• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 10:30
CEST 16:30
KST 23:30
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall8HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy6
Community News
Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL44Weekly Cups (June 23-29): Reynor in world title form?12FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event16Esports World Cup 2025 - Final Player Roster16Weekly Cups (June 16-22): Clem strikes back1
StarCraft 2
General
The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation Statistics for vetoed/disliked maps Esports World Cup 2025 - Final Player Roster How does the number of casters affect your enjoyment of esports? Weekly Cups (June 23-29): Reynor in world title form?
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series [GSL 2025] Code S: Season 2 - Semi Finals & Finals $5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo) FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event HomeStory Cup 27 (June 27-29)
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome Mutation # 478 Instant Karma Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Help: rep cant save Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL BW General Discussion [ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] GosuLeague RO16 - Tue & Wed 20:00+CET The Casual Games of the Week Thread [BSL20] ProLeague LB Final - Saturday 20:00 CET
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile What do you want from future RTS games? Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Trading/Investing Thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread NBA General Discussion Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Blogs
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
Blog #2
tankgirl
Game Sound vs. Music: The Im…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 554 users

Need more Protoss favored maps :(

Blogs > Leath
Post a Reply
Leath
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
Canada1724 Posts
December 10 2009 16:05 GMT
#1
I have a feeling most maps favor other races one way or the other, and the only reason I can win games is either because I am lucky, or 1a2a3a is easy to do.

Each week I find myself begging to find Longinus in the motw list, cuz then I can boos my points up a bit.

What other maps are GOOD for protoss?

Tau Cross: So so...
Pro: Easy to set up FE
Not too hard to flank Terran army
Zergs usually are afraid of 12 hatching due to cannon block.
Not hard to get the third base

Con: Very hard to get forth base
Terran and zerg can abuse that natural cliff much more than a P can
Zerg drops are devastating from the way your main is set up in relation to your nat/third
Zerg can flanks your bases from everywhere

Lost Temple:
Pro: Overall it is easy to control the map vs Zerg
Favors aggressive play, which I find to be good for p
Can cannon cliffs, but that works best vs others protoss..,

Con: Cliff on natural can allows terran/zerg drop
Terran can control that whole map in seconds
Some positions are very biased. 12 oclock probably the worse, opponent at 3 oclock can easily drop your cliff, shoot units leaving from ledge, and zerg can even third hatch at the min only and contain/lurker/sunke/spores.

Gaia
Pro: I think P has the upper hand vs Terran on this map.
Though terran can easily control three bases, and the cross vertical positions dont really favor protoss much, overall it is easy to flank and keep map control.

Con: Zerg map all the way. Drops, mass expo, etc. Worst thing, you cant FE in most positions cuz the nat is so large. Lings run by will be frustrating, and specially lurkers going behind the other ramp. Leave game immediately if you spawn at 6 o'clock. 12 oclcok is actually the only decent start position for PvZ.

I will keep writing later. Gotta go eat.
Please, if anyone knows what is a good protoss map besides Longinus, let me know. Please explain why too.

http://www.kongregate.com/?referrer=Sagess
justiceknight
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Singapore5741 Posts
December 10 2009 16:10 GMT
#2
any map that can macro is good for toss like

andromeda
colloseum
ultimatum
gumbum8
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States721 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-12-10 16:16:15
December 10 2009 16:15 GMT
#3
While we're on the subject of maps, I haven't played many games on the new maps :S
I'm always nervous when switching over to new maps, I dont feel comfortable when Im playing them :S
Oh well though, I'm sure we'll get comfortable this Christmas break :D
but really, has anyone REALLY been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?
Nytefish
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United Kingdom4282 Posts
December 10 2009 16:27 GMT
#4
Well the problem is that the features which make a map nice for PvT usually make it nice for ZvP as well.
Seems like min-only 3rds are nice for PvZ though, so maybe try Match Point.
No I'm never serious.
stoned_rabbit
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States324 Posts
December 10 2009 16:33 GMT
#5
On December 11 2009 01:27 Nytefish wrote:
Well the problem is that the features which make a map nice for PvT usually make it nice for ZvP as well.
Seems like min-only 3rds are nice for PvZ though, so maybe try Match Point.


this.

btw 12hatch is better for you if you scout it. 12nex > 12hatch economically.
Boblion
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
France8043 Posts
December 10 2009 16:37 GMT
#6
Luna Luna Luna
fuck all those elitists brb watching streams of elite players.
sixghost
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States2096 Posts
December 10 2009 16:44 GMT
#7
Map imbalance isn't really an issue in lower level play. Go check the iccup map statistics if you want to see for yourself. Other than a few exceptions, most maps are 51-49 or 52-48%.
mG.sixghost @ iCCup || One ling, two ling, three ling, four... Camp four gas, then ultra-whore . -Saracen
JeeJee
Profile Blog Joined July 2003
Canada5652 Posts
December 10 2009 16:46 GMT
#8
guillotine!!!!
come on protoss players step it up
(\o/)  If you want it, you find a way. Otherwise you find excuses. No exceptions.
 /_\   aka Shinbi (requesting a name change since 27/05/09 ☺)
Pyrrhuloxia
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States6700 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-12-10 17:17:10
December 10 2009 17:13 GMT
#9
Katrina

Baekmagoji, at least for PvT

Heartbreak Ridge is a good map for a noob protoss like myself (I'm D-)
betaben
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
681 Posts
December 10 2009 17:29 GMT
#10
i've wondered stuff like this before; I've always thought it would be good to have a poll about what map features favour which sides in which matchups. like..
large centre:
PVT
P vote
T vote
PvZ
P vote
Z vote
etc..

then for the other ones, difficult to hold 3rd, ramp size, natural opening size, min only island in main etc..
QuanticHawk
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States32049 Posts
December 10 2009 17:50 GMT
#11
A map that favors P in PvT is almost always against P in PvZ. Fact of life son
PROFESSIONAL GAMER - SEND ME OFFERS TO JOIN YOUR TEAM - USA USA USA
Boblion
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
France8043 Posts
December 10 2009 17:58 GMT
#12
On December 11 2009 02:50 Hawk wrote:
A map that favors P in PvT is almost always against P in PvZ. Fact of life son

Hmm usually i think you are right but imo Luna is both P > Z and P > T

It is quite hard for a Z to get and defend a third gas on this map.
Oh and yea i know pro stats aren't that bad for T and Z vs P but that was before Bisu / Stork era, when P was quite weak.
fuck all those elitists brb watching streams of elite players.
Cu(oCo)
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Italy358 Posts
December 10 2009 18:27 GMT
#13
On December 11 2009 01:37 Boblion wrote:
Luna Luna Luna

Goons? just vulture toys 휴.휴
Catch]22
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Sweden2683 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-12-10 18:38:37
December 10 2009 18:37 GMT
#14
all maps except othello favor P in PvT, he's obviously talking about PvZ

+ Show Spoiler +
Ok, maybe rush hour isnt so P friendly either in PvT.
Leath
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
Canada1724 Posts
December 10 2009 21:15 GMT
#15
On December 11 2009 03:37 Catch]22 wrote:
all maps except othello favor P in PvT, he's obviously talking about PvZ

+ Show Spoiler +
Ok, maybe rush hour isnt so P friendly either in PvT.


Lost Temple, Python, Tau Cross, Othello (so so), HeartBreak Ridge, and Destination
out of the 'popular' maps seem to favor T over P. Though, these last two a lot of people will disagree, I find that the only reason Protoss tends to dominates on these two maps if because of proxy cheese rushes. I avoid cheesing, and I find that Destination soon becomes a nightmare, and HBR is mmm... i think it kind of breaks even... lots of recalls I guess, but it is often not too obvious.



Othello, Gaia, Python (in some positions), Tau Cross, HBR, Andromeda, Colosseum seem to favor Z over P. Sure, Colosseum can be a macro friendly map, and it usually it runs smoothly until you have to take your 4th base. I find Andromeda really encourages sair/reaver play, but I find that strategy to be extremely hard to pull.


Longinus is really the perfect map for protoss. The way the nat/third are set up are so easy to defend, and other races might have a hard time on the way protoss can charge at them. That double gas expo just tops it, because HTs are cheap once you have enough game, and once again it is not hard to secure those expansions.


On December 11 2009 01:44 sixghost wrote:
Map imbalance isn't really an issue in lower level play. Go check the iccup map statistics if you want to see for yourself. Other than a few exceptions, most maps are 51-49 or 52-48%.


I dont know about those statistics, because I dont know who is 'making' them.
I say they are not reliable for backing up any information. To me it just seems that based in those stats no maps favor terrans, because they always seem to have inferior winning percentages vs P and Z alike. I would guess it is because Terran is just a harder race to play in comparison to P or Z at lower level, but that doesnt make the map the biggest influence.

I am mid C level right now, and I feel the maps do influence me a lot. For instance, I just played a PvZ on Gaia where I was unfortunate to spawn at 6, and didnt want to be lame and leave.
Instead I tried a 1 base fast sair, by getting core before second pylon in reaction to 12 hatch.
Then zerg 3 hatch lurkers followed by drops and I had the hardest time defending my nat.
Just picture it... Lurkers can easily go behind those minerals, and 3 hatch zerg makes me need tons of cannons in front too. FE would put me in a horrible position as well. I cant even know how protoss should do in that place, except pray z makes a mistake.

In HBR I feel about the same. I do an FE then im worried Z might mine that minerals and backstab me, or break the temple, or drop lurkers there. Even mutas in the spot are so annoying. Then Z can easily take the corners of the map with lurkers for def, and easily drop cuz all expos are lined up for protoss. What is my advantage in HBR? What can I possibly do? I think I can only abuse the fact there is open space and a bunch of ramps where protoss can probably pick easy fights, but usually zerg can control well those ramps. o.o

Thanks for the replies
http://www.kongregate.com/?referrer=Sagess
atm0sphere33
Profile Joined November 2009
Canada130 Posts
December 10 2009 22:01 GMT
#16
What MU? Python favors toss in PvT (but honestly, what map doesnt).

Outsider is great for protoss I find. PvZ it caters a lot to sair / reaver, and TvP arbiters tear us terrans a new asshole (more than they already do)
It may LOOK imbalanced but its not because blizard hates protoss.
Shauni
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
4077 Posts
December 10 2009 22:10 GMT
#17
What? Longinus is probably the most terran favored TvP map in recent history...
I'm taking whatever coverage I can get, because frankly, I'm busy working on this million dollar deal at my job. Early retirement is a good thing brotha man. - MessengerASL
DreaM)XeRO
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Korea (South)4667 Posts
December 10 2009 22:25 GMT
#18
lol. Longinus is sooo P favored
Neo Medusa and Destination are pretty P favored

Python is a good PvT map
and... HBR is a good P map
cw)minsean(ru
Foucault
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Sweden2826 Posts
December 10 2009 22:51 GMT
#19
On December 11 2009 01:10 justiceknight wrote:
any map that can macro is good for toss like

andromeda
colloseum
ultimatum


This. Any big open maps will favor protoss in PvT anyways. In PvZ it's the other way around where protoss wants smaller, tighter maps because zergs needs space to flank and 1a2a3a4a5a
I know that deep inside of you there's a humongous set of testicles just waiting to pop out. Let 'em pop bro. //////////////////// AKA JensOfSweden // Lee Yoon Yeol forever.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 30m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Harstem 555
Lowko409
ProTech64
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 47537
Rain 4902
Sea 3449
Jaedong 1942
EffOrt 1289
BeSt 471
ZerO 419
Stork 409
ToSsGirL 286
actioN 283
[ Show more ]
Snow 203
Light 164
Mong 112
hero 98
Sharp 67
Shinee 60
Pusan 53
Mind 52
Rush 44
sSak 41
PianO 26
Nal_rA 22
Terrorterran 21
Noble 19
GoRush 13
ajuk12(nOOB) 13
yabsab 12
Sacsri 11
sorry 10
soO 9
IntoTheRainbow 7
SilentControl 7
JulyZerg 7
zelot 4
scan(afreeca) 1
Dota 2
qojqva3778
XcaliburYe512
Counter-Strike
markeloff287
byalli262
edward62
kRYSTAL_25
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King126
Other Games
hiko1076
DeMusliM768
crisheroes360
Happy288
ArmadaUGS111
KnowMe71
QueenE38
ZerO(Twitch)20
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 8
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 72
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 5
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis7293
• TFBlade909
Upcoming Events
WardiTV European League
1h 30m
ByuN vs NightPhoenix
HeRoMaRinE vs HiGhDrA
Krystianer vs sebesdes
MaxPax vs Babymarine
SKillous vs Mixu
ShoWTimE vs MaNa
Replay Cast
9h 30m
RSL Revival
19h 30m
herO vs SHIN
Reynor vs Cure
OSC
22h 30m
WardiTV European League
1d 1h
Scarlett vs Percival
Jumy vs ArT
YoungYakov vs Shameless
uThermal vs Fjant
Nicoract vs goblin
Harstem vs Gerald
FEL
1d 1h
Korean StarCraft League
1d 12h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 19h
RSL Revival
1d 19h
FEL
2 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
FEL
2 days
BSL: ProLeague
3 days
Dewalt vs Bonyth
Replay Cast
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-06-28
HSC XXVII
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
Acropolis #3
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Championship of Russia 2025
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025

Upcoming

CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
SEL Season 2 Championship
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.