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Hey there,
I want to present you a new Phantom map: Phantom Ultimate
(Download link and screenshot at the bottom)
It's designed for average and good players (low-money of course). The map is very balanced and 100% free of cheats and bugs. It was tested thoroughly with players from all skill levels, we even had two well-known European gosus in a game a few times.
This map was necessary because ALL the common Phantom maps are either imbalanced (Phantom BGH) or just plain stupid (for example Phantom Darkness, Phantom Fast Build, Phantom BGH Gold). Basically, they are for noobs.
But not this one.
If you like the concept of Phantom, but don't like the usual maps, then try this one. As far as I know it's the only one that meets the requirements of good players.
If you don't know what Phantom is, it's simple:
- Map for 7-8 players (3 players is minimum, but the stronger the Phantom is, the more players you need. A good rule of thumb is "newbie phantom: 3-5 players, average phantom: 6 players, good phantom: 7 players, very good or gosu phantom: 8 players")
- Gameplay is like melee. No changes to elementary gameplay
- Hunters style map, but modified and balanced
- At the start, everyone is allied and has vision
- One player is the phantom, he gets chosen at random
- The phantom gets extra money constantly (but it's not that much, so he still has to expand and use his resources wisely)
- The phantom fights vs. all the other players!
- It's secret who the phantom is (only he knows), but only for a short while. After 7 minutes game time, he gets revealed to all players (automatic unally + unvision and his location is being displayed at the top left (e.g. "Phantom's base: north-east").
This is necessary because in Phantom maps without cover blow, the phantom often hides and the game takes 1 hour and people start killing themselves out of boredom. This is not how I think that the game should be played. Instead, it should be an intense battle requiring teamwork from the beginning on. So the phantom has to be offensive right from the start. The longer he waits, the harder it will be for him to win.
Features in detail:
- Normal money (low)
- Phantom is selected after a short count-down (1 minute 15 seconds game time)
- Phantom is shown after 7 minutes game time
- Observer mode after a player dies
- Hunters style map, but modified quite a bit. Changes in detail:
-- all naturals have 1 geysir of course (as in Hunters Game-i)
-- the minerals and geysirs are positioned so that the workers never block any units
-- all chokes are equally wide and Terran can do a proper wall-in everywhere
-- all natural expansions are only open to one side
-- tanks can't shoot from their bases to any of the naturals
-- in the center of the map, there are no extra minerals but 4 geysirs, spread out of course. The center of the map is very big, and nothing stands in the way.
-- 4 extra mineral chunks at the border of each base. This is mainly to give you a little bit more resources in late game (so that the Phantom can't just let all players run dry so easily). In early game, it's almost not worth harvesting from it, except for Zerg, who can place the 3rd hatch there. So this gives Zerg a little advantage, but that's okay, because Zerg usually has the hardest time defending against early Phantom attacks, while Terran and Protoss can just wall themselves in.
-- nice, unobtrusive map design/doodads
Note: game time is almost twice as fast as real time (when playing on "Fastest").
Map history:
The map is based on the old "Phantom 1.7 CB" by Ressar, but almost everything has changed except the very basic triggers which work well.
You might have played previous versions of Phantom Ultimate, they were called "Phantom Pro", "Phantom Professional" and "Phantom V". There were also a few previous versions of "Phantom Ultimate", but they all needed some more tweaking.
This is the final one.
Map editing information:
The map is protected, to make it harder for people to create cheat versions. If you want the unprotected map, send me a PM. ScmDraft must be used to edit it.
Authors:
0xDEADBEEF @ BattleNet Europe
ichwilldochnur @ BattleNet Europe
We're also sometimes playing this at around 06:00 TL.net time on the Europe server, so if you're looking for a good Phantom game you know where to go. 
There are a few more players who like this, it's almost like a small clan. I'm not saying any names, but we also have a player from fAke, LRM and DkH who often play this. This just shows that the map is well suited for skilled players, and that it's fun of course.
Download:
Phantom_ultimate_fin_p.scx (57 KB)
Screenshot of the map:
Might look a little strange compared to "Hunters" but it plays very well. And no, you can't drop tanks on any of the small island thingies. It's just decoration that has no effect on the game.
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I don't understand how the phantom can possibly survive a 7v1, even with a few extra minerals.
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1 and 2 o'clock are still positionally imbalanced. I kind of liked the BGH version where you don't run dry. I also feel like 7 minutes is too short.
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On September 25 2007 16:34 blagoonga123 wrote:
I don't understand how the phantom can possibly survive a 7v1, even with a few extra minerals.
well it's not just "a few extra minerals" i think he's under exaggerating maybe
and yeah it's still pretty hard 1v7 though but like he said the better you are then the better you'll be able to use all your money fast etc. etc.
or maybe i'm wrong and it really is a few extra minerals
i always saw the original as more of a "people" game rather than a melee game but i guess this tries to be more about SC than talking zzz
i like the effort placed into balancing out the map positions and stuff though
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wow the map looks amazing and u have done quite alot, well ima go try this tomorrow too tired to play sc now, and im going to spread this :D great job man the map looks awesome and the geysers is perfect
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On September 25 2007 16:37 azndsh wrote:
1 and 2 o'clock are still positionally imbalanced. I kind of liked the BGH version where you don't run dry. I also feel like 7 minutes is too short.
1 and 2 o'clock? You maybe mean the "red" and "blue" positions on the screenshot (although it's all random in the game of course)? Well if you are "red" and "blue" is the phantom (or the other way round) then you have a problem, yes, but you still have two viable choices:
1. Rush the phantom (with some or all workers). This probably won't make you win the game but gives your team a bit more time to grow stronger
2. Ignore your natural expansion and make a wall-in at your choke and defend like mad, then later on do a drop or something.
In any case, this map was really played often. It all works, if you think something might be imbalanced it's really no big deal.
And thanks for the feedback.
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Oh the 7 minute cover blow is pretty cool actually, although it seems short.
It allows the phantom to gather enough resources if he wants to go mass mutalisks for example, but it's still not too long. The game tends to get boring at around the 7th minute if nothing happens, and all players start to wonder who the phantom is after they have their expansion running and getting their unit production going. So it's a good time to reveal it then.
If the phantom waits over 10 minutes he'll never be able to win anyway because the players are already too big.
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United States10774 Posts
eh if I dont know if I really like the 7 minute rule ;o
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Russian Federation4235 Posts
So the retarded tankable expos, unfair expos and unbelievably bad pathing of hunters are still there. Gj.
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On September 25 2007 16:47 0xDEADBEEF wrote:Show nested quote +On September 25 2007 16:37 azndsh wrote:
1 and 2 o'clock are still positionally imbalanced. I kind of liked the BGH version where you don't run dry. I also feel like 7 minutes is too short. 1 and 2 o'clock? You maybe mean the "red" and "blue" positions on the screenshot (although it's all random in the game of course)? Well if you are "red" and "blue" is the phantom (or the other way round) then you have a problem, yes, but you still have two viable choices: 1. Rush the phantom (with some or all workers). This probably won't make you win the game but gives your team a bit more time to grow stronger 2. Ignore your natural expansion and make a wall-in at your choke and defend like mad, then later on do a drop or something. In any case, this map was really played often. It all works, if you think something might be imbalanced it's really no big deal. And thanks for the feedback.
yeah my bad, i meant 11 and 12
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BluzMan: No, no and no.
Pathing is no problem at all.
There are no unfair expansions. You might think that the expansion from top center is unfair because there are 2 chokes (though both are at the bottom). Well, the reason for that is simple: there are two players in the top right corner. That means this expansion can be defended by 2 players. If there's only 1 player in the top left corner, then he'll just take the expansion from top left and guard the choke there. So he only gets 2 expansions for free, not 3.
Top left and top center would be too strong if there were 2 players with 1 expansion each being able to guard one single choke, so we made it a bit easier to reach the top center expansion.
And tanks can only shoot on two of the expansions (center left and right) if they are at the center of the map. Which is no big deal. They don't reach all of the minerals (only 2 chunks!), they don't reach the gas at all, and most importantly they cannot reach ANYTHING if they are not out in the center, vulnerable from all sides, and basically standing right next to the choke. In which case he's about to roll over you anyway.
In the original Hunters map, tanks could shoot from inside their mains or expansions to other expansions. There is no such shit here. It's basically very safe everywhere. We did the best we could to take care of that. It's quite hard to do an 8 player map that leaves enough space everywhere and is almost 100% "tank safe".
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Why don't you just make 12 come straight down into the middle expo instead of like hunters down into 11's expo?
Btw, my strategy in phantom is to always pick zerg, and unvision everyone from the start of the game. (not unally, just vision).
I do this for a couple of reasons;
1- it confuses everyone and makes the game pace faster because people are not gonna tech up all crazy if people start acting strange.
2- if im the phantom i can start throwing down hatches and mass lings with upgrades.
3- I don't trust anyone, there is a 1/7 chance (or more) that any one player is the phantom and a 100% chance for sure that someone other than me is the phantom. I don't want the phantom seeing me and getting scared and raping me, I'll take my chances with getting bum-rushed by everyone who thinks I'm the phantom.
4- Once a player earns my trust I'll give them vision back.
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CharlieMurphy: I tried that, but it just didn't work out. There wasn't enough space in either the center or any of the top expansions then. If you look at the bottom 3 expansions, you'll see that you need much space to make it all tank safe and allow your units to have enough room for movement.
But it's no big deal, as I've said... if you are at 11/12 and 12/11 is phantom, you either do an all-in-rush or you ignore your expansion and try to stay alive. It's fun if you defend like mad and let the phantom waste many resources/units/time on you. This helps your team.
If neither 11 nor 12 is the phantom, it doesn't matter at all.
Besides, the player who gets attacked first generally has a hard time anyway and most probably dies right away. There's really not much you can do about it. It just has to be like that. If you change it, the Phantom cannot ever win.
Thankfully the map has observer mode. 
The map is still hard for the phantom, though. If there are 7 or 8 players, the phantom really needs to try hard.
And yeah your strategy is okay, of course. But I hate players who do that, I always scout them regularly.
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If you can make it fit on the bottom why can't it fit on the top? Just flip/reverse the bottom half to the top. It should fit.
PS- I forgot to mention that I kill anything that comes in my base.
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This is necessary because in Phantom maps without cover blow, the phantom often hides and the game takes 1 hour and people start killing themselves out of boredom. This is not how I think that the game should be played.
Thats the best part of Phantom!
If youre playing to win, maybe this map then. But if youre playing Phantom, then youre playing for fun, which means you Phantom on Hunters is good enough. If the game lasts for an hour, then you guys are taking it way too seriously. Kill someone and start a series of crosses and double-crosses; thats how Phantom was meant to be played.
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I understand that point, but I also know enough players who rather have a competitive map where it's really all about teamwork vs. the phantom. No boredom, no psychological tricks, no alliances, nothing. Just the phantom vs. the team.
I know that it can be fun sometimes, but often the game is really boring and is more like Sim City than StarCraft. Players get 200/200, then start all that trash talk. Lesser skilled players often accuse better players of being the Phantom, and attack them, which can be frustrating or annoying for them.
But the real problem is that the game takes much too long then.
CharlieMurphy:
LOL thanks for the visualization. I now think it is possible... but when I tried it, the center was too small or I had problems with the middle bases.
I think I'm going to try it again. It'll be hard though. In your picture, you'll notice that the expansions on bottom left and top right can be hit by tanks from the center bases. That's exactly the problem: not enough space on the map... but I'll see what I can do.
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not fun if we know who are the phantom...
my fun when im playing this game , that to make everyone kill each other .
reveal the phantom destroy the game of the phantom no ?
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On September 25 2007 17:00 OneOther wrote:
eh if I dont know if I really like the 7 minute rule ;o
got to agree. I used to be good at hiding myself during the whole game and they ended up killing each other. Fun 
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I thought phantom was supposed to be all about the psychology. The phantom could be anybody! Don't trust anybody!
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On September 25 2007 16:34 blagoonga123 wrote:
I don't understand how the phantom can possibly survive a 7v1, even with a few extra minerals.
me neither, it's possible only if the other 7 are noobs. Well most of the time they are in public games.
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should remove the 7 minute rule, its funnier when the games get to long game :p
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Iraq1230 Posts
agreed, make one version where u remove the 7 min rule
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this would be impossible as phantom. you who made this map, could you please change so that the cover-timer gets removed and that the phantom is chosen after 20-25 seconds, I would really appreciate that ;D
Please make a version like that and pm me on tl.net so I can dl it ;D forever loooove if possible!
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South Africa4316 Posts
How about you make a trigger in the beginning where the players (or just the host) can vote on the map style: Reveal or Not. If the players/host chooses reveal it reveals the phantom after 7 minutes. If the players vote on not, the host is not revealed.
It should be fairly simple, shouldn't it?
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After 7 minutes game time, he gets revealed to all players (automatic unally + unvision and his location is being displayed at the top left (e.g. "Phantom's base: north-east").
This is necessary because in Phantom maps without cover blow, the phantom often hides and the game takes 1 hour and people start killing themselves out of boredom. This is not how I think that the game should be played. Instead, it should be an intense battle requiring teamwork from the beginning on. So the phantom has to be offensive right from the start. The longer he waits, the harder it will be for him to win.
I don't like this!
Like some other guy said here, phantom was supposed to be about the psychology. Those games of 1h and more where people ally and unally, atack, threaten each other and etc ARE BY FAR the best games and the most funny games. Plus it takes more for the phantom than just starcraft skill.
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Cover blow is needed.
I don't want to spend an hour while idiots kill each other out of boredom.
Psychology? If everyone just massed to 200/200 then their would be no problem, fool proof, you need only 2-3 people take down a phantom. But some people always kill someone or whoever because they are bored.
7v1 ftw.
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the best part about phantom is acting like a newb and letting everyone kill each other!!!
otherwise you have to rush rush rush. but thats not much fun =x
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Hey 0x, you used to play on east a lot more, and back then we were mutual. After you disappeared, I had reformatted and was waiting for someone to host one of your way superior phantom maps, but it never happened. I was stuck playing crappy Phantom BGH. Thanks for posting this, it's awesome.
EDIT: Perhaps you should make an alternative version available without cover blow? Sometimes it's fun to not have any idea who the phantom is.
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cover blow sux bigtime. Phantom isnt even funny if you dont have the opportunity to hide from the other players and use your knowledge and skill about the game to look like a regular player.
We used to play some incredibly nice games on this map without the cover-blow, just ask Testie, FA, Eriador, TreK etc! phantom roxxxxxxxxxx!
grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr gogo~~
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Does this version start out giving everyone 1209102912 minerals/gas and then taking it away?
If not someone can just leave or die and then message another in the game who is the phantom after looking at the scoreboard.
Lol, I used to do this but tell people the wrong guy is phantom on purpose.
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Seven minutes sounds too short. Why not just leave out the reavealing phantom part and make everyone guess? It is so much more fun that way, especially with friends 
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On September 25 2007 18:14 CharlieMurphy wrote:If you can make it fit on the bottom why can't it fit on the top? Just flip/reverse the bottom half to the top. It should fit. PS- I forgot to mention that I kill anything that comes in my base.
wow.... thats nice.
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Along with many others, I believe that the coverblow is stupid.
The difference between a good phantom, and a great phantom is how he deceives and secretly makes the others kill each other.
My strategy is usually-
P- Mass goons & templar
T- Tanks, rines, medics, wraith backup
Z- Hydras, muta, defiler, Ling
It doesn't get as much attention as the idiots who expo whore, then get like 30 battlecruisers/carriers or mass muta, but I believe it is more effective.
Once you achieve that, you start private messaging weaker players and the middle players about how player X has so many battlecruisers and player Y has so many carriers.
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the idea seems well, but the map, the seven mins rules and the ally vision in the start .. mmm i dont think so.. its very easy to see if a player have more recourses in that way..... sorry but you need to make a tl version of the map =)
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Well easy way to tell the phantom in older versons when someone leaves who ever has the most minerals most likely is the phantom haha sometimes ive been able to get more mineral and gas becuase the phantom only takes nat while i tkae everything
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Make a seprarate map with the cover-blow excluded. I liked phantom because it had no cover blow.
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Make an option at the beginning of the game for a cover timer or not.
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Even 1v3 is difficult with some extra money -__-
Cover-blow is lame and unnecessary until the phantom has had ample time to make anything =_=
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7v1 is way too difficult for phantom no matter how he plays it, its good when phantom is played with like 5 people
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On September 26 2007 14:10 paper wrote:
Even 1v3 is difficult with some extra money -__-
Cover-blow is lame and unnecessary until the phantom has had ample time to make anything =_=
He understated the amount of resources you get as phantom. I've never lost a 1v5 as phantom by just rushing everyone. You get mins AND gas, so zerg can immediately lay down a few hatches and pool and speedling a couple then muta the rest, toss can zeal a couple then dt/sair rush everyone else, and terran can pump as much mnm as your fingers allow. If it's 1v6 or 1v7 I mass expand and wait until it's down to 1v3 (never played with cover timer).
If I'm not phantom and no one is obviously stronger, I kill anyone who sucks balls first. Many phantoms try to act super-newb, thinking they'll be safe, but logically you don't really lose anything by killing them. If they ARE the phantom you won, and if they aren't, you lost an ally that wouldn't help anyway. Also CharlieMurphy's strat doesn't work from what I've seen either: I kill anyone who unvisions or attacks anything of mine, regardless of whether they're the phantom or not. If people pick sides, they pick my side, because he incited the fighting, and looks more like the phantom. It makes the game go faster if I'm zerg, since I stick a lord in everyone's base. Logically, they have no reason to attack it unless they are the phantom, because I already have their vision.
The strategies would be completely different with cover timer. Seven minutes seems too short to me, as it basically forces the immediate rush. You'd be lucky if 1 person was dead by then, so it's basically a 1v7 every game even if you don't rush. You could have a choice at the beginning: no cover timer, 7 minute cover timer, and 15 minute cover timer. I think that would appease most everyone. Also, the host has to get to choose. All the ones I've seen make the chooser random, and he always picks the wrong thing (ie not what the hosts wanted), and usually people leave. Balancing the hunters map would be a very good idea, not just for phantom. No shared chokes should be priority #1, then either make no protected or ALL protected tankable mains (from cliff or between mins on 6 and 9), then no tankable or all tankable expos.
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I'm going to redesign the map in the next few days, to remove the shared choke @ 11/12.
But that's it. Cover blow will not be removed and there won't be an option either.
I've played a lot of Phantom games without cover blow, and in 90% of all the games (I'm not exaggerating) the Phantom did absolutely nothing (remember that it says "You are the Phantom - KILL THEM ALL!"). It was extremely boring. Often, the phantom just died like any other regular player when it was attacked (no time to get a big army).
And sometimes I was attacked by noobs who can't macro and think it's me.
Also, most good players gives a shit about that psychology crap and just starts attacking directly because they know that they have the biggest advantage right at the start.
But because Phantom BGH gives the Phantom too much money, it's imbalanced if the phantom rushes. I have never lost a game on Phantom BGH when I was the phantom. But on Phantom Ultimate it's quite hard. It takes skill to bring down 7 players, as well as it takes skill for the team to bring down a very strong phantom. It's purely skill-based and an intense battle.
In short: this is a competitive map. If you want to toy around with other players, play any of the other Phantom maps.
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But this isnt Phantom then.
Its just 7v1 Insane Comp, but with a player in place of the comp. And not even close to insane, since the "phantom" has the same amount of time as the other players. You cant mass shit, cuz then its obvious youre the phantom. You cant sit around, cuz then youre revealed as the phantom.
Youre removing the entire concept of the map.
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On September 26 2007 14:35 LonelyMargarita wrote:Show nested quote +On September 26 2007 14:10 paper wrote:
Even 1v3 is difficult with some extra money -__-
Cover-blow is lame and unnecessary until the phantom has had ample time to make anything =_= He understated the amount of resources you get as phantom. I've never lost a 1v5 as phantom by just rushing everyone. You get mins AND gas, so zerg can immediately lay down a few hatches and pool and speedling a couple then muta the rest, toss can zeal a couple then dt/sair rush everyone else, and terran can pump as much mnm as your fingers allow. If it's 1v6 or 1v7 I mass expand and wait until it's down to 1v3 (never played with cover timer). If I'm not phantom and no one is obviously stronger, I kill anyone who sucks balls first. Many phantoms try to act super-newb, thinking they'll be safe, but logically you don't really lose anything by killing them. If they ARE the phantom you won, and if they aren't, you lost an ally that wouldn't help anyway. Also CharlieMurphy's strat doesn't work from what I've seen either: I kill anyone who unvisions or attacks anything of mine, regardless of whether they're the phantom or not. If people pick sides, they pick my side, because he incited the fighting, and looks more like the phantom. It makes the game go faster if I'm zerg, since I stick a lord in everyone's base. Logically, they have no reason to attack it unless they are the phantom, because I already have their vision. The strategies would be completely different with cover timer. Seven minutes seems too short to me, as it basically forces the immediate rush. You'd be lucky if 1 person was dead by then, so it's basically a 1v7 every game even if you don't rush. You could have a choice at the beginning: no cover timer, 7 minute cover timer, and 15 minute cover timer. I think that would appease most everyone. Also, the host has to get to choose. All the ones I've seen make the chooser random, and he always picks the wrong thing (ie not what the hosts wanted), and usually people leave. Balancing the hunters map would be a very good idea, not just for phantom. No shared chokes should be priority #1, then either make no protected or ALL protected tankable mains (from cliff or between mins on 6 and 9), then no tankable or all tankable expos.
I don't die that easily. You trying to kill me opens your ass up for the phantom to rape you. Besides thats one of the goals of my strat, to induce action.
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I like to do the burrow cheat in Phantom BGH 2.3B(best version IMO), mine with the 4 drones I get, cancel burrow, make a pool, make an overlord, make a drone, then, once pool finishes, make lings and kill the nearest person.
It's like a REALLY early 4pool, and you can even throw in speed once you make 6 lings. Also, if you're the phantom, it's must easier since you've got pool up and speed researching ;D
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this version is cool. too bad the coverblow feature totally ruins it.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
DEADBEEF, it's you against what appears to be everyone else on TL.net. We all agree it's more fun without the automatic reveal at 7 minutes. Not only is its inherent worth questionable, 7 minutes is *way* too early. You want more people to play your version, you might want to consider what the rest of us want out of a Phantom map.
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The forced reveal is a bad idea and destroys the concept of phantom. Low money makes it difficult to hide that you're the phantom as well. Some suggestions to make it more enjoyable for the phantom and for low money:
1) Do away with the reveal, or at least make it an option. And if you keep it, extend it to at least 10 minutes so a phantom can build up to 200/200 and have the infrastructure to rebuild units lost once everyone attacks him.
2) I think all players should start with ally but without vision of any of the other players. In the FMP and BGH phantoms, the reason non-phantoms get attacked is because people with unlimited resources have some pretty funky build orders, and its often difficult to tell who the phantom is just by looking at what people are doing-- this doesn't hold true in low money, so get rid of vision. The "might" indicator alone is a pretty good way to spot a phantom that is rushing. If a phantom chooses to lay low, his base should be physically scouted, rather than giving non-phantoms free scout. If people want to vision others that they've decided are "safe" later in the game, thats fine, but vision shouldn't be forced.
Imo, those two things would make the map pretty darn fun as a low money map.
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On September 27 2007 13:04 Tadzio00 wrote:
The forced reveal is a bad idea and destroys the concept of phantom. Low money makes it difficult to hide that you're the phantom as well. Some suggestions to make it more enjoyable for the phantom and for low money:
1) Do away with the reveal, or at least make it an option. And if you keep it, extend it to at least 10 minutes so a phantom can build up to 200/200 and have the infrastructure to rebuild units lost once everyone attacks him.
2) I think all players should start with ally but without vision of any of the other players. In the FMP and BGH phantoms, the reason non-phantoms get attacked is because people with unlimited resources have some pretty funky build orders, and its often difficult to tell who the phantom is just by looking at what people are doing-- this doesn't hold true in low money, so get rid of vision. The "might" indicator alone is a pretty good way to spot a phantom that is rushing. If a phantom chooses to lay low, his base should be physically scouted, rather than giving non-phantoms free scout. If people want to vision others that they've decided are "safe" later in the game, thats fine, but vision shouldn't be forced.
Imo, those two things would make the map pretty darn fun as a low money map.
this is the only solution besides making the 7-minute an option...
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the best thing about phanton is to be the best player
people think u are the phanton
start attacking you
you die!
and after u will see the real phanton killing them!
kakaka
if its revealed this is not possible
=(
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So meanwhile, did anyone get the unprotected map to remove the cover blow?
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Plz reup the map. Cant download it.
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Or send it to shebotnov@gmail.com
Thx
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??? Anyone alive on the forums? Does anyone has this map ????
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Nope, I was never a big fan of phantoms but err
"This is necessary because in Phantom maps without cover blow, the phantom often hides and the game takes 1 hour and people start killing themselves out of boredom. This is not how I think that the game should be played. Instead, it should be an intense battle requiring teamwork from the beginning on. So the phantom has to be offensive right from the start. The longer he waits, the harder it will be for him to win."
I disagree. The point of phantom is that he cannot be revealed, by forcing a reveal it takes the fun out of the game. Instead, phantom should be forced to eliminate all other players by a time limit, and the other players will have to survive this time limit. This will force actions.
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CruiseR
Poland4013 Posts
On September 25 2007 16:31 0xDEADBEEF wrote:
. After 7 minutes game time, he gets revealed to all players (automatic unally + unvision and his location is being displayed at the top left (e.g. "Phantom's base: north-east").
This is necessary because in Phantom maps without cover blow, the phantom often hides and the game takes 1 hour and people start killing themselves out of boredom. This is not how I think that the game should be played. Instead, it should be an intense battle requiring teamwork from the beginning on. So the phantom has to be offensive right from the start. The longer he waits, the harder it will be for him to win.
I don't agree with this. with these stipulations it becomes like Xv1 comp who's massing.
The hidden info during the whole game makes the game psychological, and then best UMS ever for me. You must make decisions- who is the phantom, try to hurt or kill somebody, make him reveal, accuse and defend others etc. It's better and more fun to take risk even hurting your ally to detect if he's the bad one. And even with some allies already dead, if the game is like 30 minutes already, phantom can be beaten, because the 200/200 limit allowes to.
So, without coverblow it makes the best UMS map ever (and psychological, just like The Thing- that's an important aspect), and coverblow makes it like 7v1 comp/w mass money..
EDIT: lol amost the same post evanthebouncy :D
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On April 03 2008 06:41 evanthebouncy! wrote:
Nope, I was never a big fan of phantoms but err
"This is necessary because in Phantom maps without cover blow, the phantom often hides and the game takes 1 hour and people start killing themselves out of boredom. This is not how I think that the game should be played. Instead, it should be an intense battle requiring teamwork from the beginning on. So the phantom has to be offensive right from the start. The longer he waits, the harder it will be for him to win."
I disagree. The point of phantom is that he cannot be revealed, by forcing a reveal it takes the fun out of the game. Instead, phantom should be forced to eliminate all other players by a time limit, and the other players will have to survive this time limit. This will force actions.
That sounds like an awesome idea. 0_o
I've always liked Phantom maps (with all the "mindgames" and whatnot), but something always felt missing. The timer idea sounds great.
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LOL @ the guys who dont like cover blown:
Phantom without cover blow is a MAJOR waste of time. The random phantom noob will camp and wait that others people leave the game or kill each others ( yeyayyaya that is a lot of fun -.-)
Of course it can be funny if you are the phantom ...
Average game last 1 hour and is DULL there is no psychology involved because most of the random people who join the game are noobs or retarded and kill each other randomly.
I played a LOT with oxdeadbeef and ichwilldochnur on this version and i think this is the best ever made. Of course with the cover blown timer there is less psychology, but still if you are phantom terran you can let other people take expand and caught them with pant down with a mech build and a mass vult. Btw Z > P > T on this map.
If we like this version it is because you need a lot of team play and skill to beat a good phantom ( 5v1 good people is the best ) and because this version is quite balanced ( nevertheless oxdeadbeef zerg phantom isnt  ).
Vs a good (zerg) phantom you have to contain him with cannons to win. Early game is quite micro intensive. Usually 1 or 2 toss players try to build photon at the expand choke while zergs and terran bring units to give time. I love this version but you have to play it with the right people .
edit: and please beef quit bioshock, we need you to mass play again
edit2: "Classic" phantom can be fun too but only with a team full of people that you know. Public "classic" phantom suck because the people who join are stupid ( usually ). But as oxdeadbeef said this version here is competitive and cover blown is needed.
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anyone has the map??? plz upload it.
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Yeah get that version there.. sorry for dead link. Boblion has the latest one.
I wanted to make another version and also release one without cover blow (although that usually results in boring games, but if you prefer that...), but I haven't gotten around to it yet.
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A choosable cover blow version would be very cool. Maps where there also is a paladin (or anti phantom) are always very fun to play. Everyone either kills them off or waits to see who is the phantom. Then usually it turns out differently every time.
I can also understand that cover blow adds smth interest to the game but I do think 7 min are to short. Imo.
Why not really add 3 beacons to choose from - 7, 10 minuts and no cover blow.
Is there an anti phantom in this version ?
Thx for the link
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No anti phantom. That's usually a bad idea too... if it's some random retard (highly likely), he will just use his money to kill some random guy, and ruin the game in the process.
This version is designed from the ground up to minimize the impact that retards or noobs have on the game.
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What if there is a time limit at the beginning for the Phantom. Every time someone is eliminated, more time gets added to the clock? This could get rid of the cover blow and still give incentive for the Phantom to create action.
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Alright I can understand your point with antiphantom. As I agree noobs start killing off other ppl. What can be funny too. If its isnt me. Okey never mind. =)
Could at least make a version without a cover blow OR 3 beacon choice version OR send an unprotected map to me to shebotnov@gmail.com?
Thx
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I don't agree with the Phantom "cover blow" because I usually have a blast being accused of being phantom and killing other people without actually being the phantom. It spices things up .
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To thread opener, you said that this map is for average to good players. But then you argued for the implementation of a cover blow because noobs may ruin the game. Isnt that a contradiction?
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ya, but what if people want to be retarded or noob? say, nonphantoms attacking other players is hilarious and fun
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It's not designed for noobs in terms of difficulty when they are the Phantom.
They'll have almost zero chance to win, because the Phantom receives less money per "tick" than in other Phantom versions where the Phantom is so powerful that average+ players will ALWAYS win when they attack early, even without needing to expand.
The rest was about protection from noobs/retards who either do nothing when they're Phantom (they are revealed after 7min) or who start backstabbing you (since there's no "anti phantom", you always have a chance of defending).
It's best if there's no noob in the game of course, but it won't ruin your game if 1 or 2 are in (impossible to prevent that on BNet), as they can't do much to annoy you. If a noob is phant, he'll die quickly. No 1 hour long game necessary to find and beat him. You just walk over him after 7min. Which is nice.
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On April 03 2008 18:38 useLess wrote:
ya, but what if people want to be retarded or noob? say, nonphantoms attacking other players is hilarious and fun
Well you can still play with old versions of the map ( Phantom 1.7, Phantom 3.0, Phantom Darkness, or Phantom BGH ) .
This version is designed for experienced players who dont like lame noobs.
Btw GO phantom tonight ??? ( on Europe ).
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CruiseR
Poland4013 Posts
On April 03 2008 20:34 Boblion wrote:
Btw GO phantom tonight ??? ( on Europe ).
no coverblow = i'm in, just say the time ;p
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"No". :p
But tonight maybe (late).
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United States7166 Posts
It would be nice if you removed the coverblow for the people who want to play this with friends rather than on pubs, where 'long games where the phantom attacks nobody' isn't an issue.
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Did nobody realize that this was a year old topic bumped by a 6 poster? I find it strange everyone just got right back into the discussion.
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CA10824 Posts
On April 05 2008 01:36 edzwoo wrote:
Did nobody realize that this was a year old topic bumped by a 6 poster? I find it strange everyone just got right back into the discussion.
as long as it isn't a stupid bump it doesn't matter how many posts the bumper has
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On April 05 2008 01:42 Forst. wrote:
hi
Hi moffron Gogo phantom tonight with beef. If some people want to join they are welcome.
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bump can anyone reupload this map please. Hi kira
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Needs to be more like 15 minutes imo
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sorry for the bump but I love phantom mode in brood war and I want to find a good phantom map for my upcoming LAN party. Does anyone have this map or a similar one that's very well done? Preferably, I am looking for a BGH phantom low-money mode that has very high income for the phantom, phantom is not automatically revealed, observer mode after you die, and 1-2 phantoms.
edit:http://scums.unaux.com/p/?i=1
Found it!
Phantom Mode V6.1 -3Max800.scx
this allows for multiple phantoms and paladins. awesome! ready for my lan!
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EPT![[image loading]](http://freenet-homepage.de/demogorgon/Phantom-Ultimate.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i22.tinypic.com/ehkv42.jpg)
