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I don't know if anyone else has this little pet peeve, but here's one of mine.
People who are falsely modest about academics (I'm talking about tests). Here's an example: Person A goes to take a test and before the test he says "man I didn't study AT ALL for this test." Then afterwards he says "omg that test was so hard." Then the grade comes in and he's got an A "WHAT! wow that's so crazy, I didn't even study." Or, it works another way, there are people who say every test is hard regardless, so if they do poorly they say "see, I knew that test was hard" or if they do well they say "man I'm so lucky to do well". Either way, it's a cop out, and it's bullshit (it's also annoying).
In general false modesty just annoys me, but especially with respect to school, it just seems like a big pile of bullshit. In high school, it was filled with kids not wanting to look like nerds, so they pretended and acted as if they never studied, even when they actually did, and then had "WTF" faces when they got A's... and in college I've found that it's more of the opposite, people usually study a lot, but then pretend like every test is insanely hard that way they don't feel stupid if they do poorly, and they feel relieved if they do well. It's a really annoying defense mechanism that most people have...
Here's my philosophy. In high school I was a pretty poor student (got bad grades), not because I'm dumb or anything, but I didn't give a shit about school and I was lazy as hell. Despite that, I almost never said tests were hard. I knew that I did poorly because I didn't prepare enough, rather than the material being difficult. One of the only tests I thought was legitimately hard was AP Computer Science, especially because I didn't learn jack shit in the class (and almost everyone failed the test). In college now, I have the same attitude, I haven't found a test that I thought was particularly difficult, and although I haven't aced all my tests, I always know what I'm getting right and what I'm getting wrong, and I usually know why. I don't lie to myself and say tests are hard and lower my expectations.
I prepare reasonably well for my tests now, although I'm never one to put in mega study hours, I always rely on the fact that I almost always go to classes and pay close attention, and then do the reading, and a bit of reviewing for exams, maybe a little extra for finals... but so far through every test I haven't felt the need to say "that was really hard". I personally believe that if you prepare yourself enough, no test should be HARD. If you think something is hard, you just didn't try hard enough, or there is something fundamentally wrong with your understanding (for example, if you learned some information wrongly, or didn't understand it well... but again, this can be fixed with better preparation).
I'm never one to bullshit people and say "oh I dunno if I did well on that test." If I think I'm going to do well, I'll tell people just that if anybody asks, and if I say I did poorly, it's because I legitimately did. Although sometimes tests are variable and someone may think they did well and end up not doing as well, I would usually attribute that to not enough preparation, and say something like "I thought I did pretty well, but I"m annoyed because I could have done better."
I'm not a perfectionist by any means, don't have a 4.0 or anything like that, and I'm not a cocky or arrogant, but I DO like to be realistic with myself for one, and to other people should they ask... because I personally believe that always lying to yourself and others in order to make yourself feel better is really stupid / annoying.
Anyways, I don't know if anybody else has this same annoyance, or I'm just weird. But ya. Try it sometime, just be realistic about your academics (if you have the problem I bitched about above)...
 
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I think for it to be false modesty he has to be trying to be modest. These people are just being assholes.
Though occasionally there is a test that you really don't know if you did well or bad on.
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United States20661 Posts
How it works with me is that I know and confess to being an atrocious student, because I am. I heed next to no scholarly mores, and am an all-round slacker.
I still think the vast majority of tests are easy though. And I don't study for them. I sacrifice almost all points on homework by not doing any, and laze my way through school - is that inherently bad? I see it more as a flaw in our American academic system than my failures as a 'falsely modest' student.
It's fine if people say whatever the hell they want about how they did on a test; that's largely irrelevant. I can make my own judgments as to the intelligence of a person [tests don't cover that, anyway].
Attaching intelligence to academic success is rather silly. Sort of a tangent to what you said, but whatever.
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
You must hate me then too 
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United States22883 Posts
I'm usually pretty honest about everything.
"Yeah, I studied pretty well."
"Yeah, I owned the shit out of that test."
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On June 13 2008 14:09 Salv wrote:
I'm one of these people.
yeah me too, a lot of the time when i say stuff like that though i really do feel like i didn't study well enough or didn't do that well on the test, but when i get it back and it's an A i feel like shit for saying i didnt study 
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On June 13 2008 14:10 Last Romantic wrote:
How it works with me is that I know and confess to being an atrocious student, because I am. I heed next to no scholarly mores, and am an all-round slacker.
I still think the vast majority of tests are easy though. And I don't study for them. I sacrifice almost all points on homework by not doing any, and laze my way through school - is that inherently bad? I see it more as a flaw in our American academic system than my failures as a 'falsely modest' student.
It's fine if people say whatever the hell they want about how they did on a test; that's largely irrelevant. I can make my own judgments as to the intelligence of a person [tests don't cover that, anyway].
Attaching intelligence to academic success is rather silly. Sort of a tangent to what you said, but whatever.
I'm not saying there's anything WRONG with it.. I'm just saying that it's a pet peeve of mine when people do that, and it bugs me.
And ya, sort of a tangent, I wasn't referring to anyone's intelligence, I'm well aware test scores are not reflective of a person's intelligence. It just bugs me that people pretend to do bad or not study when they actually do, or when people who are really smart pretend to be dumb, that kinda thing.
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Where I go most people are lazy on school, and if they do bad they blame the professor... myself included sometimes
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Well, maybe I can give you a different perspective. I'm pretty much 'one of those people' who say tests are hard (but usually get good/descent grades) and say I didn't study when in fact I did prepare.
However, I have good reasons for doing so. First of all, when you really try to do well and don't its a lot more difficult than trying to do decently and doing decently. There is a diminishing return for study hours vs grades.
Second, its genuinely difficult to do well in a class if you don't want to be there. I've been in school way too long, and it gets to the point to where I just can't do it anymore. I literally can't force myself to actually work out the problems....in fact, this quarter many times I've done problems for the first time on the actual test.
Some classes are actually easier for freshmen then seniors. When we get assigned a lot of homework I think to myself "I'm not doing this sh*t." In fact yesterday I had a final on a single chapter. There was one type of problem that I hadn't done fully, and I told that to my friend. He asked what I was going to do, and I said I knew how to derive it. Well, not that I had derived it before, but in theory I knew how to derive it. So basically, as he summed it up while we were waiting for the final to be passed out, in theory I could derive the theory behind the problem to actually solve it.
So while the material on a test might not be hard, it can be hard none the less.
As far as studying. For those who really try to study to get really good grades and really understand things, it always feels like you haven't studied enough. Does working through the practice exams count as studying, when you haven't actually gone into the book and worked out a problem? I might spend 6 - 8 hours working through the practice exam, and say I haven't studied, because I feel that since I didn't read through the notes or homework or book, the minuscule amount that I did do is assumed implicitly by anyone taking the class.
Bottom line is if you aren't an A student and you are comparing yourself with one, your terminology will be different. If I join a game "1v1 noobs" you really don't know what that means. There are so many different levels of noobs that its just as likely you will get completely crushed as it is you will win easily.
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When I say a test is hard, I usually refer to how hard it was relative to past exams and how difficult I expected it to be. This is even if I know that I got 90+. And when I say I don't know how well I did, then I'm being honest; while I know that I probably got 75+, I probably didn't prepare well enough to know the concepts cold and am forced to derive it on past principles, which is a bit hit and miss.
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wait till you get into a hard college full of people who felt like this in high school, and shit starts getting pretty difficult because of that.
On June 13 2008 14:10 Last Romantic wrote:
How it works with me is that I know and confess to being an atrocious student, because I am. I heed next to no scholarly mores, and am an all-round slacker.
I still think the vast majority of tests are easy though. And I don't study for them. I sacrifice almost all points on homework by not doing any, and laze my way through school - is that inherently bad? I see it more as a flaw in our American academic system than my failures as a 'falsely modest' student.
It's fine if people say whatever the hell they want about how they did on a test; that's largely irrelevant. I can make my own judgments as to the intelligence of a person [tests don't cover that, anyway].
Attaching intelligence to academic success is rather silly. Sort of a tangent to what you said, but whatever.
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United States20661 Posts
oh I got into a ... sort of hard college? UC Berkeley.
I'm sure it'll be difficult; I am going into it with the thought that I am not the smartest person and will have to try hard.
High school is a fucking waste of time, though.
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I'm definitely one of those people. My parents raised me Chinese-style. I got owned for every little mistake I make on tests. So now, I'm in the habit of claiming I did poorly unless I know solved every single problem correctly (careless mistakes aside).
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On June 13 2008 14:36 Last Romantic wrote:
oh I got into a ... sort of hard college? UC Berkeley.
I'm sure it'll be difficult; I am going into it with the thought that I am not the smartest person and will have to try hard.
High school is a fucking waste of time, though.
Don't worry, it's probably not as hard as you might think ^^
... unless you're planning on getting into Haas. In that case, prepare for hell.
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I do this sometimes...or all the time. I usually do this because whenever I'm confident and feel well prepared for a test, i score low. However, having low expectations nets me 100% -_- Academic life stopped making sense after people in the top 10 ranks started scoring low on tests but still manage to pull off 4.0+ gpa's...
I think something more annoying than this is when people claim they care and study like hell to do well on the test but after a day or two, they forget everything. Maybe it's just me because I feel very strongly about this when it involves math or science classes. Especially when they plan on majoring in the subject they claim to love so much..
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On June 13 2008 14:38 B1nary wrote:
I'm definitely one of those people. My parents raised me Chinese-style. I got owned for every little mistake I make on tests. So now, I'm in the habit of claiming I did poorly unless I know solved every single problem correctly (careless mistakes aside).
I am a competitive perfectionist...
/blame parents
/see shrink
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On June 13 2008 14:10 Last Romantic wrote:
How it works with me is that I know and confess to being an atrocious student, because I am. I heed next to no scholarly mores, and am an all-round slacker.
I still think the vast majority of tests are easy though. And I don't study for them. I sacrifice almost all points on homework by not doing any, and laze my way through school - is that inherently bad? I see it more as a flaw in our American academic system than my failures as a 'falsely modest' student.
It's fine if people say whatever the hell they want about how they did on a test; that's largely irrelevant. I can make my own judgments as to the intelligence of a person [tests don't cover that, anyway].
Attaching intelligence to academic success is rather silly. Sort of a tangent to what you said, but whatever.
Enjoy it. College is literally absolutely nothing like this, if you're doing a real course of study (aka not Psychology, Sociology, or any of the bullshit majors). Trust me, you probably think, nah, it's fine, I'll get it - I breezed through high school with perfect A's and a 1600 SAT, never ever studying for a test, and I can't hold it down in college without significant work.
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I never studied in high school and did fine. I didn't study while in university either, and did fine there too. Did I make a big deal out of it? Sometimes. Do I care if I pissed off the guy who studied for 4 hours a day when I equal his mark? No, not really.
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United States22883 Posts
Those "bullshit majors" don't test very often, but they require fine paper writing skills. Convoluted bullshit generally doesn't work anymore. Maybe for psych it might.
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13196 Posts
On June 13 2008 14:40 B1nary wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 14:36 Last Romantic wrote:
oh I got into a ... sort of hard college? UC Berkeley.
I'm sure it'll be difficult; I am going into it with the thought that I am not the smartest person and will have to try hard.
High school is a fucking waste of time, though. Don't worry, it's probably not as hard as you might think ^^ ... unless you're planning on getting into Haas. In that case, prepare for hell.
uhhhh no
50% acceptance rate? lol.
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if you get far enough down the road, there will be tests that are difficult no matter how much you study
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that may be true.. but that's WAY down the road... so far in undergrad nothing I've encountered has been "hard" for me.. I got a C on my calc midterm because I knew I fucked up one of the problems and it was worth 3/4 but I got everything else correct, and when I got my test back, that's exactly what happened... that problem wasn't hard, I was just lazy and didn't pay attention when the teacher did an example of a similar problem in class.
i mean for example, for this final I had today, I think I studied for approximately 6 hours... I monday I read the book for about 2.5-3 hours, Tuesday I read over the court cases we had to know, and looked at the book for another hour... yesterday I went to office hours and listened to people ask the teacher questions for about 2 hours, and that was the extent of my studying. I felt well prepared, took the test today, didn't seem too bad... I"m thinking I"ll get an A on it... if I don't, I know there was something I missed when I was studying, or perhaps I underestimated it and didn't study enough even though I thought I did... whatever the reason, I know I"ll have earned w/e grade I got on it, and I felt good about my preparation, and that's that.
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I get A's often without studying.
And I get A's on tests that I considered difficult. Difficult to me, as in the problems take much more thought, application, and understanding, but I'm still able to come up with the correct answer. It's just harder to do than an easy test.
I guess that means my definition of difficult is different than yours.
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true, there are different definitions of difficult. I guess I'm defining difficult like: "wow that was so hard I probably failed it because I just had no idea wtf that stuff was".
on my calc problem there were 2 problems that I initially thought were really hard, and couldn't do, and even considered just turning in the test because I thought I wouldn't be able to figure them out no matter how long I stared at the paper, but I eventually worked it out and hopefully got the right answer, in the end didn't seem too bad. so, I didn't think those problems were difficult, I just struggled for a bit to come up with the method to solve it, but I was able to think through and work it out.
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United States20661 Posts
On June 13 2008 14:40 B1nary wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 14:36 Last Romantic wrote:
oh I got into a ... sort of hard college? UC Berkeley.
I'm sure it'll be difficult; I am going into it with the thought that I am not the smartest person and will have to try hard.
High school is a fucking waste of time, though. Don't worry, it's probably not as hard as you might think ^^ ... unless you're planning on getting into Haas. In that case, prepare for hell.
Yes, Haas. Somewhat hellish. 50% ain't bad, though.
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On June 13 2008 14:43 FuJi wrote:
I do this sometimes...or all the time. I usually do this because whenever I'm confident and feel well prepared for a test, i score low. However, having low expectations nets me 100% -_- Academic life stopped making sense after people in the top 10 ranks started scoring low on tests but still manage to pull off 4.0+ gpa's...
I think something more annoying than this is when people claim they care and study like hell to do well on the test but after a day or two, they forget everything. Maybe it's just me because I feel very strongly about this when it involves math or science classes. Especially when they plan on majoring in the subject they claim to love so much..
I think this happens WAY more in high school than in college... well I guess people who don't take college seriously, or have some bs major like psych just because "it's easy" rather than it being their passion.
But ya, in high school people are like this quite often. I guess you are saying that people who don't take academics seriously annoys you? Or... people who don't ENJOY learning a subject annoys you?
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i have my final japanese exam in one hour
OH SHIT
time for some false modesty, hope it works and i get an A
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On June 13 2008 15:33 snowbird wrote:
i have my final japanese exam in one hour
OH SHIT
time for some false modesty, hope it works and i get an A
Good luck with that.
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Is psychology really that easy ? When i was an biology undergrad we had courses like biopsychology together with some psychology students and while it wasn't the most difficult course i ever had you had to know quite a ,lot neurobiology for that one.
I always thought that easy subjects are more something like literature or philosophy, because you just need some brain, but don't really have to work.
Oh well, cell biochemistry finals in half an hour -_-;;
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I don't think what you're talking about it really false modesty; It's more like an attempt at modesty but just comes off as arrogant.
I think the term "false" modesty is a bit contradictory because by definition modesty is all about appearance and manner. You can't appear to be modest without actually being modest.
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i'm usually honest too
"i never studied at all"
<_< yea.
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United States22883 Posts
On June 13 2008 15:54 Dagor wrote:
Is psychology really that easy ? When i was an biology undergrad we had courses like biopsychology together with some psychology students and while it wasn't the most difficult course i ever had you had to know quite a ,lot neurobiology for that one.
I always thought that easy subjects are more something like literature or philosophy, because you just need some brain, but don't really have to work.
Oh well, cell biochemistry finals in half an hour -_-;;
None of them are really easy. Philosophy won't give you much of a work load, but your head is definitely going to hurt.
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I hate people who whine just because they suck at test taking. I honestly barely ever study, am vocal about it if asked, and usually beat the majority of the class grade wise. No they are probably not being modest or lying to you, they just don't suck at life. Why get angry at people who have natural ability, if you have to work harder for your B+ than I did for my A then work even harder and get an A+ if you care so much.
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On June 13 2008 16:03 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 15:54 Dagor wrote:
Is psychology really that easy ? When i was an biology undergrad we had courses like biopsychology together with some psychology students and while it wasn't the most difficult course i ever had you had to know quite a ,lot neurobiology for that one.
I always thought that easy subjects are more something like literature or philosophy, because you just need some brain, but don't really have to work.
Oh well, cell biochemistry finals in half an hour -_-;; None of them are really easy. Philosophy won't give you much of a work load, but your head is definitely going to hurt. Seconded. I'm a philosophy major and that's how I view it, too. This quarter, I had 3 philosophy classes:
Philosophy of Mind - a midterm, a final, and one 5-page essay. 2 books.
History of Political Philosophy - three 5-page essays. 3 books.
Logic, Second Course - 2 sets of logic problems weekly. Two midterms, one final.
So it really isn't that much work. Logic isn't a typical philosophy class in that it you actually get weekly homework, rather than a few essays. But logic was kind of like a math class anyway. If you prefer less but harder work, then you might like philosophy... (although I could just be biased and trying to make my major seem harder than it is).
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seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard..
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On June 13 2008 16:14 Therapy wrote:
I hate people who whine just because they suck at test taking. I honestly barely ever study, am vocal about it if asked, and usually beat the majority of the class grade wise. No they are probably not being modest or lying to you, they just don't suck at life. Why get angry at people who have natural ability, if you have to work harder for your B+ than I did for my A then work even harder and get an A+ if you care so much.
no that's not it at all, lol... I just finished my 3rd quarter at UCSD and 2 of them I've gotten 4.0, and the other one I got a 3.6 ... I'm not whining about having to work harder than other people, I don't work harder than a lot of people, but I'm not one to claim I don't work at all... I feel like the amount I work is sufficient to get me the grades I get, and I'm not going to bs anyone to say "well I dunno how I did, maybe I'll get a B" or something.. if I think I worked hard, I'm going to say I'm getting an A, because I feel if I work hard, I should get it, if I don't I'll be disappointed in myself.
it's just that a lot of people do those kind of things because of some kind of insecurity they have with themselves, or they just like being stupid and pretending they don't know their own abilities, either way it annoys me.
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On June 13 2008 17:26 glassmazarin wrote:
seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard..
ok well... can you tell me how a test can be HARD ? I mean, let's forget about some crazy theoretical or w/e the fuck mathematicians or physicians do in labs or whatever.. nothing insanely complicated like that gets taught at undergrad levels. but seriously, (and I'm mainly just talking about undergrad stuff here...) how can something really be hard in and of itself?
i really refuse to accept that something is inherently difficult... I believe that if you have basic skills necessary, aren't an idiot, and pay attention in class / study on your own... any test on any subject taught in the undergrad level should NOT be difficult.
my roommate complains to me sometimes like "oh engineering is so much harder than poli sci" but that in itself seems stupid to me. people who go into engineering ENJOY doing that stuff... they've presumably taken tons of math classes, are passionate about the subject, so how can it be hard? for example... I would struggle in engineering classes because I don't have the math background, or interest enough in the subject to dedicate to learning it... the same as my roommate doesn't have the skills or interest necessary to do well in Poli Sci classes. BUT, he has the passion and skills for engineering, so it should be easy IF he legitimately puts in the effort... obviously if you half ass it or lie to yourself about your effort, something may SEEM hard, but if you honestly give it your best effort and it still seems hard, then there's something wrong with what you did.
honestly, and I'm not close minded and unaccepting of admitting I am mistaken, but if anybody can provide some solid arguments on how something pre-graduate level can be extremely difficult in and of itself, I'd like to hear it.
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If you've never had a hard test in college, that's a personal thing.
Either you're the greatest genius ever to grace your campus or you haven't had a teacher who gives hard tests. Believe me, they're out there.
Did it ever occur to you that having a passion for something and having the capacity for something might be two different things?
Also, social science tests are not hard by nature, just like science and math essays are not hard by nature. There's less critical thinking to be done in social science tests as opposed to the essays, just like there's less critical thinking to be done in a science or math essay as opposed to a test.
I mean, have you ever thought about why math and science majors fail?
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On June 13 2008 15:00 GrandInquisitor wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 14:10 Last Romantic wrote:
How it works with me is that I know and confess to being an atrocious student, because I am. I heed next to no scholarly mores, and am an all-round slacker.
I still think the vast majority of tests are easy though. And I don't study for them. I sacrifice almost all points on homework by not doing any, and laze my way through school - is that inherently bad? I see it more as a flaw in our American academic system than my failures as a 'falsely modest' student.
It's fine if people say whatever the hell they want about how they did on a test; that's largely irrelevant. I can make my own judgments as to the intelligence of a person [tests don't cover that, anyway].
Attaching intelligence to academic success is rather silly. Sort of a tangent to what you said, but whatever. Enjoy it. College is literally absolutely nothing like this, if you're doing a real course of study (aka not Psychology, Sociology, or any of the bullshit majors). Trust me, you probably think, nah, it's fine, I'll get it - I breezed through high school with perfect A's and a 1600 SAT, never ever studying for a test, and I can't hold it down in college without significant work.
The social sciences get a bad rap because they're easy to pass.
However, the difference between social sciences and "real" courses of study is that to be recognized in social sciences, you need to have intuition above and beyond what you can learn from studying. To be recognized in physical sciences, you need to study something above and beyond what you can learn from intuition.
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Man I totally agree, it's a bit like "Retired" Draco who didnt practice at all....
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I'm one of those who don't learn much but get good results (almost never the best though). And I know someone who *ALWAYS* says "that was so hard, I'm so fucked, I know I got this wrong and that wrong and everything omg", and guess what, this guy gets top grades *consistently*.
It's a lot about discipline and personality IMHO... if you think you suck, you'll learn more and more efficiently, so you'll have better results. If you think you can make it without learning much, or if you think "I'm good at that, no need to prepare" you'll never be the best because you don't push yourself enough to become it.
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On June 13 2008 17:51 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 17:26 glassmazarin wrote:
seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard.. ok well... can you tell me how a test can be HARD ? I mean, let's forget about some crazy theoretical or w/e the fuck mathematicians or physicians do in labs or whatever.. nothing insanely complicated like that gets taught at undergrad levels. but seriously, (and I'm mainly just talking about undergrad stuff here...) how can something really be hard in and of itself? i really refuse to accept that something is inherently difficult... I believe that if you have basic skills necessary, aren't an idiot, and pay attention in class / study on your own... any test on any subject taught in the undergrad level should NOT be difficult. my roommate complains to me sometimes like "oh engineering is so much harder than poli sci" but that in itself seems stupid to me. people who go into engineering ENJOY doing that stuff... they've presumably taken tons of math classes, are passionate about the subject, so how can it be hard? for example... I would struggle in engineering classes because I don't have the math background, or interest enough in the subject to dedicate to learning it... the same as my roommate doesn't have the skills or interest necessary to do well in Poli Sci classes. BUT, he has the passion and skills for engineering, so it should be easy IF he legitimately puts in the effort... obviously if you half ass it or lie to yourself about your effort, something may SEEM hard, but if you honestly give it your best effort and it still seems hard, then there's something wrong with what you did. honestly, and I'm not close minded and unaccepting of admitting I am mistaken, but if anybody can provide some solid arguments on how something pre-graduate level can be extremely difficult in and of itself, I'd like to hear it.
ok, lets say we have a course in whatever subject, which is supposed to last 10 weeks. now imagine a teacher thinking "well, i think i can fit all this stuff in 5 weeks". the result? you have to work twice as hard in order to pass the course, and the test will inevitably be harder since you had less time to study for it.
the thing is that the ppl creating the courses doenst always manage to estimate the amount of work required to pass the course... this is especially the case with newer courses, which hasnt got very much student feedback yet.
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weird maybe its your school, people are usually "i had work last night i wish i had studied" or "i studied a lot but the shit just dont sink in."
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On June 13 2008 14:02 Xeris wrote:
One of the only tests I thought was legitimately hard was AP Computer Science, especially because I didn't learn jack shit in the class (and almost everyone failed the test).
COP OUT.
<3
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If I said "the test was easy" when everyone else found it hard then they look at me with a look of digust 
So I lie and say it was hard. Then I look liky even more of an asshole when I get a good result on that "hard test"
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What I hate most is when people say they didn't study and then get a real crap grade (like 4 out of 10) and shout YESS OMG I DIDNT STUDY AT ALL AND STILL GOT A 4.
Whatever, literally all those people transfered to a crappier level of education halfway of high school. (In Holland you have different levels of high school education.)
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On June 13 2008 17:51 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 17:26 glassmazarin wrote:
seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard.. ok well... can you tell me how a test can be HARD ? I mean, let's forget about some crazy theoretical or w/e the fuck mathematicians or physicians do in labs or whatever.. nothing insanely complicated like that gets taught at undergrad levels. but seriously, (and I'm mainly just talking about undergrad stuff here...) how can something really be hard in and of itself? i really refuse to accept that something is inherently difficult... I believe that if you have basic skills necessary, aren't an idiot, and pay attention in class / study on your own... any test on any subject taught in the undergrad level should NOT be difficult. my roommate complains to me sometimes like "oh engineering is so much harder than poli sci" but that in itself seems stupid to me. people who go into engineering ENJOY doing that stuff... they've presumably taken tons of math classes, are passionate about the subject, so how can it be hard? for example... I would struggle in engineering classes because I don't have the math background, or interest enough in the subject to dedicate to learning it... the same as my roommate doesn't have the skills or interest necessary to do well in Poli Sci classes. BUT, he has the passion and skills for engineering, so it should be easy IF he legitimately puts in the effort... obviously if you half ass it or lie to yourself about your effort, something may SEEM hard, but if you honestly give it your best effort and it still seems hard, then there's something wrong with what you did. honestly, and I'm not close minded and unaccepting of admitting I am mistaken, but if anybody can provide some solid arguments on how something pre-graduate level can be extremely difficult in and of itself, I'd like to hear it.
i consider a class hard if you have to work really much for it. to say that there is nothing inherently difficult as an undergrad is BS imho. i study physics and we had to do some stuff i would consider hard. you are right in that you can pass most tests well if you prepare well enough, but passing a test doesnt mean at all that you understood what you did. i.e. as an undergrad in physics you often use math you got no real clue about (there is some undergrad stuff i still dont understand(if i think about it there is little stuff i do really understand)).
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On June 13 2008 15:33 snowbird wrote:
i have my final japanese exam in one hour
OH SHIT
time for some false modesty, hope it works and i get an A
ok, so the test was very hard
(according to your theory i'll get an A now)
but actually i believe i didn't make it
god i hate kanji
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oh god
i hated physics so bad
it dropped my gpa so much t.t
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On June 13 2008 22:45 aqui wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 17:51 Xeris wrote:On June 13 2008 17:26 glassmazarin wrote:
seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard.. ok well... can you tell me how a test can be HARD ? I mean, let's forget about some crazy theoretical or w/e the fuck mathematicians or physicians do in labs or whatever.. nothing insanely complicated like that gets taught at undergrad levels. but seriously, (and I'm mainly just talking about undergrad stuff here...) how can something really be hard in and of itself? i really refuse to accept that something is inherently difficult... I believe that if you have basic skills necessary, aren't an idiot, and pay attention in class / study on your own... any test on any subject taught in the undergrad level should NOT be difficult. my roommate complains to me sometimes like "oh engineering is so much harder than poli sci" but that in itself seems stupid to me. people who go into engineering ENJOY doing that stuff... they've presumably taken tons of math classes, are passionate about the subject, so how can it be hard? for example... I would struggle in engineering classes because I don't have the math background, or interest enough in the subject to dedicate to learning it... the same as my roommate doesn't have the skills or interest necessary to do well in Poli Sci classes. BUT, he has the passion and skills for engineering, so it should be easy IF he legitimately puts in the effort... obviously if you half ass it or lie to yourself about your effort, something may SEEM hard, but if you honestly give it your best effort and it still seems hard, then there's something wrong with what you did. honestly, and I'm not close minded and unaccepting of admitting I am mistaken, but if anybody can provide some solid arguments on how something pre-graduate level can be extremely difficult in and of itself, I'd like to hear it. i consider a class hard if you have to work really much for it. to say that there is nothing inherently difficult as an undergrad is BS imho. i study physics and we had to do some stuff i would consider hard. you are right in that you can pass most tests well if you prepare well enough, but passing a test doesnt mean at all that you understood what you did. i.e. as an undergrad in physics you often use math you got no real clue about (there is some undergrad stuff i still dont understand(if i think about it there is little stuff i do really understand)).
that could be true, I honestly don't know for sure because I've never taken any real high level of physics, but you have to think.. someone taking high level physics has probably taken a bunch of high level math, and several other physics courses before. he should have the necessary background information to be able to grasp the information learned in that course, and as long as he studies enough, should be able to succeed. and again, my definition of success =/= 100%'s or anything... but a person should be able to walk out of any test thinking "I'm pretty sure I did well on that" assuming they spent a sufficient amount of time preparing.... and also realize, the amount of preparation needed to do well on exams is different for everybody... 5 hours may be enough for someone, 20 hours may be enough for another person, it's all relative.
oh and to I forgot who else... I in no way think I am a genius... I have a few friends who are geniuses and they make me look retarded in comparison. I'd say that in general, I'm probably smarter than an average person, but I am nowhere close to being a genius, I've known that for a looong time.. I wish I could understand things fully with no study time, but I realize I have to put some hours in.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On June 13 2008 17:51 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 17:26 glassmazarin wrote:
seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard.. ok well... can you tell me how a test can be HARD ? I mean, let's forget about some crazy theoretical or w/e the fuck mathematicians or physicians do in labs or whatever.. nothing insanely complicated like that gets taught at undergrad levels. but seriously, (and I'm mainly just talking about undergrad stuff here...) how can something really be hard in and of itself? i really refuse to accept that something is inherently difficult... I believe that if you have basic skills necessary, aren't an idiot, and pay attention in class / study on your own... any test on any subject taught in the undergrad level should NOT be difficult. my roommate complains to me sometimes like "oh engineering is so much harder than poli sci" but that in itself seems stupid to me. people who go into engineering ENJOY doing that stuff... they've presumably taken tons of math classes, are passionate about the subject, so how can it be hard? for example... I would struggle in engineering classes because I don't have the math background, or interest enough in the subject to dedicate to learning it... the same as my roommate doesn't have the skills or interest necessary to do well in Poli Sci classes. BUT, he has the passion and skills for engineering, so it should be easy IF he legitimately puts in the effort... obviously if you half ass it or lie to yourself about your effort, something may SEEM hard, but if you honestly give it your best effort and it still seems hard, then there's something wrong with what you did. honestly, and I'm not close minded and unaccepting of admitting I am mistaken, but if anybody can provide some solid arguments on how something pre-graduate level can be extremely difficult in and of itself, I'd like to hear it.
bio majors can pass poli sci
poli sci majors can't pass bio
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Calgary25990 Posts
lol 
degree elitism GO!
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On June 14 2008 04:29 GrandInquisitor wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 17:51 Xeris wrote:On June 13 2008 17:26 glassmazarin wrote:
seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard.. ok well... can you tell me how a test can be HARD ? I mean, let's forget about some crazy theoretical or w/e the fuck mathematicians or physicians do in labs or whatever.. nothing insanely complicated like that gets taught at undergrad levels. but seriously, (and I'm mainly just talking about undergrad stuff here...) how can something really be hard in and of itself? i really refuse to accept that something is inherently difficult... I believe that if you have basic skills necessary, aren't an idiot, and pay attention in class / study on your own... any test on any subject taught in the undergrad level should NOT be difficult. my roommate complains to me sometimes like "oh engineering is so much harder than poli sci" but that in itself seems stupid to me. people who go into engineering ENJOY doing that stuff... they've presumably taken tons of math classes, are passionate about the subject, so how can it be hard? for example... I would struggle in engineering classes because I don't have the math background, or interest enough in the subject to dedicate to learning it... the same as my roommate doesn't have the skills or interest necessary to do well in Poli Sci classes. BUT, he has the passion and skills for engineering, so it should be easy IF he legitimately puts in the effort... obviously if you half ass it or lie to yourself about your effort, something may SEEM hard, but if you honestly give it your best effort and it still seems hard, then there's something wrong with what you did. honestly, and I'm not close minded and unaccepting of admitting I am mistaken, but if anybody can provide some solid arguments on how something pre-graduate level can be extremely difficult in and of itself, I'd like to hear it. bio majors can pass poli sci poli sci majors can't pass bio
manner~
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A response to the original point:
I think one of the reasons for this "false modesty" is that people may have different standards of hard/easy and good/bad. For instance, I'm a 4.0 student. If I don't instantly know 90% of the questions on a test, then for me, that test is very very hard, in comparison to other tests I take. I'm used to knowing about 97% of all the answers right off the bat, that for me is an "easy" test.
In a similar vein, doing good/bad is relative. I consider a 90% on a test to be horrible for me. A 95% is alright, and a 100% is good. When I say "I don't think I did very well," it means I think I got around a 90%--because for me, that isn't very good.
While I agree that this acts as a defense mechanism for many people, there are those who genuinely consider "hard" or "bad" what others consider "easy" or "good."
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On June 14 2008 04:29 GrandInquisitor wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 17:51 Xeris wrote:On June 13 2008 17:26 glassmazarin wrote:
seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard.. ok well... can you tell me how a test can be HARD ? I mean, let's forget about some crazy theoretical or w/e the fuck mathematicians or physicians do in labs or whatever.. nothing insanely complicated like that gets taught at undergrad levels. but seriously, (and I'm mainly just talking about undergrad stuff here...) how can something really be hard in and of itself? i really refuse to accept that something is inherently difficult... I believe that if you have basic skills necessary, aren't an idiot, and pay attention in class / study on your own... any test on any subject taught in the undergrad level should NOT be difficult. my roommate complains to me sometimes like "oh engineering is so much harder than poli sci" but that in itself seems stupid to me. people who go into engineering ENJOY doing that stuff... they've presumably taken tons of math classes, are passionate about the subject, so how can it be hard? for example... I would struggle in engineering classes because I don't have the math background, or interest enough in the subject to dedicate to learning it... the same as my roommate doesn't have the skills or interest necessary to do well in Poli Sci classes. BUT, he has the passion and skills for engineering, so it should be easy IF he legitimately puts in the effort... obviously if you half ass it or lie to yourself about your effort, something may SEEM hard, but if you honestly give it your best effort and it still seems hard, then there's something wrong with what you did. honestly, and I'm not close minded and unaccepting of admitting I am mistaken, but if anybody can provide some solid arguments on how something pre-graduate level can be extremely difficult in and of itself, I'd like to hear it. bio majors can pass poli sci poli sci majors can't pass bio
not true.
I am a Poli Sci major - I also have a concentration in biology... and I passed every bio class I took.
I had to work harder in bio classes than in Poli Sci classes, but that's just because of my lack of background / high degree of interest in the subject... but ya, your argument isn't refuting my claim. If Poli Sci majors work hard enough, they can pass bio classes.
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Wtf, "bullshit majors"? Sounds like whining. If you were good at your own major you wouldn't care how difficult the others are.
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My pet peeve is people who can't write concisely.
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Haha, I'm usually pretty honest when I say I think I did bad. Thank god for multiple choice!
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lol multiple choice is funny ...
I coached academic decathlon at my HS last year, and one of our guys was so bad at math he actually did worse than random guessing would have gotten him.
woooooooooooooooot.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On June 14 2008 07:09 Hippopotamus wrote:
Wtf, "bullshit majors"? Sounds like whining. If you were good at your own major you wouldn't care how difficult the others are.
Applying to law school. 3.5 GPA from engineering counts less than 3.6 GPA from political science.
On June 14 2008 06:18 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2008 04:29 GrandInquisitor wrote:On June 13 2008 17:51 Xeris wrote:On June 13 2008 17:26 glassmazarin wrote:
seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard.. ok well... can you tell me how a test can be HARD ? I mean, let's forget about some crazy theoretical or w/e the fuck mathematicians or physicians do in labs or whatever.. nothing insanely complicated like that gets taught at undergrad levels. but seriously, (and I'm mainly just talking about undergrad stuff here...) how can something really be hard in and of itself? i really refuse to accept that something is inherently difficult... I believe that if you have basic skills necessary, aren't an idiot, and pay attention in class / study on your own... any test on any subject taught in the undergrad level should NOT be difficult. my roommate complains to me sometimes like "oh engineering is so much harder than poli sci" but that in itself seems stupid to me. people who go into engineering ENJOY doing that stuff... they've presumably taken tons of math classes, are passionate about the subject, so how can it be hard? for example... I would struggle in engineering classes because I don't have the math background, or interest enough in the subject to dedicate to learning it... the same as my roommate doesn't have the skills or interest necessary to do well in Poli Sci classes. BUT, he has the passion and skills for engineering, so it should be easy IF he legitimately puts in the effort... obviously if you half ass it or lie to yourself about your effort, something may SEEM hard, but if you honestly give it your best effort and it still seems hard, then there's something wrong with what you did. honestly, and I'm not close minded and unaccepting of admitting I am mistaken, but if anybody can provide some solid arguments on how something pre-graduate level can be extremely difficult in and of itself, I'd like to hear it. bio majors can pass poli sci poli sci majors can't pass bio not true. I am a Poli Sci major - I also have a concentration in biology... and I passed every bio class I took. I had to work harder in bio classes than in Poli Sci classes, but that's just because of my lack of background / high degree of interest in the subject... but ya, your argument isn't refuting my claim. If Poli Sci majors work hard enough, they can pass bio classes.
On the average. You surely must realize you are an exception. It should have been clearer that I wasn't implying every poli sci major cannot pass bio. However, the vast majority of them would do worse in biology than biology students in political science, all else being equal.
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well i'm a B student in uwloo (mid 80s roughly in % scale). i don't really study although i've started recently (went to dc library first time this term -_-) as an experiment.
my definition of hard primarily involves long tests. there's rarely a problem that i genuinely can't solve on a test but sometimes the tests are just sooooo long. USUALLY, in a 2hr midterm, if i'm reasonably confident/well prepared, i'd finish in 1hr30 and spend 30min checking over to make sure i didn't make a silly mistake/clarifying my answers, etc. this is a "standard" test-taking procedure for me (the 1:30 limit includes figuring out questions and so on)
but, recently for example i had a rather hard finance midterm
it was of such length where if you didn't instantaneously know the process of how to get the answer, you wouldn't finish. plain and simple. since i usually don't practice too much, on a lot of the tests i screw around with the theory i remember from class to come up with an algorithm to solve the question.
but here for instance, i had no time to do that. each question had to be like "oh lol its this type of question. ezpz". a friend of mine who really likes this course, knew pretty much every question, and still finished with barely 5minute to spare (no time to check over). needless to say personally i had to bullshit on 2 of the questions to fit within the time limit -_-;
to me i consider that a fairly hard test. not in terms of material, but in terms of the time constraint.
as for the "joke majors". well someone from uwloo will probably get this: i'm both a mathie and artsy and i consider arts courses way harder than math. both conceptually and in terms of actual questions. cheers mathies, enjoy your joke majors.
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Statistically PoliSci majors do less than average on the LSAT.
http://www.math.duke.edu/major/whyMajor.html
There definetly exist bullshit majors/departments, at least at UC berkeley.
"The results were clear. "The physical sciences and engineering had rigorous grading standards roughly in line with the recommendations from 1976," stated Rine, "while the humanities and social sciences in many classes had all but given up on grades below a B, and in many courses below an A-, and the biological sciences had no consistent pattern.""
http://ls.berkeley.edu/new/05/grades.html
edit: actually i don't mean to say bullshit majors. I think the majority of humanities majors are pretty respectable.
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I study extra hard every test so I can purposely get a 69 everytime :D
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Lol somebody is bitter ~~
Just ace everything and let the weaklings argue amonst themselves. Remember you yourself needs to be at the top, then everything matters little.
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On June 14 2008 09:26 UnitarySpace wrote:Statistically PoliSci majors do less than average on the LSAT. http://www.math.duke.edu/major/whyMajor.htmlThere definetly exist bullshit majors/departments, at least at UC berkeley. "The results were clear. "The physical sciences and engineering had rigorous grading standards roughly in line with the recommendations from 1976," stated Rine, "while the humanities and social sciences in many classes had all but given up on grades below a B, and in many courses below an A-, and the biological sciences had no consistent pattern."" http://ls.berkeley.edu/new/05/grades.htmledit: actually i don't mean to say bullshit majors. I think the majority of humanities majors are pretty respectable.
DOwn w/ humanity majors! Math all the way!
Llalalala
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evan you're a math at berkeley too? what year are you?
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On June 14 2008 08:08 GrandInquisitor wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2008 07:09 Hippopotamus wrote:
Wtf, "bullshit majors"? Sounds like whining. If you were good at your own major you wouldn't care how difficult the others are. Applying to law school. 3.5 GPA from engineering counts less than 3.6 GPA from political science. Show nested quote +On June 14 2008 06:18 Xeris wrote:On June 14 2008 04:29 GrandInquisitor wrote:On June 13 2008 17:51 Xeris wrote:On June 13 2008 17:26 glassmazarin wrote:
seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard.. ok well... can you tell me how a test can be HARD ? I mean, let's forget about some crazy theoretical or w/e the fuck mathematicians or physicians do in labs or whatever.. nothing insanely complicated like that gets taught at undergrad levels. but seriously, (and I'm mainly just talking about undergrad stuff here...) how can something really be hard in and of itself? i really refuse to accept that something is inherently difficult... I believe that if you have basic skills necessary, aren't an idiot, and pay attention in class / study on your own... any test on any subject taught in the undergrad level should NOT be difficult. my roommate complains to me sometimes like "oh engineering is so much harder than poli sci" but that in itself seems stupid to me. people who go into engineering ENJOY doing that stuff... they've presumably taken tons of math classes, are passionate about the subject, so how can it be hard? for example... I would struggle in engineering classes because I don't have the math background, or interest enough in the subject to dedicate to learning it... the same as my roommate doesn't have the skills or interest necessary to do well in Poli Sci classes. BUT, he has the passion and skills for engineering, so it should be easy IF he legitimately puts in the effort... obviously if you half ass it or lie to yourself about your effort, something may SEEM hard, but if you honestly give it your best effort and it still seems hard, then there's something wrong with what you did. honestly, and I'm not close minded and unaccepting of admitting I am mistaken, but if anybody can provide some solid arguments on how something pre-graduate level can be extremely difficult in and of itself, I'd like to hear it. bio majors can pass poli sci poli sci majors can't pass bio not true. I am a Poli Sci major - I also have a concentration in biology... and I passed every bio class I took. I had to work harder in bio classes than in Poli Sci classes, but that's just because of my lack of background / high degree of interest in the subject... but ya, your argument isn't refuting my claim. If Poli Sci majors work hard enough, they can pass bio classes. On the average. You surely must realize you are an exception. It should have been clearer that I wasn't implying every poli sci major cannot pass bio. However, the vast majority of them would do worse in biology than biology students in political science, all else being equal.
I don't know... I just think that testing in biology is different than testing in political science, and a lot of people who ARE poli sci majors are not comfortable with that sort of rigorous memorization that bio classes often mandate... although if they cared enough about bio to really study for it, they'd probably do well. the reason poli sci majors generally don't do well in bio classes is because mostly they take them for GE's, and don't really care enough to put in the work to get a good grade. Poli Sci classes are I guess "easier" in a sense because most of the work requires essay writing, and I know from experience (I met this girl in one of my poli sci classes who was a bio major - and her writing was HORRIBLE) that it's easier for a bio person to do well in these classes because for example, they could get a friend to help them on their essays (proof reading / editing, etc) ... while that option isn't generally available for poli sci majors taking bio classes (someone can't help you memorize facts... well, it's more difficult to help that way than it is to help someone do better on an essay).
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I did pretty well on my exams. But I didn't want to brag about it or make my classmate look bad so I was just like "i was lucky, the questions are the parts that I studied the most"
will you hate me? 
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
a column for our school paper the intro:
One of the following two problems is from the study guide for the final exam in
a Rutgers 300-level class. The other is part of homework assigned during the
second week of an introductory course. See if you can guess which is which.
An urn contains n red and m blue balls. They are withdrawn one at a time until
a total of r red balls have been withdrawn. Find the probability that a total
of k balls are withdrawn.
Which of the following statements about political thinking in adolescence is
true?
A. Adolescents are more likely to be Republicans
B. Adolescents believe in autocratic rule
C. Adolescents are not politically influenced by their living environment
D. Adolescents are likely to challenge authority and ask that laws be
reexamined.
...
Turns out the multiple choice question is from the 300-level Adolescent
Psychology final exam study guide, while the probability problem is from the
homework for Introduction to Discrete Structures II, a 200-level computer
science course.
Most of the social sciences is literally nothing more than common sense.
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Ok, but multiple choice is not social science. A harder question would be "explain why adolescents are likely to challenge authority and ask that laws be reexamined". Of course you could argue that everybody has a "common sense" notion of the answer to this as well, but not everybody can logically articulate it well enough and in fact this common sense answer itself may not necessarily be correct. Well anyone certainly could write a great response with some good essay-writing skills and good knowledge of the relevant information, but the mathematics problem can be solved just as easily having learned the mathematics needed. On average people entering the hard sciences have higher high school GPA and higher standardized test scores. The pool is already composed of the better students so it follows they will score higher on a test like LSAT as well. But of course classes for hard sciences are actually harder. That doesn't mean that social science is bullshit though.
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you don't know hard until you take an engineering class
you can love it all you want, but your teachers can still find ways to convolute problems and trick you completely
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On June 14 2008 02:16 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 22:45 aqui wrote:On June 13 2008 17:51 Xeris wrote:On June 13 2008 17:26 glassmazarin wrote:
seriously, you cant just say that there isnt hard tests.
i dont know bout you, but where i study different doctors/professors are known to have different difficulties on their tests. ofcourse there is some sort of difficulty distribution where tests out in the distribution tail is extremely hard.. ok well... can you tell me how a test can be HARD ? I mean, let's forget about some crazy theoretical or w/e the fuck mathematicians or physicians do in labs or whatever.. nothing insanely complicated like that gets taught at undergrad levels. but seriously, (and I'm mainly just talking about undergrad stuff here...) how can something really be hard in and of itself? i really refuse to accept that something is inherently difficult... I believe that if you have basic skills necessary, aren't an idiot, and pay attention in class / study on your own... any test on any subject taught in the undergrad level should NOT be difficult. my roommate complains to me sometimes like "oh engineering is so much harder than poli sci" but that in itself seems stupid to me. people who go into engineering ENJOY doing that stuff... they've presumably taken tons of math classes, are passionate about the subject, so how can it be hard? for example... I would struggle in engineering classes because I don't have the math background, or interest enough in the subject to dedicate to learning it... the same as my roommate doesn't have the skills or interest necessary to do well in Poli Sci classes. BUT, he has the passion and skills for engineering, so it should be easy IF he legitimately puts in the effort... obviously if you half ass it or lie to yourself about your effort, something may SEEM hard, but if you honestly give it your best effort and it still seems hard, then there's something wrong with what you did. honestly, and I'm not close minded and unaccepting of admitting I am mistaken, but if anybody can provide some solid arguments on how something pre-graduate level can be extremely difficult in and of itself, I'd like to hear it. i consider a class hard if you have to work really much for it. to say that there is nothing inherently difficult as an undergrad is BS imho. i study physics and we had to do some stuff i would consider hard. you are right in that you can pass most tests well if you prepare well enough, but passing a test doesnt mean at all that you understood what you did. i.e. as an undergrad in physics you often use math you got no real clue about (there is some undergrad stuff i still dont understand(if i think about it there is little stuff i do really understand)). that could be true, I honestly don't know for sure because I've never taken any real high level of physics, but you have to think.. someone taking high level physics has probably taken a bunch of high level math, and several other physics courses before. he should have the necessary background information to be able to grasp the information learned in that course, and as long as he studies enough, should be able to succeed. and again, my definition of success =/= 100%'s or anything... but a person should be able to walk out of any test thinking "I'm pretty sure I did well on that" assuming they spent a sufficient amount of time preparing.... and also realize, the amount of preparation needed to do well on exams is different for everybody... 5 hours may be enough for someone, 20 hours may be enough for another person, it's all relative. oh and to I forgot who else... I in no way think I am a genius... I have a few friends who are geniuses and they make me look retarded in comparison. I'd say that in general, I'm probably smarter than an average person, but I am nowhere close to being a genius, I've known that for a looong time.. I wish I could understand things fully with no study time, but I realize I have to put some hours in.
Dude, think for a second about what you're saying - no test can be hard, you just have to study a WHOLE LOT MORE for certain ones.
Why do you have to study more for one type of test than another?
If what you're saying is true, doesn't that apply to any test? LSAT, MCAT, IQ, etc.? Could it be that some tests aren't strictly about studying?
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I'm probably smarter than an average person
Is replacing false modesty with outright bragging really that much better?
You're so full of it lol.
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Here's an example: Person A goes to take a test and before the test he says "man I didn't study AT ALL for this test." Then afterwards he says "omg that test was so hard." Then the grade comes in and he's got an A "WHAT! wow that's so crazy, I didn't even study."
I agree so much with this point, you have no idea how much rage I feel when people pull this bullshit out of their asses.
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On June 15 2008 07:36 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:Show nested quote +Here's an example: Person A goes to take a test and before the test he says "man I didn't study AT ALL for this test." Then afterwards he says "omg that test was so hard." Then the grade comes in and he's got an A "WHAT! wow that's so crazy, I didn't even study." I agree so much with this point, you have no idea how much rage I feel when people pull this bullshit out of their asses.
I do this all the time why do you hate me its just true. Oops sorry about the bump. I was searching for a picture of  Modesty and ended up here and didn't see a warning .
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Xeris:
I do what you described. At the site of a test, when my friends ask me I always say I didn't study, and afterwards I tell people it's really hard. After I get my result back I hide it from everyone else.
False modesty is one thing. But there is another thing called jealousy. Being a show-off of academic power is even worse; you will get hated for it (this is exacerbated by the fact that most universities curve grades - so if you do really good, the prof is less likely to curve). It's much better and safer to pretend you are an idiot.
I remember one time in genetics, I got perfect on the midterm. I was the only one who managed this feast. I only told one girl about it because we were pretty close. Afterwards, however, apparently she had a conversation with another guy (neither of us knew him really well) and told him that I got perfect. She told me that he gave a really bad remark about me in front of her.
So yeah...
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On December 12 2010 11:36 Pyrrhuloxia wrote:Show nested quote +On June 15 2008 07:36 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:Here's an example: Person A goes to take a test and before the test he says "man I didn't study AT ALL for this test." Then afterwards he says "omg that test was so hard." Then the grade comes in and he's got an A "WHAT! wow that's so crazy, I didn't even study." I agree so much with this point, you have no idea how much rage I feel when people pull this bullshit out of their asses. I do this all the time why do you hate me its just true. Oops sorry about the bump. I was searching for a picture of Modesty and ended up here and didn't see a warning .
HI PYRR, well i think as with any test doing well is a function of how well you know the material. If you learn it as the class goes on you really shouldn't have to study... but for some people maybe learning requires constant reinforcement
and lol@ all the major elitism and terrible examples. People often confuse hard work with LOTS of work. At least in my experience, I mean I've taken classes from all years of the social sciences and math and they both required about the same amount of effort for me to do well or poor.
But i think social sciences get a bad rep cause so many retarded people take them cause they're more applicable to life, so it's easier for retarded people to relate to concepts that they might have already learned just by being alive.
But for the point of the topic, yes i hate false modesty. Shit is annoying when you know they're full of it
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On June 13 2008 16:03 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 15:54 Dagor wrote:
Is psychology really that easy ? When i was an biology undergrad we had courses like biopsychology together with some psychology students and while it wasn't the most difficult course i ever had you had to know quite a ,lot neurobiology for that one.
I always thought that easy subjects are more something like literature or philosophy, because you just need some brain, but don't really have to work.
Oh well, cell biochemistry finals in half an hour -_-;; None of them are really easy. Philosophy won't give you much of a work load, but your head is definitely going to hurt.
Agreed. Philosophy is not a bullshit major. It requires remarkable mental clarity and rigor of thought to do well (in a decent school, at any rate). For those to whom such things come naturally, it can be a real breeze, but if you lack the cognitive discipline, you will have notable difficulty. Plus, a philosophy major, with the right supplemental courses, can excel in almost any field because of this increased ability to just think clearly.
As for the OT- Those people annoyed the hell out of me. I was also thoroughly frustrated by people who took challenging classes and got A's just because they worked hard and not due to any natural ability for the subjects. Of course, I'm not one to talk, as I had said natural ability, but nearly failed because I am a hopeless procrastinator. >.<
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On December 12 2010 19:16 Pax wrote:Show nested quote +On June 13 2008 16:03 Jibba wrote:On June 13 2008 15:54 Dagor wrote:
Is psychology really that easy ? When i was an biology undergrad we had courses like biopsychology together with some psychology students and while it wasn't the most difficult course i ever had you had to know quite a ,lot neurobiology for that one.
I always thought that easy subjects are more something like literature or philosophy, because you just need some brain, but don't really have to work.
Oh well, cell biochemistry finals in half an hour -_-;; None of them are really easy. Philosophy won't give you much of a work load, but your head is definitely going to hurt. Agreed. Philosophy is not a bullshit major. It requires remarkable mental clarity and rigor of thought to do well (in a decent school, at any rate). For those to whom such things come naturally, it can be a real breeze, but if you lack the cognitive discipline, you will have notable difficulty. Plus, a philosophy major, with the right supplemental courses, can excel in almost any field because of this increased ability to just think clearly. As for the OT- Those people annoyed the hell out of me. I was also thoroughly frustrated by people who took challenging classes and got A's just because they worked hard and not due to any natural ability for the subjects. Of course, I'm not one to talk, as I had said natural ability, but nearly failed because I am a hopeless procrastinator. >.<
Why would you be frustrated by people who got A's by working hard? That makes no sense to me. I think it's great to work hard. Natural ability only gets you so far, and few people do well in life by coasting.
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EPT
