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On August 12 2011 10:40 Canucklehead wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 09:28 ronpaul012 wrote:On August 12 2011 09:15 forgottendreams wrote:On August 12 2011 09:12 ronpaul012 wrote:
I may get chewed out and laughed at for this, but I'm actually indifferent by this. It is the north american star league after all, and personally I would almost like to see it as only north american players, or all foreign players. To be perfectly honest I'm getting kind of sick just watching koreans absolutely destroy foreigners. Its getting to the point in most tournaments where it's not worth my time to watch before the top 8 because It's just blow-outs. Then in the top 8 its just koreans v koreans. I already have the gsl for that.
When koreans started playing in more tournaments such as the nasl, or the exchange with mlg I was pumped. But now its starting to become lame and I kind of want the older more exciting matches back. So you like watching inferior play? Color me not surprised at your username.... User was warned for this post . Can anybody really say they enjoyed championship sunday with a bunch of koreans playing from mlg anaheim more than they did back in dallas when naniwa made his spectacular run? Absolutely not. Speak for yourself. Columbus and Anaheim were way more exciting because of the koreans. I wasn't excited when naniwa won Dallas and it was a pretty ho hum event especially with all the tech problems.
nope wasnt exciting for me at all, didn't watch the stream on the last day during anaheim..
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On August 12 2011 10:42 Rorschach wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:39 esotericc wrote:
As more time goes on I am getting more and more sick of the korean scenes overall attitude. Could just be a vocal minority but they sure do believe their proverbial crap don't stink.
Considering the foreign scene is much larger than korea in regards to SC2 I feel we owe them nothing at all and they should jump at a chance to give themselves a stronger foot hold in the foreign scene. Your talking about size vs quality? Can't stand the people in this thread that are OK with inferior play at international events. Why so much Korean hate? I want to watch the best! The koreans know they are the best so why not ask for special treatment? Its not like they don't have plenty of other venues open to them. Bottom line is they don't need the NASL, the NASL (IMO) needs them to be taken seriously as a league.... *edit: it will stay this way till the rest of the world steps their games up a notch.....
Size is better than quality when you are struggling for sponsors in korea.
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This seems really silly for a player like MC. Gets that deal done with SK to pay his way for international tournaments and now he is being barred to go to a international tournament with one of the biggest prize pools?
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That's a tough break for the NASL but at least some of the foreign players have better chances of winning now I guess :/
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Hmm i don't think this is too bad because for MLG events Koreans get paid flights to america and they usually win so they get double benefit whereas player's like huk,Jinro etc had to go to korea with their own (sponsors) money to play in the GSL and arn't taking too much of the prize pool. if the koreans arn't willing to sacrifice anything to play in this league then they don't deserve to ~ will be great to see more NA players in the "NA"SL
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On August 12 2011 10:44 nufcrulz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:40 Canucklehead wrote:On August 12 2011 09:28 ronpaul012 wrote:On August 12 2011 09:15 forgottendreams wrote:On August 12 2011 09:12 ronpaul012 wrote:
I may get chewed out and laughed at for this, but I'm actually indifferent by this. It is the north american star league after all, and personally I would almost like to see it as only north american players, or all foreign players. To be perfectly honest I'm getting kind of sick just watching koreans absolutely destroy foreigners. Its getting to the point in most tournaments where it's not worth my time to watch before the top 8 because It's just blow-outs. Then in the top 8 its just koreans v koreans. I already have the gsl for that.
When koreans started playing in more tournaments such as the nasl, or the exchange with mlg I was pumped. But now its starting to become lame and I kind of want the older more exciting matches back. So you like watching inferior play? Color me not surprised at your username.... User was warned for this post . Can anybody really say they enjoyed championship sunday with a bunch of koreans playing from mlg anaheim more than they did back in dallas when naniwa made his spectacular run? Absolutely not. Speak for yourself. Columbus and Anaheim were way more exciting because of the koreans. I wasn't excited when naniwa won Dallas and it was a pretty ho hum event especially with all the tech problems. nope wasnt exciting for me at all, didn't watch the stream on the last day during anaheim..
How can you judge if you didn't watch the stream?
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This sounds like a remarkably stupid decision from the Koreans. Makes me worry about how much SC2Con is actually looking out for the players, and how much it's looking out for the GSL. I'll be watching either way, of course.
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On August 12 2011 10:45 skiptomylou1231 wrote:
That's a tough break for the NASL but at least some of the foreign players have better chances of winning now I guess :/
That is not a good thing from a spectators point of view unless all you care about is home favs.....
I don't root for the koreans because their foreigners, I root for them because they are currently at the highest lvl of play that SC2 has to offer....
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On August 12 2011 10:39 esotericc wrote:
As more time goes on I am getting more and more sick of the korean scenes overall attitude. Could just be a vocal minority but they sure do believe their proverbial crap don't stink.
Considering the foreign scene is much larger than korea in regards to SC2 I feel we owe them nothing at all and they should jump at a chance to give themselves a stronger foot hold in the foreign scene.
Foreign scene isn't larger than Korean scene. Strength of a scene is measured by quality and skill of players because that is the only real long-term value.
Everything else (tournaments, prize money etc) is just temporary, it's basically an inflated bubble. This very thread proves that best.
Korean scene in SC2 did a LOT for the foreign scene. They're basically offering free entry in the highest level professional competition in the world, something that western Brood War progamers (who couldn't even manage to earn a progaming LICENCE, let alone qualify for anything significant) would have killed for back in the day. We owe them quite a bit actually.
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Sounds to me like the Koreans threatened to pull their players and nasl tried to call their bluff and lowball them, and the Koreans went through with it.
$1000 just isn't enough for 3 nights at a hotel and two international flights. I can't blame the Korean teams here
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On August 12 2011 10:39 esotericc wrote:
Korean scene in SC2 did a LOT for the foreign scene. They're basically offering free entry in the highest level professional competition in the world, something that western Brood War progamers (who couldn't even manage to earn a progaming LICENCE, let alone qualify for anything significant) would have killed for back in the day. We owe them quite a bit actually.
yeah they're such swell guys for letting us continue to worship them instead of developing our own scene
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On August 12 2011 10:48 Veritask wrote:
Sounds to me like the Koreans threatened to pull their players and nasl tried to call their bluff and lowball them, and the Koreans went through with it.
$1000 just isn't enough for 3 nights at a hotel and two international flights. I can't blame the Korean teams here
$2000 guaranteed is more than enough to cover for flights and expenses.
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On August 12 2011 10:47 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:39 esotericc wrote:
As more time goes on I am getting more and more sick of the korean scenes overall attitude. Could just be a vocal minority but they sure do believe their proverbial crap don't stink.
Considering the foreign scene is much larger than korea in regards to SC2 I feel we owe them nothing at all and they should jump at a chance to give themselves a stronger foot hold in the foreign scene. Foreign scene isn't larger than Korean scene. Strength of a scene is measured by quality and skill of players because that is the only real long-term value. Everything else (tournaments, prize money etc) is just temporary, it's basically an inflated bubble. This very thread proves that best. Korean scene in SC2 did a LOT for the foreign scene. They're basically offering free entry in the highest level professional competition in the world, something that western Brood War progamers (who couldn't even manage to earn a progaming LICENCE, let alone qualify for anything significant) would have killed for back in the day. We owe them quite a bit actually.
You just made too much sense.
I will pull out one of my favorite quotes for forum trolls.
"Don't argue with idiots, they just pull you down to their level and beat you with experience."
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On August 12 2011 10:47 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:39 esotericc wrote:
As more time goes on I am getting more and more sick of the korean scenes overall attitude. Could just be a vocal minority but they sure do believe their proverbial crap don't stink.
Considering the foreign scene is much larger than korea in regards to SC2 I feel we owe them nothing at all and they should jump at a chance to give themselves a stronger foot hold in the foreign scene. Foreign scene isn't larger than Korean scene. Strength of a scene is measured by quality and skill of players because that is the only real long-term value. Everything else (tournaments, prize money etc) is just temporary, it's basically an inflated bubble. This very thread proves that best. Korean scene in SC2 did a LOT for the foreign scene. They're basically offering free entry in the highest level professional competition in the world, something that western Brood War progamers (who couldn't even manage to earn a progaming LICENCE, let alone qualify for anything significant) would have killed for back in the day. We owe them quite a bit actually.
Thank you for saying it like it is! It seems like anyone who wasn't around for the BW scene doesn't understand that WE need the highest lvl of play in order for SC2 to last near as long as the BW has. We owe Korea a LOT for the groundwork they have done for esports....
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On August 12 2011 10:47 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:39 esotericc wrote:
As more time goes on I am getting more and more sick of the korean scenes overall attitude. Could just be a vocal minority but they sure do believe their proverbial crap don't stink.
Considering the foreign scene is much larger than korea in regards to SC2 I feel we owe them nothing at all and they should jump at a chance to give themselves a stronger foot hold in the foreign scene. Foreign scene isn't larger than Korean scene. Strength of a scene is measured by quality and skill of players because that is the only real long-term value. Everything else (tournaments, prize money etc) is just temporary, it's basically an inflated bubble. This very thread proves that best. Korean scene in SC2 did a LOT for the foreign scene. They're basically offering free entry in the highest level professional competition in the world, something that western Brood War progamers (who couldn't even manage to earn a progaming LICENCE, let alone qualify for anything significant) would have killed for back in the day. We owe them quite a bit actually.
I understand your point of view and appreciate where you are coming from but in my opinion strength of scene comes with the money being invested into the players and events. You can have as many amazing players in korea that you want but if they only have 1 big competition, no upcoming events other than that one and they refuse to be part of the rest of the worlds events then their scene won't grow.
Just because we enjoy watching them doesn't mean they are going to be picking up sponsors outside of korea if they refuse to leave.
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First people were bitching non-stop about Koreans being in the NASL, now they're mad that most of them are leaving?
Stupid ass community is stupid.
User was warned for this post
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Was looking around PlayXP for any response. Didn't find anything official, but here are some comments on the story (which was translated by ColdViolet) from PlayXP users.
Link to PlayXP: http://www.playxp.com/sc2/global/view.php?article_id=3284548
GxPray (2011-08-12 09:21:52 KST)
[Who] are they kidding? They'll fail to draw a large audience without Koreans
장난하나 한국애들 안하면 흥행 실패인데
케이스 (2011-08-12 09:26:25 KST)
Hrm.. It's true that Korean players have merit as [SC2] stars/celebrities but.. to say 'we will participate for you, so you should do this for us' doesn't seem right. It should be a festive[?] gathering.
It's just... rather than 'Due to several difficult circumstances, we will withdraw' saying 'We need you to this and that for us because we are experiencing some hardship. You've done some things but it's not enough' frankly does look bad.
흠.. 한국 선수들이 스타성이든 뭐든 분명 메리트 있는 집단이긴 하지만.. 우리 참가하니까 이거 저거 해줘~ 라는건 좀 아닌 거 같네요.. 말그대로 축제의 한 장으로 이뤄져야 할 곳임이 분명한데...
그냥.. 우린 여러가지 여건으로 참가하기 힘드니까 빠질께... 가 아니고.. 우리 힘드니까 이러저러 해줘.. 몇개 해줬찌만 부족하니까 빠질께... 는 참.. 좀 안좋게 보이는건 사실이네요.
아이유토스 (2011-08-12 09:27:15 KST) (lol username: IUtoss)
Seems sending many players will be difficult [note: for Korean teams or NASL?]. Maybe just the winner and runner-up? That might be best. Expenses and all..
이제 많이 가는것은 힘들듯 하구요, 우승자나 준우승자 정도? 이렇게 뽑아서 가는게 좋을 듯 합니다. 경비 문제도 그렇고 ...
피베 (2011-08-12 09:33:11 KST)
This is actually for the best. 4~5 participants is about right. We almost had so many Korean players that the roster would be almost 50% Korean...
A Korean-dominated roster might enhance performance or raise the quality of games but I think it ruins the flavor [of NASL] as a foreign tournament and might actually harm its popularity [or growth].
We [Korean palyers] shouldn't over-extend ourselves trying to participate and though both parties may be a little disappointed by what has happened, I don't think the result itself is bad.
차라리 잘됐습니다. 4~5명씩만 참가하는게 맞지 이번에보면 정말 대거 참여해서
완전 한국선수들이 50%를 넘어갈정도였으니..
한국선수판이 되면 경기력이나 게임의 질은 높아지겠지만
해외대회라는게 무색해지고 흥행에도 안좋은영향을 끼칠수있다고 생각합니다.
우리도 무리해서 가는건 안좋다고 보고 서로 아쉬운부분은 있겠지만 나쁘지않은 결과라고 봐요.
Frostmourne. (2011-08-12 10:05:32 KST)
But NASL offering $2000 was a [thoughtful] concession on their part...
It's true Korean players are good but I wonder if they aren't expecting too much special treatment.
Furthermore, because the NASL format is different from MLG, an invited player may drop out early and return a lot less [to NASL] on their investment.
근데 nasl측에서도 2천불이면 나름 배려해준거같은데...
한국선수가 잘하는건 맞지만 너무 특권을 바라는건 아닌지..
게다가 nasl은 mlg와 경기방식이 달라서 초대했다가 바로 광탈하면 투자 대비 효율도 별로고
And some humorous ones..
CarlitoXPn (2011-08-12 09:08:53 KST)
Assuming this is true.. wtf Mr. Chae??? Emphasizing that being a GSL champion more than covers travel expenses and leaves plenty of profit he calls players not participating strange, and then he says something like this..;
이게 사실이라는 전제하에, 채정원은 모하는 놈인지 모르겠네요. 지에셀 상금을 볼때, 1등하면 모든 소요 경비를 다 회수하고도 이익이 엄청나다는 걸 강조하면서, 안오는 놈들 이상하다 그랬던 놈이, 어찌 저런 소릴 하누;
CarlitoXPn (2011-08-12 09:09:53 KST)
I got too excited and read the ps too late. Mr. Chae, I'm sorry.
흥분해서 ps를 늦게 봤네요. 채정원 해설님 미안합니다.
GxPray (2011-08-12 09:21:52 KST)
감염된불사조 (2011-08-12 09:54:32 KST)
All because too many Kimchi-mans participatingㅋㅋ ㅋㅋ It should be fine if only 4~5 players went.
김치맨이 너무많이참가해서 그런가보네 ㅋㅋ ㅋㅋ4~5명만 가면 괸찮을거같은데
crowley (2011-08-12 10:09:07 KST)
Mr. Chae is busy enough already and now he's gonna be troll'd by kids who didn't read this carefully [i.e., who didn't RTFA!]
Even though I and everyone knows and understand that the Korean teams are struggling financially, it is still a little disappointing [that they won't be able to participate] T T
채정원님 안그래도 일도 많으실텐데 이거 글 대충 읽은 애들 때문에 까일까봐 걱정이 일단 되네요
한국팀들이 재정 상황이 매우 어려운건 누구나 다 아는 사실이지만 개인적으로는 좀 많이 아쉽네요ㅠㅠ
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On August 12 2011 09:21 Jyvblamo wrote:
Well, I bet Puma is pretty giddy right about now.
"OMG all my competition pulled out I'm gonna be a 100,000-naire! (`･ω･´) I'm gonna buy SO MUCH lotion!"
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On August 12 2011 10:49 ComusLoM wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:48 Veritask wrote:
Sounds to me like the Koreans threatened to pull their players and nasl tried to call their bluff and lowball them, and the Koreans went through with it.
$1000 just isn't enough for 3 nights at a hotel and two international flights. I can't blame the Korean teams here $2000 guaranteed is more than enough to cover for flights and expenses.
It isn't though. I just looked up a round trip flight over a weekend from Seoul to LA and it's $2100 per person just for the plane tickets
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Very disappointing news, would have loved to see those players playing in NASL season 2, but NASL still has my full support. I could have understood teams not sending their players because they didn't find it worthwhile monetarily, but the fact that they let them play in qualifiers, and then issue an ultimatum to NASL is completely absurd. Whoever was behind this decision definitely deserves no respect for this at all. Also glad to see that Mr. Chae has been trying to help out and seems to be doing the right thing. <3 NASL <3 Mr. Chae.
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EPT
