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[G] aXa's ZvZ, Ladder Season 3

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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aXa
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
France748 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-06 15:47:20
August 14 2011 02:12 GMT
#1
Introduction

Hey guy's, it's me again. Maybe you'll remember the beloved 9 pool ZvZ build, or even the really avant-gardist Ling/bling/infestor ZvP style i wrote down 5 month ago.
Season 3 is up for several weeks now, and my 9 pool build is no longer that effective because of the new map pool. It forced me to use a more conventional style on large map. Anyway, don't expect to find in this thread an innovative build like i used to do, but a more refined 9 pool build and guide, as well as a revisited hatch first style, with an emphasize on the map and unit usage. Nothing crazy, but going in depth over some stuff could certainly improve your ZvZ, which is all about capitalizing on little edge to create an huge one.
I'm still doing quite good in ZvZ, fairly even in ZvT, and awfully bad in ZvP. It caused me a lot of frustration and i'm actually angry at the simple idea of laddering. This mindset is a motivation writing this guide to me, because i will focus on the game i like: Tight build, sharp timing, and macro-oriented game-play. Of course ZvZ does not uprise balance issues so we can certainly focus on the "Playing better than my opponent" than simply "Trying to survive the imba-cheese/turtling my opponent throwing at me every f**** game by being utterly gimmicky" This to be said, let's begin by taking a look at the map pool.


Map pool

My veto:

+ Show Spoiler +
Searing Crater: This map sucks so hard in ZvP and ZvT
Abyssal Cavern: This map sucks so hard in ZvP and ZvT
Backwater Gulch: Lol.

9 pool:

+ Show Spoiler +
Shakuras Plateau
Shattered Temple
Xel naga Cavern

Hatch first:

+ Show Spoiler +
Tal'Darim Altar
Antiga Shipyard
Nezarim Crypt
Typhoon Peaks


I think it's pretty clear why each map goes to each strategy, but i will clarify anyway: You can't expect to do damage or to scout in time on some large map, and there is a lot of large map this season.
Let's begin with the bread and butter 9 pool build

9 pool my love


The build

+ Show Spoiler +
9/10: Pool
10/10: 1st Overlord
10/18: 3 Sets of zergling
13/18: 1st Queen
15/18: 2 Drones
17/18: 2nd Overlord
19/18: 2nd Queen with extractor trick
1st larvae inject

First set of thoughts:
At exactly 3:23 in game time, is the time where you have to do 4 things simultaneously, within 4 in game sec:
-Produce another queen asap with the tight 150 mineral
-Produce an extractor, don't cancel it
-Inject asap as your first queen pop out
-Control your 6 ling and kill as much stuff as possible
In my previous thread, we had a controversy about 11/10 drone extractor trick. You can in fact squeeze another drone, but it will delay your 3rd zergling by a bit and quite mess out the timing. I tried the 11/10 trick for 2 weeks and i dropped 10% of my winrate or so, so i don't recommend it.


16/26: 6 Drones 2nd larvae inject
22/26: 3rd Queen

Second set of thoughts:
With your second queen, immediately plant a creep tumor to creep unto your ramp. Don't go asap with your 2 queens to wall off your ramp. Depending on the map and how your opponent managed your 6 initial zergling, you'll not be there in time and you can die to a large zergling counter. The safe way is to sit back in your base and defend in your mineral line until you get a third queen and creep coverage.

24/26: 1 Roach warren. Put 3 drone in gas 3rd larvae inject
23/26: 3 Drones
26/26: 3rd and 4th Overlord


Third set of thoughts:
When the 3rd larvae inject is done, you can finally go wall up your ramp. Be sure to put 3 drones in gas before making the roach warren, you'll see you can't do both simultaneously because after building your third queen, you won't have enough minerals left to do it for something like 5 more sec.

26/42: 4 to 7 roaches
36/42: 1 Expand
35/42: Lair
35/42: 2nd Extractor
34/42: Evolution chamber
33/42: 7 Drones
40/42: 5th Overlord


Fourth set of thoughts:
The amount of roach you'll have to do depends heavily on what your opponent is doing. I will talk later about scouting with overlord, but be sure to always follow this rule: If you don't see an expansion before yours, delay your Lair and your evolution chamber and make extra roaches, up to 7. The longer you don't see an expand, the more roach you'll have to make. Don't forget that queen tranfuse is the key to any all in. Let your roaches down the ramp in order to protect your currently building natural, but don't go too far and let your queen block the ramp until it's done.

42/42: +1 range attack upgrade
46/52: Roach speed and 6th overlord
52/52: Stop drone production, start Roach production with overlord.
84/84: +2 range attack upgrade


Final set of thoughts:
-Your expand should start at 6:10 and finish at 7:50 inject immediately and drone transfer
-Your lair start at 6:50
-Your +1 range attack at 7:40
-Your roach speed start at 8:15
-Your roach production start at 8:55
-Your roach timing move out around 10:20, as well as +2 range
You need exactly 32 drones in order to perform this timing well. It means 26 drones at mineral duty, 6 at gas. be sure to have no more than 16 drone at your main and around 10 at your expand to saturate them correctly.


General goals and thoughts

I'm fond of words, even in english, hence this part will describe the build in a broad fashion.
First i'd like to say that 9 pool is not a cheesy build by any mean. You have a clear follow up, and the early pool is here to apply pressure.
The initial pressure will give you a lead, a lead you will secure by playing extremely defensive thereafter.
After a short amount of dronage, you'll have the economy to get aggressive by pulling out a nice timing, using roach speed and +1 missile upgrade. This timing is extremely deadly but is not an all-in either: You'll have an upgrade lead (+2 on the way when your hits your opponent's base) and a solid drone count.
Now, why it is so effective? Certainly not because of the clear superiority of the build. First, you have a clear plan, you know exactly what to produce and when to produce it. Second, you are the pace-maker of the game: You dictate what your opponent has to do, because of the 6 initial ling AND the roach timing, which lead us to the third point:
Third, your opponent has to make no mistakes, just in order to survive. He let you kill too many drones? Game over. He overreacted and produced too many ling instead of drone? Game over. He tried a silly all-in because he felt he was behind? Poor guy, get some confidence, and some pride too. He overdroned and has no army when your fierce roach army knock to his door? Don't even GG.
Of course, the higher your league is, lower are the chance that he will screw up. In master league, you can expect 80 to 90% win rate on the 9 pool map.

Scouting: Knowledge is power

Besides, having a nice overlord spread makes you look like a boss

Of course this part will only concern the 3 9 pool maps i mentioned before.

Xel naga:

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

Overlord 1 will allow you to scout if any 9 pool is coming (Right when he passes near the west watch tower) He will not arrive into your opponents natural before the 6 lings, so be sure to quickly check if there is any hatch first with them. Right when he plants his expand down, move your 1st overlord to his third. You don't want to lose any overlord in a tight build like this.
Overlord 2 and 3 will help you to spot any kind of army movement all game long, And will help you to react accordingly when it comes to larvae management: (To drone or not to drone, that is the question.)
Overlord 4 is quite important: He will pop right around the time you'll go down your ramp with roaches and expand. The first spot will allow you to see any zergling going around and deal with them in an easier way. When your creep cover this area, send him over the brushes to spot any baneling-zergling shenanigans.
Overlord 5 will help you to spot any sneaky expand in this area, or muta if it comes to this.
I could go on with the next overlords, but they are not as critical as the 5 firsts. Spread them over each base and along the attack paths and you'll be fine.


Shakuras Plateau:

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

Assuming you are spawning in the bottom left and your opponent in the top right position. Just transpose the whole thing if the spawning are different.
Overlord 1 will tell you in time where your opponent is, and thus you'll be able to go straight with your ling to his base. You'll have a quick look at his build too. Can't hurt!
Redirect him to the natural, then at his third when it goes down.
Overlord 2 3 4 5 will give you a whole sight of the only attack path of the map.


Shattered Temple:

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

Assuming you spawn at bottom left and your opponent at top right, which is as bad as you can get.
Overlord 1 will quickly spot if your opponent is in close air position, then redirect him to the top natural. Again, when it goes down, send him to the third.
Right after building Overlord 2, send a drone (at 10 supply) to the close ground position to see if your opponent is there or not. If he is not (like in the drawing) then redirect your Overlord 2 accordingly. If he is, redirect your overlord 1. Sounds tricky but it's quite logical in the end.


Responding to your opponent build

Early game

-Your opponent will likely go 80% of the time to a standard speedling first build. In this case, target the drone and kill a maximal amount of them before the first sets of ling pops.
-If your opponent goes for hatch first, target the hatch until he cancels it, then go kill some drone, or zergling if they are already out.
-If your opponent goes for a 9 pool or an earlier one, he will likely go for an all in. You'll have the edge: You have a queen to defend yourself, just make sure to build extra ling in base and cancel his spinecrawler.
-If your opponent goes for a 11 pool or so, kill as much ling as you can. Don't send your queen too soon at your ramp, wait for the roaches.

Mid game

There are different types of reaction that your opponent will do, only one is correct and will lead both of you to late game, the others will give you an auto-win if you read it correctly.

1: Your opponent is massing zergling on 1 or 2 base and will try to counter attack you. Make sure to build extra roaches before lair and you'll be fine. Some dudes will try to baneling bust you. Laugh hard at them !

2: Your opponent is going a middle-ish way of unit, dronage and expansion. This is the type of reaction you have to expect the most. And the easier to win. When your timing has arrived, you will out number him in roach count, while he will have 5 extra drone compared to you. Insta win.

3: Your opponent handle your 9 pool well and is totally fine expanding and droning like a mad men, because he knows you won't attack him before 10 min mark. AND he is not overdroning and keep up with your roach count. When you see a roach count that you can't beat (don't forget to check upgrades, +1 is magic back up and produce 14 extra drones, in order to saturate your natural and take the 2 extra gas. You are now in the late stage of the game, do whatever you're used to in order to win that part

Unit control

6 zergling

A good player will try to surround your ling with drone using the mineral trick. Don't let your zerglings unmicroed and die stupidly.
When the drone mineral trick is done, right click away from the drone
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

Then A click on the ground
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

And get the job done.
When you have 1 or 2 zergling left, target very badly injured drone to get extra kills. It goes really fast so act like a badass zerg !

Roaches

Your initial roaches need to stay down your ramp close to your natural in order to defend any kind of attempt to cancel your expand.
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

But don't go too far from your queens or you'll die. Without transfuses, this battle is over:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]

Don't forget to get a good concave against your opponent roach army as well.The trick i use the most is to form a straight line while marching through the map, then right click beneath the opponent roach army to get a good positioning for the battle.
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Replays

Some fresh replays available. On my old thread, you can find a bunch more of them.
[url blocked]

[url blocked]



Hatch first

General thoughts

Hatch first is by far the best build on large map. They are safe enough to survive any 1 base play as long as you know what you are doing. There is no unique build following the hatch first, but different types of reaction who will allow you to survive through early and mid game. Thus i will not describe the build like i did for the 9 pool, but rather speak in a broad way about what to do. I'm a macro guy, hence my hatch first style is a reactive style. Some guy's will do a zergling all-in after an hatch first, others will go right into roaches. My way of dealing with it is to scout a lot, figure out what my opponent is doing, and reacting to it. The really interesting part of this hatch first guide will be my tactical use of units.

Spawning position

Quick summary about scouting: Send a drone at 13 food, use your first overlord to scout a main, send your drone to another one until you found him.
-If you do scout a one base play: Plant your pool and your extractor at 14 food right away.
-If your opponent is going hatch first in "close" position: at 15.
-If your opponent is going hatch first in cross position: Plant extractor and pool at 16 food.
(Get speed asap)
Then, produce 6 ling, use 2 to scout his base and 4 to defend yours

Reacting in early game

The 2 initial scouting ling will give you enough intel to make a first choice.
-If you see no drone at his natural, speed on the way, no gas mining, then he is certainly going for a speedling all in. Come back to your base, plant a baneling nest, a spinecrawler at his expand and start zergling production. When you have some baneling, consider starting a roach warren.
-if you see a roach warren, plant your roach warren and adopt a passive attitude (some roach, lot of drone)
-if you see a spinecrawler: Time to drone man, this guy is not attacking you any time soon.
Assure yourself that he is in fact going for what you thought he was in the first place. Start sending a zergling every 30 in game seconds at his base. It will give you a clear indication when to drone and when to make unit. If you survived the 10 min mark, then it is time to shine in the mid game.

Mid game plan

In the mid game, i use simple rules. Together, they shape my mid game plan. On one gas, i get speedling then +1 range, then my Lair. No need to know any kind of food number, your gas income is your time marker.
When your Lair is started, take all your gas. The aim is to saturate each base with 22 drone (16 at minerals, 6 in gas)
Start your third when Lair is halfway done.
Begin your infestation pit as your Lair is done. Start pumping roach until your third is done.
When your third is done, produce 22 more drone, saturate it (take the 2 extra gases asap). Make a macro hatch. This round of drone and the extra hatchery will allow you to produce 5ish infestors while keeping your money low.
Make a second evolution chamber, you should be upgrading +2 range and +1 armor right now.
When infestors are done, it's time to attack !

Being a true zerg

Being a true zerg implies to be a a vicious guy who knows what unit to do and how to use them.

Using Roaches
+ Show Spoiler +
Ah ah i love useless pics[image loading]

Backbone if your army, they are here to take hits while other units make the difference.
Every zerg unit have a sneaky mode. As the game goes on, i suggest you to research burrow and burrow movement. Take several squad of 4 roaches each, go sneak behind mineral lines and watch your opponent cries. Nothing much more to say about them.

Using Infestors
+ Show Spoiler +
Damn, they won't allow me more than 25 upload a day

Surprisingly, a lot of player don't really know how to use them, including me few weeks ago. Are you one of those who fungal randomly pack of roaches? Don't lie to me, i know you do. Roach die in 3 fungal (or close to). Fungaling the whole army one time has no point at all. The key is to fungal a pack of roaches 3 times in a row. If you have 6 fungals available, you can fungal 2 packs at a time, etc. Sometimes, the positioning will allow you to fungal a pack of roaches that will prevent this roaches (or the other behind it) to reach your army. It's called Fungal Field, thank you Destiny, you sick nerd infestor user !
The sneaky mode of the infestor is cool as well: Burrow and sneak into an expand. Some guy's will fungal the drone, i'd rather spawn infested terran to kill the expand as well.

Using Hydralisks

In a late game scenario, usually before getting greater spire, you want to add some of those guy to your roach army. Some hydralisks behind your roaches will do tremendous damage. Nothing new here, beside the timing of the hydra den. Don't consider going for them before having 6 extractors running. Otherwise, Hydra are bad, they don't even have a sneaky mode.

Using Zergling

Zergling. Zergling zergling zergling. Didn't you guys know? This guys are so much underused. Sometimes, a good draw worth ten times a long speech !
+ Show Spoiler +
God i love page ![image loading]

You are the blue guy, your opponent is yellow. (If he is really Yellow, just ragequit)
This situation represent a ZvZ around the time where you have 3 bases each, and when your infestors pop out.(Remember when i said "Time to attack!" ?)

The blue and and yellow rectangles represent your roach infestor army clashing with his roach infestor army. Meanwhile, your zergling squad (around 30) represented by a triangle, is used to deny the third. As you can see, your opponent can't defend it because he is engaged with your roach army. Zergling are like cavalery: Their high mobility should be used 1: As flank 2: Even better, at harassing were your opponent is not. Won me countless of ZvZ.

Another example on Antiga Shipyard
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Zerglings are sneaky. So sneaky.
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Replays

[url blocked]

VOD
TheDeconstructionist [ 0 posts | Profile | Buddy | Report ]
Subject: A VOD of your 9pool build (badly executed, though)
Date: 8/17/11 17:53

Just in case you're interested, Day9 casted a VOD where I did your build: http://blip.tv/day9tv/ahgl-google-vs-amazon-game-2-week-7-starcraft-2-5471568

It ended up as a strange game since I didn't expect an early pool from the opponent, and I was a little paranoid and waited too long with the expansion (and got an unnecessary spine crawler after scouting no expo from the other Zerg) but the idea was there, and it worked ;-)

(Also I didn't get much sleep, since I'm playing from EU in US night hours, which generally doesn't help)

Cheers on developing such an unorthodox and refined build,
-- Decon


Definitely check http://blip.tv/day9tv/ahgl-google-vs-amazon-game-2-week-7-starcraft-2-5471568 ! Thx to Decon
It gave me the idea of making a VOD-guide of the build myself, but i have no idea how to make such a thing. Would someone with the required skill help me out?

Damn, i forgot the [G] ! Can i correct that?

Blog

http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=283121
Slumph
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United Kingdom52 Posts
August 14 2011 02:25 GMT
#2
Great write up, surprised there's no comments yet. Didn't read every bit but skim read, however got a pretty good overview and I'm gunna bookmark this and probably read it at a more sensible time.

Keep fighting the good fight for E-Sports <3 also do you mind linking your bnet profile?
We spend our lives not taking chances so that we can make it safely to death.
aXa
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
France748 Posts
August 14 2011 02:26 GMT
#3
Hey, i just posted that (and still editing it) so no surprise about the lack of comments ^^ Stupid question, but how do you link your bnet profile?
J_D
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States102 Posts
August 14 2011 02:44 GMT
#4
Excellent guide! I really like the clear plan to go into the mid game and the overlord scouting diagrams. The first 9-pool guide that you made several months ago seems to work great for me in ZvP, being anywhere from a build order win if they do a greedy FFE to being basically even. However, in ZvZ i just can't seem to do enough damage with the first 6 zerglings, and then my opponent gets zergling speed so much earlier than me, which I have a hard time dealing with.

Obviously some sort of 9pool business would completely fail vs terran, but I wonder if there are any similar early pressure strats that would actually work vs terran in the first 5mins (that aren't allin).
Soluhwin
Profile Joined October 2010
United States1287 Posts
August 14 2011 02:47 GMT
#5
On August 14 2011 11:44 J_D wrote:
Excellent guide! I really like the clear plan to go into the mid game and the overlord scouting diagrams. The first 9-pool guide that you made several months ago seems to work great for me in ZvP, being anywhere from a build order win if they do a greedy FFE to being basically even. However, in ZvZ i just can't seem to do enough damage with the first 6 zerglings, and then my opponent gets zergling speed so much earlier than me, which I have a hard time dealing with.

Obviously some sort of 9pool business would completely fail vs terran, but I wonder if there are any similar early pressure strats that would actually work vs terran in the first 5mins (that aren't allin).

Umm... the 7RR is still alive and kicking. Other than that I'm not sure if there is.
happy birthday, by the way.
I put the sexy in dyslexia.
J_D
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States102 Posts
August 14 2011 02:50 GMT
#6
On August 14 2011 11:47 Soluhwin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 14 2011 11:44 J_D wrote:
Excellent guide! I really like the clear plan to go into the mid game and the overlord scouting diagrams. The first 9-pool guide that you made several months ago seems to work great for me in ZvP, being anywhere from a build order win if they do a greedy FFE to being basically even. However, in ZvZ i just can't seem to do enough damage with the first 6 zerglings, and then my opponent gets zergling speed so much earlier than me, which I have a hard time dealing with.

Obviously some sort of 9pool business would completely fail vs terran, but I wonder if there are any similar early pressure strats that would actually work vs terran in the first 5mins (that aren't allin).

Umm... the 7RR is still alive and kicking. Other than that I'm not sure if there is.
happy birthday, by the way.



I know the 7RR, along with some variants of it has the potential to do some damage vs terran, but I feel that vs someone very good (high masters - grandmaster) it just wouldn't do enough damage to not fall behind (especially if the terran scouted anything unusual, like no 15 hatch or zergling speed research).
aXa
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
France748 Posts
August 14 2011 02:54 GMT
#7
Hey J_D, try to stricly follow the 9 pool build, and you'll see it is great in ZvZ
Xanbatou
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States805 Posts
August 14 2011 03:04 GMT
#8
AxA, I always love your posts .

Anyways, I still use your 9pool build in both ZvP and ZvZ. I still seem to think it's effective on the new maps o.O. You can often scout your opponent in time to direct your zerglings. The only map that it's not good on is taldarim, because it is so big. On taldarim, I use a special all-in revolving around baneling speed if I see a FE.
mumpfel
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany52 Posts
August 14 2011 11:25 GMT
#9
thx for the guide, it is amazing and should get more attention!

few questions considering your 9pool:

1.) You said several times in your guide, that you do not have to wall-off with your 2 queens immediately. But if u see that the lings of your opponent will not make it in time you do make your walloff before they arrive, right?

2.) IF I(have to) let a few lings into my main, I always fear that he will attack my blocking queens from both sides and that i will not be able to hold. If the mainbase-area (?) is big enough like on shattered temple, they can easily run their lings aroung offcreep, so that your queens will not catch them. Did you experience that scenario? Is it possible to hold if the queens gets attacked from both sides? I always feel that sometimes it is even close if lings are attacking at your front only, so my queens would simply die if my scenario happens.

3) Isnt it more efficient, if you cancel your first extractor after you build your queen? I checked one of your Xelnaga replays and i think it would definitely be better, to cancel to extractor and then build it so that it is ready when you just want to put your drones into it. In the replay i watched, you did put down your extractor at 3:19 ingame time, but your drones started mining at 4:23. That means, you could build your extractor at 3:53 (extractor builds 30 ingame seconds long) and your gas mining would not be delayed. That again means, that you could have 1 drone mining longer for about 30 seconds - for the cost for one cancelled extractor, which is nearly nothing. What do you think about it?
aXa
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
France748 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-14 14:48:14
August 14 2011 14:45 GMT
#10
About the wall off, the main issue is that you'll need a second inject with one of your 2 initial queen, because your third is not out yet. It's dangerous to separate your queen (Like 1 at the wall, the other have to came back for injects) So its simply easier and safer to keep them both at your main until the inject is done.

Usually, zergling never really wandering in my main. They see the 2 queens and go back outside. If they stay in the main, don't wall off until your roach come out.

About the extractor, it is, but i'm used to this timing and i know if i cancel it i will forget to rebuild it in time, because you are quite busy after that. But feel free to find the right timing !


Can anyone help me about the [G] ? How i am supposed to edit it ?
zylog
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada943 Posts
August 14 2011 19:00 GMT
#11
Wow, this is a really nicely made guide. I really like the overlord path charts and the detailed instructions on how to micro and position the units.

This will be good for me as I'm struggling the most in my ZvZs, mostly due to not having a clear plan on how I want to play it. Thanks a lot for your work!
warblob004
Profile Joined January 2011
United States198 Posts
August 14 2011 19:06 GMT
#12
aXa you make laddering fucking awesome
"I have not failed; I've simply found 10,000 ways it won't work." ~Thomas Edison
mumpfel
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany52 Posts
August 14 2011 19:58 GMT
#13
I do not think you can add the [G] yourself, an admin has to do it.

Today i played some games with your 9pool and one time my opponent played the 11pool18hatch build, which is getting more popular (hi@destiny). Even though I do not think that it is a good build in zvz in general, i had the feeling that it is pretty much the counter to your 9pool strategy. Unfortunately i disconnected after the early game, but i felt i was really far behind. I was not able to do any economic damage and he was able to put down his expansion immediately after my lings were gone.

I have no idea how your push at the 10 minute mark will do anything if your opponent does not take a fast third and overdrones hardcore. He is expanding at 18 and you at 36 supply...

Any opinions?
levikus
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany19 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-08-14 20:32:10
August 14 2011 20:07 GMT
#14
aXa your ZvZ 9pool is plain awesome.
I do exact as you say and win a lot of games! But i have a suggestion: Hurry with the creepspread to your natural and put the evochamber at the bottom. Mass ling runbys are much easier to hold!
BlueLagoon
Profile Joined February 2011
France28 Posts
August 14 2011 20:55 GMT
#15
This guide is far better than the previous one. I'm glad to see some new explanations and all timing are quite perfect. This is not an easy build to do because of the 6 lings attack lead you to a defensive play with roaches and queens.

Well... I need to work on it, I like the way of thinking of this build.

Thx aXa, good write as usual! I'm back with some feedback asap.
tahiti
DrStoopid
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden45 Posts
August 14 2011 20:57 GMT
#16
I loved your last ZvZ guide, and this is even better. Great read!
Kirschke
Profile Joined December 2010
United States19 Posts
August 14 2011 21:12 GMT
#17
A great guide and is greatly appreciated thanks!
Kornholi0
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada634 Posts
August 14 2011 21:28 GMT
#18
I really like using infestors as my backbone of my army, which is why I like this write up, because you can save that 15 food worth of lings and make up for it with better fungals and deny/kill a 3rd. I do this plenty if I feel oddly aggressive in ZvZ, if not I just turtle up with a bunch of spines which allows me to defend the lings with roaches and kill his attack with infestors.
Team Channel: VTeX Team Co-leader: AGGhost 223 Stream: http://www.twitch.tv/agghost
Joey Wheeler
Profile Joined July 2011
Korea (North)276 Posts
August 14 2011 23:40 GMT
#19
I tried doing this for a while, but it simply gets hard countered by speedling expand builds. The earlier hatch and the fact you're only expanding after you get roaches means you're both safe and economically ahead.
Ingenol
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States1328 Posts
August 15 2011 03:47 GMT
#20
Do you have any replays of the 9 pool build correctly executed? I downloaded the replay pack but it was all 15-hatches. Thanks!
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