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Heimerdinger, the revered inventor
Heimer is a good pusher, good AoE damage dealer, good farmer, and very hard to gank/chase. You are not going to win teamfights on your own, but you can contribute.
Other Guides
Summoner spells: ghost/flash. Non-negotiable.
Masteries: 9 7 14. You could move points from offense into utility if you prefer.
Runes:
Quints: Flat HP or Magic Pen
Red: Magic Pen
Yellow: Mana per 5 per Level
Blue: Mana per 5 per Level
Skill Order: QWWEWR then W > R > Q > E -OR-, if you're getting fed, W > E > R > Q.
Item Build: Meki Pendant + Mana Pot + Health Pot (aggro) -OR- Doran's Ring + Mana Pot (passive) => Tear of the Goddess => Sorc Boots => Archangel's Staff => Zhonya's Ring. After this, play it by ear. More AP is the generic choice (void staff, RoA), but Rylai's, Abyssal, Guardian Angel, and Banshee's Veil are other options (Rylai's for anti-melee, Abyssal for anti-caster, GA for anti-carry, Veil for anti-cc).
Playstyle
Opening: Open with the passive items against a hard lane (usually Miss Fortune), and the aggro items against a soft lane (most opponents). The former option's additional life can be a big deal in tough matchups. Prefer middle lane, then solo top, then 1v2 top, then 2v2 bottom. Drop a turret about where your mage creeps will end up for the first wave ASAP. This is why you open turret: your mana will be regenerated by wave 1.
Early game: Focus on last hitting. Poking enemies with your wrench is great -- it has good range/damage for a caster attack. Skill order after Q at level 1 is WWEWR. Any time there are less than 3 opposing minions around, get in rocket range of the enemy champion(s) and use it -- it's great harass. Of course, you'll want to set this up in advance -- often when the melee creeps of a wave are dead and the ranged creeps being beating on each other you can sneak into position without the opponent noticing. Don't forget that someone low backing near their turret can be flashed onto, rocketed/grenaded to death, and then ghosted away from. On your first back, buy tear and boots. If you have spare money, buy wards. If the game is still stable, go grab golem before returning to lane. Golem buff is hugely powerful on Heimer. Your ult, once you have it, is used as it is throughout the game -- to save you from ganks. See below for more on this.
Chasing: Your summoner spells are all you've got. If someone is low, you may be able to ghost up to them, flash to them as they flee, and rocket them to death. It's very hard to land E on a running opponent from anything but point blank. If they don't see you coming, drop a turret on them and use your ultimate.
Being chased: Drop a turret, use your ultimate. As they go by it and are slowed, E them (easier to aim when they're slow and chasing you). Use your W, and KEEP RUNNING. They may be low, but there's nothing you can do now. Stay and they'll likely kill you. If they keep chasing, repeat this combo (though without your ult, it's harder to land E's stun) -- you'll usually get a kill. If there are multiple chasers, or they've evaded your E/R, use your summoner spells. Once in a blue moon, someone will survive the first combo, but be very low, and not run away. If you have your zhonya's up, you can sometimes lure them to your turret, then zhonya's, and let it finish them.
Team fighting: You have to make your skills count. Try to drop a turret where it can beat on someone. If they come after you, treat it as being chased (ult, E, W). If your opponents have a stationary power ult (Galio, Nunu, Kat), save your E -- you probably only get one per battle, so it has to count. Use rockets if there's a chance of hitting a squishy -- even hitting tanks with it will take a chunk off them, which isn't worthless, and this is the skill you're most likely to get to use twice. If there's no reason to save E, try to land it on a DPS carry -- even if you miss the stun, the blind on a DPS is a big deal. Finally, note that saving an ally leaving the fight and being chased is just like being chased yourself, and E is a great tool there. Typically, your ultimate is not worth using in team fights outside of the mid-fight and post-fight chasing scenarios. The exception is if you have a well placed turret beating on the other team, especially their squishies, but taking AoE and getting low -- using your ult to revitalize it can keep it outputting DPS
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United States47024 Posts
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Is Heimer still any good? I used to do really well with heimer until the 2 turret nerf.
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When the buff to turret AI is released, it should be good to get two points in turrets since your ult lets them prefer champions and getting two slows off is better then one.
If you insist on the 1 turret build I've found it's better to forgo R at level 6 in favor of another point in grenade, between masteries runes and blue buff you are close to max CDR already so missing the 10% isn't too huge and at this level the slow isn't huge for getting out of a gank since flash and ghost should be sufficient.
You should prefer solo top to mid since it's harder to gank you meaning you can farm your zhonyas faster.
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Hm, I thought that buff to turret AI hadn't gone through yet.
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United States47024 Posts
On November 10 2010 16:01 Jaksiel wrote:
Hm, I thought that buff to turret AI hadn't gone through yet.
IIRC it wasn't in the patch notes, so unless they chose not to mention it, it still hasn't gone through. Dan Dinh also said that he hasn't noticed the AI change, and he's played enough Heimer post-patch to have noticed if it went through.
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On November 10 2010 15:18 STS17 wrote:
Given the recent buff to turret AI, it is now good to get two points in turrets since your ult lets them prefer champions and getting two slows off is better then one.
If you insist on the 1 turret build I've found it's better to forgo R at level 6 in favor of another point in grenade, between masteries runes and blue buff you are close to max CDR already so missing the 10% isn't too huge and at this level the slow isn't huge for getting out of a gank since flash and ghost should be sufficient.
You should prefer solo top to mid since it's harder to gank you meaning you can farm your zhonyas faster.
Wha...?
If the other team is letting you get golem uncontested by level 6, well, great, but I wouldn't worry too much: you're pretty much going to win.
Slow is still helpful. It can save your summoners for escaping after a gank, or slow the enemy so a teammate can catch up (since Heimer isn't super-bursty, this is a big deal).
Solo top is easier to get ganked on. There's more brush, it's closer to the lane, the distance from tower to creeps is longer, and the lane is further from the rest of the map.This is why I go solo mid...
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On November 10 2010 22:47 oberon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 10 2010 15:18 STS17 wrote:
Given the recent buff to turret AI, it is now good to get two points in turrets since your ult lets them prefer champions and getting two slows off is better then one.
If you insist on the 1 turret build I've found it's better to forgo R at level 6 in favor of another point in grenade, between masteries runes and blue buff you are close to max CDR already so missing the 10% isn't too huge and at this level the slow isn't huge for getting out of a gank since flash and ghost should be sufficient.
You should prefer solo top to mid since it's harder to gank you meaning you can farm your zhonyas faster. Wha...? If the other team is letting you get golem uncontested by level 6, well, great, but I wouldn't worry too much: you're pretty much going to win. Slow is still helpful. It can save your summoners for escaping after a gank, or slow the enemy so a teammate can catch up (since Heimer isn't super-bursty, this is a big deal). Solo top is easier to get ganked on. There's more brush, it's closer to the lane, the distance from tower to creeps is longer, and the lane is further from the rest of the map.This is why I go solo mid...
I typically get blue at 5, though I don't play against the highest caliber of players, but if your jungler passes it off to you such that you only need to hit it with an auto-attack or rocket it's easy (and quick) to get at those levels.
Easier to get ganked top? There is more brush? There is one way into the lane (river) opposed to 4 (both river brushes and the side ways on your side) which need to be covered. Note: When I say # of ways in I mean number of ways which you don't expect enemies to come in from (i.e. you should expect enemies to be coming from the direction their tower is in).
Ok so there is the two top bushes as well but you shouldn't be pushing past them until you have zhonya's and/or blue anyways because you're alone and past them means past river means you're extremely vulnerable. You don't need to siege their tower as soon as possible, just chill and farm for a while then begin super pushing.
Also, it turns out I was incorrect, the AI improvement hasn't gone through yet. So I will rephrase it to "when the buff comes out" opposed to the current "given the recent buff." I haven't actually played Heimerdinger post-patch it was just an assumption.
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Updated guide to better match formats with other guides; updated some wording to make things clearer; included a link to DanDinh's guide.
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Marshall Islands3404 Posts
Asier is a good heimer too
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On November 12 2010 00:07 Brees wrote:
Asier is a good heimer too
Does he have a guide? I'd be happy to link to it. I'm not actually any good at LoL (though Heimer's one of my best characters) but we had no Heimer thread and I'd written a quick guide before, so I figured it was better than nothing. Top players' guides are much appreciated (though I still think DanDinh's is insane).
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Alright. A lot of talk recently about jungle heimer. Who's got the goods on how to pull it off as a successful troll?
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intrigue
Washington, D.C9933 Posts
bumpity bump! heimer was my favorite hero when i first started LoL, and many months later after running through the gamut of champions i found that i liked him the most still. what is the general consensus on him? i really like him in solo and AT queues, hogging mid. needless to say my experience is limited to newbie levels.
my setup:
i run 9/0/21, with 2 points in the buff mastery because i really focus on taking blues. i have mpen mp5 cdr runes with flat hp quints.
for items, i am mostly concerned about sustainability in lane. i open blue crystal + 2 health pots, going back at 1250ish for catalyst and level 1 boots. i buy a shitload of wards so i can watch for blue buffs being taken and avoid getting ganked. i go back for sorc boots, nlr and zhonya's as my first item. catalyst becomes a banshee's if necessary, otherwise a RoA. then the crazy witch hat. for some reason i hate meki pendant, and think archangel's isn't that great at all. i don't understand why heimers love it so much.
questions:
first, what do good players think of teleport/ghost? i understand the LOL of it on a lot of heroes, but on a hard pushing hero it seems very strong. the combination of turrets + teleport means that the opponent mid is hard-pressed to find time to go back and gank the side lanes. once i get blue buff for the first time (usually the second time it spawns) it takes their full attention just to keep their tower up. it is extremely rare for my team to lose a tower first, and i usually take down mid tower by 15 minutes. playing from there i teleport around and take down other towers.
a concern i see a lot is how heimer is very poor at ganking, but if the other team has a lane pushed, it very simple to go with your jungler, drop 2 turrets behind them, ult and just spam away. the faster grenade travel speed makes it a lot easier to land stuns, and w is just sick anyway. i usually go for a gank around first blue buff. there is less opportunity cost in heimer ganks, too, because your turrets farm for you while you are in transit from lane to lane. at worst, you miss a gank but still push the lane hard, forcing their mid to come over to help defend.
basically what i am asking is what makes heimer not as viable (is this even true?) or at least insanely popular at higher levels? i can't see anyone who has played TvP in broodwar having any difficulty with turret placement. the rework on his shit makes him feel amazing - far better than the old heimer. the first problem that comes to mind is teams controlling the blue buffs better as i move up in elo. or maybe heimer has a lower skill ceiling? what are the counters i should be watching for?
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Imo Flash > Ghost on Heimer, Flash Rockets are sooo good. I like Teleport on Heimer.
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I like Flash / Exhaust on heimer
I build Boots + 3 -> Cata - > Tear - > RoA - > Sorcs -> Deathcap - > AA.
Not the most AP ever but gives you decent survivability and a good mana pool mid game.
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JUNGLE DINGER!
Jungledinger is too strong.
When I play jungledinger, i run magic pen reds, armor yellows, ap/lvl blues, and flat health quints. Masteries are 9/11/10 or 9/0/21, picking up whatever combination of magic pen, armor, mag res, dodge, and extra exp because heimer is so strong that he doesn't care what masteries he has. For summoners, you need smite, and the other one is heimer's choice.
Skill order is R>Q>E>W, getting W only after you max turrets and E. Start the game with cloth armor, and run over to golem and lay a turret.Then sit there and yell at your team to make sure your team covers you, because remember, you will be carrying them. After blue spawns, have your first turret tank that shit, and when it dies, lay another one behind you and have heimer tank it until you kill it with smite. When jungling, you can mess with neutral creep leashing by putting a turret just at the brink of where they will stop chasing, which will deaggro them, allowing you to take creeps in smaller groups at a time.
From there, jungling is ez mode, except lizard, which have you have to wait until lvl 5 to get. At lvl 5 you have two main options: 1) gank a lane or 2) get lizard and continuing jungling. At lvl 5, you can gank with 2 turrets and maybe get a kill, or at least send them back, or you can wait until 6 and gank with your ult. As for items, get whatever you want. My jungledinger loves gettin' a heart of gold and sorc boots to start, makin jungling a breeze and also lettin' you hit those poor laners damn hard.
Should your team mates die or go back, just hop into their lane and cover them till they get back. If you do this, you can just leave 2 turrets by golem or lizard after turrets are lvl 4 and get a free buff from anywhere on the map. Dragon is also ez after lvl 9 if you haven't been feeding (and you haven't).
http://i52.tinypic.com/2s15df9.jpg
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United States47024 Posts
Catalyst is not that good on Heimerdinger. Like Lux, you're a fairly long-range caster in teamfights, meaning you don't really want to invest that much towards survivability items. That makes Catalyst an iffy buy, and why getting as many Doran's Rings as necessary is the more appropriate way to achieve sustainability in lane. You want to beeline Deathcap as fast as possible from there.
I consider Flash/Ghost mandatory, but that's because of this way that I play Heimer--with minimal survivability midgame, there's zero room for getting caught.
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On February 21 2011 01:13 TheYango wrote:
Catalyst is not that good on Heimerdinger. Like Lux, you're a fairly long-range caster in teamfights, meaning you don't really want to invest that much towards survivability items. That makes Catalyst an iffy buy, and why getting as many Doran's Rings as necessary is the more appropriate way to achieve sustainability in lane. You want to beeline Deathcap as fast as possible from there.
I consider Flash/Ghost mandatory, but that's because of this way that I play Heimer--with minimal survivability midgame, there's zero room for getting caught.
Hourglass is pretty much the survivability item for heimer, if they have someone that can suddenly be in the middle of your turrets and burst you down (akali, jax). Grenade, Hourglass, Grenade while they get picked apart by turrets.
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I don't have time right now to rewrite the whole first post, but a quick summary:
You must run flash/ghost.
9/7/14 is still good. 9/0/21 became better with the nerf on SoS.
Since "Zhonya's" (in first post) meant the ring, the itemization is a bit different now. I prefer tear -> boots -> deathcap -> archangel's. You can replace tear/archangel with cata/RoA if you want more life and less damage.
All of Heimer's mechanics are different with his new ult. I haven't played enough on the new version to talk about all the tactics yet. Anything I mention above should still work, but it may no longer be the optimal use of his ult.
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A decent, but risky Heimer trick late game is to flank your enemies for a team fight, setting up two turrets for those going back along the typical escape route. If they come back to destroy the turrets, you can pop your ult and engage at the turrets, or you can wait and reset them, either way, it gives most enemies a moment of panic. The slow of the turrets is very useful.
You may have to ghost to loop back to team, but you're usually less useful in team fights at the beginning and a lot better at the end.. the burst isn't focused, but the cleanup potential is great.
You've still got to poke in teamfights.
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EPT
