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I keep getting surprised by the racial statistics for various maps in Korean sponsor matches. It's so interesting to me that I'm making this thread.
Source: sponbbang
For the first surprise, I want to ask what race you think the map Nemesis (the new twilight one, not the old space one) favours, and if not one race, what the matchups are like on it. No cheating by looking the stats up first!
Spoilered image of the map in question:
+ Show Spoiler +
I thought it'd be a Zerg map in ZvT for sure, because of four geysers accessible behind one entrance. I thought around 52 to 55% ZvT.
I thought Protoss would be able to fight Zerg ok with sair reaver, so around 50% in that matchup.
I thought Protoss would have an advantage over Terran, maybe 55 to 60% PvT.
The actual results for Nemesis this year, so far:
+ Show Spoiler +
PvT: 58.8%
TvZ: 56%
ZvP: 51.5%
I was right about PvT and ZvP, but I did not see the TvZ coming.
How does Terran keep getting away with this? Maps that look worse for Terran in every way keep having equal or better winrates for the race than other established points of comparison.
It's humbling and shows that I don't know anything for sure until it's actually tested xd
Did you manage to predict the statistics?
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Without looking at it I would assume
PvT 55/45
PvZ 40/60ish
TvZ 55/45
let see the..
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PvZ being almost even is weird.. I was pretty sure Zerg has an advantage on that map
what is the sample size btw???
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On December 06 2022 06:15 MaGic~PhiL wrote:
PvZ being almost even is weird.. I was pretty sure Zerg has an advantage on that map
what is the sample size btw???
The one gate meta, you don't want to take a far third. If you take one of the semi isalnd thirds your larva cannot be used for army. Essentially zerg is forced to take a far third against a gateway expand
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Another thing to think about is imagine attacking into to the semi island base, when there's tanks or reavers defending. It's an easy base for T and P to take vs Z.
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On December 06 2022 06:15 MaGic~PhiL wrote:
PvZ being almost even is weird.. I was pretty sure Zerg has an advantage on that map
what is the sample size btw???
412 games in all matchups except mirrors
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Netherlands3589 Posts
PvT 57/43
TvZ 54/46
ZvP 52/48
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Netherlands3589 Posts
Close enough ^^
PvT: It looks difficult for T to take 4th in TvP, but IF they do it's all gas, even the 3rd. Mid seems to have no obstacles so T can't 2/1 push free as expos are on the edge of the map.
TvZ: Tbh I mostly voted with the trend of the current players in mind. I assume Royal, Light and Rush will have positive win records regardless of the map.
ZvP: It seems easier to defend Hydra bust on this map and then take into account natural ZvP imba.
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sponbbang is dead like almost a year. nobody use that website since early 2022. although someone is trying to maintain the website, but we don't care because of bunch of ads + spam + DDoS + server admin doesn't listen to our feedback.
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Use eloboard.com. I believe you have the most up to date statistics and records tehre
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Keep in mind that the race distribution for spon matches is not even. Historically, a lot of the time it was more focused on "entertaining" match-ups like Bisu PvZ, so you'd have more Bisu PvZs proportionally to other Protoss and Zergs in general, so it could be argued that they are weighted stats and not to be trusted about overall balance IMO. Obv once the sample size gets bigger in unbiased sources like Eloboard, that is much better, just FYI.
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Well, if u ask me, usually weirder maps tend to give more of a classic P>T>Z>P situation
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Thanks for the new website. I just got back to StarCraft and didn't know about it
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I thought this would be good for Zerg originally as well, but the 12/3/6/9 gases are reduced, so taking the 2 islands adjacent to you for 4 gas really isn't that strong you still have to secure another main/nat late game vs T/P.
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Dakota_Fanning
Hungary2264 Posts
N e m e s i s 1.0 on repmastered has 176 games so far, 155 inlcuded in stats.
The matchup stats so far:
PvZ: 47% (or ZvP: 53%)
TvZ: 69%
PvT: 52%
Upload more reps to have more accurate stats.
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EPT![[image loading]](https://liquipedia.net/commons/images/8/82/Nemesiseu.jpg)
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/nx4Woig.png)
