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watch this.... Its blows me away, the people that i am forced to play with, on maps that are as stupid as all hell. See- tau and HB.
so lets begin:
My first game on tau- and i am playing a protoss player. So i send a drone out at 11 to scout, and proceed to 12 hatch. Now i place a drone at my choke to make sure that i can not be pyloned in. So all is well- his scouting probe is chilling inside of my base, when i see from one of my scouting lords- another probe. At this point, i know something is going down- and begin to race my drones to my choke. Now my 11 scout drone is completely on the other side of the map- and slowly returning home at this point.
To my dismay- the scout probe and the other probe are able to lay a pylon some how when my drone is there- effectivly trapping me. My only hope now, is my 11 scout drone- who is still running back to base.
Sadly the fucktard of a P player puts up 2 cannons, and my 1 single drone cannot handle it. GG and FML
Second game: HB ridge against T.
I 12 hatch again, send a drone scout at 11- and place a drone in my choke in case of depot. all is well- untill i find a proxy 9 rax in the map on HB. so i rally all of my drones exept for three- and begin the bunker war. I need to grab many more drones than usual however- because i cannot let an scv block my choke with a depot, stop marines, and stop that bunker. So at this point in the game- i have 12 drones, and all but three are now running around the map trying to kill rines.
Lucky for me- this fucker brings most of his scv's out and begins to chase my drones around with his scv/marine combo. I lose all but 2- and with my inital 12 lings- i find that he has walled off with his rax and a factory. I cannot break the wall down considering the fact he had 4 scv's repairing it- and before long a vulture was out.
Back at home, i was mining off of minimal drones- i place a sunken before 16 supply and then start getting my third hath before gas. I block his vult- but then find that he was wraiths killing my lords. My spire has not even started yet so gg once again- to fucktards.
I am done with this game- it sickens me that no one plays straight up- but instead hides around fucking map bullshit. the motw set is retarded, and i cannot believe that anyone thinks having a tight choke from the natural to main is a good idea at all. zerg always has to be extra defensive, and i am done with it.
Maybe i will play when the maps go towards something resembling normalcy but for now fuck it.
I find it funny that people complain about zerg cheese. Zerg can't cheese. they can't do shit- if you fail to any zerg sneak strategy then you deserved it. Zerg doesn't have any proxy this, or proxy that- so if you play P or T and you have done what i have described above to any player- i hope that you suffer in the near future.
Im going to play halo.
 
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pool first on those maps misrah!
either that or 9drone scout. You just have to assume you are getting cheesed every single game until you can prove otherwise.
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On September 07 2009 15:00 sixghost wrote:
pool first on those maps misrah!
Fuck that- then you can just wall of your nat- and do what you like. i lose economy for nothing!!!!!! woot woot!
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anyone else have some good ideas? i swear- as soon as the next motw comes out- i am going to 4 pool iccup into hell.
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you play stupid
those maps force you to pool first you idiot
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On September 07 2009 15:06 FragKrag wrote:
you play stupid
those maps force you to pool first you idiot
and that's bullshit. i should take an economic because why???? ohh wait- the map.
so 12 pool all day every day?
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hey, i play to win
if cheese = gg, cool with me ^^
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On September 07 2009 15:09 lighter wrote:
hey, i play to win
if cheese = gg, cool with me ^^
yep you don't deserve to have that zerg symbol. change it.
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hahah I think someone was talking about doing this to someone on op irc earlier today.
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i 4pool only, and got to b-
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why are you complaining about losing when you're obviously playing bad? If you keep thinking about unorthodox/aggressive play as "cheese" and that your "straight up" play is magically going to win you games just because it "should" then this shit is going to keep happening to you.
I'd suggest rather than change any strategy, build, or tactic of yours, you drastically change the way you think.
Because from all you have written, it seems you know what you need to be doing for your game, and in the games you played too, it's just that your own thinking that your "straight up play" makes you deserve to win games is holding you back.
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On September 07 2009 15:14 jodogohoo wrote:
i 4pool only, and got to b-
That's because you played foreigners only.
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i overpool every game zvt and zvp because i'm scared of them making ebay/pylon blocking my natural hatchery, i fucking hate that
oh well, that early economy hit doesn't really matter at the shitty ranks
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In the tau game, you should have used your 11 scout drone to take the 3rd main base and play standard from there
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i 4pooled on heartbreak... forgot that smart terrans will block their entrance
geegee
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Pool first you stubborn ignorant fuck. People who are better than you are telling you to, and you disagree? True sign of an idiot.
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That kind of BS cheese only started happening after I got to C- level. I subsequently switched around with D+ and C- facing 2/3 terrans cheesing (1/3 of them hastily switching to terran after I choose zerg), and 1/3 toss players doing some sort of cannon rush.
why are you complaining about losing when you're obviously playing bad? If you keep thinking about unorthodox/aggressive play as "cheese" and that your "straight up" play is magically going to win you games just because it "should" then this shit is going to keep happening to you.
And I win most straight up plays. My drones are not gosu enough to fight probes or scvs!
Oh well I suck.
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On September 07 2009 15:16 avilo wrote:
why are you complaining about losing when you're obviously playing bad? If you keep thinking about unorthodox/aggressive play as "cheese" and that your "straight up" play is magically going to win you games just because it "should" then this shit is going to keep happening to you.
I'd suggest rather than change any strategy, build, or tactic of yours, you drastically change the way you think.
Because from all you have written, it seems you know what you need to be doing for your game, and in the games you played too, it's just that your own thinking that your "straight up play" makes you deserve to win games is holding you back.
LOL hardly. i play to get better, not to win- like some people. I can tell you that with out a shadow of a doubt in a straight up game, my winrate is much much higher than if i have to deal with cheese. It's not unorthodox, and it's not aggressive. It is cheese. It is people playing to win, not to get better- and i hate it. An aggressive strat is 2 gate, sparks, 2 hatch muta. Don't try and tell me the line between cheese and aggression.
change the way i think? no i don't think so. The way the kids on the B train train in korea, it's not with cheese. in fact- if you are cheesing during a game while practicing you are thrown out of the house. Because guess what? cheese doesn't make you any better at the game. Period.
You play terran? then you wouldn't understand.
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By the way pool first ZvT isn't really good unless you commit to it (with speed), so what is more common nowadays is 9 drone scout (after you start your first overlord).
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Ugh 12 hatch vs protoss is really rough imo. They get such a fast tech it's ridiculous. I always overpool vs protoss so they have to put down cannons and slow their tech down. It's very worth it. Plus overpool is very good vs 2 gate and proxy gates (imo it's an instant win vs proxy gates) or any faggotry like that.
Vs terran just go 9 pool if you need to pool first. Either that or overpool/12 pool aren't horrible if you are doing a 2 hatch I find.
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On September 07 2009 15:21 fanatacist wrote:
Pool first you stubborn ignorant fuck. People who are better than you are telling you to, and you disagree? True sign of an idiot.
I'm not disagreeing with anything. I am merely stating the fact that i find it rather funny that this MOTW list has multiple maps where zerg HAS to do a strat (particularly pool first) builds- for no reason other than to watch out for early game shit. I think that is ridiculous.
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except tau is decently balanced right
and on heartbreak tvz terran is forced to mech
means you're doing something wrong
zerg aggression = later cc or added cannons
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Well you know how In EVERY map in EVERY MOTW Protoss have to do FE vs. Z? Yea.
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cheese is part of the game deal with it period.
oh by the way tell that to boxer or leta or any cheesy sh*t because we see cheesy play from korea too.
yes i play terran guess what i understand watch more PL your posts are pretty ignorant from people on TL on helping your play. dont like SC? dont play at all
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^ Work on your concept transitions bro, you just threw like 10 ideas into 2 sentences and shook it up with an egg beater.
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On September 07 2009 15:32 fanatacist wrote:
Well you know how In EVERY map in EVERY MOTW Protoss have to do FE vs. Z? Yea.
Nope. i am sure i have seen proxy gates, 2 gate, 1 gate and the like. But i could be wrong- because i suck and don't know the difference between a forge and a gate.
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One build I've seen work well on HBR is overpool, but 9 scout and mine out the backdoor minerals. You will finish mining it out JUST as your lings gets there. At D rank no one checks it
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On September 07 2009 15:36 Misrah wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 15:32 fanatacist wrote:
Well you know how In EVERY map in EVERY MOTW Protoss have to do FE vs. Z? Yea. Nope. i am sure i have seen proxy gates, 2 gate, 1 gate and the like. But i could be wrong- because i suck and don't know the difference between a forge and a gate.
Yes but those are all clearly inferior and never win.
Remember, accepting you have a problem is the first step to getting through it. Maybe you should watch some progames or something, there is this site... Ah fuck it, once a noob always a noob. Good luck getting out of D rank without anti-cheese game sense.
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On September 07 2009 15:33 geegee1 wrote:
cheese is part of the game deal with it period.
oh by the way tell that to boxer or leta or any cheesy sh*t because we see cheesy play from korea too.
yes i play terran guess what i understand watch more PL your posts are pretty ignorant from people on TL on helping your play. dont like SC? dont play at all
too bad boxer is accomplished and sadly- no one iccup can compare to the emperor. 2 port wraith isn't cheese- it's brute apm skill.
You don't understand the difference between unorthodox/ aggressive play, and cheese.
Boxer didn't do what he did through cheese. Not at all.
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LMAO
I feel your pain
I'm a zerg player who almost always 12 hatches
One of the first things I did was get a friend who is a higher rank than I am cheese me over and over again until I could block them
Trust me, you need to learn how to block cheese and the only way you can do that is to practice against it
And when you see a cheese, don't get too worked up
I used to get super pissed whenever I saw a cheese and that fucked me up bad
You play MUCH better when you are calm and confident, and that will come from practice
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On September 07 2009 15:38 frogmelter wrote:
LMAO
I feel you're pain
A promising start to a post...
On September 07 2009 15:38 frogmelter wrote:
I'm a zerg player who almost always 12 hatches
Even better...
On September 07 2009 15:38 frogmelter wrote:
One of the first things I did was get a friend who is a higher rank than I am cheese me over and over again until I could block them
Trust me, you need to learn how to block cheese and the only way you can do that is to practice against it
And when you see a cheese, don't get too worked up
I used to get super pissed whenever I saw a cheese and that fucked me up bad
You play MUCH better when you are calm and confident, and that will come from practice
Congrats you saved this post's quality.
8/10.
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On September 07 2009 15:38 Misrah wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 15:33 geegee1 wrote:
cheese is part of the game deal with it period.
oh by the way tell that to boxer or leta or any cheesy sh*t because we see cheesy play from korea too.
yes i play terran guess what i understand watch more PL your posts are pretty ignorant from people on TL on helping your play. dont like SC? dont play at all too bad boxer is accomplished and sadly- no one iccup can compare to the emperor. 2 port wraith isn't cheese- it's brute apm skill. You don't understand the difference between unorthodox/ aggressive play, and cheese. Boxer didn't do what he did through cheese. Not at all.
you just called 2 port bullshit
and i dunno, i think bunker rushes and scv/rine allins are pretty cheesy.
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Misrah, you have had pretty much everybody who bothered to respond to your thread call you an idiot. Haven't you figured it out by now?
You are not forced in to anything, you know that right? You want to get better? Learn to think. Your BO of choice keeps getting punished? Either scout earlier or your BO on the fly. If you want to just follow a preset plan until the game is over go play connect the dots or something because that certainly is not going to make you better at SC.
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On September 07 2009 15:44 Bearigator wrote:
Misrah, you have had pretty much everybody who bothered to respond to your thread call you an idiot. Haven't you figured it out by now?
You are not forced in to anything, you know that right? You want to get better? Learn to think. Your BO of choice keeps getting punished? Either scout earlier or your BO on the fly. If you want to just follow a preset plan until the game is over go play connect the dots or something because that certainly is not going to make you better at SC.
9/10 for the syntax mistake. Otherwise 100% true. Connect the dots was a good touch.
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On September 07 2009 15:18 Camlito wrote:That's because you played foreigners only.
i'm in the same timezone as korea. fuuuuck.
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If you went 9 pool you would have won and your opponents would be raging in the same fashion as yourself. WHY CANT THIS ZERG JUST PLAY STANDARD 12 HATCH AND LOSE LIKE I WANT!!!!!!!!
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On September 07 2009 15:52 madnessman wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 15:18 Camlito wrote:On September 07 2009 15:14 jodogohoo wrote:
i 4pool only, and got to b- That's because you played foreigners only. i'm in the same timezone as korea. fuuuuck.
Play at night (:
I do this and it backfires, you do this and you WIN.
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On September 07 2009 15:21 fanatacist wrote:
Pool first you stubborn ignorant fuck. People who are better than you are telling you to, and you disagree? True sign of an idiot.
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No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post
I understand your pain even though I quit Zerg long time ago. The reason why I quit Zerg was because Zerg rarely had any cheeses and always had to adapt according to your opponent, and if Z did have some, it was pretty much all-in unlike Terrans who can cheese and never get punished for it because most of their cheese is not all-in.
Your first example verses the Protoss player was kinda meaningless because it was your fault for playing a dumb map that allowed that kind of shit. (When I used to see Terrans who made Lost Temple on iccup, I would join, make fun of him for hosting the imba map, and just leave right when game started)
But I totally feel your pain of having to scout for that hidden proxy because Zerg cant proxy anything and the mere fact that you're wasting your scouting worker's time JUST to look for the non-existent proxy already creates a small disadvantage.
You just have to accept the fact that no human-made RTS game can be truly balanced. [Insert Artosis's Famous Balance Quote Here] Yes, Starcraft is a balanced piece of art but its not balanced enough (underpowered Z, overpowered T, sometimes)
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough)
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On September 07 2009 15:59 AzureEye wrote:
No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post
I understand your pain even though I quit Zerg long time ago. The reason why I quit Zerg was because Zerg rarely had any cheeses and always had to adapt according to your opponent, and if Z did have some, it was pretty much all-in unlike Terrans who can cheese and never get punished for it because most of their cheese is not all-in.
Your first example verses the Protoss player was kinda meaningless because it was your fault for playing a dumb map that allowed that kind of shit. (When I used to see Terrans who made Lost Temple on iccup, I would join, make fun of him for hosting the imba map, and just leave right when game started)
But I totally feel your pain of having to scout for that hidden proxy because Zerg cant proxy anything and the mere fact that you're wasting your scouting worker's time JUST to look for the non-existent proxy already creates a small disadvantage.
You just have to accept the fact that no human-made RTS game can be truly balanced. [Insert Artosis's Famous Balance Quote Here] Yes, Starcraft is a balanced piece of art but its not balanced enough (underpowered Z, overpowered T, sometimes)
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough)
I bolded everything that is wrong or stupid in your post. Needless to say my opinion of you is rather negative right now.
-2/10
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Zurich15317 Posts
On September 07 2009 15:52 Swarmy wrote:
If you went 9 pool you would have won and your opponents would be raging in the same fashion as yourself. WHY CANT THIS ZERG JUST PLAY STANDARD 12 HATCH AND LOSE LIKE I WANT!!!!!!!!
This. I go 9 pool on HBR just because of the high rate of free wins vs proxy 8rax. And since you are playing on D enough D don't even know how to wall right. Admittedly it sets you back a bit if they wall off correctly but not by too much.
Vs P do what someone else suggested, send your 9 drone to his back minerals and overpool.
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On September 07 2009 15:52 madnessman wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 15:18 Camlito wrote:On September 07 2009 15:14 jodogohoo wrote:
i 4pool only, and got to b- That's because you played foreigners only. i'm in the same timezone as korea. fuuuuck.
I'm in the korean timezone too  .
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dammit I just know that if my opponent goes for mass wraith valk I'll win
wtf is this vulture tank bullshit
why can't these guys play the way I want them to
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intrigue
Washington, D.C9933 Posts
at the very very least you should be scouting on 9 if you want to 12 hatch. any later is just overly greedy, for maybe a gain of 50 minerals. is it that marginal gain ever worth instant losing a game for? do you really think at the D level something like that will make or break your game?
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On September 07 2009 16:04 fanatacist wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 15:59 AzureEye wrote:
No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post
I understand your pain even though I quit Zerg long time ago. The reason why I quit Zerg was because Zerg rarely had any cheeses and always had to adapt according to your opponent, and if Z did have some, it was pretty much all-in unlike Terrans who can cheese and never get punished for it because most of their cheese is not all-in.
Your first example verses the Protoss player was kinda meaningless because it was your fault for playing a dumb map that allowed that kind of shit. (When I used to see Terrans who made Lost Temple on iccup, I would join, make fun of him for hosting the imba map, and just leave right when game started)
But I totally feel your pain of having to scout for that hidden proxy because Zerg cant proxy anything and the mere fact that you're wasting your scouting worker's time JUST to look for the non-existent proxy already creates a small disadvantage.
You just have to accept the fact that no human-made RTS game can be truly balanced. [Insert Artosis's Famous Balance Quote Here] Yes, Starcraft is a balanced piece of art but its not balanced enough (underpowered Z, overpowered T, sometimes)
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough) I bolded everything that is wrong or stupid in your post. Needless to say my opinion of you is rather negative right now. -2/10
The fact that you bolded the first sentence "No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post" just shows your post is more worthless than mine
And the fact that you rate a post too lol
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On September 07 2009 16:12 AzureEye wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 16:04 fanatacist wrote:On September 07 2009 15:59 AzureEye wrote:
No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post
I understand your pain even though I quit Zerg long time ago. The reason why I quit Zerg was because Zerg rarely had any cheeses and always had to adapt according to your opponent, and if Z did have some, it was pretty much all-in unlike Terrans who can cheese and never get punished for it because most of their cheese is not all-in.
Your first example verses the Protoss player was kinda meaningless because it was your fault for playing a dumb map that allowed that kind of shit. (When I used to see Terrans who made Lost Temple on iccup, I would join, make fun of him for hosting the imba map, and just leave right when game started)
But I totally feel your pain of having to scout for that hidden proxy because Zerg cant proxy anything and the mere fact that you're wasting your scouting worker's time JUST to look for the non-existent proxy already creates a small disadvantage.
You just have to accept the fact that no human-made RTS game can be truly balanced. [Insert Artosis's Famous Balance Quote Here] Yes, Starcraft is a balanced piece of art but its not balanced enough (underpowered Z, overpowered T, sometimes)
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough) I bolded everything that is wrong or stupid in your post. Needless to say my opinion of you is rather negative right now. -2/10 The fact that you bolded the first sentence "No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post" just shows your post is more worthless than mine And the fact that you rate a post too lol
Who said my posts were worth anything? You put a lot more effort into yours than I did mine, and for what result? Yea.
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On September 07 2009 16:13 fanatacist wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 16:12 AzureEye wrote:On September 07 2009 16:04 fanatacist wrote:On September 07 2009 15:59 AzureEye wrote:
No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post
I understand your pain even though I quit Zerg long time ago. The reason why I quit Zerg was because Zerg rarely had any cheeses and always had to adapt according to your opponent, and if Z did have some, it was pretty much all-in unlike Terrans who can cheese and never get punished for it because most of their cheese is not all-in.
Your first example verses the Protoss player was kinda meaningless because it was your fault for playing a dumb map that allowed that kind of shit. (When I used to see Terrans who made Lost Temple on iccup, I would join, make fun of him for hosting the imba map, and just leave right when game started)
But I totally feel your pain of having to scout for that hidden proxy because Zerg cant proxy anything and the mere fact that you're wasting your scouting worker's time JUST to look for the non-existent proxy already creates a small disadvantage.
You just have to accept the fact that no human-made RTS game can be truly balanced. [Insert Artosis's Famous Balance Quote Here] Yes, Starcraft is a balanced piece of art but its not balanced enough (underpowered Z, overpowered T, sometimes)
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough) I bolded everything that is wrong or stupid in your post. Needless to say my opinion of you is rather negative right now. -2/10 The fact that you bolded the first sentence "No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post" just shows your post is more worthless than mine And the fact that you rate a post too lol Who said my posts were worth anything? You put a lot more effort into yours than I did mine, and for what result? Yea.
Obviously you care about how valuable posts are when you are here wasting time to think of the score quality of someone's post
Way to contradict yourself, eh? 
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Can you imagine the rage if Misrah played Terran?
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On September 07 2009 16:14 AzureEye wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 16:13 fanatacist wrote:On September 07 2009 16:12 AzureEye wrote:On September 07 2009 16:04 fanatacist wrote:On September 07 2009 15:59 AzureEye wrote:
No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post
I understand your pain even though I quit Zerg long time ago. The reason why I quit Zerg was because Zerg rarely had any cheeses and always had to adapt according to your opponent, and if Z did have some, it was pretty much all-in unlike Terrans who can cheese and never get punished for it because most of their cheese is not all-in.
Your first example verses the Protoss player was kinda meaningless because it was your fault for playing a dumb map that allowed that kind of shit. (When I used to see Terrans who made Lost Temple on iccup, I would join, make fun of him for hosting the imba map, and just leave right when game started)
But I totally feel your pain of having to scout for that hidden proxy because Zerg cant proxy anything and the mere fact that you're wasting your scouting worker's time JUST to look for the non-existent proxy already creates a small disadvantage.
You just have to accept the fact that no human-made RTS game can be truly balanced. [Insert Artosis's Famous Balance Quote Here] Yes, Starcraft is a balanced piece of art but its not balanced enough (underpowered Z, overpowered T, sometimes)
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough) I bolded everything that is wrong or stupid in your post. Needless to say my opinion of you is rather negative right now. -2/10 The fact that you bolded the first sentence "No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post" just shows your post is more worthless than mine And the fact that you rate a post too lol Who said my posts were worth anything? You put a lot more effort into yours than I did mine, and for what result? Yea. Obviously you care about how valuable posts are when you are here wasting time to think of the score quality of someone's post Way to contradict yourself, eh?
3/10
That took a lot of thought.
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Safe builds >>>> Aggressive builds >>>> Greedy builds > Safe builds.
You choose greedy builds and get punished by aggressive builds, that's just that simple.
And why should you NOT improve while doing pool first? JD is doing pool first, every goddamned pro on certain maps goes pool first. But you cannot?! LOL! Also remember that as well as being insta-win vs cheeses, pool early forces P to make cannons before nexus.
And don't BS about playing to improve - you won't play 100% to improve if you don't play practice partner. Either find one and practice one by one certain builds or go laddering and play MU's with every possibility in mind
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^@ Ty. I work extra hard for my extra points, your logic still fails though
On September 07 2009 16:14 Adeny wrote:
Can you imagine the rage if Misrah played Terran?
No, he wouldn't need to rage if he played Terran
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On September 07 2009 16:16 AzureEye wrote:
^@ Ty. I work extra hard for my extra points, your logic still fails though
I care.
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Fanatacist wins this thread tbh.
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Zerg is most all-inning race out there...
I think Nony said it best during his courage run, "I'm playing an all-in zerg next... but what zerg's AREN'T all-in?"
PvZ, a constant probe scout is necessary to scout the shit like 5-pool/ 9-pool speed run-by/ 3-hatch-hydra/ 2 hatch-hydra/ 3 hatch-speedlings.
Then you got the, fast lurker/mutalisk switch up at Lair, or they can just play straight up and take 5 bases.
I had a friend constantly do 9-pool speedlings against me and now at my level, I get confident once I'm suspicious that they're going to try it. Stop complaining about balance and rage-quitting starcraft because of stupid complaints.
At D, the map imbalances aren't even going to punish you that harshly.
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On September 07 2009 16:16 AzureEye wrote:^@ Ty. I work extra hard for my extra points, your logic still fails though Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 16:14 Adeny wrote:
Can you imagine the rage if Misrah played Terran? No, he wouldn't need to rage if he played Terran
Oh dude you don't even know how much rage there would be if he was Terran. Shit would get ugly.
Also,
On September 07 2009 15:59 AzureEye wrote:
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough)
I find it extremely odd that you would cite the Terran's ability to switch techs when I consider the zerg's ability to switch techs to be one of its greatest strengths. A terran would have to lay down a lot of new buildings in order to reasonably switch techs. By contrast a zerg has an all-purpose production building, and typically only needs to construct one new buillding to do the same.
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Scout with drone at 9. Proceed with your 12 hatch.
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I cant tell if misrah is trolling or not tbh, either way kudos for selling it to so many people, or, kudos for sticking by your guns even tho everyone is telling you how wrong you are and how silly your point of view is coming across.
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I have the answer: Don't play MOTW. No one is forcing you to use one of those 5 maps that you seem to be struggling with, play a different map, maybe one where your build order is more viable. At this level of play I doubt the bonus points would have really helped you anyway.
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I always get cheesed by p on hbr
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Lol fanatacist you are too funny.
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On September 07 2009 15:59 AzureEye wrote:
No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post
I understand your pain even though I quit Zerg long time ago. The reason why I quit Zerg was because Zerg rarely had any cheeses and always had to adapt according to your opponent, and if Z did have some, it was pretty much all-in unlike Terrans who can cheese and never get punished for it because most of their cheese is not all-in.
Your first example verses the Protoss player was kinda meaningless because it was your fault for playing a dumb map that allowed that kind of shit. (When I used to see Terrans who made Lost Temple on iccup, I would join, make fun of him for hosting the imba map, and just leave right when game started)
But I totally feel your pain of having to scout for that hidden proxy because Zerg cant proxy anything and the mere fact that you're wasting your scouting worker's time JUST to look for the non-existent proxy already creates a small disadvantage.
You just have to accept the fact that no human-made RTS game can be truly balanced. [Insert Artosis's Famous Balance Quote Here] Yes, Starcraft is a balanced piece of art but its not balanced enough (underpowered Z, overpowered T, sometimes)
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough)
LOL this is the biggest troll post in the history of terrible troll posts
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Sad thing is it wasn't a troll.
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fuck that I get all-in linged every game tvz nowadays
i even see it fucking coming but nooo if i 1 rax fe 2 firebats and 8 rines cant fend fucking 30 speedlings shitting on your nat without having to lift and go 1 base play only to see 4 lurkers coming to assfuck you right after
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I like how the counter to zerg complaining too some people is complaining about there own experience about how they always lose vs zerg.
Such a nice, stupid world we live in.
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lol you know what? fuck D that's right fuck it. I just decided to jump on again- and over pooled every game.
FUCK YA 4 and ohhh bitches. I got 2 cheezing bastards with their pants down, and the other two tried some cute shit that failed.
Fuck 12 hatch- overpool ftw.
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On September 07 2009 17:52 Misrah wrote:
lol you know what? fuck D that's right fuck it. I just decided to jump on again- and over pooled every game.
FUCK YA 4 and ohhh bitches. I got 2 cheezing bastards with their pants down, and the other two tried some cute shit that failed.
Fuck 12 hatch- overpool ftw.
Now the next time someone posts a blog similar to your op, you can laugh at how much of an idiot they are too! :D. Grats 
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tau cross vs P you never 12hatch. Ever. I have no idea why anyone would even consider it in any situation.
On HBR 9pool isn't bad vs T. Their wall at nat will most likely have the second supply depot just started and you should be able to kill it since they won't be able to repair. Their barracks possibly isn't finished when you arrive either. A drone scout harrass would help immensely, but 9pool + drone scout is quite a hit to your economy. If they wall their main, the depot wall won't hold and the rax-fac wall lets you kill the factory. If you force them to pull a lot of SCVs and get a couple of them, you're pretty much even or ahead, and their entire timings are screwed up.
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Overpool is preety standard build in zvp and in no way you are behind vs fe infact you are getin advantage making p go forge cannon first instead nexus. every zerg that goes 12 hatch on tau deserves to get cannon rushed every time. I know i cannon rush zergs when i see them 12 hatch and i scout them at first try = free points
Dont hate iccup for your incompetence of not understanding basic stuff. And for the record tau cross is Z>>>>>P i know this because i play zvp pvz
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+ Show Spoiler +On September 07 2009 18:33 SkelA wrote:
Overpool is preety standard build in zvp and in no way you are behind vs fe infact you are getin advantage making p go forge cannon first instead nexus. every zerg that goes 12 hatch on tau deserves to get cannon rushed every time. I know i cannon rush zergs when i see them 12 hatch and i scout them at first try = free points
Dont hate iccup for your incompetence of not understanding basic stuff. And for the record tau cross is Z>>>>>P i know this because i play zvp pvz
Yea I'm with you misrah ♥ fuck P on that map with their forge block bullshit or how about a little proxy barracks, into proxy factory ... notice that everyone who replied OMG you don't like CHEESE??? is either p or t. And no overpool = forge, nexus, cannons
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On September 07 2009 14:54 Misrah wrote:
Im going to play halo.
Yessss come to the dark side.
GT: bwwaaaa
Add me yo!
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United States11390 Posts
On September 07 2009 18:33 SkelA wrote:
Overpool is preety standard build in zvp and in no way you are behind vs fe infact you are getin advantage making p go forge cannon first instead nexus. every zerg that goes 12 hatch on tau deserves to get cannon rushed every time. I know i cannon rush zergs when i see them 12 hatch and i scout them at first try = free points
Dont hate iccup for your incompetence of not understanding basic stuff. And for the record tau cross is Z>>>>>P i know this because i play zvp pvz
?
Most maps (like HBR) you can forge nex before cannon against overpool.
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On September 07 2009 19:21 Harem wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 18:33 SkelA wrote:
Overpool is preety standard build in zvp and in no way you are behind vs fe infact you are getin advantage making p go forge cannon first instead nexus. every zerg that goes 12 hatch on tau deserves to get cannon rushed every time. I know i cannon rush zergs when i see them 12 hatch and i scout them at first try = free points
Dont hate iccup for your incompetence of not understanding basic stuff. And for the record tau cross is Z>>>>>P i know this because i play zvp pvz ? Most maps (like HBR) you can forge nex before cannon against overpool.
Easy to stop send 9 drone to check if he has probe and building pylon with drone and block place for forge if he is send 1-2 more drones = making toss mad and discing . Had exatcly game like this last season
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On September 07 2009 18:50 Wotans_Fire wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On September 07 2009 18:33 SkelA wrote:
Overpool is preety standard build in zvp and in no way you are behind vs fe infact you are getin advantage making p go forge cannon first instead nexus. every zerg that goes 12 hatch on tau deserves to get cannon rushed every time. I know i cannon rush zergs when i see them 12 hatch and i scout them at first try = free points
Dont hate iccup for your incompetence of not understanding basic stuff. And for the record tau cross is Z>>>>>P i know this because i play zvp pvz Yea I'm with you misrah ♥ fuck P on that map with their forge block bullshit or how about a little proxy barracks, into proxy factory ... notice that everyone who replied OMG you don't like CHEESE??? is either p or t. And no overpool = forge, nexus, cannons
Not correct again If zerg is doing overpool and making lings after pool and ignoring your scout you can barely defend with cannons + 5-10 probes going into block on expo which put you at great disadvantage not minging for like 1 min with and he can just runin your base picking of probes delay your mining.
You can go forge nexus cannon if zerg is overpool 12 hatch then 2-4 lings + pump drones after
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On September 07 2009 16:12 AzureEye wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 16:04 fanatacist wrote:On September 07 2009 15:59 AzureEye wrote:
No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post
I understand your pain even though I quit Zerg long time ago. The reason why I quit Zerg was because Zerg rarely had any cheeses and always had to adapt according to your opponent, and if Z did have some, it was pretty much all-in unlike Terrans who can cheese and never get punished for it because most of their cheese is not all-in.
Your first example verses the Protoss player was kinda meaningless because it was your fault for playing a dumb map that allowed that kind of shit. (When I used to see Terrans who made Lost Temple on iccup, I would join, make fun of him for hosting the imba map, and just leave right when game started)
But I totally feel your pain of having to scout for that hidden proxy because Zerg cant proxy anything and the mere fact that you're wasting your scouting worker's time JUST to look for the non-existent proxy already creates a small disadvantage.
You just have to accept the fact that no human-made RTS game can be truly balanced. [Insert Artosis's Famous Balance Quote Here] Yes, Starcraft is a balanced piece of art but its not balanced enough (underpowered Z, overpowered T, sometimes)
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough) I bolded everything that is wrong or stupid in your post. Needless to say my opinion of you is rather negative right now. -2/10 The fact that you bolded the first sentence "No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post" just shows your post is more worthless than mine And the fact that you rate a post too lol
God fanatacist. Yeah you are a smart guy, but in this thread you are being fucking retarded.
oooooo "9/10 for the syntax mistake" so sexy! oh my i am impressed.
Stop being a fuckshitass pompous douche. we are not all little kids begging for your approval "ooo fanatacist please rate my post!"
needless to say, my opinion of you is rather negative right now.
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Netherlands19129 Posts
overpool no gas 3 hat vs P and vs T just send out 2 drones, you have to anyway cause its a 2 player map and if he builds something just pool gas.
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If you arenot able to win against cheesy build it is only your fault.
Cheesy build is one of the most entertaining part of the game.
When yellow had been three time in a row bunker rushed by yellow should had cried?
I know it piss of but it is only a strategy gam..wake up
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12 hatch vs protoss on tau/heartbreak is really just asking for it. If I was playing protoss and intending to FE and play straight up, but then saw that you 12 hatched, I'd still go for the cannons.
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On September 07 2009 19:58 m4gdelen4 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 16:12 AzureEye wrote:On September 07 2009 16:04 fanatacist wrote:On September 07 2009 15:59 AzureEye wrote:
No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post
I understand your pain even though I quit Zerg long time ago. The reason why I quit Zerg was because Zerg rarely had any cheeses and always had to adapt according to your opponent, and if Z did have some, it was pretty much all-in unlike Terrans who can cheese and never get punished for it because most of their cheese is not all-in.
Your first example verses the Protoss player was kinda meaningless because it was your fault for playing a dumb map that allowed that kind of shit. (When I used to see Terrans who made Lost Temple on iccup, I would join, make fun of him for hosting the imba map, and just leave right when game started)
But I totally feel your pain of having to scout for that hidden proxy because Zerg cant proxy anything and the mere fact that you're wasting your scouting worker's time JUST to look for the non-existent proxy already creates a small disadvantage.
You just have to accept the fact that no human-made RTS game can be truly balanced. [Insert Artosis's Famous Balance Quote Here] Yes, Starcraft is a balanced piece of art but its not balanced enough (underpowered Z, overpowered T, sometimes)
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough) I bolded everything that is wrong or stupid in your post. Needless to say my opinion of you is rather negative right now. -2/10 The fact that you bolded the first sentence "No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post" just shows your post is more worthless than mine And the fact that you rate a post too lol God fanatacist. Yeah you are a smart guy, but in this thread you are being fucking retarded. oooooo "9/10 for the syntax mistake" so sexy! oh my i am impressed. Stop being a fuckshitass pompous douche. we are not all little kids begging for your approval "ooo fanatacist please rate my post!" needless to say, my opinion of you is rather negative right now.
Someone's opinion of someone is negative? ON THE INTERNET? Alert all battlestations! This is unacceptable!
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On September 07 2009 15:38 frogmelter wrote:
LMAO
I feel you're pain
I'm a zerg player who almost always 12 hatches
One of the first things I did was get a friend who is a higher rank than I am cheese me over and over again until I could block them
Trust me, you need to learn how to block cheese and the only way you can do that is to practice against it
And when you see a cheese, don't get too worked up
I used to get super pissed whenever I saw a cheese and that fucked me up bad
You play MUCH better when you are calm and confident, and that will come from practice
end of thread?
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From a pure game theory point of view, it's highly illogical not to overpool early season, D rank, on those particular maps. And if you're planning to 12 hatch, why not 9 drone scout? At your level, in 99.5% of cases it won't cause you to lose the game.
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I was gonna say that pool first was the morale of the story but i guess this is already settled. Congrats.
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Frogmetter was right on.
Going 12 hatch is not some right every zerg has. You can't expect to start with an instant expasion with a booming economy every game on every map without the posibility of getting punished. With every economy build comes a RISK. If you want to 12 hatch you better know how to prevent getting owned by cheese.
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On September 07 2009 15:28 Misrah wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 15:21 fanatacist wrote:
Pool first you stubborn ignorant fuck. People who are better than you are telling you to, and you disagree? True sign of an idiot. I'm not disagreeing with anything. I am merely stating the fact that i find it rather funny that this MOTW list has multiple maps where zerg HAS to do a strat (particularly pool first) builds- for no reason other than to watch out for early game shit. I think that is ridiculous.
Likewise as a non-chessing protoss I find I always have to use my 9th probe (10 supply) to build forge asap cause zergs will 4poo/9pool/overpool much more often.
And btw, I think zerg in zvp has one of the most powerful cheeses. 2 hat hydra. If protoss can't scout it, he's fucked unless he gets like 4-5 cannons + 1 control group of probes to defend
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On September 07 2009 21:38 win8282 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 15:28 Misrah wrote:On September 07 2009 15:21 fanatacist wrote:
Pool first you stubborn ignorant fuck. People who are better than you are telling you to, and you disagree? True sign of an idiot. I'm not disagreeing with anything. I am merely stating the fact that i find it rather funny that this MOTW list has multiple maps where zerg HAS to do a strat (particularly pool first) builds- for no reason other than to watch out for early game shit. I think that is ridiculous. Likewise as a non-chessing protoss I find I always have to use my 9th probe (10 supply) to build forge asap cause zergs will 4poo/9pool/overpool much more often. And btw, I think zerg in zvp has one of the most powerful cheeses. 2 hat hydra. If protoss can't scout it, he's fucked unless he gets like 4-5 cannons + 1 control group of probes to defend
Isn't 2 hat hydra more like an agressive strat than cheese? But thats the risk protoss takes when going FE.
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motbob
United States12546 Posts
On September 07 2009 21:53 Thats_The_Spirit wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 21:38 win8282 wrote:On September 07 2009 15:28 Misrah wrote:On September 07 2009 15:21 fanatacist wrote:
Pool first you stubborn ignorant fuck. People who are better than you are telling you to, and you disagree? True sign of an idiot. I'm not disagreeing with anything. I am merely stating the fact that i find it rather funny that this MOTW list has multiple maps where zerg HAS to do a strat (particularly pool first) builds- for no reason other than to watch out for early game shit. I think that is ridiculous. Likewise as a non-chessing protoss I find I always have to use my 9th probe (10 supply) to build forge asap cause zergs will 4poo/9pool/overpool much more often. And btw, I think zerg in zvp has one of the most powerful cheeses. 2 hat hydra. If protoss can't scout it, he's fucked unless he gets like 4-5 cannons + 1 control group of probes to defend Isn't 2 hat hydra more like an agressive strat than cheese? But thats the risk protoss takes when going FE.
Cheese is so vague. 2 hatch hydra is an all-in timing attack.
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On September 07 2009 21:26 Thats_The_Spirit wrote:
Frogmetter was right on.
Going 12 hatch is not some right every zerg has. You can't expect to start with an instant expasion with a booming economy every game on every map without the posibility of getting punished. With every economy build comes a RISK. If you want to 12 hatch you better know how to prevent getting owned by cheese.
Defensive 12hatch (in the main) is safe in every matchup except ZvZ, and still safe vs. 9pools without aggressive sunken. If you are cheesed (or non-proxy-2gated and contained) your sweet economy should let you break out pretty easily.
9overlord
12hatch (main)
11pool
13hatch (nat) (place in main or skip for faster hydra/muta against some aggressive plays)
Is acceptable against P/T, and the delay in mining at your nat's minerals shouldn't cost all that much. Not every build can be done in the same way as if you 12hatch expo, but it's safer and gets the full drone count until the fourth hatchery (which is delayed by the lost minerals).
On September 07 2009 21:53 Thats_The_Spirit wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 21:38 win8282 wrote:On September 07 2009 15:28 Misrah wrote:On September 07 2009 15:21 fanatacist wrote:
Pool first you stubborn ignorant fuck. People who are better than you are telling you to, and you disagree? True sign of an idiot. I'm not disagreeing with anything. I am merely stating the fact that i find it rather funny that this MOTW list has multiple maps where zerg HAS to do a strat (particularly pool first) builds- for no reason other than to watch out for early game shit. I think that is ridiculous. Likewise as a non-chessing protoss I find I always have to use my 9th probe (10 supply) to build forge asap cause zergs will 4poo/9pool/overpool much more often. And btw, I think zerg in zvp has one of the most powerful cheeses. 2 hat hydra. If protoss can't scout it, he's fucked unless he gets like 4-5 cannons + 1 control group of probes to defend Isn't 2 hat hydra more like an agressive strat than cheese? But thats the risk protoss takes when going FE.
If you feel the need to classify, 3hat hydra is an aggressive strat while 2hat hydra is cheese.
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to op: learn to play and quit whining. Obviously you must use your brains to become a good player at this game.
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I tried to play you standard... =p
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On September 07 2009 21:53 Thats_The_Spirit wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 21:38 win8282 wrote:On September 07 2009 15:28 Misrah wrote:On September 07 2009 15:21 fanatacist wrote:
Pool first you stubborn ignorant fuck. People who are better than you are telling you to, and you disagree? True sign of an idiot. I'm not disagreeing with anything. I am merely stating the fact that i find it rather funny that this MOTW list has multiple maps where zerg HAS to do a strat (particularly pool first) builds- for no reason other than to watch out for early game shit. I think that is ridiculous. Likewise as a non-chessing protoss I find I always have to use my 9th probe (10 supply) to build forge asap cause zergs will 4poo/9pool/overpool much more often. And btw, I think zerg in zvp has one of the most powerful cheeses. 2 hat hydra. If protoss can't scout it, he's fucked unless he gets like 4-5 cannons + 1 control group of probes to defend Isn't 2 hat hydra more like an agressive strat than cheese? But thats the risk protoss takes when going FE.
imho it's cheese, if you are able to scout it in time zerg has no chance.
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At D rank or any rank where you know you are likely to be the clear favorite to win, you should have the mindset that your opponent can only beat you with cheese. Not only is that true, but your opponent will be that much more likely to "cheese" you; i.e., you shouldn't use a strategy that you know has a hole that "cheese" can exploit, at least not till you get to a more highly skilled rank, where they are more inclined to use skill to win.
I realize at the start of the season you can't be sure of what skill level you are playing against, but that is merely more reason to play cautiously.
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lol, how is not 12hatching losing eco vs Protoss? It's more like, you lose more eco comparable to the Protoss if he scouts you fast. 12hatch vs 12/13/14 nexus is pretty gay.
Also, it's your bloody fault for trying to 12hatch on Tau Cross, seriously. That's just asking to get screwed. There's just seriously 0 reasons for you to 12hatch at all on these two maps. They're going to scout you early, and it's not like you lose any eco from going 9pool or overpool vs Protoss FE.
And Terrans always always always pull out disgustingly frustrating builds on 2 player maps. You can't really do much about that. It's always been like that.
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One of the first things I learned about Zerg is that you can NEVER EVER for one second think that you are ahead. You are on 3 bases and just busted that tosses nat? Well I hope your overlords are placed in the right spots because if they aren't, you'll lose.
Zerg can never be ahead, only even. That is the price we pay for playing the least boring race.
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On September 07 2009 23:33 Kletus wrote:
One of the first things I learned about Zerg is that you can NEVER EVER for one second think that you are ahead. You are on 3 bases and just busted that tosses nat? Well I hope your overlords are placed in the right spots because if they aren't, you'll lose.
Zerg can never be ahead, only even. That is the price we pay for playing the least boring race.
Is the complaint that you don't have to buy detectors to have detection? LOL.
If Protoss scatters their Pylons around the map and accidentally forgets to build one in their base, we get fucked too...
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On September 07 2009 23:33 Kletus wrote:
One of the first things I learned about Zerg is that you can NEVER EVER for one second think that you are ahead. You are on 3 bases and just busted that tosses nat? Well I hope your overlords are placed in the right spots because if they aren't, you'll lose.
Zerg can never be ahead, only even. That is the price we pay for playing the least boring race.
Uh, what?
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On September 07 2009 23:38 Severedevil wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 23:33 Kletus wrote:
One of the first things I learned about Zerg is that you can NEVER EVER for one second think that you are ahead. You are on 3 bases and just busted that tosses nat? Well I hope your overlords are placed in the right spots because if they aren't, you'll lose.
Zerg can never be ahead, only even. That is the price we pay for playing the least boring race. Is the complaint that you don't have to buy detectors to have detection? LOL.
No I'm not complaining. I don't mind having to have to play almost perfect against an opponent that doesn't.
The overlord placement scenario was just one example.
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On September 07 2009 19:47 SkelA wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 19:21 Harem wrote:On September 07 2009 18:33 SkelA wrote:
Overpool is preety standard build in zvp and in no way you are behind vs fe infact you are getin advantage making p go forge cannon first instead nexus. every zerg that goes 12 hatch on tau deserves to get cannon rushed every time. I know i cannon rush zergs when i see them 12 hatch and i scout them at first try = free points
Dont hate iccup for your incompetence of not understanding basic stuff. And for the record tau cross is Z>>>>>P i know this because i play zvp pvz ? Most maps (like HBR) you can forge nex before cannon against overpool. Easy to stop send 9 drone to check if he has probe and building pylon with drone and block place for forge if he is send 1-2 more drones = making toss mad and discing . Had exatcly game like this last season
You cannot possibly expect people to 9 drone scout ZvP on 2 player maps.
Also PLEASE use something called grammar, your post was nearly unreadable.
Honestly I dont get all the OP bashing either, yeah going 12 hatch on tau cross in ZvP isnt smart, yeah a better player would have defended better, yeah it's a bit whiny, but I bet at least 70% of all the bashing people nerdrage themselves when they get cheesed.
+ Show Spoiler +bye bye fanatacist, I used to like his posts but
I'm glad he got temp banned, he's just been a fucking dick lately
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On September 07 2009 23:42 7mk wrote:+ Show Spoiler +bye bye fanatacist, I used to like his posts but
I'm glad he got temp banned, he's just been a fucking dick lately
I try not to judge, I mean maybe he's just having some real life issues or w/e.
Anyways back to the topic, I used to go 12hatch against P but then got tired of all the cheese and stuff. 9pool all the way, you'd be surprised how many greedy tosses there are and how many free points you'll get. Also, DO NOT send a drone out to scout at 9 unless you are planning on going overpool and digging out back minerals.
On September 07 2009 23:38 Severedevil wrote:
If Protoss scatters their Pylons around the map and accidentally forgets to build one in their base, we get fucked too...
Not if the Protoss is on 3 bases.
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Yea, this happened three times in a row on tau (terran player), stopped it once and then some idiot on andro who was like 1900 bbs'd me but couldn't macro for his life and I ran him over after losing 8 drones. But I also overpool almost every game
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Norway28582 Posts
tau cross is a total zerg map even when you pool first
heartbridge is a good zerg map going pool first..
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On September 08 2009 00:19 Liquid`Drone wrote:
tau cross is a total zerg map even when you pool first
heartbridge is a good zerg map going pool first..
agreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed agreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed agreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed agreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed agreeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed
If you hate D so much, cheese your way out (Ling all-in/4pool) and become D+ for once.
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On September 07 2009 16:20 Sadistx wrote:
Fanatacist wins this thread tbh.
and gets the award
on a serious note: long long time ago i watched nal_crayons replay where he blocked that choke with 2 drones until he had lings running. Thats what you can do if youre brave enough to 12 hatch. Or atleast fight the scv in choke and switch up drones when they low on health, this will require some care and he can block if you mess up
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Bosnia-Herzegovina1437 Posts
Raaaaaaaaaaaaaage
Are you so fucking stupid as to not pool on obvious cheese/gay shit maps?
God damn.
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LOL yes play Halo cause you suck at starcraft. Learn to play a 9 pool opening on maps where cannon rushing is common. That build has been a staple since tau's release, don't complain about it now / say zerg cant cheese. Lol.
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Bosnia-Herzegovina1437 Posts
TL:DR; east noobie try's out iccup and gets raped by people 2-3 ranks above him. Cry's a river about how zerg doesn't have any cheeses when they have the gayest cheeses of all time.
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On September 07 2009 23:42 7mk wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 19:47 SkelA wrote:On September 07 2009 19:21 Harem wrote:On September 07 2009 18:33 SkelA wrote:
Overpool is preety standard build in zvp and in no way you are behind vs fe infact you are getin advantage making p go forge cannon first instead nexus. every zerg that goes 12 hatch on tau deserves to get cannon rushed every time. I know i cannon rush zergs when i see them 12 hatch and i scout them at first try = free points
Dont hate iccup for your incompetence of not understanding basic stuff. And for the record tau cross is Z>>>>>P i know this because i play zvp pvz ? Most maps (like HBR) you can forge nex before cannon against overpool. Easy to stop send 9 drone to check if he has probe and building pylon with drone and block place for forge if he is send 1-2 more drones = making toss mad and discing . Had exatcly game like this last season You cannot possibly expect people to 9 drone scout ZvP on 2 player maps. Also PLEASE use something called grammar, your post was nearly unreadable. Honestly I dont get all the OP bashing either, yeah going 12 hatch on tau cross in ZvP isnt smart, yeah a better player would have defended better, yeah it's a bit whiny, but I bet at least 70% of all the bashing people nerdrage themselves when they get cheesed. + Show Spoiler +bye bye fanatacist, I used to like his posts but
I'm glad he got temp banned, he's just been a fucking dick lately
I think my english is good enough... and you clearly didnt understand my point for 9 drone is not meant for scouting him but just checking your natural really early just for the reason of forge block.
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Norway28582 Posts
on a map like heartbreak as protoss you make forge then nexus vs overpool and forge then cannon vs 9pool or earlier
you can't make nexus then forge because your scouting probe does not arrive in his base early enough to know whether hes pooling before lord or after.
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i think your not intimidating your opponents enough
i let them know within the first 2 minutes that I cannot be cheesed. Haven't been cheesed yet this season.
as a sidenote: Play othello,medusa, etc. lol. those are the zerg maps this MOTW anyway. why are you starting yourself with a disadvantage?
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On September 08 2009 01:38 SkelA wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 23:42 7mk wrote:On September 07 2009 19:47 SkelA wrote:On September 07 2009 19:21 Harem wrote:On September 07 2009 18:33 SkelA wrote:
Overpool is preety standard build in zvp and in no way you are behind vs fe infact you are getin advantage making p go forge cannon first instead nexus. every zerg that goes 12 hatch on tau deserves to get cannon rushed every time. I know i cannon rush zergs when i see them 12 hatch and i scout them at first try = free points
Dont hate iccup for your incompetence of not understanding basic stuff. And for the record tau cross is Z>>>>>P i know this because i play zvp pvz ? Most maps (like HBR) you can forge nex before cannon against overpool. Easy to stop send 9 drone to check if he has probe and building pylon with drone and block place for forge if he is send 1-2 more drones = making toss mad and discing . Had exatcly game like this last season You cannot possibly expect people to 9 drone scout ZvP on 2 player maps. Also PLEASE use something called grammar, your post was nearly unreadable. Honestly I dont get all the OP bashing either, yeah going 12 hatch on tau cross in ZvP isnt smart, yeah a better player would have defended better, yeah it's a bit whiny, but I bet at least 70% of all the bashing people nerdrage themselves when they get cheesed. + Show Spoiler +bye bye fanatacist, I used to like his posts but
I'm glad he got temp banned, he's just been a fucking dick lately I think my english is good enough... and you clearly didnt understand my point for 9 drone is not meant for scouting him but just checking your natural really early just for the reason of forge block.
you're right that was pretty stupid on my part but it was for some part also because no the english isn't that great in that post.
Here's how I guess you meant that post:
Easy to stop, send your 9th drone to check if he has a probe building a pylon. Try to block the place for the forge, if he has still managed to start building it send 1-2 more drones
so much easier to read.
If your english just isnt too amazing then I'm sorry,no need to bash you for that, but to me it looked like you could have easily made it much easier to read if you just added some words and had used punctuation.
OK enough bitching.
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Norway28582 Posts
erm tau cross is way better for zerg than either of those.. they're both fine for zvp (although tau is even more fine) but they're pretty crappy for zvt, whereas tau is one of the few genuine z > t maps.
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On September 08 2009 01:55 Liquid`Drone wrote:
erm tau cross is way better for zerg than either of those.. they're both fine for zvp (although tau is even more fine) but they're pretty crappy for zvt, whereas tau is one of the few genuine z > t maps.
i actually find Z=T on tau... and im a terran player, i find that most zergs dont know how to abuse it. Neither do I.
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On September 08 2009 01:50 inertinept wrote:
i think your not intimidating your opponents enough
i let them know within the first 2 minutes that I cannot be cheesed. Haven't been cheesed yet this season.
as a sidenote: Play othello,medusa, etc. lol. those are the zerg maps this MOTW anyway. why are you starting yourself with a disadvantage?
Othello is hella T>Z.
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why is tau cross good for zerg against terran? sorry if this is an obvious one
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try telling that to this guy. I was discussing it on the premise that he didnt want to get cheesed. very hard to get cheesed on othello or medusa.
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Norway28582 Posts
tau is good for zerg vs terran because it's so incredibly open. on most maps there are key areas where terran can both be set up in a good position where it's hard to flank, and where they are also threatening zerg and forcing zerg to engage. tau cross has no such area. in addition it's fairly easy for zerg to take third gas, and big drops are really devastating (in particular if you are like, top left vs top right, top right vs bottom or bottom vs top left. )
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wow misrah you should change to protoss cause thats the only race that fits your brain power. are you kidding me? pool first isnt an economic hit if the terran proxi raxs.. and it stops his cheese. what you are saying could be related to someone saying "why does terran always make mines and turrets my dt rush isnt working! everyone plays so defencive"
call the fucking wambulance yo!
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On September 08 2009 04:32 CoOl]1st[ wrote:
wow misrah you should change to protoss cause thats the only race that fits your brain power. are you kidding me? pool first isnt an economic hit if the terran proxi raxs.. and it stops his cheese. what you are saying could be related to someone saying "why does terran always make mines and turrets my dt rush isnt working! everyone plays so defencive"
call the fucking wambulance yo!
and you my friend- just pissed me the fuck off. I have an idea- why don't you and your 40iq comments stay the fuck out of my blog ok? nice ad hominimz. anytime you want you little shit- i will BO3 your pitiful ass.
Holy fuck your English and general overall post structure is inept to the point of incompetence. I cannot believe that i just wasted time reading this puke onto paper you somehow call a post.
you know what TL it's funny- that when i come ranting into my blog after a really shitty day on cup, i get fucking stoned like that whore in the bible. except this time, there is no Jesus to save my herpes ridden ass. Why is with all of the hate? (i don't even want to begin cool1st over here.) For christ sakes it's one thing to get told your an idiot by sixghost- whom i respect, but seriously? everyone needs to tell me the same thing time and time again?
This is ridiculous to the point of insanity, that all of the TL community would get so worked up over me ranting about having a rough night of icup. All of you need to get off of your fucking high horse, and once and awhile- not take SC as SUPER FUCKING SRS BIZZZZ. IT'S A FUCKING GAME for christ sake.
/rant
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I'm going to bookmark this thread and just come back and read it everytime I get 2 hatch hydra'd or 3 hatch ling'd in pvz, to redefine my reality.
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All of you need to get off of your fucking high horse, and once and awhile- not take SC as SUPER FUCKING SRS BIZZZZ. IT'S A FUCKING GAME for christ sake.
You should google the word hypocrite.
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its a game yet you bash everyone who post on this thread
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16953 Posts
On September 08 2009 06:45 Misrah wrote:
and you my friend- just pissed me the fuck off. I have an idea- why don't you and your 40iq comments stay the fuck out of my blog ok? nice ad hominimz. anytime you want you little shit- i will BO3 your pitiful ass.
Holy fuck your English and general overall post structure is inept to the point of incompetence. I cannot believe that i just wasted time reading this puke onto paper you somehow call a post.
you know what TL it's funny- that when i come ranting into my blog after a really shitty day on cup, i get fucking stoned like that whore in the bible. except this time, there is no Jesus to save my herpes ridden ass. Why is with all of the hate? (i don't even want to begin cool1st over here.) For christ sakes it's one thing to get told your an idiot by sixghost- whom i respect, but seriously? everyone needs to tell me the same thing time and time again?
This is ridiculous to the point of insanity, that all of the TL community would get so worked up over me ranting about having a rough night of icup. All of you need to get off of your fucking high horse, and once and awhile- not take SC as SUPER FUCKING SRS BIZZZZ. IT'S A FUCKING GAME for christ sake.
/rant
![[image loading]](http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/3201/thispost.jpg)
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I like how you're refusing to not 12 hatch lol..
especially considering almost no one 12 hatches in the foreigner scene
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On September 08 2009 06:45 Misrah wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2009 04:32 CoOl]1st[ wrote:
wow misrah you should change to protoss cause thats the only race that fits your brain power. are you kidding me? pool first isnt an economic hit if the terran proxi raxs.. and it stops his cheese. what you are saying could be related to someone saying "why does terran always make mines and turrets my dt rush isnt working! everyone plays so defencive"
call the fucking wambulance yo! and you my friend- just pissed me the fuck off. I have an idea- why don't you and your 40iq comments stay the fuck out of my blog ok? nice ad hominimz. anytime you want you little shit- i will BO3 your pitiful ass. Holy fuck your English and general overall post structure is inept to the point of incompetence. I cannot believe that i just wasted time reading this puke onto paper you somehow call a post. you know what TL it's funny- that when i come ranting into my blog after a really shitty day on cup, i get fucking stoned like that whore in the bible. except this time, there is no Jesus to save my herpes ridden ass. Why is with all of the hate? (i don't even want to begin cool1st over here.) For christ sakes it's one thing to get told your an idiot by sixghost- whom i respect, but seriously? everyone needs to tell me the same thing time and time again? This is ridiculous to the point of insanity, that all of the TL community would get so worked up over me ranting about having a rough night of icup. All of you need to get off of your fucking high horse, and once and awhile- not take SC as SUPER FUCKING SRS BIZZZZ. IT'S A FUCKING GAME for christ sake. /rant
its cute how your nerdraging about how people shouldnt criticize you when your nerdraging.
heres a tip dont make blogs because your terrible at starcraft.
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You have to realize that Starcraft is a game in which every strategy is allowable and acceptable. There is no "lame" strategy (although 4pool comes close). Every build has its strengths and weaknesses and every race has its own inherent strengths and weaknesses. You just have to learn to deal with them and if you are playing at D level, you should probably learn how to play against cheese, especially so early in the season. 9pool is probably a much better idea than 12 hatch, like people have been saying.
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rofl, you must be pretty bad.
I cheese 9 out of 10 games when I play against D/D+, because worse players simply cannot handle cheese. this way I move up the ladder much faster.
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I'm z, i do a lot of hatch 12 strat, simply cauz there's almost nothing else i can do beside p first. But we gotta realize that it's not really a good idea on tau cross and HB simply because it's sooo easy for the T or the P to block the path between the main and the natural.
Even if you have 1 drone in order to prevent the cheese, sometimes you think that if you went for pool first you'd have saved all the pain for just a hatch first strat. Not to mention that h12 is hardly better than pool first (against FE P that is). So yeah, i think you're just upset.
Take a break like 1 or 2 days then play again, but don't forget to change styles from time to time.
Playing blindly the same strat over and over again isn't always good.
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On September 08 2009 08:09 Cambium wrote:
rofl, you must be pretty bad.
I cheese 9 out of 10 games when I play against D/D+, because worse players simply cannot handle cheese. this way I move up the ladder much faster.
I also cheese early because you can win faster and rank up faster. Playing standard against weaker players doesn't really help you that much. You learn better by getting totally trashed by someone way better than you are because you can see your weaknesses that way.
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On September 08 2009 09:18 ghostWriter wrote:Show nested quote +On September 08 2009 08:09 Cambium wrote:
rofl, you must be pretty bad.
I cheese 9 out of 10 games when I play against D/D+, because worse players simply cannot handle cheese. this way I move up the ladder much faster. I also cheese early because you can win faster and rank up faster. Playing standard against weaker players doesn't really help you that much. You learn better by getting totally trashed by someone way better than you are because you can see your weaknesses that way.
Seriously. I played 20+ standard games against D level players (I have multiple accounts... a lot actually) and when the time came when I had to face the C ranks, I felt as if my skills were drained compared to before...
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On September 07 2009 15:26 Misrah wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 15:16 avilo wrote:
why are you complaining about losing when you're obviously playing bad? If you keep thinking about unorthodox/aggressive play as "cheese" and that your "straight up" play is magically going to win you games just because it "should" then this shit is going to keep happening to you.
I'd suggest rather than change any strategy, build, or tactic of yours, you drastically change the way you think.
Because from all you have written, it seems you know what you need to be doing for your game, and in the games you played too, it's just that your own thinking that your "straight up play" makes you deserve to win games is holding you back. LOL hardly. i play to get better, not to win- like some people. I can tell you that with out a shadow of a doubt in a straight up game, my winrate is much much higher than if i have to deal with cheese. It's not unorthodox, and it's not aggressive. It is cheese. It is people playing to win, not to get better- and i hate it. An aggressive strat is 2 gate, sparks, 2 hatch muta. Don't try and tell me the line between cheese and aggression. change the way i think? no i don't think so. The way the kids on the B train train in korea, it's not with cheese. in fact- if you are cheesing during a game while practicing you are thrown out of the house. Because guess what? cheese doesn't make you any better at the game. Period. You play terran? then you wouldn't understand.
It's not cheese. It's done because he sees "oh this kid went for a 12 hatch, and lookie here I have a forge. Because of his build order, I can win if I do this."
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fuck this been happening to me all day aswel
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On September 07 2009 15:01 Misrah wrote:
anyone else have some good ideas? i swear- as soon as the next motw comes out- i am going to 4 pool iccup into hell.
I have an ide. Go and play some D- games. Then maybe you can get a win XD ?
And dont 12 hatch vs P on Tau, that is just giving him a freewin.
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On September 09 2009 01:06 Neivler wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 15:01 Misrah wrote:
anyone else have some good ideas? i swear- as soon as the next motw comes out- i am going to 4 pool iccup into hell. I have an ide. Go and play some D- games. Then maybe you can get a win XD ? And dont 12 hatch vs P on Tau, that is just giving him a freewin.
err what is it about tau that makes 12 hatch weak? short rush distance?
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United States11390 Posts
On September 09 2009 01:57 lazz wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2009 01:06 Neivler wrote:On September 07 2009 15:01 Misrah wrote:
anyone else have some good ideas? i swear- as soon as the next motw comes out- i am going to 4 pool iccup into hell. I have an ide. Go and play some D- games. Then maybe you can get a win XD ? And dont 12 hatch vs P on Tau, that is just giving him a freewin. err what is it about tau that makes 12 hatch weak? short rush distance?
Pylon the choke and cannon.
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ToT)MidiaN(
England2183 Posts
What I hate about iccup D rank is that there are like 100 people in the channel, and nobody plays. When you join "D Heartbreak" game or something people are either AFK or boot you more than 50% of the time. People are retarded, trying to dodge and pick opponents constantly. Just fucking play the game, it's hard enough to find a game without people constantly trying to select who they play. So pathetic.
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ToT)MidiaN(
England2183 Posts
Anyway you have to overpool on Tau, yes your economy suffers a little but so does theirs as they have to cannon defensively so their Nexus is slower and they will most likely cut probes somewhat also in the early game.
Heartbreak Ridge ZvT just send a 9 drone scout and check for proxy rax.... you can still 12 hatch expo
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ToT)MidiaN(
England2183 Posts
Anyway your arguments are stupid. You want to play every game with an economical advantage and then complain when your overly economical build gets crushed in 5 minutes. If you want to play a long game, learn when you have you play safe in order to do so, you can't just 12 hatch expo every game on every map vs every race and expect to play a lot of long games.
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On September 11 2009 13:44 ToT)MidiaN( wrote:
What I hate about iccup D rank is that there are like 100 people in the channel, and nobody plays. When you join "D Heartbreak" game or something people are either AFK or boot you more than 50% of the time. People are retarded, trying to dodge and pick opponents constantly. Just fucking play the game, it's hard enough to find a game without people constantly trying to select who they play. So pathetic.
That reminds me of someone... gonna ask him about it when I look in the mirror
Are you D? Thought you would hit at least C+ on ICCUP.
It is just that people racepick, refuse to play mirrors and not advertise it in the game title, ban players with no AH, ban players who are D+ joining D-/D Python come games, in general people with a lot more points, not necesarily D+.
And the goddamn resetters, avoid them everytime you see them. So many frustrated players reset to bash noobs. Never play anyone with exactly 1000 points unless in the first 3 weeks of the season.
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I hate when i play 10-0 guys.
ESPECIALLY if they don't even bother to get to their real rank with this aka after.
You can't even be happy to know that you have been raped by a B Korean
It is just another 10-0 D / D+ guy... and you will never know his real level.
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On September 11 2009 19:18 Boblion wrote:I hate when i play 10-0 guys. ESPECIALLY if they don't even bother to get to their real rank with this aka after. You can't even be happy to know that you have been raped by a B Korean It is just another 10-0 D / D+ guy... and you will never know his real level.
Well to go 10-0 you're playing mostly D rank players so it wouldn't be hard for someone who was high D+ or C-. If they stop so soon it's likely their real rank isn't much higher anyway and they just want nice stats.
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On September 11 2009 20:01 Nytefish wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2009 19:18 Boblion wrote:I hate when i play 10-0 guys. ESPECIALLY if they don't even bother to get to their real rank with this aka after. You can't even be happy to know that you have been raped by a B Korean It is just another 10-0 D / D+ guy... and you will never know his real level. Well to go 10-0 you're playing mostly D rank players so it wouldn't be hard for someone who was high D+ or C-. If they stop so soon it's likely their real rank isn't much higher anyway and they just want nice stats.
If you win ten straight games against D players, who either cheese constantly or are in fact higher rank in reality, you're probably better than D+/C-. I made it there last season, and now I'm struggling to get back there because of all the better players currently still at D.
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On September 11 2009 20:01 Nytefish wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2009 19:18 Boblion wrote:I hate when i play 10-0 guys. ESPECIALLY if they don't even bother to get to their real rank with this aka after. You can't even be happy to know that you have been raped by a B Korean It is just another 10-0 D / D+ guy... and you will never know his real level. Well to go 10-0 you're playing mostly D rank players so it wouldn't be hard for someone who was high D+ or C-. If they stop so soon it's likely their real rank isn't much higher anyway and they just want nice stats.
10-0 early season could be any rank between C and A+
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If you're sick of cheese, then 9pool speedling if you're an aggressive type (and get only 6 lings? I don't play Z) or overpool for better econ
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On September 11 2009 23:52 Boblion wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2009 20:01 Nytefish wrote:On September 11 2009 19:18 Boblion wrote:I hate when i play 10-0 guys. ESPECIALLY if they don't even bother to get to their real rank with this aka after. You can't even be happy to know that you have been raped by a B Korean It is just another 10-0 D / D+ guy... and you will never know his real level. Well to go 10-0 you're playing mostly D rank players so it wouldn't be hard for someone who was high D+ or C-. If they stop so soon it's likely their real rank isn't much higher anyway and they just want nice stats. 10-0 early season could be any rank between D and A+
It's not like real D ranks don't play early season, and 10 games is such a small amount anyway.
But if you don't want to perceive it that way and just get frustrated I'm not going to stop you.
I just noticed the iccup site doesn't list people with 100% win ratios.
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On September 07 2009 15:18 Camlito wrote:That's because you played foreigners only.
you must've had the luck to face the worst players on the entire iccup then.. D+ and better players should have the proper micro to defend a 4 pool.
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This thread is so full of hate lol.
Funny arguments, though haha.
That wins it though:
On September 07 2009 16:04 fanatacist wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2009 15:59 AzureEye wrote:
No need to bash him this much, its a frigging blog post
I understand your pain even though I quit Zerg long time ago. The reason why I quit Zerg was because Zerg rarely had any cheeses and always had to adapt according to your opponent, and if Z did have some, it was pretty much all-in unlike Terrans who can cheese and never get punished for it because most of their cheese is not all-in.
Your first example verses the Protoss player was kinda meaningless because it was your fault for playing a dumb map that allowed that kind of shit. (When I used to see Terrans who made Lost Temple on iccup, I would join, make fun of him for hosting the imba map, and just leave right when game started)
But I totally feel your pain of having to scout for that hidden proxy because Zerg cant proxy anything and the mere fact that you're wasting your scouting worker's time JUST to look for the non-existent proxy already creates a small disadvantage.
You just have to accept the fact that no human-made RTS game can be truly balanced. [Insert Artosis's Famous Balance Quote Here] Yes, Starcraft is a balanced piece of art but its not balanced enough (underpowered Z, overpowered T, sometimes)
Just change your race or just accept that Starcraft is the way it is and its way too late for them to tweak balance issues. But yeah, they really should have thought better than to give Toss/Terran ability to proxy, lift-off into your main type of cheese, transition from bio to mech to wraith air so easily kind of stuff
I'm blabbing on because I'm writing this at 4 am but yeah, don't play shitty maps and stick with another race. I love Zerg but I quit playing Z because I felt that Z was way too disadvantaged against some matchups (ZvT cough) I bolded everything that is wrong or stupid in your post. Needless to say my opinion of you is rather negative right now. -2/10
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LOL hardly. i play to get better, not to win- like some people. I can tell you that with out a shadow of a doubt in a straight up game, my winrate is much much higher than if i have to deal with cheese. It's not unorthodox, and it's not aggressive. It is cheese. It is people playing to win, not to get better- and i hate it. An aggressive strat is 2 gate, sparks, 2 hatch muta. Don't try and tell me the line between cheese and aggression.
change the way i think? no i don't think so. The way the kids on the B train train in korea, it's not with cheese. in fact- if you are cheesing during a game while practicing you are thrown out of the house. Because guess what? cheese doesn't make you any better at the game. Period.
You play terran? then you wouldn't understand.
I totally agree. At low levels playing to improve is much more important than playing to win.
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The best thing to do is to watch replays of yourself with a knowledgeable friend and have them point out all your mistakes and give you tips. Then watch replays of good people and see how their play differs from yours and see why they win which will make you see why you lose.
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Is a Zerg blogging about how hard it is to play against cheese on HBR?
LOL
+ Show Spoiler +don't say that Terrans don't know how you feel, dickbutt
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On September 12 2009 10:28 Nytefish wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2009 23:52 Boblion wrote:On September 11 2009 20:01 Nytefish wrote:On September 11 2009 19:18 Boblion wrote:I hate when i play 10-0 guys. ESPECIALLY if they don't even bother to get to their real rank with this aka after. You can't even be happy to know that you have been raped by a B Korean It is just another 10-0 D / D+ guy... and you will never know his real level. Well to go 10-0 you're playing mostly D rank players so it wouldn't be hard for someone who was high D+ or C-. If they stop so soon it's likely their real rank isn't much higher anyway and they just want nice stats. 10-0 early season could be any rank between D and A+ It's not like real D ranks don't play early season, and 10 games is such a small amount anyway. But if you don't want to perceive it that way and just get frustrated I'm not going to stop you. I just noticed the iccup site doesn't list people with 100% win ratios.
The odds for a D player to get 10-0 early season are close to 0.
That's why someone getting this kind of record is usually at least C.
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Even if it's 1% for an individual you have hundreds of D rank players.
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On September 14 2009 06:38 Nytefish wrote:
Even if it's 1% for an individual you have hundreds of D rank players.
It is less than 1% rofl.
Ok i'm like a D+ toss.
Probability to beat me. I would say ~ 20% for a D player.
Probability to give a 7 min quick rape as T i would say 1% for a D player.
And i'm not even talking about the 9 others players ( probably a some D/D+/C- and maybe higher ).
1% x 50%^9 ( let's say they are all D which i HIGHLY doubt rofl ) ~ 0
Probability of you trolling or being an idiot = 99,9%
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EPT
