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So a few days ago i decided for the first time in a year and a half that I wanted to play starcraft seriously and actually get good at the game and achieve a high rank on iccup.
I met a known gosu player named iajtls who plays occasionally with some EG. players such as Louder and an occasional game with Ret. But he defiantly knows his stuff. Iajtls said that he recommended learning one build order and practicing over and over and over until I got it perfect well I've done that.. with the 9 minute push TvZ build.
His second piece of advice was that my apm was too low and id have to raise it.. he stated the best way to do this was to do that same build order with APM count on and make my APM stay over 400 even if i played like a D- noobie.
So I've been doing that for two days about 3 hours a day. The problem is i can can maintain the 400 apm until about eh 4 minute mark where it falls to about 340 and then by the 9 minute push its down at about 220.
How can I keep my apm from falling?
Note: Even if I mange to get a 400 apm against the computer I know I wont have 400 apm in a real game. The purpose of this is just to get my hands used to moving at a high level.
edit: and i just made my self look retarded by spelling APM wrong in the title lol.. ):
 
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you can keep your apm from falling if you actually spend it on worthwhile things
chances are, you mostly spent it on spamming the command center and SCVs, and past four minutes, you're busy with doing things that actually count (not spamming), and you stop spamming on the CC/SCV's and thats how it falls below
you have to know what you're doing, and don't ever let spamming APM distract you
just watch some pro FPVOD's, and you'll get the idea
*inb4 "APM doesn't count" *
edit: also, i think this should be in the strategy forum
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Uh well first of all, what rank are you?
And second of all, most pro gamers dont have 400 apm. I think if you can maintain a 200+ apm throughout a long game, you are golden. Keep doing what your doing, practice the same build and try to keep up your actions, just don't focus entirely upon it.
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Stop worrying about apm, Just think about the game and what needs to be done in it. I suggest doing that rather than focusing on spamming your probe hotkeys
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delete bwchart or whatever you are using to check your apm and start to play starcraft instead of pointlessly hitting keyboard keys
focus on the game instead of on speed, speed and multitasking will come with experience
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Isn't iajtls LastShadow?
And i'm not even gonna get in on the whole "APM"-discussion, i will say this though, that is probably the worst piece of advice i have ever heard.
I don't know if you are trolling or if he was trolling you, but that is complete bullshit.
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I actually think his method is sound. I remember blueiris had a thread saying to do the exact same thing. Just keep doing what you are doing.
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On November 21 2009 07:11 grobo wrote:
Isn't iajtls LastShadow?
And i'm not even gonna get in on the whole "APM"-discussion, i will say this though, that is probably the worst piece of advice i have ever heard.
I don't know if you are trolling or if he was trolling you, but that is complete bullshit.
Is he? I don't know if he is or not.
It sounded like good advice to me.
Yea heres alot of spam going on in the early game but its not like im spamming the whole time i make my units on time and dont get supply blocked and get upgrades, group my units and everything. Which is why my apm falls when i start having to do all those things.. How can i do all that but still keep it up?
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On November 21 2009 07:16 vRoOk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:11 grobo wrote:
Isn't iajtls LastShadow?
And i'm not even gonna get in on the whole "APM"-discussion, i will say this though, that is probably the worst piece of advice i have ever heard.
I don't know if you are trolling or if he was trolling you, but that is complete bullshit. Is he? I don't know if he is or not. It sounded like good advice to me. Yea heres alot of spam going on in the early game but its not like im spamming the whole time i make my units on time and dont get supply blocked and get upgrades, group my units and everything. Which is why my apm falls when i start having to do all those things.. How can i do all that but still keep it up?
The reason why your APM drops when you do those things is because you spam all the time whenever you are not making units, getting upgrades, grouping units.
But honestly, wouldn't you rather be able to win games by outplaying your opponent, by successfully killing him with a flawless timing attack or by reaching 200/200 at the 14min mark? You don't win games by having higher APM than your opponent.
APM = Shit, Testie was raping pro's left and right with his 120-140apm.
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On November 21 2009 07:08 Nal_rAwr wrote:
you can keep your apm from falling if you actually spend it on worthwhile things
chances are, you mostly spent it on spamming the command center and SCVs, and past four minutes, you're busy with doing things that actually count (not spamming), and you stop spamming on the CC/SCV's and thats how it falls below
you have to know what you're doing, and don't ever let spamming APM distract you
just watch some pro FPVOD's, and you'll get the idea
*inb4 "APM doesn't count" *
edit: also, i think this should be in the strategy forum
It's actually halfway decent advice. There was a thread a while ago about playing games vs the computer doing the same build order and forcing yourself to keep your apm over 200-300 even if its just spam, in order to get your hands used to the speed. I never did it but I see how it could help.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=56230
This was the thread by the way.
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On November 21 2009 07:22 grobo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:16 vRoOk wrote:On November 21 2009 07:11 grobo wrote:
Isn't iajtls LastShadow?
And i'm not even gonna get in on the whole "APM"-discussion, i will say this though, that is probably the worst piece of advice i have ever heard.
I don't know if you are trolling or if he was trolling you, but that is complete bullshit. Is he? I don't know if he is or not. It sounded like good advice to me. Yea heres alot of spam going on in the early game but its not like im spamming the whole time i make my units on time and dont get supply blocked and get upgrades, group my units and everything. Which is why my apm falls when i start having to do all those things.. How can i do all that but still keep it up? The reason why your APM drops when you do those things is because you spam all the time whenever you are not making units, getting upgrades, grouping units. But honestly, wouldn't you rather be able to win games by outplaying your opponent, by successfully killing him with a flawless timing attack or by reaching 200/200 at the 14min mark? You don't win games by having higher APM than your opponent. APM = Shit, Testie was raping pro's left and right with his 120-140apm. Low APM can be overcome when you have incredible game knowledge. But saying APM doesn't matter for newer players is just wrong.
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On November 21 2009 07:23 sixghost wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:08 Nal_rAwr wrote:
you can keep your apm from falling if you actually spend it on worthwhile things
chances are, you mostly spent it on spamming the command center and SCVs, and past four minutes, you're busy with doing things that actually count (not spamming), and you stop spamming on the CC/SCV's and thats how it falls below
you have to know what you're doing, and don't ever let spamming APM distract you
just watch some pro FPVOD's, and you'll get the idea
*inb4 "APM doesn't count" *
edit: also, i think this should be in the strategy forum It's actually halfway decent advice. There was a thread a while ago about playing games vs the computer doing the same build order and forcing yourself to keep your apm over 200-300 even if its just spam, in order to get your hands used to the speed. I never did it but I see how it could help. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=56230This was the thread by the way.
It doesn't matter if your hands get used to the speed, if your mind can't keep up you'll get slaughtered, the best advice is to just play the game and practice build orders and certain timings, the better you get at those things the faster your overall playing gets.
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On November 21 2009 07:16 vRoOk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:11 grobo wrote:
Isn't iajtls LastShadow?
And i'm not even gonna get in on the whole "APM"-discussion, i will say this though, that is probably the worst piece of advice i have ever heard.
I don't know if you are trolling or if he was trolling you, but that is complete bullshit. Is he? I don't know if he is or not. It sounded like good advice to me. Yea heres alot of spam going on in the early game but its not like im spamming the whole time i make my units on time and dont get supply blocked and get upgrades, group my units and everything. Which is why my apm falls when i start having to do all those things.. How can i do all that but still keep it up?
do you seriously expect us to tell you some magic trick or way of playing at 300+apm?
theres only 1 answer to your questions and problems, just keep playing SC, and dont give a flying fuck about speed.none will help you more than this comment, we can mamble all day long about what and how you should do at late game but you just gotta "feel it" in order to play at desired speed
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On November 21 2009 07:26 grobo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:23 sixghost wrote:On November 21 2009 07:08 Nal_rAwr wrote:
you can keep your apm from falling if you actually spend it on worthwhile things
chances are, you mostly spent it on spamming the command center and SCVs, and past four minutes, you're busy with doing things that actually count (not spamming), and you stop spamming on the CC/SCV's and thats how it falls below
you have to know what you're doing, and don't ever let spamming APM distract you
just watch some pro FPVOD's, and you'll get the idea
*inb4 "APM doesn't count" *
edit: also, i think this should be in the strategy forum It's actually halfway decent advice. There was a thread a while ago about playing games vs the computer doing the same build order and forcing yourself to keep your apm over 200-300 even if its just spam, in order to get your hands used to the speed. I never did it but I see how it could help. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=56230This was the thread by the way. It doesn't matter if your hands get used to the speed, if your mind can't keep up you'll get slaughtered, the best advice is to just play the game and practice build orders and certain timings, the better you get at those things the faster your overall playing gets.
In alot of circumstances newer players minds arent what are slowing them down toward the end game. How could getting your hands used to 200 apm speed hurt in any way? I'm not suggesting it as a replacement for learning builds, timings, and all the basics of SC, but in addition to those things.
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On November 21 2009 07:27 Itachii wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:16 vRoOk wrote:On November 21 2009 07:11 grobo wrote:
Isn't iajtls LastShadow?
And i'm not even gonna get in on the whole "APM"-discussion, i will say this though, that is probably the worst piece of advice i have ever heard.
I don't know if you are trolling or if he was trolling you, but that is complete bullshit. Is he? I don't know if he is or not. It sounded like good advice to me. Yea heres alot of spam going on in the early game but its not like im spamming the whole time i make my units on time and dont get supply blocked and get upgrades, group my units and everything. Which is why my apm falls when i start having to do all those things.. How can i do all that but still keep it up? do you seriously expect us to tell you some magic trick or way of playing at 300+apm? theres only 1 answer to your questions and problems, just keep playing SC, and dont give a flying fuck about speed.none will help you more than this comment, we can mamble all day long about what and how you should do at late game but you just gotta "feel it" in order to play at desired speed
Yeah I was hoping for some kind of advice.
Perhaps i should find a different more complicated build order that requires more than just macroing that would have me move units around the map while macroing?
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lol! just LOL!!! i dont see how u will get better by spamming 400apm vs the comp. i think its more important to focus on the important stuff with the apm u have right now AND after that u can try to mix some other stuff into your standard game and your apm will raise itself. if u just want high apm to feel gosu put your cc/hatch/nexus on 1 and press the key after every command and every second if u have nothing else to do. im sure u will have 400 APM that way.
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On November 21 2009 07:33 vRoOk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:27 Itachii wrote:On November 21 2009 07:16 vRoOk wrote:On November 21 2009 07:11 grobo wrote:
Isn't iajtls LastShadow?
And i'm not even gonna get in on the whole "APM"-discussion, i will say this though, that is probably the worst piece of advice i have ever heard.
I don't know if you are trolling or if he was trolling you, but that is complete bullshit. Is he? I don't know if he is or not. It sounded like good advice to me. Yea heres alot of spam going on in the early game but its not like im spamming the whole time i make my units on time and dont get supply blocked and get upgrades, group my units and everything. Which is why my apm falls when i start having to do all those things.. How can i do all that but still keep it up? do you seriously expect us to tell you some magic trick or way of playing at 300+apm? theres only 1 answer to your questions and problems, just keep playing SC, and dont give a flying fuck about speed.none will help you more than this comment, we can mamble all day long about what and how you should do at late game but you just gotta "feel it" in order to play at desired speed Yeah I was hoping for some kind of advice. Perhaps i should find a different more complicated build order that requires more than just macroing that would have me move units around the map while macroing?
I already posted an entire 220+ post thread talking about this topic for you.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=56230
If you just want to practice against the computer, just do a normal build order and practing scouting, proper building position, constant scv production, unit movement, etc. That alone will keep you above 200 apm.
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Training your hands to move that fast is a really useful skill. LS preaches it all the time, load up a single player game and start spamming your face off getting used to flying through hotkeys and clicking at speeds that seem unrealistic to you. Eventually you will begin to notice things come naturally at faster speeds and it will improve your gameplay.
Also for improving mouse/hand dexterity and helping raise your apms I highly recommend playing osu! great game yo.
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On November 21 2009 07:36 MeProU_Kor wrote:
lol! just LOL!!! i dont see how u will get better by spamming 400apm vs the comp. i think its more important to focus on the important stuff with the apm u have right now AND after that u can try to mix some other stuff into your standard game and your apm will raise itself. if u just want high apm to feel gosu put your cc/hatch/nexus on 1 and press the key after every command and every second if u have nothing else to do. im sure u will have 400 APM that way.
Well honestly I'm gonna take LastShadows gosu opinion over your 29 post one anyday I'm afraid.
Did you read up at all? the purpose is not "to feel like a 400 apm gosu"
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On November 21 2009 07:33 vRoOk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:27 Itachii wrote:On November 21 2009 07:16 vRoOk wrote:On November 21 2009 07:11 grobo wrote:
Isn't iajtls LastShadow?
And i'm not even gonna get in on the whole "APM"-discussion, i will say this though, that is probably the worst piece of advice i have ever heard.
I don't know if you are trolling or if he was trolling you, but that is complete bullshit. Is he? I don't know if he is or not. It sounded like good advice to me. Yea heres alot of spam going on in the early game but its not like im spamming the whole time i make my units on time and dont get supply blocked and get upgrades, group my units and everything. Which is why my apm falls when i start having to do all those things.. How can i do all that but still keep it up? do you seriously expect us to tell you some magic trick or way of playing at 300+apm? theres only 1 answer to your questions and problems, just keep playing SC, and dont give a flying fuck about speed.none will help you more than this comment, we can mamble all day long about what and how you should do at late game but you just gotta "feel it" in order to play at desired speed Yeah I was hoping for some kind of advice. Perhaps i should find a different more complicated build order that requires more than just macroing that would have me move units around the map while macroing?
as i said, keep playing.late game tvz (vs decent zergs of course)should give you good speed training if you really want some kind of it
edit:considering that you know what to do in it, of course^^
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May be that guy was just joking?
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Try practicing a build that's very APM demanding. When i started playing zerg i would go for 3 hatch muta all the time even though i couldn't handle all the multi-task. Needless to say, i lost alot, but now it's the easiest thing in the world.
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On November 21 2009 07:04 vRoOk wrote:
Iajtls said that he recommended learning one build order and practicing over and over and over until I got it perfect
Haven't I been telling you this for months? Aw well, not like I'm some gosu you should take a lot of advice from. 
Gl on destroying zergs in 9 mins. Try it on me sometime. 
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On November 21 2009 07:24 sixghost wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:22 grobo wrote:On November 21 2009 07:16 vRoOk wrote:On November 21 2009 07:11 grobo wrote:
Isn't iajtls LastShadow?
And i'm not even gonna get in on the whole "APM"-discussion, i will say this though, that is probably the worst piece of advice i have ever heard.
I don't know if you are trolling or if he was trolling you, but that is complete bullshit. Is he? I don't know if he is or not. It sounded like good advice to me. Yea heres alot of spam going on in the early game but its not like im spamming the whole time i make my units on time and dont get supply blocked and get upgrades, group my units and everything. Which is why my apm falls when i start having to do all those things.. How can i do all that but still keep it up? The reason why your APM drops when you do those things is because you spam all the time whenever you are not making units, getting upgrades, grouping units. But honestly, wouldn't you rather be able to win games by outplaying your opponent, by successfully killing him with a flawless timing attack or by reaching 200/200 at the 14min mark? You don't win games by having higher APM than your opponent. APM = Shit, Testie was raping pro's left and right with his 120-140apm. Low APM can be overcome when you have incredible game knowledge. But saying APM doesn't matter for newer players is just wrong.
But it is the least important thing a new player needs to worry about.
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On November 21 2009 07:39 vRoOk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:36 MeProU_Kor wrote:
lol! just LOL!!! i dont see how u will get better by spamming 400apm vs the comp. i think its more important to focus on the important stuff with the apm u have right now AND after that u can try to mix some other stuff into your standard game and your apm will raise itself. if u just want high apm to feel gosu put your cc/hatch/nexus on 1 and press the key after every command and every second if u have nothing else to do. im sure u will have 400 APM that way. Well honestly I'm gonna take LastShadows gosu opinion over your 29 post one anyday I'm afraid. Did you read up at all? the purpose is not "to feel like a 400 apm gosu"
Trust me, the better approach would be first to play a lot and get comfortable with the builds and timings and then move on to increasing your speed, not the other way around.
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On November 21 2009 07:39 vRoOk wrote:
Well honestly I'm gonna take LastShadows gosu opinion over your 29 post one anyday I'm afraid.
Did you read up at all? the purpose is not "to feel like a 400 apm gosu"
1) i dont know any top foreigner with 400APM (only fenix maybe with like ~370APM in most reps)
2) if u just even dont know bos, u just lack in too many things and APM is your smallest problem
3) after u fixed every other problem your apm will raise itself
4) sure u can train to get higher apm but for what? to get better mechanics? if u just focus on your game your mechanics will get better and your apm will raise. sounds more logical for me.
5) why dont u just ask LS? i think he can give you the best advice how to get higher apm since apm is very important for him.
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I think that as long as you can maintain ~120apm without spamming, there's not a lot of point in being faster until you're good with your strategies. If you can do that, APM won't be a limiting factor until you're well into the B ranks.
I just don't see the point in a sub C player worrying about having +200 APM because there are so many other holes in your game that APM is far from your biggest problem.
What exactly is your rank?
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Alot of people are forgetting the fact that APM equates to more than just hand speed. In order to have good macro, you need FAST HANDS. Watch a few streams, and you will see that all of the players are 200+APM, you need this in order to continually multitask...which is a HUGE PART OF THE GAME. Ignore the people that are saying APM is useless. Sure 400APM is unrealistic and pretty useless for a player of your caliber, but you certainly should try and maintain 190-220 APM while playing. This is not too fast that you can't think straight, but its also fast enough to allow you to multitask properly.
Your APM will not raise itself, no matter what people say. You need to take an active role in getting faster, because otherwise your hands will get use to the slower speed you are playing, and you wont get any faster. This stuff takes effort, and doesn't just come as you play.
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On November 21 2009 08:09 Biochemist wrote:
I think that as long as you can maintain ~120apm without spamming, there's not a lot of point in being faster until you're good with your strategies. If you can do that, APM won't be a limiting factor until you're well into the B ranks.
I just don't see the point in a sub C player worrying about having +200 APM because there are so many other holes in your game that APM is far from your biggest problem.
What exactly is your rank?
My rank is C- about
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On November 21 2009 08:14 eXigent. wrote:
Your APM will not raise itself, no matter what people say. You need to take an active role in getting faster, because otherwise your hands will get use to the slower speed you are playing, and you wont get any faster. This stuff takes effort, and doesn't just come as you play.
I strongly disagree with this.
I never even had BWChart up until a year ago, and i loaded up my old reps from when i just started playing and i was at ~40apm, and these days i'm at ~160apm without ever so much as thinking about my APM when i was playing.
APM comes with your overall knowledge of the game, period.
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On November 21 2009 07:33 vRoOk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:27 Itachii wrote:On November 21 2009 07:16 vRoOk wrote:On November 21 2009 07:11 grobo wrote:
Isn't iajtls LastShadow?
And i'm not even gonna get in on the whole "APM"-discussion, i will say this though, that is probably the worst piece of advice i have ever heard.
I don't know if you are trolling or if he was trolling you, but that is complete bullshit. Is he? I don't know if he is or not. It sounded like good advice to me. Yea heres alot of spam going on in the early game but its not like im spamming the whole time i make my units on time and dont get supply blocked and get upgrades, group my units and everything. Which is why my apm falls when i start having to do all those things.. How can i do all that but still keep it up? do you seriously expect us to tell you some magic trick or way of playing at 300+apm? theres only 1 answer to your questions and problems, just keep playing SC, and dont give a flying fuck about speed.none will help you more than this comment, we can mamble all day long about what and how you should do at late game but you just gotta "feel it" in order to play at desired speed Yeah I was hoping for some kind of advice. Perhaps i should find a different more complicated build order that requires more than just macroing that would have me move units around the map while macroing?
Always sair/reaver pvz, you'll notice everything improve.
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On November 21 2009 08:14 eXigent. wrote:
Alot of people are forgetting the fact that APM equates to more than just hand speed. In order to have good macro, you need FAST HANDS. Watch a few streams, and you will see that all of the players are 200+APM, you need this in order to continually multitask...which is a HUGE PART OF THE GAME. Ignore the people that are saying APM is useless. Sure 400APM is unrealistic and pretty useless for a player of your caliber, but you certainly should try and maintain 190-220 APM while playing. This is not too fast that you can't think straight, but its also fast enough to allow you to multitask properly.
Your APM will not raise itself, no matter what people say. You need to take an active role in getting faster, because otherwise your hands will get use to the slower speed you are playing, and you wont get any faster. This stuff takes effort, and doesn't just come as you play.
u know why most newbs are slow? cause they watch the battles and dont use hotkeys. if they would just remember to focus on there macro and keep buildings probes + units they would get like +50 APM. sure you need apm to micro/macro good but you will learn mechanics only by playing and focusing on it not by focusing on getting higher apm.
did any one wrote that apm isnt important?
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On November 21 2009 08:14 eXigent. wrote:
Your APM will not raise itself, no matter what people say. You need to take an active role in getting faster, because otherwise your hands will get use to the slower speed you are playing, and you wont get any faster. This stuff takes effort, and doesn't just come as you play.
I agree with grobo, this does not seem like very good adivce. If you want to improve, do not focus on your apm, as you get better IT WILL INCREASE ON ITS OWN.
This is the case, just practise builds and timings and watch VODs in a "learning mindset" (see chill's guide on improving). Focussing on purely increasing your apm when you have a game knowledge that could be greatly improved will most likely be detrimental to your overall gameplay.
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Holy shit, iajtls is indeed lastshadow. Whatever you do, DO NOT BEFRIEND THIS FAGGOT.
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On November 21 2009 08:52 Pokebunny wrote:
Holy shit, iajtls is indeed lastshadow. Whatever you do, DO NOT BEFRIEND THIS FAGGOT.
Well someone doesn't like LS..
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United States43188 Posts
If I didn't know LS to be an idiot I would say he was just trolling you for lulz. But I do know that so whatever, you're still wasting your time.
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On November 21 2009 08:35 Suc wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 08:14 eXigent. wrote:
Your APM will not raise itself, no matter what people say. You need to take an active role in getting faster, because otherwise your hands will get use to the slower speed you are playing, and you wont get any faster. This stuff takes effort, and doesn't just come as you play. I agree with grobo, this does not seem like very good adivce. If you want to improve, do not focus on your apm, as you get better IT WILL INCREASE ON ITS OWN. This is the case, just practise builds and timings and watch VODs in a "learning mindset" (see chill's guide on improving). Focussing on purely increasing your apm when you have a game knowledge that could be greatly improved will most likely be detrimental to your overall gameplay.
Its not bad advice at ALL. Nony was the first one to say this long ago. Sure you can naturally increase APM as you play, but what im talking about is eventually you will hit a speed where unless you ACTIVELY try to get faster, you will stay at that speed. 120APM is slow...so yeah naturally a person will reach this speed, however in order to multitask properly at a decent level, you need to be closer to 200. In order to accomplish this, you have to sit down and practice playing that fast.
What you are assuming is that I want him to focus on spamming his controls while his gameplay suffers, but in reality what I am basically saying is that once he knows his build orders and timings, he should actively work on being faster. Not just spamming 123123123123, but doing EVERYTHING he does.....just faster. What is soo wrong about that? How is that bad advice?
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I thought you were talking about like starting a rock band and your amplifier wasn't working... Instead it's an apm thread. Bye.
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Practicing exactly one build over and over = good
Spamming 400 apm for the sake of it = lolno
You'll find things to do with apm, and it will keep going up as long as you take an active approach to practicing.
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ppl say LS is shit and apm is shit
but the truth is that both of those things are good but highly over-discussed
however 400 apm is ridiculously much, im happy to maintain 300 apm lategame and im not any worse than LS
using 1 BO is good as long as u can adapt to ur enemy. as long as u have a game structure in ur head "if he do this i do this" all planned out will allow u to improvise less causing u to play really well. this is also my method of gaming but the hard part is to know what bo is best and how do u counter some strategies timings etc, and not to mention be fast (apm)
just like he tells u to get 400 apm vs a comp before start playing real
is just like telling somebody to get hard fingers and learn some chords before trying to learn a song
but then again 400 is extreme, most progamers dont have this AVG apm in a 15+ min game
but as mentioned in replies in this thread, "its better to do the other way around" which is get comfortable with what to do against what, get comfortable with the builds and understand them. then game and as u play u will learn to execute it step by step
well this way works too
the great thing about improving is that there r tons of ways to do it, and u cant tell somebody what they do is bad, cause after all we r all individuals
if id give u advise to get a high rank, just learn to defend cheese get a strong all-round timing attack and crush ur opponent due to low ranks are easy and cheesy
but if u wanna get even higher rank, like A rank. ull have to watch pro vods and learn to play in alot more in-deph game thinking and also lets not forget jump around on the screen like a korean nerd^^
edit: sorry if im off-topic here but from my experience and ive known this guy a long time (good guy if u get to know him) anyhow, dont learn from him, dont ask him for advise how to play and dont get inspired by his play. im not saying his bad im just saying if u listen to him too much u will think hes 4 times better than he actually is. and what he actually is is a guy from america who thinks sunkens got 1 armor. just cause u get A rank or w/e doesnt mean you deserve it, take me for an example, i needed 500+ games to get A- this season and last season i had A- with less than 10 losses. yes that is how ridiculous difference it is between korean and foreigner ladder
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On November 21 2009 09:03 disco wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 08:52 Pokebunny wrote:
Holy shit, iajtls is indeed lastshadow. Whatever you do, DO NOT BEFRIEND THIS FAGGOT. Well someone doesn't like LS..
Uhm well he map rigged for a while competitively and tried to make himself out to be some e-famous figure... he always self-promoted and never got a better attitude and is still a cocky annoying kid.
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On November 21 2009 07:39 vRoOk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:36 MeProU_Kor wrote:
lol! just LOL!!! i dont see how u will get better by spamming 400apm vs the comp. i think its more important to focus on the important stuff with the apm u have right now AND after that u can try to mix some other stuff into your standard game and your apm will raise itself. if u just want high apm to feel gosu put your cc/hatch/nexus on 1 and press the key after every command and every second if u have nothing else to do. im sure u will have 400 APM that way. Well honestly I'm gonna take LastShadows gosu opinion over your 29 post one anyday I'm afraid. Did you read up at all? the purpose is not "to feel like a 400 apm gosu"
anyone else think that this thread was made to promote lastshadow. i thought we were past this.
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On November 21 2009 09:43 Myxomatosis wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:39 vRoOk wrote:On November 21 2009 07:36 MeProU_Kor wrote:
lol! just LOL!!! i dont see how u will get better by spamming 400apm vs the comp. i think its more important to focus on the important stuff with the apm u have right now AND after that u can try to mix some other stuff into your standard game and your apm will raise itself. if u just want high apm to feel gosu put your cc/hatch/nexus on 1 and press the key after every command and every second if u have nothing else to do. im sure u will have 400 APM that way. Well honestly I'm gonna take LastShadows gosu opinion over your 29 post one anyday I'm afraid. Did you read up at all? the purpose is not "to feel like a 400 apm gosu" anyone else think that this thread was made to promote lastshadow. i thought we were past this.
I'm starting to think so too, when LS gets called Gosu twice in one thread you know something's wrong.
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In all honesty, if you can maintain ~200, you're perfectly fine until you hit progamer level.
-_-
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Not to disagree with the common wisdom of everyone in this thread, but having high APM, even if it's mostly spam, will make you much much better. You'll find you're macro improves considerably and you're multi tasking and general reaction time is much higher.
Just saying what worked with me. I made a significant effort a month or two ago when I started playing in earnest to raise my apm from 250 to 350ish and it paid off immensely.
Best way I found of increasing it was one of two exercises. 1a2a3a4a5a1a2a3a4a5a1a2a3a 4a5a1a2a3a4a5a1a2a3a4a5a1a2a3a4a5a until you're blue in the face is good. Also try making single player games and spamming like crazy or loading replays with the hotkey selector thing in chaos launcher and play along with the replay. Again, makes you feel stupid and well...it is. But its a good way of focusing purely on hand speed and paying attention to the minimap.
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On November 21 2009 09:10 eXigent. wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 08:35 Suc wrote:On November 21 2009 08:14 eXigent. wrote:
Your APM will not raise itself, no matter what people say. You need to take an active role in getting faster, because otherwise your hands will get use to the slower speed you are playing, and you wont get any faster. This stuff takes effort, and doesn't just come as you play. I agree with grobo, this does not seem like very good adivce. If you want to improve, do not focus on your apm, as you get better IT WILL INCREASE ON ITS OWN. This is the case, just practise builds and timings and watch VODs in a "learning mindset" (see chill's guide on improving). Focussing on purely increasing your apm when you have a game knowledge that could be greatly improved will most likely be detrimental to your overall gameplay. Its not bad advice at ALL. Nony was the first one to say this long ago. Sure you can naturally increase APM as you play, but what im talking about is eventually you will hit a speed where unless you ACTIVELY try to get faster, you will stay at that speed. 120APM is slow...so yeah naturally a person will reach this speed, however in order to multitask properly at a decent level, you need to be closer to 200. In order to accomplish this, you have to sit down and practice playing that fast. What you are assuming is that I want him to focus on spamming his controls while his gameplay suffers, but in reality what I am basically saying is that once he knows his build orders and timings, he should actively work on being faster. Not just spamming 123123123123, but doing EVERYTHING he does.....just faster. What is soo wrong about that? How is that bad advice?
Oh okay, I guess I just misunderstood your point. I thought you meant that he should focus on getting ridiculously fast through spamming and useless actions.
Now that I understand your point, i.e. he should actively try to be faster with his build and complete things faster, I do agree. This is what I was trying to get across before.
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On November 21 2009 09:43 Myxomatosis wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 07:39 vRoOk wrote:On November 21 2009 07:36 MeProU_Kor wrote:
lol! just LOL!!! i dont see how u will get better by spamming 400apm vs the comp. i think its more important to focus on the important stuff with the apm u have right now AND after that u can try to mix some other stuff into your standard game and your apm will raise itself. if u just want high apm to feel gosu put your cc/hatch/nexus on 1 and press the key after every command and every second if u have nothing else to do. im sure u will have 400 APM that way. Well honestly I'm gonna take LastShadows gosu opinion over your 29 post one anyday I'm afraid. Did you read up at all? the purpose is not "to feel like a 400 apm gosu" anyone else think that this thread was made to promote lastshadow. i thought we were past this.
I didn't even know when i made the thread that iajtls was LS...
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if your apm falls below 9000 at any point in the game, you are screwed, try to practise to maintain you apm over nine thousand!
if seriously, dont try to force apm rise by spam, it will rise itself. If you got 250ish it's pretty good since most of progamers have 250-300. I'm not talking about july, nada, bisu or jaedong for the obvious reasons.
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damn i was gonna say
"u mean APM?"
but you actually did mean it T_T
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Well... you see, the problem here is you're letting your voltage get too high, and sacrificing voltage and amps. The trick will be to use a transformer to low the voltage so you can increase the amps to about 400 again.
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On November 21 2009 10:03 Suc wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2009 09:10 eXigent. wrote:On November 21 2009 08:35 Suc wrote:On November 21 2009 08:14 eXigent. wrote:
Your APM will not raise itself, no matter what people say. You need to take an active role in getting faster, because otherwise your hands will get use to the slower speed you are playing, and you wont get any faster. This stuff takes effort, and doesn't just come as you play. I agree with grobo, this does not seem like very good adivce. If you want to improve, do not focus on your apm, as you get better IT WILL INCREASE ON ITS OWN. This is the case, just practise builds and timings and watch VODs in a "learning mindset" (see chill's guide on improving). Focussing on purely increasing your apm when you have a game knowledge that could be greatly improved will most likely be detrimental to your overall gameplay. Its not bad advice at ALL. Nony was the first one to say this long ago. Sure you can naturally increase APM as you play, but what im talking about is eventually you will hit a speed where unless you ACTIVELY try to get faster, you will stay at that speed. 120APM is slow...so yeah naturally a person will reach this speed, however in order to multitask properly at a decent level, you need to be closer to 200. In order to accomplish this, you have to sit down and practice playing that fast. What you are assuming is that I want him to focus on spamming his controls while his gameplay suffers, but in reality what I am basically saying is that once he knows his build orders and timings, he should actively work on being faster. Not just spamming 123123123123, but doing EVERYTHING he does.....just faster. What is soo wrong about that? How is that bad advice? Oh okay, I guess I just misunderstood your point. I thought you meant that he should focus on getting ridiculously fast through spamming and useless actions. Now that I understand your point, i.e. he should actively try to be faster with his build and complete things faster, I do agree. This is what I was trying to get across before.
ah ok cool. Well I apologize if I came off too strong. Cheers
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United States43188 Posts
On November 21 2009 12:04 vRoOk wrote:
just got 270.. : /
Just got 120.
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Dominican Republic825 Posts
On November 21 2009 08:14 eXigent. wrote:
Alot of people are forgetting the fact that APM equates to more than just hand speed. In order to have good macro, you need FAST HANDS. Watch a few streams, and you will see that all of the players are 200+APM, you need this in order to continually multitask...which is a HUGE PART OF THE GAME. Ignore the people that are saying APM is useless. Sure 400APM is unrealistic and pretty useless for a player of your caliber, but you certainly should try and maintain 190-220 APM while playing. This is not too fast that you can't think straight, but its also fast enough to allow you to multitask properly.
Your APM will not raise itself, no matter what people say. You need to take an active role in getting faster, because otherwise your hands will get use to the slower speed you are playing, and you wont get any faster. This stuff takes effort, and doesn't just come as you play.
totally right my buddy
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EPT
