• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 20:58
CEST 02:58
KST 09:58
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915Serral wins Maestros of the Game 244ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3
Community News
New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery!27Weekly Cups (August 17-23): Zerg dominate the week4Weekly Cups (August 10-16): SHIN doubles2GSTL Returns in 2026!45Weekly Cups (Aug 3-9): Protoss get shut out7
StarCraft 2
General
How would you feel about frequent/monthly balance patches for SC2? Starcraft2 player guess game is Coming~! Weekly Cups (August 17-23): Zerg dominate the week SC4ALL II: SC2 Player Announcement 6/8 - Maru PhD study /w SC2 - help with a survey!
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament 2026 GSTL Announcement IntoTheTV X SOOP SC2 League : Weekly & Monthly PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August) WORTEX 2026 - Hungarian SC2 Finals Budapest
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 540 Dodge This The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 539 Thunder Dome Mutation # 538 Media Blackout
Brood War
General
New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery! [ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call Farewell Beloved Starcraft (Youtube Videos) BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro24 Group E [ASL22] Ro24 Group F [ASL22] Ro24 Group D Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft Replay Review Process - What do you do? Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Anyone here play Quakeworld back in the day? Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Dating: How's your luck? Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The Creator Fan Club MarineLorD Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
Young Players Exit Esports E…
TrAiDoS
LOCKPICKING NOOB
LUCKY_NOOB
Cathedral Of CS And NY pizza a…
FuDDx
Please support my new stand…
Peanutsc
Hello guys!
LIN1s
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 4100 users

Recommendations for Future BroodWar StarLeagues - Page 2

Blogs > ninazerg
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
YPang
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
United States4024 Posts
August 03 2012 15:22 GMT
#21
On August 03 2012 13:15 ninazerg wrote:

After 10 minutes:

- Protoss will have a difficult time securing bases; the "normal" third base with gas is completely open on all sides for vulture harassment, which makes it difficult to defend. Taking a fourth gas is even more problematic, because the distance of the fourth base from the other bases make it easy to isolate and kill for the Terran player.

- The map's layout is deceptive. It looks "wide open", which typically favors Protoss armies during engagements, but there are a lot of narrow chokes at the bridges and entrances, which means the Terran player can secure a bridge area pretty easily, and take their third base.

- I would say the best option for Protoss to open is with 2-Base Arbiter with 4-6 gateways before expanding to get some map control, because the vultures are very annoying when they're free to use all the roundabout routes to hit that exposed Protoss third base. This also threatens the Terran with a recall, however, being forced to go 2-Base Arbiter doesn't exactly make a map flexible in terms of strategy.

- Those cliffs, dude.


Protoss also faces similar problems against Zerg, but with the added threat of massive drops in their main. I'm not saying the map is unplayable, but it's not very practical for modern play.

It's not as obvious as it looks,

When protoss getting 3rd base is a huge factor, when toss gets it early it's because they know that terran is going to get their 3rd base fast too and camp till 200 before moving out. As a result terran will not have many vultures, they might only harrass with 3-4 vults at a time which doesn't make it too hard to get a 3rd. If toss doesn't scout that terran is going to camp, but instead with 5-6 factories waiting to push out, toss will not get 3rd as easily and will get about 6-8 gateways with shuttle with zealots before getting their 3rd, and as a result, if terran deicdes to harrass they'll be losing vulture count which will defeats the purpose of his main timing push.

The small chokes do favor terran if the protoss is dumb and decides to engage at such spots. But most competent protoss will know not to engage terran at those spots. They will go around the map and hit their 3rd while terran is just moving out. They will play hit and run until they get 4-5 bases with massive gateways before attempting to engage. The map layout isn't usually an issue. Plus those small chokes makes statis a bitch, oh and recall.

Most maps makes does allow an fairly easy 3rd base, but in late games the accessibility of the 4th base is a MAJOR factor of game outcomes. The 4th base is definitly not as easy to get for terran, because of the map layout and the bridges.

I beileve tau is a fairly balanced map in terms of TvP, but it is out-dated but not imbalanced. I think it favors terran slightly in TvZ but that's a different story.
sMi.Gladstone | BW: B high| SC2: gold T_T
ninazerg
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States7291 Posts
August 03 2012 19:50 GMT
#22
On August 04 2012 00:22 YPang wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 03 2012 13:15 ninazerg wrote:

After 10 minutes:

- Protoss will have a difficult time securing bases; the "normal" third base with gas is completely open on all sides for vulture harassment, which makes it difficult to defend. Taking a fourth gas is even more problematic, because the distance of the fourth base from the other bases make it easy to isolate and kill for the Terran player.

- The map's layout is deceptive. It looks "wide open", which typically favors Protoss armies during engagements, but there are a lot of narrow chokes at the bridges and entrances, which means the Terran player can secure a bridge area pretty easily, and take their third base.

- I would say the best option for Protoss to open is with 2-Base Arbiter with 4-6 gateways before expanding to get some map control, because the vultures are very annoying when they're free to use all the roundabout routes to hit that exposed Protoss third base. This also threatens the Terran with a recall, however, being forced to go 2-Base Arbiter doesn't exactly make a map flexible in terms of strategy.

- Those cliffs, dude.


Protoss also faces similar problems against Zerg, but with the added threat of massive drops in their main. I'm not saying the map is unplayable, but it's not very practical for modern play.

It's not as obvious as it looks,

When protoss getting 3rd base is a huge factor, when toss gets it early it's because they know that terran is going to get their 3rd base fast too and camp till 200 before moving out. As a result terran will not have many vultures, they might only harrass with 3-4 vults at a time which doesn't make it too hard to get a 3rd. If toss doesn't scout that terran is going to camp, but instead with 5-6 factories waiting to push out, toss will not get 3rd as easily and will get about 6-8 gateways with shuttle with zealots before getting their 3rd, and as a result, if terran deicdes to harrass they'll be losing vulture count which will defeats the purpose of his main timing push.

The small chokes do favor terran if the protoss is dumb and decides to engage at such spots. But most competent protoss will know not to engage terran at those spots. They will go around the map and hit their 3rd while terran is just moving out. They will play hit and run until they get 4-5 bases with massive gateways before attempting to engage. The map layout isn't usually an issue. Plus those small chokes makes statis a bitch, oh and recall.

Most maps makes does allow an fairly easy 3rd base, but in late games the accessibility of the 4th base is a MAJOR factor of game outcomes. The 4th base is definitly not as easy to get for terran, because of the map layout and the bridges.

I beileve tau is a fairly balanced map in terms of TvP, but it is out-dated but not imbalanced. I think it favors terran slightly in TvZ but that's a different story.


I see what you're saying, but I'm saying that while the Terran player is piling up tanks to build a maxed-out army on three bases, they can afford to lose some vultures, because it's the tank numbers that take so long to build up. Vultures will be built and regenerated quickly if they are lost, but I think anyone with decent vulture control would be able to exploit the hell out of this map, putting the Protoss badly behind in production.
"If two pregnant women get into a fist fight, it's like a mecha-battle between two unborn babies." - Fyodor Dostoevsky
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
2026 GSTL: Main Stage Day 2
CranKy Ducklings113
Discussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ProTech137
RuFF_SC2 61
EnDerr 6
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 2984
GuemChi 2024
Artosis 697
Light 62
firebathero 0
Dota 2
monkeys_forever347
NeuroSwarm179
LuMiX1
League of Legends
Doublelift4834
C9.Mang0281
Counter-Strike
minikerr101
taco 73
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox385
Mew2King143
Other Games
Day[9].tv1474
shahzam758
Livibee134
ViBE107
Maynarde72
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV37
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 96
• davetesta26
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota2983
League of Legends
• Stunt274
Other Games
• Day9tv1474
• imaqtpie1252
• Scarra903
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
9h 3m
Replay Cast
23h 3m
Escore
1d 9h
IntoTheTV X SOOP
1d 10h
Korean StarCraft League
2 days
GSL
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
WardiTV Weekly
3 days
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
[ Show More ]
GSL
5 days
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 22: Qualifier 1
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
META DYMY #4

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL Season 22: Qualifier 2
RSL Revival: Season 6
Light Tournament 2026
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
Esports World Cup 2026: LCQ
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026

Upcoming

BSL 2026 LAN: Kraków
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - TRS
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Acropolis #5 - GSB
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Calamity Invitational
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.