EPTif people are honest in their queuing then the carry/mid queues will be HUGELY higher than the support queues. which means people will queue support, and not play support. it's a pointless endeavor that creates more problems than it solves.
Why Dota 2 Sucks - Page 2
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Kiante
Australia7069 Posts
if people are honest in their queuing then the carry/mid queues will be HUGELY higher than the support queues. which means people will queue support, and not play support. it's a pointless endeavor that creates more problems than it solves. | ||
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thOr6136
Slovenia1775 Posts
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SnowfaLL
Canada730 Posts
Dota2 needs a leaderboard for MMR, otherwise you just play 100s of games for no reason, no goal in mind. | ||
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Steveling
Greece10806 Posts
As if the game is not the reward by itself. People these days. You should play wow or something, you will enjoy that, ). | ||
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KharadBanar
Austria463 Posts
I am using the word "skill" between quotes here, because MMR is a very indirect representation of the unquantifiable concept of skill. If humans have such a difficult time estimating how good they are at something, how should the game know it? Many people don't even get to play enough games for the system to gather enough data points to reliably slot them into a "skill" bracket. You are putting much trust into the game by blindly accepting a number as validation for "how good you are". As for the point of not getting to see how the performance bars are calculated: If you would see that, would you begin gaming the system? Like, say the XPM is the most important factor in that, would you just care about the XPM on your heroes to get the longest possible performance bar? If people start doing that, and other people realise it, they're not going to trust the rating as much anymore because they'd see it as exploitable. It's all a matter of statistics, and statistics will always be able to be manipulated in some way, either by the ones compiling them (Valve) or the people who actually provide the data points (the players), so don't rely on them all too much and just have fun playing the game. | ||
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
On January 20 2013 05:06 AKRW wrote: Its what surrounds a game that makes it great. Not just a waste of your life. If you seek a progressive feeling through your entertainment, then I suggest you start new hobbies where the act fulfills your time and enjoyment. | ||
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ZeaL.
United States5955 Posts
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Abraxas514
Canada475 Posts
On January 20 2013 04:21 AKRW wrote: After having played the game for 300 hours (which might not be a lot for everyone but for me personally that's quite a lot) i think i am finally done with the game. Why? Lets be real the game is built towards competitive play but hardly anyone does that. Most players just log on and pub. The game lacks critical features that would allow these players to transition. I know its just beta but i cant see much change towards launch. So you actually have a game that is build towards something nobody actually does and the game doesn't even try introduce these players to the COMPLETELY different competitive play. The game suffers in multiple areas. -Hidden MMR thus i cant see any progress. What keeps those millions in LOL engaged? The pursuit of those magical numbers (EDIT: I mean rating+the points you can spend on new heroes and skins). Some accomplishment so you don't feel that you have just wasted your time doing nothing. What incentive is there to play if you don't have a team? Items? -Horrible reward system. You might not even get anything for a 60 min match. -Obscure skill rating system. What does that score even mean on your profile page. Saying "This chart shows how well you play a hero relative to those at your skill level" doesn't explain anything. What do i need to do to get a higher rating with a hero? Is my GPM too low? Is it the XPM? Nobody knows. -Games are incredibly one sided most of the time. Only 20% of the games are actually challenging. Its either your team feeds and its 5-0 for the enemy team by the 7 minute mark and you feel totally hopeless and you can only watch as the world falls apart around you or you completely dominate the enemy which isn't much fun either. -Lack of an English only server. I cant even communicate with my team most of the time because they don't speak English, yes the game is flooded with Russians that spam the chat in their native language nonstop -Lack of built in help to find a team. How cool would it be if when you find a great great people in a pub game you could just click a "play again" button at the end of the match and easily play with them again. -Lack of a balanced team mode where you could sign up as for example "support" and get matched with someone that signed up as carry, mid etc.., single draft is a complete joke. -Pub games are so different from competitive play that it doesn't prepare you for the real thing at all. -No real punishment for those that constantly ruin the game for others. What do you get for being reported? 2 days of low priority matchmaking where you simply don't get items nor xp?! Things nobody ever cares about. Well that's it for now. I mostly wrote this for myself so i can just come back and read it whenever i get possessed by evil spirits that force me to play fake dota in hopes of eventually transitioning to the real game which will probably never happen. I played dota for 3 years. I only discovered TDA after a year and a half but it was the greatest thing ever. Even though "newish" players were present, the rules were REALLY tough. Even saying the word "nigger" would get you banned, even if it wasn't meant "offensively". Teams played as teams, got on vent, trilaned, called missing, called runes, placed wards etc etc it was a WHOLE different game. DotA 2 will have these features eventually, but at the moment what you are experiencing is what we used to call "APEM" or ezmode agi carry time. I haven't played DotA 2 but if people are the same no matter where, pub trash will always be pub trash and the game will suck balls if that's all you can play. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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Demizzle
Australia397 Posts
If that's all you're worried about then you're not actually trying to improve yourself. You're more concerned with your own appearance and your ego. DOTA 2 needs neither a leaderboard, nor an MMR. It does nothing good for LOL or HON and it won't do anything good for DOTA | ||
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Shock710
Australia6097 Posts
Also pub is pub, its random no set rules of what u can do, its just what it says it is; a public game with those u dont know, if you want the competitive feel theres CM and clan wars, you just need a bunch of friends to play with you (which is what dota is all about a team game, and now with friends you hopefully wont have people running around doing random shit) Its like you're playing 3v3 or 4v4 in sc2, and asking why doesnt my pro inspired build work!!! Well you're playing in the wrong place go to 1v1, and in dota go to CM | ||
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Daozzt
United States1263 Posts
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sorrowptoss
Canada1431 Posts
The biggest problem I see with visible MMR as it is in LoL is that people begin to play simply to raise an arbitrary number, and not for the fun of the game itself. It doesn't matter how "good" you are, MMR is just a variable the server uses to ensure that people of similar "skill" get together so the games get more close and exciting. Yes, but raising the arbitrary number, to use your words, is the fun of the game for many people. People find pleasure in different things. Most reasonably intricate games have an "arbitrary" number or a benign item(s) that technically should not provoke any fun, but are designed to keep people playing for hours just to achieve their benign goals, and that's actually part of the philosophy of game-creation and design. So in theory there isn't anything wrong with revealing that magical number, because it will keep players on the game for awhile, questing for evermore show-off-worthy numbers or items that ultimately are there to give the illusion that your hours spent on the game were not fruitless; and this belongs to the intrinsic design of, I'd say, 95% of games. People play not because the game itself as a whole is fun, but rather for specific achievements that, one way or another, make them feel better about themselves. Beating the boss stage, collecting all secret items, having 2000mmr, getting into the Grandmasters' League, winning 500 times, etc... | ||
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Abraxas514
Canada475 Posts
On January 20 2013 08:58 sorrowptoss wrote: Yes, but raising the arbitrary number, to use your words, is the fun of the game for many people. People find pleasure in different things. Most reasonably intricate games have an "arbitrary" number or a benign item(s) that technically should not provoke any fun, but are designed to keep people playing for hours just to achieve their benign goals, and that's actually part of the philosophy of game-creation and design. So in theory there isn't anything wrong with revealing that magical number, because it will keep players on the game for awhile, questing for evermore show-off-worthy numbers or items that ultimately are there to give the illusion that your hours spent on the game were not fruitless; and this belongs to the intrinsic design of, I'd say, 95% of games. People play not because the game itself as a whole is fun, but rather for specific achievements that, one way or another, make them feel better about themselves. Beating the boss stage, collecting all secret items, having 2000mmr, getting into the Grandmasters' League, winning 500 times, etc... But then you get the phenomenon of people doing whatever raises their mmr. Win a game or else. Sometimes, just like in sc2, you need to loose games in order to learn to do things. Also, the essence of DotA is playing different heroes. Why would anyone try a new hero if they are afraid to loose and drop in MMR? That's the reason why it's so stunningly hard to race swap during a league in sc2 because you end up playing people way above your level. LoL is about kill kill kill action action but DotA is more about think think clever plan. MMR e-peen numbers draw the first type of person. | ||
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SamsungStar
United States912 Posts
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Demizzle
Australia397 Posts
There are plenty of resources for people that want a more serious DOTA experience. Just because the game doesn't hold your hand while you do it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. | ||
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LaSt)ChAnCe
United States2179 Posts
On January 20 2013 05:04 AKRW wrote: No they arent they just create separate divisions.They are completely valid for me. Since this is my opinion and the way i see the game and what i think is missing. it might be different for you. You are entitled to your opinion. when you say "this is why dota 2 sucks" instead of "this is why i think dota 2 sucks" it looks more like you consider your opinion as fact than opinion | ||
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SamsungStar
United States912 Posts
On January 20 2013 09:58 Demizzle wrote: There is. It's called captain's mode. If you wanna play competitive DOTA, get a team of 5 and play some CM. There are plenty of resources for people that want a more serious DOTA experience. Just because the game doesn't hold your hand while you do it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. ...Except in CM there are still trolls who join and pick nonsense heroes.Plus, I don't have enough friends to guarantee a skilled 5-man every time I log in, especially seeing as my playtimes are erratic and dependent on when I have free time. I graduated college years ago and don't really have a rigid school/play schedule I can stick to anymore. | ||
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KharadBanar
Austria463 Posts
On January 20 2013 08:58 sorrowptoss wrote: Yes, but raising the arbitrary number, to use your words, is the fun of the game for many people. People find pleasure in different things. Most reasonably intricate games have an "arbitrary" number or a benign item(s) that technically should not provoke any fun, but are designed to keep people playing for hours just to achieve their benign goals, and that's actually part of the philosophy of game-creation and design. So in theory there isn't anything wrong with revealing that magical number, because it will keep players on the game for awhile, questing for evermore show-off-worthy numbers or items that ultimately are there to give the illusion that your hours spent on the game were not fruitless; and this belongs to the intrinsic design of, I'd say, 95% of games. People play not because the game itself as a whole is fun, but rather for specific achievements that, one way or another, make them feel better about themselves. Beating the boss stage, collecting all secret items, having 2000mmr, getting into the Grandmasters' League, winning 500 times, etc... The problem I see with that is, if you give people stats, some of them are going to feel obligated to optimise them. I know, because I have in the past, and it wasn't about fun for me. Rather it was a chore, getting an arbitrary rating up and and not actually having fun. I now know that (in hindsight), but I fear Dota could become this for many people if MMR is made visible and I do not want the game to take that step. | ||
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SnipedSoul
Canada2158 Posts
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