• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 17:12
CEST 23:12
KST 06:12
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror4[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10
Community News
5.0.17 Patch Notes - October 7, 20269Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4)0SC4ALL: II SC2 Complete Invited Player Lineup10StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026)78Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double2
StarCraft 2
General
5.0.17 Patch Notes - October 7, 2026 [Old] StarCraft 3 Reportedly in Development StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026) How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4)
Tourneys
ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament 2026 GSTL Grand Finals Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 546 Catch the Train The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 545 And Drops and Rifts Mutation # 544 Double Trouble
Brood War
General
Fantasy returning? BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion GG Lan Fest Sofia, Bulgaria [this November] Sagi.gg Launcher Released
Tourneys
[ASL22] Semifinal B [ASL22] Semifinal A [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Ro8 Day 4
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Zero
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Artificial Intelligence Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Escaping Into Video Games: G…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8737 users

Rant 1: STOP with the damn BW Comparisons

Blogs > deth2munkies
Post a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 Next All
deth2munkies
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States4051 Posts
September 24 2010 19:46 GMT
#1
Preface: Yeah, check the join date, I joined during the SC2 beta where I heard TL was to Starcraft 2, EJ was to WoW. Before I joined, I had a tangential relationship at best with the BW scene: I beat my friends at it with DT rushes and occasionally watched a Korean do unreasonably awesome things with it whenever it was linked to me by a 3rd party. So yeah, I'm from the SC2 generation: deal with it.


OK, I get it, this has been a BW site for a long ass time before SC2 was even on the drawing board, but that doesn't mean we have to compare them in every other post. While it's died down some, you still can't get a thread going long enough in the SC2 forums before someone mentions how it was so much better in BW or how lurkers should be in SC2 or how micro was more important in BW, etc. Here's the kicker: None of that shit matters at all. Starcraft 2 is not attempting to compete with Starcraft 1, it is attempting to compete with Dawn of War, Total War, and other RTS series out today.

Let's take a non-nostalgia tinted comparison of SC1 vs SC2. SC1 is a buggy game with shit graphics, terrible UI, terrible AI and unit pathing, and sub par sound and voice acting. Did that hurt? It's true.

SC1 was revolutionary for the time, but now it's outdated, and 90% of the things you're bitching about (reduced micro potential, et al) are actually improvements rather than problems. Yeah, sure, Starcraft 1 was so terrible that you had to not only overcome your opponent, but the game itself to actually win. With Starcraft 2, you don't have to fight the game mechanics as much so you're free to focus on your opponent.

People wanting old units/voices/music/micro/etc are too blinded by nostalgia to enjoy the greatest RTS to come out in the last 5 years at least, and it's time SC2 was judged on its own merits or at least against its peers, rather than against a game whose only leg up on SC2 is the same name and nostalgia. So get over it and move on if you want to post about SC2 or in the SC2 forums. Otherwise stick to BW and keep your shit out of my areas.

/endrant

*
seRapH
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States9830 Posts
September 24 2010 19:48 GMT
#2
On September 25 2010 04:46 deth2munkies wrote:
Starcraft 2 is not attempting to compete with Starcraft 1, it is attempting to compete with Dawn of War, Total War, and other RTS series out today.

i'm sorry, but you clearly have no clue what the hell is going on do you?
boomer hands
Comeh
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States18919 Posts
September 24 2010 19:49 GMT
#3
Why shouldn't we compare it to scbw? The format is similar - however the best reason to compare the two games is that broodwar is the epitome of competitive gaming - its simply the best game that has ever come out. It has the best balance, amazingly high skill gap, ridiculous mechanics, and the hardest to master game ever. If a board game comes out that people claim as being the best game ever, isn't it fair to compare it to chess and Go?
ヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノDELETE ICEFROGヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(⌐■_■)ノヽ(
seRapH
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States9830 Posts
September 24 2010 19:51 GMT
#4
oh btw, we're not blinded by nostalgia (many bw supporters are actually relatively new), and you're blinded by shiny graphics :D
boomer hands
mdb
Profile Blog Joined February 2003
Bulgaria4059 Posts
September 24 2010 19:52 GMT
#5
Ok, sorry. I`ll keep my shit out of your area.
LunarDestiny
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States4177 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-24 20:06:03
September 24 2010 19:52 GMT
#6
Let's take a non-nostalgia tinted comparison of SC1 vs SC2. SC1 is a buggy game with shit graphics, terrible UI, terrible AI and unit pathing, and sub par sound and voice acting. Did that hurt? It's true.


Stopped reading right there.

On a side note, BW is considered to be the best RTS at balancing and skill cap. If SC2 is not comparing itself to the best RTS out there, then I don't know what is it trying to do.

If you wish the BW people not to hijack the SC2 forum, you can just ask. Insulting the game won't help at all.
Monokeros
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
United States2493 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-24 19:54:24
September 24 2010 19:53 GMT
#7
On September 25 2010 04:48 seRapH wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 25 2010 04:46 deth2munkies wrote:
Starcraft 2 is not attempting to compete with Starcraft 1, it is attempting to compete with Dawn of War, Total War, and other RTS series out today.

i'm sorry, but you clearly have no clue what the hell is going on do you?


to further clarify on this somewhat vague reply to this seemingly well-thought out and very emotional OP
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=150858

Is a clear example of why SC2 recieves a lot of heat from BW fans, simply because its arrival threatens the BW community more than any other game. That being said as long as they dont destroy each other in the end I'm sure the outcome will be 'favorable' at best.
Keep the Dream Alive twitch.tv/monokerros
emperorchampion
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada9496 Posts
September 24 2010 19:55 GMT
#8
u hert mi feelings
TRUEESPORTS || your days as a respected member of team liquid are over
FetusFondler
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States246 Posts
September 24 2010 19:55 GMT
#9
On September 25 2010 04:46 deth2munkies wrote:
Starcraft 2 is not attempting to compete with Starcraft 1, it is attempting to compete with Dawn of War, Total War, and other RTS series out today.


Are you saying that Starcraft: BW isn't an RTS?

And aren't you doing the same thing as the people who compare BW to SC2? Complaining about the differences between the games? I'm confused.
None are so busy as the fool and knave.
FetusFondler
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States246 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-24 19:59:11
September 24 2010 19:57 GMT
#10
On September 25 2010 04:53 Monokeros wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 25 2010 04:48 seRapH wrote:
On September 25 2010 04:46 deth2munkies wrote:
Starcraft 2 is not attempting to compete with Starcraft 1, it is attempting to compete with Dawn of War, Total War, and other RTS series out today.

i'm sorry, but you clearly have no clue what the hell is going on do you?


to further clarify on this somewhat vague reply to this seemingly well-thought out and very emotional OP
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=150858

Is a clear example of why SC2 recieves a lot of heat from BW fans, simply because its arrival threatens the BW community more than any other game. That being said as long as they dont destroy each other in the end I'm sure the outcome will be 'favorable' at best.


Well the OP contradicted himself, unless he was under the impression that BW was NOT in fact a legitimate RTS, which is wrong. And if so, ruins his credibility. Er, at least, that's what I assumed.

And SC2 only effects the BW community in terms of Progaming, the game itself will still have a huge fanbase.
None are so busy as the fool and knave.
awu25
Profile Joined April 2010
United States2003 Posts
September 24 2010 19:58 GMT
#11
i think one of the problems is that many people grew up with BW
they grow attached to it and then SC2 comes out, and now they're older and able to pick out the flaws of something instead of blindly thinking something is awesome
also, there's the fact that BW took like 10 years to get awesome and a ton of people are complaining about how there won't be any creativity in SC2 even though it's only been out for 2 months
gods_basement
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States305 Posts
September 24 2010 19:59 GMT
#12
I read the forums quite a bit, but i havent read any of these comparisons since phase one beta. could you provide some examples?
(TT~TT)
asianskill
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States289 Posts
September 24 2010 19:59 GMT
#13
scbw is anything but outdated
herrro
Kralic
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Canada2628 Posts
September 24 2010 20:02 GMT
#14
You do know people compare stuff to good or proven stuff? Read any car and driver magazine when they do a review on a sports sedan. 9 times out of 10 they will compare it to a BMW 3 series sedan(Not related except for the fact they are both Sport Sedans(RTS games with mostly the same things).

I do get sick of the BW vs SC2 debacle but that is something else.
Brood War forever!
Hunch
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Canada336 Posts
September 24 2010 20:03 GMT
#15
rant all you want your argument is invalid with the points your using.
I have a Hunch.770
tree.hugger
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-24 20:07:42
September 24 2010 20:05 GMT
#16
So in arguing that we should stop comparing BW to Sc2, you basically compare Sc2 extremely favorably to BW. Good one.

On September 25 2010 04:48 seRapH wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 25 2010 04:46 deth2munkies wrote:
Starcraft 2 is not attempting to compete with Starcraft 1, it is attempting to compete with Dawn of War, Total War, and other RTS series out today.

i'm sorry, but you clearly have no clue what the hell is going on do you?

And Starcraft 2 and BW are not just competitors, they're integral to each others existence. BW built this house, this isn't "your areas". Even if you're not a fan of BW, know your history, or don't attempt to argue it.

Can't wait for Rant #2.
ModeratorEffOrt, Snow, GuMiho, and Team Liquid
Kraznaya
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States3711 Posts
September 24 2010 20:07 GMT
#17
cool story bro

User was temp banned for this post.
do you have enough resolve, hero of justice?
PoP
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
France15446 Posts
September 24 2010 20:09 GMT
#18
On September 25 2010 04:46 deth2munkies, in a thread called "Rant 1: STOP with the damn BW Comparisons", wrote:
Let's take a non-nostalgia tinted comparison of SC1 vs SC2. SC1 is a buggy game with shit graphics, terrible UI, terrible AI and unit pathing, and sub par sound and voice acting. Did that hurt? It's true.

SC1 was revolutionary for the time, but now it's outdated, and 90% of the things you're bitching about (reduced micro potential, et al) are actually improvements rather than problems. Yeah, sure, Starcraft 1 was so terrible that you had to not only overcome your opponent, but the game itself to actually win. With Starcraft 2, you don't have to fight the game mechanics as much so you're free to focus on your opponent.


How do you want people to take you seriously when your points are so ridiculously wrong and over-exaggerated, while at the same time completely contradicting the very title of your post?

I do agree (partly) with the title though. Good job on that at least.
Administrator
Piy
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Scotland3152 Posts
September 24 2010 20:10 GMT
#19
This is like those conversations people had about BW when WC3 came out.
My. Copy. Is. Here.
DragoonPK
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
3259 Posts
September 24 2010 20:12 GMT
#20
Really dude? I love BW to death and still think its the greatest RTS ever made. Comparison to BW is not the problem, the problem is people not giving SC2 a chance. Blantly saying its bad from now doesnt make sense to me. In addition , dont talk like you lived the whole BW scene, because trust me if you weren't there during the Daum OSL finals watching GGplay vs Iris then you have no idea how much BW means to people and why we always compare SC2 to it.
1 2 3 4 5 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 3m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
mouzHeroMarine 590
ProTech145
RuFF_SC2 112
Liquid`TLO 103
Nina 94
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 19408
firebathero 91
Bale 22
PianO 15
Sacsri 4
Dota 2
Gorgc7774
monkeys_forever178
canceldota35
League of Legends
Doublelift3125
Counter-Strike
fl0m1026
Super Smash Bros
PPMD30
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu830
Other Games
summit1g5632
FrodaN1250
Beastyqt510
shahzam478
mouzStarbuck289
B2W.Neo262
ToD229
C9.Mang0141
RotterdaM91
UpATreeSC76
Mew2King38
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 50
• mYiSmile113
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 21
• niya90s 1
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Other Games
• imaqtpie1156
• Shiphtur660
Upcoming Events
OSC
1h 3m
Replay Cast
1h 48m
OSC
1d 1h
Big Brain Bouts
1d 12h
Rex vs INexorable
GgMaChine vs HeRoMaRinE
Reynor vs herO
AI Arena Tournament
1d 19h
BSL: Ladder Tournament
1d 21h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
Patches Events
2 days
BSL Open Qualifier
2 days
BSL Open Qualifier
2 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Copium Cup

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - GSB
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
HCC Season 3
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.