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Active: 8304 users

Why are English casts so "newb" in comparison?

Forum Index > Closed
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HardMacro
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Canada361 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-26 01:51:43
January 26 2012 01:01 GMT
#1
So I found out a week ago that I will no longer be buying a GSL pass next season, as I can watch all GSL/KSL/GTSL/etc. vods with Chinese commentary on youku.com, the Chinese version of youtube. I haven't gone back to the GOMTV casts since, even though the quality is better and the loading is faster.

The reason? Skill level of the English commentary is AWFUL in comparison to commentaries in many other languages. Korean roommates tell me that the Korean commentators in SC2 are actually pretty damn good not too far behind BW commentators, and my Russian roommate tells me the level of Russian casts are usually much higher as well.

Personally, I find the Chinese commentaries to be better and preferable as well. The Chinese dual-casts usually breaks down as follows (percentages as estimates to convey my point):

+ Show Spoiler +
20% joking/poking fun at players/not being serious

10% player introduction

10% fillers/simply stating what's happening on screen

10% game result predictions

50% in-depth analysis of builds/timings/etc.



English casts break-down in comparison:

+ Show Spoiler +
20% joking/poking fun at players/not being serious

10% player introduction

40% fillers/simply stating what's happening on screen

10% game result predictions

20% in-depth analysis of builds/timings/etc.



Essentially, it all comes down to this; I can turn off the sounds/commentary from English casts and safety know I won't miss a thing from simply watching and not listening, whereas in Chinese casts I am constantly enlightened by the insightful observations/analysis of the commentators.

I know there have been discussions regarding specific English commentators, but overall I feel this is an issue that needs to be addressed. How did the situation arise? Are the English commentators just bad in comparison with poor game knowledge, does the English-speaking audience prefer this "easy-going", "state what's happening" type of commentary, or are the commentators simply delivering a product to suit the skill level of the intended audience?

Poll: Do you think English casts should focus more on in-depth analysis?

Yes (200)
 
83%

No (41)
 
17%

241 total votes

Your vote: Do you think English casts should focus more on in-depth analysis?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No



Poll: Do you prefer English casts or casts in another language?

I only know English (43)
 
48%

English casts, I speak more than just English (40)
 
44%

Casts in another language (Please specify) (7)
 
8%

90 total votes

Your vote: Do you prefer English casts or casts in another language?

(Vote): English casts, I speak more than just English
(Vote): Casts in another language (Please specify)
(Vote): I only know English




Edit:

On January 26 2012 10:21 willoc wrote:
Question: Are the Chinese and Russian casts live like the English ones?


Yes, before the GSL games start they are in the lobby as observers.

On January 26 2012 10:15 cosine wrote:
lol i like how you try to support your argument with made up numbers. grow up.


It's something I've noticed for a while, and echo'ed by many peers. Simply putting it up for discussion here.

More backing claims:

+ Show Spoiler +
On January 26 2012 10:18 kukarachaa wrote:
I can vouch for Russian cast being absolutely amazing and way more entertaining than the English ones, its on par with tastetosis when it comes to humor and fun, but with way more knowledge about the game, considering all the casters are in GM.


+ Show Spoiler +
On January 26 2012 10:16 AndAgain wrote:
I can confirm that Russian casts tend to be better than English ones. (Unfortunately, it's hard to find them because I don't know how to read Russian well.)


[quote]On January 26 2012 10:20 ggrrg wrote:
You can't generalize "English casts". There are so many people casting in English and the differences between them are huge.

I'm sorry if I seem to be over-generalizing as I probably am, but on the whole I think most English casters offer less in-depth analysis than most Chinese/Russian/Korean/etc. casters.


Also, poll replaced.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ saving this here because I use it, don't know how to make it, and don't know it's name
Scrandom
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada2819 Posts
January 26 2012 01:03 GMT
#2
I do enjoy watching casts in my own language but you are right, sometimes I would prefer to hear some knowledge about the game itself
Karthane
Profile Joined June 2010
United States1183 Posts
January 26 2012 01:03 GMT
#3
Considering the majority of us aren't fluent in Chinese or Russian, we don't really have much to compare to.
gogogadgetflow
Profile Joined March 2010
United States2583 Posts
January 26 2012 01:07 GMT
#4
I like my english casts how they are and I'm a little surprised to hear that the chinese casters go more in depth than english casters actually -. And I voted for english casts because I can understand english, though watching sc2 commentated in another language is fine as well.
green.at
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Austria1459 Posts
January 26 2012 01:07 GMT
#5
german casts are much worse than english ones, but PLEASE PLEASE casters of the world, we (read: I) want more analysis. Thats why i love homestory cups, all the pro's just know what I want to hear.
Inputting special characters into chat should no longer cause the game to crash.
piplup
Profile Joined April 2011
117 Posts
January 26 2012 01:08 GMT
#6
It's because everyone's trying to copy/one up tastosis
TotalBiscuit
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United Kingdom5437 Posts
January 26 2012 01:11 GMT
#7
On January 26 2012 10:08 piplup wrote:
It's because everyone's trying to copy/one up tastosis


We really aren't
CommentatorHost of SHOUTcraft Clan Wars- http://www.mlg.tv/shoutcraft
Sumahi
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
Guam5609 Posts
January 26 2012 01:11 GMT
#8
On January 26 2012 10:08 piplup wrote:
It's because everyone's trying to copy/one up tastosis


I agree with this, I think alot of casters are trying to be popular and liked, more than come off as smart or communicate about the game indepth. That being said I enjoy the lightheartedness of most English casters, and so the Tastosis style of lots of silly jokes has its place as well. It is unfortunate though how that tends to set the trend for others. On GomTV.net so many of the complaints from people that I see are about other casters simply not being like Tastotis.
Startale <3, ST_July <3, HongUn <3, Savior <3, Gretorp <3, Nada <3, Rainbow <3, Ret <3, Squirtle <3, Bomber <3
Leviwtf
Profile Joined October 2010
174 Posts
January 26 2012 01:12 GMT
#9
People want different things from a cast, some people want in depth analysis and strategy talk, others want to get excited and just let the game be enjoyable to watch. Its impossible for a caster to appeal to everyone.

It would be interesting if you got hard data on this, for example in a cast of 10 minutes how many actual seconds is spent on each of your categories? The percentages you wrote are somewhat out of thin air and very dependent on the particular caster.
TALegion
Profile Joined October 2010
United States1187 Posts
January 26 2012 01:12 GMT
#10
If possible changing the second poll would probably be preferable.
I'm rather sure that most TL posters don't have the option to have any casting other than English, so it will get some pretty misleading results (if you're trying to make a point).
A person willing to die for a cause is a hero. A person willing to kill for a cause is a madman
shabby
Profile Joined March 2010
Norway6402 Posts
January 26 2012 01:14 GMT
#11
I kind of agree. There needs to be more analysis and less joking around. It's great that two co-casters have good chemistry and are good friends, but we don't need to hear about your daily activities in every single cast. If something important happens, please comment on it! This goes especially for the early game, where it seems that many casters have just deemed it as a downtime. Sure, commenting on the first SCVs built isn't that rewarding, but don't let the "downtime" last into minute 4-5, when builds are actually forming.
Jaedong, Gumibear, Leenock, Byun
killerdog
Profile Joined February 2010
Denmark6522 Posts
January 26 2012 01:14 GMT
#12
I think the problem with english casters is twofold, firstly, alot of them arn't actually good enough at the game/follow the trends which are happening at the top level closely enough to say something like "because this fifth unit is a stalker rather then a sentry, we are seeing blink into dt" or something like that. Alot of the casters in the foreign community are just essentially diamond/masters players who just talk about what is happening on the screen. The people who are actually capable of giving high level insightful commentary, such as artosis and day9, are clearly trying to gear their commentary to a less hardcore audience, as day9's dailies are mostly to help newer players, and the gsl is clearly (in my opinion) not meant to be watched by the high diamond players trying to make masters, but by the silver leaguers and their non playing friends.

If you watch artosis's stream (or the vods, he hasn't streamed since his kid was born) you can see how in depth he can go with his commentary, its just not that exciting for the casual viewer and requires quite alot of knowledge to understand.
Gosi
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
Sweden9072 Posts
January 26 2012 01:14 GMT
#13
Korean casters > all. Tastosis can be pretty funny and make some good calls but just the energy and hype the korean casters bring (in BW at least, never seen a cast with koreans in sc2 ) makes up for the stuff you don't understand. But after a while you still kinda get what they are saying because of the names of the unit, spells and what you see on the screen.

And most english casters don't do in-depth analysis just because they can't. They are just to bad at the game itself. :/
[13:40] <Qbek> gosi i dreanmt about you
YpnotiS
Profile Joined March 2011
France163 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-26 01:16:54
January 26 2012 01:14 GMT
#14
Well, i can only understand French (maternal language) and English...
French casters are usually bad (imo), but sometimes I watch it because I'm tired of English. So, I can only say that I prefer English casts even there are better casts in other languages (and I would watch them if I can).. Your second poll is not good imo.

I am for more knowledge and in-depth commentaries.


edit: I would add there are many programers who provide sometimes amazing casting with a real big knowledge of the game (HSC casts by example, some of them really amazing)
cosine
Profile Joined September 2011
313 Posts
January 26 2012 01:15 GMT
#15
lol i like how you try to support your argument with made up numbers. grow up.
kaisr
Profile Joined October 2007
Canada715 Posts
January 26 2012 01:16 GMT
#16
not sure about sc2, but the first time i watched a korean BW VOD with subtitles I learned an insane amount of new stuff even though I had been ICCUPing for around a year and was C
AndAgain
Profile Joined November 2010
United States2621 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-26 01:20:03
January 26 2012 01:16 GMT
#17
I can confirm that Russian casts tend to be better than English ones. (Unfortunately, it's hard to find them because I don't know how to read Russian well.)

On January 26 2012 10:08 piplup wrote:
It's because everyone's trying to copy/one up tastosis


Yeah, that's really true. Everybody is trying way too hard to be funny. Even Tastosis over do it.
All your teeth should fall out and hair should grow in their place!
kukarachaa
Profile Joined February 2011
United States284 Posts
January 26 2012 01:18 GMT
#18
I can vouch for Russian cast being absolutely amazing and way more entertaining than the English ones, its on par with tastetosis when it comes to humor and fun, but with way more knowledge about the game, considering all the casters are in GM.
ggrrg
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
Bulgaria2717 Posts
January 26 2012 01:20 GMT
#19
You can't generalize "English casts". There are so many people casting in English and the differences between them are huge.
I'd agree that a wide range of casters seem boring/superficial/lack knowledge etc. However, Day[9] is top notch and I'm certain that his casting skills at least match those of other Chinese/Korean pro casters. Pretty much the same goes for Artosis. Not to mention that there are a bunch of English casters, who might not be overly analytical but still provide an extremely pleasant viewing experience.

btw German casters are terrible... Khaldor used to be very enjoyable in German, but nowadays he pretty much casts only in English.
Zooper31
Profile Joined May 2009
United States5714 Posts
January 26 2012 01:20 GMT
#20
As much as I love Korean commentaries I prefer a language I actually understand.

I wouldn't change anything about Tastosis and half the reason I tune in is for their jokes and banter between each other.
Asato ma sad gamaya, tamaso ma jyotir gamaya, mrtyor mamrtam gamaya
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