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On January 20 2013 07:42 Abraxas514 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2013 04:21 AKRW wrote:
After having played the game for 300 hours (which might not be a lot for everyone but for me personally that's quite a lot) i think i am finally done with the game. Why? Lets be real the game is built towards competitive play but hardly anyone does that. Most players just log on and pub. The game lacks critical features that would allow these players to transition. I know its just beta but i cant see much change towards launch. So you actually have a game that is build towards something nobody actually does and the game doesn't even try introduce these players to the COMPLETELY different competitive play.
The game suffers in multiple areas.
-Hidden MMR thus i cant see any progress. What keeps those millions in LOL engaged? The pursuit of those magical numbers (EDIT: I mean rating+the points you can spend on new heroes and skins). Some accomplishment so you don't feel that you have just wasted your time doing nothing. What incentive is there to play if you don't have a team? Items?
-Horrible reward system. You might not even get anything for a 60 min match.
-Obscure skill rating system. What does that score even mean on your profile page. Saying "This chart shows how well you play a hero relative to those at your skill level" doesn't explain anything. What do i need to do to get a higher rating with a hero? Is my GPM too low? Is it the XPM? Nobody knows.
-Games are incredibly one sided most of the time. Only 20% of the games are actually challenging. Its either your team feeds and its 5-0 for the enemy team by the 7 minute mark and you feel totally hopeless and you can only watch as the world falls apart around you or you completely dominate the enemy which isn't much fun either.
-Lack of an English only server. I cant even communicate with my team most of the time because they don't speak English, yes the game is flooded with Russians that spam the chat in their native language nonstop
-Lack of built in help to find a team. How cool would it be if when you find a great great people in a pub game you could just click a "play again" button at the end of the match and easily play with them again.
-Lack of a balanced team mode where you could sign up as for example "support" and get matched with someone that signed up as carry, mid etc.., single draft is a complete joke.
-Pub games are so different from competitive play that it doesn't prepare you for the real thing at all.
-No real punishment for those that constantly ruin the game for others. What do you get for being reported? 2 days of low priority matchmaking where you simply don't get items nor xp?! Things nobody ever cares about.
Well that's it for now. I mostly wrote this for myself so i can just come back and read it whenever i get possessed by evil spirits that force me to play fake dota in hopes of eventually transitioning to the real game which will probably never happen. I played dota for 3 years. I only discovered TDA after a year and a half but it was the greatest thing ever. Even though "newish" players were present, the rules were REALLY tough. Even saying the word "nigger" would get you banned, even if it wasn't meant "offensively". Teams played as teams, got on vent, trilaned, called missing, called runes, placed wards etc etc it was a WHOLE different game. DotA 2 will have these features eventually, but at the moment what you are experiencing is what we used to call "APEM" or ezmode agi carry time. I haven't played DotA 2 but if people are the same no matter where, pub trash will always be pub trash and the game will suck balls if that's all you can play.
Man that is not how I remember playing in TDA at all. That's where I played all my games prior to GArena. As far as I recall TDA was basically pub but just had not very many leavers since they got banned but that was about it.
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On January 20 2013 10:38 GogoKodo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2013 07:42 Abraxas514 wrote:On January 20 2013 04:21 AKRW wrote:
After having played the game for 300 hours (which might not be a lot for everyone but for me personally that's quite a lot) i think i am finally done with the game. Why? Lets be real the game is built towards competitive play but hardly anyone does that. Most players just log on and pub. The game lacks critical features that would allow these players to transition. I know its just beta but i cant see much change towards launch. So you actually have a game that is build towards something nobody actually does and the game doesn't even try introduce these players to the COMPLETELY different competitive play.
The game suffers in multiple areas.
-Hidden MMR thus i cant see any progress. What keeps those millions in LOL engaged? The pursuit of those magical numbers (EDIT: I mean rating+the points you can spend on new heroes and skins). Some accomplishment so you don't feel that you have just wasted your time doing nothing. What incentive is there to play if you don't have a team? Items?
-Horrible reward system. You might not even get anything for a 60 min match.
-Obscure skill rating system. What does that score even mean on your profile page. Saying "This chart shows how well you play a hero relative to those at your skill level" doesn't explain anything. What do i need to do to get a higher rating with a hero? Is my GPM too low? Is it the XPM? Nobody knows.
-Games are incredibly one sided most of the time. Only 20% of the games are actually challenging. Its either your team feeds and its 5-0 for the enemy team by the 7 minute mark and you feel totally hopeless and you can only watch as the world falls apart around you or you completely dominate the enemy which isn't much fun either.
-Lack of an English only server. I cant even communicate with my team most of the time because they don't speak English, yes the game is flooded with Russians that spam the chat in their native language nonstop
-Lack of built in help to find a team. How cool would it be if when you find a great great people in a pub game you could just click a "play again" button at the end of the match and easily play with them again.
-Lack of a balanced team mode where you could sign up as for example "support" and get matched with someone that signed up as carry, mid etc.., single draft is a complete joke.
-Pub games are so different from competitive play that it doesn't prepare you for the real thing at all.
-No real punishment for those that constantly ruin the game for others. What do you get for being reported? 2 days of low priority matchmaking where you simply don't get items nor xp?! Things nobody ever cares about.
Well that's it for now. I mostly wrote this for myself so i can just come back and read it whenever i get possessed by evil spirits that force me to play fake dota in hopes of eventually transitioning to the real game which will probably never happen. I played dota for 3 years. I only discovered TDA after a year and a half but it was the greatest thing ever. Even though "newish" players were present, the rules were REALLY tough. Even saying the word "nigger" would get you banned, even if it wasn't meant "offensively". Teams played as teams, got on vent, trilaned, called missing, called runes, placed wards etc etc it was a WHOLE different game. DotA 2 will have these features eventually, but at the moment what you are experiencing is what we used to call "APEM" or ezmode agi carry time. I haven't played DotA 2 but if people are the same no matter where, pub trash will always be pub trash and the game will suck balls if that's all you can play. Man that is not how I remember playing in TDA at all. That's where I played all my games prior to GArena. As far as I recall TDA was basically pub but just had not very many leavers since they got banned but that was about it.
Maybe we played at different times. I played from 2007-2009. Most of my games I hosted and had 2-3 guys in under my listchecker. The other team usually had at least 2-3 guys on a team. We mostly played SD but we played CM once that came out. I stopped playing around the time batrider was released. I started around the time the 6.xx series began.
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I can only speak from experience, and this is from many years back when we were still playing DotA in Garena.
Most players, outside the ones lucky enough to know the competitive players personally, had to play through pub games after pub games, perfecting whatever personal skill they could, while watching replay and have ideas about competitive play in mind. One day (probably) you ll get lucky and manage to show ur skill to a player that matter, and they ll bring you into the competitive scene, where you ll start your climb from the bottom.
I played pub AP DotA for about 2 years before i took part in the first Clan War Room match. But towards the end of my DotA life, i actually got to know iceiceice and furryfish, drafted w papaxiong, alanter n them, and were part of a team that was pretty decent (we never got too far, but it was fun regardless).
Anyway my point is, you probably are demanding gratification earlier than you are expected to get. And quite honestly, if 300 hours were the total amount of time you had spent in DotA, your skill are probably skill lacking anyway. Pubs is a decent place to practice personal skills, even if you don't think that. So if you are interested in competitive DotA, keep the pub games going (it used to be worse in the past, when people leave game quickly if/when they/their team got owned), your skill will hopefully improve, at which point, someone's bound to take notice of you.
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As much as I love playing Dota 2, I have to agree with you on a lot of the points you mentioned.
The thing is, when I'm just pubbing with people I don't know, I tend to not play as seriously.
When I'm playing with friends, then I play somewhat better.
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From my experience, like people already mentioned, Dota is best when you play with at least 2 friends.
I think showing the mmr or any magical number is a double edged sword. It does provide you a sense of progress (very much like the points/rank in BW ICCUP) and help you get some extra motivation other than the fun of the game, but on the flip side, people can get so hung up on maintaining their elo that they get hostile to teammates who aren't performing well and forget to have fun. This was very much the case in throneit for those who remember  Dotacash, not so much as I remember.
No reward system? Feel like you accomplished nothing when you lose a 60-70 min game? I think if you like the game, that won't matter. Yea it's a tough pill to swallow when you lose those long games, but when you win those, oh man...it feels so good.
My biggest problem with Dota 2 is that it's very hard to smurf your friends Like you have to buy another steam account, and get in a similar mmr to your friends and get lucky enough to be matched into the same game as them. In Dota 1, all you had to do is make a new account and join the game your friends hosted and go to the opposite team. THAT was THE SHIT 
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On January 20 2013 04:21 AKRW wrote:
The game suffers in multiple areas.
-Hidden MMR thus i cant see any progress. What keeps those millions in LOL engaged? The pursuit of those magical numbers (EDIT: I mean rating+the points you can spend on new heroes and skins). Some accomplishment so you don't feel that you have just wasted your time doing nothing. What incentive is there to play if you don't have a team? Items?
-Games are incredibly one sided most of the time. Only 20% of the games are actually challenging. Its either your team feeds and its 5-0 for the enemy team by the 7 minute mark and you feel totally hopeless and you can only watch as the world falls apart around you or you completely dominate the enemy which isn't much fun either.
-Lack of an English only server. I cant even communicate with my team most of the time because they don't speak English, yes the game is flooded with Russians that spam the chat in their native language nonstop
I agree with these. I've played a bit less than 100 hours and I have noticed that the MMR keeps your win/loss rate bit much 50/50. It's really onesided often, of who wins.
I miss the "English only" server. In Dota 2, wherever region (NA and europe) I play, there are always russians speaking only russian. GO PLAY in your Russia region!!
One thing you didn't mention, what I'd like Dota 2 to also have, is the surrender option. It's suffer to play till the end, even though you know you are going to lose anyway.
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On January 20 2013 17:52 Kaiol wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2013 04:21 AKRW wrote:
The game suffers in multiple areas.
-Hidden MMR thus i cant see any progress. What keeps those millions in LOL engaged? The pursuit of those magical numbers (EDIT: I mean rating+the points you can spend on new heroes and skins). Some accomplishment so you don't feel that you have just wasted your time doing nothing. What incentive is there to play if you don't have a team? Items?
-Games are incredibly one sided most of the time. Only 20% of the games are actually challenging. Its either your team feeds and its 5-0 for the enemy team by the 7 minute mark and you feel totally hopeless and you can only watch as the world falls apart around you or you completely dominate the enemy which isn't much fun either.
-Lack of an English only server. I cant even communicate with my team most of the time because they don't speak English, yes the game is flooded with Russians that spam the chat in their native language nonstop
I agree with these. I've played a bit less than 100 hours and I have noticed that the MMR keeps your win/loss rate bit much 50/50. It's really onesided often, of who wins. I miss the "English only" server. In Dota 2, wherever region (NA and europe) I play, there are always russians speaking only russian. GO PLAY in your Russia region!! One thing you didn't mention, what I'd like Dota 2 to also have, is the surrender option. It's suffer to play till the end, even though you know you are going to lose anyway.
True i forgot to mention the lack of surrender option. Which is again against Valve's mighty philosophy. There is nothing worse when the game is over and you have to wait 20 mins for the other team to finish.
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Although at points I would like a surrender system, some of the best games come from being down 2-15 or so 20 minutes in, and then edging it out late game with sick team fights.
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Croatia9527 Posts
On January 20 2013 21:45 mizU wrote:
Although at points I would like a surrender system, some of the best games come from being down 2-15 or so 20 minutes in, and then edging it out late game with sick team fights.
I can't agree more with this.
I rage so hard when my team gives up when we're losing 1-10, even though we have superior late game. It's not over until your throne is down. Some of the best games in my life were sick comebacks that would never be possible with a surrender system. I really hope Valve never introduces a surrender button.
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On January 20 2013 23:28 2Pacalypse- wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2013 21:45 mizU wrote:
Although at points I would like a surrender system, some of the best games come from being down 2-15 or so 20 minutes in, and then edging it out late game with sick team fights. I can't agree more with this. I rage so hard when my team gives up when we're losing 1-10, even though we have superior late game. It's not over until your throne is down. Some of the best games in my life were sick comebacks that would never be possible with a surrender system. I really hope Valve never introduces a surrender button.
Yes, i feel the same, but on the other hand those games are a tiny minority compared to the hours wasted in the other 90% of the games where a comeback isnt possible and it is just plain boring to play on for 20 minutes because the enemy team doesnt end it or fountain dives/hooks for 5 minutes while the creeps struggle with t4 towers.
I also have had some games where we came back from an incredible disadvantage, most notably being 2 lanes down against a furion team and then winning anyway, or having throne down to 400hp then winning anyway, but those are 2 games that i can recall right now and i dont think they outweight the time wasted by not being able to surrender.
If your team has given up and is already hiding in the jungle it doesnt matter if there is a surrender button or not, you will not have a comeback.
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On January 20 2013 06:28 AKRW wrote:Show nested quote +On January 20 2013 06:08 Kiante wrote:
but what if I want to play SD mid. do i queue as support, pick SD and walk mid? The whole point is that if you queue as support you wouldn't be able to play SD. You would have to queue as mid.
But shadow demon can be both mid and support. So can a lot of heroes.
There are very few heroes that don't fluctuate into multiple roles. Is CK going to be first of second position? Is the mirana going to be safe laning? Mid laning? Off-laning? Roaming? And so on.
This kind of system would be next to impossible to actually design well in dota2.
Nothing is going to prevent people from queueing as a 4th or 5th position and then picking something for first or second position.
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On January 20 2013 04:21 AKRW wrote:
After having played the game for 300 hours (which might not be a lot for everyone but for me personally that's quite a lot) i think i am finally done with the game. Why? Lets be real the game is built towards competitive play but hardly anyone does that. Most players just log on and pub. The game lacks critical features that would allow these players to transition. I know its just beta but i cant see much change towards launch. So you actually have a game that is build towards something nobody actually does and the game doesn't even try introduce these players to the COMPLETELY different competitive play.
The game suffers in multiple areas.
-Hidden MMR thus i cant see any progress. What keeps those millions in LOL engaged? The pursuit of those magical numbers (EDIT: I mean rating+the points you can spend on new heroes and skins). Some accomplishment so you don't feel that you have just wasted your time doing nothing. What incentive is there to play if you don't have a team? Items?
Well that's it for now. I mostly wrote this for myself so i can just come back and read it whenever i get possessed by evil spirits that force me to play fake dota in hopes of eventually transitioning to the real game which will probably never happen.
If you search your own name and then select a different skill tier ie normal, high, very high you can see where you actually rank.
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On January 20 2013 04:21 AKRW wrote:
The game suffers in multiple areas.
-Hidden MMR thus i cant see any progress. What keeps those millions in LOL engaged? The pursuit of those magical numbers (EDIT: I mean rating+the points you can spend on new heroes and skins). Some accomplishment so you don't feel that you have just wasted your time doing nothing. What incentive is there to play if you don't have a team? Items?
-Horrible reward system. You might not even get anything for a 60 min match.
-Obscure skill rating system. What does that score even mean on your profile page. Saying "This chart shows how well you play a hero relative to those at your skill level" doesn't explain anything. What do i need to do to get a higher rating with a hero? Is my GPM too low? Is it the XPM? Nobody knows.
The point of the playing is for fun, that's it. If you need rewards to keep playing then the game's probably just not for you. It would be nice to see your MMR thought, to get a sense of improvement. And the skill rating was doomed from the start, there's no way to really measure skill with a skill bar that means anything.
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Random russian noob: "mid" -> picks some mid hero
Random russian noob2: "short lane" -> picks some farmer
Deityh: I guess its time for another support long lane shit and trying to not feed there too much.
Thats why dota sucks. You cant choose what you do in game. Other people decide it for you.
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On February 26 2013 06:09 Deityh wrote:
Random russian noob: "mid" -> picks some mid hero
Random russian noob2: "short lane" -> picks some farmer
Deityh: I guess its time for another support long lane shit and trying to not feed there too much.
Thats why dota sucks. You cant choose what you do in game. Other people decide it for you.
Find some friends and work it out with them : ) Then you can do whatever you want.
And if you don't have any I'm sure you could arrange a 5pack on TL where you can choose a role you want.
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I love this game because it doesn't have summoner spells. I hated when I was jungling or something in league of legends and I would catch someone out of position about to obliterate them, to have them woosh away along with my hopes, dreams, and gold D:
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I registered for this forum just to agree with this post. What could have been an amazing game has become horrible. The only way is to completely write-off playing in pubs as idiotic twitch practice and familiarizing yourself with heros, because NOTHING has any bearing in reality when playing tourament or captain's mode.
User was temp banned for this post.
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You have to be delusional to think that you playing in a public game with the average player is going to resemble anything close to what teams of professionals that play the game for a living do against each other. NO ONE compares their work/school/minor city league sports teams with what national and world class teams - why in the world are you doing it with games? Gamers complain so often about how their esports enthusiasm isn't completely socially accepted and looked down but how could you possibly offer that kind of complaint when you're expecting professional level games when you and your other average gaming peers can't possibly even make games like that happen even if you were spoon fed that possibility? Complaining that the game is "horrible" because "idiots" in the pub games that you're a part of can't replicate what you see on streams of the highest levels of play in the world? This is just narcissism, pure and simple. Know your place.
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United States47024 Posts
The OP for this blog hasn't even posted on TL for like 6+ months. How do people find this stuff?
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On September 25 2013 06:04 TheYango wrote:
The OP for this blog hasn't even posted on TL for like 6+ months. How do people find this stuff?
Presumably by searching something along the lines of "Dota 2 sucks"
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EPT
