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Active: 630 users

[Map] Rosario

Forum Index > BW General
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1 2 Next All
konadora *
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Singapore66158 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-12-02 03:50:50
November 30 2009 05:12 GMT
#1
Rosario 1.4
[image loading]


Changes:
- Made nat's gas untankable from island expansion (moved island expansion further)
- Made some area outside natural unbuildable for Terran imbalance issues

+ Show Spoiler +
Rosario 1.3
[image loading]


+ Show Spoiler +
Rosario 1.2
[image loading]


Resources:
Main: 9M2G (Top geyser is 5000, bottom geyser is depleted 500)
Nat: 7M1G
Mineral-only: 5M (1000 each)
Island expo: 7M1G
Center: Random value minerals and gas

Mapmaker's comments:
I wanted to try using a depleted geyser at main. I'm interested in how it may affect gameplay, because players can mine from it (2 gas per round) whenever they feel they need that small extra gas.

Replays from beta-test stage:
- Mech TvZ
- Mech TvZ (another game)
- TvP
- ZvT

Special thanks to:
- Nikoner
- Grobyc
- Mystlord

Dowload link:
- Version 1.2
- Version 1.3
- Version 1.4
- Version 1.4 (obs)


Hoping for lots of feedback and comments!
POGGERS
iNfeRnaL *
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
Germany1908 Posts
November 30 2009 05:15 GMT
#2
interesting idea, however taking a glance at it the naturals look really really hard to defend as protoss - how do you wanna forge gate/wall there? if so at the very entrance, which is bad cause those cans won't help vs muta/lurker drop at all ~~
Camlito
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
Australia4040 Posts
November 30 2009 05:16 GMT
#3
Watched you make it, looks nice.

Looks sort of like ultimatem with different details (ofcourse) and that extra geyser.

Overall i like it.
sAviOr...
YPang
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
United States4024 Posts
November 30 2009 05:16 GMT
#4
zerg biased 101
sMi.Gladstone | BW: B high| SC2: gold T_T
ghermination
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States2851 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-30 05:19:30
November 30 2009 05:17 GMT
#5
The mining rates of depleted geysers is pretty slow. Maybe you could add a low amount of gas (like 300 or 500) to make cool timing pushes possible on this map which rely on taking that couple gas. It would add a bit of depth.

Also, those naturals are really wide. You should reshape the terrain to make the edges more flat so that there isn't room for zerglings to slip past the buildings, as well as tighten them up a bit. Make something like ling-tight 4 or 5 building wall possible.
U Gotta Skate.
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
November 30 2009 05:19 GMT
#6
Hmm. The islands making the natural cliffable seems like it would make the map really terran favored. Especially because you can conceivably control 3 expansions and the choke to your base with 2-3 siege tanks and 1-2 turrets (Not sure on the choke though, that does look a bit far). I would recommend just making them not islands, which would make it play out a bit like colosseum but with extra gas. (So it would probably be better for zerg).

The depleted gas in main is an interesting idea, though. I think it would favor protoss the most though. (No other race has as powerful of units that are so non-mineral reliant. Arbs/HT/Archons).
konadora *
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Singapore66158 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-30 05:22:17
November 30 2009 05:19 GMT
#7
On November 30 2009 14:15 iNfeRnaL wrote:
interesting idea, however taking a glance at it the naturals look really really hard to defend as protoss - how do you wanna forge gate/wall there? if so at the very entrance, which is bad cause those cans won't help vs muta/lurker drop at all ~~


i tried forge fe, there isn't trouble with the positions, although there may be some lack of space

On November 30 2009 14:16 YPang wrote:
zerg biased 101


for who?

On November 30 2009 14:17 ghermination wrote:
The mining rates of depleted geysers is pretty slow. Maybe you could add a low amount of gas (like 300 or 500) to make cool timing pushes possible on this map which rely on taking that couple gas. It would add a bit of depth.

Also, those naturals are really wide. You should reshape the terrain to make the edges more flat so that there isn't room for zerglings to slip past the buildings, as well as tighten them up a bit. Make something like ling-tight 4 or 5 building wall possible.


Hmm that's interesting. I'll consider it. Also, the nats are ling-tight-wallable (by Terran). For toss I'm not sure.

On November 30 2009 14:19 Nevuk wrote:
Hmm. The islands making the natural cliffable seems like it would make the map really terran favored. Especially because you can conceivably control 3 expansions and the choke to your base with 2-3 siege tanks and 1-2 turrets (Not sure on the choke though, that does look a bit far). I would recommend just making them not islands, which would make it play out a bit like colosseum but with extra gas. (So it would probably be better for zerg).

The depleted gas in main is an interesting idea, though. I think it would favor protoss the most though. (No other race has as powerful of units that are so non-mineral reliant. Arbs/HT/Archons).


Well if you go mech it's very hard for Zergs to engage straight-on with the army, just tried that. I'll upload some replays from the map testing.
POGGERS
meeple
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Canada10211 Posts
November 30 2009 05:22 GMT
#8
Very interesting... I don't think the extra geyser will affect the gameplay a whole lot, but it will help zerg in the midgame, while they fight for a 4th gas. Does that little min patch on the island expos block the building from being placed there?
konadora *
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Singapore66158 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-30 05:27:01
November 30 2009 05:25 GMT
#9
On November 30 2009 14:22 meeple wrote:
Very interesting... I don't think the extra geyser will affect the gameplay a whole lot, but it will help zerg in the midgame, while they fight for a 4th gas. Does that little min patch on the island expos block the building from being placed there?

yes it does

added some replays
POGGERS
Kimaker
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States2131 Posts
November 30 2009 05:28 GMT
#10
Kon, you need to release a map pack of all your maps just so I can make sure I didn't miss any.And for the record, I love Shamshel and Fubuki! Keep up the good work!
Entusman #54 (-_-) ||"Gold is for the Mistress-Silver for the Maid-Copper for the craftsman cunning in his trade. "Good!" said the Baron, sitting in his hall, But Iron — Cold Iron — is master of them all|| "Optimism is Cowardice."- Oswald Spengler
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-30 05:33:19
November 30 2009 05:29 GMT
#11
On November 30 2009 14:19 konadora wrote:

Show nested quote +
On November 30 2009 14:19 Nevuk wrote:
Hmm. The islands making the natural cliffable seems like it would make the map really terran favored. Especially because you can conceivably control 3 expansions and the choke to your base with 2-3 siege tanks and 1-2 turrets (Not sure on the choke though, that does look a bit far). I would recommend just making them not islands, which would make it play out a bit like colosseum but with extra gas. (So it would probably be better for zerg).

The depleted gas in main is an interesting idea, though. I think it would favor protoss the most though. (No other race has as powerful of units that are so non-mineral reliant. Arbs/HT/Archons).


Well if you go mech it's very hard for Zergs to engage straight-on with the army, just tried that. I'll upload some replays from the map testing.

I meant really terran favored in TvP, actually. Especially in close positions. Both islands and cliffs above naturals make 1factstar openings so powerful, and pretty much force really fast robo/1base play from P.

In TvZ it wouldn't be quite as bad, but defending a slow push will still be a pain on the map. Cross map it doesn't seem to be a problem at all in either matchup due to the unbuildable middle (it is unbuildable?). Not sure how viable mnm would be.

edit : Also, I think that 9 mineral in main might be a bit much, but I'm no expert on that.
konadora *
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Singapore66158 Posts
November 30 2009 05:31 GMT
#12
middle is mostly unbuildable
POGGERS
konadora *
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Singapore66158 Posts
November 30 2009 05:33 GMT
#13
On November 30 2009 14:28 Kimaker wrote:
Kon, you need to release a map pack of all your maps just so I can make sure I didn't miss any.And for the record, I love Shamshel and Fubuki! Keep up the good work!

http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=98919
POGGERS
Cu(oCo)
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Italy358 Posts
November 30 2009 05:35 GMT
#14
weird name, but rly a sweet idea
Goons? just vulture toys 휴.휴
jalstar
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
United States8198 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-30 05:38:14
November 30 2009 05:37 GMT
#15
On November 30 2009 14:16 YPang wrote:
zerg biased 101


not sure about that, the third gas is either at an island or another main/nat

although i'm not sure how the depleted gas thing affects balance
Xxio
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada5565 Posts
November 30 2009 05:41 GMT
#16
i like the 2 gas in main - sc2 style - even though it is depleted
awesome
KTY
arb
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Noobville17921 Posts
November 30 2009 05:46 GMT
#17
no one else has said it but, im guessing the nat gas is tankable from that island expo?
Artillery spawned from the forges of Hell
konadora *
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Singapore66158 Posts
November 30 2009 05:47 GMT
#18
On November 30 2009 14:46 arb wrote:
no one else has said it but, im guessing the nat gas is tankable from that island expo?

yes

and vice versa, island is tankable from main ground
POGGERS
Grobyc
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada18410 Posts
November 30 2009 05:48 GMT
#19
I still think the middle is somewhat a wasteland and that it wouldn't serve too many purposes. Sort of like Colosseum or HBR's middle for example.

As mentioned before, I don't think the depleted geyser will change gameplay at all really. Boosting it to just a low amount for certain pushes or builds could be nice, and although it is supposed to be a really likable thing for Zerg, you would need 4 drones off minerals to get such a low amount of gas, and -4 drones is quite a bit for a Zerg player since expos are often never as saturated as they should be.

After that I think it's just a matter of possibly rearranging any terrain issues regarding proper walls and such for individual matchups, which is easily fixed without comments/advice needed to be given.

Thanks for credit though ^^
If you want to test more maps in the future or anything just msg.
If you watch Godzilla backwards it's about a benevolent lizard who helps rebuild a city and then moonwalks into the ocean.
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
November 30 2009 05:56 GMT
#20
Watching those replays, it will be impossible to ever break a meching terran who sits in their base and turtles up to 200/200 , even if the zerg is significantly better. This type of map has worked on ones like say, Colloseum, however, the difference is Colloseum only allows for 3 bases with 3 gas, while this map allows for easy access to 4 bases, and an additional 1/4 gas, which is just enough to allow for sparse use of Vessels, or more plentifully, Valkyries.

I'm not actually sure if the Zerg would have the resources to win even if they took every other base on the map, short of very successful doom drops.
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