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Hi, im going to a lan in two days and with the ambition to place first in a wc3 tourney(need a razor diamondback ). I know nearly all players and when i played them on fun lans iIsaw that my mechanics, micro and macro were as good or better then theirs (thx 2 bw <3) and I only lost due to the fact that I have no idea how to play the different matchups (unit counters, what combinations), so i mostly played FE and powered hard.
So im asking you for help, yes you - i don't trust wc3 forums and teamliquid is just the best source for everything.
Everything.
My race is Terran Human and i would be glad if anyone could tell me the standard buils in all matchups and how to encounter stuff, im also watching replays and im gonna play about 50 games for train :D I know the very basics, like Archmage as first hero and stuff, but i just dont know any strat except this mass tower camping and tanks against ud which is pretty funny, but i would love to know an other strat, since this is quite predictable.
Yes most of us are noobs ^^
Im gonna make updates how i do in the tourney if anyone is interested :D
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Practice BW all day and it'll be a flawless victory, guaranteed. We all know being average at BW makes you pro at War3 since it's sooo much worse and we are sooo much better.
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how can i meet up with you, i can help
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Actually applying what you know from Brood War will make you much worse, believe me. You might think that you're better because you've played Brood War. That your micro, macro, and strategical decisions are far superior. But if you thought that it would only be because you're too arrogant to realize how little you actually understand about the game.
Trust me on this, I and most people I know who have had BW experience were the same way. You can't approach the two games in a similar way and expect to beat anyone above a complete nub level. You might actually have better macro, and in all honesty you should. But macro especially isn't the same in War3 as it is in BW, thus making it actually harmful to play it in the same way.
Your first mistake is assuming that you've only lost due to not knowing the matchup or the correct strategies. That's more than likely not the case, because that actually doesn't matter very much in War3 at a lower level. You also seem to have made the mistake of "powering hard", which considering you're a BW player, probably means that you did something that you really shouldn't have. Keep an eye on your supply in respect to upkeep limits, timing the breaking point is pretty important.
As far as strategy and build order goes, just watch replays for that, it's the quickest and easiest way. But pay special attention to creeping patterns and the timing at which the players do particular things, those are two really important factors that will set you apart and help you win far more than superior macro or strategical decisions will. Keep your heroes alive and make sure they level - if you aren't fighting, and you aren't healing, make sure you're creeping.
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ill play today @ 21 C.E.T or sth on europe with the nick ash.WC3TerraN
tomorrow ill paly the whole day - same nick ofc
to simulate LAN environment ill play drunk.
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Well Orlandu, I actually thought they would all beat me quite hard since they played wc3 for years - and i watched just watched some streams from time to time, but i was actually able to beat most of them 50% of the time.
I think one of my advantages is that i play quite micro orientated in sc, so i can keep up with their micro, but for example i didnt even notice that this supply limits are anyhow important :X
thx for your advice im watching some ToD replays right now, any other Human players that you could recommend?
sorry for doublepost
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Yeah if your micro is actually better than theirs, then that's going to help you a lot. It's pretty important in battles.
As for Humans, other than ToD Sky is your best bet. Those two, Infi, and TH000 are the better Humans out there. ToD and Sky are really the ones who define Human though, but be warned that there's usually a lot of towers involved with Human.
For Human your hero combination is gonna stay pretty static, for the most part you'll always want the AM first. The second hero you have a bit of choice with. MK is always a solid pick, Naga can be pretty useful, Panda is good in some situations, and BeastMaster is pretty good against Orc.
Also as I'm sure you've already figured out, Humans almost always fast creep with their militia. You don't always have to fast expand (though it's really good on some maps), but fast creeping with militia is almost always the best opening. It's just so fast and you can take down stronger creeps much sooner.
If you haven't figured it out already, Lost Temple is by far the best Human map. Terenas Stand and Echo Isles are also great for Human. Stay away from maps like Gnoll Wood and Twisted Meadows for the most part.
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So what maps would you advise me to fast expo most of the time, which not
Against what do you build the Panda and why is the beastmaster good against orc? Sorry for asking so stupid, but i just couldnt figure which tavern heros are viable.
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Hungary11300 Posts
1. Fast Expo is usually good on: Lost Temple (duh), Echo Isles
Less recommended on: Twisted Meadows, Terenas Stand, Secret Valley
Near impossible: Turtle Rock
If you want to FE also depends on the matchup, the opponent's hero choice and the map positions. The further away, the better! There are scenarios where staying tier 1 for an extended period of time puts you far behind and therefore allows your opponent to capitalize on it, for example against Undead where you might need HEAVY towers to deal with his fast Destroyers.
2. Panda vs. Beastmaster is a tricky issue. Generally it was accepted that Beastmaster is good vs Orc for two reasons: a) He uses summons and Orc is generally late with dispel / has costly dispel, so mass summons were viable against Orc for quite some time. b) The Beastmaster adds additional HP and Firepower right from when you buy him and early tier 2 is a period where you want to exploit your advantage from your casters as much as possible. If you add a Panda, you will spend some time levelling him up and equipping him, thus resulting in a slower push.
As Orc has tended to rely more and more on Spiritwalkers, Beastmaster has become a less popular choice. Therefore going with the old-fashioned Mountain King is feasible again.
You might quite often want to add a Panda when playing other humans. The Panda can force him essentially to stay mostly on Spellbreakers, giving you the chance to counter those with Knights.
Never get Panda against Undead. Against a Human, UD's staple units are Destroyers and sadly those are immune against Magic.
3. Sometimes when pushing a Nightelf, a Naga can be a wise choice. Mountainking will get burned by the DH, summon heroes are too weak to dryad dispel.
If you find this helpful, feel free to ask more.
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Right when you get your AM + 2 footies. You should be able to fast creep with 4-5 militans on a push.
I think the build order is something like Altar - Barracks - Farm - Lumber Mill - Farm. Once you got at least like 1 foot or 2 foots.
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Since your micro is good but you don't know strats, why don't you just pick one strategy that will allow you to abuse your micro and not worry to much about strategic choices? I'd suggest just going for hardcore archmage harrassment with water elementals/footmen rush every time.
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Hungary11300 Posts
If your micro is godly and you want a safe strat, go for mass rifle / caster. You dance your rifles and just push the hell out of them. Also makes the games end rather fast. Complement these units with MK / Naga.
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On March 18 2008 02:32 Aesop wrote:
If your micro is godly and you want a safe strat, go for mass rifle / caster. You dance your rifles and just push the hell out of them. Also makes the games end rather fast. Complement these units with MK / Naga.
isn't this easily countered by aoe spells?
Thx for all the help, plz more
I ll ask questions later, im first going to play a bit and try to use the bo's i saw from the th000/sky/ToD reps i dl'ed
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On March 17 2008 23:40 asel wrote:
Well Orlandu, I actually thought they would all beat me quite hard since they played wc3 for years - and i watched just watched some streams from time to time, but i was actually able to beat most of them 50% of the time.
Lol, they must suck really hard. I remember playing some guy who was pro at SC (WCG Canada rep) and was getting into War3 at the time. It took him at least a few months of training before he could beat me in WC3, and I was only an above average player at the time (nowhere near pro).
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On March 18 2008 02:51 asel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2008 02:32 Aesop wrote:
If your micro is godly and you want a safe strat, go for mass rifle / caster. You dance your rifles and just push the hell out of them. Also makes the games end rather fast. Complement these units with MK / Naga. isn't this easily countered by aoe spells? Thx for all the help, plz more I ll ask questions later, im first going to play a bit and try to use the bo's i saw from the th000/sky/ToD reps i dl'ed
If the other guy's going lots of AOE, just mix in spell breakers and buy as many healing scrolls at the shop as you can afford (especially when you're near upkeep limit). You'll be loaded anyways if you FE'd.
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Seriously, the audios here are very helpful for anyone getting into WC3. I would listen to at least a couple of them on each matchup, it will give you a good understanding of what to do.
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What caster would you recommend?
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On March 18 2008 04:39 asel wrote:
What caster would you recommend?
Klazart.
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gryphon (d.hawk) + tank powered by masstowered massexpos will beat the shit out of most of your friendly UD noobs
t2 am+bm push will beat the crap out of your nooby ORCs
play oldstyle tower rush against NE, t1 or t2 what suits best each game
against HU, just beat them with the same units they use, u play bw right?
p.s: playing drunk = +100 points
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EPT
