I take my natural as usual. I tech towards Lurkers. Before I'm able to get my lurkers out, a Terran user usually has bunkers + turret set up just out of range of my sunkens. Did I mention they usually have range? So my lurkers get completely annihalated by the long-ranged marines in bunkers. I'm contained for a while, trying to build up an army in order to break out, but by the time I think I have a "sufficient" force, the Terran has several tanks supported by more m&m.
My question is, how do you break out of a containment like this if you've gone lurker? Or even better, how do you prevent it?
Drop at base? Or just get drop fast and drop outside your own base so you can walk your lurks to their base. Just seems logical since they spent money on turret/bunks, they'd be a little weaker on base defense and plus slower sci vessel, which you really should have in order to efficiently stop lurks within your base.
Hmm... I know several Terrans that like to contain me early on just like this (with a bunker + turret), but I was always able to break out just fine. Break out with your first couple of lurkers. Chances are that they'll have a tank and a bunker + turret and some mnm. But you really should be able to break the containment as long as you have support for your lurkers and micro decently.
You can try a couple of things. First of all, try to get in the habit of keeping an overlord outside his base to see troops leaving, and one outside yours to catch them setting up. If it's close enough, you can try creeping a couple of sunkens before he gets range, but if not, get drop as soon as you can. That will allow you to drop outside of your base to intercept reinforcements, and send units to his base. You can also use slowdrop sometimes to drop on other cliffs he would normally believe to be safe, such as he's setting up vs you @12, you can drop lurks at 3, and sometimes take out his units that are too near that cliff. Don't be afraid to stop drone production and go hard ling/lurk for a little bit, because when you break out, chances are he'll be undermanned, and you'll have sufficient time to set up your econ. If you notice this early, a +1 upgrade on either armor or ling attack can be very helpful when breaking a contain. When doing so, having drop also helps to drop 1-2 overlords of lings behind his set up to help flank.
if you were getting drop, ferry your units out and ignore the bunks
if you weren't getting drop, you should have made few drones and mass lurk/ling, just annihilate his setup
I guess you are talking about nostalgia? If you were talking about LT, a fast dropship build is a bigger problem vs ur tech choice by far, especially if u like to start out with drop (u wont be able to stop well microed mm drop)
if its nostalgia u probably went mass lurk/ling without drop (theres really no other choice if u fast exp) and u should have just made few drones and used the alternative exit // broken out accordingly
Correct me if I'm wrong but lurkers should still out range the bunkers shouldn't they? I've always found that bunker/turret is a temporary lurk slow down tactic until vessel/tank can be used. Bunker/turret isn't a lurker "counter" persay.
Also keep in mind that if you see the containment really early, going muta and sunkening hard would be a smarter way to go.
start drop if you havent already then push at his containment. He'll run out of scan fairly quickly. If that's no good, plant a couple of lurkers outside of his main once you get drop, then expand using drop then mass and bust out
and this is what he did. He just relaxed casue of the Bunkers the tanks are out of range of your drones. so they do no real damage, they just shoot at your sunkens which is not that problematic.
now push all your minerals and gas in Lurker until you have a decent ammount. than take all your lurkers and crush the terran the momment he tries to enter your base.
after you crushed his contain you can expand and build up a good eco.
I did the same thing against a zerg on LT a few days ago... zerg at 12, me at 9.. What looked like it was gonna be a 9 pool, turned out to be a very obvious fast tech to lurks (no lings/ no expo). Immediately I set up the bunker/turret deal inside his main away from the creep. he ended up losing 4-ish lurks to the bunk/turret before my newly built fac outside the ramp kicked in, and it was GG shortly after.
muta/ling and lurk/ling are both pretty viable so long as you're not skipping units. If you're teching straight without anything to keep the terran from setting up, then it is mostly game over already. Otherwise as long as you are making the lings and using them to scout around/ pressure the terran you will most likely have time to get either lurks or mutas by the time the terran mm force is forcing your lings to run back.
I find this tvz bunk in strat extremely successful and a pain in the ass when ur zerg and t does it correctly. Btw i'd be lurk dropping their main and lurking behind there bunks to get reinforcements when they come.
If he doesn't put too much effort into his containment, you can kill it. If he puts much into it, you can harass at his main, while expoing somewhere else yourself.
I like to do this sort of quick contain against a friend TvZ, but just to tell you it gets stopped cold if the zerg spots it and acts before the first bunker goes up. Its simply a matter of keeping overlords watching outside your base and outside the terran's base. Once they get a solid bunker + 2 tanks or so set up it gets MUCH harder to break out, but still possible.
On September 30 2004 20:52 Rayzorblade wrote: Here is the scenario:
I take my natural as usual. I tech towards Lurkers. Before I'm able to get my lurkers out, a Terran user usually has bunkers + turret set up just out of range of my sunkens. Did I mention they usually have range? So my lurkers get completely annihalated by the long-ranged marines in bunkers. I'm contained for a while, trying to build up an army in order to break out, but by the time I think I have a "sufficient" force, the Terran has several tanks supported by more m&m.
My question is, how do you break out of a containment like this if you've gone lurker? Or even better, how do you prevent it?
hmm... drop seems to be the answer, but where is the bunker in consideration to your main? if on a map such as lost temple, one can perhaps run units past the contain if it's in the middle of the base. if it's right under the ramp, i'd suggest drop, but if it's close to your base andd not close to the ramp i would suggest to run lurkling around the "contain" and attack or maybe expo? don't ask me, i'm just newbie zerg
Drops can also help making a pincer move to his contain ... or maybe just drop in his base... quick hive can also help but i dont recommend it, you can rape his main with muta... or you can just start massing untis stopping drone prodduction and break the contain.
On September 30 2004 21:00 VerticalHorizon wrote: Drop at base? Or just get drop fast and drop outside your own base so you can walk your lurks to their base. Just seems logical since they spent money on turret/bunks, they'd be a little weaker on base defense and plus slower sci vessel, which you really should have in order to efficiently stop lurks within your base.
Uh No? I played a zvt and terran did a lil quick 2 bunk contain on korhal and i was EASILY able to burrow lurks and hit bunker while not getting hit back. Im not sure if he had range though.
On October 01 2004 07:24 MPXMX wrote: I'm pretty sure lurkers have at least range 7. Goons don't outrange lurkers and i believe those guys go 5 -> 7 after upgrade.
Marines, Hydras, and Dragoons all have range 4. After respective range upgrades, Marines and Hydras have range 5 while Dragoons have range 6. Lurkers have range 6 but splashes to 6.5.
On October 01 2004 07:24 MPXMX wrote: I'm pretty sure lurkers have at least range 7. Goons don't outrange lurkers and i believe those guys go 5 -> 7 after upgrade.
Marines, Hydras, and Dragoons all have range 4. After respective range upgrades, Marines and Hydras have range 5 while Dragoons have range 6. Lurkers have range 6 but splashes to 6.5.
So one could actually kill the bunker with hitting your own lings? Cool
tokoreawithlove u have to remember the bunkers not empty, so if u run a lot of lings in there u might as well not worry about 6.5 splash and just get in there
uhhm... I just always set up some big flank attack with hyde/ling (drop outside base, and bring troops around). Or, if your feeling fancy, try to ignore it until he gets tanks :p
EPT
