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On June 16 2011 03:00 Jinsho wrote:
In my opinion TotalBiscuit is immature. I followed his casting a while back when he was doing other stuff, and he was constantly raging on how people did not appreciate what he was doing, how he is so important for esports and the community. He did not respond well to criticism of any kind, instead resorting to things like "i'd like to see YOU do better". So I stopped supporting him.
His style of casting doesn't resonate with me either, so I do not enjoy watching him cast SC2 at all. That's pretty much it.
Excellent! That post, aside from Nazgul's, was probably the best thing in this thread so far. My "facts" people can question and that's fine. But you, you have legitimate, reasonable reasons why you don't care for the guy. That was one of the things I am was trying to get across. Good, logical conversation about things like this are things I wish would happen more often instead of, "This blog is terrible."
Thank you.
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Nazgul said it perfectly.
I'm a TB fan and proud of it. I love watching the videos he does of other games as well. If I'm on the fence about a game, I'll look to see if TB has done a review on it and see what his impressions were and judge them to what I've learned for myself. TB always does a very thorough review of any video game he uploads.
As for SC2, he's stated many times he does it for pure entertainment and not necessarily for knowledge and I'm glad he's up front about that.
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Generally: I have nothing but admiration and respect for TotalBiscuit. His last mailbox video about boycotting games with consumer-harming conditions (Battlefield 3 unique preorder weapons specifically) was very inspiring and set an example for all of us to follow. I started listening to him cast SC2 during the beta because his voice and style intrigued me, but since then I've followed pretty much everything on his channel except for SC2 content. He's become a terrific entertainer, a dedicated community member, and an esports scion.
Starcraft 2: While I no longer watch TB's SC2 videos on youtube, I do really enjoy the opportunity to hear him cast a tournament, and here's why: When I watch SC2, I watch it to be entertained. I love the game. I don't sit down with a pen/paper to dissect every build order and try to get into masters, I sit down with beer and chips, get excited about the drama and crazy shit that happens, and dick around in platinum league when I have time. I feel like there are many thousands of SC2 viewers just like me in that regard, as many people on TL watch more SC2 than they play. TB follows the game well enough and uses his entertaining speech to contribute to what these kinds of fans want to see: a fun and exciting game.
This is why TB is awesome. I have a better time watching games with him casting than with Idra because I couldn't care less about whether or not the caster has enough game sense to tell me what's going to happen. I'm going to see it for myself in 2 minutes anyways, so I'd rather have the commentator get excited and take me along for the ride.
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Look, Tastosis is awesome. Day9 is freaking gosu in so many ways. But TB? Man, TB is greater than god. It's no shame to say you're less smart than Einstein. It's no shame to say you're not as creative as Leonardo da Vince.
I do love both Tastosis and specially Day9. But you can't compare them to Total Biscuit. He's on another level of awesomeness.
A few vocal minority will always exist about anything doesn't matter how awesome it is. At the end of the day, haters are not nearly as relevant as the supporters.
If you disagree... then.. then... YOUR RUINING ESPORTS!
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I love TotalBiscuit, even though I have only been a subscriber for the past couple of months I dont miss a single video from him (apart from the WoW dailies as I don't play WoW), hes an honour to the SC2 community and helps eSports a great deal. Hes a legend.
However I fail to see his logic when it comes to his YouTube presence. In a mailbox (which was a while ago) he said that video game developers should stop putting DRM and protection in their games as it makes the developer look like they treat their customers like thieves. However, TB does not read his YouTube comments and instead leaves it to moderators to pass on messages, basically making TB look like a hypocrite by treating all his customers like trolls, which we aren't.
Maybe its just me who feels this way....
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I think TB is great, however tweeting "well i thats one person i won't be inviting to my next tourney" perplexed me.
Idra doesn't like TB's casting, as Idra is almost universally agreed to be the best analyst out there and thinks people who know zip about the game aren't good casters, he is entitled to that opinion. Not inviting a player to your tourney because they don't like you or your casting is like saying "being a good guy is more important than being good at the game".
If i were a caster and Idra called me the worst caster on the face of the planet, said that i was scum and should die, I would still invite him to my tourneys because he is that good that I'd want him in it. Who cares if he doesn't like me, i'm sure he'll be perfectly fine with taking my money and attempting to smash nerds for my enjoyment which is what SC2 is about.
I don't respect any tourney that values something other than skill, it shouldn't be a popularity contest and it shouldn't be a personality contest... thats what beauty pageants are for, and I think we can safely say that Anna has that market locked up in the SC2 community and rightly so.
anywho, there is a place for everyone in this community and blind hate is stupid, I don't agree with idra's views but I can understand his viewpoint. I also respect that TB is actively trying to get better at the game and to learn more, but as i said above I just don't see how you can have tourney invites that don't include one of the best players in the world just because he doesn't like your casting and have your tourney respected.
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TotalBiscuit, because he's so focused on the art of broadcasting, is out of touch with the Starcraft community and what they expect from commentators. He may in the traditional sense be a picture-perfect broadcast personality, but the Starcraft casting community grew organically out of the players and fans themselves.
Whenever TB goes into a rant about how the way he does things is the way things should be done because when you watch [X televised sport] this guy does this and this guy does this, he's technically correct. But hardly anyone cares about that.
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On June 16 2011 02:55 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
When Treetop says TotalBiscuit is the best caster in the world of video games he is specifically implying that SC2 is only a part of that world. He's just saying what TB does in other games is not something the casters you have come to love so much in SC2 would be able to do. I think he's probably right about that, although I don't know any non-SC2 casters personally.
The TB hate is really ridiculous. There are tons of respected casters that don't understand the game very well, and as long as they cast in a manner that shows they are aware of this it can still lead to great casting. Especially when paired with someone with more knowledge.
Agree, and it's not like he's sc2-dumb either. I mean, casting for months and months games of the highest level will bring the caster some knowledge. And he even plays the game and stream his playing sessions. Yes, he doesn't deliver high level analysis, he's sometime wrong like every other caster, but he still know the game.
That's strange, personally I like Idra casts and I like TB casts too. Both have a different atmosphere, I learn from Idra and I'm entertained by TB. Both are fine and you can like one without hating the other.
On a side note, the TB hate isn't real TB hate, it's just Idra fanboys who hate because idra said they must hate (for the most part). Like idra said "My fans are dumb".
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TB is a good caster. His knowledge is no worse than 99% of the other casters out there, and he does his best to work up the crowd to get into the game.
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On June 16 2011 03:36 emythrel wrote:
I don't respect any tourney that values something other than skill
[...]
anywho, there is a place for everyone in this community and blind hate is stupid, I don't agree with idra's views but I can understand his viewpoint. I also respect that TB is actively trying to get better at the game and to learn more, but as i said above I just don't see how you can have tourney invites that don't include one of the best players in the world just because he doesn't like your casting and have your tourney respected. If you really believed on what you're saying. If you really believe you should respect other people's opinion. Shouldn't you respect TB's opinion and his position to leave Idra out?
Your post can be summarized to:
- I disagree with blind hate, so here it goes:
[blind hates]
I mean, personally I wouldn't leave Idra out myself. And I do understand and respect your opinion about it. But I can also understand and respect TB's opinion. On his point of view, it's understandable. Even if I disagree I won't lose respect for him. I disagree a lot with a lot of people I love. You can be constructive critic.
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In the end, they do what they do for the love of the game. I really see no reason why any arguments are necessary. TB does need lot of work regarding his casting in terms of experience.
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Its just in vogue among the "leet" kids to hate on TB.
All the analytic casters make mistakes constantly but no-one calls them out when they do.
Also, I would rather be entertained by good professional casting than bored to sleep by some analytic 5 minute commentary about stuff I already know about.
Furthermore, TB can always improve his game knowledge. Idra will always be boring though, and I dont think he will be able to change that 
That being said, I dont think any caster (including idra) are really bad. I do enjoy them all, and having variety is always a good thing.
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On June 16 2011 02:55 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
When Treetop says TotalBiscuit is the best caster in the world of video games he is specifically implying that SC2 is only a part of that world. He's just saying what TB does in other games is not something the casters you have come to love so much in SC2 would be able to do. I think he's probably right about that, although I don't know any non-SC2 casters personally.
The TB hate is really ridiculous. There are tons of respected casters that don't understand the game very well, and as long as they cast in a manner that shows they are aware of this it can still lead to great casting. Especially when paired with someone with more knowledge.
On a related note, TB does himself a huge disservice when he engages with the people who openly hate him. It's incredibly useless, and only brings out more haters because they know they can get a response out of him.
There are plenty of other casters that are successful that people hate, yet they don't pay any attention to them and just keep on doing their own thing.
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So...this is a argument about peoples opinions, conflicting between Idra and TB, that was started because they don't like each others, which is also an opinion.
This leads to the question, why not enjoy what You enjoy? Why not watch what You want to watch? Instead of moaning and annoying two highly valuable members of the sc2 community.
But in the end, 'tis nothing but an opinion in itself, so inevitablity be ignored by the haters
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Idra stated categorically that TB sucks, If he had said I dont like TB's casting, THEN its is ok and then he is just stating his opinion. But saying that TB sucks, is just malicious hate on someone who tried to give him constructive criticism, before anybody disagrees or argues with me, READ EVERYTHING IN THIS, TB's article and then Idra's response, it is quite clear that TB was very respectful where Idra was not.
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These 2 are so much smarter than everyone gives them credit for. Sure they don't like each other that much is clear. Something as simple as that one would assume they would just ignore each other and move on, but they are more intelligent than that, they feed into the drama because they know people love that shit and will eat it right up. I'm not saying their remarks back and forth to one another don't have any merit , just that they both realize whats actually going on when they feed into it. It's almost a cross promotion of sorts. They are only giving each other and themselves more attention and in this type of environment that is never a bad thing. Idra has been making remarks like this for a while and its not because he's just a hate filled person, he just realizes that by making fringe statements thousands of people will jump on them and start talking about it like its the most important thing ever.
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On June 16 2011 02:54 JackMcCoy wrote:
Fact: Green is the best color.
Fact: The Rolling Stones are the best band.
Fact: This blog is terrible.
What are the Rolling Stones?
I follow TotalBiscuit on twitter, and considering a lot of the hate he gets(now), I think he handles himself pretty well. :/
I absolutely LOVE his casting, because it makes me feel like I'm watching a real sport(not saying e-sports isn't a real sport, but I mean more like outside sport) and it gets me so pumped.
Although his knowledge is lacking, I'm sure if paired with the right person, it would be fantastic.
Either way, I think he's doing a fine job, BM or not. It entertains me more than anything.
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So... it was a good read on your opion about TB. I don't agree with it in full but for the most part I agree on how TB is a great caster overall in many different games.
If it is true that TB said no to IdrA for a tournament invite then good on TB for showing some people you can't be accepted into tournies just by pure skill while your attitude during and outside of the tournament is utter trash.
+ Show Spoiler +This blog has a lot of great responses though. Did the people who are bashing you for your opinion in an editorial not understand what an editorial is?
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the people who dont like TB do not understand what a caster is. they prefer analytical casterss, which is fine, but that is more of a colour commentator roll.
TB is an excellent 'caster'. he may suck at SC, and can provide hardly any DEEP analytical information about the game, but that is irrelevant to being a broadcaster.
You take all of the SC2 casters and put them on a different game, and TB would be one of the few that shine, because he is a broadcaster.
Learn the difference before saying TB is a bad caster
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Meh I guess he is fine for the casual gamers, but I just don't see his appeal in spouting random nothingness while other casters attempt to explain and analyze the game. His professionalism can't really be doubted and neither can his success, but the only reason he receives hate around these parts is that he is ridiculously casual and has never ever been "good" at a game. This is fine for some broadcasters but the traditionally "elitist" community of SC2 is less accepting.
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EPT
