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699 Posts
On August 12 2011 10:31 epik640x wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 08:34 NASL.tv wrote:On August 12 2011 08:31 masterbreti wrote:
tbh good for the Koreans for sticking to their guns.
Has anyone here auctally tried to caculate the cost of a 1 week trip to cali from seoul and back. its damn expensive. Being almost 3k with hotel and airfare and such. For the chance at $500, which would still lose them $500 if NASL paid 2k.
I can understand why the teams would do this tbh. They are not in a healthy state in Korea and of course they would want people to pay, since they can't temselves. I can answer this question. We paid for Korean players to come to NASL Season 1. We bought tickets for MC, PuMa, Zenio, and Squirtle. We paid $1,192 for each ticket. The hotel cost was $353 for the entire event. Travel cost was about $80 per person (shuttle service to and from). This averages out about $1650, factoring in meals ($50 per day even) ... giving each player $2,000 should cover that. $1,192 for a ticket is just one way though, right? Round trip is usually almost $3,000. So $2,000 wouldn't nearly be enough.
Nope -- $1,192 round trip.
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On August 12 2011 10:31 Rorschach wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:25 Talin wrote:On August 12 2011 10:19 NicolBolas wrote:On August 12 2011 10:16 Talin wrote:On August 12 2011 10:11 Sandro wrote:On August 12 2011 10:08 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 09:11 hdan wrote:
Im quite happy that the koreans have pulled out, if they cant afford to send theyre players to a tournments with prize pools that big so be it, some money in foreigner pockets is okay by me, besides, puma hero rain and the FXO guys will probably be up there if they can take the places.
You're not at all concerned that we are essentially getting a worse product? Not if Western tournaments are made into Korean piggy banks, I don't see teams like Dignitas or EG demanding upwards of 2k for stipends to travel. Really? There were plenty of calls (demands, if you will) to make Code A more accessible to foreign players because it apparently isn't appealing enough as it is. And GOM has actually responded to that by partnering with MLG and handing out invites to pretty much every notable foreigner that shows up in Korea regardless of the exchange program. Considering how brutally hard the qualifiers are, that's quite a reward in itself. Of course, not everybody can make the same demands - there's much more weight to the demands of teams that have the best players in the world than the teams whose players mostly get rolled over every single MLG. Asking for invitations to Code A is rather different from asking for money. No, it really isn't. Without a Code A invitation you could be locked into playing qualifiers for months (think about Bomber, DRG, MMA) before making it in. GOM has essentially cut off up to 2-3 months of expenses for foreign players by handing out Code A invites. Let's not forget that they also provide accommodation and even a direct Code S spot for MLG winner. If you think invites are so cheap, then why not suggest that NASL invites up to 8 Koreans directly to the Top 16 live event? That might just be more appealing to sc2con teams. Besides, the complaint about Code A was specifically that "it's not worth it financially". So nobody asked for invites, it was GOM who came up with that themselves. You hit the nail on the head on this one. Its NO different then GOM giving "foreigners" special privileges... Watching code A the other night was a joke, there is no question in my mind that Koreans are miles ahead of the rest of the world. If you want to watch inferior play with "home favorites" then NASL just like IPL will give you that. I will have to stick to the GSL and MLG since I want to see pros at the highest lvl...
And while the foreigners have had special treatment at GSL, so have the Koreans at MLG. They get treated like royalty at MLG. They win all the money, are seeded right into group play, get their own practice area and so on.
Lets not act like the foreigners playing in Code A is the only part of the deal here, Koreans have made it out pretty damn well in that deal too.
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Invite all/most SlayerS since they don't belong to Sc2con
Yellow,MMA,Boxer is all we need
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On August 12 2011 10:30 AlBundy wrote:
By reading this thread I have to say that I'm really surprised and disappointed to see that so many people are posting comments such as "fuck koreans". Wow. What happened to this community?
Yes, instead lets give koreans a blank check to do whatever they please.
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On August 12 2011 10:33 DontGiveUp wrote:
I also don`t see why NASL wouldn`t distribute the prize pool even more to make the ro16 players receive a higher minimum amount. Maybe they offered it already, but if they didn`t, this looks like an easy fix for the problem right now.
By doing so, NASL wouldn`t raise their bduget nor break its promise to retain the prize pool. Plus, the koreans would have guranteed the equivalent of travel costs plus a minimum profit.
If koreans are willing to fly to MLG for travel costs + ridiculous prize pool, I can`t see why they wouldn`t fly for the equivalent of travel costs + small guaranteed profit + chance of higher prizes.
In the end, NASL should ask themselves, what would atract more players and viewers:
a) a tournament with 100k prize pool, without korean, where the winner earns 40k; or
b) a tournament with 100k prize pool, with koreans, where the winner earns 25k.
Sounds like a no brainer for me. Easy solution, honestly, considering that 2scon easing demanding reschedules and such.
TL;DR: an easy fix is to redistribute the same prize pool even further, lowering the winner`s prize but guarateing profit for everyone, and see if it meets what the koreans want, considering their demands so far consist in having the travel costs assured.
This and please change the harsh format! It was painful to watch Ret bust his ass only to be knocked out so quickly.........
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On August 12 2011 10:31 epik640x wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 08:34 NASL.tv wrote:On August 12 2011 08:31 masterbreti wrote:
tbh good for the Koreans for sticking to their guns.
Has anyone here auctally tried to caculate the cost of a 1 week trip to cali from seoul and back. its damn expensive. Being almost 3k with hotel and airfare and such. For the chance at $500, which would still lose them $500 if NASL paid 2k.
I can understand why the teams would do this tbh. They are not in a healthy state in Korea and of course they would want people to pay, since they can't temselves. I can answer this question. We paid for Korean players to come to NASL Season 1. We bought tickets for MC, PuMa, Zenio, and Squirtle. We paid $1,192 for each ticket. The hotel cost was $353 for the entire event. Travel cost was about $80 per person (shuttle service to and from). This averages out about $1650, factoring in meals ($50 per day even) ... giving each player $2,000 should cover that. $1,192 for a ticket is just one way though, right? Round trip is usually almost $3,000. So $2,000 wouldn't nearly be enough.
i flew to thailand for like $1100 (round trip).
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On August 12 2011 10:31 epik640x wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 08:34 NASL.tv wrote:On August 12 2011 08:31 masterbreti wrote:
tbh good for the Koreans for sticking to their guns.
Has anyone here auctally tried to caculate the cost of a 1 week trip to cali from seoul and back. its damn expensive. Being almost 3k with hotel and airfare and such. For the chance at $500, which would still lose them $500 if NASL paid 2k.
I can understand why the teams would do this tbh. They are not in a healthy state in Korea and of course they would want people to pay, since they can't temselves. I can answer this question. We paid for Korean players to come to NASL Season 1. We bought tickets for MC, PuMa, Zenio, and Squirtle. We paid $1,192 for each ticket. The hotel cost was $353 for the entire event. Travel cost was about $80 per person (shuttle service to and from). This averages out about $1650, factoring in meals ($50 per day even) ... giving each player $2,000 should cover that. $1,192 for a ticket is just one way though, right? Round trip is usually almost $3,000. So $2,000 wouldn't nearly be enough.
Wrong, about 1100-1300 USD is enough for a round trip. At least from Korea to NY
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Well that sucks, I would have definitely liked to see them play, but it should be good nonetheless. Are you replacing the korean invites with foreigner invites? or just playing a few players short of the intended player count.
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On August 12 2011 10:34 Sandro wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:30 AlBundy wrote:
By reading this thread I have to say that I'm really surprised and disappointed to see that so many people are posting comments such as "fuck koreans". Wow. What happened to this community? Yes, instead lets give koreans a blank check to do whatever they please.
Probably not what he's saying.
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On August 12 2011 10:24 Rorschach wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:18 silentrealm wrote:
Terrible terrible terrible....
Oh wait...who cares?
This tournament is the North American Starleague. It was never about the Koreans, it was about a foreigner tournament becoming as prominent as the GSL
It can still do that despite the stubbornness of the Korean teams. Wake up call, a lot of people care.... This is a hard hit to the NASL. Asking for special treatment is not all that cool but at the same time when "your" players offer the highest lvl of play and this is the entertainment industry your really at their mercy......
Do you actually have numbers to back it up ? 100 screaming posters on TL is not a proof that their viewership will be much affected.
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On August 12 2011 10:34 DarkRise wrote:
Invite all/most SlayerS since they don't belong to Sc2con
Yellow,MMA,Boxer is all we need
To bad he declined.
On August 12 2011 10:34 jmbthirteen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:31 Rorschach wrote:On August 12 2011 10:25 Talin wrote:On August 12 2011 10:19 NicolBolas wrote:On August 12 2011 10:16 Talin wrote:On August 12 2011 10:11 Sandro wrote:On August 12 2011 10:08 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 09:11 hdan wrote:
Im quite happy that the koreans have pulled out, if they cant afford to send theyre players to a tournments with prize pools that big so be it, some money in foreigner pockets is okay by me, besides, puma hero rain and the FXO guys will probably be up there if they can take the places.
You're not at all concerned that we are essentially getting a worse product? Not if Western tournaments are made into Korean piggy banks, I don't see teams like Dignitas or EG demanding upwards of 2k for stipends to travel. Really? There were plenty of calls (demands, if you will) to make Code A more accessible to foreign players because it apparently isn't appealing enough as it is. And GOM has actually responded to that by partnering with MLG and handing out invites to pretty much every notable foreigner that shows up in Korea regardless of the exchange program. Considering how brutally hard the qualifiers are, that's quite a reward in itself. Of course, not everybody can make the same demands - there's much more weight to the demands of teams that have the best players in the world than the teams whose players mostly get rolled over every single MLG. Asking for invitations to Code A is rather different from asking for money. No, it really isn't. Without a Code A invitation you could be locked into playing qualifiers for months (think about Bomber, DRG, MMA) before making it in. GOM has essentially cut off up to 2-3 months of expenses for foreign players by handing out Code A invites. Let's not forget that they also provide accommodation and even a direct Code S spot for MLG winner. If you think invites are so cheap, then why not suggest that NASL invites up to 8 Koreans directly to the Top 16 live event? That might just be more appealing to sc2con teams. Besides, the complaint about Code A was specifically that "it's not worth it financially". So nobody asked for invites, it was GOM who came up with that themselves. You hit the nail on the head on this one. Its NO different then GOM giving "foreigners" special privileges... Watching code A the other night was a joke, there is no question in my mind that Koreans are miles ahead of the rest of the world. If you want to watch inferior play with "home favorites" then NASL just like IPL will give you that. I will have to stick to the GSL and MLG since I want to see pros at the highest lvl... And while the foreigners have had special treatment at GSL, so have the Koreans at MLG. They get treated like royalty at MLG. They win all the money, are seeded right into group play, get their own practice area and so on. Lets not act like the foreigners playing in Code A is the only part of the deal here, Koreans have made it out pretty damn well in that deal too.
Koreans made it good out of the deal because they're good. Foreigners in return, can get good from practicing in korea.
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On August 12 2011 10:31 epik640x wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 08:34 NASL.tv wrote:On August 12 2011 08:31 masterbreti wrote:
tbh good for the Koreans for sticking to their guns.
Has anyone here auctally tried to caculate the cost of a 1 week trip to cali from seoul and back. its damn expensive. Being almost 3k with hotel and airfare and such. For the chance at $500, which would still lose them $500 if NASL paid 2k.
I can understand why the teams would do this tbh. They are not in a healthy state in Korea and of course they would want people to pay, since they can't temselves. I can answer this question. We paid for Korean players to come to NASL Season 1. We bought tickets for MC, PuMa, Zenio, and Squirtle. We paid $1,192 for each ticket. The hotel cost was $353 for the entire event. Travel cost was about $80 per person (shuttle service to and from). This averages out about $1650, factoring in meals ($50 per day even) ... giving each player $2,000 should cover that. $1,192 for a ticket is just one way though, right? Round trip is usually almost $3,000. So $2,000 wouldn't nearly be enough.
Some posts in this thread are seriously making me sadfaced.. ]: Please guys, learn to read before posting. A TL manager as well as NASL has already posted that it is only around $1200 for a ROUNDABOUT trip to the finals. Not $1200 there and another $1200 back home.
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On August 12 2011 10:17 ronpaul012 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:08 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 09:11 hdan wrote:
Im quite happy that the koreans have pulled out, if they cant afford to send theyre players to a tournments with prize pools that big so be it, some money in foreigner pockets is okay by me, besides, puma hero rain and the FXO guys will probably be up there if they can take the places.
You're not at all concerned that we are essentially getting a worse product? With the koreans out there will be a better chance that our foreign sc2 players will do better. Players we can relate too. And the skill gap between the 2 is huge, everybody see it. With koreans out the games will most likely be much much closer and therefor entertaining. So it's not really a worse product.
LOL don't speak for "we."
I feel like I can relate to Korean players (at least understand their culture) better than foreigners because 1) I'm Asian and 2) I followed BW for years.
It is hard to relate to the ideal that practice = being good?
I want to see the best players win.
You want low level close games? Go watch Day9's AH something league.
Also, I feel people aren't mentioning that this kinda delegitimizes the NASL as a competitive league.
After GSL people were crowning Nestea best in the world.
Who's going to do that to the winner of NASL when we know for sure the best in the world aren't competing?
Obviously it'll be a huge accomplishment but it won't mean the same.
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Looks like I won't be watching the NASL again nor purchasing a season pass, NASL's fault or not im not interested in watching a tournament that will not have the best players in the world playing(koreans).
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On August 12 2011 10:31 MildSeven wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:29 jmbthirteen wrote:On August 12 2011 10:25 Haustka wrote:
NASL make it sounds like all Koreans did was threaten NASL(when it was necessary for them to have that sort of money to even get an air plane ticket, which is normally over $1000) to pay them and declined after third trial? well did you know GTSL happens every month almost none stop? Why is NASL make it sound like its all Koreans need to apologize and should always come to USA whenever they call them. Koreans arent slaves. Perhaps NASL shouldve made better offer from the beganning not trying to test Koreans to see if they accept it or not. This is not Korean players but rather NASL's fault. LOL you serious? Yeah hey we will give you a $1000 in travel money and you will walk away with at least another $1000. Yeah NASL is treating them like slaves. They are treating them like everyone else. You think it was cheap for White Ra or Sen to fly into the finals? I know Sen probably got there solely on the support from sponsor, not sure about WhiteRa. I also think that all the players gets this new offer, not just Koreans. But 2k isn't even enough for roundabout trip, let alone hotel fees, food, etc.
2k is enough. Read the damn thread. NASL and TL manager both posted the same numbers. Flight is like 1200. It doesn't cost $800 more for a hotel for a couple of nights and food.
The problem here isn't what NASL is giving or lack there of. Its the fact that Korean teams don't have money and feel like because of this they deserve special treatment. The managers of Korean teams need to be working harder to get the sponsors that allow foreign teams to fly around to all of these tournaments.
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Eek, thats a rough spot, but it is really expensive to fly from korea.
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On August 12 2011 10:34 jmbthirteen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 10:31 Rorschach wrote:On August 12 2011 10:25 Talin wrote:On August 12 2011 10:19 NicolBolas wrote:On August 12 2011 10:16 Talin wrote:On August 12 2011 10:11 Sandro wrote:On August 12 2011 10:08 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 09:11 hdan wrote:
Im quite happy that the koreans have pulled out, if they cant afford to send theyre players to a tournments with prize pools that big so be it, some money in foreigner pockets is okay by me, besides, puma hero rain and the FXO guys will probably be up there if they can take the places.
You're not at all concerned that we are essentially getting a worse product? Not if Western tournaments are made into Korean piggy banks, I don't see teams like Dignitas or EG demanding upwards of 2k for stipends to travel. Really? There were plenty of calls (demands, if you will) to make Code A more accessible to foreign players because it apparently isn't appealing enough as it is. And GOM has actually responded to that by partnering with MLG and handing out invites to pretty much every notable foreigner that shows up in Korea regardless of the exchange program. Considering how brutally hard the qualifiers are, that's quite a reward in itself. Of course, not everybody can make the same demands - there's much more weight to the demands of teams that have the best players in the world than the teams whose players mostly get rolled over every single MLG. Asking for invitations to Code A is rather different from asking for money. No, it really isn't. Without a Code A invitation you could be locked into playing qualifiers for months (think about Bomber, DRG, MMA) before making it in. GOM has essentially cut off up to 2-3 months of expenses for foreign players by handing out Code A invites. Let's not forget that they also provide accommodation and even a direct Code S spot for MLG winner. If you think invites are so cheap, then why not suggest that NASL invites up to 8 Koreans directly to the Top 16 live event? That might just be more appealing to sc2con teams. Besides, the complaint about Code A was specifically that "it's not worth it financially". So nobody asked for invites, it was GOM who came up with that themselves. You hit the nail on the head on this one. Its NO different then GOM giving "foreigners" special privileges... Watching code A the other night was a joke, there is no question in my mind that Koreans are miles ahead of the rest of the world. If you want to watch inferior play with "home favorites" then NASL just like IPL will give you that. I will have to stick to the GSL and MLG since I want to see pros at the highest lvl... And while the foreigners have had special treatment at GSL, so have the Koreans at MLG. They get treated like royalty at MLG. They win all the money, are seeded right into group play, get their own practice area and so on. Lets not act like the foreigners playing in Code A is the only part of the deal here, Koreans have made it out pretty damn well in that deal too.
Um... yeah.
And that is why they're still going to MLG.
So what's your point? 
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heh guess its an easy win for puma again
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On August 12 2011 10:37 Sanguinarius wrote:
Eek, thats a rough spot, but it is really expensive to fly from korea.
its expensive to fly from taiwan, ukraine, sweden, etc. it was actually more expensive for me to fly to paris than it was for me to fly to bangkok. so....
edit: i live in the san francisco area.
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Really this sucks. Hopefully we get to see some new NA/EU talent though!
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EPT
