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On May 06 2011 14:51 R0YAL wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 13:20 Jeremy Reimer wrote:
Apologies if this has been brought up before.
I really enjoyed Idra's stream today, especially the Q&A part. It's actually pretty amazing how anyone can ask questions of a top-level pro and actually get answered... really cool interaction with the fans.
I felt he answered a lot of the questions fairly and respectfully. He didn't sound like he was trolling, so I'm going to assume he wasn't.
So it confused me a bit when he said he wasn't having fun playing Starcraft 2. He brought up comparisons with Brood War, saying that in BW you weren't as vulnerable to all-ins because it was easier to defend (and I can sort of see that seeing top-level BW games where people make lots of sunken colonies and lurkers). He made it seem like SC2 was more volatile, easier to win by just making a random build order guess and winning that way, whereas in BW it wouldn't really matter if you had a better build if you were playing someone much more skilled than you.
It made me think a bit. He's not the only one who has said this--Jinro said something very similar. I don't want to turn this into a BW vs SC2 flamewar, because I enjoy watching both. I'm just wondering about Idra saying he wasn't having fun playing SC2. Could he really not be having fun? He's at the top level, at the highest tier of a game that is exploding internationally. How could that not be fun?
For one the high ground advantage for bw was astronomically better in terms of defending. In sc2 just a single colossus or air unit essentially negates any and all high ground advantage. Also in sc2 all the units are just contributing to a stronger army which is very one dimensional in terms of strategy. In bw things like placing spider mines strategically to allow you to push one way while being less susceptible to a counter attack or to slow down an opponent that has an observer and is forced to clear out the mine field to get by, etc.. Camping lurkers outside a protoss base so they are forced to get an observer before they can move out allowing you essential time to get a third or forth up, or maybe sniping observers with scourge so your lurkers can rain uncontested havoc on the protoss army below. Stuff like that. But one thing is damn certain.. Sunkens are unexpressibly better than spine crawlers. In bw you could throw down a few cheap creep colonies and morph then into sunkens when you see the enemy move out. You didnt have to commit 100% and if they moved out then the sunkens would be finished in time which made Zerg much more flexible and stable. In sc2 you have to preemptively put down spines or else they wont finish no matter the map.
Honestly, Every serious player right now feels like BW is far and away better than SC2 in terms of competitiveness, but can't really voice it because of contracts and stuff. Which is expected, because Brood War is like 10 years old while SC2 is fewer than 2 years old.
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On May 06 2011 13:46 Ansinjunger wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 12:45 Mailing wrote:On May 06 2011 12:40 absalom86 wrote:On May 06 2011 09:02 arQ wrote:On May 06 2011 08:31 jakekosberg wrote:
This shouldn't be a big deal, but the bias moderation on this forum is a joke.
User was banned for this post. Is this 1984? What is going on? You cant express an opinion about the moderators of TL? I dont care much about fanboism, Idra, or Cruncher, but do not treat people like this for stating their opinion. That is ridiculous. Does the owners of TL.net think that this kind of moderating is a good thing? I doubt it considering the fact that it turns people off from the main SC2 hub in the west. Edit: And now it says i cant talk about that either. Are you defending someones right to call another person a waste of life on here ? TL admins hold the forum to a high standard of no insults and so on and a star player like IdrA does not get special treatment in that regard. Test calling someone a waste of life and a cheater on here and you'll be permanently banned, IdrA is IdrA so he only gets a 2 day ban and should be happy about that. Look at some of these posts http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=141572 I saw those posts of Rekrul notoriety since you linked them. I wasn't around and don't know much about Rekrul, but I found his posts to be completely un-entertaining. What context am I missing that people back then could use such abusive language and it's okay? I actually feel bad for Idra now, even if he has brought most of his notoriety on himself.
I'm not sure the point he was trying to make. As someone who visited TL "back in the day" (I was a total newb incidentally) I can tell you comparing IdrA to Rekrul is really stupid. Their personalities, motivations, and dates they were pro are completely different. Rekrul gets a lot of leeway from the mods b/c he comes from the earliest days of BW when people like Nazgul and Elky were still in the game. To me at least, he's kind of like a historical Starcraft figure that pops up occasionally to take a huge shit on a thread.
My favorite Rekrul post incidentally involves our hero Greg Fields.
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Idra,
BREAKING a DEAL with your fans is a big MISTAKE.
You are going to lose a fan here, one who cares enough even to write this message.
I'm pretty sure you are losing another hundred that don't care enough to write.
This Teamliquid shit is theirs, and they can ban whoever they please as many times as they want for the reasons they want. That's the deal.
Remember YOUR deal.
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shit mods as usual.
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User was temp banned for this post.
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So mods, let me get this straight... trolling hard is ok, but getting pissed about it isn't?
User was temp banned for this post.
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It's obvious Cruncher cheated, that man is a joke... To ban IdrA for stating a fact is an even worse joke
User was temp banned for this post.
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On May 06 2011 17:14 Hertingen wrote:
It's obvious Cruncher cheated, that man is a joke... To ban IdrA for stating a fact is an even worse joke
this
User was temp banned for this post.
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Mhmm gotta say, I'm kinda disappointed. After all, we the fans suffer most and thats just not fair. I think it's wrong to just ban IdrA for flaming in his own Stream-Thread, but it's also childish to just stop streaming because he got banned, it's like punishing us for doing nothing....
Also i find it a little weak that IdrA lets a ladder game vs Cruncher get that close to him while he leaves other ladder games for no reason or for instance because he doesnt want to play vs a turtling 2 base protoss....
User was temp banned for this post.
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Ok, so his fan club gets banned? Yet his stream post doesnt...0.O
I think theres to many Chiefs and not as many Indians around personally...
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Some broader context. Original reddit link here.
All that log shows is how stupid it is for TL to keep operating how they have been in regards to Idra. Either ban the guy permanently, or let him say whatever the hell he wants to say. Threatening him with perma-ban several times and then never following through on it just shows that there is an unwillingness to do it. Letting your mods temp ban him but not perma ban him is only going to lead to more problems and I would guess (though I could be wrong this is just my opinion) it is very frustrating for some of the mods, make a decision. Regardless of whether you choose to let him speak as he wishes or ban him from the site it will make the mod's jobs much easier.
User was temp banned for this post.
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On May 06 2011 16:41 Krissam wrote:
So mods, let me get this straight... trolling hard is ok, but getting pissed about it isn't?
User was temp banned for this post.
Now why this guy got banned for ?!?!? 0.0
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United States44291 Posts
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On May 06 2011 09:17 Chillsucks wrote:
--- Nuked ---
lol so u created a new acc just to post this?
disgusting to see cowardsl trolling around.
You should definitely consider to get urself some balls!
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Bad situation just becouse someone was honest :<
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United States22883 Posts
Does anyone remember when IdrA said he was leaving for NASL?
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As much as I disagree with banning IdrA because he spoke what everyone thought.
JUST as much I disagree with him trying to use his fanbase as a personal army against chill now. This *Sombody was evil to me, now I don't stream. If you are upset about this, nuke the fucker*...comon Idra, that was not neccessary.
User was temp banned for this post.
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ah for casting NASL if you mean yeah its the down statement i think too
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Saturday I believe, to be casting the next week
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On May 06 2011 17:18 Leach wrote:
Mhmm gotta say, I'm kinda disappointed. After all, we the fans suffer most and thats just not fair. I think it's wrong to just ban IdrA for flaming in his own Stream-Thread, but it's also childish to just stop streaming because he got banned, it's like punishing us for doing nothing....
Also i find it a little weak that IdrA lets a ladder game vs Cruncher get that close to him while he leaves other ladder games for no reason or for instance because he doesnt want to play vs a turtling 2 base protoss....
User was temp banned for this post.
Can´t get the BAN right here. No trolling/flamming. just giving his oppinion in an imho reasonable way.
@Jibba : He was talking about 2 more days of streaming (Friday/Saturday i guess) before leaving for 5 days in order to commentate on NASL if i´m correct.
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EPT
