• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 10:23
CEST 16:23
KST 23:23
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro4 Preview: On Course10Code S Season 1 - RO8 Preview7[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Progenitors8Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun13[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt1: Inheritors16
Community News
Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !8Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple0RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event12Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results12026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers25
StarCraft 2
General
Code S Season 1 - RO8 Preview Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results
Tourneys
Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) 2026 GSL Season 2 Qualifiers Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) WardiTV Mondays
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Mutation # 525 Wheel of Misfortune The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 524 Death and Taxes Mutation # 523 Firewall
Brood War
General
ASL Tickets to Live Event Finals? [ASL21] Ro4 Preview: On Course Quality of life changes in BW that you will like ? Why there arent any 256x256 pro maps? RepMastered™: replay sharing and analyzer site
Tourneys
[ASL21] Semifinals A [BSL22] RO16 Group Stage - 02 - 10 May [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro8 Day 3
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates Muta micro map competition What's the deal with APM & what's its true value
Other Games
General Games
Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Daigo vs Menard Best of 10
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread The Letting Off Steam Thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
streaming software Strange computer issues (software) [G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
How EEG Data Can Predict Gam…
TrAiDoS
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2568 users

Free will

Blogs > JWD[9]
Post a Reply
JWD[9]
Profile Blog Joined November 2015
364 Posts
April 06 2017 15:31 GMT
#1
Now we can eat a Mc Chicken or a Crispy Chicken, both, nothing or something different.
If whichever of these options we choose, influences who we are, then we will never know whom we might had become, had we chosen differently, unless we travel back in time.
It will take two more minutes to invent timetravel, so lets take that time and think about how we made choices before it was invented. We tried to make predictions based on the models we created from past experiences. Lets keep in mind that this is all under the assumption that what we choose influences who we are.

Now we go back in time and eat both, surely not our first choice, but we just wanna know where that path will lead us. So either our model was good, and eating both is a terrible idea, or we improve our model for choice making. Eventually we end up with a model of the world that is more accurate, and better yet, if it fails we just go back in time. Now all the coices we make will be in tune with who we are and strive to be. These aren't exactly choices, these are logical steps.
So then there really ever only was one choice, wasn't there? Who are you?

There is something not accounted for in the first sentence, the something different part. What if that actually sums up infinite somethings. Now even a timemachine does not do the job of giving us the accurate model. If there isn't and can't be an accurate model, then we are left with choices we make, the intentions we had, the effects that ... well, do they affect us?

If they do, then the more time we spend living, the more we might move away from our selfs. Might, because what if, by serendipity a wrongly predicted outcome actually moves us closer to who we want to be. Is life like playing darts, trying to hit bullseye and sometimes your failures land in tripple 20?

Another assumption made was that "Who are you?" is a choice. What if it isn't? Now life becomes truly dull. Now free will and choices are nothing more than the attempt to follow your model of the world with precision.

Lets take a stand right now on wether who you are is a choice or not, before looking into the implications of a world, where the effects of the choices you make do not influence who you are. Do I care wether I chose to be who I am or just am who I am? Nope.

So, Hedonism? It does not work on a physical level, as our brain will strive to balance out happy and sad, wether we win the lottery or are an inmate on deathrow. That doesn't mean it won't work on a spiritual level, so we then are free to make whatever choice to the best of our abilities, to see if we find something fun for the immortal soul. And we get to try over and over again, maybe not as precise as we would if we had a time machine, but there is plenty room for error.

What if this is all backwards? What if life isn't about creating a good model and reasonable decisions? What if we don't know the answer to "Who are you?" and by intuitively stumbling through life instead, everything we recognize as a choice, tells us something about who we are? A timemachine would then have the most destructive effect on the psyche, as it robs us
from discovering who we are, as we would have to live with having made all the choices.

If an inaccurate model is part of the human condition, then who cares about free will, if life feels like living again if all we gotta do is stop thinking for a second?

So I guess, what I wanna tell myself, is to stop predicting the future and start discovering the past while moving forward.

ninazerg
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States7291 Posts
April 06 2017 22:44 GMT
#2
Something in our psyche, whether it be cultural or biologically innate, requires us to think we have this free range of choices, when really, the only choices we could have made are the ones we did. On top of that, we have no control over where we are born, where we live, and circumstances of existing, such as natural disasters, moments of luck, random stingray attacks, errors in the judgement of others, and microscopic viruses. Do you think one-third of the population of Europe CHOSE to die from the black plague during the Dark Ages? Maybe if they had access to soap... but alas.
"If two pregnant women get into a fist fight, it's like a mecha-battle between two unborn babies." - Fyodor Dostoevsky
FiveHundred
Profile Blog Joined April 2017
109 Posts
April 07 2017 02:04 GMT
#3
Causation may be merely opinion.

Since we do not know the formulation of causation, we cannot comment on the existence of free will from the typical philosophical perspective: determinism. Most philosophers, notably especially Daniet C. Dennett embrace a loose form of compatibilism which is essentially an acknowledgment of causation (that it exists), and that free will, whatever it is, is compatible with causation, whatever it is.

Dennett himself is seen in lecture to provide extensive background modeling including the famous "life world" modeling and several other conceptual projects which support his view that free will (as Dennett is seen to understand it) is compatible with causation (as Dennett is seen to understand it).

We do not know anything about causation, in the opinion of many enlightened philosophers. This concept began with David Hume, that we simply have insufficient knowledge of causation. Physicists, notably Brian Greene of Columbia have presented models of time wherein there is a rate of information transmission (bounded by Einstein's theories) wherein the current situation on Earth is transmitted sufficiently to the rest of the universe. We do not know what that entails, in my opinion, because it seems very opaque, from my current knowledge of the physical universe. Other planets in the universe may not be informed of our whereabouts, which creates significant confusion from the perspective of Earth. Does the physics of other places in our world adequately acknowledge the present state of Earth. To be honest, I do not think we can answer this question.

Therefore, your past is speculative from the global worldview. I would not be depressed about it.
Recipient of a divinity survey. Users can identify you by your password. A cat is a fully-explained dog.
FiveHundred
Profile Blog Joined April 2017
109 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-04-08 01:23:18
April 07 2017 22:35 GMT
#4
Your blog has been very helpful in crafting my philosophy book which is now nearing 60,000 words. Particularly, I found myself asking, "What if I could live the lives of all things cotemporaneous to my own life?" The prevailing theory is that if everything lived perfectly my life would be perfect. I don't think this entails or debunks hedonism. I don't know if it does.

Actually I found myself asking the other night whether there was much sense in the usual sado-masochism. There are some interesting esoteric physics hypotheses like "quantum immortality" and "the everett multiworld hypothesis" that seem to tie into what you've written, and I think a lot of people have written on this question. We can see there are a variety of strategies for navigating whatever terrain is presented in these ideas. But it seems not many people have a solution that they like themselves. There are obvious psychological advantages in various strategies like "depression" "mania" and similar mental functions, but it is never obvious that the functional role could not be maintained without resorting to the states of illness.
Recipient of a divinity survey. Users can identify you by your password. A cat is a fully-explained dog.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Wardi Open
12:00
#86
WardiTV1038
Rex125
Liquipedia
GSL
08:00
2026 Season 2: Qualifiers
Zoun vs CureLIVE!
IntoTheiNu 1087
CranKy Ducklings SOOP104
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
MaxPax 145
Rex 125
ProTech108
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 8505
Bisu 2563
Sea 1962
Jaedong 1942
EffOrt 1084
Horang2 924
Mini 759
ZerO 436
Hyuk 396
Larva 350
[ Show more ]
actioN 325
BeSt 302
ggaemo 300
Snow 277
Soulkey 198
Rush 184
firebathero 162
Mind 112
Mong 73
Hyun 71
HiyA 68
Sharp 62
Sea.KH 61
Pusan 56
Aegong 48
soO 41
[sc1f]eonzerg 41
Barracks 37
Killer 36
sorry 26
Movie 21
IntoTheRainbow 17
Hm[arnc] 17
SilentControl 13
Bale 7
Rock 5
Terrorterran 4
Dota 2
Gorgc4447
syndereN231
XcaliburYe191
NeuroSwarm62
Counter-Strike
fl0m2302
byalli445
Heroes of the Storm
MindelVK11
Other Games
B2W.Neo963
hiko829
Lowko357
Happy323
Hui .273
crisheroes162
ArmadaUGS125
monkeys_forever121
elazer95
Livibee61
ZerO(Twitch)13
KnowMe1
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL32693
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• LUISG 12
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 34
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis5528
• TFBlade1272
Other Games
• WagamamaTV438
Upcoming Events
Monday Night Weeklies
1h 37m
OSC
9h 37m
CranKy Ducklings
19h 37m
Afreeca Starleague
19h 37m
Light vs Flash
PiGosaur Cup
1d 9h
Replay Cast
1d 18h
Replay Cast
2 days
The PondCast
2 days
OSC
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
3 days
OSC
3 days
Korean StarCraft League
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
BSL
5 days
GSL
5 days
Cure vs TBD
TBD vs Maru
BSL
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
KK 2v2 League Season 1
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
SCTL 2026 Spring
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W7
YSL S3
Escore Tournament S2: W8
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026: Closed Qualifier
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.