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mderg is town.
He strongly towned raynpelikoneet. He voted GiygaS after my case, went to bed and then reconsidered. He then moved to Boxer making him 2 votes. He looks like he got weirded out at the end by all the malaise so he bailed with his top townread onto someone who was about equal.
Almost all of his posts have a read in them. I couldn't find his slOosh nor GGtemplar reads nor if he had a lynch pool. But by his actions, it seemed like either Boxerfred or Nooniansoong. Comparing mderg and nooniansoongs, I definitely have more of a sense of what he's thinking than Noon.
so mafia!mderg bails from a wagon that at the last second giving up towncred and gaining certain scrutiny? I don't think the eod was all that hectic. Only Rayn was yelling for movement, no one else really ever voiced a will to move. I was the other wagon, and I think if anyone should have felt things were hectic it would be me. I easily imagine town getting quesy at the last minute and switching to the towniest towner of towns. That seems more likely than him trying to save his buddy. If he was going to save his buddy he'd have jumped to me. I'd have been easily killed. It wouldn't be that tough to explain away hammering a bad towny. It's been done many times before.
+ Show Spoiler [rayn towniest towner of townville] +On January 09 2016 18:33 mderg wrote:rayn has pretty much been the towniest towner that ever towned so far. Show nested quote +On January 09 2016 13:37 GiygaS wrote: Currently feeling weird about mderg and sloosh. Sloosh for reasons other people are giving, and I find it weird that mderg showed up, talked about my question (NAI) then peaced out for no good reason.
darth, templar was talking about toning down defending his early reads late in to the game. That post is not going to mean anything d1 if you're just evaluating if he's staying true to it or not. I might have had one of the best reasons possible to peace out... it was 2am here + Show Spoiler [scum darth] +On January 09 2016 19:09 mderg wrote:I don't like darthfoley so far because of this: Show nested quote +On January 09 2016 17:13 darthfoley wrote: For me, I am mainly am just confused as to why he's been reluctant to back off Sloosh after saying he wouldn't target active townspeople on day 1. Maybe he strictly means he won't vote for active townspeople but still target them in discussion, though his grilling of Sloosh followed by a pivot towards a poster with no history seems out of place and too random for my liking. Show nested quote +On January 09 2016 13:33 darthfoley wrote: I do think it's strange that Templar talks in his opening post about "toning it down a bit" and then doesn't really contribute much, followed by a vote on sloosh. It seems like he's already deviating from the plan he set up an hour ago, leading me to have a scum read on him so far Feels like the stuff you come up with, if you're trying to scumread someone just for the sake of scumreading people. + Show Spoiler [more explain of darth] +On January 09 2016 19:37 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2016 19:09 mderg wrote:I don't like darthfoley so far because of this: On January 09 2016 17:13 darthfoley wrote: For me, I am mainly am just confused as to why he's been reluctant to back off Sloosh after saying he wouldn't target active townspeople on day 1. Maybe he strictly means he won't vote for active townspeople but still target them in discussion, though his grilling of Sloosh followed by a pivot towards a poster with no history seems out of place and too random for my liking. On January 09 2016 13:33 darthfoley wrote: I do think it's strange that Templar talks in his opening post about "toning it down a bit" and then doesn't really contribute much, followed by a vote on sloosh. It seems like he's already deviating from the plan he set up an hour ago, leading me to have a scum read on him so far Feels like the stuff you come up with, if you're trying to scumread someone just for the sake of scumreading people. This would have been better instead of the first quote Show nested quote +On January 09 2016 16:31 darthfoley wrote: Koshi trying to sway Rayne's town read on sloosh seems out of place to me, given that Sloosh has been a pretty active poster so far; it contradicts one of his first posts in the game.
Some more explanation: He scumreads two people for not doing things how they promised to do things. But if you really think about it, scum usually thinks much more about their appearance in things like this and town just plays how they think on the spot. So it actually makes much more sense for town to contradict what they said a few hours before. This makes me think darthfoley didn't think about it and just went: contradiction --> free scumread + Show Spoiler [VA & Tube easy scumreads] +On January 10 2016 10:16 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 04:06 slOosh wrote:On January 10 2016 04:04 Koshi wrote:On January 10 2016 04:01 slOosh wrote:On January 10 2016 03:29 Koshi wrote:On January 10 2016 03:06 slOosh wrote: Wait Koshi you townlean mderg?
Please explain. Entrance to the thread seemed more likely to come from town than from mafia. Boils down to the fact I think he might check things better if he was mafia, and not have the chain of posts he had about the VT claim thing. Could you answer my question? And in addition. Give your read on me? You haven't talked about me at all. Oh I thought it was clear from my followup posts that it is currently mderg. I like your "today" posting much more than your "yesterday" posting. I tend to move votes only when switching onto someone else, but if it will ease your mind ##Unvote Koshi So who is your nr 2 mafia read? mderg, vayne, tubesock in that order I don't really know about me but vayne and tubesock feel like really easy scumreads to have + Show Spoiler [Should add kmatt to pool] +On January 10 2016 10:25 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 10:17 Koshi wrote:On January 10 2016 10:16 mderg wrote:On January 10 2016 04:06 slOosh wrote:On January 10 2016 04:04 Koshi wrote:On January 10 2016 04:01 slOosh wrote:On January 10 2016 03:29 Koshi wrote:On January 10 2016 03:06 slOosh wrote: Wait Koshi you townlean mderg?
Please explain. Entrance to the thread seemed more likely to come from town than from mafia. Boils down to the fact I think he might check things better if he was mafia, and not have the chain of posts he had about the VT claim thing. Could you answer my question? And in addition. Give your read on me? You haven't talked about me at all. Oh I thought it was clear from my followup posts that it is currently mderg. I like your "today" posting much more than your "yesterday" posting. I tend to move votes only when switching onto someone else, but if it will ease your mind ##Unvote Koshi So who is your nr 2 mafia read? mderg, vayne, tubesock in that order I don't really know about me but vayne and tubesock feel like really easy scumreads to have That's because they easily could be mafia. Makes sense. At least kamtt should be added, though + Show Spoiler [Eden weird feels] +On January 10 2016 19:54 mderg wrote: Feeling weird about Eden. I like what he says especially in the Tubesock Giygas thing. But I don't like how he says things, feels like an indifferent observer. + Show Spoiler [Vote count with his added in] +On January 10 2016 22:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:EditedVote Count Tubesock (3): Koshi, GiygaS, darthfoley VayneAuthority (2): nooniansoong, slOosh GiygaS (3): Tubesock, Eden1892, mderg slOosh (1): VayneAuthority Koshi (1): boxerfred boxerfred (1): GGTeMpLaR nooniansoong (1): Raynpelikoneet Not voted (1): Kmatt, Currently, Tubesock is being lynched. You have until Sunday, Jan 10 11:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00), or to lynch someone. Voting is mandatory and done in this thread. Votes GiygaS at 10hrs to lynch + Show Spoiler [unvotes GiygaS] +On January 11 2016 05:09 mderg wrote: The more I think about Tube's case the less I like the GiygaS lynch...
##unvote Unvotes 3 hours to lynch + Show Spoiler [Boxer Vote at 2:09 till] +On January 11 2016 05:51 mderg wrote: Seriously, I'm fucking lost this game.
voting boxerfred because the only thing he's done is scumreading Koshi for things that aren't scummy. On January 10 2016 22:25 Artanis[Xp] wrote:EditedVote Count Tubesock (2): Koshi, GiygaS, darthfoleyVayneAuthority (2): nooniansoong, slOosh GiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892, mdergslOosh (1): VayneAuthority Koshi (1): boxerfred boxerfred (2): GGTeMpLaR, mderg nooniansoong (1): Raynpelikoneet Not voted (1): Kmatt, Currently, Tubesock is being lynched. You have until Sunday, Jan 10 11:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00), or to lynch someone. Voting is mandatory and done in this thread. + Show Spoiler [Noon playing similiar to last towngame] +On January 11 2016 07:35 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2016 07:33 raynpelikoneet wrote:On January 11 2016 07:32 Koshi wrote: Yeah kush is playing exactly the same as last towngame. no He's at least playing pretty similar to his last towngame + Show Spoiler [Noon wasn't useful last game] +On January 11 2016 07:53 mderg wrote: Well, kush is producing less content than the last game I've played with him. And even in that game he was not producing enough content for me. I can definitely see where you're coming from. + Show Spoiler [votes at :59] +On January 11 2016 07:59 mderg wrote: ##unvote ##Vote nooniansoong On January 11 2016 08:00 mderg wrote: fuck it. voting kush
Boxerfred dies.
Didn't really see any reads. One post that said Noon and Boxer may have looked better but since consensus was ok with Boxer it had to be wrong. + Show Spoiler [Explains Shenany] +On January 12 2016 04:47 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2016 03:30 nooniansoong wrote:Anyway during lunch i went through some filters. Mderg looking scummy. - pressure on darthfoley that goes no where - sheeped TS onto gigyas - jumped ship on gigyas when wagon looked like it was going to falter. He gave no reason except that he thought about it more. - left a scumlynch a the last second for me. Again without any reasoning, except my lack of content. On January 11 2016 07:53 mderg wrote: Well, kush is producing less content than the last game I've played with him. And even in that game he was not producing enough content for me. I can definitely see where you're coming from. But boxerfred had even less content then me so I don't buy this reason to switch off boxerfred. I wasn't voting you for lack of content. That played a big part in it but it was not what put you above boxerfred for the lynch. You two were practically the same to me, you probably even looked a bit better. But everybody seemed fine with the boxerfred lynch, so I thought it somehow had to be wrong
Votes me. Cause duh.
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Koshi, you're just wrong.
And just because someone does something YOU don't understand doesn't mean it's stupid. Not at all.
Anyway, I have to work tonight. So, adios. I may or may not be back.
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On January 13 2016 10:50 GiygaS wrote: Eden can you explain why you thought I was lying initially? I read the guy town so logically*...
Never had a knee jerk reaction to game-changing info?
It wasn't smart lol
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It's weirdin me out that he's trying so hard
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On January 13 2016 10:02 Koshi wrote: Fucking waste of a day.
- redcheck we can't trust and are forced to lynch - a person getting lynched making cases on confirmed town by setup. Literally not doing anything else. - some guy rehearsing things that happened. If nothing happened around a person he calls them town, if a person lynches mafia and ias almost impossible mafia he calls them, wait for it, mafia. of course. - VA, who is awesome but untrustable. - Scott - Some guy who can't read the OP, and probably will get misslynched. - Top tier player who is trash - Mderg who is lost somewhere, I am not sure if I should alert the cops.
Brilliant. At least we had D1.
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Damnit - forgot to c/p my whole notepad -
On January 13 2016 04:05 nooniansoong wrote: tubesock why are you trying so hard with your megaposts at the same time as saying "please lynch me". whats your motivation here?
On January 13 2016 04:08 slOosh wrote:I'd be more comfortable lynching something like this than Tubesock Show nested quote +On January 13 2016 01:57 scott31337 wrote:So the way I see it is - if we don't lynch the red-check (which all the vet's in my mind are telling me you would) - he will always be doubtful - Look at Holyflare in http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/487093-mafia-in-the-himalayas?user=Holyflare - Unless Tubesock just completely dumps some major town rainbows, he's more of a liability that can bite us later. If our conf's have a better plan - I'm willing to listen. I'm still three pages behind. Meeting time - bbl.
Your conf town which upsets me, that you have nothing behind it but "I'd lynch him instead" - I'll flip VT. I don't spam the fucking thread like the others do, I observe, post my thoughts, and go with it - You should find another. Did you even read what I said? What's the mafia motivation? To lynch our red-check? Did you even read the game? I've obs'ed games for almost two years.
On January 13 2016 04:33 Koshi wrote: I am going to let you guys play a bit.
<3
On January 13 2016 09:10 GiygaS wrote: Can we get confirmation that farmer can target mafia to make it look like town? Koshi didn't like this dumbtell but hated mine.
On January 13 2016 09:39 Koshi wrote: darthfoley called me possible mafia. Awesome. Of course I am mafia on who mafia boxerfred showed face on with his fake as shit case, and then I ended up on boxerfred instead of any other guy I could have picked. He even claims that if I am mafia, Tubesock is town, which is entirely the most retarded thing ever because if I am mafia bussing, I probably want to do that to save my more active buddy or w.e.
This is such a bullshit association to make. Insane. Just fucking insane. If I join rayn (which I super easily could have done) we would have lynched Kush. Or is he also my mafia buddy?
This is raging Koshi town - if he's not dead d4 - then you can worry.
I do believe he could be framed - who's the lynch then?
On January 13 2016 10:02 Koshi wrote: Fucking waste of a day.
- redcheck we can't trust and are forced to lynch - a person getting lynched making cases on confirmed town by setup. Literally not doing anything else. - some guy rehearsing things that happened. If nothing happened around a person he calls them town, if a person lynches mafia and ias almost impossible mafia he calls them, wait for it, mafia. of course. - VA, who is awesome but untrustable. - Scott - Some guy who can't read the OP, and probably will get misslynched. - Top tier player who is trash - Mderg who is lost somewhere, I am not sure if I should alert the cops.
Brilliant. At least we had D1.
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Giygas are you voting with your redcheck or not?
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Shit thought I already hadn't voted. Yeah I am: ##vote tubesock
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On January 13 2016 03:46 nooniansoong wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2016 05:58 VayneAuthority wrote:I will write my quick thoughts incase I am vigged, don't want to invest too much time obviously when its super possible ill just die. The most likely mafia I can deduct from voting analysis and a follow up of his filter is darthfoleyYou will see that Tubesock was most likely the mafia mislynch of choice, kinda sure he is town. When the 2nd vote drops onto boxerfred, tubesock is sitting at 3 votes. starting to get close. then darthfoley goes ahead and votes for tubesock to make it a comfortable 4-2. But what you can't account for as mafia is a last second large swing like that resulting in boxer's lynch. It is a very suspicious and well timed vote on his part. Follow that up with gems like this from his filter On January 10 2016 05:35 darthfoley wrote: 1) I think it's scummy to generate discussion and then pop out because it seems helpful, all while staying under the radar without much concrete reasoning.
2) At the time I made my post, I'm pretty sure VA had only thrown out one name in the whole thread: slOosh as scum read. boxerfred has been more holistic in his approach to Q&A to Koshi and others imo. I haven't looked through Tubesock's or any of the less active posters yet. See part 2, boxerfred literally has almost no filter besides 1 post. He hasn't looked through any of the less active posters but says boxerfred is a shining example of being holistic? Soft defense that you wouldn't technically even realize you are doing as a mafia partner. Now look through his voting pattern, he flip flops on me and tubesock at the slightest change of wind to try to appear as if he is mulling his options but really he doesnt care that either of us is lynched, they are both mislynches for him. Thread support was the only thing that ever swayed his opinion. Finally, this is more of tells for me instead of mafia play but his first page is a lot of feigning ignorance with mechanics of the game to generate filter and even tells us about stuff he is doing irl which I largely associate with mafia attempting to lighten mood/make them appear more likable. cya at deadline Maybe. Defense of darthfoley: First thing is his first game and he uses a lot of reasoning and explains his thought process in a way that I wouldn't expect a first game player to even come close to faking. Yes, a lot of his arguments are bad (scumread on Koshi for starting discussion), but I think bad arguments like that commonly come from noobs. Changing your read a lot day 1 strikes me as a very townie thing to do. Scum pick a suspect then go with it. His reads show he is thinking about things and changing his mind based on the arguments people are presenting. And he mentioned boxerfred only because he was asked about him. scumvayne: This is the level of try hard I would expect from scumvayne on d2: the minimum necessary to look townie. He does a simple vca which is NAI. and then he does a very surface reading of darthfoley's filter and misrepresents him to look scummy.
There's no VCA in the post - did you see mine? I do not see any "simple VCA" done - I did a whole lot more. Let's try again.
On January 11 2016 07:35 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Final Vote Count boxerfred (3): GGTeMpLaR, slOosh, KoshiTubesock (2): Giygas, darthfoley Giygas (2): Tubesock, Eden1892 nooniansoong (2): raynpelikoneet, mderg VayneAuthority (1): nooniansoong slOosh (1): VayneAuthority Koshi (1): boxerfredNot voted (1): Kmatt Currently, boxerfred is being lynched. You have until Sunday, Jan 10 11:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00), or to lynch someone. Voting is mandatory and done in this thread.
I'm Kmatt - I'm town. If no one is fake-claiming (which should not be) - Where is your VCA you are speaking of?
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On January 13 2016 00:48 Tubesock wrote:slOosh is Town. First to vote, votes Koshi. slOosh then moves onto VayneAuthority after slOosh and Koshi hug it out and Vayne says he prefers to lynch someone else then votes slOosh. slOosh makes it clear he'll go to Boxer and then does before even Koshi does. He went to Boxer when I still had 4 on me and it was 2:2 boxer/ giygas. If you think I will flip red then this shows he saved me over Boxer and killed our roleblocker instead of GiygaS. Tinfoil that he forsaw Boxer switch and wanted town credit. But after I flip green, this clears him 100%. His read progression on wagons and his votes: (GiygaS, me, Boxerfred, VayneAuthority): + Show Spoiler [VA scums slOosh too much] +On January 09 2016 12:25 slOosh wrote: Hmm big things are you as strong town for picking up on similar things to me + more.
GGTeMpLaR I also noticed his first post was kinda awkward, but I felt like he could very well be those townies that if you pressure they just ... react poorly? I'm not sure how to phrase it, but I don't think a direct pressure approach would work out. So I wanted him to post on something else to figure out if he is nervous b/c scum or nervous b/c newer player.
Vayne ... I feel like he is reading me slightly more scum than someone reasonably could? Either that or his style of playing is very different to mine, almost like Oatsmaster or something if he is still around.
No one else has too much for me. Not a scumread really. He's just saying VA is overexaggerating. + Show Spoiler [Scums me and VA 4 lurkee profile] +On January 10 2016 02:46 slOosh wrote: Ok so I think it's a fair assessment to say that thus far in this game, I have been receiving the most flak. There's been some other things here and there, but not quite the same level as the attention to me.
Additionally, I would say that the general vibe thus far is quite good. There is a good atmosphere for discussion, people are talking and explaining instead of shouting / attacking.
So I would say that I expect mafia playstyle (in this context right now) to look more laid back, non intrusive and perhaps adding some fuel to the slOosh lynch wagon to make sure it goes through.
Who fits this bill?
mderg - I read him as detached from thread. I'm one of the biggest topics at this point and he has yet to say anything about me. He only posted when prompted and doesn't look interested in helping people figure things out.
Tubesock - rayn pointed out his complaint of something that had not happened yet. Scum complain about things without doing anything to help. He is lurking hard so tough to say more, but in this context, scum would be more likely to lurk.
VayneAuthority - hasn't produced any posts outside of getting suspicion on me - fits the bill of getting the D1 mislynch secured without putting more effort than necessary
Will answer GGTemplar's list next. + Show Spoiler [towns Boxer, with bonus Darth find] +On January 10 2016 03:01 slOosh wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 02:00 GGTeMpLaR wrote: I wasn't super impressed by what boxer had to say.
@sloOsh I would be most interested in your reads on darth, mderg, and boxer at this point.
Specifically mderg's read on darth. I like darth's posting thus far. He engages in topics that are relevant to the thread at the time and gives fleshed out explanations. I believe that mderg's read shows that he isn't reading the thread closely. Show nested quote +On January 09 2016 14:07 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 13:37 GiygaS wrote: Currently feeling weird about mderg and sloosh. Sloosh for reasons other people are giving, and I find it weird that mderg showed up, talked about my question (NAI) then peaced out for no good reason.
darth, templar was talking about toning down defending his early reads late in to the game. That post is not going to mean anything d1 if you're just evaluating if he's staying true to it or not. Oh yea I just reread that, that was dumb of me. If he was, (or if he was at least reading darthfoley closely), he should have seen this post. Show nested quote +On January 09 2016 16:31 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 08:51 Koshi wrote: I am also going to make it my policy to not lynch an active player on D1. Going to go for a scummy low amount poster. and if there isn't one, I ll take down the lowest filter. Koshi trying to sway Rayne's town read on sloosh seems out of place to me, given that Sloosh has been a pretty active poster so far; it contradicts one of his first posts in the game. I would also suspect that he should also have been able to point out darthfoley's mistake in time order, as Koshi posted what he did before my spurt of posting, before I was an "active poster". Furthermore, I don't get the sense that he is actually trying to convince anyone. He is throwing out a read, explaining it, but that's it. Looks like he is trying to keep up appearances. Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 01:10 boxerfred wrote:On January 09 2016 23:13 GGTeMpLaR wrote: Quick summary
koshi, eden, rayn
sloosh, mderg, darth how is koshi green in your head I liked this post from boxerfred. He thinks Koshi is scum, and first thing he does is question why other people have town reads on him. He actually looks engaged in wanting either others convinced to lynch Koshi or himself convinced that Koshi is town. + Show Spoiler [scumlist mderg VA Tube] +On January 10 2016 04:06 slOosh wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 04:04 Koshi wrote:On January 10 2016 04:01 slOosh wrote:On January 10 2016 03:29 Koshi wrote:On January 10 2016 03:06 slOosh wrote: Wait Koshi you townlean mderg?
Please explain. Entrance to the thread seemed more likely to come from town than from mafia. Boils down to the fact I think he might check things better if he was mafia, and not have the chain of posts he had about the VT claim thing. Could you answer my question? And in addition. Give your read on me? You haven't talked about me at all. Oh I thought it was clear from my followup posts that it is currently mderg. I like your "today" posting much more than your "yesterday" posting. I tend to move votes only when switching onto someone else, but if it will ease your mind ##Unvote Koshi So who is your nr 2 mafia read? mderg, vayne, tubesock in that order One page prior to my "easy townread" post on page 17. + Show Spoiler [VA secondary lynch target] +On January 10 2016 16:45 slOosh wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 16:37 Eden1892 wrote:On January 10 2016 16:30 slOosh wrote: Eden, what do you think about Tubesock's point that GiygaS had more or less the same townreads as Tubesock, yet cites his townreads as the reason for voting Tubesock? It's interesting, a pretty reasonable read. But I would still rather kill Tubesock, as that's the only thing he's posted (as of me typing this) that's left me willing to consider not killing him, and as I already thought GiygaS was pretty solidly town. What do you think? I think it is a decently a compelling point against GiygaS and am interested in his response. At this point I would place mderg, vayne and kmatt as lynch preferences. I don't see how people are reading mderg town, and I've yet the time to properly read vayne's meta b/c I don't really see any content from him. + Show Spoiler [votes VA] +On January 10 2016 17:15 slOosh wrote:Bah I'm falling asleep so can't followup on Tubesock / GiygaS till tomorrow. I will leave with my stronger preference on lynching Vayne. He is clearly not interested in engaging with town in any fashion. His best read after me is a total cop-out. Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 04:26 VayneAuthority wrote:On January 10 2016 04:18 slOosh wrote: Vayne, apart from me, could I have your strongest scum read? If i really had to pick, mderg, but it is a very weak/generic read at this point And I just found out that while he doesn't bother adding to town discussion at all, he does make sure he leaves a vote on me in the voting thread. I think this is the best lynch right now. ##Vote VayneAuthority On January 10 2016 15:30 rsoultin wrote:Edited Vote Count Tubesock (4): Eden1892, Koshi, GiygaS, darthfoley slOosh (2): GGTeMpLaR, VayneAuthority VayneAuthority (2): nooniansoong, slOosh Koshi (1): boxerfred GiygaS (1): Tubesock Not voted (4): mderg, Kmatt, Raynpelikoneet Currently, Tubesock is being lynched. You have until Sunday, Jan 10 11:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00), or to lynch someone. Voting is mandatory and done in this thread. + Show Spoiler [Says GigygaS vs Tube is TvT] +On January 11 2016 05:28 slOosh wrote: Yea I definitely don't think we should be lynching either GiygaS or Tubesock today. There's enough good things from each player but nothing so bad that you could lynch them with that much confidence (there might be and if you see something please share with the rest of class). It could easily be town vs town. + Show Spoiler [can go on Boxer if it goes] +On January 11 2016 05:58 slOosh wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2016 05:55 Koshi wrote:On January 11 2016 05:32 slOosh wrote: Excellent.
Koshi, you mentioned at the start of the game that you would prefer to lynch a low amount poster / low filter poster. Would you like to join me in lynching VA? I could. But I am still sitting pretty on boxerfred. Ok. I'm ok with that too if we end up going that way. + Show Spoiler [Votes Boxerfred] +On January 11 2016 07:05 slOosh wrote: I'm moving to boxerfred. I really don't think Tubesock is the lynch here.
##Vote boxerfred + Show Spoiler [Votebox, slOosh votes with #1 scumread] +On January 11 2016 06:25 Trfel wrote:Edited Unofficial Vote Count Tubesock (3): Koshi, GiygaS, Raynpelikoneet,darthfoley VayneAuthority (2): nooniansoong, slOoshGiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892 boxerfred (2): GGTeMpLaR, mderg, slOosh slOosh (1): VayneAuthority Koshi (1): boxerfred Not voted (2): Kmatt, darthfoley Currently, Tubesock is being lynched. You have until Sunday, Jan 10 11:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00), or to lynch someone. Voting is mandatory and done in this thread. + Show Spoiler [Noon read] +Beginning to talk about Noon switch linkOn January 11 2016 07:51 slOosh wrote: rayn, just so you don't feel like you are talking to deaf ears:
I disagree with your initial noon case. The first quote he said that you thought was useless was like 1 hour into D1, giving a towntell to Koshi for being indifferent doesn't seem weird and being ok with lynching Vayne for various reasons doesn't seem that weird either.
I think it is a playstyle thing where you assume everyone should play a certain fashion and if they don't they are scum, but they could just be playing a different playstyle.
I will agree with you that he has low post count, but I think at least he is checking into thread ala. tubesock read. why did you spend all this time making this towncase for an un-cc'd named vt........
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On January 13 2016 07:15 darthfoley wrote:Okay I've read the last couple of pages and I will try to respond to everything that's been presented against me. I'll provide my reads currently Confirmed town: slOosh (named VT and no one can counterclaim), GiygaS (cop) ~100% confirmed town in my mind: GGTemplar. As I posted earlier, GGTemp was on the boxerfred wagon from the beginning, and I can't see a mafia strat including bussing your RB from almost the beginning of day 1. I'm less certain (but would bet) that Koshi is playing a good town game. However, I've rightly caught a lot of flak for being wishy washy on my voting habits; Koshi voted for four people during the day phase (Nooniansong, VA, Tubesock, Boxerfred). While unlikely, is it impossible for him to be on Tubesock, realize it won't go through, and switch to Boxerfred because the town cred for being on the correct lynch wagon vastly outweighs the benefit of having a suspiciously inactive mafia around that could eventually be tied back to you, even if it's the RB? Boxerfred in his kill post even said he realized he couldn't be active. I think smart mafia may be able to use that to their advantage in their QT thing. May i'm getting too tin-foil hatty here, or perhaps i'm sherlock holmes. This would basically confirm town Tubesock though, unless we somehow had two correct lynch wagons going on D1. Regarding VA, I just want to point this post out near the beginning of the game from Koshi. Show nested quote + 3) VA is a master of pushing mafia agenda. If Sloosh isn't mafia the agenda is very intact. What I mean is: his options are still completely open to do w.e the fuck he wants to reach his wincon and help his team win.
If VA is either a smart town or good mafia, it makes sense why he would target me coming out N1 with a hard read on me. I've clearly been wishy washy on votes, misread posts, and haven't really led town discussion on anything, which signals weak first game town that can easily be made into a *ding ding ding, darth checks off all the mafia bells.* I understand why his case is compelling, except I haven't "feigned ignorance" like he says I have. I fully accept that I haven't been a strong town, but I haven't relied on the newbie crutch at all imo. If you guys end up lynching me, take good look at him when I come back green. I've gone through mderg's filter and I think he is probably town at this point; I don't think it would make sense to get off the Boxerfred wagon at that point in the day if he were trying to claim town cred for a correct lynch. While his filter is shorter than most, I don't see anything incriminating him currently. With the setup confirmed A, I think Tubesock is a potential frame target, however the EoD vote was so scattered that I could see mafia team including Tubesock deciding to not frame Tubesock to green. Given how his wagon kind of collapsed near the end of the day, there seemed to be some consensus that Tubesock was acting more townie. Personally i'm not very sold on the WIFOM "lynch me!" because isn't that exactly what you would do to come off as a town, willing to die for the good of the order? Noonian - I'm not sure what I think of Noonian at this point. While it doesn't make much sense for a mafia to defend someone who is likely to be lynched in the next day or two, it could also maybe(?) establish town creds when I flip green. Noon hasn't really given any reads besides his mderg+Eden hail mary, so that gives me some scum vibes. Scott - I don't want to beat a dead horse, but Scott's number 1-7 thing is pretty questionable. His excuse that he hadn't updated it when he posted it is also kind of silly: GGTemp being the same as me at 5.5, even though he advocated hard for boxerfred, and I didn't? I don't know why, if he's been reading the thread like he says he has, you would only have a "light" town read on GGTemp. I also don't think his case against mderg has any legs to stand on, leaving him with little substance even though he's posted a fair amount. He's my #2 lynch behind Tubesock. Eden - I think he's been especially strong since EoD1, making me fairly confident he's town. His discussion of mafia teams/lynch strategy make a lot of sense if you agree that either (but not both) me or Tubesock are mafia-- and most of you do. I realize this is the dreaded wall of text, but I haven't been able to post for a while soooooo
100% town: sloosh, giygas, ggtemplar pretty town: me, mderg
shrug: noonian
lynch: tubesock, scott
koshi is ?????? you say probably a good townie game but then spend the rest of the paragraph talking about how he's mafia...
va is "smart town or good mafia" who we should look at
This is pretty uninspiring for me. Obvious town reads are obvious, made only slightly spicy by somehow not town reading Koshi as strongly as some other town reads. Obvious lynches are obvious.
The thing that would actually help us solve this game is sorting out the trio of darthfoley, Vayne and kush. darth gives us very little about this -- his read on Vayne seems to imply that he thinks Vayne is mafia (see "when I flip green look at this guy"), but he starts off by saying "If VA were smart town or good mafia," his behavior makes sense. So all I learn from this is that darth doesn't think VA is dumb town. Great I guess, but not really helping.
It's also strange to me that darth combines a very conceding treatment of VA's arguments (stuff like "I understand I haven't been a great townie" and the like), but then still thinks we should suspect VA. If VA's arguments are reasonable enough to force a concessive "I understand I haven't been a great townie" type of reaction, then why would VA be suspicious for giving such an argument?
Shocking, I know, but this seems like a mafia reaction to me. Acknowledge your opponent has a point, but still try to paint your opponent as suspicious for making it. Not liking it.
And then there's just not a lot said about Noonian either way, looks like a light scumread but darth isn't initiating a lot of conversation with Noonian to sort out his read. Especially given how Noonian should be near the top of his suspects list given his reads and the game state information we have, I'm -- surprise -- suspicious of darth here too.
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On January 10 2016 05:26 darthfoley wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 05:03 Eden1892 wrote:On January 10 2016 03:13 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 17:43 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 17:33 raynpelikoneet wrote:On January 09 2016 17:27 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 17:21 raynpelikoneet wrote: boo to yourself eden You do read what I say! I am curious why you and slOosh seemed to just mutually drop your conversation about your divergent reads on GiygaS. Weren't you a little curious why slOosh could read the same thing you did and conclude the exact opposite thing about GiygaS's alignment? There is no reason for me to answer this before slOosh does. I will after that. I will just say that coming to opposite conclusion (which is btw pretty strong wording here -- since i literally stated my read is "tentative") and concluding that the other person makes sense are not mutually exclusive. They aren't exclusive, I just figured you might still be curious enough to ask. But you are right, I would much rather hear slOosh's answer on this first. On January 09 2016 17:29 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 17:20 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 17:13 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 16:51 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 16:34 darthfoley wrote: I'm also voting Koshi as it stands. The more I look at his posts, the less helpful they seem to the Town.
##Vote: Koshi What is unhelpful about Koshi's posts in your own words? As they seem less helpful the more you look at them, I expect that you will be able to explain this pretty easily for this potato townie questioning you. Well, originally I thought that the conversation's direction regarding sloosh was pretty productive. It got him talking, and also gave out a decent amount of info to sift through, which you've courteously done. Out of all the active players so far, I think rayne has been the most town; his posts are well thought out and his questions are inquisitive. So, I looked at Koshi closer because he was one of the adamant Sloosh scum posters next to rayne. For me, I am mainly am just confused as to why he's been reluctant to back off Sloosh after saying he wouldn't target active townspeople on day 1. Maybe he strictly means he won't vote for active townspeople but still target them in discussion, though his grilling of Sloosh followed by a pivot towards a poster with no history seems out of place and too random for my liking. He cites "terrible" reasons that he probably won't remember in the morning, which basically provides no information about anything at all. Why couldn't he include at least an outline of something relevant? I'm unclear on Sloosh, because some of his questioning lacks a clear direction and looks kind of filler. I think Giygas is town as of now. Your point on his intuitive search for more info at the start of the game re game setup is an angle I hadn't thought of. A counterquestion. Why should Koshi be reluctant to back off? Just because he said he wouldn't lynch active players? Most pushes this early in day 1 don't lead to lynching the people being pushed. I would even go as far as to say that if your early pushes are engineered to lynch people, you're doing it wrong. The point of putting other players' feet to the fire early is to force them to make substantive statements about the game state. This is helpful regardless of whether the player is town or mafia, active or inactive, yada yada. I agree it's a bit bizarre that he pivoted over to noonian and doesn't post anything. Not leaving any reasons for it is, indeed unhelpful. But you said this: I'm also voting Koshi as it stands. The more I look at his posts, the less helpful they seem to the Town. This sounds to me more like an indictment of his entire posting history, not just his admittedly bordering-on-useless "vote/push" post. You're not telling me that of all the posts Koshi has made this day, the whole body of work is unhelpful due to this one post at the end, are you? If you are, forgive me for finding it uncompelling. I think Koshi's been of at least moderate use in generating discussion. I think his pressure on slOosh was constructive, and I would certainly not call the body of work unhelpful. You're going to have to do better than just handwave the whole thing as unhelpful. Maybe cite something specific for me outside of the noonian vote? (Or if you have nothing else, then please elaborate as to why that invalidated the rest of his posting history this game.) Meh, i'm starting to see why there are newbie mafia games run lol. It was a bit too shallow to vote on Koshi given the circumstances. The more I think about it, the more I do see the utility of his grilling of Sloosh near the start. It's true that he doesn't have to back off a scum read, especially because as you said, lots of people get grilled day 1 and it doesn't necessarily mean it's aimed at a lynch. I was under the impression that Koshi actually scum reads Sloosh, although it's useful info either way. The more reflective I am of the Koshi v Sloosh dynamic, the more I realize that I can't let my frustration of being kind of clueless make me jump to hasty conclusions. At this point, I can't constructively add much until Koshi explains his Noon read imo. I don't understand what was shallow about voting Koshi there. If your takeaway from my questions was "you are wrong for voting Koshi," that takeaway isn't the one I intended to convey. The takeaway was "I don't understand why you are voting Koshi" -- and you're essentially telling me you don't have much to add to the discussion until Koshi explains his read. But... you still had a reason for saying that Koshi's posts were unhelpful. After all, unless you intend to tell me your statement that "The more I look at his posts, the less helpful they seem to the Town." was made up, something you read made you think this. I just want to know what that something is. The reasons I said that were because of the Noon vote, and because I thought he was really trying hard to sway rayne's townread on Sloosh in a way that seemed a bit suspicious. It wasn't that much to go on. Just woke up so i'll get up to date with the thread, but I wanted to make sure I responded to this Ok. So, you felt the Noonian vote and the attempt to sway ray's vote was suspicious. In what way(s) were they so? I don't care that you have decided Koshi isn't suspicious anymore, I just want to know why you felt he was so I may evaluate your alignment. Well if I were scum, I think it would make sense to get in the ear of someone who has basically been agreed to be town read, especially when he (rayne) has been leading a lot of the discussion. If you are being helpful to one of the "towniest town" people, you could be either helpful town or smart scum. I initially read it as a clever scum play. I've already explained why I found the Noonian vote suspicious: there was nothing concrete about it and seemed random because Noonian hadn't posted anything at that point. Also, thanks for the Named VT explanation
Reading your filter, this stuck out to me.
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On January 13 2016 18:24 scott31337 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 05:26 darthfoley wrote:On January 10 2016 05:03 Eden1892 wrote:On January 10 2016 03:13 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 17:43 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 17:33 raynpelikoneet wrote:On January 09 2016 17:27 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 17:21 raynpelikoneet wrote: boo to yourself eden You do read what I say! I am curious why you and slOosh seemed to just mutually drop your conversation about your divergent reads on GiygaS. Weren't you a little curious why slOosh could read the same thing you did and conclude the exact opposite thing about GiygaS's alignment? There is no reason for me to answer this before slOosh does. I will after that. I will just say that coming to opposite conclusion (which is btw pretty strong wording here -- since i literally stated my read is "tentative") and concluding that the other person makes sense are not mutually exclusive. They aren't exclusive, I just figured you might still be curious enough to ask. But you are right, I would much rather hear slOosh's answer on this first. On January 09 2016 17:29 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 17:20 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 17:13 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 16:51 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 16:34 darthfoley wrote: I'm also voting Koshi as it stands. The more I look at his posts, the less helpful they seem to the Town.
##Vote: Koshi What is unhelpful about Koshi's posts in your own words? As they seem less helpful the more you look at them, I expect that you will be able to explain this pretty easily for this potato townie questioning you. Well, originally I thought that the conversation's direction regarding sloosh was pretty productive. It got him talking, and also gave out a decent amount of info to sift through, which you've courteously done. Out of all the active players so far, I think rayne has been the most town; his posts are well thought out and his questions are inquisitive. So, I looked at Koshi closer because he was one of the adamant Sloosh scum posters next to rayne. For me, I am mainly am just confused as to why he's been reluctant to back off Sloosh after saying he wouldn't target active townspeople on day 1. Maybe he strictly means he won't vote for active townspeople but still target them in discussion, though his grilling of Sloosh followed by a pivot towards a poster with no history seems out of place and too random for my liking. He cites "terrible" reasons that he probably won't remember in the morning, which basically provides no information about anything at all. Why couldn't he include at least an outline of something relevant? I'm unclear on Sloosh, because some of his questioning lacks a clear direction and looks kind of filler. I think Giygas is town as of now. Your point on his intuitive search for more info at the start of the game re game setup is an angle I hadn't thought of. A counterquestion. Why should Koshi be reluctant to back off? Just because he said he wouldn't lynch active players? Most pushes this early in day 1 don't lead to lynching the people being pushed. I would even go as far as to say that if your early pushes are engineered to lynch people, you're doing it wrong. The point of putting other players' feet to the fire early is to force them to make substantive statements about the game state. This is helpful regardless of whether the player is town or mafia, active or inactive, yada yada. I agree it's a bit bizarre that he pivoted over to noonian and doesn't post anything. Not leaving any reasons for it is, indeed unhelpful. But you said this: I'm also voting Koshi as it stands. The more I look at his posts, the less helpful they seem to the Town. This sounds to me more like an indictment of his entire posting history, not just his admittedly bordering-on-useless "vote/push" post. You're not telling me that of all the posts Koshi has made this day, the whole body of work is unhelpful due to this one post at the end, are you? If you are, forgive me for finding it uncompelling. I think Koshi's been of at least moderate use in generating discussion. I think his pressure on slOosh was constructive, and I would certainly not call the body of work unhelpful. You're going to have to do better than just handwave the whole thing as unhelpful. Maybe cite something specific for me outside of the noonian vote? (Or if you have nothing else, then please elaborate as to why that invalidated the rest of his posting history this game.) Meh, i'm starting to see why there are newbie mafia games run lol. It was a bit too shallow to vote on Koshi given the circumstances. The more I think about it, the more I do see the utility of his grilling of Sloosh near the start. It's true that he doesn't have to back off a scum read, especially because as you said, lots of people get grilled day 1 and it doesn't necessarily mean it's aimed at a lynch. I was under the impression that Koshi actually scum reads Sloosh, although it's useful info either way. The more reflective I am of the Koshi v Sloosh dynamic, the more I realize that I can't let my frustration of being kind of clueless make me jump to hasty conclusions. At this point, I can't constructively add much until Koshi explains his Noon read imo. I don't understand what was shallow about voting Koshi there. If your takeaway from my questions was "you are wrong for voting Koshi," that takeaway isn't the one I intended to convey. The takeaway was "I don't understand why you are voting Koshi" -- and you're essentially telling me you don't have much to add to the discussion until Koshi explains his read. But... you still had a reason for saying that Koshi's posts were unhelpful. After all, unless you intend to tell me your statement that "The more I look at his posts, the less helpful they seem to the Town." was made up, something you read made you think this. I just want to know what that something is. The reasons I said that were because of the Noon vote, and because I thought he was really trying hard to sway rayne's townread on Sloosh in a way that seemed a bit suspicious. It wasn't that much to go on. Just woke up so i'll get up to date with the thread, but I wanted to make sure I responded to this Ok. So, you felt the Noonian vote and the attempt to sway ray's vote was suspicious. In what way(s) were they so? I don't care that you have decided Koshi isn't suspicious anymore, I just want to know why you felt he was so I may evaluate your alignment. Well if I were scum, I think it would make sense to get in the ear of someone who has basically been agreed to be town read, especially when he (rayne) has been leading a lot of the discussion. If you are being helpful to one of the "towniest town" people, you could be either helpful town or smart scum. I initially read it as a clever scum play. I've already explained why I found the Noonian vote suspicious: there was nothing concrete about it and seemed random because Noonian hadn't posted anything at that point. Also, thanks for the Named VT explanation Reading your filter, this stuck out to me. why
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On Mderg -
On January 10 2016 20:05 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 19:53 raynpelikoneet wrote:On January 10 2016 19:46 mderg wrote:On January 10 2016 15:26 Tubesock wrote:##Vote: GiygaSOn January 10 2016 12:11 GiygaS wrote:I'm gonna ladder a bit and come back, but before I do ##Vote tubesockHis last posts townreads were really odd. Basically My list is (roughly from scummy to less scummy) tubesock: not much more to say on him that darth already hasn't + Show Spoiler [ Darthfoley's Tube Case] +On January 10 2016 10:08 darthfoley wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 04:37 Tubesock wrote: @Eden - I did think the thread was heading in the towning people for too dumb to be mafia reasons. Also I posted to post. At the time there really wasn't anything I felt compelled to respond to.
Easy town reads Reyn, Eden, SloOsh, Nooniansoong
GGtemplar I didn't like his first like 5 posts but he looks a lot better this morning. Koshi while gives me some weird scuzzies I am not willing to lynch him. Vayne I am not willing to lynch either. I like his tone.
the rest haven't said anything I found interesting or memorable.
I have to work today and have Christmas dinner tonight but after that I'll be in thread. This is Tubesock's only post of the day and I'm not a fan. Easy reads on sloosh, Noonian? None of these reads have any reasoning behind them. The vagueness with things like tone or "weird scuzzies" make me think scum mderg: + Show Spoiler [ blah blah words] +says easy things that are easy to say. his darth case is the only real content he has and it doesn't feel very substantial. Feels like he went looking around for something to read on, made the post and moved on. He's not pushing his read anymore, and hasn't even really talked about it again.
---- Line of scumminess --- kmatt: baby come back VA: I want to believe that his matter of fact tone makes him town, but I just can't given the things I'm reading about his reputation ---- Line of towniness --- noonboxer koshiggtemp: If he was mafia he would have used his supposed inexperience as a shield. sloosh---- Line of more-towniness --- darth eden raynThere's very likely a mafia in my town reads as I'm really not sure about a lot of them, but I want to lynch mderg or tubesock as it stands now. My TR's "were really odd". Yet compare them and notice GiygaS has the same ones. You can argue that I town VayneAuthority while GiygaS nulls him. But then I put VA in the same group as two others where I say something was bothering me about them yet I was not willing to lynch him. So, you can argue I null him instead. I don't care how you label it, "null", "slight/could be/ has a chance at being town", "I have no idea" whatever it isn't really relevant. It is clear it is not a strong read in either direction. The point is GiygaS and my reads are essentially equal. As in we are reading hte same game. How can my reads possibly be "weird" in his eyes? GiygaS cites Darthfoley's case on me. Darth's case is basically how the fuck can SloOsh and Noon be "easy town reads"? and my only commentary uses vagueness tone and he didn't like the phrase "weird scuzzies". BUT GiygaS goes with the "yeah weird town reads!" Why? well because Rayne, Koshi and Eden already said they think I am mafia. Koshi I htink it was already pointed out what a good point (weird statement) the easy town reads of Sloosh and Noon are. So, GiygaS KNOWS he has support and won't be questioned about this weird reads thing. GiygaS can give some reasons make it look like a case so he's doing something AND he knows he has the support of the 3 strongest thread presences. He won't have to fight them or do much to convince them. GiygaS should be latching onto the vaqueness of tone and "weird scuzzies" statements that Darth made. His case if he were town would include things like how I scum claimed, bitched and whined about something that probably wasn't going to happen, and then when I was called out for it I bailed scummily. That I have 3 posts and that each one is the epitome of doing "just enough" to stay under the radar. That maybe I was trying to play up the too scummy to be scum vibe. If you are going to make a case, it should be something like Tubesock's Tubesock is mafia case. Not, wow we have the same reads but Tubesocks town reads are so weird! There is plenty to case me on beyond just what Darth has said without needing to parrot the most active posters. I really like this post. That reason giygas gave for scumreading Tubesock looks fabricated. So is this a reason for you to scumread GiygaS? If it is, what in GiygaS' answer to the concerns here does not make sense? Yes, this is a reason for me to scumread him. It's not that his answer doesn't make any sense. It's simply unconvincing Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 17:00 GiygaS wrote:On January 10 2016 16:55 Tubesock wrote: So, basically, you are saying that if I simply said:
Town reads Rayne, Eden, SloOsh, Noonsiansoong
then the rest as finished, you would think I'm town? That would have helped, when your filter is that short its hard to say much else when there's basically nothing else in your filter. There's nothing of substance in that except for that post, and the one just now where you scum read me because I scum read you for the wrong reasons. Also this sounds like he is simply looking for a reason to scumread Tubesock.
Where are you trying to go here?
On January 10 2016 20:34 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 03:01 slOosh wrote:On January 10 2016 02:00 GGTeMpLaR wrote: I wasn't super impressed by what boxer had to say.
@sloOsh I would be most interested in your reads on darth, mderg, and boxer at this point.
Specifically mderg's read on darth. I like darth's posting thus far. He engages in topics that are relevant to the thread at the time and gives fleshed out explanations. I believe that mderg's read shows that he isn't reading the thread closely. On January 09 2016 14:07 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 13:37 GiygaS wrote: Currently feeling weird about mderg and sloosh. Sloosh for reasons other people are giving, and I find it weird that mderg showed up, talked about my question (NAI) then peaced out for no good reason.
darth, templar was talking about toning down defending his early reads late in to the game. That post is not going to mean anything d1 if you're just evaluating if he's staying true to it or not. Oh yea I just reread that, that was dumb of me. If he was, (or if he was at least reading darthfoley closely), he should have seen this post. On January 09 2016 16:31 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 08:51 Koshi wrote: I am also going to make it my policy to not lynch an active player on D1. Going to go for a scummy low amount poster. and if there isn't one, I ll take down the lowest filter. Koshi trying to sway Rayne's town read on sloosh seems out of place to me, given that Sloosh has been a pretty active poster so far; it contradicts one of his first posts in the game. I would also suspect that he should also have been able to point out darthfoley's mistake in time order, as Koshi posted what he did before my spurt of posting, before I was an "active poster". Furthermore, I don't get the sense that he is actually trying to convince anyone. He is throwing out a read, explaining it, but that's it. Looks like he is trying to keep up appearances. How does my read show that I'm not reading the thread closely? I quoted the post I supposedly missed like 5 minutes after my scumread on darthfoley, saying that it would have been a better quote than the one I had used. Dunno about the mistake in time order, I never considered you to be inactive at any point in this game.
On January 10 2016 20:34 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 03:01 slOosh wrote:On January 10 2016 02:00 GGTeMpLaR wrote: I wasn't super impressed by what boxer had to say.
@sloOsh I would be most interested in your reads on darth, mderg, and boxer at this point.
Specifically mderg's read on darth. I like darth's posting thus far. He engages in topics that are relevant to the thread at the time and gives fleshed out explanations. I believe that mderg's read shows that he isn't reading the thread closely. On January 09 2016 14:07 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 13:37 GiygaS wrote: Currently feeling weird about mderg and sloosh. Sloosh for reasons other people are giving, and I find it weird that mderg showed up, talked about my question (NAI) then peaced out for no good reason.
darth, templar was talking about toning down defending his early reads late in to the game. That post is not going to mean anything d1 if you're just evaluating if he's staying true to it or not. Oh yea I just reread that, that was dumb of me. If he was, (or if he was at least reading darthfoley closely), he should have seen this post. On January 09 2016 16:31 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 08:51 Koshi wrote: I am also going to make it my policy to not lynch an active player on D1. Going to go for a scummy low amount poster. and if there isn't one, I ll take down the lowest filter. Koshi trying to sway Rayne's town read on sloosh seems out of place to me, given that Sloosh has been a pretty active poster so far; it contradicts one of his first posts in the game. I would also suspect that he should also have been able to point out darthfoley's mistake in time order, as Koshi posted what he did before my spurt of posting, before I was an "active poster". Furthermore, I don't get the sense that he is actually trying to convince anyone. He is throwing out a read, explaining it, but that's it. Looks like he is trying to keep up appearances. How does my read show that I'm not reading the thread closely? I quoted the post I supposedly missed like 5 minutes after my scumread on darthfoley, saying that it would have been a better quote than the one I had used. Dunno about the mistake in time order, I never considered you to be inactive at any point in this game.
And here?
On January 10 2016 22:27 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 22:13 Tubesock wrote:On January 10 2016 22:01 mderg wrote: Let's take the way I saw the quote. Then, was that quote right or wrong? Uh It would be a pretty logical case. And I don't fault anyone for casing me on those points. Hell, if GiygaS did I wouldn't have anything to argue with at all. So, sure it could be right. Now what? Ok, I'm satisfied with that. That part played a big role in me believing your case on Giygas to be genuine. So your initial response saying the quote was wrong made me reconsider my stance on you.
What were you satisfied here?
On January 12 2016 05:29 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2016 10:58 GiygaS wrote: My "blue hunting" was me genuinely not knowing how a named VT works in the average game. I read it on the mafiascum wiki that their claim is very important, so I thought it might be worth asking to generate some non-joke discussion.
To explain my townread on boxerfred, while it was light, and dropped continuously as he didn't show up, was that he seemed to be reading posts very carefully to make analysis. He was picking out tiny things like the medic dodge specificity that I missed and thought was interesting, esp. when I was suspicious of Koshi at the time.
Updated reads for me is that ggtemp, koshi and sloosh are confirmed for the time being. Rayn is still very town in my eyes, and mderg has moved up since I don't think he would have swapped to a 1 vote wagon if he was scum trying to save his teammate (he would have swapped to one of the two vote wagons).
It's worth noting that we know boxer wasn't around as there's no way he wouldn't have either swapped votes or talked in the thread otherwise. So there was max 2 mafia in the thread at the time of the lynch. I don't think reading carefully and picking out tiny things is particularly towny. About the last minute vote switch: Moving to a 2 vote wagon wouldn't really have made a difference. I couldn't have saved boxerfred myself and would have needed someone else to switch either way.
That's nice - he's conftown now - what else you got?
On January 13 2016 08:29 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2016 03:49 slOosh wrote: Like, if we all agree that darthfoley is scum, then it seems like the right play to lynch him first. I think him flipping scum would be strong enough to exonerate Tubesock, despite the redcheck, given how D1 voting played out.
Am I making sense? I had darthfoley as scummy for quite some time. Haven't been able to read his filter since EOD1, though. Will take a look tomorrow to see what I think about that.
You have no mention of why Darthfoley is scummy until this post - #1091 - Can you explain further?
So, Mderg's last three posts after the red check are -
On January 13 2016 08:29 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2016 03:49 slOosh wrote: Like, if we all agree that darthfoley is scum, then it seems like the right play to lynch him first. I think him flipping scum would be strong enough to exonerate Tubesock, despite the redcheck, given how D1 voting played out.
Am I making sense? I had darthfoley as scummy for quite some time. Haven't been able to read his filter since EOD1, though. Will take a look tomorrow to see what I think about that.
and
On January 13 2016 08:38 mderg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2016 04:13 nooniansoong wrote:On January 13 2016 04:07 slOosh wrote:On January 13 2016 03:54 nooniansoong wrote:On January 09 2016 17:13 darthfoley wrote: For me, I am mainly am just confused as to why he's been reluctant to back off Sloosh after saying he wouldn't target active townspeople on day 1. Maybe he strictly means he won't vote for active townspeople but still target them in discussion, though his grilling of Sloosh followed by a pivot towards a poster with no history seems out of place and too random for my liking. He cites "terrible" reasons that he probably won't remember in the morning, which basically provides no information about anything at all. Why couldn't he include at least an outline of something relevant?
like just read that.. scum can't fake a thought process like that. I dunno that post is weird because the timeline is actually Koshi & others thought slOosh was weird --> slOosh gets annoyed and gets more active --> Koshi backs off after seeing this Whereas darthfoley's interpretation is something like Koshi & others thought slOosh was weird (but still active) --> Koshi should be backing off but isn't the way i see it is darth think sloosh was active enough already when koshi started in on him and so koshi's pressure looked fake. then he didn't like the "pivot" koshi did to an inactive poster. It has nothing to do with the timeline you are presenting. I woudl be super super impressed with darthfoley was mafia, just because I never see mafia coming up with weird cases like. Tubesock as for your mafia abilities, I suspect you were towned for a megapost/tinfoil which is not what I'm basing my townread on here. I thought that post was scummy. Doesn't really matter to me whether he thought sloosh was active enough already or he misinterpreted koshi's posts.
I'm not calling out anyone out scummy - just doing my research... mderg seems off though.
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On January 13 2016 18:24 scott31337 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2016 05:26 darthfoley wrote:On January 10 2016 05:03 Eden1892 wrote:On January 10 2016 03:13 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 17:43 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 17:33 raynpelikoneet wrote:On January 09 2016 17:27 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 17:21 raynpelikoneet wrote: boo to yourself eden You do read what I say! I am curious why you and slOosh seemed to just mutually drop your conversation about your divergent reads on GiygaS. Weren't you a little curious why slOosh could read the same thing you did and conclude the exact opposite thing about GiygaS's alignment? There is no reason for me to answer this before slOosh does. I will after that. I will just say that coming to opposite conclusion (which is btw pretty strong wording here -- since i literally stated my read is "tentative") and concluding that the other person makes sense are not mutually exclusive. They aren't exclusive, I just figured you might still be curious enough to ask. But you are right, I would much rather hear slOosh's answer on this first. On January 09 2016 17:29 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 17:20 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 17:13 darthfoley wrote:On January 09 2016 16:51 Eden1892 wrote:On January 09 2016 16:34 darthfoley wrote: I'm also voting Koshi as it stands. The more I look at his posts, the less helpful they seem to the Town.
##Vote: Koshi What is unhelpful about Koshi's posts in your own words? As they seem less helpful the more you look at them, I expect that you will be able to explain this pretty easily for this potato townie questioning you. Well, originally I thought that the conversation's direction regarding sloosh was pretty productive. It got him talking, and also gave out a decent amount of info to sift through, which you've courteously done. Out of all the active players so far, I think rayne has been the most town; his posts are well thought out and his questions are inquisitive. So, I looked at Koshi closer because he was one of the adamant Sloosh scum posters next to rayne. For me, I am mainly am just confused as to why he's been reluctant to back off Sloosh after saying he wouldn't target active townspeople on day 1. Maybe he strictly means he won't vote for active townspeople but still target them in discussion, though his grilling of Sloosh followed by a pivot towards a poster with no history seems out of place and too random for my liking. He cites "terrible" reasons that he probably won't remember in the morning, which basically provides no information about anything at all. Why couldn't he include at least an outline of something relevant? I'm unclear on Sloosh, because some of his questioning lacks a clear direction and looks kind of filler. I think Giygas is town as of now. Your point on his intuitive search for more info at the start of the game re game setup is an angle I hadn't thought of. A counterquestion. Why should Koshi be reluctant to back off? Just because he said he wouldn't lynch active players? Most pushes this early in day 1 don't lead to lynching the people being pushed. I would even go as far as to say that if your early pushes are engineered to lynch people, you're doing it wrong. The point of putting other players' feet to the fire early is to force them to make substantive statements about the game state. This is helpful regardless of whether the player is town or mafia, active or inactive, yada yada. I agree it's a bit bizarre that he pivoted over to noonian and doesn't post anything. Not leaving any reasons for it is, indeed unhelpful. But you said this: I'm also voting Koshi as it stands. The more I look at his posts, the less helpful they seem to the Town. This sounds to me more like an indictment of his entire posting history, not just his admittedly bordering-on-useless "vote/push" post. You're not telling me that of all the posts Koshi has made this day, the whole body of work is unhelpful due to this one post at the end, are you? If you are, forgive me for finding it uncompelling. I think Koshi's been of at least moderate use in generating discussion. I think his pressure on slOosh was constructive, and I would certainly not call the body of work unhelpful. You're going to have to do better than just handwave the whole thing as unhelpful. Maybe cite something specific for me outside of the noonian vote? (Or if you have nothing else, then please elaborate as to why that invalidated the rest of his posting history this game.) Meh, i'm starting to see why there are newbie mafia games run lol. It was a bit too shallow to vote on Koshi given the circumstances. The more I think about it, the more I do see the utility of his grilling of Sloosh near the start. It's true that he doesn't have to back off a scum read, especially because as you said, lots of people get grilled day 1 and it doesn't necessarily mean it's aimed at a lynch. I was under the impression that Koshi actually scum reads Sloosh, although it's useful info either way. The more reflective I am of the Koshi v Sloosh dynamic, the more I realize that I can't let my frustration of being kind of clueless make me jump to hasty conclusions. At this point, I can't constructively add much until Koshi explains his Noon read imo. I don't understand what was shallow about voting Koshi there. If your takeaway from my questions was "you are wrong for voting Koshi," that takeaway isn't the one I intended to convey. The takeaway was "I don't understand why you are voting Koshi" -- and you're essentially telling me you don't have much to add to the discussion until Koshi explains his read. But... you still had a reason for saying that Koshi's posts were unhelpful. After all, unless you intend to tell me your statement that "The more I look at his posts, the less helpful they seem to the Town." was made up, something you read made you think this. I just want to know what that something is. The reasons I said that were because of the Noon vote, and because I thought he was really trying hard to sway rayne's townread on Sloosh in a way that seemed a bit suspicious. It wasn't that much to go on. Just woke up so i'll get up to date with the thread, but I wanted to make sure I responded to this Ok. So, you felt the Noonian vote and the attempt to sway ray's vote was suspicious. In what way(s) were they so? I don't care that you have decided Koshi isn't suspicious anymore, I just want to know why you felt he was so I may evaluate your alignment. Well if I were scum, I think it would make sense to get in the ear of someone who has basically been agreed to be town read, especially when he (rayne) has been leading a lot of the discussion. If you are being helpful to one of the "towniest town" people, you could be either helpful town or smart scum. I initially read it as a clever scum play. I've already explained why I found the Noonian vote suspicious: there was nothing concrete about it and seemed random because Noonian hadn't posted anything at that point. Also, thanks for the Named VT explanation Reading your filter, this stuck out to me.
I read from our other town - It's really wordy speak, and thought I thought I would flag this - I've had a few to drink tonight, and re-evaluate
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On January 13 2016 18:20 Eden1892 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2016 07:15 darthfoley wrote:Okay I've read the last couple of pages and I will try to respond to everything that's been presented against me. I'll provide my reads currently Confirmed town: slOosh (named VT and no one can counterclaim), GiygaS (cop) ~100% confirmed town in my mind: GGTemplar. As I posted earlier, GGTemp was on the boxerfred wagon from the beginning, and I can't see a mafia strat including bussing your RB from almost the beginning of day 1. I'm less certain (but would bet) that Koshi is playing a good town game. However, I've rightly caught a lot of flak for being wishy washy on my voting habits; Koshi voted for four people during the day phase (Nooniansong, VA, Tubesock, Boxerfred). While unlikely, is it impossible for him to be on Tubesock, realize it won't go through, and switch to Boxerfred because the town cred for being on the correct lynch wagon vastly outweighs the benefit of having a suspiciously inactive mafia around that could eventually be tied back to you, even if it's the RB? Boxerfred in his kill post even said he realized he couldn't be active. I think smart mafia may be able to use that to their advantage in their QT thing. May i'm getting too tin-foil hatty here, or perhaps i'm sherlock holmes. This would basically confirm town Tubesock though, unless we somehow had two correct lynch wagons going on D1. Regarding VA, I just want to point this post out near the beginning of the game from Koshi. 3) VA is a master of pushing mafia agenda. If Sloosh isn't mafia the agenda is very intact. What I mean is: his options are still completely open to do w.e the fuck he wants to reach his wincon and help his team win.
If VA is either a smart town or good mafia, it makes sense why he would target me coming out N1 with a hard read on me. I've clearly been wishy washy on votes, misread posts, and haven't really led town discussion on anything, which signals weak first game town that can easily be made into a *ding ding ding, darth checks off all the mafia bells.* I understand why his case is compelling, except I haven't "feigned ignorance" like he says I have. I fully accept that I haven't been a strong town, but I haven't relied on the newbie crutch at all imo. If you guys end up lynching me, take good look at him when I come back green. I've gone through mderg's filter and I think he is probably town at this point; I don't think it would make sense to get off the Boxerfred wagon at that point in the day if he were trying to claim town cred for a correct lynch. While his filter is shorter than most, I don't see anything incriminating him currently. With the setup confirmed A, I think Tubesock is a potential frame target, however the EoD vote was so scattered that I could see mafia team including Tubesock deciding to not frame Tubesock to green. Given how his wagon kind of collapsed near the end of the day, there seemed to be some consensus that Tubesock was acting more townie. Personally i'm not very sold on the WIFOM "lynch me!" because isn't that exactly what you would do to come off as a town, willing to die for the good of the order? Noonian - I'm not sure what I think of Noonian at this point. While it doesn't make much sense for a mafia to defend someone who is likely to be lynched in the next day or two, it could also maybe(?) establish town creds when I flip green. Noon hasn't really given any reads besides his mderg+Eden hail mary, so that gives me some scum vibes. Scott - I don't want to beat a dead horse, but Scott's number 1-7 thing is pretty questionable. His excuse that he hadn't updated it when he posted it is also kind of silly: GGTemp being the same as me at 5.5, even though he advocated hard for boxerfred, and I didn't? I don't know why, if he's been reading the thread like he says he has, you would only have a "light" town read on GGTemp. I also don't think his case against mderg has any legs to stand on, leaving him with little substance even though he's posted a fair amount. He's my #2 lynch behind Tubesock. Eden - I think he's been especially strong since EoD1, making me fairly confident he's town. His discussion of mafia teams/lynch strategy make a lot of sense if you agree that either (but not both) me or Tubesock are mafia-- and most of you do. I realize this is the dreaded wall of text, but I haven't been able to post for a while soooooo 100% town: sloosh, giygas, ggtemplar pretty town: me, mderg shrug: noonian lynch: tubesock, scott koshi is ?????? you say probably a good townie game but then spend the rest of the paragraph talking about how he's mafia... va is "smart town or good mafia" who we should look at This is pretty uninspiring for me. Obvious town reads are obvious, made only slightly spicy by somehow not town reading Koshi as strongly as some other town reads. Obvious lynches are obvious. The thing that would actually help us solve this game is sorting out the trio of darthfoley, Vayne and kush. darth gives us very little about this -- his read on Vayne seems to imply that he thinks Vayne is mafia (see "when I flip green look at this guy"), but he starts off by saying "If VA were smart town or good mafia," his behavior makes sense. So all I learn from this is that darth doesn't think VA is dumb town. Great I guess, but not really helping. It's also strange to me that darth combines a very conceding treatment of VA's arguments (stuff like "I understand I haven't been a great townie" and the like), but then still thinks we should suspect VA. If VA's arguments are reasonable enough to force a concessive "I understand I haven't been a great townie" type of reaction, then why would VA be suspicious for giving such an argument? Shocking, I know, but this seems like a mafia reaction to me. Acknowledge your opponent has a point, but still try to paint your opponent as suspicious for making it. Not liking it. And then there's just not a lot said about Noonian either way, looks like a light scumread but darth isn't initiating a lot of conversation with Noonian to sort out his read. Especially given how Noonian should be near the top of his suspects list given his reads and the game state information we have, I'm -- surprise -- suspicious of darth here too. This is all very weak stuff. It doesn't convince me of anything. It are just a bunch of words without direction.
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I am looking for reasons to call Tubesock town beyond the redcheck. But the redcheck is so strong I don't want to. Especially that post Tubesock made during the night with "shoot me or lynch me but don't copcheck me" really bothers me. It is 100% wifom but it bothers me.
It is true Tubesock is doing things D2, but he is not solving the game. He made a case on confirmed town and now a case on mderg... While previously he said that we needed to look into all people except those 2.
The only problem that I have is that Tubesock voted giygas D1, while as mafia wouldn't it be better to be on the damn mafia lynch, or at least the townlynch that had momentum aka Kush? That being said, no other mafia was on the damn mafia lynch... So the argument is completely m00t except when ggtemplar is mafia and that is near impossible.
We still need to lynch Tubesock. And after that Eden.
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On January 13 2016 22:32 Koshi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2016 18:20 Eden1892 wrote:On January 13 2016 07:15 darthfoley wrote:Okay I've read the last couple of pages and I will try to respond to everything that's been presented against me. I'll provide my reads currently Confirmed town: slOosh (named VT and no one can counterclaim), GiygaS (cop) ~100% confirmed town in my mind: GGTemplar. As I posted earlier, GGTemp was on the boxerfred wagon from the beginning, and I can't see a mafia strat including bussing your RB from almost the beginning of day 1. I'm less certain (but would bet) that Koshi is playing a good town game. However, I've rightly caught a lot of flak for being wishy washy on my voting habits; Koshi voted for four people during the day phase (Nooniansong, VA, Tubesock, Boxerfred). While unlikely, is it impossible for him to be on Tubesock, realize it won't go through, and switch to Boxerfred because the town cred for being on the correct lynch wagon vastly outweighs the benefit of having a suspiciously inactive mafia around that could eventually be tied back to you, even if it's the RB? Boxerfred in his kill post even said he realized he couldn't be active. I think smart mafia may be able to use that to their advantage in their QT thing. May i'm getting too tin-foil hatty here, or perhaps i'm sherlock holmes. This would basically confirm town Tubesock though, unless we somehow had two correct lynch wagons going on D1. Regarding VA, I just want to point this post out near the beginning of the game from Koshi. 3) VA is a master of pushing mafia agenda. If Sloosh isn't mafia the agenda is very intact. What I mean is: his options are still completely open to do w.e the fuck he wants to reach his wincon and help his team win.
If VA is either a smart town or good mafia, it makes sense why he would target me coming out N1 with a hard read on me. I've clearly been wishy washy on votes, misread posts, and haven't really led town discussion on anything, which signals weak first game town that can easily be made into a *ding ding ding, darth checks off all the mafia bells.* I understand why his case is compelling, except I haven't "feigned ignorance" like he says I have. I fully accept that I haven't been a strong town, but I haven't relied on the newbie crutch at all imo. If you guys end up lynching me, take good look at him when I come back green. I've gone through mderg's filter and I think he is probably town at this point; I don't think it would make sense to get off the Boxerfred wagon at that point in the day if he were trying to claim town cred for a correct lynch. While his filter is shorter than most, I don't see anything incriminating him currently. With the setup confirmed A, I think Tubesock is a potential frame target, however the EoD vote was so scattered that I could see mafia team including Tubesock deciding to not frame Tubesock to green. Given how his wagon kind of collapsed near the end of the day, there seemed to be some consensus that Tubesock was acting more townie. Personally i'm not very sold on the WIFOM "lynch me!" because isn't that exactly what you would do to come off as a town, willing to die for the good of the order? Noonian - I'm not sure what I think of Noonian at this point. While it doesn't make much sense for a mafia to defend someone who is likely to be lynched in the next day or two, it could also maybe(?) establish town creds when I flip green. Noon hasn't really given any reads besides his mderg+Eden hail mary, so that gives me some scum vibes. Scott - I don't want to beat a dead horse, but Scott's number 1-7 thing is pretty questionable. His excuse that he hadn't updated it when he posted it is also kind of silly: GGTemp being the same as me at 5.5, even though he advocated hard for boxerfred, and I didn't? I don't know why, if he's been reading the thread like he says he has, you would only have a "light" town read on GGTemp. I also don't think his case against mderg has any legs to stand on, leaving him with little substance even though he's posted a fair amount. He's my #2 lynch behind Tubesock. Eden - I think he's been especially strong since EoD1, making me fairly confident he's town. His discussion of mafia teams/lynch strategy make a lot of sense if you agree that either (but not both) me or Tubesock are mafia-- and most of you do. I realize this is the dreaded wall of text, but I haven't been able to post for a while soooooo 100% town: sloosh, giygas, ggtemplar pretty town: me, mderg shrug: noonian lynch: tubesock, scott koshi is ?????? you say probably a good townie game but then spend the rest of the paragraph talking about how he's mafia... va is "smart town or good mafia" who we should look at This is pretty uninspiring for me. Obvious town reads are obvious, made only slightly spicy by somehow not town reading Koshi as strongly as some other town reads. Obvious lynches are obvious. The thing that would actually help us solve this game is sorting out the trio of darthfoley, Vayne and kush. darth gives us very little about this -- his read on Vayne seems to imply that he thinks Vayne is mafia (see "when I flip green look at this guy"), but he starts off by saying "If VA were smart town or good mafia," his behavior makes sense. So all I learn from this is that darth doesn't think VA is dumb town. Great I guess, but not really helping. It's also strange to me that darth combines a very conceding treatment of VA's arguments (stuff like "I understand I haven't been a great townie" and the like), but then still thinks we should suspect VA. If VA's arguments are reasonable enough to force a concessive "I understand I haven't been a great townie" type of reaction, then why would VA be suspicious for giving such an argument? Shocking, I know, but this seems like a mafia reaction to me. Acknowledge your opponent has a point, but still try to paint your opponent as suspicious for making it. Not liking it. And then there's just not a lot said about Noonian either way, looks like a light scumread but darth isn't initiating a lot of conversation with Noonian to sort out his read. Especially given how Noonian should be near the top of his suspects list given his reads and the game state information we have, I'm -- surprise -- suspicious of darth here too. This is all very weak stuff. It doesn't convince me of anything. It are just a bunch of words without direction. What's weak about it or lacking in direction?
You're free not to be convinced, but my points are definitely good and the direction (darthfoley is mafia) should be very clear to anybody reading.
You're complaining about a wasted day but then wasting your time on making a post like this?
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On January 14 2016 01:52 Eden1892 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2016 22:32 Koshi wrote:On January 13 2016 18:20 Eden1892 wrote:On January 13 2016 07:15 darthfoley wrote:Okay I've read the last couple of pages and I will try to respond to everything that's been presented against me. I'll provide my reads currently Confirmed town: slOosh (named VT and no one can counterclaim), GiygaS (cop) ~100% confirmed town in my mind: GGTemplar. As I posted earlier, GGTemp was on the boxerfred wagon from the beginning, and I can't see a mafia strat including bussing your RB from almost the beginning of day 1. I'm less certain (but would bet) that Koshi is playing a good town game. However, I've rightly caught a lot of flak for being wishy washy on my voting habits; Koshi voted for four people during the day phase (Nooniansong, VA, Tubesock, Boxerfred). While unlikely, is it impossible for him to be on Tubesock, realize it won't go through, and switch to Boxerfred because the town cred for being on the correct lynch wagon vastly outweighs the benefit of having a suspiciously inactive mafia around that could eventually be tied back to you, even if it's the RB? Boxerfred in his kill post even said he realized he couldn't be active. I think smart mafia may be able to use that to their advantage in their QT thing. May i'm getting too tin-foil hatty here, or perhaps i'm sherlock holmes. This would basically confirm town Tubesock though, unless we somehow had two correct lynch wagons going on D1. Regarding VA, I just want to point this post out near the beginning of the game from Koshi. 3) VA is a master of pushing mafia agenda. If Sloosh isn't mafia the agenda is very intact. What I mean is: his options are still completely open to do w.e the fuck he wants to reach his wincon and help his team win.
If VA is either a smart town or good mafia, it makes sense why he would target me coming out N1 with a hard read on me. I've clearly been wishy washy on votes, misread posts, and haven't really led town discussion on anything, which signals weak first game town that can easily be made into a *ding ding ding, darth checks off all the mafia bells.* I understand why his case is compelling, except I haven't "feigned ignorance" like he says I have. I fully accept that I haven't been a strong town, but I haven't relied on the newbie crutch at all imo. If you guys end up lynching me, take good look at him when I come back green. I've gone through mderg's filter and I think he is probably town at this point; I don't think it would make sense to get off the Boxerfred wagon at that point in the day if he were trying to claim town cred for a correct lynch. While his filter is shorter than most, I don't see anything incriminating him currently. With the setup confirmed A, I think Tubesock is a potential frame target, however the EoD vote was so scattered that I could see mafia team including Tubesock deciding to not frame Tubesock to green. Given how his wagon kind of collapsed near the end of the day, there seemed to be some consensus that Tubesock was acting more townie. Personally i'm not very sold on the WIFOM "lynch me!" because isn't that exactly what you would do to come off as a town, willing to die for the good of the order? Noonian - I'm not sure what I think of Noonian at this point. While it doesn't make much sense for a mafia to defend someone who is likely to be lynched in the next day or two, it could also maybe(?) establish town creds when I flip green. Noon hasn't really given any reads besides his mderg+Eden hail mary, so that gives me some scum vibes. Scott - I don't want to beat a dead horse, but Scott's number 1-7 thing is pretty questionable. His excuse that he hadn't updated it when he posted it is also kind of silly: GGTemp being the same as me at 5.5, even though he advocated hard for boxerfred, and I didn't? I don't know why, if he's been reading the thread like he says he has, you would only have a "light" town read on GGTemp. I also don't think his case against mderg has any legs to stand on, leaving him with little substance even though he's posted a fair amount. He's my #2 lynch behind Tubesock. Eden - I think he's been especially strong since EoD1, making me fairly confident he's town. His discussion of mafia teams/lynch strategy make a lot of sense if you agree that either (but not both) me or Tubesock are mafia-- and most of you do. I realize this is the dreaded wall of text, but I haven't been able to post for a while soooooo 100% town: sloosh, giygas, ggtemplar pretty town: me, mderg shrug: noonian lynch: tubesock, scott koshi is ?????? you say probably a good townie game but then spend the rest of the paragraph talking about how he's mafia... va is "smart town or good mafia" who we should look at This is pretty uninspiring for me. Obvious town reads are obvious, made only slightly spicy by somehow not town reading Koshi as strongly as some other town reads. Obvious lynches are obvious. The thing that would actually help us solve this game is sorting out the trio of darthfoley, Vayne and kush. darth gives us very little about this -- his read on Vayne seems to imply that he thinks Vayne is mafia (see "when I flip green look at this guy"), but he starts off by saying "If VA were smart town or good mafia," his behavior makes sense. So all I learn from this is that darth doesn't think VA is dumb town. Great I guess, but not really helping. It's also strange to me that darth combines a very conceding treatment of VA's arguments (stuff like "I understand I haven't been a great townie" and the like), but then still thinks we should suspect VA. If VA's arguments are reasonable enough to force a concessive "I understand I haven't been a great townie" type of reaction, then why would VA be suspicious for giving such an argument? Shocking, I know, but this seems like a mafia reaction to me. Acknowledge your opponent has a point, but still try to paint your opponent as suspicious for making it. Not liking it. And then there's just not a lot said about Noonian either way, looks like a light scumread but darth isn't initiating a lot of conversation with Noonian to sort out his read. Especially given how Noonian should be near the top of his suspects list given his reads and the game state information we have, I'm -- surprise -- suspicious of darth here too. This is all very weak stuff. It doesn't convince me of anything. It are just a bunch of words without direction. What's weak about it or lacking in direction? You're free not to be convinced, but my points are definitely good and the direction (darthfoley is mafia) should be very clear to anybody reading. You're complaining about a wasted day but then wasting your time on making a post like this? It's a fucking shit read on darth. Nothing that you said made him mafia. Nothing.
- Obvious reads except 1 (what is mafia about it, everybody got fucking obvious reads in this game, and he has 2 unusual reads with me and you BT fucking Way) - Says the VA read on him is understandable, but also says VA could be mafia jumping on lynchbait (what is mafia about pointing that out, it makes 100% sense) - Not much about Kush (Why is that mafia? Why? And why does he need to have multiple strong mafia reads?? We are voting on a fucking redcheck which might mean only 1 mafia after this)
What else is there on your shitcase in your shitpost?
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