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Humans are complex creatures - at least to humans they are. I'm sure other animals think of us like we think of them - simple lives filled with instinctual habits while I'm stuck here thinking about how other of my species think about it.
The more complex part about humans though is their relationships with one another. The complex part however isn't THAT humans have relationships - but rather how they have them. It's basically a giant ever evolving chess game of who can manipulate the other's sub conscious the fastest. This is normal even in animals, but humans make it more difficult because they do it both directly and indirectly - basically making sure chaos happens in any relationship.
That's why people fight - Because they can't handle the chaos that is being created anymore. But where does this chaos stem from? My dad told me once that this is just how things are and how they will always be. I hate that attitude. Shouldn't we ask WHY are things this way? and HOW they got this way? And maybe ways we can change them?
The cause of this chaos is the acceptance that one must tell a lie in certain situations. There are pieces of information that you don't need to tell people because they're better off without it anyway. This has been a theme for what seems to be at least the past century. Looking at our politics and school system in the United States, it's obvious to see this idea is in full effect.
I'm here to say the opposite - Lying doesn't do anything but bad in ANY situation. The example my dad gave me was when my mom asks if something makes her butt look big. The question she is asking isn't that, and I',m not sure what question she is trying to ask, but he knows that if he answers with "yes", she is not going to be happy, so he doesn't. But is she really looking for an honest response to start with? Or is she playing a game to see how he will react? Is it ok that she masks her test with an irrelevant question made to trap him?
No, it's not ok. It's not ok for people to not tell you something because they don't think you can handle it. I don't care who you are - that's not really up to you to decide. My friend Daniel and I had this conversation about how people talk to children. It seemed to us that some people think you should talk to children even at the age of 5 like their a child and don't understand. However, my sister speaks to her children like they're adults and they act like they're adults for the most part. They're not really crazy, and I have conversations with them. They're 4 and 2 years old.
With honesty will come truth, and with truth will come happiness. Acceptance is part of life, but make sure you're accepting reality. Be someone's friend. Don't judge beliefs, but judge character.
P.S.
Not really sure why I wrote this blog. This idea has been bugging me for a long time so I wanted to get it out I guess.
 
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I wish people had not tried to shield me from the truth when I was young. I talk to kids like i talk to everyone. I wish i was a little better at being kidd-ish.
I think this piece is a bit unspecific. When do we lie to potential lovers? I try to be honest.
I think if someone asks how something looks good, they want honesty. They want honest reassurance from someone who is looking out for them. They want to know you want them to look as good as they can, but they don't want someone who is going to let them descend into a lie about who they are.
Sometimes i can build love on a a lie from my own mind. Yes the love feels good at the start but it crumbles so quickly once the lie is exposed. It still feels worth it though.."love is crazy and stupid, but we just keep doing it. I think most of us need the (metaphorical) eggs" - woody allen (paraphrase)
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It calls for a certain balance, and I posited it earlier this month to someone:
Do you want someone/friends who is/are supportive but dishonest, or unsupportive and honest? (And yes, there are situations in which someone can be supportive and honest, etc.., doesn't illustrate the point I was/am making)
People will fall on either side, and they'll come to realize that they kind of have to draw a line where they can surround themselves with certain people, and be able to go to those certain people who can give them what they need at any given time. There are those that need a mental pick-me-up in the face of opposing facts, and those that have been led astray that really need things laid out for them to see.
Personally, I would abhor anyone who is dishonestly supportive of something I'm doing or thinking; I'll always take honesty first and foremost. But that's just me.
As for more on topic stuff related to what you wrote. I don't necessarily disagree with asking the "why" part, but I challenge the notion that we should accept this illusion of change that we think we possess. I think as a species, we probably give ourselves far too much credit.
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On November 21 2012 02:28 divito wrote:
It calls for a certain balance, and I posited it earlier this month to someone:
Do you want someone/friends who is/are supportive but dishonest, or unsupportive and honest? (And yes, there are situations in which someone can be supportive and honest, etc.., doesn't illustrate the point I was/am making)
People will fall on either side, and they'll come to realize that they kind of have to draw a line where they can surround themselves with certain people, and be able to go to those certain people who can give them what they need at any given time. There are those that need a mental pick-me-up in the face of opposing facts, and those that have been led astray that really need things laid out for them to see.
Personally, I would abhor anyone who is dishonestly supportive of something I'm doing or thinking; I'll always take honesty first and foremost. But that's just me.
As for more on topic stuff related to what you wrote. I don't necessarily disagree with asking the "why" part, but I challenge the notion that we should accept this notion and illusion of change that we think we possess. I think as a species, we probably give ourselves far too much credit.
I disagree. Humans have literally changed how not only they but every other animal lives on this planet. Well, at least the ones we come into contact with, and whether or not that was for better or worse is debatable, but humans have the power to change quite a bit. They have and they will - it's just a matter of who and when.
If you're going to ask someone a question, I would hope you want their honest opinion and not one made to make you feel better. If I suck at basketball, I want my friends to tell me I suck - not that I'm pretty good. If I'm not good, then say it. The truth hurts but it also heals.
Under no circumstances do I see it being beneficial for either party when one of them is lying - regardless of intention.
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If you're not prepared to lie, then prepare to be alone.
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The more you grow older the more you realize this world is really messed up and relationships are 90% social games.
Lying is a big part of the game, of course you need to be smart when lying or dodging questions.
Women mostly use words to transfer/share emotions.
Men in my opinion more use it to transfer knowledge and information.
Both use words to manpulate: creating positive/negative emotions at will, decieving by providing false informations.
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Because, humans especially, have a hard time facing their own reality.
That is why social games exist. Because the world would be far too cruel a place with we were faced with what most people truly are.
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we have grown beyond the basic desires of food, shelter, and sex. Our wishes, desires, and interests have become far more complicated than any other organism in this world. With these different interests comes conflinct, because how can you ever get along with someone that has desires that are in conflict with yours? On a large scale thats how wars start, and on a smaller scale it's how relationships can become more difficult. Especially when you combine that with regular people's inability to compromise and communicate.
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On November 21 2012 01:47 hoby2000 wrote:
Humans are complex creatures - at least to humans they are. I'm sure other animals think of us like we think of them - simple lives filled with instinctual habits while I'm stuck here thinking about how other of my species think about it.
The more complex part about humans though is their relationships with one another. The complex part however isn't THAT humans have relationships - but rather how they have them. It's basically a giant ever evolving chess game of who can manipulate the other's sub conscious the fastest. This is normal even in animals, but humans make it more difficult because they do it both directly and indirectly - basically making sure chaos happens in any relationship.
That's why people fight - Because they can't handle the chaos that is being created anymore. But where does this chaos stem from? My dad told me once that this is just how things are and how they will always be. I hate that attitude. Shouldn't we ask WHY are things this way? and HOW they got this way? And maybe ways we can change them?
The cause of this chaos is the acceptance that one must tell a lie in certain situations. There are pieces of information that you don't need to tell people because they're better off without it anyway. This has been a theme for what seems to be at least the past century. Looking at our politics and school system in the United States, it's obvious to see this idea is in full effect.
I'm here to say the opposite - Lying doesn't do anything but bad in ANY situation. The example my dad gave me was when my mom asks if something makes her butt look big. The question she is asking isn't that, and I',m not sure what question she is trying to ask, but he knows that if he answers with "yes", she is not going to be happy, so he doesn't. But is she really looking for an honest response to start with? Or is she playing a game to see how he will react? Is it ok that she masks her test with an irrelevant question made to trap him?
No, it's not ok. It's not ok for people to not tell you something because they don't think you can handle it. I don't care who you are - that's not really up to you to decide. My friend Daniel and I had this conversation about how people talk to children. It seemed to us that some people think you should talk to children even at the age of 5 like their a child and don't understand. However, my sister speaks to her children like they're adults and they act like they're adults for the most part. They're not really crazy, and I have conversations with them. They're 4 and 2 years old.
With honesty will come truth, and with truth will come happiness. Acceptance is part of life, but make sure you're accepting reality. Be someone's friend. Don't judge beliefs, but judge character.
P.S.
Not really sure why I wrote this blog. This idea has been bugging me for a long time so I wanted to get it out I guess.
Umm I disagree. Classic example in philosophy: Your hiding jews in the cellar/attic in the Third Reich. The SS knocks at your door and asks you if your hiding any jews/know their whereabouts. You gotta be pretty hardcore to think lying is worse than telling the truth in this case.
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Yeah! Why don't we change all the rules and make things simpler! That ought to get rid of all the drama. Right?
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Curse of intelligence = ).
Wait for strong AI, then talk to machines instead.
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On November 21 2012 02:35 Fumanchu wrote:
If you're not prepared to lie, then prepare to be alone.
I don't lie to my friends or family. I'm not alone.
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How do you know the subconscious is indirectly manipulated by other people? How do you even manipulate someone elses subconscious if ypu cant even control your own?
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EPT
