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On March 10 2012 12:08 supernovamaniac wrote:
For those who don't know: The team who goes directly for the finals can pick which map becomes 1st set, which will also become the 7th (ACE) set.
So whoever goes to finals directly will have huge advantage.
They should have just let each team veto a map for the ace and randomly pick one of the remaining ones. A lot less biased that way.
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Just a few days.. can't wait.
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On March 09 2012 15:07 Antoine wrote:ace match being back is bad news for all non-kt fans 
The Bo7 format more than makes up for that. Overall the change is bad for KT.
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On March 12 2012 04:24 Simplistik wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2012 15:07 Antoine wrote:ace match being back is bad news for all non-kt fans The Bo7 format more than makes up for that. Overall the change is bad for KT.
I don't know. I think the determining factor here is key integration, utilization and timing of their incorportation of the destructible rocks into their builds. Purely hypothetically speaking from an objectively abstract perspective, if KT can take down the alpha and beta DRX's (Destructible Rox) to roughly 33% before 6:32 on any 256x256 map, they can lock down gamma and omega DRX's at their leisure with no loss to their air support or calvary detectments. Of course this means a nearly 28% increase in favorability of a 47% increase in victory for KT over 70% of teams played.
Also, marines need to go left before their go right or they will get bamboozled by effective deployments of counter infantry units by the opposing side.
I hope this has contributed signifcantly to you understanding of this important situation in a positive yet firm way.
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Very pleased about the format. Cant wait.
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On March 12 2012 14:58 Torpedo.Vegas wrote:Show nested quote +On March 12 2012 04:24 Simplistik wrote:On March 09 2012 15:07 Antoine wrote:ace match being back is bad news for all non-kt fans The Bo7 format more than makes up for that. Overall the change is bad for KT. I don't know. I think the determining factor here is key integration, utilization and timing of their incorportation of the destructible rocks into their builds. Purely hypothetically speaking from an objectively abstract perspective, if KT can take down the alpha and beta DRX's (Destructible Rox) to roughly 33% before 6:32 on any 256x256 map, they can lock down gamma and omega DRX's at their leisure with no loss to their air support or calvary detectments. Of course this means a nearly 28% increase in favorability of a 47% increase in victory for KT over 70% of teams played. Also, marines need to go left before their go right or they will get bamboozled by effective deployments of counter infantry units by the opposing side. I hope this has contributed signifcantly to you understanding of this important situation in a positive yet firm way.
lol, Flash already understands this as such human calculations are trivial
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On March 12 2012 04:24 Simplistik wrote:Show nested quote +On March 09 2012 15:07 Antoine wrote:ace match being back is bad news for all non-kt fans The Bo7 format more than makes up for that. Overall the change is bad for KT.
I disagree, KT's main weakness is their 3rd & 4th players not their 5-6th. Essentially we have excellent 1-2, bad 3-4, and pretty good 5-6. Mind, Action, Wooki, Crazy Hydra, are all fairly bad 3-4 but excellent 5-6.
I also don't think the ace match is that much of an advantage, despite Flash, Neo Chain Reaction for Ace map is almost going to force Stats which makes us weaker.
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Giving crazy-hydra performance this year (8-2 overall and in a 7 game winning streak only losing to Leta and the master PvZer Best xD) KT should be a little more confident having a third reliable player?
Also in the Khan's winners interview vs Stars, they said the same about picking maps,
Q: Which team would you like to make it to the semis?
Stork = We get to choose the 1st and 7th set map, so that's good. What's more important than which team we meet is which players we face, but... Woongjin is always quite strong against us, so it would be nice if KT could make it.
This guy here explained it
It's whoever is higher in the ranking who gets to pick Day 1 and 3 maps for Ace, lower ranking gets Day 2 Ace choice. So SKT gets to pick for their sole Bo7 the Ace map (which is also Map 1 as well) while Khan gets to pick the Ace map for Day 1 and 3 for the team that will win the KT vs CJ/Stars quarterfinals, who will have KT choosing their Day 1/3 maps as well.
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I just realized something. The ace match is a really........ REALLY good way to snipe Flash. Lots of preparations can be done and a prepared player can beat Flash.
I don't know why KT is pleased with this. Unless KT coach becomes unpredictable and send an Anti-Sniper.
Down with CJ/KT/T1
Gogog Stars/Khan
On March 12 2012 21:13 HopLight wrote:Show nested quote +On March 12 2012 04:24 Simplistik wrote:On March 09 2012 15:07 Antoine wrote:ace match being back is bad news for all non-kt fans The Bo7 format more than makes up for that. Overall the change is bad for KT. I disagree, KT's main weakness is their 3rd & 4th players not their 5-6th. Essentially we have excellent 1-2, bad 3-4, and pretty good 5-6. Mind, Action, Wooki, Crazy Hydra, are all fairly bad 3-4 but excellent 5-6. I also don't think the ace match is that much of an advantage, despite Flash, Neo Chain Reaction for Ace map is almost going to force Stats which makes us weaker.
I am mostly a Flash Anti-fan but Flash can play in any map as long as he is able to practice with it and come up with good/safe builds. And hope that he doesn't get cocky.
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This is going to be so awesome, I can't wait. GO KHAN!
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Will be the finals be at Busan? I saw in one of the interviews someone mentioned it but I didn't read that anywhere else.
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Getting to pick the 7th map is such a joke. Not happy with that rule at all.
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On March 13 2012 00:01 J1.au wrote:
Getting to pick the 7th map is such a joke. Not happy with that rule at all.
Oh I see this coming, KT loses in set 7 and everyone is blaming the rule 
But honestly I don't think this rule puts a huge disadvantage on KT, besides of Flash is crushing anyone on any map (yea I know he lost two games), this new rule helps him to border the choice of opponents, so he can prepare better.
Hopefully KT does not manage to make it to the finals, I do not hate them at all, but I don't want to see a SKT vs KT final again. I was hoping to see SKT vs KT on first play off day, so what. Can't wait to 17th of March.
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The ability to pick the ace map is stupid. Both Chain Reaction and Outlier are completely unplayable for TvP. KHAN and SKT1, teams with protoss aces, are obviously going to choose these maps. We'll be seeing anticlimactic PvP mirrors for the ace match instead of a TvP on a more balanced map. With the season on the line, do you really want to watch Stats playing a PvP?
Funny how the Proleague format, the absence of Winners League and the playoff format all need to be made with one certain player in mind. The format is pretty much conspired to ensure KTFlash doesn't win for the third time in a row.
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On March 13 2012 01:54 salito wrote:
The ability to pick the ace map is stupid. Both Chain Reaction and Outlier are completely unplayable for TvP. KHAN and SKT1, teams with protoss aces, are obviously going to choose these maps. We'll be seeing anticlimactic PvP mirrors for the ace match instead of a TvP on a more balanced map. With the season on the line, do you really want to watch Stats playing a PvP?
Funny how the Proleague format, the absence of Winners League and the playoff format all need to be made with one certain player in mind. The format is pretty much conspired to ensure KTFlash doesn't win for the third time in a row.
I doubt that rule is new, sounds like it always has been there. I have no idea thought.
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On March 12 2012 21:13 HopLight wrote:Show nested quote +On March 12 2012 04:24 Simplistik wrote:On March 09 2012 15:07 Antoine wrote:ace match being back is bad news for all non-kt fans The Bo7 format more than makes up for that. Overall the change is bad for KT. I disagree, KT's main weakness is their 3rd & 4th players not their 5-6th. Essentially we have excellent 1-2, bad 3-4, and pretty good 5-6. Mind, Action, Wooki, Crazy Hydra, are all fairly bad 3-4 but excellent 5-6. I also don't think the ace match is that much of an advantage, despite Flash, Neo Chain Reaction for Ace map is almost going to force Stats which makes us weaker.
I'll just take the liberty to quote myself here:
On February 04 2012 07:54 Simplistik wrote:
I was thinking about the effect of the format change the other day. There were a lot of predictions that KT would suffer from the lack of Ace Match, but I think those were wrong. Allow me to explain...
Last season KT were basically working like this: Flash and Stats give two wins. Then KT has four shots at getting to the Ace Match using their second string players. Finally Flash, and occasionally Stats, would show up to win the Ace Match. Flash and Stats managed a combined 6 - 3 in Ace Matches, including playoffs. But that's "only" 67%.
This season the Ace Match burden has been lifted. Flash and Stats have to practice one map, which increases their win chance. This season they are a combined 16 - 3 (84%), compared to last season's 61 - 33 (65%), discounting Winners League. That's quite scary. On top of that, once any of the second string players wins, KT wins the entire match. The chance for Flash or Stats to be sniped in the Ace Match has been removed completely.
In conclusion, I think that the removal of the Ace Match format didn't hurt KT much, but the shortening from Bo7 to Bo5 helped KT a lot. If I had to assess KT's chance depending on the format then it would look like this, from great to bad:
1) Bo5 + Ace Match = great for KT; able to win with just Flash and Stats, plus occasional help from others
2) Bo5 - Ace Match = good for KT; Flash and Stats can focus, 3 shots for the others to get one win
3) Bo7 + Ace Match = so - so for KT; 4 shots for the others to get it to Ace Match, then Flash brings home the bacon
4) Bo7 - Ace Match = bad for KT; need 50% win rate from the 2nd line, looks bad based on last season's results
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Dominican Republic145 Posts
LEE YOUNG HO VS THE WORLD! the clash of God is imminent. Must be prepared...! Lets get it On!
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On March 13 2012 02:26 Simplistik wrote:Show nested quote +On March 12 2012 21:13 HopLight wrote:On March 12 2012 04:24 Simplistik wrote:On March 09 2012 15:07 Antoine wrote:ace match being back is bad news for all non-kt fans The Bo7 format more than makes up for that. Overall the change is bad for KT. I disagree, KT's main weakness is their 3rd & 4th players not their 5-6th. Essentially we have excellent 1-2, bad 3-4, and pretty good 5-6. Mind, Action, Wooki, Crazy Hydra, are all fairly bad 3-4 but excellent 5-6. I also don't think the ace match is that much of an advantage, despite Flash, Neo Chain Reaction for Ace map is almost going to force Stats which makes us weaker. I'll just take the liberty to quote myself here: Show nested quote +On February 04 2012 07:54 Simplistik wrote:
I was thinking about the effect of the format change the other day. There were a lot of predictions that KT would suffer from the lack of Ace Match, but I think those were wrong. Allow me to explain...
Last season KT were basically working like this: Flash and Stats give two wins. Then KT has four shots at getting to the Ace Match using their second string players. Finally Flash, and occasionally Stats, would show up to win the Ace Match. Flash and Stats managed a combined 6 - 3 in Ace Matches, including playoffs. But that's "only" 67%.
This season the Ace Match burden has been lifted. Flash and Stats have to practice one map, which increases their win chance. This season they are a combined 16 - 3 (84%), compared to last season's 61 - 33 (65%), discounting Winners League. That's quite scary. On top of that, once any of the second string players wins, KT wins the entire match. The chance for Flash or Stats to be sniped in the Ace Match has been removed completely.
In conclusion, I think that the removal of the Ace Match format didn't hurt KT much, but the shortening from Bo7 to Bo5 helped KT a lot. If I had to assess KT's chance depending on the format then it would look like this, from great to bad:
1) Bo5 + Ace Match = great for KT; able to win with just Flash and Stats, plus occasional help from others
2) Bo5 - Ace Match = good for KT; Flash and Stats can focus, 3 shots for the others to get one win
3) Bo7 + Ace Match = so - so for KT; 4 shots for the others to get it to Ace Match, then Flash brings home the bacon
4) Bo7 - Ace Match = bad for KT; need 50% win rate from the 2nd line, looks bad based on last season's results
So essentially you quote yourself while not actually meeting the main point I made?
Ok, let me break it down:
KT vs SKT1
KT top players are better than SKT1 (Flash Stats vs Fantasy Bisu)
KT Mid players are all worse than SKT1 mid players (Mind, Action, Wooki, Crazy Hydra vs Best/By.Sun)
However when it comes to 5-6th set KT are still fielding mid players against the fairly terrible last 2 for SKT1: (Mind, Action, Wooki, Crazy Hydra vs Hyuk, n.die_soo, s2)
What I'm saying is the actual Ace match is iffy because the other teams can snipe Flash with BOTH map, player, and build, but I think our additional 6th player is on par with any 6th player out there (with the possible exception of CJ)
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Does anybody know the ticket price for a final and where we can buy one ?
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On March 13 2012 03:15 Naoned wrote:
Does anybody know the ticket price for a final and where we can buy one ?
No information has been posted afaik. Not even the venue for the finals.
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EPT
