|
http://www.huntingtonbeachca.gov/residents/green_city/reusable-bag-ordinance/
In March 2013, the City Council approved the Reusable Bag Ordinance, which seeks to reduce the likelihood that single-use plastic carryout bags will enter the environment and thereby improve the aesthetics of the City's beaches, parks, and other public spaces. The Ordinance prohibits the distribution of plastic carryout bags in commercial point of sale purchases within the City of Huntington Beach and establishes a 10 cent charge on the issuance of recyclable paper carryout bags at all grocery stores, supermarkets, drug stores, pharmacies, convenience stores, food marts and farmer's markets. Please see below for answers to the most common questions regarding the Reusable Bag Ordinance.
Photo of reusable bag
When does the Reusable Bag Ordinance take effect?
Implementation of the Ordinance becomes official on Friday, November 1, 2013, and affected retail stores as described below are required to comply with the provisions of the Ordinance prohibiting the distribution of single-use plastic carryout bags.
What stores must comply with the Reusable Bag Ordinance?
The following retail establishments located within the boundaries of the City of Huntington Beach that fall into any of the following categories:
The Reusable Bag Ordinance initiates a community-wide shift from the use of plastic and paper carryout bags and promotes the use of reusable bags for retail customers in Huntington Beach therefore protecting our beaches and oceans
Full-line, self-service retail: A store with gross annual sales of two million dollars ($2,000,000), or more, that sells a line of dry grocery, canned goods, or nonfood items and some perishable items (i.e. Wal-Mart, Home Depot, Target);
Large Retail Store: A store of at least ten thousand (10,000) square feet of retail space that generates sales or use tax pursuant to the Reusable Bag Ordinance and has a licensed pharmacy; or
Drug stores, pharmacies, supermarkets, grocery stores, convenience food stores, food marts, or other entities engaged in the retail sale of a limited line of goods that includes milk, bread, soda and snack foods, including those stores with a Type 20 or 21 license issued by the Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control (i.e. CVS, Walgreens, Rite Aid, Albertsons, Ralphs, Vons, 7-11 and other convenience or liquor stores).
Earlier this year they were trying to ban the firepits at the beach as well, because of pollution etc. Which was shot down because it's a big tourist money maker, amongst other things.
Couple of thoughts immediately came to mind. Namely money being the bottom line. And who lobbied for this change (which I haven't researched into yet, but would wager that it was big businesses).
I would be interested to see the change in a year's time. All the pros and cons. I bet they are about the same if not worse.
In my experience, 90% of people I know save the grocery bags for little trash cans, or random usages. Which fits very fine in the recycle, reduce, reuse methodology we were all taught growing up.
And still after then, it is disposed of into trash or recycle cans that everyone in the city has. There are even receptacles in front of almost every grocery store specifically designated for grocery bag recycle. One grocery store even has a couple benches out front made from entirely recycled grocery bags.
Stores are going to make more money off people who forget their bags or whatever. Or lines will be held up because people forgot them in the car.
Most importantly, People are not going to have the excess bags laying around their house anymore and are going to need to buy little trash bags to use for their little trash cans now. Ie; about the same amount of plastic waste and the charge is now on the consumer rather than the corporations. I think the whole thing is a fucking sham under disguise of helping the environment.
What do you guys think about stuff like this? Has anything like this happened in your city?
 
|
fire pits are a tourist attraction? what kind of post-apocalyptic fetish is that
|
On November 13 2013 10:15 Roe wrote:
fire pits are a tourist attraction? what kind of post-apocalyptic fetish is that
In orange county/southern california. Many people from inland areas make weekend trips etc here to the beach to have parties or birthdays etc. The firepits offer them a place to cook or be warm in the cold beach air into the night. Gathering around a fire is as old as time in terms of human bonding.
The concerns were first brought up from rich idiots who payed lots of money to buy expensive beach houses who don't like people coming here and trashing up their beach and having smoke billowing towards their homes all the time. They are fucking dumb for buying a house there and not expecting this imho. And these shitty people who come and trash the beach are a small cost compared to the money netted from those people coming here in the first place.
Side note, there was a riot here during the last US open which probably cost (guessing all overhead costs and damages) about 10-15 thousand dollars. This wasn't even a fraction of the money earned from all the tourists even for a couple hours. And people were making a huge deal about it, like they should ban the US open or just general bigotry towards 'non locals', '909ers', and 'IEers (inland empire)'. The ironic thing too, was that at least half of the people caught were from 714 area code, and a couple actually from HB itself.
|
plastic from coastal regions into the oceans is a huge problem.
You might laugh about it, but those plastic bags do a lot of harm.
|
as a resident of the area banning firepits is so dumb wtf that's half the reason to go to the beach
i guess HB people are gonna have to go a city over for (plastic) bags...
|
On November 13 2013 10:20 LaNague wrote:
plastic from coastal regions into the oceans is a huge problem.
You might laugh about it, but those plastic bags do a lot of harm.
I understand the huge problem of the plastic in the ocean and all the Great pacific garbage patch stuff etc. But this isn't going to do anything at all. It's just a way for big companies to deflect cost to consumers by making them pay 10c per bag, making them buy more expensive reusable bags, or charge them for small trash bags (as I mentioned most people use these bags for little trash cans).
|
Fire pits just reminds me of trailer trash/suburb kids/douches
|
On November 13 2013 10:23 Juliette wrote:
as a resident of the area banning firepits is so dumb wtf that's half the reason to go to the beach
i guess HB people are gonna have to go a city over for (plastic) bags...
Yea, It got banned in Newport beach and HB was supposed to follow suit, but I knew it wouldn't happen. NP is more snobby.
And yea that is a great point as well, people on the borders of the city are now going to take their business and taxes to the next city over instead of HB because then they don't have to worry about bags.
Also, the fact that the bags are not going to be uniform or easily accessed from cashiers/baggers is going to slow lines down a bit at the checkouts.
|
Assuming you don't recycle bags, it's probably an average of 1.25$ per visit per month per family. So let's say 15 bucks a year. Population is about 195k people, divide by 3 (avg family size) and you get 65,000 x 15$ = $975,000, which is almost a million dollars the people of HB could/would be paying instead of the companies. Not even taking into account all the 16million visitors a year, and all the small trash bag sales that will inevitably result from this
Ignoring the money thing. There are probably hundreds/thousands of bad apples that fuck up the beaches etc. and you shouldn't punish the entire population based on those fuckups. I don't think a single person I know has ever thrown a plastic bag anywhere but the trash/recycle.
And, while I agree that plastics in landfills or whatever is a problem, this is like putting a bandaid on a broken arm. The issue deeper than this surface level nonsense.
|
I live in a city that does this to at least some degree.
It's not that bad IMO. I always took in way more grocery bags than I ever used for trash. The bags would accumulate over time. Now I just use the cloth bags and I'm pretty sure my plastic bag consumption is substantially reduced overall. Yes, it costs me slightly more because I have to buy garbage bags, but I find the expense to be negligible. I don't know if this is good or bad for the stores, but I don't really care much either way.
|
On November 13 2013 10:50 Firnafth wrote:
I live in a city that does this to at least some degree.
It's not that bad IMO. I always took in way more grocery bags than I ever used for trash. The bags would accumulate over time. Now I just use the cloth bags and I'm pretty sure my plastic bag consumption is substantially reduced overall. Yes, it costs me slightly more because I have to buy garbage bags, but I find the expense to be negligible. I don't know if this is good or bad for the stores, but I don't really care much either way.
What city do you live in? How long has this been in effect?
BoT, Alternative solutions?
The city should just pay people to clean up the beaches instead; out of a tax from companies that use plastic bags in our city. I would take that job, considering that I need one at the moment.
Or better yet, which will never happen, US gov't force mandate for all companies to use biodegradable bags without passing the cost onto consumers directly.
|
I think you are vastly overestimating how many people reuse the plastic bags. If you grocery shop every week for a family of four there's no possible way you can use all those bags up. Especially when people ask for "double bags" because they don't think the bags are strong enough.
I also think you are vastly overestimating the cost savings to "big companies" who "don't want to pay for plastic bags." Your rage is misplaced.
|
Already happened in NorCal since the beginning of the year.
I always forget to bring a grocery bag with me so I end up paying an additional 20 cents. I also swear to myself that I'll remember to bring a bag the next time, which I promptly forget.
|
Nothing has happened in SoCal. They tried banning fire pits in a specific beach, can't remember which one, but they didn't go through with it.
|
Plastic bags have been obsolete in this country since 2011. As a substitute, the sell you bags in a similar plastic style, but made from corn, 100% biodegradable. Small groceries shops and small shops still use them and 90% of time they are not sold.
This substitute is of material that breaks very easily. I wish they had paper bags everywhere, american-style. I don' t care which system pollutes less, tbh, anything less would be hypercritical unless you are directly involved in creating more substainable life. I just want them paper bags
Edit: Most people (myself included) always bring a bag to shop. Anything less is disorganazation and lazyness. good shooping
|
On November 13 2013 11:18 IgnE wrote:
I think you are vastly overestimating how many people reuse the plastic bags. If you grocery shop every week for a family of four there's no possible way you can use all those bags up. Especially when people ask for "double bags" because they don't think the bags are strong enough.
I also think you are vastly overestimating the cost savings to "big companies" who "don't want to pay for plastic bags." Your rage is misplaced.
We manage to keep a stockpile of bags and I use them constantly for bathroom trashbags as well as my room. And if we ever want to give away fruit from our trees or need a bag, we got one. Most people I know, also do the same things with their bags as almost everyone has a place where they keep old grocery bags, it's almost weird if someone doesn't these days. I would say the average house has anywhere from 15-50 bags saved at any given time.
Since my estimates are close to about a million a year here (not counting visitor sales or small trash bag sales increase) in just this one city alone, imagine what the cost saved could be over the entire country if they followed suit. And I think you underestimating the bottom line for big companies. There is a documentary on wal-mart that is relevant to this. There is also a movie called 'the corporation' among numerous other documentaries (I can't remember the names right now. + Show Spoiler +One had emphasis on how shopping works economically with animations and stuff. IIRC, found on TL, pretty good.
On November 13 2013 11:29 tognix wrote:
Nothing has happened in SoCal. They tried banning fire pits in a specific beach, can't remember which one, but they didn't go through with it.
Clearly read the thread.
|
If I had to guess, this is a research project of some sort? I actually did a study about the usage and recycling of plastic bags about 4 years ago back when I was in college. I honestly cannot remember too much, but if you need some information, feel free to PM me!
As for the plastic bag ban, a lot of major cities in Eastern Asia have already banned plastic bags and grocery stores, convenient stores, drug stores, etc make you pay a fee if you need a plastic bag.
In Taipei, Taiwan, the plastic bag ban has been around for at least 5-6 years. In the beginning, I noticed a lot of people still bought the plastic bags because back then, the cloth bags were not as popular as they are now. As time went on, more and more people, mostly women because they have purses, walk around with reusable bags.
However, if you're familiar with Taiwan, there are a lot of small privately owned shops that do not really follow this rule. Mostly chain stores like Watsons, 7-11, Wellcome, and Carrefour charge for plastic bags.
I know one thing is for sure, not many places recycle plastic bags. The apartment complex that I live in recycles them, but I do not really see any plastic bag recycling bins near grocery stores, or anywhere to be honest.
I am also in Hong Kong very often and I have noticed that major chain stores also charge for plastic bags. Not sure how long the law has been around though.
|
its for the environment, not for money
|
On November 13 2013 11:41 rkshox wrote:
If I had to guess, this is a research project of some sort? I actually did a study about the usage and recycling of plastic bags about 4 years ago back when I was in college. I honestly cannot remember too much, but if you need some information, feel free to PM me!
As for the plastic bag ban, a lot of major cities in Eastern Asia have already banned plastic bags and grocery stores, convenient stores, drug stores, etc make you pay a fee if you need a plastic bag.
In Taipei, Taiwan, the plastic bag ban has been around for at least 5-6 years. In the beginning, I noticed a lot of people still bought the plastic bags because back then, the cloth bags were not as popular as they are now. As time went on, more and more people, mostly women because they have purses, walk around with reusable bags.
However, if you're familiar with Taiwan, there are a lot of small privately owned shops that do not really follow this rule. Mostly chain stores like Watsons, 7-11, Wellcome, and Carrefour charge for plastic bags.
I know one thing is for sure, not many places recycle plastic bags. The apartment complex that I live in recycles them, but I do not really see any plastic bag recycling bins near grocery stores, or anywhere to be honest.
I am also in Hong Kong very often and I have noticed that major chain stores also charge for plastic bags. Not sure how long the law has been around though.
I know in India it is/was a huge problem as well. But in USA, the system was built in place that gives incentive to companies and people for recycling. A lot of big companies actually rely on their estimated recycle as part of their budgets every year. I can't recall exactly what it was, but I remember a story where a company was doing fraudulent shit based on this idea. They would like buy all the copper salvage or something and move it around constantly to keep their monopoly and keep their product limited etc.
|
On November 13 2013 11:48 Smurfett3 wrote:
its for the environment, not for money
It's like putting a bandaid on a broken arm.
This is not the solution. It's not even a step in the right direction, it's a step away from the core issue, which is another topic entirely.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
