good terrans out there: What is your view on sharp doing the classic FD vs protoss? Artosis' seems to think its a decent b0x build since it can do damage if your really greedy or defend if your too aggro. Anything else to it? Builds its good vs, or anything artosis isnt seeing?
You can do pressure vs a 1 gate nex but 2 gate before nex is risky, toss will have 4 goons when range finished so it's better to stay at home.
No one really does FD pushes anymore (unless it's a semi allin like 10-10-10), it only works if your opponent can't goon micro. Even if P goes 1 gate 28 nex they can defend a FD push, if P 2 gates and you decide to FD push for some odd reason then you're just dead.
Going gas > 2-4 marines > CC > tank > defensive mines > 2nd fact > light poke or defensive play (situational) is a solid opener tho. Watch Scan reps or vods if you wanna see someone execute this style really well (he does it frequently), these type of builds are mostly done on maps that have an easy nat to push on (i.e not CB cus of the narrow bridges, which is why 15cc is more popular on CB). It's a solid opener on FS for example.
Sharp likes to go defensive FD, not the classic marine tank vult offensive FD. Watch his game vs Rain on FS for 1 variation of the b.o (https://www.twitch.tv/videos/345330242?t=02h29m12s no 2nd fact this game because he was blind and it's cross position anyways). He likes to go fact > bunk > siege expo on reverse ramp maps but that's a normal b.o, a lot of people still do that.
Sharp does the defensive FD into 2 fact variation vs Dewalt at the Moscow LAN, he decided to play defensive w/ his 2 facts and go into a 5 fact push behind it tho (Dewalt went for 2 base aggro play into 2 base arbs). Defensive FD is a good overall b.o that gives you a lot of flexibility, the key is understanding the matchup (all the different situations, factoring in the map and spawn locations) in order to optimize your followup as much as possible.
Sharp also likes to go starport behind a defensive FD, he most likely likes to go FD a lot it because it gives him a lot of post expansion options. He's also one of the best players when it comes to vulture usage so it fits his play-style really well.
On December 07 2018 14:09 rand0MPrecisi0n wrote: What do you consider a "classic" fd?
6 marines 1 tank push followed by vultures and a CC, what else?
There's a lot of variation inside the term "fd", but I'm sure you know that mr. zerg user.
I agree with TT1 that in general it's bad but that's something Dazed already knew so without any more details it's impossible to answer. I'd also avoid listening to Artosis if you want strategy advice, since he'll say blatantly wrong stuff all the time just to create hype or have something to talk about.
Ok, so I guess I've got 2 questions, which are sort of related to one another.
Intro : I understand HT are essential for PvZ early-mid game, but I tend to keep them in late as well, as I cannot miss on the value of storms (although I've been losing a lot doing this). And recently I've started warping most of my HTs in the lategame (18+mins) to archons with a decent success. Questions: * So my question is how much do you need HTs late? * It is correct to just warp all of them but 3/4 to archons in the very late game? * Finally, does it depend on the composition Zergs are going for, for example, I can see mass archon being effective against ultra ling, but less so against hydra/lurker/ling.
Am I onto something here, or have I got the entire match wrong?
You wanna be more HT heavy in the middgame because they're more efficient vs hydra comps (archons less so) and less HT heavy in the lategame. That said, i personally stick to about 4 HTs at any stage of the game (midd or lategame), only difference is i'll have khaydarin amulet in the lategame.
A lot of protoss players run into the same problem where they over-make HTs, can't hit all their storms and end up having a flimsy ground comp and just get rolled by the zerg. Lategame vs Z you want your army to be very archon heavy with a few reavs (2-4) and 3-4 HTs, in order to fight efficiently vs defilers/lurks etc.
yeah you rarely need more than 3-4 ht at any time in the game. 3-4 ht without energy upgrades still gives you 4-8 storms. 8 storms is actually heaps and if youre relying on yourself to hit 8 good storms to win a fight then you shouldnt be fighting at all tbh. morph everything else into archons. great tanks, good damage
On December 09 2018 01:12 Alpha-NP- wrote: Why have I heard that lategame Ultras fell out of style in ZvP? Why aren’t they considered good any more?
They are good, and they're great late game-- i mean, its not 2006 or 2005 anymore, where ultraling was considered unstoppable. The halcyon days of ultra/crackling late game was basically down to the fact that maps tended to be less gas heavy and so protoss couldnt compete against that composition as well as today.
Thanks all. It's been great help. Glad that I was not the only one wondering this and thank to all who shared their thoughts I think it really helped me.
On December 09 2018 01:12 Alpha-NP- wrote: Why have I heard that lategame Ultras fell out of style in ZvP? Why aren’t they considered good any more?
A few ultras are good to tank initial reav shots in big engagements, massing ultras isnt cost efficient tho. Reav/archon/storm eats it up. Best to have like 3-4 ultras, engage with them first and swarm in with ur ling/hydra/lurk/defiler comp.
I know liquipedia has a guide on Iloveoov Build (in TvP) but I am wondering if anyone has a more detailed guide or if the build is even viable nowadays.
EPT
