EPT[G] TheCore - Advanced Keyboard Layout - Page 149
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Ninjury_J
Canada408 Posts
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
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sanddbox_sc2
United States173 Posts
On March 22 2013 06:33 thayneq wrote: Disclaimer: I am a bronze level player with ~280apm. I'm not very good since I'm very new, but I've watched many games and I think I know how to play rather well. (just can't do it haha). The only possible way you could have 280 apm in bronze is just by spamming mindlessly all game long. That's not exactly a habit you want to develop  Alas, watching the game and playing it are two very, very different things. I think not understanding this holds a lot of people back. -- As for the mouse buttons, I'm reserving judgement for now, but I don't see a compelling reason to switch, especially because I already use the mouse buttons as a control group. | ||
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Shompol
United States12 Posts
I am considering TheCore, as my control is on the slow side (APM ~30), but there is one issue that I need to overcome:  The right-handed layout makes one use left hand on the right side of the keyboard. This is an uncharted territory for a left had to be. Not only will it impede learning, but I also want my game keyboard skills to be transferable to my other computer interactions.  So, the question is as follows: Is it possible to rip full benefits of TheCore while using a left-handed layout, given that I am right-handed?There is probably no reason why not, but wanted to double-check with the experts before I dive into this. Thank you | ||
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thayneq
96 Posts
On March 22 2013 07:41 sanddbox_sc2 wrote: The only possible way you could have 280 apm in bronze is just by spamming mindlessly all game long. That's not exactly a habit you want to develop That's a very poor judgement having never seen me play. I'm only in bronze because still because when I started, I didn't know what I was doing at all. Now that I've done TheCore for a few months, I still never play on ranked ladder. I'm sure if I did I could easily crush through bronze and silver. I don't spam at all, I think that's a waste of energy. I am getting extremely fast at spreading creep, queen injects, macro in general before I work on other parts of my game. I really suck at micro, mostly because I'm not sure what units counter what. Generally in the beginning of the game my APM is around 60-100. I imagine when I start competing for rank, things will change. | ||
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thayneq
96 Posts
On March 22 2013 07:54 Shompol wrote: Hello, I am considering TheCore, as my control is on the slow side (APM ~30), but there is one issue that I need to overcome: The right-handed layout makes one use left hand on the right side of the keyboard. This is an uncharted territory for a left had to be. Not only will it impede learning, but I also want my game keyboard skills to be transferable to my other computer interactions. So, the question is as follows: Is it possible to rip full benefits of TheCore while using a left-handed layout, given that I am right-handed?There is probably no reason why not, but wanted to double-check with the experts before I dive into this. Thank you Someone jump in here, but I believe that's exactly what The Chameleon layout aims to do. Trust me, it's uncomfortable for your hand at first, but after a week of practice, and a hotkey trainer, it's really not bad. I can still type normally like I always could, but now my left hand knows the keys JIOP as much as they know ASDF. | ||
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thayneq
96 Posts
On March 22 2013 06:43 Ninjury_J wrote: Thayneq, the set camera / scroll idea sounds very intriguing. I'm not sure I understand precisely what you do though. Would you be able to explain it a little more? I'm pretty bad at visualizing, so if you can share exactly what you press to do what, that would be awesome. All I'm doing is using one click of the wheel in place of the button "Y" and one click in the other direction as "G." There is no use for it to be on the wheel persay, just that it's easier to access than the Y and G keys for me. I tried using the side buttons as the free cams and that worked pretty well too actually. I think those cameras are severely underused by gamers in general, especially as zerg who need to constantly go back to their base cameras for injects (except of course folks who use minimap inject). So basically I use the free cam as a very very fast way to "get back to where I want to be" instead of constantly clicking the minimap. Granted, I'm not very good with my mouse control, so this is probably a bad habit for me. My usage is like this: spreading creep with my queen, want to save this location: shift+wheel-up. Go inject with my queens using the base cam method. Wheel-up to recall my previous spot. Now I'm right back where I was and I didn't have to move my mouse off the center of the screen. Jak, I know it's not tournament legal. I don't ever plan to play at that level. I just hated having these wheel functions that did nothing for me when they are just so fast and easy. Feel free to tell me it's a dumb idea... it probably is, but so far it's serving me better than Y and G which I almost never use. | ||
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Ninjury_J
Canada408 Posts
I would appreciate if someone can please test this, as I will have no access to sc2 for a bit. Please go into a custom game and get a queen, spread a tumour. Then, in your hotkey file, make camera 7 recall to "ctrl + i". Make camera 7 create set to "alt+ i". Make spread creep "i". Then try to spread creep by: 1) click a new creep tumour and press alt I. 2) wait 15 seconds and move your camera. 3) press ctrl I. 4) keep pressing ctrl. Click the spreadable tumour(s). 5) release ctrl. press I and spread creep. 6) keep I pressed. Press alt. 7) repeat starting at 2. In theory this doesn't conflict with anything I can think of.... Ctrl I (ability 2) is never used on zxmx because it is not a control group and alt I is not used because I is not a camera yet. If someone or many people can try this and tell us if it is A) easy or hard B) conflicting with something else C) useful (does it spread creep well or does center on current selection screw it up?) D) do you see a better way to make this better ... I would be very grateful  | ||
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JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
On March 22 2013 07:54 Shompol wrote: Hello, I am considering TheCore, as my control is on the slow side (APM ~30), but there is one issue that I need to overcome: The right-handed layout makes one use left hand on the right side of the keyboard. This is an uncharted territory for a left had to be. Not only will it impede learning, but I also want my game keyboard skills to be transferable to my other computer interactions. So, the question is as follows: Is it possible to rip full benefits of TheCore while using a left-handed layout, given that I am right-handed?There is probably no reason why not, but wanted to double-check with the experts before I dive into this. Thank you I actually use TheCore for all computer games I play. Sc2, LoL, DotA 2, even pokemon mmo I really like it in LoL I strongly suggest committing to learning TheCore. Once its in the fingers, few ever to go back | ||
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xTrim
472 Posts
I quit SC2 with new years.. Now with HotS out I just thought about playing some WoL just for the sake of it, since there is unranked playing and etc. I was "rusty" so to speak, but on my comeback I was still wasting my diamonds and low masters friends. Then I thought "well, if I don`t do it right now, I won't EVER do it". So I took a deep breath and started playing with it. I`ve just finished my 30th game and now I am sharing my thoughts: - It is a rough beginning. I went from winning against masters to losing to gold players. The thing is, I KNOW what needs to be done, of course, my game senses are master-level, but execution does not allow me to do it. I was always messing up the SCV button (and I still do to some extend, pressing J instead of I, but much less now). Scan was non-existent and so was supply call down. I think the third game the guy failed a 4 gate with double gas, into DTs. I was so ready for it, with 1 scan on each Orbital, and when he started whacking my SCVs, fuck, my hand AUTOMATICALLY RAN TO MY 4 (cc hotkey back in the days) and C (scan hotkey). Of course nothing happened, and he kept killing everything, while I was frantically pressing CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC. Then I literally LOOKED at the key board and SCANNED with the K button, but the DTs were not where I scanned... ahahah - After the very bad beginning, I started playing mroe consistently, with simple builds every MU. Cloakshee TvT, 1 rax CC mech TvZ and 1 rax CC into 2 more raxes TvP. Though I do know how to do run-bys, drops, fancy banshee micro, I was always losing my stuff... Banshees got killed and etc, because I try to macro, nothing happens while microing (because I hit wrong hotkeys, for example) and then I have to "pay attention" to the macro, while the micro suffers. So even trying these kinds of stuff, I always get behind... ahahah (2)... - Then after 25ish games, the first inflection point came! Things got a little better, I don`t press J to make SCVs, I can micro some easy stuff while macroing, etc. Games started getting longer and I started beating Platinums and low Diamonds! And during the games I simply realise how come I am doing EVERYTHING without dancing with my keyboard hand! It really feels smooth. However, I still cannot win nasty engagements (especially ghost vs templars). I am still going the attack-move friendly builds. So basically that`s it. It feels good but I still need more games! =P After 30 games I feel a little better and indeed, mechanically, things are SOOOOOOOOO much easier! Recommended! | ||
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Deleted User 299381
18 Posts
On March 22 2013 08:57 JaKaTaK wrote: I actually use TheCore for all computer games I play. Sc2, LoL, DotA 2, even pokemon mmo I really like it in LoL I strongly suggest committing to learning TheCore. Once its in the fingers, few ever to go back How in the world are you using it for LoL and DotA 2? Also, whats the change between 0.6.2 and 0.6.3??? And, honestly learning this is easy, I started learning it after playing 150+ games using a slightly modified Standard layout. I've learned to fully use this layout after about 30 games AND at the same time learning a completely new race ( Zerg). Honestly, on the outside this looks like a typical hotkey layout but the layered cameras and how accessible the Control Groups and Cams are make this very efficient. My APM is now around 170 and sometimes above 200 while using TheCore with Zerg( have only played 40 games of it in 4v4 only). When I go to play Terran (my main race) I dont really benefit much from TheCore unless its late game. | ||
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Ninjury_J
Canada408 Posts
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Deleted User 299381
18 Posts
On March 22 2013 09:39 Ninjury_J wrote: @pagos, why do you think you benefit more from TheCore when playing Zerg than when playing Terran? Injecting. Simple as that. AND as a Zerg you have (most of the time) alot of bases compared to Terran and Protoss. Much more bases that need to be controlled. Also, you need to control many Queens and separate the injecting ones from creep spreading ones to be most efficient. I could provide many more reasons if needed but those should suffice. | ||
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theprotagonist
Australia85 Posts
Have to admit...had trouble fighting my instincts to press standard buttons, scroll to locations instead of just using the camera hotkey and stuffing up injects...after about a week...I got the hang of it. | ||
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fengshaun
149 Posts
On March 22 2013 08:19 thayneq wrote: My usage is like this: spreading creep with my queen, want to save this location: shift+wheel-up. Go inject with my queens using the base cam method. Wheel-up to recall my previous spot. Now I'm right back where I was and I didn't have to move my mouse off the center of the screen. Jak, I know it's not tournament legal. I don't ever plan to play at that level. I just hated having these wheel functions that did nothing for me when they are just so fast and easy. Feel free to tell me it's a dumb idea... it probably is, but so far it's serving me better than Y and G which I almost never use. That's genius! I have two scroll wheels (R.A.T. 7) on my mouse and I might just have to do that with at least one of them! @Jak, I know it's off-topic, but can you post your Core hotkey layout for LoL and Dota 2 on a pastebin or something? Thanks! Maybe you could make a thread on the relevant sections of TL.net? | ||
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Ninjury_J
Canada408 Posts
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Shompol
United States12 Posts
On March 22 2013 08:12 thayneq wrote: ... Someone jump in here, but I believe that's exactly what The Chameleon layout aims to do. Trust me, it's uncomfortable for your hand at first, but after a week of practice, and a hotkey trainer, it's really not bad. I can still type normally like I always could, but now my left hand knows the keys JIOP as much as they know ASDF. Thank you for the Chameleon tip. It is not as well documented though. I still would be interested in an answer from someone who understands TheCore design: is it OK to use a left-handed layout with err... my left hand, or the benefits of layout will be lost? It is a matter of principle that I don't want to use left hand on the wrong side of keyboard. (a) I play once a week, so learning curve is important and (b) I want to use PC keyboard as a keyboard and not as a joystic contraption. Else I would buy something like this: Toshiba Gaming Keyboard which is easier to lug around and I am sure blows schemas like TheCore out of the water. | ||
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Snoodles
401 Posts
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Snoodles
401 Posts
On March 22 2013 14:35 Shompol wrote: It is a matter of principle that I don't want to use left hand on the wrong side of keyboard. (a) I play once a week, so learning curve is important and That's not a principle, that's just being stubborn, unless you truly believe it's morally wrong to use your left hand on the right side of keyboard. And to answer your question, the whole point of thecore is to have the large, important keys like CTRL, shift, a [tab] substitute, and alt accessible with your thumb. I used to use my pinky for those keys. My thumb is a lot faster, stronger, and more flexible. | ||
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SpoogeCoffer
New Zealand51 Posts
On March 22 2013 14:46 Snoodles wrote: Does anyone have a strategy for loading a medivac and not having all the surrounding marines follow the medivac? This messes up my keybinds when I want to set 7-8 to drops and wastes my apm as i have to box the units chasing the medivac to stop them, and this often results in me accidentally stopping the medivac too. Say you have your bio + all medivacs on one control group (typical terran play), you want to load one of these medivacs and set it up for a drop, the process is to select the control group (we'll say it's control group p), right click the medivac to load it, then while we still have the control group selected shift click the medivac to remove from our selection and then reassign the control group ctrl+shift+p. So: 1) p 2) right click on medivac to load 3) shift click medivac to deselect it 4) ctrl+shift+p to reassign control group p. 5) right click somewhere else to move them away from following medivac, or alternatively hit stop (H for me). From here you can: 1) left click the medivac to select it 2) ctrl+shift+' to put it on the ' control group. 3) right click it somewhere on the map / shift queue up an unload drop somewhere on the map This is how I do it and I can't see a shorter way, it is somewhat annoying I'll agree, but there is no boxing required. Just one accurate shift+ click on the medivac. | ||
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