On July 11 2018 04:52 NihiLStarcraft wrote: Yeah this constant play for time, with the acting, the diving, the shooting/punching the ball away... It's making me never want to watch soccer ever again until they finally fix it. Either by making people actually leave the pitch, time penalties or fixed clock or something. This is garbage. The French are overdoing it here, but honestly every team does it to an extent and I can't stand it...
It was obvious as hell especially with Mbappe throwing away the ball and whoever else of the French sat on the ball or w/e else. Disgraceful final x minutes by French. Hope they get destroyed by whoever makes the finals (hopefully Croatia!)
So, if Croatia gets to the final and does the exact same thing for the last 10 minutes
are you going to ask for Croatia to get destroyed too? so who does destroys who?
Sure, I think purposely wasting time is terrible. Even more so when it's obvious as hell. So, let me ask you, you are satisfied with the crap that Mbappe pulled there? I certainly was not amused.
I don't need to be amused, i just need to realize is part of the game and some of the problem is belgium being trash at scoring vs France
if France was losing i can assure you that Mbappe would not be doing that, and he lord Hazard would have.
On July 11 2018 05:02 Mensol wrote:
On July 11 2018 05:00 BigFan wrote:
On July 11 2018 04:59 Faruko wrote:
On July 11 2018 04:58 BigFan wrote:
On July 11 2018 04:52 NihiLStarcraft wrote: Yeah this constant play for time, with the acting, the diving, the shooting/punching the ball away... It's making me never want to watch soccer ever again until they finally fix it. Either by making people actually leave the pitch, time penalties or fixed clock or something. This is garbage. The French are overdoing it here, but honestly every team does it to an extent and I can't stand it...
It was obvious as hell especially with Mbappe throwing away the ball and whoever else of the French sat on the ball or w/e else. Disgraceful final x minutes by French. Hope they get destroyed by whoever makes the finals (hopefully Croatia!)
So, if Croatia gets to the final and does the exact same thing for the last 10 minutes
are you going to ask for Croatia to get destroyed too? so who does destroys who?
Sure, I think purposely wasting time is terrible. Even more so when it's obvious as hell. So, let me ask you, you are satisfied with the crap that Mbappe pulled there? I certainly was not amused.
A life time chance for getting a WC trophy, five minutes left and it doesnt matter if you get a yellow card.
i dont blame Mbappe at all. Winning a WC as 19 years old will take lots of pressure from him.
Neither of these are satisfactory reasons, aka "he did or would do it so I should do it too!". These players some have some class, but it seems I expect too much. Bummer that most seem to be ok with such behaviour. To be clear, I have no issues if the players decide to pass it to each other, even if I think it's not great, but purposely kicking the ball away after the whistle to waste time is disgusting and I'll stand by that.
This is not directed at you specifically, but generally to everyone who keeps repeatedly complaining everytime a player goes down.
None of those things are preferable, but given its ingrained nature in the game unless its extremely excessive its something you have to live with unless a larger cultural shift is brought in by the administrators.
Because it is ingrained and fans have limited capacity to effect this (the ones who are even bothered by it in the first place), thats how it will be for now.
This is the frustrating thing. The behaviour is a disgrace, rolling around screaming like little girls, wasting time and generally cheating. With VAR much of this behaviour could be eradicated very quickly by giving an automatic red card for diving in the box if the VAR spots it. If a player is down injured on the pitch they go off, an then have to spend the same amount of time waiting to get back on the pitch afterwards. These kind of rules could make the game about football instead of being about who's better at cheating.
I like the game more than I dislike this behavior. That is a subjective choice I make when I spent my time watching.
All games have something people can complain about, thats why some people like some things and others like other games.
If you find this aspect unbearable feel free to skip the final. No ones who really cares about the game has time for people bitching about minor incidents of time wasting. Sure if you want to shit on excessive behavior thats fine. But every time someone displays some gamesmanship and you cant handle it. Please dont remind us for the 1231241412831 time.
This is nonsense. If you don't like it don't watch? Some of us like football, and have a right to be annoyed about players who constantly shit on the very idea of football. Its even more frustrating that most of the best players are also massive cheats.
There are only two kinds of people who bitch about this all the time.
1) People who dont know jackshit, the once every four years viewer, or that guy who just shows up to tell you why he can never like football because of this, normally American, but ofcourse edgy Europeans will be found doing this aswell (we dont care)
Actually we should care if people don't watch football because of all the cheating. Its not 'edgy' to think a game should be played by the rules.
2) People who hypocritically complain when it happens to the team they are supporting.
Yeah this happens, which gives people the perfect excuse for losing. For example, we'll never know if Belgium would have won last night without France constantly cheating for the last half an hour. I guess its just one of those things.
How did France cheat in the last half an hour?
The constant diving, crying, timewasting etc. Deliberate timewasting when the ball is out of play is against the rules.
I'm not saying France are any worse than any other team, they aren't, they're about the same (its also more of a comment on football in general than specifically last night's match). I'm saying this behaviour delegitimises any idea that football is about which team is better at football (if you define football by its rules).
On July 11 2018 04:52 NihiLStarcraft wrote: Yeah this constant play for time, with the acting, the diving, the shooting/punching the ball away... It's making me never want to watch soccer ever again until they finally fix it. Either by making people actually leave the pitch, time penalties or fixed clock or something. This is garbage. The French are overdoing it here, but honestly every team does it to an extent and I can't stand it...
It was obvious as hell especially with Mbappe throwing away the ball and whoever else of the French sat on the ball or w/e else. Disgraceful final x minutes by French. Hope they get destroyed by whoever makes the finals (hopefully Croatia!)
So, if Croatia gets to the final and does the exact same thing for the last 10 minutes
are you going to ask for Croatia to get destroyed too? so who does destroys who?
Sure, I think purposely wasting time is terrible. Even more so when it's obvious as hell. So, let me ask you, you are satisfied with the crap that Mbappe pulled there? I certainly was not amused.
I don't need to be amused, i just need to realize is part of the game and some of the problem is belgium being trash at scoring vs France
if France was losing i can assure you that Mbappe would not be doing that, and he lord Hazard would have.
On July 11 2018 05:02 Mensol wrote:
On July 11 2018 05:00 BigFan wrote:
On July 11 2018 04:59 Faruko wrote:
On July 11 2018 04:58 BigFan wrote:
On July 11 2018 04:52 NihiLStarcraft wrote: Yeah this constant play for time, with the acting, the diving, the shooting/punching the ball away... It's making me never want to watch soccer ever again until they finally fix it. Either by making people actually leave the pitch, time penalties or fixed clock or something. This is garbage. The French are overdoing it here, but honestly every team does it to an extent and I can't stand it...
It was obvious as hell especially with Mbappe throwing away the ball and whoever else of the French sat on the ball or w/e else. Disgraceful final x minutes by French. Hope they get destroyed by whoever makes the finals (hopefully Croatia!)
So, if Croatia gets to the final and does the exact same thing for the last 10 minutes
are you going to ask for Croatia to get destroyed too? so who does destroys who?
Sure, I think purposely wasting time is terrible. Even more so when it's obvious as hell. So, let me ask you, you are satisfied with the crap that Mbappe pulled there? I certainly was not amused.
A life time chance for getting a WC trophy, five minutes left and it doesnt matter if you get a yellow card.
i dont blame Mbappe at all. Winning a WC as 19 years old will take lots of pressure from him.
Neither of these are satisfactory reasons, aka "he did or would do it so I should do it too!". These players some have some class, but it seems I expect too much. Bummer that most seem to be ok with such behaviour. To be clear, I have no issues if the players decide to pass it to each other, even if I think it's not great, but purposely kicking the ball away after the whistle to waste time is disgusting and I'll stand by that.
This is not directed at you specifically, but generally to everyone who keeps repeatedly complaining everytime a player goes down.
None of those things are preferable, but given its ingrained nature in the game unless its extremely excessive its something you have to live with unless a larger cultural shift is brought in by the administrators.
Because it is ingrained and fans have limited capacity to effect this (the ones who are even bothered by it in the first place), thats how it will be for now.
This is the frustrating thing. The behaviour is a disgrace, rolling around screaming like little girls, wasting time and generally cheating. With VAR much of this behaviour could be eradicated very quickly by giving an automatic red card for diving in the box if the VAR spots it. If a player is down injured on the pitch they go off, an then have to spend the same amount of time waiting to get back on the pitch afterwards. These kind of rules could make the game about football instead of being about who's better at cheating.
I like the game more than I dislike this behavior. That is a subjective choice I make when I spent my time watching.
All games have something people can complain about, thats why some people like some things and others like other games.
If you find this aspect unbearable feel free to skip the final. No ones who really cares about the game has time for people bitching about minor incidents of time wasting. Sure if you want to shit on excessive behavior thats fine. But every time someone displays some gamesmanship and you cant handle it. Please dont remind us for the 1231241412831 time.
This is nonsense. If you don't like it don't watch? Some of us like football, and have a right to be annoyed about players who constantly shit on the very idea of football. Its even more frustrating that most of the best players are also massive cheats.
There are only two kinds of people who bitch about this all the time.
1) People who dont know jackshit, the once every four years viewer, or that guy who just shows up to tell you why he can never like football because of this, normally American, but ofcourse edgy Europeans will be found doing this aswell (we dont care)
Actually we should care if people don't watch football because of all the cheating. Its not 'edgy' to think a game should be played by the rules.
2) People who hypocritically complain when it happens to the team they are supporting.
Yeah this happens, which gives people the perfect excuse for losing. For example, we'll never know if Belgium would have won last night without France constantly cheating for the last half an hour. I guess its just one of those things.
How did France cheat in the last half an hour?
The constant diving, crying, timewasting etc. Deliberate timewasting when the ball is out of play is against the rules.
I'm not saying France are any worse than any other team, they aren't, they're about the same (its also more of a comment on football in general than specifically last night's match). I'm saying this behaviour delegitimises any idea that football is about which team is better at football (if you define football by its rules).
Timewasting yes, I totally agree with you thats horrible for the game. But there was no diving or crying... The incidents you probably mean were real fouls from Belgium (they had 16 fouls to France's 6). And Matuidi was seriously dizzy after the horrible crash with Hazard. Maybe Belgium should have rather fouled less in the last 30?
I noticed that whenever France got a free kick after a foul they wasted/used 2-3 minutes. It took its toll, Belgium probably shot themselves in the foot by fouling them.
On July 11 2018 16:53 -Archangel- wrote: I noticed that whenever France got a free kick after a foul they wasted/used 2-3 minutes. It took its toll, Belgium probably shot themselves in the foot by fouling them.
But that's normal. Each time a freekick is given players (on both ends) take quite some time to get prepared. That's really nothing dirty, they prolly took 10-20 seconds longer than usual but freekicks are never fast stuff except when they are played fast
I am getting super, super tired of time wasting. It is getting ridicolous. Mbappe was disgusting the last 15 minutes - throwing the ball away, faking things... There are two solutions that I would like to see adopted in Football:
1) The most important one: stop the time when the game is stopped (similar to basketball). This way, all time wasting strategies go to hell. Remove stoppage time and and if 45 or 90 minutes kick in, you continue until the ball goes out (which is basically one last possession for the attackers). 2) Remove substitutions from 80 minutes onwards. It is FUCKING RIDICOLOUS to have players play 2 minutes just to lose some time. Fucking pricks.
On July 11 2018 17:10 SoSexy wrote: I am getting super, super tired of time wasting. It is getting ridicolous. Mbappe was disgusting the last 15 minutes - throwing the ball away, faking things... There are two solutions that I would like to see adopted in Football:
1) The most important one: stop the time when the game is stopped (similar to basketball). This way, all time wasting strategies go to hell. Remove stoppage time and and if 45 or 90 minutes kick in, you continue until the ball goes out (which is basically one last possession for the attackers). 2) Remove substitutions from 80 minutes onwards. It is FUCKING RIDICOLOUS to have players play 2 minutes just to lose some time. Fucking pricks.
I would like to see these done too but then the timing system would be perilously close to the NFL for many Europeans.
And people complained about Brazilians haha, they all were classy in defeat.
Btw, tactical fouls are a much bigger offence than time wasting, it's harming the game a fucking ton more and should result in at least a yellow + 10 minutes suspension. The Belgians abused this disgusting tactic but I don't see anyone complaining.
Explain me how time wasting (with a ref keeping track anyway) is worse than having a clear opportunity denied by a cheap foul?
I would also like to see time stopping when the ball is not in play. 90 min of play and that's it. Also, I'd like to see harsh punishments for un-sportsmanship behavior to be dealt after the game also. If someone was simulating a foul, fine him and his team. Poking fun at Neymar does nothing. He should have been shunned and punished for his actions.
On July 11 2018 17:32 SoSexy wrote: Because the foul is already punished with a free/penalty kick + yellow/red. Wasting time leads to no punishment in 90% of cases.
A free kick in the middle of the pitch worth absolutely nothing at all... Yellows are barely shown unless the guy is at full speed. I stand by my point, tactical fouls are worse for the game than a bit of time wasting. Stop making it sound like Matuidi did not receive a full speed Hazard on his chest. He was our best player on the pitch, it was not a tactical substitution.
On July 11 2018 17:32 SoSexy wrote: Because the foul is already punished with a free/penalty kick + yellow/red. Wasting time leads to no punishment in 90% of cases.
A free kick in the middle of the pitch worth absolutely nothing at all... Yellows are barely shown unless the guy is at full speed. I stand by my point, tactical fouls are worse for the game than a bit of time wasting. Stop making it sound like Matuidi did not receive a full speed Hazard on his chest. He was our best player on the pitch, it was not a tactical substitution.
You've changed your tune since the England vs Columbia game!\ I guess your opinions depend on who's playing.
I think just stopping the clock for any time waste / freekick would be what i would do. Don't let the ref keep time, let him focus on the game and there can be a "timekeeper" job added to 4th official so he just stops clock everytime ball goes dead and then he tells ref when to blow whilst.
I guess maybe a reason they don't do that is because the game is so big how does it work at lower levels.
Oh well, as we kinda discovered every team timewastes. I can show you Man City vs Yanited game where Peps City had the ball in the corner wasting time at the start of the second half and then bringing on midfielders for striker etc. Every manager does it, the will to win is always greater than the need to entertain.
Same way some people don't mind cheese strats in SC2/BW year some people think that is "Low skilled".
On July 11 2018 17:32 SoSexy wrote: Because the foul is already punished with a free/penalty kick + yellow/red. Wasting time leads to no punishment in 90% of cases.
A free kick in the middle of the pitch worth absolutely nothing at all... Yellows are barely shown unless the guy is at full speed. I stand by my point, tactical fouls are worse for the game than a bit of time wasting. Stop making it sound like Matuidi did not receive a full speed Hazard on his chest. He was our best player on the pitch, it was not a tactical substitution.
Hmm let me try to explain my view better. I believe that a perfect, clean game won't ever happen because that is the nature of humans. What we can do is prevent 'bugs' in the system. What are easy, fixable things? As I said, time wasting is very fixable. By stopping the clock, you would solve slow free kicks, goal kicks, stupid substitutions, throwing the ball away and so on.
Tactical fouls are not preventable, because you can't physically remove them from the game nor physically block the players from committing them. I agree that the referees should go harder on the yellow/red card, but the whole idea seems difficult to implement because there would always be troubles defining what a tactical foul is. Is the player using his hand to prevent a goal committing a tactical foul? Also, if we implement tactical foul, what stops us from implementing 'tactical waste of time plays', i.e. when an attacker takes the ball to the corner and tries to defend it there?
All things considered, I think it would be way too difficult to implement a tactical foul rule and the 10 minutes suspension is crazy, to be honest. Referees would have a massive power to change a game by calling a tactical foul and putting you out for 10 minutes. These are my two cents.
On July 11 2018 17:32 SoSexy wrote: Because the foul is already punished with a free/penalty kick + yellow/red. Wasting time leads to no punishment in 90% of cases.
A free kick in the middle of the pitch worth absolutely nothing at all... Yellows are barely shown unless the guy is at full speed. I stand by my point, tactical fouls are worse for the game than a bit of time wasting. Stop making it sound like Matuidi did not receive a full speed Hazard on his chest. He was our best player on the pitch, it was not a tactical substitution.
You've changed your tune since the England vs Columbia game!\ I guess your opinions depend on who's playing.
What? I don't see how it's a different tune. Saying tactical fouls are worse than time wasting does not change the fact Colombia vs England was even when it came to dirty antics. I'm just denying that England was the white knight and that the Colombians were a bunch of criminals which was the narrative following this game.
If you honestly think England were as bad as Colombia in that game i have no idea what game you watched and look forward to when some team does that to a team you support so i can troll you as well. Colombia made 2 3 <<< TWENTY THREE fouls in that game.
On July 11 2018 17:10 SoSexy wrote: I am getting super, super tired of time wasting. It is getting ridicolous. Mbappe was disgusting the last 15 minutes - throwing the ball away, faking things... There are two solutions that I would like to see adopted in Football:
1) The most important one: stop the time when the game is stopped (similar to basketball). This way, all time wasting strategies go to hell. Remove stoppage time and and if 45 or 90 minutes kick in, you continue until the ball goes out (which is basically one last possession for the attackers). 2) Remove substitutions from 80 minutes onwards. It is FUCKING RIDICOLOUS to have players play 2 minutes just to lose some time. Fucking pricks.
I would like to see these done too but then the timing system would be perilously close to the NFL for many Europeans.
If my memory is correct IFAB actually proposed a new timer system which involves stopping the clock. They had two variations:
1) Applying stopping clock in the last 5 minutes of the 1st half and last 10 minutes of the 2nd half; 2) Stopping the clock for the entirely of a match, but half time length is reduced to 30 minutes, for a total of 60 minutes match time, which is close to the average "effective" time of a 90 minute match.
On July 11 2018 17:10 SoSexy wrote: I am getting super, super tired of time wasting. It is getting ridicolous. Mbappe was disgusting the last 15 minutes - throwing the ball away, faking things... There are two solutions that I would like to see adopted in Football:
1) The most important one: stop the time when the game is stopped (similar to basketball). This way, all time wasting strategies go to hell. Remove stoppage time and and if 45 or 90 minutes kick in, you continue until the ball goes out (which is basically one last possession for the attackers). 2) Remove substitutions from 80 minutes onwards. It is FUCKING RIDICOLOUS to have players play 2 minutes just to lose some time. Fucking pricks.
I would like to see these done too but then the timing system would be perilously close to the NFL for many Europeans.
What NFL has to do with it anything here lol
This part here:
American football (NFL): The National Football League requires twenty commercial breaks per game, with ten in each half. (Exceptions to this are overtime periods, which have none.) These breaks run either a minute, or two minutes in length.
Is anyone here actually willing to trade getting rid of time wasting with that?
On July 11 2018 17:10 SoSexy wrote: I am getting super, super tired of time wasting. It is getting ridicolous. Mbappe was disgusting the last 15 minutes - throwing the ball away, faking things... There are two solutions that I would like to see adopted in Football:
1) The most important one: stop the time when the game is stopped (similar to basketball). This way, all time wasting strategies go to hell. Remove stoppage time and and if 45 or 90 minutes kick in, you continue until the ball goes out (which is basically one last possession for the attackers). 2) Remove substitutions from 80 minutes onwards. It is FUCKING RIDICOLOUS to have players play 2 minutes just to lose some time. Fucking pricks.
I would like to see these done too but then the timing system would be perilously close to the NFL for many Europeans.
American football (NFL): The National Football League requires twenty commercial breaks per game, with ten in each half. (Exceptions to this are overtime periods, which have none.) These breaks run either a minute, or two minutes in length.
Is anyone here actually willing to trade getting rid of time wasting with that?
EPT
