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I'm a little bit weirded out that widen refused to believe my cop claim until everybody else did
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Okay I've read the last couple of pages and I will try to respond to everything that's been presented against me.
I'll provide my reads currently
Confirmed town: slOosh (named VT and no one can counterclaim), GiygaS (cop)
~100% confirmed town in my mind: GGTemplar. As I posted earlier, GGTemp was on the boxerfred wagon from the beginning, and I can't see a mafia strat including bussing your RB from almost the beginning of day 1. I'm less certain (but would bet) that Koshi is playing a good town game. However, I've rightly caught a lot of flak for being wishy washy on my voting habits; Koshi voted for four people during the day phase (Nooniansong, VA, Tubesock, Boxerfred). While unlikely, is it impossible for him to be on Tubesock, realize it won't go through, and switch to Boxerfred because the town cred for being on the correct lynch wagon vastly outweighs the benefit of having a suspiciously inactive mafia around that could eventually be tied back to you, even if it's the RB? Boxerfred in his kill post even said he realized he couldn't be active. I think smart mafia may be able to use that to their advantage in their QT thing. May i'm getting too tin-foil hatty here, or perhaps i'm sherlock holmes. This would basically confirm town Tubesock though, unless we somehow had two correct lynch wagons going on D1.
Regarding VA, I just want to point this post out near the beginning of the game from Koshi.
3) VA is a master of pushing mafia agenda. If Sloosh isn't mafia the agenda is very intact. What I mean is: his options are still completely open to do w.e the fuck he wants to reach his wincon and help his team win.
If VA is either a smart town or good mafia, it makes sense why he would target me coming out N1 with a hard read on me. I've clearly been wishy washy on votes, misread posts, and haven't really led town discussion on anything, which signals weak first game town that can easily be made into a *ding ding ding, darth checks off all the mafia bells.* I understand why his case is compelling, except I haven't "feigned ignorance" like he says I have. I fully accept that I haven't been a strong town, but I haven't relied on the newbie crutch at all imo. If you guys end up lynching me, take good look at him when I come back green.
I've gone through mderg's filter and I think he is probably town at this point; I don't think it would make sense to get off the Boxerfred wagon at that point in the day if he were trying to claim town cred for a correct lynch. While his filter is shorter than most, I don't see anything incriminating him currently.
With the setup confirmed A, I think Tubesock is a potential frame target, however the EoD vote was so scattered that I could see mafia team including Tubesock deciding to not frame Tubesock to green. Given how his wagon kind of collapsed near the end of the day, there seemed to be some consensus that Tubesock was acting more townie. Personally i'm not very sold on the WIFOM "lynch me!" because isn't that exactly what you would do to come off as a town, willing to die for the good of the order?
Noonian - I'm not sure what I think of Noonian at this point. While it doesn't make much sense for a mafia to defend someone who is likely to be lynched in the next day or two, it could also maybe(?) establish town creds when I flip green. Noon hasn't really given any reads besides his mderg+Eden hail mary, so that gives me some scum vibes.
Scott - I don't want to beat a dead horse, but Scott's number 1-7 thing is pretty questionable. His excuse that he hadn't updated it when he posted it is also kind of silly: GGTemp being the same as me at 5.5, even though he advocated hard for boxerfred, and I didn't? I don't know why, if he's been reading the thread like he says he has, you would only have a "light" town read on GGTemp. I also don't think his case against mderg has any legs to stand on, leaving him with little substance even though he's posted a fair amount. He's my #2 lynch behind Tubesock.
Eden - I think he's been especially strong since EoD1, making me fairly confident he's town. His discussion of mafia teams/lynch strategy make a lot of sense if you agree that either (but not both) me or Tubesock are mafia-- and most of you do.
I realize this is the dreaded wall of text, but I haven't been able to post for a while
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On January 13 2016 06:44 GiygaS wrote:
I'm a little bit weirded out that widen refused to believe my cop claim until everybody else did
Who the fuck is widen?
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Hold on, trying to find a question Eden had for me
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On January 13 2016 06:44 GiygaS wrote:
I'm a little bit weirded out that widen refused to believe my cop claim until everybody else did
I believed your claim basically from the drop, it didn't make sense otherwise. I ran through all the possibilities to be thorough, but my acceptance of your cop claim was pretty quick and certainly not "until everybody else did."
I didn't believe your scan to be true.
And I still don't.
I'm voting Tubesock with significant reservations, and may very well vote somebody else by EOD
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On January 12 2016 11:50 Eden1892 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2016 08:58 darthfoley wrote:On January 12 2016 07:48 Eden1892 wrote:On January 12 2016 07:22 darthfoley wrote:On January 12 2016 07:05 Eden1892 wrote:Updated thoughts from everybody's favorite townie. I think Tubesock is town. I am not sure if GiygaS is town or mafia. Very willing to entertain that the argument was between two townies, am 100% sure it wasn't two mafia. If this isn't obvious to anyone at this point, I can elaborate, but I think Tubesock's posting throughout this phase speaks for itself. He had a mediocre/bad start, but that doesn't mean very much, and his recovery has me sold. + Show Spoiler [For Eden] +Don't bother reading this, I was gonna do this but then I saw the stuff about darthfoley and found more interesting stuff to talk about. Typing all this with html tags was a bitch so I'm keeping this here for later.Following from that, some vote count analysis. I'm filling in my reads as green and flipped boxerfred as red. I will keep my reads limited to the ones I think are uncontroversial so as to limit the number of leaps needed to accept my premises.
Vote Count (16.5 hours)
Tubesock (4): Eden1892, Koshi, GiygaS, darthfoley
slOosh (2): GGTeMpLaR, VayneAuthority
VayneAuthority (1): nooniansoong
Koshi (1): boxerfred
GiygaS (1): Tubesock
(9.5 hours)
Vote Count
Tubesock (3): Koshi, GiygaS, darthfoley
VayneAuthority (2): nooniansoong, slOosh
GiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892
slOosh (1): VayneAuthority
Koshi (1): boxerfred
boxerfred (1): GGTeMpLaR
nooniansoong (1): Raynpelikoneet
(1.5 hours)
Unofficial Vote Count
Tubesock (3): Koshi, GiygaS, Raynpelikoneet
VayneAuthority (2): nooniansoong, slOosh
GiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892
boxerfred (2): GGTeMpLaR, mderg
slOosh (1): VayneAuthority
Koshi (1): boxerfred
(1 hour)
Official Vote Count
Tubesock (4): Koshi, GiygaS, Raynpelikoneet, darthfoley
boxerfred (3): GGTeMpLaR, mderg, slOosh
GiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892
VayneAuthority (1): nooniansoong
slOosh (1): VayneAuthority
Koshi (1): boxerfred
(Final)
Final Vote Count
boxerfred (3): GGTeMpLaR, slOosh, Koshi
Tubesock (2): GiygaS, darthfoley
GiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892
nooniansoong (2): raynpelikoneet, mderg
VayneAuthority (1): nooniansoong
slOosh (1): VayneAuthority
Koshi (1): boxerfred
On January 11 2016 01:45 darthfoley wrote:
Good morning
I like the way Tubesock has defended himself over the past 3-4 pages so i'm ##unvoting for now. On January 11 2016 05:28 darthfoley wrote:
Given how this Tubesock/GiygaS has progressed, i'm more confident in my vote for VA. He hasn't posted anything recently, and I find very little substance in what he has posted. I'm with you on this one sloosh
##Vote: VayneAuthority On January 11 2016 06:28 darthfoley wrote:
I read through VA's filters from the previous two games and I see what rayne is saying. VA's D1 posts are consistently not substantive as town.
I don't see any sense in considering Rayne as a better lynch than Noonian on D1, so I'm back on Tubesock.
##Unvote
darthfoley: What changed in between these posts for you? You retracted your vote on Tubesock about 6.5 hours before the lynch, saying that you were satisfied with Tubesock's defense of himself. You even felt that your argument on Vayne was better for the matter, since it didn't try to resolve a confusing situation between GiygaS and Tubesock. But then just a few hours later, you say that because Vayne is "consistently not substantive as town" on D1, you're back to voting Tubesock? Even though you were satisfied with his defense? What changed is that I went back and looked at Tubesock vs. GiygaS again. As GiygaS pointed out, Tubesock had basically only provided one read of substance (exluding posts like, "I like darth because his posts feel towny") the entire day: GiygaS. I also realized that his case of GiygaS regarding "our reads are the same but he says it's weird" is actually quite easily explained... because my original post that GiygaS quoted explained his reasoning in full. So you reread Tubesock's posts, after your unvote, and found that Tubesock had only given one read all day? That's odd. How much reading did you really do? Because before you even unvoted, Tubesock had plenty to say about other people in the game: On January 11 2016 00:47 Tubesock wrote:On January 11 2016 00:40 Koshi wrote:
VA, Boxerfred, Sloosh need to be lynched if Tubesock isnt' happening.
Kush is a terrible lynch.
Giygas is just not mafia.
Tubesock is fucking hard to read. I'm onboard for the Boxerfred or Kmatt lynch. VA is an ok enough lynch. He'd be number 4 though. Noon is a terrible lynch. I'd lynch Rayne before Noon. I don't know how to help you with a meta read, but if you have some other questions I'm around because apparently I'm not sleeping for awhile. On January 11 2016 01:56 darthfoley wrote:
Right now I'm most suspicious of GiygaS or VA for a red D1 lynch, but I'd also like to hear the case on boxerfred I also question that you went back and reread the initial case Tubesock gave, as if you had, you would have noticed that GiygaS did not quote you in his original post. Tubesock filled in the posts from you to explain his case. Would you care to resolve these discrepancies? I said he only posted one read of substance. Regarding the reads you quoted, I explained at the time that it didn't make sense to consider Noon more towny than Rayne at that point in the game. I think being "onboard" for boxerfred or Kmatt is pretty safe at that point in the voting process, especially because at this time it was 4 to 3 for Tubesock vs. Boxerfred. Would've been tied 4/4 if he changed from GiygaS to Boxerfred. Boxerfred hadn't been very active and you would get lots of town cred if you supported a correct lynch day 1. I mean we've already confirmed town everyone who voted for Boxerfred, so losing an inactive mafia isn't the end of the world if it basically makes you an unlynchable for a while. However, people then jumped off the Tubesock wagon and he didn't need to do this, while still getting towncred for being "okay" with a boxerfred lynch and consistency for sticking with GiygaS. GiygaS didn't directly quote me, but he basically did "not much more to say on him that darth already hasn't" That's great and all, but at the end of the day, you're not explaining why it is that Tubesock's posting, which was essentially unchanged between your unvote and your subsequent vote, no longer was townie enough for you. You've just gone in after being called on it and basically said some things that, if true, were already true of Tubesock before you unvoted. Like if you felt his reads weren't substantive enough, that's fine, but you either decided that they were substantive enough when you unvoted him (as that was the reason you voted him initially), or you unvoted him despite them not being substantive enough. Either way there's a glaring discrepancy that your explanation fails to satisfy.
At the time I unvoted I did believe Tubesock's defense against GiygaS. However, as the day progressed I realized how easy I am to manipulate because most arguments seem more credible to me than they really are. I started to get this feeling because Rayne kept grilling Tubesock over it regarding details I hadn't thought of. I then voted on VA because I was suspicious of his inactivity and thought it was a safe bet. But because I trusted Rayne the most, I took his advice and looked through his D1 posts from other games. I saw his point and decided that I wouldn't vote VA EoD1, leaving me to either go back to Tubesock, or randomly vote for people I didn't have strong suspicions of: GiygaS, Boxerfred, slOosh or Koshi. I didn't find any of those people more suspicious than Tubesock, so I voted Tubesock. Even though Tubesock had 3 votes when I got back on the wagon, votes were spread thinly so I didn't want to screw up with some shot in the dark against someone else.
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On January 13 2016 07:54 darthfoley wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2016 11:50 Eden1892 wrote:On January 12 2016 08:58 darthfoley wrote:On January 12 2016 07:48 Eden1892 wrote:On January 12 2016 07:22 darthfoley wrote:On January 12 2016 07:05 Eden1892 wrote:Updated thoughts from everybody's favorite townie. I think Tubesock is town. I am not sure if GiygaS is town or mafia. Very willing to entertain that the argument was between two townies, am 100% sure it wasn't two mafia. If this isn't obvious to anyone at this point, I can elaborate, but I think Tubesock's posting throughout this phase speaks for itself. He had a mediocre/bad start, but that doesn't mean very much, and his recovery has me sold. + Show Spoiler [For Eden] +Don't bother reading this, I was gonna do this but then I saw the stuff about darthfoley and found more interesting stuff to talk about. Typing all this with html tags was a bitch so I'm keeping this here for later.Following from that, some vote count analysis. I'm filling in my reads as green and flipped boxerfred as red. I will keep my reads limited to the ones I think are uncontroversial so as to limit the number of leaps needed to accept my premises.
Vote Count (16.5 hours)
Tubesock (4): Eden1892, Koshi, GiygaS, darthfoley
slOosh (2): GGTeMpLaR, VayneAuthority
VayneAuthority (1): nooniansoong
Koshi (1): boxerfred
GiygaS (1): Tubesock
(9.5 hours)
Vote Count
Tubesock (3): Koshi, GiygaS, darthfoley
VayneAuthority (2): nooniansoong, slOosh
GiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892
slOosh (1): VayneAuthority
Koshi (1): boxerfred
boxerfred (1): GGTeMpLaR
nooniansoong (1): Raynpelikoneet
(1.5 hours)
Unofficial Vote Count
Tubesock (3): Koshi, GiygaS, Raynpelikoneet
VayneAuthority (2): nooniansoong, slOosh
GiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892
boxerfred (2): GGTeMpLaR, mderg
slOosh (1): VayneAuthority
Koshi (1): boxerfred
(1 hour)
Official Vote Count
Tubesock (4): Koshi, GiygaS, Raynpelikoneet, darthfoley
boxerfred (3): GGTeMpLaR, mderg, slOosh
GiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892
VayneAuthority (1): nooniansoong
slOosh (1): VayneAuthority
Koshi (1): boxerfred
(Final)
Final Vote Count
boxerfred (3): GGTeMpLaR, slOosh, Koshi
Tubesock (2): GiygaS, darthfoley
GiygaS (2): Tubesock, Eden1892
nooniansoong (2): raynpelikoneet, mderg
VayneAuthority (1): nooniansoong
slOosh (1): VayneAuthority
Koshi (1): boxerfred
On January 11 2016 01:45 darthfoley wrote:
Good morning
I like the way Tubesock has defended himself over the past 3-4 pages so i'm ##unvoting for now. On January 11 2016 05:28 darthfoley wrote:
Given how this Tubesock/GiygaS has progressed, i'm more confident in my vote for VA. He hasn't posted anything recently, and I find very little substance in what he has posted. I'm with you on this one sloosh
##Vote: VayneAuthority On January 11 2016 06:28 darthfoley wrote:
I read through VA's filters from the previous two games and I see what rayne is saying. VA's D1 posts are consistently not substantive as town.
I don't see any sense in considering Rayne as a better lynch than Noonian on D1, so I'm back on Tubesock.
##Unvote
darthfoley: What changed in between these posts for you? You retracted your vote on Tubesock about 6.5 hours before the lynch, saying that you were satisfied with Tubesock's defense of himself. You even felt that your argument on Vayne was better for the matter, since it didn't try to resolve a confusing situation between GiygaS and Tubesock. But then just a few hours later, you say that because Vayne is "consistently not substantive as town" on D1, you're back to voting Tubesock? Even though you were satisfied with his defense? What changed is that I went back and looked at Tubesock vs. GiygaS again. As GiygaS pointed out, Tubesock had basically only provided one read of substance (exluding posts like, "I like darth because his posts feel towny") the entire day: GiygaS. I also realized that his case of GiygaS regarding "our reads are the same but he says it's weird" is actually quite easily explained... because my original post that GiygaS quoted explained his reasoning in full. So you reread Tubesock's posts, after your unvote, and found that Tubesock had only given one read all day? That's odd. How much reading did you really do? Because before you even unvoted, Tubesock had plenty to say about other people in the game: On January 11 2016 00:47 Tubesock wrote:On January 11 2016 00:40 Koshi wrote:
VA, Boxerfred, Sloosh need to be lynched if Tubesock isnt' happening.
Kush is a terrible lynch.
Giygas is just not mafia.
Tubesock is fucking hard to read. I'm onboard for the Boxerfred or Kmatt lynch. VA is an ok enough lynch. He'd be number 4 though. Noon is a terrible lynch. I'd lynch Rayne before Noon. I don't know how to help you with a meta read, but if you have some other questions I'm around because apparently I'm not sleeping for awhile. On January 11 2016 01:56 darthfoley wrote:
Right now I'm most suspicious of GiygaS or VA for a red D1 lynch, but I'd also like to hear the case on boxerfred I also question that you went back and reread the initial case Tubesock gave, as if you had, you would have noticed that GiygaS did not quote you in his original post. Tubesock filled in the posts from you to explain his case. Would you care to resolve these discrepancies? I said he only posted one read of substance. Regarding the reads you quoted, I explained at the time that it didn't make sense to consider Noon more towny than Rayne at that point in the game. I think being "onboard" for boxerfred or Kmatt is pretty safe at that point in the voting process, especially because at this time it was 4 to 3 for Tubesock vs. Boxerfred. Would've been tied 4/4 if he changed from GiygaS to Boxerfred. Boxerfred hadn't been very active and you would get lots of town cred if you supported a correct lynch day 1. I mean we've already confirmed town everyone who voted for Boxerfred, so losing an inactive mafia isn't the end of the world if it basically makes you an unlynchable for a while. However, people then jumped off the Tubesock wagon and he didn't need to do this, while still getting towncred for being "okay" with a boxerfred lynch and consistency for sticking with GiygaS. GiygaS didn't directly quote me, but he basically did "not much more to say on him that darth already hasn't" That's great and all, but at the end of the day, you're not explaining why it is that Tubesock's posting, which was essentially unchanged between your unvote and your subsequent vote, no longer was townie enough for you. You've just gone in after being called on it and basically said some things that, if true, were already true of Tubesock before you unvoted. Like if you felt his reads weren't substantive enough, that's fine, but you either decided that they were substantive enough when you unvoted him (as that was the reason you voted him initially), or you unvoted him despite them not being substantive enough. Either way there's a glaring discrepancy that your explanation fails to satisfy. At the time I unvoted I did believe Tubesock's defense against GiygaS. However, as the day progressed I realized how easy I am to manipulate because most arguments seem more credible to me than they really are. I started to get this feeling because Rayne kept grilling Tubesock over it regarding details I hadn't thought of. I then voted on VA because I was suspicious of his inactivity and thought it was a safe bet. But because I trusted Rayne the most, I took his advice and looked through his D1 posts from other games. I saw his point and decided that I wouldn't vote VA EoD1, leaving me to either go back to Tubesock, or randomly vote for people I didn't have strong suspicions of: GiygaS, Boxerfred, slOosh or Koshi. I didn't find any of those people more suspicious than Tubesock, so I voted Tubesock. Even though Tubesock had 3 votes when I got back on the wagon, votes were spread thinly so I didn't want to screw up with some shot in the dark against someone else.
You didn't take rayn his advice. rayn went to noon and you kept telling the thread to lynch Tubesock? Why did you want to lynch him?
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I took rayn's advice regarding holding off on the VA vote until D2.
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fuck tuesdays.
I guess we lynch Tubesock. I don't think there's any way around it
##vote tubesock
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On January 13 2016 03:49 slOosh wrote:
Like, if we all agree that darthfoley is scum, then it seems like the right play to lynch him first. I think him flipping scum would be strong enough to exonerate Tubesock, despite the redcheck, given how D1 voting played out.
Am I making sense?
I had darthfoley as scummy for quite some time. Haven't been able to read his filter since EOD1, though. Will take a look tomorrow to see what I think about that.
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On January 13 2016 04:13 nooniansoong wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2016 04:07 slOosh wrote:On January 13 2016 03:54 nooniansoong wrote:On January 09 2016 17:13 darthfoley wrote:
For me, I am mainly am just confused as to why he's been reluctant to back off Sloosh after saying he wouldn't target active townspeople on day 1. Maybe he strictly means he won't vote for active townspeople but still target them in discussion, though his grilling of Sloosh followed by a pivot towards a poster with no history seems out of place and too random for my liking. He cites "terrible" reasons that he probably won't remember in the morning, which basically provides no information about anything at all. Why couldn't he include at least an outline of something relevant?
like just read that.. scum can't fake a thought process like that. I dunno that post is weird because the timeline is actually Koshi & others thought slOosh was weird --> slOosh gets annoyed and gets more active --> Koshi backs off after seeing this Whereas darthfoley's interpretation is something like Koshi & others thought slOosh was weird (but still active) --> Koshi should be backing off but isn't the way i see it is darth think sloosh was active enough already when koshi started in on him and so koshi's pressure looked fake. then he didn't like the "pivot" koshi did to an inactive poster. It has nothing to do with the timeline you are presenting. I woudl be super super impressed with darthfoley was mafia, just because I never see mafia coming up with weird cases like. Tubesock as for your mafia abilities, I suspect you were towned for a megapost/tinfoil which is not what I'm basing my townread on here.
I thought that post was scummy. Doesn't really matter to me whether he thought sloosh was active enough already or he misinterpreted koshi's posts.
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On January 13 2016 07:17 Koshi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2016 06:44 GiygaS wrote:
I'm a little bit weirded out that widen refused to believe my cop claim until everybody else did Who the fuck is widen?
Eden, autocorrect is cruel.
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Can we get confirmation that farmer can target mafia to make it look like town?
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why nvm i want to know lol.
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darthfoley called me possible mafia. Awesome. Of course I am mafia on who mafia boxerfred showed face on with his fake as shit case, and then I ended up on boxerfred instead of any other guy I could have picked.
He even claims that if I am mafia, Tubesock is town, which is entirely the most retarded thing ever because if I am mafia bussing, I probably want to do that to save my more active buddy or w.e.
This is such a bullshit association to make. Insane. Just fucking insane. If I join rayn (which I super easily could have done) we would have lynched Kush. Or is he also my mafia buddy?
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Fuck. That wall of text is just rehearsing what has been said and some really dumb shit. The guy believes Eden is locked town and all others are suspicious? If anybody is suspicious it is Eden. Doing fucking nothing.
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wtf has Eden done except attack confrimed town with Sloosh and Giygas? Or for some fucking reason been unable to take a hard stance on the redcheck ???
Explain me that.
Eden is somebody who solves games. Not some insecure pussy not being able to make up his goddamn mind.
If you think he is lock town. You are bad.
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EPT
