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EDIT: FEW WEEKS LATER (JUSTICE IS DONE)
It turns out this specific female teacher isn't just doing this shit to me. She not only gives people who she dislikes BAD marks, but gives suck ups GOOD MARKS (for example, someone was sick, gave him a 10/10 for not doing anything).
So she got in shit cause when the upper staff had to supervise the report writings, they saw all the inconsistencies with her markings regarding her students, then one day she came into class all quiet and calm, (which is unlike her), and she RE handed out essays, I went from a 6.5 to a 9.5. (a crossed out 6.5, then a 9.5 beside it) as well as 2 or 3 other students.
It's an Internet post, not an essay KK? I know it's not grammaticality correct! OK?
Hey TL, I really need some more opinion before I really just accept the fact that my English teacher is failing me because she does not like me and is bias is some way. So this year, I got a really ABSTRACT English teacher who runs philosophy club. She likes to make things complicated and philosophical resulting in wasting time debating random crap. Like e.g Why are the chairs BLUE? Half lesson wasted by her ranting. I have to say, I do not respect her as much as my other teachers and I know it's really disrespectful to tell a teacher how to teach, but I will say IMO she is really unprofessional. So yeah, people show her disrespect, especially me always pushing her buttons and talking back. Now, English is one of my good subjects, I'm naturally good at it. In the previous year I got a 9/10 on my report card, with all my essays and presentations 8.5 ATLEAST. I also do English tuition outside of school on weekends. I admit I do not put in 100% effort into my assignments this year because our teacher is really unprofessional and changes the assignment halfway from when she assigned it to when it is due! I don't see how I can fail year 9 English, but can do well in year 10 English!
I do decent work, but yet she marks my rubrics sheets for assignments as if it was a bingo game giving me 3/5 and 4/5 and 2/5 etc. She takes off marks as if she just feels
like it. Resulting in 6.5 / 10's for assessment tasks!
My work style is, K.I.S.S Keep It Simple Shitface. I don't get a thesaurus and add these big words that I just realised existed. I don't take 15 minutes to add this flashy picture onto my work. I use a blue pen and write. I don't talk super loudly so the teacher "overhears" how much effort I put into my work when I hand it in. I do NOT suck up.
Is it RIGHT for teachers to mark students based on effort and attitude? Like, if you put in a lot of effort and do a crummy job you get a 8.5/10. You put in a limited amount of effort and do a high standard piece of work and get a 6.5 because your potential isn't YOUR maximum potential. I would like to see her mark the class's work without names on the work.
"So how about you put more effort into assignments?"... Well. I have now, I put in 100% effort in my last essay, I'm yet to get my results back. But that's not the point. s it RIGHT for teachers to mark students based on effort and attitude? I.E, tell everyone not to put the names on each persons work, let her corrected him then compare it to if we did put our names on our work.
Has this sort of thing happened to anyone before? Is it right for teachers to mark down work because of effort and you as a person? Should I talk to someone about this?
EDIT: Look I know I might sound a little cocky about my work. I'm not saying I am the English God. But 6.5 Is not me.
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teachers can be heavily biased and I took it badly in high school. I was joking with one of my friends saying some racist jokes BETWEEN us and he overheard us. He left a comment and I told him we were joking but from that day onwards my grades were F-C, when previously I was always in the A (minus) - B score. I almost failed my last year English because of that asshole. Oh btw I actually sucked up to him at the end of the year because he was literally going to fail me and pull be back a whole year just because he thought I was racist. 1st time and only time I will suck up (hopefully..)
so yes teachers are biased a lot of the time but not always. Sometimes its just the student
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Have you considered the idea that maybe your work isn't as good as you think it is?
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Deal with it, you need to learn how to manage different people, in the following years you'll have bosses that you hate, co-workers that you hate and so on, deal with it.
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You should probably talk to her. This will probably clear up any confusion.
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On May 11 2012 18:31 chaokel wrote:
Have you considered the idea that maybe your work isn't as good as you think it is?
EDIT: Look I know I might sound a little cocky about my work. But I can honestly tell you that I'm not saying I am the English God. But 6.5 Is not me.
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How about you put more effort into assingments?
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On May 11 2012 18:33 kzdanze wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 18:31 chaokel wrote:
Have you considered the idea that maybe your work isn't as good as you think it is?
EDIT: Look I know I might sound a little cocky about my work. But I can honestly tell you that I'm not saying I am the English God. But 6.5 Is not me.
Then why don't you take it up with yours school councilor? I find it hard to believe a teacher would purposefully fail you. There is no doubt everyone is biased, but ruining someone's future is another thing.
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At my university you have the right to get another teacher to decide your grade if you feel that you have gotten the wrong grade due to bias and such, talk with someone in charge to find out if this is the case for you too.
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Attitude will always be factored in in life when your work is evaluated (in this case, your teacher grading your stuff). You may be a decent pupil but judging from what you've said about your own behaviour (being disrespectful, talking back, provoking her) - and that's just your side of the story! - it's no wonder your grades reflect your attitude.
Respect goes a long way; have you actually tried a constructive dialogue with her before ranting? Chances are you haven't. Do realize that this teacher's universe doesn't revolve around you. You're just one of many pupils for her (and an annoying one at that, it seems) and there's no way she can deduce all your fantastic english skills when all you do is bitch and make life hard for her.
Take the first step, talk to her. Be polite about it. Maybe even admit that you haven't exactly shown your best behaviour.
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If you are sure, you could go to some higher authority with your problem. Ask another teacher to mark the assignments without names, and see if they come out with similar results.
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first lesson on how there is no justice in the world my friend.
want to make it big? cut corners, rort people, abuse loop holes.
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For starters, go to another teacher (an old teacher you respect?) and ask them to give an opinion. If they say it is only worth anything from 8 or below... Well, those few marks can be "Marker's discretion". Bad luck, but that's English for you.
You could try and put in effort, stop being a smartass in class and see if you suddenly get a better mark. Probably the best solution for everyone involved. You shouldn't disrespect someone because you don't like the way they go about their job. Give them a chance, and at worst you are only stuck in it for a year.
Or, and this is probably what you should really try, is go and talk to your teacher. Explain any issues you have with her marking/teaching, politely, and ask what you could do to improve.
Really though, if you are going to screw around in her class, you deserve crap marks. It isn't hard to just keep your mouth shut if you disagree with something, or have a productive discussion without being disrespectful (which is how you come across to me).
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OP, don't take this the wrong way, but your post is not particularly well written, and not really supported by any evidence. Just because you used to get good marks does not mean that you will continue to get them.
Officially complaining that a teacher is biased against you is pretty difficult to prove I think. The teacher will be able to pull out your assignments / tasks etc and point out why you got the marks you got. How are you going to argue your point that because you behave poorly and push her buttons that she is treating you badly back? It does not sound like a good idea to me.
Off Topic to sekritzzz:
+ Show Spoiler +
It's good to see that the lesson you took away was not to tell racist jokes becuase people might think you're a racist, but to suck up to the teacher instead. :-)
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you're beginning to learn now that as you grow older people become much more biased. it is a fact of life and you have to learn to manipulate their bias or stay out of the crosshairs if you want to do well.
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How many else she failing in the class? That's your start.
The better course of action is not showing her disrespect, and uniting with others in your class that understand she is more given to rants than teaching, and brings it up with her supervision and perhaps collaborating with parents to realize it is serious. What you don't do is slack of giving less than 100% to give her ammo that you're disruptive and a bad student. You're convoluting a matter with your actions. She may have had good reason to give a 3/5 or 4/5 on work, and you're just construing the difference given your perception of her dislike towards you.
~~Probably better in Blogs regardless, given your extreme emotion in the matter at hand, and relative unimportance of what place teachers can give for disrespectful attitudes and the rest in the classroom in grades.
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It's not too smart to talk back in class against a teacher who controls your grades. If you dislike her teaching fine, but don't challenge her in class. If you really feel she is doing a crap job, talk to someone above her with a neutral, official complaint and ask if they can keep it anonymous. Nothing more you can do really. I'd take this as a life lesson, sometimes the wrong people have certain power, but if it's not too big of a deal don't fight that person in public.
I'm not saying it's okay to ignore retarted people with some power, just be more strategic about it. Right now the damage has been done, so damage control (talk with her about the issue or something) seems like a good option. I mean, do you really think she will change her ways because of your opinion? Probably not and combined with the fact this is a temporary problem for you, just let it go.
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Uh...have you tried talking to the teacher about it? Asking for examples of what they consider better work?
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On May 11 2012 18:40 DR.Ham wrote:
Officially complaining that a teacher is biased against you is pretty difficult to prove I think. The teacher will be able to pull out your assignments / tasks etc and point out why you got the marks you got. How are you going to argue your point that because you behave poorly and push her buttons that she is treating you badly back? It does not sound like a good idea to me.
Why would that be hard? Just let another teacher put his/her grades on the same assignments and see if they are the same.
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This happen to everybody and will happen all the time for the rest of your life. Further in your life, you will have many professor, you will have many boss and many superior who will have a duty to judge your performance on something. you might get along with them well or might not but not all of them will be the person you expected to be. Learn to deal with it.
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Well, no offence intended, but your writing in this thread isn't perfect.
That aside, you sound a lot like me in high school. English is philosophical. It's like art - completly subjective.
Your best bet is to think about what your teacher wants (or as above, ask for more feedback directly), and write that. If you're as good as you say, it shouldn't be a problem.
Secondly, getting 6.5/10 (or even 65% overall) in year 10 English means nothing. Literally. Nothing. Even if it was year 12 so it counted for your UAI (or equalivent), there are always ways to do what you want after school without getting 85 in English.
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Have you considered asking here what you should do better?
Some teachers just judge "diffrent", especially when it comes to essays. There is the (kinda big) possibility that she isn't doing it on purpose. You two are obviously not "on the same page" why should this suddenly be different when judging an essay?
My essays marks during school ranged from "very good" to "sufficient" depending on the teacher, whiteout myself getting much better or worse... But i didn't give a fuck because.. sufficent is sufficent ^^.
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On May 11 2012 18:40 DR.Ham wrote:
OP, don't take this the wrong way, but your post is not particularly well written.
I was going to say the same thing. Perhaps you really need to re-evaluate your abilities.
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I ran into this crap a lot at school, I swear to you, Me and about 20 others had to go to summer school because of my 9th grade Math teacher, what an incompetent b*tch. One of the very few times it was all on the Teacher, I'll skip the Daddy act cause I'm assuming this is also the case with you.
Do you have guidance counselors? deans? See if what she is doing is actually allowed, or if they have no problem with her doing that. If it is ok, or they don't have any problem with what she is doing, see if you can transfer to another class/teacher if thats even possible. If not, I hate to say it but you're screwed, lol, your best bet will then be to do the best you can, and try to get on her good side, if shes knocking points for bias, shell give them for bias. Play her game, fuck it, its your grades, sometimes you have to go along.
I had to do my first year of summer school in my Life because of her (she was fired the year after, my luck). Can't always have it easy, life is not fair, lol.
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Hey,
I think that's a very interesting subject on education you're bringing here. I've always been quite a lazy student in high school. I was lucky enough to receive some kind of privileged education and a good access to cultural stuff from my family, therefore school was a bit easier to me and I never felt like putting much effort into it since I could always get decent grades (I'm talking basic decent like 13/20 or 14/20 [French grading system]) doing almost nothing. However I was a curious student, and would ask many questions so teachers would kinda like me for that. During one of my last years I talked with my maths teacher (which I knew well at that point) and she explained me I was basically the most annoying kind of student she could ever get. The kind you can't really blame for anything since the grades are decent, but the kind you also want to slap in the face so hard because you know they could do better if only they put a little more work to it.
Know my personal opinion is that a teacher should just grade each students regardless of who they are and of what they could potentially achieve. This is the fairest way to do things obviously.
HOWEVER, I must admit that grading a student based on his potential is a very good way to help him/her achieve more and get better. Problem being that it can also lead to the kind of bias you're talking about when a teacher starts giving you lower grades based on things that have nothing to do with education (how you behave in class, what your mom told her during the last parent-teacher reunion ....).
This is the kind of debate that's be running for years in many countries, should the educational system help kids/young people reach a certain level of knowledge (grades based on same things for everyone) or should it just help them become better (grades based more on students potential)?
Both of these visions have their problems and advantages. How should teachers spend the same amount of time with each student when some require more attention than others? How impartial can they be when it comes to grading considering they are free to grade based on potential?
I think the best answer most educational systems have for that is private school / public schools. Public schools will tend to be more fair when private schools will tend to help children get better than what they currently are. Now I know what I just said can seem awful to some people: "OMG you're so cruel, so poorer people that can't afford private school should just reach the average level and can't get better". Well as cruel as it may seem it's at the moment the "best" way to do things IMO (but we could definitely use a better one ...).
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United States43810 Posts
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On May 11 2012 18:41 pZu wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 18:40 DR.Ham wrote:
Officially complaining that a teacher is biased against you is pretty difficult to prove I think. The teacher will be able to pull out your assignments / tasks etc and point out why you got the marks you got. How are you going to argue your point that because you behave poorly and push her buttons that she is treating you badly back? It does not sound like a good idea to me.
Why would that be hard? Just let another teacher put his/her grades on the same assignments and see if they are the same.
English past general structure and the basics is highly subjective, and there is a decent amount of lee-way for the teacher to give a range of marks.
Thinking about it, most teachers I know would generally support another teacher or colleague above a student who admits being a smart-ass in class. In a completely fair world, they wouldn't, but just as a student would never take the teachers side above another student, I can't imagine it's any different for them.
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On May 11 2012 18:43 thesideshow wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 18:40 DR.Ham wrote:
OP, don't take this the wrong way, but your post is not particularly well written.
I was going to say the same thing. Perhaps you really need to re-evaluate your abilities.
it would depend largely on his assignments, but it's pretty evident that OP shouldn't be getting marked down as severely as he claims. grade 10 english is not university level.
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On May 11 2012 18:43 thesideshow wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 18:40 DR.Ham wrote:
OP, don't take this the wrong way, but your post is not particularly well written.
I was going to say the same thing. Perhaps you really need to re-evaluate your abilities.
It's an Internet post, not an essay KK? I know it's not grammaticality correct! OK?
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On May 11 2012 18:49 kzdanze wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 18:43 thesideshow wrote:On May 11 2012 18:40 DR.Ham wrote:
OP, don't take this the wrong way, but your post is not particularly well written.
I was going to say the same thing. Perhaps you really need to re-evaluate your abilities. It's an Internet post, not an essay KK? I know it's not grammaticality correct! OK?
Sorry buddy, I wasn't trying to be a prick. You must be able to see the irony that the one example we have of your writing is poor, while claiming you are being victimized by getting poor marks... :-)
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On May 11 2012 18:44 Emix_Squall wrote:
Hey,
I think that's a very interesting subject on education you're bringing here. I've always been quite a lazy student in high school. I was lucky enough to receive some kind of privileged education and a good access to cultural stuff from my family, therefore school was a bit easier to me and I never felt like putting much effort into it since I could always get decent grades (I'm talking basic decent like 13/20 or 14/20 [French grading system]) doing almost nothing. However I was a curious student, and would ask many questions so teachers would kinda like me for that. During one of my last years I talked with my maths teacher (which I knew well at that point) and she explained me I was basically the most annoying kind of student she could ever get. The kind you can't really blame for anything since the grades are decent, but the kind you also want to slap in the face so hard because you know they could do better if only they put a little more work to it.
Know my personal opinion is that a teacher should just grade each students regardless of who they are and of what they could potentially achieve. This is the fairest way to do things obviously.
HOWEVER, I must admit that grading a student based on his potential is a very good way to help him/her achieve more and get better. Problem being that it can also lead to the kind of bias you're talking about when a teacher starts giving you lower grades based on things that have nothing to do with education (how you behave in class, what your mom told her during the last parent-teacher reunion ....).
This is the kind of debate that's be running for years in many countries, should the educational system help kids/young people reach a certain level of knowledge (grades based on same things for everyone) or should it just help them become better (grades based more on students potential)?
Both of these visions have their problems and advantages. How should teachers spend the same amount of time with each student when some require more attention than others? How impartial can they be when it comes to grading considering they are free to grade based on potential?
I think the best answer most educational systems have for that is private school / public schools. Public schools will tend to be more fair when private schools will tend to help children get better than what they currently are. Now I know what I just said can seem awful to some people: "OMG you're so cruel, so poorer people that can't afford private school should just reach the average level and can't get better". Well as cruel as it may seem it's at the moment the "best" way to do things IMO (but we could definitely use a better one ...).
Thanks a lot man. This was the post I was looking for. You are right, and this post may be the post that might really change me as a person.
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Yes, teachers are biased. They are human after all. You can get on their good and bad side. With some you can get there easily, with some it takes time and effort. With some it can take just one moment. Some are actually not biased. Some can be biased at some moments but not at other moments.
eg. I usually didn't study much in elementary school, so one time when I did and owned a test and I shown that I actually studied the teacher was so happy and amazed that she kept giving me higher grades from then onwards even if I didn't deserve them. That teacher was one of the most serious and feared teachers in the school too. It was a german teacher. Actually, that exact thing happened in high school too, german teacher again. (It also happened with a few other subjects.)
I personally didn't really get on anyone's bad side, maybe one teacher, but I've seen other people get there. heh
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Ok, I have an idea.
Why not post your assignment, and the task description here and we can evaluate it in an unbiased way? :-)
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On May 11 2012 18:51 kzdanze wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 18:44 Emix_Squall wrote:
Hey,
I think that's a very interesting subject on education you're bringing here. I've always been quite a lazy student in high school. I was lucky enough to receive some kind of privileged education and a good access to cultural stuff from my family, therefore school was a bit easier to me and I never felt like putting much effort into it since I could always get decent grades (I'm talking basic decent like 13/20 or 14/20 [French grading system]) doing almost nothing. However I was a curious student, and would ask many questions so teachers would kinda like me for that. During one of my last years I talked with my maths teacher (which I knew well at that point) and she explained me I was basically the most annoying kind of student she could ever get. The kind you can't really blame for anything since the grades are decent, but the kind you also want to slap in the face so hard because you know they could do better if only they put a little more work to it.
Know my personal opinion is that a teacher should just grade each students regardless of who they are and of what they could potentially achieve. This is the fairest way to do things obviously.
HOWEVER, I must admit that grading a student based on his potential is a very good way to help him/her achieve more and get better. Problem being that it can also lead to the kind of bias you're talking about when a teacher starts giving you lower grades based on things that have nothing to do with education (how you behave in class, what your mom told her during the last parent-teacher reunion ....).
This is the kind of debate that's be running for years in many countries, should the educational system help kids/young people reach a certain level of knowledge (grades based on same things for everyone) or should it just help them become better (grades based more on students potential)?
Both of these visions have their problems and advantages. How should teachers spend the same amount of time with each student when some require more attention than others? How impartial can they be when it comes to grading considering they are free to grade based on potential?
I think the best answer most educational systems have for that is private school / public schools. Public schools will tend to be more fair when private schools will tend to help children get better than what they currently are. Now I know what I just said can seem awful to some people: "OMG you're so cruel, so poorer people that can't afford private school should just reach the average level and can't get better". Well as cruel as it may seem it's at the moment the "best" way to do things IMO (but we could definitely use a better one ...). Thanks a lot man. This was the post I was looking for. You are right, and this post may be the post that might really change me as a person.
It might be useful to point out that private schools in Australia are the equivalent to public schools in the UK and vice versa. It was very confusing when I first lived there...
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On May 11 2012 18:51 kzdanze wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 18:44 Emix_Squall wrote:
Hey,
I think that's a very interesting subject on education you're bringing here. I've always been quite a lazy student in high school. I was lucky enough to receive some kind of privileged education and a good access to cultural stuff from my family, therefore school was a bit easier to me and I never felt like putting much effort into it since I could always get decent grades (I'm talking basic decent like 13/20 or 14/20 [French grading system]) doing almost nothing. However I was a curious student, and would ask many questions so teachers would kinda like me for that. During one of my last years I talked with my maths teacher (which I knew well at that point) and she explained me I was basically the most annoying kind of student she could ever get. The kind you can't really blame for anything since the grades are decent, but the kind you also want to slap in the face so hard because you know they could do better if only they put a little more work to it.
Know my personal opinion is that a teacher should just grade each students regardless of who they are and of what they could potentially achieve. This is the fairest way to do things obviously.
HOWEVER, I must admit that grading a student based on his potential is a very good way to help him/her achieve more and get better. Problem being that it can also lead to the kind of bias you're talking about when a teacher starts giving you lower grades based on things that have nothing to do with education (how you behave in class, what your mom told her during the last parent-teacher reunion ....).
This is the kind of debate that's be running for years in many countries, should the educational system help kids/young people reach a certain level of knowledge (grades based on same things for everyone) or should it just help them become better (grades based more on students potential)?
Both of these visions have their problems and advantages. How should teachers spend the same amount of time with each student when some require more attention than others? How impartial can they be when it comes to grading considering they are free to grade based on potential?
I think the best answer most educational systems have for that is private school / public schools. Public schools will tend to be more fair when private schools will tend to help children get better than what they currently are. Now I know what I just said can seem awful to some people: "OMG you're so cruel, so poorer people that can't afford private school should just reach the average level and can't get better". Well as cruel as it may seem it's at the moment the "best" way to do things IMO (but we could definitely use a better one ...). Thanks a lot man. This was the post I was looking for. You are right, and this post may be the post that might really change me as a person.
Well I didn't give that much of an answer but I tried to give an overview of the subject considering I've been thinking about this a lot too 
I think the bottom line of what I was trying to say is that you should always wonder if you could do better and if the grade reflects what you honestly think your WORK was worth.
Being a big fish in a small pond is sure comfortable but you might regret it later considering you were potentially capable of more ...
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On May 11 2012 18:53 DR.Ham wrote:
Ok, I have an idea.
Why not post your assignment, and the task description here and we can evaluate it in an unbiased way? :-)
I'm not going to do that because, firstly, what I'm talking about is how she marks work differently for different people. Showing the Internet my work isn't going to prove my point because what I am focusing on this post is that she marks high for other students just because they make their work flashy and suck up at how much effort they put into it. Secondly, I do not know who you are, I do not know who everyone else is and I do not want to put up private stuff onto a website based on Starcraft 2. OK?
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On May 11 2012 19:00 kzdanze wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 18:53 DR.Ham wrote:
Ok, I have an idea.
Why not post your assignment, and the task description here and we can evaluate it in an unbiased way? :-) I'm not going to do that because, firstly, what I'm talking about is how she marks work differently for different people. Showing the Internet my work isn't going to prove my point because what I am focusing on this post is that she marks high for other students just because they make their work flashy and suck up at how much effort they put into it. Secondly, I do not know who you are, I do not know who everyone else is and I do not want to put up private stuff onto a website based on Starcraft 2. OK?
i would imagine he was being sarcastic, but your original and subsequent posts come off as looking for justification for some sort of confirmation bias without really providing us with anything to work with.
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On May 11 2012 19:03 Terranist wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 19:00 kzdanze wrote:On May 11 2012 18:53 DR.Ham wrote:
Ok, I have an idea.
Why not post your assignment, and the task description here and we can evaluate it in an unbiased way? :-) I'm not going to do that because, firstly, what I'm talking about is how she marks work differently for different people. Showing the Internet my work isn't going to prove my point because what I am focusing on this post is that she marks high for other students just because they make their work flashy and suck up at how much effort they put into it. Secondly, I do not know who you are, I do not know who everyone else is and I do not want to put up private stuff onto a website based on Starcraft 2. OK? i would imagine he was being sarcastic, but your original and subsequent posts come off as looking for justification for some sort of confirmation bias without really providing us with anything to work with.
Or you can understand it as an open debate on educational system, why are people so eager on judging others?
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i remember when i was in grade 4 i had a teacher who HATED me. though my parents and other teachers said its just me that thinks it.
you see however i was the smartest in the class. infact i had actually been moved up a grade years earlier for being WAY smarter then everyone. but in grade 4 i was consistantly getting D's and F's.
one day i had enough and sparked a deal with the nicest quiet girl which everyone liked. i gave her my next lunch order (canteen order) if she would participate in a trade with me. I would hand up her work, she mine.This girl ALWAYS got A's so it would be expected if i handed up her work i would get an A also right?
got the assignment back. F. she got an A. When the teacher went to explain about how we all should have done the assignment i stood up and told her that this was actually the girls work and that she had handed up mine. Then i started to question how can a girls work who gets A's everytime be so bad to get an F.
the girl at this point thought she was just going to trade her work with mine for the fun of it, but as soon as she relised her work got an F she stood up as well and joined in my argument. soon enough we had the entire class in the argument debating why i always got F's and why the teacher hated me so much to give me F's
the ultimate end result was that i got suspended for 2 days for disrespecting the teacher and manipulating the class into helping me.
I did the same trade with my classmates MANY times, though after the initial incident i never told the teacher about it. the entire class knew though that the teacher hated my guts we just never knew why.
(well i understand now that my parents have tole me why. the teacher hated me simply because my family had only moved to the town 4 years prior and was considered the "new people". still disgusting in all honesty)
Tl;DR Some teachers are biased as fuck. some aren't. sometimes it works in your favor. sometimes not.
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However biased your teacher may be, you being a dick to your teacher probably doesn't help.
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On May 11 2012 19:00 kzdanze wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 18:53 DR.Ham wrote:
Ok, I have an idea.
Why not post your assignment, and the task description here and we can evaluate it in an unbiased way? :-) I'm not going to do that because, firstly, what I'm talking about is how she marks work differently for different people. Showing the Internet my work isn't going to prove my point because what I am focusing on this post is that she marks high for other students just because they make their work flashy and suck up at how much effort they put into it. Secondly, I do not know who you are, I do not know who everyone else is and I do not want to put up private stuff onto a website based on Starcraft 2. OK?
Your original point was that your marks were lower than they should be because she was biased against you, if that is not the case and your point is that she is raising others because of the effort they put in that you don't, then I don't know how to help you. I didn't realize that your assignments were so personal, no need to be defensive, OK?
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On May 11 2012 18:44 Emix_Squall wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Hey,
I think that's a very interesting subject on education you're bringing here. I've always been quite a lazy student in high school. I was lucky enough to receive some kind of privileged education and a good access to cultural stuff from my family, therefore school was a bit easier to me and I never felt like putting much effort into it since I could always get decent grades (I'm talking basic decent like 13/20 or 14/20 [French grading system]) doing almost nothing. However I was a curious student, and would ask many questions so teachers would kinda like me for that. During one of my last years I talked with my maths teacher (which I knew well at that point) and she explained me I was basically the most annoying kind of student she could ever get. The kind you can't really blame for anything since the grades are decent, but the kind you also want to slap in the face so hard because you know they could do better if only they put a little more work to it.
Know my personal opinion is that a teacher should just grade each students regardless of who they are and of what they could potentially achieve. This is the fairest way to do things obviously.
HOWEVER, I must admit that grading a student based on his potential is a very good way to help him/her achieve more and get better. Problem being that it can also lead to the kind of bias you're talking about when a teacher starts giving you lower grades based on things that have nothing to do with education (how you behave in class, what your mom told her during the last parent-teacher reunion ....).
This is the kind of debate that's be running for years in many countries, should the educational system help kids/young people reach a certain level of knowledge (grades based on same things for everyone) or should it just help them become better (grades based more on students potential)?
Both of these visions have their problems and advantages. How should teachers spend the same amount of time with each student when some require more attention than others? How impartial can they be when it comes to grading considering they are free to grade based on potential?
I think the best answer most educational systems have for that is private school / public schools. Public schools will tend to be more fair when private schools will tend to help children get better than what they currently are. Now I know what I just said can seem awful to some people: "OMG you're so cruel, so poorer people that can't afford private school should just reach the average level and can't get better". Well as cruel as it may seem it's at the moment the "best" way to do things IMO (but we could definitely use a better one...) .
It's the informative and well reflected posts like this that make TL a worthwhile read. Thanks!
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The problem that most non-university teachers have, is that they think you owe them something. They feel offended if you are not living up to your full potential, but don't realize that it's your own decision if you just don't give two flying fucks. They somehow always believe that everything you do and they don't like is on purpose to piss them off. Some teachers just care too much.
Then there is the other kind of teacher who are just assholes. They hate their job and if you are making their job even harder, they will hate you too
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On May 11 2012 19:41 TyrantPotato wrote:
i remember when i was in grade 4 i had a teacher who HATED me. though my parents and other teachers said its just me that thinks it.
you see however i was the smartest in the class. infact i had actually been moved up a grade years earlier for being WAY smarter then everyone. but in grade 4 i was consistantly getting D's and F's.
one day i had enough and sparked a deal with the nicest quiet girl which everyone liked. i gave her my next lunch order (canteen order) if she would participate in a trade with me. I would hand up her work, she mine.This girl ALWAYS got A's so it would be expected if i handed up her work i would get an A also right?
got the assignment back. F. she got an A. When the teacher went to explain about how we all should have done the assignment i stood up and told her that this was actually the girls work and that she had handed up mine. Then i started to question how can a girls work who gets A's everytime be so bad to get an F.
the girl at this point thought she was just going to trade her work with mine for the fun of it, but as soon as she relised her work got an F she stood up as well and joined in my argument. soon enough we had the entire class in the argument debating why i always got F's and why the teacher hated me so much to give me F's
the ultimate end result was that i got suspended for 2 days for disrespecting the teacher and manipulating the class into helping me.
I did the same trade with my classmates MANY times, though after the initial incident i never told the teacher about it. the entire class knew though that the teacher hated my guts we just never knew why.
(well i understand now that my parents have tole me why. the teacher hated me simply because my family had only moved to the town 4 years prior and was considered the "new people". still disgusting in all honesty)
Tl;DR Some teachers are biased as fuck. some aren't. sometimes it works in your favor. sometimes not.
This is AWESOME !!! Congratz on putting your balls on the table and really trying to figure out whether it was just your imagination or she was really giving you bad grades on purpose! However I'm quite shocked with the ending of your story .... how can a school's administration who acknowledged such situation just do nothing about it?
Sure you probably deserved to be suspended from the "rules" point of view; but still you made it pretty clear this teacher is totally biased ... this should be enough for any school's administration to take measures making sure it doesn't happen again ... (not necessarily firing her of course, but a severe warning would seem appropriate ...)
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Hyrule19200 Posts
Did you just complain that philosophy was too philosophical?
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On May 11 2012 21:19 tofucake wrote:
Did you just complain that philosophy was too philosophical?
There is a line between philosophical and just complete crackhead. She would debate anything you say. The chairs are blue.... I'm serious.
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On May 11 2012 21:22 kzdanze wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 21:19 tofucake wrote:
Did you just complain that philosophy was too philosophical? There is a line between philosophical and just complete crackhead. She would debate anything you say. The chairs are blue.... I'm serious.
Questions like that seem stupid, sure, but people take them seriously. Wiki "Philosphy of Perception" or go to some philosophy classes when you get to college. You seem more guilty of bias than your teacher.
A teacher like that seems awesome anyway. High school is mostly a dull waste of time if you're decently intelligent; bringing in some philosophy for the smart people (like you apparently) is pretty fucking cool.
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On May 11 2012 20:42 MaGariShun wrote:
The problem that most non-university teachers have, is that they think you owe them something. They feel offended if you are not living up to your full potential, but don't realize that it's your own decision if you just don't give two flying fucks. They somehow always believe that everything you do and they don't like is on purpose to piss them off. Some teachers just care too much.
Then there is the other kind of teacher who are just assholes. They hate their job and if you are making their job even harder, they will hate you too
Actually, the problem that the most high school students have, is that they think they can do whatever the fuck they please and get away with it. If you're making a teacher's job even harder just for the hell of it, and do not respect the teacher, I really have no sympathy for any kind of bad or 'biased' marks you might be getting. These days teachers have very little power over obnoxious students with shittiest attitudes possible, so scoring them down is pretty much the only thing they CAN do.
I don't know how can anyone have sympathy for a guy who openly says he is disrupting classes on purpose; I certainly don't.
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You sound kind of dumb and you're afraid to post your work to prove otherwise. I think it's kind of obvious what's going on here.
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This thread isn't even about Highschool is it? Its about below highschool? If so then it doesnt matter, at all.
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From your OP you sound like a douche.
Your teacher is trying to teach you a more philosophical way of thinking and you simply brush it off because "KISS".
I've met people like you through my school year, give them anything new or truly challenging and they fail. What a useless waste of free will.
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Most teachers will take into account what kind of a person you are. Even if it's not blatant, they're going to give you the benefit of the doubt if you are like-able and hardworking, while picking on niggling things if you are lazy or rude.
It does feel unfair, but considering how useful/important it is to be like-able and hardworking, it actually works out pretty well.
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This is how life works.
Let me tell you my story: When i was in highschool, i failed my final years exam and had to enroll into evening school because of fkn biased teachers (didnt want to stay another year at that retarded school).
I have to say, i was the most lazy and arrogant student they ever had: never showed up on time, and always minimum effort. Even my classmates would backstab me because I was always getting passing grades while putting minimum effort. Why? Because pre-high school we made a test to determine your level for highschool, i got a convincing mark (548/550 points) for highest level highschool, but when I got there they put me a level lower because they said i wasnt serious enough, so i decided to do nothing because anything below highest was too easy.
So at highschool I was always sleeping and rarely opened a book during class or pre-tests. I put minimum effort into assignments and projects. I was pretty much hated by teachers, but those that had respect never failed me because my minimum work was better than class average. If i really fucked up and got a 1/10 (read:F) in an test I would simply open my book for a day and get an 10/10 (A+?) for my next test. Ezpz.
Problems started when I got in my final year, which is half decided by national exam and other half by school marks. I had an asshole for geographics and history. I rarely had a insufficient grade for these subjects and could easily get a high grade if i opened my book. However, this year was different, this teacher hated me thoroughly and never ever gave me a sufficient grade througout the year, even if i did study. Ending me on a 5/10 (5.5 is pass). He always stated that my answers were half right (i didn have wrong answers just all half right) so i always got only 5/10.
Thats means that i had to get a 6/10 on my national exam, and because i had to pass, i actually opened my book and studied my ass off. I made the exam, i checked the answers and i was fairly confident i had a 8/10 atleast. 2 weeks later, i received a 5,8 on my exam (5.4 total, 5.5 is pass) and i failed the year. The same teacher watched the exam and gave me half the points for everything again. The asshole.
So i was left with choice to resit year or go to evening school and university at a different place, at the same time. I took 2nd choice and finished the subjects year after with a 9/10 total. Also finished university first year with propedeuse and all my ECTS. Still confident that the teacher fucked me over.
Anyway school doesnt mean shit. I quit university on final year, and i went back to my home town to run my family company. Now i have 2 more companies, Im 23 years old and my owners equity is already a 6 number figure. Last week I saw that same teacher and he still hates for me being lazy and succesful. Owned
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On May 11 2012 22:14 ruiyang wrote:
This is how life works.
Let me tell you my story: When i was in highschool, i failed my final years exam and had to enroll into evening school because of fkn biased teachers (didnt want to stay another year at that retarded school).
I have to say, i was the most lazy and arrogant student they ever had: never showed up on time, and always minimum effort. Even my classmates would backstab me because I was always getting passing grades while putting minimum effort. Why? Because pre-high school we made a test to determine your level for highschool, i got a convincing mark (548/550 points) for highest level highschool, but when I got there they put me a level lower because they said i wasnt serious enough, so i decided to do nothing because anything below highest was too easy.
So at highschool I was always sleeping and rarely opened a book during class or pre-tests. I put minimum effort into assignments and projects. I was pretty much hated by teachers, but those that had respect never failed me because my minimum work was better than class average. If i really fucked up and got a 1/10 (read:F) in an test I would simply open my book for a day and get an 10/10 (A+?) for my next test. Ezpz.
Problems started when I got in my final year, which is half decided by national exam and other half by school marks. I had an asshole for geographics and history. I rarely had a insufficient grade for these subjects and could easily get a high grade if i opened my book. However, this year was different, this teacher hated me thoroughly and never ever gave me a sufficient grade througout the year, even if i did study. Ending me on a 5/10 (5.5 is pass). He always stated that my answers were half right (i didn have wrong answers just all half right) so i always got only 5/10.
Thats means that i had to get a 6/10 on my national exam, and because i had to pass, i actually opened my book and studied my ass off. I made the exam, i checked the answers and i was fairly confident i had a 8/10 atleast. 2 weeks later, i received a 5,8 on my exam (5.4 total, 5.5 is pass) and i failed the year. The same teacher watched the exam and gave me half the points for everything again. The asshole.
So i was left with choice to resit year or go to evening school and university at a different place, at the same time. I took 2nd choice and finished the subjects year after with a 9/10 total. Also finished university first year with propedeuse and all my ECTS. Still confident that the teacher fucked me over.
Anyway school doesnt mean shit. I quit university on final year, and i went back to my home town to run my family company. Now i have 2 more companies, Im 23 years old and my owners equity is already a 6 number figure. Last week I saw that same teacher and he still hates for me being lazy and succesful. Owned
Seems like that teacher played a pretty significant part in making you who you are today. If you like that person, and are happy with yourself, I'd thank him. Seems like he did you a favour.
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On May 11 2012 22:21 Jehct wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 22:14 ruiyang wrote:
This is how life works.
Let me tell you my story: When i was in highschool, i failed my final years exam and had to enroll into evening school because of fkn biased teachers (didnt want to stay another year at that retarded school).
I have to say, i was the most lazy and arrogant student they ever had: never showed up on time, and always minimum effort. Even my classmates would backstab me because I was always getting passing grades while putting minimum effort. Why? Because pre-high school we made a test to determine your level for highschool, i got a convincing mark (548/550 points) for highest level highschool, but when I got there they put me a level lower because they said i wasnt serious enough, so i decided to do nothing because anything below highest was too easy.
So at highschool I was always sleeping and rarely opened a book during class or pre-tests. I put minimum effort into assignments and projects. I was pretty much hated by teachers, but those that had respect never failed me because my minimum work was better than class average. If i really fucked up and got a 1/10 (read:F) in an test I would simply open my book for a day and get an 10/10 (A+?) for my next test. Ezpz.
Problems started when I got in my final year, which is half decided by national exam and other half by school marks. I had an asshole for geographics and history. I rarely had a insufficient grade for these subjects and could easily get a high grade if i opened my book. However, this year was different, this teacher hated me thoroughly and never ever gave me a sufficient grade througout the year, even if i did study. Ending me on a 5/10 (5.5 is pass). He always stated that my answers were half right (i didn have wrong answers just all half right) so i always got only 5/10.
Thats means that i had to get a 6/10 on my national exam, and because i had to pass, i actually opened my book and studied my ass off. I made the exam, i checked the answers and i was fairly confident i had a 8/10 atleast. 2 weeks later, i received a 5,8 on my exam (5.4 total, 5.5 is pass) and i failed the year. The same teacher watched the exam and gave me half the points for everything again. The asshole.
So i was left with choice to resit year or go to evening school and university at a different place, at the same time. I took 2nd choice and finished the subjects year after with a 9/10 total. Also finished university first year with propedeuse and all my ECTS. Still confident that the teacher fucked me over.
Anyway school doesnt mean shit. I quit university on final year, and i went back to my home town to run my family company. Now i have 2 more companies, Im 23 years old and my owners equity is already a 6 number figure. Last week I saw that same teacher and he still hates for me being lazy and succesful. Owned Seems like that teacher played a pretty significant part in making you who you are today. If you like that person, and are happy with yourself, I'd thank him. Seems like he did you a favour.
How do you mean? I dont understand
Im still the same as ever. Im lazy and unmotivated and put minimum effort into things i dont have passion for. So i save my energy for things I do think are interesting and important. The only thing he showed me is that people can be so unforgiving if they think your only putting enough effort to be sufficient in something you dont care about.
If im happy who i am? Everything has it downsides. Succes comes with bitter feeling and tastes. I respect everyone who chose different paths and have different interests or motivations. Its just that some people cant appreciate me for who i am.
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Sometimes, you just have to bend a little to suit the person in power. At least in high school it's clear who holds the power (the teacher who gives you the grades, duh). It's fine to maintain your unique style of writing (everyone sort of has one), but it is necessary to tweak it here and there so that the person in power can also appreciate it.
You should fight for your grades, yes. Don't let the system push you over. However, easier way to get your grades back up, is to adapt and be flexible. You may also find that people who get consistently high grades across all subjects throughout high school are not only talented and hard-working, but flexible, open-minded, and fast to adapt.
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On May 11 2012 22:34 ruiyang wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 22:21 Jehct wrote:On May 11 2012 22:14 ruiyang wrote:
This is how life works.
Let me tell you my story: When i was in highschool, i failed my final years exam and had to enroll into evening school because of fkn biased teachers (didnt want to stay another year at that retarded school).
I have to say, i was the most lazy and arrogant student they ever had: never showed up on time, and always minimum effort. Even my classmates would backstab me because I was always getting passing grades while putting minimum effort. Why? Because pre-high school we made a test to determine your level for highschool, i got a convincing mark (548/550 points) for highest level highschool, but when I got there they put me a level lower because they said i wasnt serious enough, so i decided to do nothing because anything below highest was too easy.
So at highschool I was always sleeping and rarely opened a book during class or pre-tests. I put minimum effort into assignments and projects. I was pretty much hated by teachers, but those that had respect never failed me because my minimum work was better than class average. If i really fucked up and got a 1/10 (read:F) in an test I would simply open my book for a day and get an 10/10 (A+?) for my next test. Ezpz.
Problems started when I got in my final year, which is half decided by national exam and other half by school marks. I had an asshole for geographics and history. I rarely had a insufficient grade for these subjects and could easily get a high grade if i opened my book. However, this year was different, this teacher hated me thoroughly and never ever gave me a sufficient grade througout the year, even if i did study. Ending me on a 5/10 (5.5 is pass). He always stated that my answers were half right (i didn have wrong answers just all half right) so i always got only 5/10.
Thats means that i had to get a 6/10 on my national exam, and because i had to pass, i actually opened my book and studied my ass off. I made the exam, i checked the answers and i was fairly confident i had a 8/10 atleast. 2 weeks later, i received a 5,8 on my exam (5.4 total, 5.5 is pass) and i failed the year. The same teacher watched the exam and gave me half the points for everything again. The asshole.
So i was left with choice to resit year or go to evening school and university at a different place, at the same time. I took 2nd choice and finished the subjects year after with a 9/10 total. Also finished university first year with propedeuse and all my ECTS. Still confident that the teacher fucked me over.
Anyway school doesnt mean shit. I quit university on final year, and i went back to my home town to run my family company. Now i have 2 more companies, Im 23 years old and my owners equity is already a 6 number figure. Last week I saw that same teacher and he still hates for me being lazy and succesful. Owned Seems like that teacher played a pretty significant part in making you who you are today. If you like that person, and are happy with yourself, I'd thank him. Seems like he did you a favour. How do you mean? I dont understand Im still the same as ever. Im lazy and unmotivated and put minimum effort into things i dont have passion for. So i save my energy for things I do think are interesting and important. The only thing he showed me is that people can be so unforgiving if they think your only putting enough effort to be sufficient in something you dont care about. If im happy who i am? Everything has it downsides. Succes comes with bitter feeling and tastes. I respect everyone who chose different paths and have different interests or motivations. Its just that some people cant appreciate me for who i am.
Sorry to be so harsh, but you do know that the central exams in the Netherlands are not only graded by your primary teacher? A secondary randomly selected teacher somewhere else in the country gets your exams and checks the grading to see if it was fair judgement. To me this sounds a lot like complaining about being fucked with while all the time you are just making this up to give yourself some peace of mind.
Get over it, deal with it, be a better man because of it!
Also: congratulations with taking over the family business and making some good money, but are you sure you don't want to finish up your studies just to be on the safe side? When things turn for the worse (Im not saying it will, but accidents happen  ) you always have something to fall back on.
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On May 11 2012 21:43 Sethronu wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 20:42 MaGariShun wrote:
The problem that most non-university teachers have, is that they think you owe them something. They feel offended if you are not living up to your full potential, but don't realize that it's your own decision if you just don't give two flying fucks. They somehow always believe that everything you do and they don't like is on purpose to piss them off. Some teachers just care too much.
Then there is the other kind of teacher who are just assholes. They hate their job and if you are making their job even harder, they will hate you too
Actually, the problem that the most high school students have, is that they think they can do whatever the fuck they please and get away with it. If you're making a teacher's job even harder just for the hell of it, and do not respect the teacher, I really have no sympathy for any kind of bad or 'biased' marks you might be getting. These days teachers have very little power over obnoxious students with shittiest attitudes possible, so scoring them down is pretty much the only thing they CAN do. I don't know how can anyone have sympathy for a guy who openly says he is disrupting classes on purpose; I certainly don't.
purposely disrupting classes is wrong, but there is punishment for it. The grades you get from exams and homeworks however should never be influenced by your behaviour in class. Teachers don't have to "do" anything against students with shitty attitudes, that's exactly my point. Give them the grades they deserve for their work and if their behaviour is inappropriate there are ways to punish them (call the parents, detention, separate grades for behaviour etc.). Not doing as much as you could is certainly not "bad behaviour" and up to the student himself.
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Canada13405 Posts
Seems like you are a young guy and you like it simple so here are three things to learn from all this:
1) Its year 9, fuck it.
2) People are biased. Thats all there is to it.
3) You just learned an important life lesson: you don't need to suck up to people who have power over you in some way but you can't be a dick.
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Authority can do what they want without your say. This should be a lesson not to troll people with more power than you. It sucks, but we are all zombies.
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On May 12 2012 00:07 MaGariShun wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 21:43 Sethronu wrote:On May 11 2012 20:42 MaGariShun wrote:
The problem that most non-university teachers have, is that they think you owe them something. They feel offended if you are not living up to your full potential, but don't realize that it's your own decision if you just don't give two flying fucks. They somehow always believe that everything you do and they don't like is on purpose to piss them off. Some teachers just care too much.
Then there is the other kind of teacher who are just assholes. They hate their job and if you are making their job even harder, they will hate you too
Actually, the problem that the most high school students have, is that they think they can do whatever the fuck they please and get away with it. If you're making a teacher's job even harder just for the hell of it, and do not respect the teacher, I really have no sympathy for any kind of bad or 'biased' marks you might be getting. These days teachers have very little power over obnoxious students with shittiest attitudes possible, so scoring them down is pretty much the only thing they CAN do. I don't know how can anyone have sympathy for a guy who openly says he is disrupting classes on purpose; I certainly don't. purposely disrupting classes is wrong, but there is punishment for it. The grades you get from exams and homeworks however should never be influenced by your behaviour in class. Teachers don't have to "do" anything against students with shitty attitudes, that's exactly my point. Give them the grades they deserve for their work and if their behaviour is inappropriate there are ways to punish them (call the parents, detention, separate grades for behaviour etc.). Not doing as much as you could is certainly not "bad behaviour" and up to the student himself.
It depends on what kind of parents the student has, but most of the time 'calling the parents' results in the said parents saying what a bright and lovely kid their boy is, and how the teacher should cut him some slack and not be mean. And what do you mean teachers don't have to "do" anything against students with shitty attitudes?! If a guy is being a dick in the middle of class, not paying attention to the teacher, disturbing other students with his bullshit - the teacher does kinda have to deal with it in some way, it's just that they don't really have the tools to do so.
If you read the OP closely, it's pretty obvious that the main issue isn't the fact that the guy isn't "giving his 100% to the assignments" - it's the fact that he has 0 respect for the teacher, to the point where he outright says "people disrespect this teacher, especially me always pushing her buttons and talking back."
This is how life works.
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Anyway school doesnt mean shit. I quit university on final year, and i went back to my home town to run my family company. Now i have 2 more companies, Im 23 years old and my owners equity is already a 6 number figure. Last week I saw that same teacher and he still hates for me being lazy and succesful. Owned
You mean, this is how life works if you have a business your parents pass on to you after you fail at school? Sure, some people do get lucky and become successful with minimal effort, but damn this is some pretty bad life advice right there. :p You don't have to be an amazing student to achieve something in life, but it's pretty unlikely you'll get anywhere beyond mediocrity without working your butt off for it, unless you're spoonfed 'success' by your parents or whatever without having to do anything for it yourself.
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The truth about English classes is that everybody is awful at it and there's no rigor at all. If she's telling you that you suck she's probably the first person in the entire world who's told you the truth.
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When I read this thread I'm truly disappointed by the TL community. The OP of this post is basically asking a question and trying to create some kind of debate on a precise topic.
"Has this sort of thing happened to anyone before? Is it right for teachers to mark down work because of effort and you as a person? Should I talk to someone about this?"
But most people in the last 2 pages are only here judging him, saying how much he is a cocky bastard and should stfu because it's his fault. You should all be ashamed .... Why are you so eager on judging him? Who do you think you are? So you don't appreciate the attitude he seems to be having in class .... so???? How is this any relevant to the question that is asked? If you can't just stay in the topic don't post ... No one gives a crap about what you think of the way he behaves in class, seriously NO ONE!
I basically posted an answer here (go read page 2 if you're curious about it) because, believe it or not, this is a subject that's been interesting me a lot considering my younger brother and I have very similar profiles and I've been trough this kind of situation in high school (and he still is). And I actually value people of TL's opinion because most of the time it leads to constructive thoughts. However on this subject you're all pointing at the guy without giving any thought to the initial question.
Just don't post if you don't think this is a relevant topic, the post will die within a day and you won't have to here about it again. Or maybe there's some kind of malicious need you have to belittle the guy so it somehow makes you feel you're a better person.
I'm usually not the "defending poor and oppressed people" kind of guy but seeing how a simple debate/questioning can turn into massive flaming, on something TOTALLY OFF TOPIC by the way, is just sad.
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Or maybe we just want the guy to realize that being an ass to anyone, yet alone people who are older and wiser than you such as your teachers, is not good for his future and instead of being bitter and angry about it he should take a look at himself and see if perhaps change his attitude?
If you want to create a debate on a 'precise topic' without having to listen to personal advise or criticism, leave personal details out of it. Don't make a topic, "my teacher is marking me down because i'm an ass to her", make the topic, "is it right for a teacher to mark down students based on their behaviour". Consider the subject of this thread has "ME" in it, I don't see how can you say comments aimed at OP's behaviour rather than rhetoric of the post alone are 'unwarranted' - and hey, what you said goes both ways; if no one truly gives a crap about posts telling the OP that he should stfu and not be a cocky bastard, well, don't read them and don't respond to them?
By the way, being critical of someone doesn't necessarily imply malice or 'a need to belittle the guy'. I'm pretty sure most people who had told the OP that being respectful to teachers isn't a bad idea in general had nothing but his future well-being in mind. And how is it 'off topic', again?
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you sound like a spoiled brat tbh
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On May 11 2012 21:22 kzdanze wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2012 21:19 tofucake wrote:
Did you just complain that philosophy was too philosophical? There is a line between philosophical and just complete crackhead. She would debate anything you say. The chairs are blue.... I'm serious.
Seems strange. A teacher trying to get students to think, "inside" and "outside" of the box, about the world they live in. Your line between philosophical and "crackhead" maybe much different than your teacher's. Granted your teacher has had oh......a shit ton more schooling and life experience than you (though that is not always definitive when trying to understand differences of opinion between age ranges).
edit 1- not trying to berate OP. Just trying to point out that you are a student (learner) and she is a teacher (instructor). Once you've passed through her class, you can choose to never look back; but while in that class it's best to do your best, be respectful, and learn.
edit 2- OP I am NOT directing this at you. But I have heard that children in Australian schools can tend to be very rude (though truth be told, I think this is a worldwide event I think rather than an "Aussie" issue). I found an article that I found to very interesting. Rude Students Destroy Teaching
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Ha, I had a geometry teacher in 8th grade who got pissed off that I kept missing class for math competitions (I was taking math at the high school while in middle school). So, what ended up happening is that she started randomly marking off answers as wrong even when they were right, to drop my grade saying "oh, I'll fix that grading mistake" but never doing so. Funny thing is I was #57 or so at the nationals in mathcounts that year, and somehow was getting a D- in her geometry class lol.
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On May 12 2012 02:02 Emix_Squall wrote:
When I read this thread I'm truly disappointed by the TL community. The OP of this post is basically asking a question and trying to create some kind of debate on a precise topic.
"Has this sort of thing happened to anyone before? Is it right for teachers to mark down work because of effort and you as a person? Should I talk to someone about this?"
But most people in the last 2 pages are only here judging him, saying how much he is a cocky bastard and should stfu because it's his fault. You should all be ashamed .... Why are you so eager on judging him? Who do you think you are? So you don't appreciate the attitude he seems to be having in class .... so???? How is this any relevant to the question that is asked? If you can't just stay in the topic don't post ... No one gives a crap about what you think of the way he behaves in class, seriously NO ONE!
I basically posted an answer here (go read page 2 if you're curious about it) because, believe it or not, this is a subject that's been interesting me a lot considering my younger brother and I have very similar profiles and I've been trough this kind of situation in high school (and he still is). And I actually value people of TL's opinion because most of the time it leads to constructive thoughts. However on this subject you're all pointing at the guy without giving any thought to the initial question.
Just don't post if you don't think this is a relevant topic, the post will die within a day and you won't have to here about it again. Or maybe there's some kind of malicious need you have to belittle the guy so it somehow makes you feel you're a better person.
I'm usually not the "defending poor and oppressed people" kind of guy but seeing how a simple debate/questioning can turn into massive flaming, on something TOTALLY OFF TOPIC by the way, is just sad.
Oh right, if some random 12 year old comes on the forums and starts a thread on "how his sis' is bein a hoe yo", we should restrain from pointing out the idiocy of his post and simply be nice with him and create a debate we have no interest in.
Facts are that OP is probably just terrible, period. I was a lazy ass student and many teachers got mad at me because I could obtain the highest grades with no effort, but my results never changed, and when they did it's simply because everyone fucks up from time to time.
A respectful attitude and an open mind can resolve 99% of any student-teacher issues.
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Not as bad as mine. I did wonderful on all my English assignments, yet failed due to attendance. ATTENDANCE. Please tell me what the fuck attendance has to do with writing good essays? MEH
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Is it RIGHT for teachers to mark students based on effort and attitude?
I think asking "is it right?" is the wrong approach; the classroom isn't concerned with "right" or "wrong." You should be asking yourself, "What can I do to show my teacher that I don't deserve the grades she's giving me?"
The latter relies on a.) making it clear you are putting effort into your assignments (note: I am not saying that you should use big words or what-not, but showing her that you cared enough about the assignment to put effort into not only the content but also its presentation goes a long way), and b.) listening and respecting her.
There are tons of teachers in HS who aren't fit for being teachers, but tbh, even they should be treated with respect. They are figures of authority; you will have to deal with people you don't think deserve to be in their positions all your life, so you might as well get started on it. Don't talk back to them; disagree with them, sure, but don't ever give them the impression you think you are too good for the class and that you know everything they have to teach already unless you have ... well, a certain charm to you (which I don't think you do) and they have a good humor and/or you have a good relationship/rapport with them. There are ways to "talk back" without getting on your teacher's nerve, and there are ways to be inattentive without annoying your teacher.
HS is all about jumping through hoops. Faster you realize that, the smoother your HS career will go.
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Ok being serious, this has happened to me in both pre highschool and in one class in highschool. I was a lazy ass minimal effort ftw guy. In the 8th grade my english teacher failed me since well, she didnt quite like me. I was arrogant, the class clown in a sense and always talking back. Next year we got a different teacher, he noticed my complete lack of interest in the class and asked me why(first one to ever do such a thing) i said it was simply too easy and showing up listening to other people studying single words and shit was below me.
He said "fair enough, try the national test for your grade, if you get an A you can keep the grade and dont have to show up for class" so i took it and got an A without much effort(thank you internet and videogames) and he came to me asking me if i wanted to take the 9th year and i said sure, same deal applied there. This went on until i got to take the test for third year highschool english(still in the 8th grade) got A's until this one since it involved reading a bunch of books which i didn't wanna do so i got a B- trying to analyze a book via wikipedia.
The point is, he did me a huge favor. He didn't have to. He could've just gone with the state issued program and let me sitt there, stare at the wall and eventually start to hate me, and lower my grades because of it. Point being, nobody has to do you any favors, they don't owe you anything. And teaching anything below university(atleast in Scandinavia) pays like shit, you are completely locked into a government issued corricilum and any attempt at being refreshing and original is firmly shut down by your superiors who simply point to the state issued corricilum and plans. So the whole dead poet's society teacher is an extremelly rare breed, and usually young. Once in the job for a while you just lose your passion since well you aren't allowed to utilize it.
What im trying to say is you are on your own in your school years, even in primary and highschool. In University it is even more so, nobody is gonna give a shit if you fail whereas in High school etc there MIGHT be someone who notices and tries to help. But in University? Nope, nothing. Your on your own. You get sick and miss a class? Sucks to be you hope you know someone who takes notes. Your sick and miss a test? Sucks to be you you're either gonna fail or have to retake it in 6 months. You fail to deliver a mandatory assignment on time, that only counts for 1/100th of the grade? Sucks to be you, you've failed the class. In highschool when someone failed a test you could try it again like a week later, if you had a decent teacher you could retry it like four times.
This is a good lesson for you, one i wished i had learned earlier since it would've given me better studying habits(I'm in my last year of University now). Nobody is gonna help you out if you're an ass. And nobody HAS to help you either. And you cannot challenge those in power when you have no power yourself, you have 0 leverage as a student. You are nothing. Hence getting good grades isn't just about studying, it's about playing ball and doing what is asked of you.
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On May 12 2012 05:48 CecilSunkure wrote:
Not as bad as mine. I did wonderful on all my English assignments, yet failed due to attendance. ATTENDANCE. Please tell me what the fuck attendance has to do with writing good essays? MEH
Been there, i was lucky with a good teacher later on but, its because the government says you should have X% attendance, so they dont really have a choice but to fail your ass.
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Considering the quality of your English in the first message... I'm surprised you got a 6.5, I would have failed you. But that's my opinion. Don't know what to tell you... Grades have always been up to the teacher's discretion, whining about it solves nothing. Welcome to the grown up world, where nothing is fair. You can complain your whole life, but it's not going to help... You'll just have to man up, tough it out, and deal with your problems yourself.
Is it RIGHT for teachers to mark students based on effort and attitude?
Yes, because knowledge and regurgitating information is only half the battle. School is basically preparing you for the workplace. If you know everything but can't deal with people, you'll have a hard time keeping a job.
In my school, if you wanted to get anything 80%+, you had to go beyond and do extra than what was asked in the assignment. I thought it was stupid at the time, but I'm starting to see the relevance of it. Still don't think its completely right, but you'll always find things you don't agree with. In college, I had a few courses that gave you grades just for showing up. 30% of my final grade is for attendance? It's stupid, Point is, anyone can do the minimum. The good grades plus the great attitude and effort will immediately show. Cream of the crop, if you will.
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One day you will learn that your superiors don't care about what you have to say and that your job is to kiss ass and make the best out of every situation. How much for your english tutoring on the weekends? lol
You should really get your english tutoring business up and running steadily, because your boss is going to be "against you" too. Also, the government and the cops will have it out for you too. Maybe, the world isn't out to get you, you're just a moron.
Food for thought!
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Teachers are humans too. If you treat her like crap, you're going to get it one way or another no matter what you "think" you deserve. When you graduate and get a job, you may think your boss is a complete idiot and take credit for your work. What can you really do about it? Quit? Try to take it to the higher ups? Thats just life. Deal with it.
As a teacher myself, if a student is giving me hell, you can be sure he/she won't be a happy camper whether they think its fair or not. That's just being honest to god. Talk to the teacher one on one, apologize for your behavior and man up instead of ranting all day about how life is unfair. Teachers have too much on their hands already to deal with additional BS like the OP describes.
tl:dr - karma's a bitch, deal with it
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EPT
