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Simple Questions, Simple Answers - Page 410

Forum Index > Brood War Strategy
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badpenny
Profile Joined August 2018
Canada54 Posts
December 04 2018 18:00 GMT
#8181
On December 05 2018 02:52 jello_biafra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 04 2018 05:09 badpenny wrote:
does the banned gas walk still exist in brood war, and if so how is it done?

Yes, you hold down shift + spam right click on a vespene geyser (one with no refiner/assimilator/extractor on it) and then shift+right click/move/attack to wherever you want to go.


ah
i was trying this yesterday and not getting it, but i was only clicking the geyser once, then spamming the move command
turns out its banned in cpl anyway, but thanks for answering me
Alpha-NP-
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States1242 Posts
December 05 2018 03:06 GMT
#8182
Watching ZvP pro games I see sometimes where the Zerg will make it well into the midgame playing with only Hydra-Lurker and practically no Spire units. What is this strategy called? And when is it good to play in the midgame while still on Hydra-Lurker only? I’ve seen Soulkey do it in some ASL games vs Protoss.
kogeT
Profile Joined September 2013
Poland2040 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-12-05 12:00:36
December 05 2018 09:56 GMT
#8183
In general zerg will always rely on mass hydra in mid game (exception is if zerg goes for quick 4 base, then its mass sunken + scourge/muta/ling + lurker defence). So that mass hydra you either add muta if protoss is low on corsairs or you add lurker if its high on corsair. (you can of course still do mind games like try to invest heavy in scourge/muta to eliminate air and ambush with mass hydra, but its more risky)

Later when you get to hive tech your natural transition will always be mass ling / hydra / lurker + delifer
https://www.twitch.tv/kogetbw
Dazed.
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3301 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-12-06 23:30:38
December 06 2018 23:30 GMT
#8184
Any good terrans out there: What is your view on sharp doing the classic FD vs protoss? Artosis' seems to think its a decent b0x build since it can do damage if your really greedy or defend if your too aggro. Anything else to it? Builds its good vs, or anything artosis isnt seeing?
Never say Die! ||| Fight you? No, I want to kill you.
rand0MPrecisi0n
Profile Joined February 2017
313 Posts
December 07 2018 05:09 GMT
#8185
What do you consider a "classic" fd?
KameZerg
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Sweden1767 Posts
December 07 2018 05:34 GMT
#8186
On December 07 2018 14:09 rand0MPrecisi0n wrote:
What do you consider a "classic" fd?


6 marines 1 tank push followed by vultures and a CC, what else?
asdasdasdasdasd123123123
KameZerg
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Sweden1767 Posts
December 07 2018 05:36 GMT
#8187
On December 07 2018 08:30 Dazed. wrote:
Any good terrans out there: What is your view on sharp doing the classic FD vs protoss? Artosis' seems to think its a decent b0x build since it can do damage if your really greedy or defend if your too aggro. Anything else to it? Builds its good vs, or anything artosis isnt seeing?


You can do pressure vs a 1 gate nex but 2 gate before nex is risky, toss will have 4 goons when range finished so it's better to stay at home.
asdasdasdasdasd123123123
TT1
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada10010 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-12-07 09:16:13
December 07 2018 06:12 GMT
#8188
No one really does FD pushes anymore (unless it's a semi allin like 10-10-10), it only works if your opponent can't goon micro. Even if P goes 1 gate 28 nex they can defend a FD push, if P 2 gates and you decide to FD push for some odd reason then you're just dead.

Going gas > 2-4 marines > CC > tank > defensive mines > 2nd fact > light poke or defensive play (situational) is a solid opener tho. Watch Scan reps or vods if you wanna see someone execute this style really well (he does it frequently), these type of builds are mostly done on maps that have an easy nat to push on (i.e not CB cus of the narrow bridges, which is why 15cc is more popular on CB). It's a solid opener on FS for example.

Sharp likes to go defensive FD, not the classic marine tank vult offensive FD. Watch his game vs Rain on FS for 1 variation of the b.o (https://www.twitch.tv/videos/345330242?t=02h29m12s no 2nd fact this game because he was blind and it's cross position anyways). He likes to go fact > bunk > siege expo on reverse ramp maps but that's a normal b.o, a lot of people still do that.

Sharp does the defensive FD into 2 fact variation vs Dewalt at the Moscow LAN, he decided to play defensive w/ his 2 facts and go into a 5 fact push behind it tho (Dewalt went for 2 base aggro play into 2 base arbs). Defensive FD is a good overall b.o that gives you a lot of flexibility, the key is understanding the matchup (all the different situations, factoring in the map and spawn locations) in order to optimize your followup as much as possible.

Sharp also likes to go starport behind a defensive FD, he most likely likes to go FD a lot it because it gives him a lot of post expansion options. He's also one of the best players when it comes to vulture usage so it fits his play-style really well.
ab = tl(i) + tl(pc), the grand answer to every tl.net debate
rand0MPrecisi0n
Profile Joined February 2017
313 Posts
December 07 2018 06:26 GMT
#8189
On December 07 2018 14:34 KameZerg wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 07 2018 14:09 rand0MPrecisi0n wrote:
What do you consider a "classic" fd?


6 marines 1 tank push followed by vultures and a CC, what else?


There's a lot of variation inside the term "fd", but I'm sure you know that mr. zerg user.

I agree with TT1 that in general it's bad but that's something Dazed already knew so without any more details it's impossible to answer. I'd also avoid listening to Artosis if you want strategy advice, since he'll say blatantly wrong stuff all the time just to create hype or have something to talk about.
y2kid
Profile Joined May 2018
92 Posts
December 07 2018 23:55 GMT
#8190
PvZ archon composition

Ok, so I guess I've got 2 questions, which are sort of related to one another.

Intro :
I understand HT are essential for PvZ early-mid game, but I tend to keep them in late as well, as I cannot miss on the value of storms (although I've been losing a lot doing this). And recently I've started warping most of my HTs in the lategame (18+mins) to archons with a decent success.
Questions:
* So my question is how much do you need HTs late?
* It is correct to just warp all of them but 3/4 to archons in the very late game?
* Finally, does it depend on the composition Zergs are going for, for example, I can see mass archon being effective against ultra ling, but less so against hydra/lurker/ling.

Am I onto something here, or have I got the entire match wrong?

Thanks
TT1
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada10010 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-12-08 01:58:37
December 08 2018 00:50 GMT
#8191
You wanna be more HT heavy in the middgame because they're more efficient vs hydra comps (archons less so) and less HT heavy in the lategame. That said, i personally stick to about 4 HTs at any stage of the game (midd or lategame), only difference is i'll have khaydarin amulet in the lategame.

A lot of protoss players run into the same problem where they over-make HTs, can't hit all their storms and end up having a flimsy ground comp and just get rolled by the zerg. Lategame vs Z you want your army to be very archon heavy with a few reavs (2-4) and 3-4 HTs, in order to fight efficiently vs defilers/lurks etc.
ab = tl(i) + tl(pc), the grand answer to every tl.net debate
Alpha-NP-
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States1242 Posts
December 08 2018 01:51 GMT
#8192
Nice question y2kid I was recently wondering your same question.
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia8690 Posts
December 08 2018 06:39 GMT
#8193
yeah you rarely need more than 3-4 ht at any time in the game. 3-4 ht without energy upgrades still gives you 4-8 storms. 8 storms is actually heaps and if youre relying on yourself to hit 8 good storms to win a fight then you shouldnt be fighting at all tbh.
morph everything else into archons. great tanks, good damage
Dazed.
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3301 Posts
December 08 2018 15:35 GMT
#8194
the only time i'd ever have more than 4 ht's would be if a couple were defending critical expos' late game, in tandem with reavers.
Never say Die! ||| Fight you? No, I want to kill you.
Alpha-NP-
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States1242 Posts
December 08 2018 16:12 GMT
#8195
Why have I heard that lategame Ultras fell out of style in ZvP? Why aren’t they considered good any more?
Dazed.
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3301 Posts
December 08 2018 17:25 GMT
#8196
On December 09 2018 01:12 Alpha-NP- wrote:
Why have I heard that lategame Ultras fell out of style in ZvP? Why aren’t they considered good any more?
They are good, and they're great late game-- i mean, its not 2006 or 2005 anymore, where ultraling was considered unstoppable. The halcyon days of ultra/crackling late game was basically down to the fact that maps tended to be less gas heavy and so protoss couldnt compete against that composition as well as today.
Never say Die! ||| Fight you? No, I want to kill you.
y2kid
Profile Joined May 2018
92 Posts
December 08 2018 19:49 GMT
#8197
Thanks all. It's been great help. Glad that I was not the only one wondering this and thank to all who shared their thoughts I think it really helped me.
TT1
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada10010 Posts
December 09 2018 00:00 GMT
#8198
On December 09 2018 01:12 Alpha-NP- wrote:
Why have I heard that lategame Ultras fell out of style in ZvP? Why aren’t they considered good any more?


A few ultras are good to tank initial reav shots in big engagements, massing ultras isnt cost efficient tho. Reav/archon/storm eats it up. Best to have like 3-4 ultras, engage with them first and swarm in with ur ling/hydra/lurk/defiler comp.
ab = tl(i) + tl(pc), the grand answer to every tl.net debate
Anc13nt
Profile Blog Joined October 2017
1557 Posts
December 09 2018 23:22 GMT
#8199
I know liquipedia has a guide on Iloveoov Build (in TvP) but I am wondering if anyone has a more detailed guide or if the build is even viable nowadays.
kidcrash
Profile Joined September 2009
United States620 Posts
December 10 2018 05:23 GMT
#8200
I'm sure pros know better than I do but doesn't rush's factory placement at 19:04 cause "building exit blocked"?
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