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On November 15 2012 03:09 Evangelist wrote:
Blizzard Korea has been battling KESPA for close to ten years. I imagine they've got pretty specific guidelines on how to deal with it. Maybe if the weeping vaginas in this thread had any common sense they'd realize that Blizzard reckon it's pretty cool their old game is still so loved and played.
TL again proves that it is the common sense of a confused pygmy regarding BW.
What is your response to my arguments?
1 Korea has stricter rules compared to the rest of the world. (The ISL's had more than $500 in their prize pools, and they got away with it).
2 Brood War has stricter rules compared to StarCraft 2. (500 instead of 5000)
3 They waited until the finals before doing anything.
4 They are sending (or at the very least publicly stated that they are considering sending) copyright notices to Brood War streams on Afreeca, but have never sent in such a notice to any private StarCraft 2 stream, despite StarCraft 2 generating more ad revenue from streaming.
What is the justification for this? Show me your " common sense " that I lack. Obviously, this was Blizzard Korea, not Blizzard, but Blizzard gave them the rules. The rules of only allowing BW tournaments to have a prize pool of $500 without paying, and letting SC2 have $5000. The rules of treating Korea worse than the rest of the world when it comes to tournaments.
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10387 Posts
for all of you "oh-so-rational" people high and mighty about how we're being irrational and our reaction is unwarranted, judging our community .. let me requote Falling here
On November 14 2012 18:37 Falling wrote:Show nested quote +On November 14 2012 17:58 Shockk wrote:
It's been a while since I've been to the Broodwar forums, but this thread is outright depressing. Not because of the sad news for SSL, but because of the reactions of the vast majority of posters in this thread.
All there is at the moment is one side of the story and so far there are four pages of massive anti-SC2, anti-Blizzard circlejerk, filled to the brim with hate and hyperbole. Sure, the current state of BW is nothing to be too happy about. But if this is TeamLiquid's reaction to the issue (or at least TL's BW crowd), then please, don't act surprised if TL and the "Broodwar elitists" are met with disdain everywhere else.
This may be one of the last great bastions of BW fandom on the web, this may be your little club to hang out and socialize, but you're doing an abysmal job of representing the oh-so "mature" StarCraft community. What is the mature and reasonable reaction you are expecting? If after 12 years, all the SC2 tourneys got shut down or tranitioned into MOBA games. All the pros and casters retire or switch to MOBA games. And then one guy started up a SC2 tourney because he's passionate about it. And then a bunch of the old SC2 pro's started showing up. And then Tastosis said they'd like to cast the finals. So you're super psyched. And then Blizzard drops a cease and desist two days before the tourney? What other reaction is there?
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I WANT A PRO-BROODWAR ONLINE PETITION!!
Seriously, we, the fans are obliged to show our power. I want Blizzard to know that I still love watching professional and semi-professional BroodWar, and I am even the heretic to PLAY BROOD WAR.
Please, do something 
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this is so unbelievable..
i was already disappointed in them but this is beyond anything. theyve gone too far. such a douchebag move.
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On November 15 2012 03:22 TarsolyGer wrote:I WANT A PRO-BROODWAR ONLINE PETITION!! Seriously, we, the fans are obliged to show our power. I want Blizzard to know that I still love watching professional and semi-professional BroodWar, and I am even the heretic to PLAY BROOD WAR. Please, do something
i think a petition would be a great idea to get the message to blizzard
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On November 15 2012 03:31 JohnChoi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 03:22 TarsolyGer wrote:I WANT A PRO-BROODWAR ONLINE PETITION!! Seriously, we, the fans are obliged to show our power. I want Blizzard to know that I still love watching professional and semi-professional BroodWar, and I am even the heretic to PLAY BROOD WAR. Please, do something i think a petition would be a great idea to get the message to blizzard
What makes you think they would care?
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On November 14 2012 18:37 Falling wrote:Show nested quote +On November 14 2012 17:58 Shockk wrote:
It's been a while since I've been to the Broodwar forums, but this thread is outright depressing. Not because of the sad news for SSL, but because of the reactions of the vast majority of posters in this thread.
All there is at the moment is one side of the story and so far there are four pages of massive anti-SC2, anti-Blizzard circlejerk, filled to the brim with hate and hyperbole. Sure, the current state of BW is nothing to be too happy about. But if this is TeamLiquid's reaction to the issue (or at least TL's BW crowd), then please, don't act surprised if TL and the "Broodwar elitists" are met with disdain everywhere else.
This may be one of the last great bastions of BW fandom on the web, this may be your little club to hang out and socialize, but you're doing an abysmal job of representing the oh-so "mature" StarCraft community. What is the mature and reasonable reaction you are expecting? If after 12 years, all the SC2 tourneys got shut down or tranitioned into MOBA games. All the pros and casters retire or switch to MOBA games. And then one guy started up a SC2 tourney because he's passionate about it. And then a bunch of the old SC2 pro's started showing up. And then Tastosis said they'd like to cast the finals. So you're super psyched. And then Blizzard drops a cease and desist two days before the tourney? What other reaction is there?
i want to point out too that its not really a couple days before the tourney. if this happened before 7th ssl began id be bummed out that it has to be delayed but it wouldve been less of a shock. they decided to intervene right before the climax of the tournament, right before the finals and use that opportunity to slam down two licenses at once.. it just doesnt seem right. to me its clear blizzard knew of this and attacked when it would hurt the most.
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Canada4481 Posts
Looks like Mike Morhaime might be trying to fix/allow it to continue. Thanks WaxAngel!
edit: looks like it's already been posted =\
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Guys, get with the news okay.
The higher-ups of Blizzard are trying to sort this out as we speak. Mike Morhaime is on it. https://twitter.com/mikemorhaime/status/268746874838732800
Blizzard korea is just a local department, but they have been struggeling with Kespa for years so noone in their right mind can blame them for being strict with their IP rights. Through i would say it would be fair to argue about their timing.
Can you all put down those damm pitchforks now, this is getting embarrassing.
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On November 15 2012 03:33 Potling wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 03:31 JohnChoi wrote:On November 15 2012 03:22 TarsolyGer wrote:I WANT A PRO-BROODWAR ONLINE PETITION!! Seriously, we, the fans are obliged to show our power. I want Blizzard to know that I still love watching professional and semi-professional BroodWar, and I am even the heretic to PLAY BROOD WAR. Please, do something i think a petition would be a great idea to get the message to blizzard What makes you think they would care?
i think even if they dont necessarily care... wouldnt it at least be bad for blizzards public image? i just want our voice to be heard
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On November 15 2012 03:17 ArvickHero wrote:for all of you "oh-so-rational" people high and mighty about how we're being irrational and our reaction is unwarranted, judging our community .. let me requote Falling here Show nested quote +On November 14 2012 18:37 Falling wrote:On November 14 2012 17:58 Shockk wrote:
It's been a while since I've been to the Broodwar forums, but this thread is outright depressing. Not because of the sad news for SSL, but because of the reactions of the vast majority of posters in this thread.
All there is at the moment is one side of the story and so far there are four pages of massive anti-SC2, anti-Blizzard circlejerk, filled to the brim with hate and hyperbole. Sure, the current state of BW is nothing to be too happy about. But if this is TeamLiquid's reaction to the issue (or at least TL's BW crowd), then please, don't act surprised if TL and the "Broodwar elitists" are met with disdain everywhere else.
This may be one of the last great bastions of BW fandom on the web, this may be your little club to hang out and socialize, but you're doing an abysmal job of representing the oh-so "mature" StarCraft community. What is the mature and reasonable reaction you are expecting? If after 12 years, all the SC2 tourneys got shut down or tranitioned into MOBA games. All the pros and casters retire or switch to MOBA games. And then one guy started up a SC2 tourney because he's passionate about it. And then a bunch of the old SC2 pro's started showing up. And then Tastosis said they'd like to cast the finals. So you're super psyched. And then Blizzard drops a cease and desist two days before the tourney? What other reaction is there?
I have no problem with the reaction, before the twitter post. Blizzard shut down something that you are passionate about and I would be pissed too in your shoes.
But, you have a quote from the CEO of Blizzard directly saying that Blizzard isn't going to shut down this tournament. Outside of a few people trying to point it out to the masses, the reaction is exactly the same! The continued anti-Blizzard tone of this thread just shows how bitter and irrational that this community can be, and it isn't limited to the BW fans.
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On November 15 2012 03:36 Sumadin wrote:Guys, get with the news okay. The higher-ups of Blizzard are trying to sort this out as we speak. Mike Morhaime is on it. https://twitter.com/mikemorhaime/status/268746874838732800Blizzard korea is just a local department, but they have been struggeling with Kespa for years so noone in their right mind can blame them for being strict with their IP rights. Through i would say it would be fair to argue about their timing. Can you all put down those damm pitchforks now, this is getting embarrassing.
I have no problem with the reaction, before the twitter post. Blizzard shut down something that you are passionate about and I would be pissed to in your shoes.
But, you have a quote from the CEO of Blizzard directly saying that Blizzard isn't going to shut down this tournament. Outside of a few people trying to point it out to the masses, the reaction is exactly the same! The continued anti-Blizzard tone of this thread just shows how bitter and irrational that this community can be, and it isn't limited to the BW fans.
Allow me to quote myself.
What is the justification for this? Show me your " common sense " that I lack. Obviously, this was Blizzard Korea, not Blizzard, but Blizzard gave them the rules. The rules of only allowing BW tournaments to have a prize pool of $500 without paying, and letting SC2 have $5000. The rules of treating Korea worse than the rest of the world when it comes to tournaments.
Even if this was all Blizzard Korea's fault, and not Blizzard's (Intervening right before the finals rather than earlier, threatening with copyright notices against Brood War streams while leaving SC2 streams alone) Blizzard still instructed Blizzard Korea to do that shit.
And they still have the bullshit rules of treating Korea and the rest of the world differently when it comes to BW tournaments, and treating BW worse than SC2 when it comes to running tournaments.
Do you have any justification for this? If you don't, I'm going to continue thinking Blizzard are assholes. I don't see how they're not, but if you have arguments, let me know them, and if they are sound, I will change my mind.
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On November 15 2012 03:12 Evangelist wrote:
Also, to be honest, if this is the reaction they get for a minor licencing issue (they happen all the time) then I'd be of the opinion that I WOULD kill BW just to irritate people who clearly hate their company. Frankly, I wouldn't do anything for any of you.
I really liked your post, because despite trying to insult us little, confused pygmys from your high horse you managed to hit the nail on the head. They are - in fact - not doing anything for any of us right now. If that is the case, because they feel offended by our opinions (which are at least partially backed by facts) or not I can't say. You missed one point though. This is not a minor licensing issue as this is not a minor tourney. It's the only one we have at that level of play. Many of us posters even acknowledge that they are somewhat right to do something like this; the timing is what we take issue with.
As it was said before: I'm shocked that these newsposts do not surprise me anymore. I am already actively boycotting blizzard. I suggest you do the same.
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Wow so we can't even have tournaments anymore..........
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Canada11524 Posts
A little calmer now after some sleep.
I like how reddit has managed to drop that down to zero points. 300 up. 332 down
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What a thing to wake up to this morning
The way I see they had over a month to shut this down but waited until days before the finals to be as harmful as possible. They probably didn't care until Sonic announced it would be in an auditorium casted by Kim Carrier. Blizzard must think the SSL has potential to bring Brood War back into the mainstream other wise they wouldn't do this. That explains why they never said a peep about ISL and other foreign tournaments with over $500 in the prize pool. I hope over 1000 people show up for the finals.
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On November 15 2012 03:09 Evangelist wrote:
Blizzard Korea has been battling KESPA for close to ten years. I imagine they've got pretty specific guidelines on how to deal with it. Maybe if the weeping vaginas in this thread had any common sense they'd realize that Blizzard reckon it's pretty cool their old game is still so loved and played.
TL again proves that it is the common sense of a confused pygmy regarding BW.
User was temp banned for this post.
Aw, man. I sent him a PM asking him to respond to my arguments. Now I'll never know whether he was going to say something, or just ignore me.
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On November 15 2012 03:40 vOdToasT wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2012 03:36 Sumadin wrote:Guys, get with the news okay. The higher-ups of Blizzard are trying to sort this out as we speak. Mike Morhaime is on it. https://twitter.com/mikemorhaime/status/268746874838732800Blizzard korea is just a local department, but they have been struggeling with Kespa for years so noone in their right mind can blame them for being strict with their IP rights. Through i would say it would be fair to argue about their timing. Can you all put down those damm pitchforks now, this is getting embarrassing. Show nested quote +I have no problem with the reaction, before the twitter post. Blizzard shut down something that you are passionate about and I would be pissed to in your shoes.
But, you have a quote from the CEO of Blizzard directly saying that Blizzard isn't going to shut down this tournament. Outside of a few people trying to point it out to the masses, the reaction is exactly the same! The continued anti-Blizzard tone of this thread just shows how bitter and irrational that this community can be, and it isn't limited to the BW fans. Allow me to quote myself. Show nested quote +
What is the justification for this? Show me your " common sense " that I lack. Obviously, this was Blizzard Korea, not Blizzard, but Blizzard gave them the rules. The rules of only allowing BW tournaments to have a prize pool of $500 without paying, and letting SC2 have $5000. The rules of treating Korea worse than the rest of the world when it comes to tournaments.
Even if this was all Blizzard Korea's fault, and not Blizzard's (Intervening right before the finals rather than earlier, threatening with copyright notices against Brood War streams while leaving SC2 streams alone) Blizzard still instructed Blizzard Korea to do that shit. And they still have the bullshit rules of treating Korea and the rest of the world differently when it comes to BW tournaments, and treating BW worse than SC2 when it comes to running tournaments. Do you have any justification for this? If you don't, I'm going to continue thinking Blizzard are assholes. I don't see how they're not, but if you have arguments, let me know them, and if they are sound, I will change my mind.
Because they've had past history specifically in south korea regarding IP rights problems, namely Kespa? Because they just went through a long and bad PR period with Kespa simply to get their rights to scbw recognized? So the rules were obviously put in place to keep KESPA in check, but this was unfortunately a byproduct. Blizz KR is obviously told to be more strict about IP respects because this is literally the ONLY region where they had issues with IP rights, and thus were probably told to be extra careful, and like most people in business, and like I stated before, their LEGAL DEPARTMENT NOT THEIR ESPORTS DEPARTMENT, probably was informed of the SSL late because it wasn't a major tournament, and like you stated was merely an amateur league, but when it became more popular with the finals looming, and with bigger casters attending, it obviously created some buzz, and forced the legal team to look into it. They obviously aren't the PR team either, and don't understand how this is gonna negatively impact both the SSL and blizzard. Hence why once Mike Morhaime was informed, he immediately tried to resolve the issue, because none of the strictness that occurs in KR is about hurting the little guy, but about protecting blizz from Kespa regaining it's unilateral power again.
Regarding your points of brood war streams, i still haven't seen it happen, you're merely throwing speculation about them, and chances are, it's again, the blizz kr team trying to be harsh to make sure people don't try to circumvent the IP rights that blizz has fought so hard to obtain in SKR. I still see afreeca streaming bw, and i haven't yet heard of anyone being shut down or charged for it, just like blizz hasn't done so to sc2, why? because they don't want to stop people from streaming even if it technically is within their power, so you're attacks on that are still largely unwarranted. My guess is the threats are merely to keep people from trying to host their own kespa style league/tourney without respecting blizz's IP. Chances are, it's just like sc2's tournament scene in that if you're going to host a tournament, you fill out a simple form, and request permission, if prize money is less than what they deem is 'significant', then you can proceed, but even small tournaments are supposed to request permission. Yes, scbw's significant $ pool is set much lower than the sc2 scene, but this number was set for a reason, who knows why, maybe it's something kespa negotiated into the final agreement with blizz to make sure they didn't have major competition for other tournaments once kespa was given 'rights' to host scbw tournaments (which they ended up stopping eventually regrettably). But all of this is still jsut speculation from BOTH sides because we don't know the details. The simple truth is, YOU ASK FOR PERMISSION IF YOU ARE GOING TO HOST A TOURNAMENT.
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Always nice to see how childish the BW community is.
Blizzard is on it, stop QQ'ing about your dead game and live with it.
User was banned for this post.
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GRAND OLD AMERICA16375 Posts
On November 15 2012 03:45 Falling wrote:A little calmer now after some sleep. I like how reddit has managed to drop that down to zero points. 300 up. 332 down
Well, Reddit is just sc2 forum, so I'm not surprised.
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EPT
