• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 20:24
CEST 02:24
KST 09:24
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S RO12 Preview: Maru, Trigger, Rogue, NightMare12Code S RO12 Preview: Cure, sOs, Reynor, Solar15[ASL19] Ro8 Preview: Unyielding3Official Ladder Map Pool Update (April 28, 2025)17[ASL19] Ro8 Preview: Rejuvenation8
Community News
Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A Results (2025)4$1,250 WardiTV May [May 6th-May 18th]5Clem wins PiG Sty Festival #67Weekly Cups (April 28-May 4): ByuN & Astrea break through1Nexon wins bid to develop StarCraft IP content, distribute Overwatch mobile game29
StarCraft 2
General
Clem wins PiG Sty Festival #6 How does the number of casters affect your enjoyment of esports? Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A Results (2025) Code S RO12 Preview: Maru, Trigger, Rogue, NightMare Nexon wins bid to develop StarCraft IP content, distribute Overwatch mobile game
Tourneys
[GSL 2025] Code S:Season 1 - RO12 - Group B [GSL 2025] Code S:Season 1 - RO12 - Group A $1,250 WardiTV May [May 6th-May 18th] SOOPer7s Showmatches 2025 Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
[G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 472 Dead Heat Mutation # 471 Delivery Guaranteed Mutation # 470 Certain Demise Mutation # 469 Frostbite
Brood War
General
(UMS) Artosis vs Ogre Zerg [The Legend Continues] BW General Discussion BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Recent recommended BW games Preserving Battlereports.com
Tourneys
[BSL20] RO32 Group F - Saturday 20:00 CET [BSL20] RO32 Group E - Sunday 20:00 CET [ASL19] Ro8 Day 4 [CSLPRO] $1000 Spring is Here!
Strategy
[G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player Creating a full chart of Zerg builds [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread What do you want from future RTS games? Nintendo Switch Thread Grand Theft Auto VI Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread TL Mafia Plays: Diplomacy TL Mafia: Generative Agents Showdown Survivor II: The Amazon
Community
General
UK Politics Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Elon Musk's lies, propaganda, etc. Ask and answer stupid questions here!
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Books] Wool by Hugh Howey Surprisingly good films/Hidden Gems
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread NHL Playoffs 2024 NBA General Discussion Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Cleaning My Mechanical Keyboard How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard?
TL Community
BLinD-RawR 50K Post Watch Party The Automated Ban List TL.net Ten Commandments
Blogs
Why 5v5 Games Keep Us Hooked…
TrAiDoS
Info SLEgma_12
SLEgma_12
SECOND COMMING
XenOsky
WombaT’s Old BW Terran Theme …
WombaT
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
BW PvZ Balance hypothetic…
Vasoline73
Test Entry for subject
xumakis
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 12143 users

Efficiency vs Effectiveness

Blogs > MaD.pYrO
Post a Reply
1 2 Next All
Mr.Pyro
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Denmark959 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-03 17:16:01
March 03 2010 11:42 GMT
#1
Have to admit there seems to stem a lot of confusion from people when using words like efficiency, efficient, effective and so on.

I'd really love it if people could keep the differences between the two, and really leads to a lot of miscommunication.


Efficiency - Efficency deals with how effective something is in regards to the cost of it.
Crude example - Wood is more efficient for building houses, but steel is more effective because it is tougher. Nanogel is also far more effective but not efficient.

In the same manner you may say that 20 zerglings are quite effective against 5 marines - but this doesn't mean that zerglings are efficient against marines.


ef·fi·cien·cy
   /ɪˈfɪʃənsi/ [ih-fish-uhn-see]
the ratio of the work done or energy developed by a machine, engine, etc., to the energy supplied to it, usually expressed as a percentage.




ef·fec·tive

adequate to accomplish a purpose; producing the intended or expected result: effective teaching methods; effective steps toward peace.


..

So when having these balance discussions i'd really like people to notice the difference between the two, because frankly my brain sometimes hurts when it's apparent that a lot of people don't

Happy Gaming
-Mr.Pyro

***
P⊧[1]<a>[2]<a>[3]<a>tt | P ≝ 1.a.2.a.3.a.P
Kashll
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States1117 Posts
March 03 2010 11:44 GMT
#2
you forgot to define efficacy
"After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music." - Aldous Huxley
Mr.Pyro
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Denmark959 Posts
March 03 2010 12:14 GMT
#3
Don't introduce more things to confuse people =p
P⊧[1]<a>[2]<a>[3]<a>tt | P ≝ 1.a.2.a.3.a.P
Patriot.dlk
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Sweden5462 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-03 12:15:54
March 03 2010 12:15 GMT
#4
Sauron
Profile Joined November 2008
Romania169 Posts
March 03 2010 12:20 GMT
#5
Wow, really effective blog. I learned somenthing today.(or at least I hope so) Make more of them!
Soothsayer
NovaTheFeared
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
United States7212 Posts
March 03 2010 12:25 GMT
#6
I think 20 zerglings are both effective and efficient vs. 5 marines.
日本語が分かりますか
meeple
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Canada10211 Posts
March 03 2010 12:26 GMT
#7
On March 03 2010 21:20 Sauron wrote:
Wow, really effective blog. I learned somenthing today.(or at least I hope so) Make more of them!


Ah but was it efficient? Could he have said the same thing with less words?
Mr.Pyro
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Denmark959 Posts
March 03 2010 12:28 GMT
#8
On March 03 2010 21:26 meeple wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 03 2010 21:20 Sauron wrote:
Wow, really effective blog. I learned somenthing today.(or at least I hope so) Make more of them!


Ah but was it efficient? Could he have said the same thing with less words?


Or could i have made the point more effectively by using DIFFERENT words? HMM...
P⊧[1]<a>[2]<a>[3]<a>tt | P ≝ 1.a.2.a.3.a.P
Ftrunkz
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
Australia2474 Posts
March 03 2010 12:38 GMT
#9
so basically scouts are efficient, but not very effective for anti air?
@NvPinder on twitter | Member of Gamecom Nv | http://www.clan-ta.com | http://www.youtube.com/user/ftrunkz | http://www.twitchtv.com/xghpinder
aqui
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Germany1023 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-03 15:37:46
March 03 2010 12:40 GMT
#10
effectively this is a very inefficient use of me time, i should rather improve my efficacy in other areas.
edit:yarrr, shiver me timbers
Jakalo
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Latvia2350 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-03 13:14:28
March 03 2010 13:12 GMT
#11
ef.. effec.. feces
Nostalgia is not as good as it used to be.
Mr.Pyro
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Denmark959 Posts
March 03 2010 13:18 GMT
#12
On March 03 2010 21:38 Ftrunkz wrote:
so basically scouts are efficient, but not very effective for anti air?



Basically 20 zealots are effective against 1 ultralisk, but Zealots aren't efficient against ultralisks.
P⊧[1]<a>[2]<a>[3]<a>tt | P ≝ 1.a.2.a.3.a.P
krndandaman
Profile Joined August 2009
Mozambique16569 Posts
March 03 2010 14:27 GMT
#13
--- Nuked ---
Ftrunkz
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
Australia2474 Posts
March 03 2010 14:40 GMT
#14
On March 03 2010 22:18 MaD.pYrO wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 03 2010 21:38 Ftrunkz wrote:
so basically scouts are efficient, but not very effective for anti air?



Basically 20 zealots are effective against 1 ultralisk, but Zealots aren't efficient against ultralisks.

TROLLLLLLLLED! YES!
@NvPinder on twitter | Member of Gamecom Nv | http://www.clan-ta.com | http://www.youtube.com/user/ftrunkz | http://www.twitchtv.com/xghpinder
JohannesH
Profile Joined September 2009
Finland1364 Posts
March 03 2010 14:49 GMT
#15
On March 03 2010 21:38 Ftrunkz wrote:
so basically scouts are efficient, but not very effective for anti air?

basically no
If you have to ask, you don't know.
Purind
Profile Blog Joined April 2004
Canada3562 Posts
March 03 2010 14:58 GMT
#16
On March 03 2010 20:42 MaD.pYrO wrote:
In the same manner you may say that 20 zerglings are quite effective against 5 marines - but this doesn't mean that zerglings are efficient against marines.


On March 03 2010 22:18 MaD.pYrO wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 03 2010 21:38 Ftrunkz wrote:
so basically scouts are efficient, but not very effective for anti air?



Basically 20 zealots are effective against 1 ultralisk, but Zealots aren't efficient against ultralisks.


Bad examples. 20 zerglings are efficient against 5 marines, and 20 zealots are efficient against 1 ultralisk. If you meant ling vs marines in large numbers, or lots vs ultras in large numbers, then they are both ineffective and inefficient. Your examples don't outline anything. It's like me saying "Corsairs are effective against wraiths, but aren't efficient against goliaths." They are both effective and efficient against wraiths, but are both ineffective and inefficient against goliaths, which is along the lines of your examples. It doesn't illustrate anything
Trucy Wright is hot
Djin)ftw(
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Germany3357 Posts
March 03 2010 15:22 GMT
#17
hm i think strategy and tactics are more often misused than efficiency/effectiveness

still, now i learned that there is the word "efficacy" and how it is pronounced, thanks Kashll, thanks leo <3
"jk CLG best mindgames using the baron to counterthrow" - boesthius
SkylineSC
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States564 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-03 15:25:05
March 03 2010 15:23 GMT
#18
efficiency in starcraft can be described as

cost/benefit

cost is mineral, benefit is damage. so efficiency can only be applied to each unit.

unit a: 50 mineral/10 damage
unit b: 100 mineral/10 damage

unit a is more efficient.

however, the damage is modified by
a). matchup (large vs small unit, etc)
b). tactics (surround, splash damage, etc)

so then efficiency is varied across different matchup of units.

and effectiveness can mean many things. I'm pretty sure the scientific definition is just the gross effect. which means all the "benefit" or "damage" a unit deals. yamato cannon is very effective, scv's melee attack is not. but whether not they are efficient is depended on the cost.

also pokemon example ie. fireblast is super effective vs grass type because it deals most damage, however its 5pp hurt its efficiency compare to an attack like flame thrower.

/end nerdrant
Glull
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
Germany404 Posts
March 03 2010 15:31 GMT
#19
[image loading]


>_>
seppolevne
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada1681 Posts
March 03 2010 16:26 GMT
#20
On March 04 2010 00:23 SkylineSC wrote:
efficiency in starcraft can be described as

cost/benefit

cost is mineral, benefit is damage. so efficiency can only be applied to each unit.

unit a: 50 mineral/10 damage
unit b: 100 mineral/10 damage

unit a is more efficient.

however, the damage is modified by
a). matchup (large vs small unit, etc)
b). tactics (surround, splash damage, etc)

so then efficiency is varied across different matchup of units.

and effectiveness can mean many things. I'm pretty sure the scientific definition is just the gross effect. which means all the "benefit" or "damage" a unit deals. yamato cannon is very effective, scv's melee attack is not. but whether not they are efficient is depended on the cost.

also pokemon example ie. fireblast is super effective vs grass type because it deals most damage, however its 5pp hurt its efficiency compare to an attack like flame thrower.

/end nerdrant

pp isn't really the best measure for it's cost, as the cost of fireblast is still 1 -> 1pp, 1 turn. A better example would be something with varying mana cost or cast time.
J- Pirate Udyr WW T- Pirate Riven Galio M- Galio Annie S- Sona Lux -- Always farm, never carry.
1 2 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Circuito Brasileiro de…
19:00
A Decisão - Playoffs D1
davetesta29
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ProTech93
StarCraft: Brood War
sSak 137
Movie 16
Sexy 11
Dota 2
monkeys_forever919
Counter-Strike
Fnx 1138
Super Smash Bros
AZ_Axe91
Heroes of the Storm
Grubby4655
Khaldor227
Other Games
summit1g13195
FrodaN3005
shahzam1219
JimRising 309
ViBE264
JuggernautJason66
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1066
StarCraft 2
ESL.tv141
Other Games
BasetradeTV3
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• gosughost_ 8
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• Ler92
League of Legends
• Doublelift5801
Other Games
• Scarra1736
Upcoming Events
Online Event
3h 36m
MaxPax vs herO
SHIN vs Cure
Clem vs MaxPax
ShoWTimE vs herO
ShoWTimE vs Clem
Sparkling Tuna Cup
9h 36m
WardiTV Invitational
10h 36m
AllThingsProtoss
10h 36m
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
13h 36m
Chat StarLeague
15h 36m
BSL Season 20
17h 36m
MadiNho vs dxtr13
Gypsy vs Dark
Circuito Brasileiro de…
18h 36m
Afreeca Starleague
1d 9h
BeSt vs Light
Wardi Open
1d 10h
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
1d 23h
Replay Cast
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Snow vs Soulkey
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
PiGosaur Monday
2 days
GSL Code S
3 days
ByuN vs Rogue
herO vs Cure
Replay Cast
3 days
GSL Code S
4 days
Classic vs Reynor
GuMiho vs Maru
The PondCast
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
GSL Code S
5 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL Nation Wars Season 2
PiG Sty Festival 6.0
Calamity Stars S2

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
ASL Season 19
YSL S1
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
China & Korea Top Challenge
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
CSLPRO Spring 2025
2025 GSL S1
Heroes 10 EU
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
ECL Season 49: Europe
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025
ESL Pro League S21

Upcoming

NPSL S3
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLAN 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2025
2025 GSL S2
DreamHack Dallas 2025
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.