• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 15:43
CET 20:43
KST 04:43
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book19Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview13Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info8
Community News
2026 KongFu Cup Announcement3BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled11Blizzard Classic Cup - Tastosis announced as captains15Weekly Cups (March 2-8): ByuN overcomes PvT block4GSL CK - New online series18
StarCraft 2
General
Blizzard Classic Cup - Tastosis announced as captains BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT Terran AddOns placement
Tourneys
RSL Season 4 announced for March-April Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament 2026 KongFu Cup Announcement [GSL CK] Team Maru vs. Team herO StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly)
Strategy
Custom Maps
Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026] Map Editor closed ?
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 516 Specter of Death Mutation # 515 Together Forever Mutation # 514 Ulnar New Year
Brood War
General
ASL21 General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Are you ready for ASL 21? Hype VIDEO Gypsy to Korea BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL22] Open Qualifiers & Ladder Tours IPSL Spring 2026 is here! ASL Season 21 Qualifiers March 7-8
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Fighting Spirit mining rates Zealot bombing is no longer popular?
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread PC Games Sales Thread No Man's Sky (PS4 and PC)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Five o'clock TL Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Mexico's Drug War Russo-Ukrainian War Thread NASA and the Private Sector
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread General nutrition recommendations Cricket [SPORT] TL MMA Pick'em Pool 2013
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Laptop capable of using Photoshop Lightroom?
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Money Laundering In Video Ga…
TrAiDoS
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
Shocked by a laser…
Spydermine0240
Unintentional protectionism…
Uldridge
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 3811 users

I hate mirror matchups.

Blogs > Bleak
Post a Reply
1 2 Next All
Bleak
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Turkey3059 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-12 09:52:24
January 12 2012 09:50 GMT
#1
Wanted to ladder a bit....and got matched with 5 Protoss in a row...4 losses.

I just hate this matchup. I'm losing to Gold ranked players. ('Im Platinum btw) I don't know what to do, it's so retarded that words cannot describe it. You cannot expand, every attack is potentially lethal, units are bland and dull (why don't we have reaver...or something the equivalent of Reaver instead of the retarded cliff walker) It is not fun to play.

It's not that other mirror matchups are great either. TvT is perhaps the best out of three but it's still mind draining 50min position wars. which leave me mentally fucked up after each match. ZvZ is all about who can flip the coin better. All mirror matchups suck ass. It is really stupid to me, when all the game is about 3 different races and how their differences interact with each other, to have same races play again each other. I would die for an option to block mirror matchups and just play versus a different race.

Yeah..fuck this game. Mirror matchups are not fun to play at all. I don't care if they are balanced or imbalanced, interesting or bland, but still at the end, it's not fun to play them. Period.

*
"I am a beacon of knowledge blazing out across a black sea of ignorance. "
FyRe_DragOn
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Canada2056 Posts
January 12 2012 09:56 GMT
#2
i heard there are reavers in bw
aka DragOn[NaS]
Djagulingu
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Germany3605 Posts
January 12 2012 09:58 GMT
#3
Being a coinflip matchup with both players doing some build and crossing their fingers for his opponent not doing the build that counters their build, ZvZ is still the best MM. It's not that you take half the map and wait until your opponent unsieges first and still you can expand.
"windows bash is a steaming heap of shit" tofucake
neoghaleon55
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7435 Posts
January 12 2012 09:58 GMT
#4
I often times wish ladder would allow you to accept or reject certain matchups (limited number of times per day)
This way you can narrow down and practice against your weakest matchup.

Nothing's worse than just losing a ZvT and then getting the next 8 matches be zvz.
It's like...there's no closure...



You can also do what I do and quit all your mirrors on certain days.


Yea....my ranking varies wildly from platinum to bronze because of this
:D
moo...for DRG
Snaiil
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Sweden312 Posts
January 12 2012 10:00 GMT
#5
All this post proves is that you have no understanding whatsoever of the mirror matchups. Stop being such a whiny bitch and learn to play them. Just get some pro replays and copy them.

User was warned for this post
FinestHour
Profile Joined August 2010
United States18466 Posts
January 12 2012 10:01 GMT
#6
I remember seeing a thread in strategy about a build that would never die to four gate, perhaps try that out?
thug life.                                                       MVP/ex-
Westy
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
England808 Posts
January 12 2012 10:06 GMT
#7
I half agree with you. Obviously you can't stop having mirror matchups, but Blizzard should put something in battle net that stops you being matched up against the same race a certain amount of times.

I am a mid-high masters player, and it seems to be that that whole section of players are just protoss players. So far I have had a streak of 7 PvP's in a row. It's simply just not fun to play that many PvP's. In the last week of laddering at least 70% of my games have been PvP's, which has caused me to now switch to zerg. Yes mirror matchups are boring, but the real problem is that fact that there is no system in place stopping you from playing them over and over again.

Like I said, 7 PvP's in a row on ladder is enough to make anyone not want to play the game anymore.
Tobberoth
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden6375 Posts
January 12 2012 10:30 GMT
#8
ZvZ isn't a coin flip. 14/14 is always safe and hatch first doesn't give any form of game ending advantage, so hatch first is not a coin flip win vs 14/14. 10 pool however is a coin flip win vs hatch first. Therefor, if you always go 14/14, you deny the coinflippage.
scruffeh
Profile Joined November 2010
England196 Posts
January 12 2012 10:34 GMT
#9
On January 12 2012 19:00 Snaiil wrote:
All this post proves is that you have no understanding whatsoever of the mirror matchups. Stop being such a whiny bitch and learn to play them. Just get some pro replays and copy them.


He pretty much said that he doesn't understand the matchups. I don't see the need to be rude. I don't think I'll ever enjoy ZvZ, regardless of how good/bad I am at it, I just feel that it's rubbish to watch, rubbish to play, and volatile as hell.

I wish I could racepick the matchups on ladder, but it's never going to happen.
Egyptian_Head
Profile Joined October 2010
South Africa508 Posts
January 12 2012 10:35 GMT
#10
I 100% agree, I cannot stand mirror matches, I play random and just leave every match that is a mirror match right at the begining.
Bleak
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Turkey3059 Posts
January 12 2012 10:36 GMT
#11
On January 12 2012 19:01 FinestHour wrote:
I remember seeing a thread in strategy about a build that would never die to four gate, perhaps try that out?


I can hold off a 4-gate, I just don't know what to do after.
"I am a beacon of knowledge blazing out across a black sea of ignorance. "
Talin
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Montenegro10532 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-12 11:00:04
January 12 2012 10:59 GMT
#12
Holy shit Inca.

...and then oh shit Inca. -__-

Whoops, wrong thread. Somehow appropriate though lol.
Grndr101
Profile Joined March 2011
Belgium125 Posts
January 12 2012 11:00 GMT
#13
Having played all 3 MM I have to say TvT is the most intresting one. Although ZvZ with infestors can be a lot of fun.
Kid-Fox
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada400 Posts
January 12 2012 11:10 GMT
#14
I'm not sure where all the "2hr long siege tanks inching forward 1by1" TvT ideas are coming from. You can go bio and try to outplay your opponent, marine-tank aggressively (very intense. My favorite games to do), or mech, which still requires that you harass with BFH. When a game DOES get drawn out, it's a race for the skies with vikings, ravens, and BC goodness.

But yeah, PvP is bs. =/ One of the many reasons I play terran.....
OmniEulogy
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada6598 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-12 11:10:54
January 12 2012 11:10 GMT
#15
Adelscotts 2 gate. All that is needed is good macro / multitasking and you expand quite early and always have the economic advantage with little risk.
LiquidDota Staff
lastshadow
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States1372 Posts
January 12 2012 11:11 GMT
#16
On January 12 2012 18:58 Djagulingu wrote:
Being a coinflip matchup with both players doing some build and crossing their fingers for his opponent not doing the build that counters their build, ZvZ is still the best MM. It's not that you take half the map and wait until your opponent unsieges first and still you can expand.



? PvP isn't so much a coinflip anymore, and TvT is by far the best match-up [in the game] in terms of balance, even most P/Z progamers would say this.
Patience is a small price to pay for perfection.
Selendis
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Australia509 Posts
January 12 2012 11:12 GMT
#17
I think of PvP like walking a tightrope. With your friend racing you on his own tightrope. Armed with shotguns.
One wrong move and you cop a shotgun shell to the torso and fall to your death.

The true art of PvP is knowing when your opponent has fucked up (eg got himself supply blocked) so you can finidh him off. Also you have to make sure that you yourself dotn race ahead (eg taking en expo or overteching) otherwise you will be in sight for the perfect buckshot (a full warp in into your base) and make sure that you return the favor if he tries the same.
Probes are sooo OP
RogerX
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
New Zealand3180 Posts
January 12 2012 11:48 GMT
#18
On January 12 2012 19:59 Talin wrote:
Holy shit Inca.

...and then oh shit Inca. -__-

Whoops, wrong thread. Somehow appropriate though lol.

This post intrigues me, where were you initally intending to post at?

Also, I hear broodwar mirror matchups are the most frustrating things in the world.
But really I hate mirror matchups in every game as well and they're boring as.
Stick it up. take it up. step aside and see the world
MCDayC
Profile Joined March 2011
United Kingdom14464 Posts
January 12 2012 12:24 GMT
#19
Bar roach infestor vs Roach infestor, I like ZvZ, TvT is awesome, I honestly can't understand why people don't like it. PvP... meh.
VERY FRAGILE, LIKE A BABY PANDA EGG
FaZe
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Canada472 Posts
January 12 2012 12:47 GMT
#20
I totally agree.

T is so overpowered in TvT, and P in PvP is just imba. Don't even get me started on ZvZ, Z can have so many units so fast, it's really hard to deal with.

Honestly though, once you improve your understanding of the game mirrors can become pretty fun.

TvT is my favorite matchup, with PvP a close second. There are so many different ways to play - keep your mind open to different playstyles, solidified matchups are often the ones that change the most when they do!
"Victory needs no explanation; defeat allows none."
1 2 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
17:00
Bonus Cup #5
uThermal488
Liquipedia
PSISTORM Gaming Misc
15:55
FSL Playoffs ST vs PTB
Freeedom23
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
uThermal 488
Liquid`TLO 290
trigger 159
elazer 67
Nathanias 65
EmSc Tv 28
PattyMac 9
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 19804
Mini 330
Shuttle 280
Dewaltoss 120
Aegong 49
Backho 44
Free 35
NaDa 17
910 8
Dota 2
Gorgc6076
monkeys_forever147
Counter-Strike
fl0m3353
byalli547
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor589
Liquid`Hasu434
MindelVK14
Other Games
gofns69706
tarik_tv17219
Grubby2517
FrodaN1856
Beastyqt708
KnowMe549
crisheroes180
ToD179
Fuzer 149
ArmadaUGS92
Trikslyr66
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream19341
Other Games
gamesdonequick2050
ComeBackTV 236
BasetradeTV29
StarCraft 2
EmSc Tv 28
EmSc2Tv 28
angryscii 27
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• printf 57
• Response 5
• Kozan
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 44
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis4926
• Shiphtur426
Other Games
• imaqtpie1280
Upcoming Events
BSL
17m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
14h 17m
RSL Revival
14h 17m
ByuN vs SHIN
Maru vs Krystianer
WardiTV Team League
16h 17m
Patches Events
21h 17m
BSL
1d
Replay Cast
1d 4h
Replay Cast
1d 13h
Wardi Open
1d 16h
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 21h
[ Show More ]
OSC
2 days
WardiTV Team League
2 days
GSL
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
KCM Race Survival
4 days
WardiTV Team League
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
KCM Race Survival
5 days
WardiTV Team League
5 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-03-13
WardiTV Winter 2026
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Jeongseon Sooper Cup
BSL Season 22
RSL Revival: Season 4
Nations Cup 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual

Upcoming

CSL Elite League 2026
ASL Season 21
Acropolis #4 - TS6
2026 Changsha Offline CUP
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
NationLESS Cup
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.