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On February 05 2011 18:52 theramstoss wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 18:46 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:36 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 16:18 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:08 theramstoss wrote:
I think the best players make around 300k (flash etc), especially counting all endorsements and individual leagues (I dont think it's at a million). But that still doesnt compare to sc2 right now, imagine if a bonjwa emerged, he could potentially win 10 out of the 12 tourneys as they dont overlap with each other, which would amount to like a million. Flash is rumoured to make 300k salary with performance bonuses. Individual leagues and endorsements probably get him much more. Also, GSL lowered the prize money of their "regular" tournaments to 50m won and they don't even have 12 GSLs a year anymore. Can you link me to where it says they will have less than 12 GSL's a year? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190136 wow.. so that's pretty much the same as sc1 now, except minus the team salaries.
quite impressing to me considering they started sc2 stuff about 6 months ago.
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On February 05 2011 18:32 samachking wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 18:18 theramstoss wrote:
I was referring to Julyzerg's talent in his prime (which I don't think you can argue against, he has a golden mouse samachking if you didn't know. He also won his last OSL in 2008, which isn't that long ago..). But I guess his status at the time of the switch matters too. But then there's people like Nestea (and also MC), who was a mediocre player then coach.
But with regards to july, the difference between people in how well it translates played a role. I remember in an intervew July said that he lost so many games in a row (9?) in public rooms in sc2 since he started. His OSL run was a fluke, he had BO wins in the ro36, played well in his ZvZ group, got the 3 worst PvZ players of all time who somehow fluked their way into the ro8/ro4/finals, I'm talking about you Backho and Rock. I cannot deny his talent in his prime, but current performance and status before that matters, and his last stand was his last performance in the 3rd season of GOM, he played a strong series vs Flash where Flash turned into a god in 2009. He wasn't a bad player, just not good enough to be fielded as a player with 3 better zergs in his team. Edit: Anyways, this is off topic, sorry for derailing the topic.
On the contrary, he secured massive massive advantages with all-ins vs Flash which succeeded and put him MILES ahead, and somehow still managed to lose 0-3.
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On February 05 2011 18:52 theramstoss wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 18:46 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:36 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 16:18 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:08 theramstoss wrote:
I think the best players make around 300k (flash etc), especially counting all endorsements and individual leagues (I dont think it's at a million). But that still doesnt compare to sc2 right now, imagine if a bonjwa emerged, he could potentially win 10 out of the 12 tourneys as they dont overlap with each other, which would amount to like a million. Flash is rumoured to make 300k salary with performance bonuses. Individual leagues and endorsements probably get him much more. Also, GSL lowered the prize money of their "regular" tournaments to 50m won and they don't even have 12 GSLs a year anymore. Can you link me to where it says they will have less than 12 GSL's a year? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190136 wow.. so that's pretty much the same as sc1 now, except minus the team salaries.
And minus real team competition (GSTL is nothing compared to PL).
And minus teams being sponsored by actually large companies.
And minus salaries for every professional player.
And minus Korean fan support (compare GSL4 finals crowd to OSL finals crowd - here).
And minus better opportunities for lower level pro's to play (Dream league, random PL appearances, OSL/MSL qualifiers, etc).
And minus several dozen professional games being played each week.
And minus open, freely available replays of every pro game.
And minus a decade long history of fantastic tournaments, rivalries, goofs, human interest stories, and everything else you'd expect from an actually successful sport.
And minus being live broadcast on two different TV channels.
And minus being the most successful esport in history.
And minus Bunkie.
You've got a long way to go.
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you mean VODs, not replays.
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On February 05 2011 19:43 deafhobbit wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 18:52 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 18:46 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:36 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 16:18 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:08 theramstoss wrote:
I think the best players make around 300k (flash etc), especially counting all endorsements and individual leagues (I dont think it's at a million). But that still doesnt compare to sc2 right now, imagine if a bonjwa emerged, he could potentially win 10 out of the 12 tourneys as they dont overlap with each other, which would amount to like a million. Flash is rumoured to make 300k salary with performance bonuses. Individual leagues and endorsements probably get him much more. Also, GSL lowered the prize money of their "regular" tournaments to 50m won and they don't even have 12 GSLs a year anymore. Can you link me to where it says they will have less than 12 GSL's a year? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190136 wow.. so that's pretty much the same as sc1 now, except minus the team salaries. And minus real team competition (GSTL is nothing compared to PL). And minus teams being sponsored by actually large companies. And minus salaries for every professional player. And minus Korean fan support (compare GSL4 finals crowd to OSL finals crowd - here). And minus better opportunities for lower level pro's to play (Dream league, random PL appearances, OSL/MSL qualifiers, etc). And minus several dozen professional games being played each week. And minus open, freely available replays of every pro game. And minus a decade long history of fantastic tournaments, rivalries, goofs, human interest stories, and everything else you'd expect from an actually successful sport. And minus being live broadcast on two different TV channels. And minus being the most successful esport in history. And minus Bunkie. You've got a long way to go.
Uh saying it's "real team" competition is kinda meaningless. It's still team vs team, one is just more prominent. Every professional player does not have a salary I don't believe. It's just free rent. Maybe some food? Lower levels of play have much more opportunity on the international scene than BW does as well, significantly more, no comparison. OSL/MSL qualifiers is irrelevant... GSL has qualifiers too... and when GSL is running there are often just as many if not more games than BW. You are wrong about having open, freely available replays as well, there aren't. The VODs of proleague and stuff are illegal I believe, (jon747 etc), which is why they were taken down from youtube. It's not like you can't find GSL games easily illegally either, I watched all 3 of the first seasons free. Being the "most successful esport in history" isn't a valid argument.
They do have Bunkie though.
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On February 05 2011 20:38 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 19:43 deafhobbit wrote:On February 05 2011 18:52 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 18:46 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:36 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 16:18 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:08 theramstoss wrote:
I think the best players make around 300k (flash etc), especially counting all endorsements and individual leagues (I dont think it's at a million). But that still doesnt compare to sc2 right now, imagine if a bonjwa emerged, he could potentially win 10 out of the 12 tourneys as they dont overlap with each other, which would amount to like a million. Flash is rumoured to make 300k salary with performance bonuses. Individual leagues and endorsements probably get him much more. Also, GSL lowered the prize money of their "regular" tournaments to 50m won and they don't even have 12 GSLs a year anymore. Can you link me to where it says they will have less than 12 GSL's a year? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190136 wow.. so that's pretty much the same as sc1 now, except minus the team salaries. And minus real team competition (GSTL is nothing compared to PL). And minus teams being sponsored by actually large companies. And minus salaries for every professional player. And minus Korean fan support (compare GSL4 finals crowd to OSL finals crowd - here). And minus better opportunities for lower level pro's to play (Dream league, random PL appearances, OSL/MSL qualifiers, etc). And minus several dozen professional games being played each week. And minus open, freely available replays of every pro game. And minus a decade long history of fantastic tournaments, rivalries, goofs, human interest stories, and everything else you'd expect from an actually successful sport. And minus being live broadcast on two different TV channels. And minus being the most successful esport in history. And minus Bunkie. You've got a long way to go. Uh saying it's "real team" competition is kinda meaningless. It's still team vs team, one is just more prominent. Every professional player does not have a salary I don't believe. It's just free rent. Maybe some food? Lower levels of play have much more opportunity on the international scene than BW does as well, significantly more, no comparison. OSL/MSL qualifiers is irrelevant... GSL has qualifiers too... and when GSL is running there are often just as many if not more games than BW. You are wrong about having open, freely available replays as well, there aren't. The VODs of proleague and stuff are illegal I believe, (jon747 etc), which is why they were taken down from youtube. It's not like you can't find GSL games easily illegally either, I watched all 3 of the first seasons free. Being the "most successful esport in history" isn't a valid argument. They do have Bunkie though.
IRRC Nevake is TL's official BWvod channel. TL is smater than to be involved with illegal activities. Jon747 was terminated due to mutiple complaints made by WCG and possibly Sony.
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On February 05 2011 20:38 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 19:43 deafhobbit wrote:On February 05 2011 18:52 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 18:46 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:36 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 16:18 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:08 theramstoss wrote:
I think the best players make around 300k (flash etc), especially counting all endorsements and individual leagues (I dont think it's at a million). But that still doesnt compare to sc2 right now, imagine if a bonjwa emerged, he could potentially win 10 out of the 12 tourneys as they dont overlap with each other, which would amount to like a million. Flash is rumoured to make 300k salary with performance bonuses. Individual leagues and endorsements probably get him much more. Also, GSL lowered the prize money of their "regular" tournaments to 50m won and they don't even have 12 GSLs a year anymore. Can you link me to where it says they will have less than 12 GSL's a year? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190136 wow.. so that's pretty much the same as sc1 now, except minus the team salaries. And minus real team competition (GSTL is nothing compared to PL). And minus teams being sponsored by actually large companies. And minus salaries for every professional player. And minus Korean fan support (compare GSL4 finals crowd to OSL finals crowd - here). And minus better opportunities for lower level pro's to play (Dream league, random PL appearances, OSL/MSL qualifiers, etc). And minus several dozen professional games being played each week. And minus open, freely available replays of every pro game. And minus a decade long history of fantastic tournaments, rivalries, goofs, human interest stories, and everything else you'd expect from an actually successful sport. And minus being live broadcast on two different TV channels. And minus being the most successful esport in history. And minus Bunkie. You've got a long way to go. Uh saying it's "real team" competition is kinda meaningless. It's still team vs team, one is just more prominent. Every professional player does not have a salary I don't believe. It's just free rent. Maybe some food? Lower levels of play have much more opportunity on the international scene than BW does as well, significantly more, no comparison. OSL/MSL qualifiers is irrelevant... GSL has qualifiers too... and when GSL is running there are often just as many if not more games than BW. You are wrong about having open, freely available replays as well, there aren't. The VODs of proleague and stuff are illegal I believe, (jon747 etc), which is why they were taken down from youtube. It's not like you can't find GSL games easily illegally either, I watched all 3 of the first seasons free. Being the "most successful esport in history" isn't a valid argument. They do have Bunkie though.
You're misinformed. BW VODs are not illegal. OGN's official stream is even free.
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On February 05 2011 20:55 Ryo wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 20:38 FabledIntegral wrote:On February 05 2011 19:43 deafhobbit wrote:On February 05 2011 18:52 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 18:46 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:36 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 16:18 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:08 theramstoss wrote:
I think the best players make around 300k (flash etc), especially counting all endorsements and individual leagues (I dont think it's at a million). But that still doesnt compare to sc2 right now, imagine if a bonjwa emerged, he could potentially win 10 out of the 12 tourneys as they dont overlap with each other, which would amount to like a million. Flash is rumoured to make 300k salary with performance bonuses. Individual leagues and endorsements probably get him much more. Also, GSL lowered the prize money of their "regular" tournaments to 50m won and they don't even have 12 GSLs a year anymore. Can you link me to where it says they will have less than 12 GSL's a year? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190136 wow.. so that's pretty much the same as sc1 now, except minus the team salaries. And minus real team competition (GSTL is nothing compared to PL). And minus teams being sponsored by actually large companies. And minus salaries for every professional player. And minus Korean fan support (compare GSL4 finals crowd to OSL finals crowd - here). And minus better opportunities for lower level pro's to play (Dream league, random PL appearances, OSL/MSL qualifiers, etc). And minus several dozen professional games being played each week. And minus open, freely available replays of every pro game. And minus a decade long history of fantastic tournaments, rivalries, goofs, human interest stories, and everything else you'd expect from an actually successful sport. And minus being live broadcast on two different TV channels. And minus being the most successful esport in history. And minus Bunkie. You've got a long way to go. Uh saying it's "real team" competition is kinda meaningless. It's still team vs team, one is just more prominent. Every professional player does not have a salary I don't believe. It's just free rent. Maybe some food? Lower levels of play have much more opportunity on the international scene than BW does as well, significantly more, no comparison. OSL/MSL qualifiers is irrelevant... GSL has qualifiers too... and when GSL is running there are often just as many if not more games than BW. You are wrong about having open, freely available replays as well, there aren't. The VODs of proleague and stuff are illegal I believe, (jon747 etc), which is why they were taken down from youtube. It's not like you can't find GSL games easily illegally either, I watched all 3 of the first seasons free. Being the "most successful esport in history" isn't a valid argument. They do have Bunkie though. You're misinformed. BW VODs are not illegal. OGN's official stream is even free.
oopsies.
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On February 05 2011 20:48 ShadeR wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 20:38 FabledIntegral wrote:On February 05 2011 19:43 deafhobbit wrote:On February 05 2011 18:52 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 18:46 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:36 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 16:18 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:08 theramstoss wrote:
I think the best players make around 300k (flash etc), especially counting all endorsements and individual leagues (I dont think it's at a million). But that still doesnt compare to sc2 right now, imagine if a bonjwa emerged, he could potentially win 10 out of the 12 tourneys as they dont overlap with each other, which would amount to like a million. Flash is rumoured to make 300k salary with performance bonuses. Individual leagues and endorsements probably get him much more. Also, GSL lowered the prize money of their "regular" tournaments to 50m won and they don't even have 12 GSLs a year anymore. Can you link me to where it says they will have less than 12 GSL's a year? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190136 wow.. so that's pretty much the same as sc1 now, except minus the team salaries. And minus real team competition (GSTL is nothing compared to PL). And minus teams being sponsored by actually large companies. And minus salaries for every professional player. And minus Korean fan support (compare GSL4 finals crowd to OSL finals crowd - here). And minus better opportunities for lower level pro's to play (Dream league, random PL appearances, OSL/MSL qualifiers, etc). And minus several dozen professional games being played each week. And minus open, freely available replays of every pro game. And minus a decade long history of fantastic tournaments, rivalries, goofs, human interest stories, and everything else you'd expect from an actually successful sport. And minus being live broadcast on two different TV channels. And minus being the most successful esport in history. And minus Bunkie. You've got a long way to go. Uh saying it's "real team" competition is kinda meaningless. It's still team vs team, one is just more prominent. Every professional player does not have a salary I don't believe. It's just free rent. Maybe some food? Lower levels of play have much more opportunity on the international scene than BW does as well, significantly more, no comparison. OSL/MSL qualifiers is irrelevant... GSL has qualifiers too... and when GSL is running there are often just as many if not more games than BW. You are wrong about having open, freely available replays as well, there aren't. The VODs of proleague and stuff are illegal I believe, (jon747 etc), which is why they were taken down from youtube. It's not like you can't find GSL games easily illegally either, I watched all 3 of the first seasons free. Being the "most successful esport in history" isn't a valid argument. They do have Bunkie though. IRRC Nevake is TL's official BWvod channel. TL is smater than to be involved with illegal activities. Jon747 was terminated due to mutiple complaints made by WCG and possibly Sony.
The unofficial story is two complaints by Gretech and one by WCG. No one really knows since Baezzi ~disappeared~.
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On February 05 2011 20:38 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 19:43 deafhobbit wrote:On February 05 2011 18:52 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 18:46 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:36 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 16:18 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:08 theramstoss wrote:
I think the best players make around 300k (flash etc), especially counting all endorsements and individual leagues (I dont think it's at a million). But that still doesnt compare to sc2 right now, imagine if a bonjwa emerged, he could potentially win 10 out of the 12 tourneys as they dont overlap with each other, which would amount to like a million. Flash is rumoured to make 300k salary with performance bonuses. Individual leagues and endorsements probably get him much more. Also, GSL lowered the prize money of their "regular" tournaments to 50m won and they don't even have 12 GSLs a year anymore. Can you link me to where it says they will have less than 12 GSL's a year? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190136 wow.. so that's pretty much the same as sc1 now, except minus the team salaries. And minus real team competition (GSTL is nothing compared to PL). And minus teams being sponsored by actually large companies. And minus salaries for every professional player. And minus Korean fan support (compare GSL4 finals crowd to OSL finals crowd - here). And minus better opportunities for lower level pro's to play (Dream league, random PL appearances, OSL/MSL qualifiers, etc). And minus several dozen professional games being played each week. And minus open, freely available replays of every pro game. And minus a decade long history of fantastic tournaments, rivalries, goofs, human interest stories, and everything else you'd expect from an actually successful sport. And minus being live broadcast on two different TV channels. And minus being the most successful esport in history. And minus Bunkie. You've got a long way to go. Uh saying it's "real team" competition is kinda meaningless. It's still team vs team, one is just more prominent. Every professional player does not have a salary I don't believe. It's just free rent. Maybe some food? Lower levels of play have much more opportunity on the international scene than BW does as well, significantly more, no comparison. OSL/MSL qualifiers is irrelevant... GSL has qualifiers too... and when GSL is running there are often just as many if not more games than BW. You are wrong about having open, freely available replays as well, there aren't. The VODs of proleague and stuff are illegal I believe, (jon747 etc), which is why they were taken down from youtube. It's not like you can't find GSL games easily illegally either, I watched all 3 of the first seasons free. Being the "most successful esport in history" isn't a valid argument. They do have Bunkie though.
Team Competition - One is a year long competition, broadcast on multiple television networks, that draws tens of thousands of people to the finals. The other is less than a month long. They're not in the same league.
Salaries - To my knowledge, at least all A teamers are paid, and you are the first person I've ever heard suggest this wasn't the case. Evidence is obviously needed, but given the size of the sponsors involved in BW i'd be very suppressed if all players didn't at least earn something.
Lower Level Play - Note my terminology - "lower level pro's." Pro = professional = someone who does this for a living. International sc2 competitions don't count as professional play because the vast majority of people in them aren't truly professional players. Also, why are qualifiers irrelevant? They require a pro gaming license, are KESPA official tournaments, and can result in one gaining entrance to the tournament proper.
GSL having more games - Bullshit, maybe you should try looking things up before making claims like this. I just took a few minutes and added up the number of scheduled games (which is a better long term metric for comparing them than number played) for all GSL events in January, and compared it to OSL/MSL/WL. Here are the results.
GSL - 34 events, 246 games
OSL/MSL/WL - 48 events, 316 games.
I may very well have missed a few, but i doubt they would make up a 70 game deficit. Turns out, Proleague every week adds up.
VOD's - Jon747 got taken down for WCG replays, not Korean scene ones. Re-uploading Kespa replays is 100% legal.
Most Successful Esport - Why not? Name me one other esport that has even come close to having the popular appeal of BW in Korea. You can't, because there hasn't been one. You can talk all you want about GSL viewship numbers, but the fact of the matter is that most those people are people like us - nerds who are really into gaming and who like to watch people play well. BW is Korea is different, large portions of it's fanbase are not gamers and follow it like they would follow any other sport.
And yes, it does have Bunkie.
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For me it's simple :
OSL/MSL/PL :
Everyone gets salary + free gaming condition (house, food, machines) + secured job.
Tournament winners get lesser money + high salary + bonus
GSL :
Tournament winners get more money.
Really, the "winner wins it all" approach sucks since it shows that the tournament organizers are incapable of covering for every professional players, if OSL/MSL/PL just cancel progaming house and salaries their price money will get higher than the GSL, but it will just destroy the scene. Also, the winners of BW tournament are guarantied to have high salary and bonus in addition to the price money that will put them ahead of the GSL winner in term of yearly income, unless the GSL guy wins more than 3 titles a year (which seems not realistic).
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On February 05 2011 16:51 BLinD-RawR wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 16:19 GTR wrote:
unlike sc2, bw players get appearance fees (players actually went on strike in 2003 to get these). SC2 players do get paid salaries... Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 14:10 JunkkaGom wrote:
I just don't see why people make so much fuss about the prize pool. Sure, the money for 1st place is half the open season and runner up recieved 2/3 of the money in open season. BUT the prize pool for Ro16~32 has gone up considerably. Also Code S players get paid salary regardless of their result. We do not cut prize pool because of our budget, as all prize money comes from sponsors.
Overall if you combine Code A and Code S the total prize pool is pretty much the same as Open seasons. this is a quote of one of the GOM staff members(John).
Obviously anyone would expect Bacchus to not have a high prize pool.
It is obvious that in GSL one of the main "sponsors" is Blizzard, when you make negotiations for sponsoring a broadcasting, the broadcaster shows the figures and put the price of that sponsorship according to the exposure that the sponsor product should get, there is no way that in a real market you could get more money from sponsors for a GSL than for an OSL or MSL, it is simple: if your product is in a program with better ratings you got to pay more, and theres not doubt that GSL online ratings are not comparable to OSL and MSL ratings.
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On February 05 2011 22:43 palexhur wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 16:51 BLinD-RawR wrote:On February 05 2011 16:19 GTR wrote:
unlike sc2, bw players get appearance fees (players actually went on strike in 2003 to get these). SC2 players do get paid salaries... On February 01 2011 14:10 JunkkaGom wrote:
I just don't see why people make so much fuss about the prize pool. Sure, the money for 1st place is half the open season and runner up recieved 2/3 of the money in open season. BUT the prize pool for Ro16~32 has gone up considerably. Also Code S players get paid salary regardless of their result. We do not cut prize pool because of our budget, as all prize money comes from sponsors.
Overall if you combine Code A and Code S the total prize pool is pretty much the same as Open seasons. this is a quote of one of the GOM staff members(John).
Obviously anyone would expect Bacchus to not have a high prize pool. It is obvious that in GSL one of the main "sponsors" is Blizzard, when you make negotiations for sponsoring a broadcasting, the broadcaster shows the figures and put the price of that sponsorship according to the exposure that the sponsor product should get, there is no way that in a real market you could get more money from sponsors for a GSL than for an OSL or MSL, it is simple: if your product is in a program with better ratings you got to pay more, and theres not doubt that GSL online ratings are not comparable to OSL and MSL ratings.
Could you point me to the evidence?
edit: wait, I realized you are saying OSL/MSL ratings are way higher, which I agree. No evidence needed.
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I can't believe people are discussing whether or not GSL is better/worse than OSL/MSL/PL.
Ratings of BW is just better than GSL there's no denying it. However GSL has the potential to become greater than BW simply put because of the scene outside Korea. BW outside Korea is dead as much as BW fans hate this. SC2 hasn't gotten off yet in Korea but outside Korea you see the prizepools and tournaments rising up and this shows the potential that sc2 could bring.
Furthermore GSL is planning to extend their tournaments to the foreign scene according to John. This means it'll take a (few) year(s) but that's still faster than what BW did in Korea. Afaik last year in Shanghai was the first time ever that a Starleague finals (think it was OSL) held outside Korea.
GSL has already made plans to do this in less than a year of release.
So in summary:
- BW has better ratings than GSL
- BW has an established scene compared to GSL
- BW scene is pretty much dead outside Korea
- SC2 hasn't gotten off yet in Korea BUT outside Korea it's still blooming and growing
- SC2 foreign viewers on GSL is higher than in foreign viewers on BW
- SC2 is less than a year old while BW is already 10+ years old.
- BW pro's get on average paid more than SC2 pro's
- BW has less prize money than GSL
- BW has 2 tv channels broadcasting BW while GSL not (1 for recap I think?).
So you see there are good and bad sides on both sides but currently BW in Korea is just better for sponsors than SC2 in Korea for now while outside SC2 is better for sponsors than BW does.
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On February 05 2011 19:03 jacen wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 18:52 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 18:46 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:36 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 16:18 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:08 theramstoss wrote:
I think the best players make around 300k (flash etc), especially counting all endorsements and individual leagues (I dont think it's at a million). But that still doesnt compare to sc2 right now, imagine if a bonjwa emerged, he could potentially win 10 out of the 12 tourneys as they dont overlap with each other, which would amount to like a million. Flash is rumoured to make 300k salary with performance bonuses. Individual leagues and endorsements probably get him much more. Also, GSL lowered the prize money of their "regular" tournaments to 50m won and they don't even have 12 GSLs a year anymore. Can you link me to where it says they will have less than 12 GSL's a year? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190136 wow.. so that's pretty much the same as sc1 now, except minus the team salaries. quite impressing to me considering they started sc2 stuff about 6 months ago.
seems like blizzard wants to create their own osl/msl!
On February 06 2011 00:02 shannn wrote:
So you see there are good and bad sides on both sides but currently BW in Korea is just better for sponsors than SC2 in Korea for now while outside SC2 is better for sponsors than BW does.
yeah, thats what it seems like. the gsl being less popular in korea may not really matter though, considering how much more popular it is worldwide. why can't they both co-exist? the only thing sc2 really lacks at the moment is the star power that BW has with Flash/JD/Bisu.
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actually shann, with 50000000 won for winner and 7 tourneys a year, SC2 potential earning cap is now less than sc1, with prize pool being roughly equal or slightly greater.
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On February 06 2011 00:04 dras wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 19:03 jacen wrote:On February 05 2011 18:52 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 18:46 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:36 theramstoss wrote:On February 05 2011 16:18 aru wrote:On February 05 2011 16:08 theramstoss wrote:
I think the best players make around 300k (flash etc), especially counting all endorsements and individual leagues (I dont think it's at a million). But that still doesnt compare to sc2 right now, imagine if a bonjwa emerged, he could potentially win 10 out of the 12 tourneys as they dont overlap with each other, which would amount to like a million. Flash is rumoured to make 300k salary with performance bonuses. Individual leagues and endorsements probably get him much more. Also, GSL lowered the prize money of their "regular" tournaments to 50m won and they don't even have 12 GSLs a year anymore. Can you link me to where it says they will have less than 12 GSL's a year? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190136 wow.. so that's pretty much the same as sc1 now, except minus the team salaries. quite impressing to me considering they started sc2 stuff about 6 months ago. seems like blizzard wants to create their own osl/msl! Show nested quote +On February 06 2011 00:02 shannn wrote:
So you see there are good and bad sides on both sides but currently BW in Korea is just better for sponsors than SC2 in Korea for now while outside SC2 is better for sponsors than BW does. yeah, thats what it seems like. the gsl being less popular in korea may not really matter though, considering how much more popular it is worldwide. why can't they both co-exist? the only thing sc2 really lacks at the moment is the star power that BW has with Flash/JD/Bisu.
And Stork!! It's Taek bang lee ssang, not taek lee ssang.
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On February 06 2011 00:10 theramstoss wrote:
actually shann, with 50000000 won for winner and 7 tourneys a year, SC2 potential earning cap is now less than sc1, with prize pool being roughly equal or slightly greater.
You're mistaken a bit.
The 7 tourney's a year is just 7 GSL Code S/A leagues.
There is also the Blizzard Cup, the Super tournament and some others all organised by GSL.
It comes down to 11-12 events a year with the prize pool being rougly equal of each event except the Super tournament which is the same as the GSL Open (100m won for 1st place).
Edit:
Here I found it on the link on previous pages.
7 GSL code S and A tournaments
1 GSTL after code S and A tournaments (let's just make it 1 since each GSTL is 1 week).
1 Super tournament
1 World championship
1 Blizzard cup
So it's 10 or 11 events depending if you count all GSTL as 1 big event. All with a similar prize pool.
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AH, this is exactly why I still love BW Forum, because even though the discussion has evolved past the initial OP (prize-money -> progamer' salaries) we can still be civil and level-headed enough to not spam with extra threads or get this one closed. GJ guyz 
Anyone have any statistics on what B-Teamers get paid? And for the OSL/MSL champions (+WCG) do the players themselves get ALL THAT MONEY, or is it distributed to team/sponsor?
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1019 Posts
you guys better stop riding close to the BW vs SC2, this thread will get locked if you go down that path. I believe players in BW get a stipend (both A-team and B-team) in addition to the room/board. Unless your an above average player and make it consistently into individual leagues, get bonuses, or make appearance fees, its difficult to become financially successful as a progamer. But keep in mind that the standard of living is still lower in Korea than western countries so the amount of money that the average progamer makes might well be good enough for them considering that they didn't even go to college yet.
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EPT
