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Canada11602 Posts
Yeah. I mean, I guess if you just exist in the context of the SC2 community then the last couple months have been swept with community hyper-drama. So people are now on high-alert for a hint of pitch-fork shenanigans.
But the situation in BW is vastly different and quite a few comments in here come off as highly insensitive as to the current state of BW and the potential growth that we were just starting to see.
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I already stopped buying their products after they shut down proleague. I mean seriously, Blizzard. BW viewers are the minority. This is like seeing some old guy walking down the street giving away ice cream to little kids and you just take your big fuckin' SUV and slam into all of them. And then when you're driving down the street a week later you think "Hey let's see how the old man is doing at the hospital." And then you go to the hospital and unplug him from life support.
YOU MONSTERS!
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On November 15 2012 05:05 Falling wrote:Yeah. I mean, I guess if you just exist in the context of the SC2 community then the last couple months have been swept with community hyper-drama. So people are now on high-alert for a hint of pitch-fork shenanigans. But the situation in BW is vastly different and quite a few comments in here come off as highly insensitive as to the current state of BW and the potential growth that we were just starting to see.
Reddit sure does like to say circlejerk
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28102 Posts
Well, this is unfortunate. I was looking forward to the finals 
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the only silver lining i see in this is that the SSL received some publicity due to this blizzard-induced outrage
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Great job BlizzTard ! Surely the SSL has dealt a massive blow to your business ....
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On November 15 2012 04:38 JohnChoi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 04:22 TrippSC2 wrote:On November 15 2012 03:40 vOdToasT wrote:On November 15 2012 03:36 Sumadin wrote:
Guys, get with the news okay.
The higher-ups of Blizzard are trying to sort this out as we speak. Mike Morhaime is on it.
Blizzard korea is just a local department, but they have been struggeling with Kespa for years so noone in their right mind can blame them for being strict with their IP rights. Through i would say it would be fair to argue about their timing.
Can you all put down those damm pitchforks now, this is getting embarrassing. I have no problem with the reaction, before the twitter post. Blizzard shut down something that you are passionate about and I would be pissed to in your shoes.
But, you have a quote from the CEO of Blizzard directly saying that Blizzard isn't going to shut down this tournament. Outside of a few people trying to point it out to the masses, the reaction is exactly the same! The continued anti-Blizzard tone of this thread just shows how bitter and irrational that this community can be, and it isn't limited to the BW fans. Allow me to quote myself.
What is the justification for this? Show me your " common sense " that I lack. Obviously, this was Blizzard Korea, not Blizzard, but Blizzard gave them the rules. The rules of only allowing BW tournaments to have a prize pool of $500 without paying, and letting SC2 have $5000. The rules of treating Korea worse than the rest of the world when it comes to tournaments.
Even if this was all Blizzard Korea's fault, and not Blizzard's (Intervening right before the finals rather than earlier, threatening with copyright notices against Brood War streams while leaving SC2 streams alone) Blizzard still instructed Blizzard Korea to do that shit. And they still have the bullshit rules of treating Korea and the rest of the world differently when it comes to BW tournaments, and treating BW worse than SC2 when it comes to running tournaments. Do you have any justification for this? If you don't, I'm going to continue thinking Blizzard are assholes. I don't see how they're not, but if you have arguments, let me know them, and if they are sound, I will change my mind. So, you continue to prove my point. First, different standards for BW and SC2 is irrelevant to the topic this thread is supposed to be about, which is SSL being shut down by Blizzard. SSL has a larger prize pool than is allowed for either BW or SC2, so it's not a relevant topic in this case. Seeing as how no action had been taken at all until the finals, which as I stated above has too large a prize pool for either game, wouldn't it be reasonable to assume that either $500 was a typo and should have been $5000 or that $5000 is the new standard that was set and hasn't been updated in the information provided? Essentially there is no proof that there is more restriction being placed on BW than SC2 in terms of prize money. On the lawsuit topic, I'm ignorant of the Korean legal system and the source of the information stated that it was roughly translated and is not an official source but instead hearsay, but it seems possible to me that the "lawsuit" he was referring to might be similar to an injunction in the US legal system that would prevent the streaming service from broadcasting the event, which is the really the only control Blizzard can exert over BW, since it has LAN support. It seems reasonable to me that Blizzard Korea wasn't trying to stop BW streaming entirely, but just trying to stop this event from broadcasting while in violation. I really doubt the official terms would have that kind of typo i dont think its safe to assume such a thing.. and its. ot just the broadcasting online they also require you to purchase a license for the offline finals event which is indeed a LAN which means they are targetting both the online broadcast and the LAN aspect. The reason people are saying bw streams are also affectex is due to nowcom receiving a copyright which means bw streams would have to stop.. of course im only basing this off of what one streamer (Zergman) said and he is no lawyer or anything.. but the possibility of bw streams being forced to shutdown is still possible it really depends on how nowcom handles it. Plz read the other posts before you start posting stuff like this... it only further stirs up needless arguments.
I don't think you are understanding what I'm saying.
The policy being different between BW and SC2 is in writing and is unfair, if enforced that way.
The problem with everyone's complaints is that it hasn't been enforced unfairly. A tournament that would be against the terms for either SC2 or BW was to be shut down. You're free to speculate all you like as to why the actual policy isn't being enforced for BW, but the fact is that until a tournament with a <$5000 prize pool is shut down, there isn't actually anything to bitch about and this isn't applicable to this situation.
Unless I'm mistaken, Nowcom runs Afreeca who would be providing streaming for SSL. If I'm not mistaken about that, don't you think that it's at least possible that Blizzard Korea is actually making sure that they don't stream the event if they try to put on the SSL anyway, since they can't really do much about them playing the event in-private with LAN? Especially since the two sources are not first-party sources?
I get that you have a source that you believe, but don't tell me that I have to accept hearsay as fact in order to post.
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Oh blizzard, you'll simply never stop being a shit tier company will you? This makes me so damn happy that SC2 is the shit game it is.
Congrats blizz, you killed the first and only true eSport to have existed to this date, and now that it is raising on its own without any help, you just can't stand having it be while your "main" game keeps shrinking and shrinking globally because it sucks.
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You guys are acting like this is a simple issue, it is more complicated. I don't hate Blizzard but I'm sure they thought long and hard about this, so I don't question their decision. Blizzard knows more about this than we do, so don't hate on them.
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On November 15 2012 05:49 123Viril69 wrote:
You guys are acting like this is a simple issue, it is more complicated. I don't hate Blizzard but I'm sure they thought long and hard about this, so I don't question their decision. Blizzard knows more about this than we do, so don't hate on them.
If your don't know shit about the situation please don't post like this. If you do, please again shed some light on us living under the rock...
Edit:
This is a shit move by Blizz and we as the community of BW lovers have every right to not see this through!
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Fuck you blizzard.
This is truly a disgrace. At least they had to back down from this blatant attempt of shutting down the bw community completely.
What can we do?
I posted my complaint on their FB page.
I will concider it very weak if not at least some of the old people in this community, Tasteless, Artosis, Day9 etc, will stand up for BW in public.
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On November 15 2012 05:40 TrippSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 04:38 JohnChoi wrote:On November 15 2012 04:22 TrippSC2 wrote:On November 15 2012 03:40 vOdToasT wrote:On November 15 2012 03:36 Sumadin wrote:Guys, get with the news okay. The higher-ups of Blizzard are trying to sort this out as we speak. Mike Morhaime is on it. https://twitter.com/mikemorhaime/status/268746874838732800Blizzard korea is just a local department, but they have been struggeling with Kespa for years so noone in their right mind can blame them for being strict with their IP rights. Through i would say it would be fair to argue about their timing. Can you all put down those damm pitchforks now, this is getting embarrassing. I have no problem with the reaction, before the twitter post. Blizzard shut down something that you are passionate about and I would be pissed to in your shoes.
But, you have a quote from the CEO of Blizzard directly saying that Blizzard isn't going to shut down this tournament. Outside of a few people trying to point it out to the masses, the reaction is exactly the same! The continued anti-Blizzard tone of this thread just shows how bitter and irrational that this community can be, and it isn't limited to the BW fans. Allow me to quote myself.
What is the justification for this? Show me your " common sense " that I lack. Obviously, this was Blizzard Korea, not Blizzard, but Blizzard gave them the rules. The rules of only allowing BW tournaments to have a prize pool of $500 without paying, and letting SC2 have $5000. The rules of treating Korea worse than the rest of the world when it comes to tournaments.
Even if this was all Blizzard Korea's fault, and not Blizzard's (Intervening right before the finals rather than earlier, threatening with copyright notices against Brood War streams while leaving SC2 streams alone) Blizzard still instructed Blizzard Korea to do that shit. And they still have the bullshit rules of treating Korea and the rest of the world differently when it comes to BW tournaments, and treating BW worse than SC2 when it comes to running tournaments. Do you have any justification for this? If you don't, I'm going to continue thinking Blizzard are assholes. I don't see how they're not, but if you have arguments, let me know them, and if they are sound, I will change my mind. So, you continue to prove my point. First, different standards for BW and SC2 is irrelevant to the topic this thread is supposed to be about, which is SSL being shut down by Blizzard. SSL has a larger prize pool than is allowed for either BW or SC2, so it's not a relevant topic in this case. Seeing as how no action had been taken at all until the finals, which as I stated above has too large a prize pool for either game, wouldn't it be reasonable to assume that either $500 was a typo and should have been $5000 or that $5000 is the new standard that was set and hasn't been updated in the information provided? Essentially there is no proof that there is more restriction being placed on BW than SC2 in terms of prize money. On the lawsuit topic, I'm ignorant of the Korean legal system and the source of the information stated that it was roughly translated and is not an official source but instead hearsay, but it seems possible to me that the "lawsuit" he was referring to might be similar to an injunction in the US legal system that would prevent the streaming service from broadcasting the event, which is the really the only control Blizzard can exert over BW, since it has LAN support. It seems reasonable to me that Blizzard Korea wasn't trying to stop BW streaming entirely, but just trying to stop this event from broadcasting while in violation. I really doubt the official terms would have that kind of typo i dont think its safe to assume such a thing.. and its. ot just the broadcasting online they also require you to purchase a license for the offline finals event which is indeed a LAN which means they are targetting both the online broadcast and the LAN aspect. The reason people are saying bw streams are also affectex is due to nowcom receiving a copyright which means bw streams would have to stop.. of course im only basing this off of what one streamer (Zergman) said and he is no lawyer or anything.. but the possibility of bw streams being forced to shutdown is still possible it really depends on how nowcom handles it. Plz read the other posts before you start posting stuff like this... it only further stirs up needless arguments. I don't think you are understanding what I'm saying. The policy being different between BW and SC2 is in writing and is unfair, if enforced that way. The problem with everyone's complaints is that it hasn't been enforced unfairly. A tournament that would be against the terms for either SC2 or BW was to be shut down. You're free to speculate all you like as to why the actual policy isn't being enforced for BW, but the fact is that until a tournament with a <$5000 prize pool is shut down, there isn't actually anything to bitch about and this isn't applicable to this situation. Unless I'm mistaken, Nowcom runs Afreeca who would be providing streaming for SSL. If I'm not mistaken about that, don't you think that it's at least possible that Blizzard Korea is actually making sure that they don't stream the event if they try to put on the SSL anyway, since they can't really do much about them playing the event in-private with LAN? Especially since the two sources are not first-party sources? I get that you have a source that you believe, but don't tell me that I have to accept hearsay as fact in order to post.
Umm ya tbh i dont understand what your saying but it seems as though your saying ssl will be able to commence as a private lan event without streams on afreeca but im trying to tell you blizzard requires a license to just host the finals in the first place regardless of whether its an offline lan or an online thing.
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This super pisses me off. What's the point? Why does blizzard have to be such a fuckface.
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License fees were never a good idea anyway. The industry really isn't that profitable, and it's not like esports takes money away from Blizzard, so they shouldn't need to take money for licensing. I think the idea of intellectual property is you don't want people stealing your property. That's not at play here. It's just money grubbing. In the old days, any revenue that came from ad packages/etc. was just reinvested into the scene so the scene didn't collapse and the viewer still got to watch without PPV. Giving Blizzard a part of that revenue serves no purpose. What exactly can Blizzard do with it that an enterprising community that built a scene from the ground-up can't? Take it to pay the esports team's salary and pay for Blizzcon/WCS? The entire esports scene is free advertising for the game industry. I don't know why Blizzard can't just leave it at that. Taking money out of the scene doesn't help the scene, and it probably only marginally helps Blizzard because if the scene isn't left in the sandbox to grow to its full potential, then that free advertising isn't being as effective.
These industries aren't even that relevant to each other. One is sell more copies of the latest (most expensive) game. The other is about getting people watching and playing a game over the long term. I love these games, but if Blizzard's bubble ever bursts it will be very satisfying to behold.
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On November 15 2012 06:16 JohnChoi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 05:40 TrippSC2 wrote:On November 15 2012 04:38 JohnChoi wrote:On November 15 2012 04:22 TrippSC2 wrote:On November 15 2012 03:40 vOdToasT wrote:On November 15 2012 03:36 Sumadin wrote:Guys, get with the news okay. The higher-ups of Blizzard are trying to sort this out as we speak. Mike Morhaime is on it. https://twitter.com/mikemorhaime/status/268746874838732800Blizzard korea is just a local department, but they have been struggeling with Kespa for years so noone in their right mind can blame them for being strict with their IP rights. Through i would say it would be fair to argue about their timing. Can you all put down those damm pitchforks now, this is getting embarrassing. I have no problem with the reaction, before the twitter post. Blizzard shut down something that you are passionate about and I would be pissed to in your shoes.
But, you have a quote from the CEO of Blizzard directly saying that Blizzard isn't going to shut down this tournament. Outside of a few people trying to point it out to the masses, the reaction is exactly the same! The continued anti-Blizzard tone of this thread just shows how bitter and irrational that this community can be, and it isn't limited to the BW fans. Allow me to quote myself.
What is the justification for this? Show me your " common sense " that I lack. Obviously, this was Blizzard Korea, not Blizzard, but Blizzard gave them the rules. The rules of only allowing BW tournaments to have a prize pool of $500 without paying, and letting SC2 have $5000. The rules of treating Korea worse than the rest of the world when it comes to tournaments.
Even if this was all Blizzard Korea's fault, and not Blizzard's (Intervening right before the finals rather than earlier, threatening with copyright notices against Brood War streams while leaving SC2 streams alone) Blizzard still instructed Blizzard Korea to do that shit. And they still have the bullshit rules of treating Korea and the rest of the world differently when it comes to BW tournaments, and treating BW worse than SC2 when it comes to running tournaments. Do you have any justification for this? If you don't, I'm going to continue thinking Blizzard are assholes. I don't see how they're not, but if you have arguments, let me know them, and if they are sound, I will change my mind. So, you continue to prove my point. First, different standards for BW and SC2 is irrelevant to the topic this thread is supposed to be about, which is SSL being shut down by Blizzard. SSL has a larger prize pool than is allowed for either BW or SC2, so it's not a relevant topic in this case. Seeing as how no action had been taken at all until the finals, which as I stated above has too large a prize pool for either game, wouldn't it be reasonable to assume that either $500 was a typo and should have been $5000 or that $5000 is the new standard that was set and hasn't been updated in the information provided? Essentially there is no proof that there is more restriction being placed on BW than SC2 in terms of prize money. On the lawsuit topic, I'm ignorant of the Korean legal system and the source of the information stated that it was roughly translated and is not an official source but instead hearsay, but it seems possible to me that the "lawsuit" he was referring to might be similar to an injunction in the US legal system that would prevent the streaming service from broadcasting the event, which is the really the only control Blizzard can exert over BW, since it has LAN support. It seems reasonable to me that Blizzard Korea wasn't trying to stop BW streaming entirely, but just trying to stop this event from broadcasting while in violation. I really doubt the official terms would have that kind of typo i dont think its safe to assume such a thing.. and its. ot just the broadcasting online they also require you to purchase a license for the offline finals event which is indeed a LAN which means they are targetting both the online broadcast and the LAN aspect. The reason people are saying bw streams are also affectex is due to nowcom receiving a copyright which means bw streams would have to stop.. of course im only basing this off of what one streamer (Zergman) said and he is no lawyer or anything.. but the possibility of bw streams being forced to shutdown is still possible it really depends on how nowcom handles it. Plz read the other posts before you start posting stuff like this... it only further stirs up needless arguments. I don't think you are understanding what I'm saying. The policy being different between BW and SC2 is in writing and is unfair, if enforced that way. The problem with everyone's complaints is that it hasn't been enforced unfairly. A tournament that would be against the terms for either SC2 or BW was to be shut down. You're free to speculate all you like as to why the actual policy isn't being enforced for BW, but the fact is that until a tournament with a <$5000 prize pool is shut down, there isn't actually anything to bitch about and this isn't applicable to this situation. Unless I'm mistaken, Nowcom runs Afreeca who would be providing streaming for SSL. If I'm not mistaken about that, don't you think that it's at least possible that Blizzard Korea is actually making sure that they don't stream the event if they try to put on the SSL anyway, since they can't really do much about them playing the event in-private with LAN? Especially since the two sources are not first-party sources? I get that you have a source that you believe, but don't tell me that I have to accept hearsay as fact in order to post. Umm ya tbh i dont understand what your saying but it seems as though your saying ssl will be able to commence as a private lan event without streams on afreeca but im trying to tell you blizzard requires a license to just host the finals in the first place regardless of whether its an offline lan or an online thing.
Third time is the charm.
We know that Blizzard has sent a cease-and-desist to the organizer to stop the event. If the organizer had chosen to ignore this and run the event anyway, there is nothing Blizzard Korea could do to physically stop them from playing the game, since BW can be played offline (not on Blizzard's servers). Yes, they can say they don't license the event and there would likely be legal action after the fact, but there is nothing Blizzard could do to stop the games from being played.
The only viable action to prevent them for putting on the event was to go after their medium of obtaining viewership (AfreecaTV) and prevent them from broadcasting it. If that is the case, maybe the reason for the legal action against Nowcom that we are hearing about from indirect sources is related to only broadcasting SSL, instead of BW in general.
We don't know much or have any reliable sources to know, so no one can logically make a judgment either way. It's possible this was a plot to stop BW from taking hold again in Korea and if you're cynical enough, you'll believe that regardless of facts. I prefer to wait for the facts to make my judgment.
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Blizzard, or blizzard Korea.
Fuck you
Sincerely
A fan of the best game you made
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It makes me upset that any wing of Blizzard anywhere thought that this was a good idea. Just leave our community alone please.
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On November 15 2012 04:22 Korelle wrote:
The Teamliquid Brood War community immediately assuming the worst and jumping on a hate-fuelled bandwagon to engage in their favourite pastime of shitting on Blizzard without knowing the full story?
SAY IT AIN'T SO.
oh come on
1. The blizz tweet did not exist yesterday when i read this
2. Blizz delays the only BW tourney right before a finals? Not only would attacking the bw tourney at all make anyone mad, but doing it before the finals? It should be something to be complied with eventually, not "as of now no more BW love blizz"
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On November 15 2012 06:57 Iplaythings wrote:
Blizzard, or blizzard Korea.
Fuck you
Sincerely
A fan of the best game you made
Okay, if Mike Morhaime goes through with what he said he would I wont feel as wronged by blizzard.
Still that this happend to begin with was fucking stupid still, and don't forget that blizz might try to kill Afreeca..
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is awesome32281 Posts
On November 15 2012 03:36 Sumadin wrote:
Can you all put down those damm pitchforks now, this is getting embarrassing.
SC2 user coming to the BW forum to tell us to put down the pitchforks? Is it reverse day today?
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EPT
