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EDIT: I am not complaining about the lag, nor am I saying the tournament is unsuccessful. I only want to discuss what consequences the complaints of OTHERS may have on the TSL, whether there is any merit to these complaints, and what may be done about them.
So, it seems that the big topic of controversy and discussion surrounding the TSL 3 has been the various problems with lag/latency. These issues have led many to believe that the Korean participants' ability to play consistently and to the highest ability has been undermined. Many, including Korean netizens and Boxer's girlfriend, have even claimed that this factor alone has been the deciding factor in the results for Korean players.
Now, I'm not here to start another topic about how severe the lag actually is or whether the Koreans face an insurmountable handicap to their play because of it, but rather to address how these concerns effect the way the TSL 3 is viewed as a major competitive tournament.
I would say that the TSL 3 has all the building blocks assembled to be considered one of the top tournaments around, with the excellent organization, high viewership by the foreign community and contribution by GOMtv to further include the Korean community, big prize pool, and good casters it would be hard to say otherwise. And I can only say that the quality has only improved since TSL 1 and 2. It has really set itself up to be one of the biggest and most successful tournaments which includes the foreign community, making it a much more internationally focused event in a way that is prohibitive in the GSL format.
However, I've seen many saying that because it is an online tournament, and that there are these latency issues, it doesn't realistically reflect the skills and potential of the people playing and thus nullifies the results of the matches. These claims that the results cannot be trusted seem to undermine the premise that this is a serious competitive tournament. All of the hard work and organization to set up an international tournament thus seems worthless if people are not going to even consider it seriously.
Should these issues disqualify TSL 3 as a legitimate international and fair tournament, as some seem to think? Even though I disagree, i'm wondering if these views are justified, and what the TSL organizers could do in the future to avoid this disparaging by some members of the community.
Personally, looking at some of the decision making made by the Korean participants in their matches and the post by Jinro that it is possible to adjust to the latency, I think the Koreans definitely can play on equal footing as the foreigners, but they simply have not put in enough practice to adjust, and this should not reflect negatively on the TSL itself. They have done everything they can to resolve these problems, and obviously blizzard is not going to try and help with this, so there really aren't many other options for this internationally focused event. Perhaps all the matches from the Ro32 should be held in single location, as I know they are doing this for the finals, and it would dissuade the complaints, but that may not be logistically possible for the organizers or players. What do you think? I really want the TSL to become a mainstay of the Starcraft 2 competitive tournament scene and am disappointed to see that it is being questioned in its viability for recognition on the same level as GSL in the future.
  
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TSL has been perfect in every way so far imo.
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On March 28 2011 03:31 LuckyFool wrote:
TSL has been perfect in every way so far imo.
I can't agree. I'm not saying the foreigners wouldn't be able to win in equal situations, they played very well; but I'll always ask, "what would've the outcome been without latency?" I am actually hoping they get eliminated (the remaining Koreans) now just so it doesn't have a sense of unfairness.
And everyone cheering on foreigners feels equally unfair; it's like me beating someone at a sport who is coming to play very sick, and everyone congratulates me for it.
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Korea (South)11584 Posts
On March 28 2011 03:31 LuckyFool wrote:
TSL has been perfect in every way so far imo.
disagree. Where's the DOWN DOWN DOWN.
and where's the BW?
everything besides those 2 things, it's very much pretty awesome.
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+ Show Spoiler +FXOpen Invitational yesterday wasn't played on the Korean server and a Korean won it.
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On March 28 2011 03:39 Zim23 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +FXOpen Invitational yesterday wasn't played on the Korean server and a Korean won it. What you're saying is ridiculous and overblown. Also the TSL3 has already succeeded. It's not some fledgling tournament trying to make it. It is a mainstay, it has gotten more views than any other online SC2 tournament, it is now the golden standard. Lag is an integral part of an online game, something all of us have dealt with. Doesn't undermine anything.
Yes, I agree. This does seem waaaay overblown + I don't think the OP knows that TSL has already been established as being legitimate. There is no question in almost everyones mind that the TSL is legitimate and the winner is the one who prepared the most, trained the hardest and played the best.
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+ Show Spoiler +On March 28 2011 03:39 Zim23 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +FXOpen Invitational yesterday wasn't played on the Korean server and a Korean won it. What you're saying is ridiculous and overblown. Also the TSL3 has already succeeded. It's not some fledgling tournament trying to make it. It is a mainstay, it has gotten more views than any other online SC2 tournament, it is now the golden standard. Lag is an integral part of an online game, something all of us have dealt with. Doesn't undermine anything.
Perhaps I should've made my position clearer. I agree that the TSL 3 has been great and acknowledged the massive viewership, I'm trying to address the opinions of the many vocal critics who would put these accomplishments down and am only trying to begin a discussion as to what could assuage their complaints, if they need to be dealt with at all that is, which it seems many don't think so. I guess a minority was just being very loud and I took it to be a larger, more serious group than it actually is. I apologize if I came off as uniformed or as one of those critics myself 
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Lag/lat may make you mess up a tiny bit in some battles, but if you practice on that server for a while then you get used to it. If you are the better play you should win regardless of a slight delay. Koreans fault for not taking the games seriously enough. I've seen Cella play on NA server and he owns up nerds just fine.
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On March 28 2011 03:39 Zim23 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +FXOpen Invitational yesterday wasn't played on the Korean server and a Korean won it. What you're saying is ridiculous and overblown. Also the TSL3 has already succeeded. It's not some fledgling tournament trying to make it. It is a mainstay, it has gotten more views than any other online SC2 tournament, it is now the golden standard. Lag is an integral part of an online game, something all of us have dealt with. Doesn't undermine anything.
Sure it undermines it. Just because all games have to deal with it doesn't mean it's fair. It's not a true competition if someone has an unfair advantage over another. I think the TSL has been a great success, creating entertaining games and loads of views nonetheless.
Also, all games don't deal with it, look at BW. LAN ftw.
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On March 28 2011 04:06 Inori wrote:
I thought games were played on neutral server? i.e. us vs kor @ eu
ROFL
stares @ john the translator
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This is a Blizzard problem, not a TSL3 problem.
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46k current viewers and there isn't even a game going on atm. 50k-ish viewers when there's a game in progress.
I'd say the TSL is doing well.
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On March 28 2011 03:34 CaucasianAsian wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2011 03:31 LuckyFool wrote:
TSL has been perfect in every way so far imo. disagree. Where's the DOWN DOWN DOWN. and where's the BW? everything besides those 2 things, it's very much pretty awesome.
seconded.
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On March 28 2011 03:39 Zim23 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +FXOpen Invitational yesterday wasn't played on the Korean server and a Korean won it. What you're saying is ridiculous and overblown. Also the TSL3 has already succeeded. It's not some fledgling tournament trying to make it. It is a mainstay, it has gotten more views than any other online SC2 tournament, it is now the golden standard. Lag is an integral part of an online game, something all of us have dealt with. Doesn't undermine anything.
This seems like the post of someone born in like 2004 o.O
Lag is an integral part of an online game? The hell? How about almost every single game ever played in tournaments before this ridiculous 2010+ fad of games developers not putting in LAN support
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On March 28 2011 04:07 Misanthrope wrote:
This is a Blizzard problem, not a TSL3 problem.
exactly. TL does everything to provide as fair a playing field as possibly. There's literally nothing more than can do. So to say the integrity of the TSL is in question honestly is questioning the integrity of the entire game.
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I stopped reading at "Boxer's girlfriend".
She is a master on the subject, huh?
edit: I can't believe I'm adding to this, but Adelscott played MVP on the NA server from Europe, obviously. What's the excuse for that?
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On March 28 2011 04:11 sc4k wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2011 03:39 Zim23 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +FXOpen Invitational yesterday wasn't played on the Korean server and a Korean won it. What you're saying is ridiculous and overblown. Also the TSL3 has already succeeded. It's not some fledgling tournament trying to make it. It is a mainstay, it has gotten more views than any other online SC2 tournament, it is now the golden standard. Lag is an integral part of an online game, something all of us have dealt with. Doesn't undermine anything. This seems like the post of someone born in like 2004 o.O Lag is an integral part of an online game? The hell? How about almost every single game ever played in tournaments before this ridiculous 2010+ fad of games developers not putting in LAN support
You do know this is an online tournament right? And players are playing cross-world? Lag is par for the course there, and there's nothing TL could do about it.
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TSL is a great tournament, with an excellent array of players and casters. They also tried to reduce the lag problem as much as they could. On the other hand, it is showing SC2 is so volatile that we could as well play cointoss to decide victory.
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It's a tournament hosted in NA. If the Koreans wanna play, either face the latency or come to NA to play, it's not TL fault.
Jinro has already stated the latency isn't game decisive if you practice to get around it.
//tx
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EPT
