EPTwhy i hate iccup D rank. - Page 5
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Nytefish
United Kingdom4282 Posts
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iLoveKT
Philippines3615 Posts
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Thats_The_Spirit
Netherlands138 Posts
Going 12 hatch is not some right every zerg has. You can't expect to start with an instant expasion with a booming economy every game on every map without the posibility of getting punished. With every economy build comes a RISK. If you want to 12 hatch you better know how to prevent getting owned by cheese. | ||
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win8282
Korea (South)454 Posts
On September 07 2009 15:28 Misrah wrote: I'm not disagreeing with anything. I am merely stating the fact that i find it rather funny that this MOTW list has multiple maps where zerg HAS to do a strat (particularly pool first) builds- for no reason other than to watch out for early game shit. I think that is ridiculous. Likewise as a non-chessing protoss I find I always have to use my 9th probe (10 supply) to build forge asap cause zergs will 4poo/9pool/overpool much more often. And btw, I think zerg in zvp has one of the most powerful cheeses. 2 hat hydra. If protoss can't scout it, he's fucked unless he gets like 4-5 cannons + 1 control group of probes to defend | ||
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Thats_The_Spirit
Netherlands138 Posts
On September 07 2009 21:38 win8282 wrote: Likewise as a non-chessing protoss I find I always have to use my 9th probe (10 supply) to build forge asap cause zergs will 4poo/9pool/overpool much more often. And btw, I think zerg in zvp has one of the most powerful cheeses. 2 hat hydra. If protoss can't scout it, he's fucked unless he gets like 4-5 cannons + 1 control group of probes to defend Isn't 2 hat hydra more like an agressive strat than cheese? But thats the risk protoss takes when going FE. | ||
motbob
United States12546 Posts
On September 07 2009 21:53 Thats_The_Spirit wrote: Isn't 2 hat hydra more like an agressive strat than cheese? But thats the risk protoss takes when going FE. Cheese is so vague. 2 hatch hydra is an all-in timing attack. | ||
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Severedevil
United States4839 Posts
On September 07 2009 21:26 Thats_The_Spirit wrote: Frogmetter was right on. Going 12 hatch is not some right every zerg has. You can't expect to start with an instant expasion with a booming economy every game on every map without the posibility of getting punished. With every economy build comes a RISK. If you want to 12 hatch you better know how to prevent getting owned by cheese. Defensive 12hatch (in the main) is safe in every matchup except ZvZ, and still safe vs. 9pools without aggressive sunken. If you are cheesed (or non-proxy-2gated and contained) your sweet economy should let you break out pretty easily. 9overlord 12hatch (main) 11pool 13hatch (nat) (place in main or skip for faster hydra/muta against some aggressive plays) Is acceptable against P/T, and the delay in mining at your nat's minerals shouldn't cost all that much. Not every build can be done in the same way as if you 12hatch expo, but it's safer and gets the full drone count until the fourth hatchery (which is delayed by the lost minerals). On September 07 2009 21:53 Thats_The_Spirit wrote: Isn't 2 hat hydra more like an agressive strat than cheese? But thats the risk protoss takes when going FE. If you feel the need to classify, 3hat hydra is an aggressive strat while 2hat hydra is cheese. | ||
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Piste
6183 Posts
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Pokebunny
United States10654 Posts
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Piste
6183 Posts
On September 07 2009 21:53 Thats_The_Spirit wrote: Isn't 2 hat hydra more like an agressive strat than cheese? But thats the risk protoss takes when going FE. imho it's cheese, if you are able to scout it in time zerg has no chance. | ||
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machinehead..
412 Posts
I realize at the start of the season you can't be sure of what skill level you are playing against, but that is merely more reason to play cautiously. | ||
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
Also, it's your bloody fault for trying to 12hatch on Tau Cross, seriously. That's just asking to get screwed. There's just seriously 0 reasons for you to 12hatch at all on these two maps. They're going to scout you early, and it's not like you lose any eco from going 9pool or overpool vs Protoss FE. And Terrans always always always pull out disgustingly frustrating builds on 2 player maps. You can't really do much about that. It's always been like that. | ||
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Kletus
Canada580 Posts
Zerg can never be ahead, only even. That is the price we pay for playing the least boring race. | ||
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Severedevil
United States4839 Posts
On September 07 2009 23:33 Kletus wrote: One of the first things I learned about Zerg is that you can NEVER EVER for one second think that you are ahead. You are on 3 bases and just busted that tosses nat? Well I hope your overlords are placed in the right spots because if they aren't, you'll lose. Zerg can never be ahead, only even. That is the price we pay for playing the least boring race. Is the complaint that you don't have to buy detectors to have detection? LOL. If Protoss scatters their Pylons around the map and accidentally forgets to build one in their base, we get fucked too... | ||
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
On September 07 2009 23:33 Kletus wrote: One of the first things I learned about Zerg is that you can NEVER EVER for one second think that you are ahead. You are on 3 bases and just busted that tosses nat? Well I hope your overlords are placed in the right spots because if they aren't, you'll lose. Zerg can never be ahead, only even. That is the price we pay for playing the least boring race. Uh, what? | ||
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Kletus
Canada580 Posts
On September 07 2009 23:38 Severedevil wrote: Is the complaint that you don't have to buy detectors to have detection? LOL. No I'm not complaining. I don't mind having to have to play almost perfect against an opponent that doesn't. The overlord placement scenario was just one example. | ||
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7mk
Germany10157 Posts
On September 07 2009 19:47 SkelA wrote: Easy to stop send 9 drone to check if he has probe and building pylon with drone and block place for forge if he is send 1-2 more drones = making toss mad and discing . Had exatcly game like this last season You cannot possibly expect people to 9 drone scout ZvP on 2 player maps. Also PLEASE use something called grammar, your post was nearly unreadable. Honestly I dont get all the OP bashing either, yeah going 12 hatch on tau cross in ZvP isnt smart, yeah a better player would have defended better, yeah it's a bit whiny, but I bet at least 70% of all the bashing people nerdrage themselves when they get cheesed. + Show Spoiler + bye bye fanatacist, I used to like his posts but I'm glad he got temp banned, he's just been a fucking dick lately | ||
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Kletus
Canada580 Posts
On September 07 2009 23:42 7mk wrote: + Show Spoiler + bye bye fanatacist, I used to like his posts but I'm glad he got temp banned, he's just been a fucking dick lately I try not to judge, I mean maybe he's just having some real life issues or w/e. Anyways back to the topic, I used to go 12hatch against P but then got tired of all the cheese and stuff. 9pool all the way, you'd be surprised how many greedy tosses there are and how many free points you'll get. Also, DO NOT send a drone out to scout at 9 unless you are planning on going overpool and digging out back minerals. On September 07 2009 23:38 Severedevil wrote: If Protoss scatters their Pylons around the map and accidentally forgets to build one in their base, we get fucked too... Not if the Protoss is on 3 bases. | ||
n.DieJokes
United States3443 Posts
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28866 Posts
heartbridge is a good zerg map going pool first.. | ||
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