EPT[O] Q&A 49 - Page 13
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Integra
Sweden5626 Posts
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PlutoNZ
New Zealand410 Posts
On February 20 2009 17:33 Integra wrote: Those swarm thingies that the queen produces. Are they permanent or are they on a set timer and vanish after a certain amount of time? Do you mean Razor Plague? Razor Plague: with a great breath the queen exhales a cloud of tiny Zerg creatures that create a vast swarm nearby. These creatures attack all enemy creatures within their swarm, doing additional damage to biological targets. What makes it worse is the Zerg player can control the swarm, moving it around to attack whatever enemies he wishes until the swarm becomes exhausted and dissipates. | ||
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L0thar
987 Posts
On February 20 2009 14:07 deathgod6 wrote: Scanner Sweep: using a satellite in high-orbit, the Terrans reveal a large area anywhere on the map and detect all cloaked units within the target area. Does that mean terran wasn't originally going to have scan?  It was always there. Sadly, the most interesting "new" mechanic introduced for Terran in this batch is the more than 10 years old scanner. May I ask all the people which think the new mechanic are actually good - which of you are going to use this calldown aditional supply nonsense? Because it use the same energy like scanner, I see no reason why don't use scan (or save the energy for future use) and just grab one of my scvs and build a new supply depot. It seems like the scanner will be even more needed than in BW. Lurkers now outragne static detectors, invisible banshee could probably wipe out static detectors in matter of seconds, protoss players now could make any unit invisible for some time from the beginnig of the game (almost)... You either need Nighthawk (which isn't exactly cheep) on the right place in the right time or you need scan. On the other hand, Terran players will probably have less scanners than before, because you cannot lift-of your CC after upgrade, so probably no more scanners in dangerous expansions. So who would ever wanted to use his precious scaner energy for something like 2 additional supply, which can be easily supplemeneted by builing another depot? Now if the additional supply allows you to go - even temporary - over your supply limit, even the max 200 limit, that would be interesting. But as for now, it seems like the most pitiful ability in SC universe. | ||
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IdrA
United States11541 Posts
On February 20 2009 20:40 adelarge wrote: It was always there. Sadly, the most interesting "new" mechanic introduced for Terran in this batch is the more than 10 years old scanner. May I ask all the people which think the new mechanic are actually good - which of you are going to use this calldown aditional supply nonsense? Because it use the same energy like scanner, I see no reason why don't use scan (or save the energy for future use) and just grab one of my scvs and build a new supply depot. presumably the calldown is instantaneous. having to wait for a missed supply depot to finish when you're doing a timing rush can cost you the game. so ya its a shitty mechanic, the only way its gonna be used is as a failsafe for fucking up. but it would be useful in those situations. | ||
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L0thar
987 Posts
On February 20 2009 20:44 IdrA wrote: presumably the calldown is instantaneous. having to wait for a missed supply depot to finish when you're doing a timing rush can cost you the game. so ya its a shitty mechanic, the only way its gonna be used is as a failsafe for fucking up. but it would be useful in those situations. Well, the calldown of mules isn't, but yeah, I can see some possibilites here. But still, I would rather not fuck up and have scans left in case he decides to counter my push with DT's, burrowed banelings or burrow micro with roaches... | ||
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The Storyteller
Singapore2486 Posts
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IdrA
United States11541 Posts
and for later game timings like a 2/1 push with a vessel tvp or something, things arent as precise supply wise since its alot longer buildup and theres more variables going into little things like supply, and you're still gonna want the scans for checking on your opponents timings, since again there are alot more variables you have to account for (how much is he expoing, is he teching, whats he teching, when did he add gates, etc) | ||
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Unentschieden
Germany1471 Posts
On February 20 2009 21:25 IdrA wrote: i think the fact that it draws on the same resource as scanning is gonna limit that severely. the really delicate timing pushes, where an extra 2 supply here and there would make a real difference, are almost always pretty early in the game, you're not likely to have a nighthawk for mobile detection by that point, so you're gonna need all the scans you can get with threats like burrowed banelings and dts. and for later game timings like a 2/1 push with a vessel tvp or something, things arent as precise supply wise since its alot longer buildup and theres more variables going into little things like supply, and you're still gonna want the scans for checking on your opponents timings, since again there are alot more variables you have to account for (how much is he expoing, is he teching, whats he teching, when did he add gates, etc) Well that is the balancing act in it. It´s quite obvious between Sweep and MULE - if you think you can manage without sweep that extra energy turns into extra income. Extra supplys do have factors going for it but IMHO 2 is a bit weak. With 4 extra supply you´d trade 50 energy for 50 Minerals (1/2 Depo) instantly. | ||
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Santrega
United States29 Posts
I'd prefer being able to call down some sort of drone which can decrease the building time for an scv to make a building. Make it so it can be called while a building is under construction, and speed build time for 1 building by 25% or so. Basically, you call it down, and it hovers over a building and helps with the construction, then, when the building is done, it takes off. Thats far more useful than "call down additional supplies". | ||
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freelander
Hungary4707 Posts
On February 20 2009 23:05 Unentschieden wrote: Well that is the balancing act in it. It´s quite obvious between Sweep and MULE - if you think you can manage without sweep that extra energy turns into extra income. Extra supplys do have factors going for it but IMHO 2 is a bit weak. With 4 extra supply you´d trade 50 energy for 50 Minerals (1/2 Depo) instantly. my problem is that dark pylon seems much-much stronger. dark pylon is really not expensive, and you can build several of it. dark pylon abilities: faster mining cloaking ---> this is for some cheese stuff, not necessary to use energy transfer ---> situational, well it is not really used in early game i believe terran stuff abilities: mule ----> it should be used as much as possible scan ----> this is a often used ability too extra supply ---> it shouldnt be used if everything is going as your plan while the dark pylon's main ability is the faster mining, and the other functions dont even have to be used, the scan and mule are both very important to use, hence the protoss can make his mining constantly faster, while the terran is more limited. I didnt even mention that the terran building is limited one per command center, while you can build a lot of dark pylons (I think protoss players will build at least two of them at their nexus). What I like that zerg didn't get a "faster mining ability", so they are once again determined to expo more, like in SC1, but for different reasons. | ||
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L0thar
987 Posts
On February 20 2009 23:05 Unentschieden wrote: Well that is the balancing act in it. It´s quite obvious between Sweep and MULE - if you think you can manage without sweep that extra energy turns into extra income. Extra supplys do have factors going for it but IMHO 2 is a bit weak. With 4 extra supply you´d trade 50 energy for 50 Minerals (1/2 Depo) instantly. It would still be an extremely boring ability... Just try to compare this new mechanics. Invisible Carriers or Collossi combined with the ability to replenish your caster's energy instatly on the one side...and the ability to make 10 supply from 8 on the other. Does it seem like a fair update to anybody? (Not to mention they use such a cool mechanic like drop-pods for what? Sending down crippled SCVs which even couldn't built anything and have timed life?) | ||
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L0thar
987 Posts
On February 20 2009 23:32 Santrega wrote: I'd prefer being able to call down some sort of drone which can decrease the building time for an scv to make a building. Make it so it can be called while a building is under construction, and speed build time for 1 building by 25% or so. Basically, you call it down, and it hovers over a building and helps with the construction, then, when the building is done, it takes off. Thats far more useful than "call down additional supplies". Sounds good. Much more interesting and flexible. Allows you to for example faster expoing with building CC quicker or quickly add factories before timing attack and other stuff. | ||
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SWPIGWANG
Canada482 Posts
Linking scan energy and macro spells really restricts what one can do with the idea. One can't make the building with low energy cap (say, 30 energy) to push the player constantly use them unlike more independent buildings, and a large pool of mana means it is not so time critical, and bad control only means looser timing as opposed to wasted time. Its probably better to de-link scan and macro spells, by making one group be timer based ability (thus costing no energy) or just two sets of energy pool. ---------------- It perhaps one can reorient terran into the base creep race with instant drop supply wall, flying buildings and more accessible (cheaper, lower tech) nighthawk spamming the map filled of mines, turrets and walls. Make nighthawk detection cost energy if it result in too much detectors (or just make mines really cheap energy wise, and turrets costs mostly energy than resources) | ||
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wrags
United States379 Posts
On February 21 2009 01:05 SWPIGWANG wrote: Additional supplies as is now, is almost useless. The only use I can imagine is that if the supply have significant hp, than it'd work as a insta wall that costs nothing and can be summoned quickly, especially if it is anywhere near cheap enough to be compared to normal supply. Linking scan energy and macro spells really restricts what one can do with the idea. One can't make the building with low energy cap (say, 30 energy) to push the player constantly use them unlike more independent buildings, and a large pool of mana means it is not so time critical, and bad control only means looser timing as opposed to wasted time. Its probably better to de-link scan and macro spells, by making one group be timer based ability (thus costing no energy) or just two sets of energy pool. ---------------- It perhaps one can reorient terran into the base creep race with instant drop supply wall, flying buildings and more accessible (cheaper, lower tech) nighthawk spamming the map filled of mines, turrets and walls. Make nighthawk detection cost energy if it result in too much detectors (or just make mines really cheap energy wise, and turrets costs mostly energy than resources) i thought about that too, but if a game came down to counting scans (although mothership and vulkan are same level tech, so i guess burrow rushes or something) and the terran has too many because of the low cost seems as if there's not as much trade off it would seem using the macro mechanic to help go for 'faster' air tech scout vs using the energy for scans appears to be the current trade, however i haven't even seen it so my point being i think it's way too early to shun it off | ||
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wrags
United States379 Posts
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L0thar
987 Posts
On February 21 2009 01:05 SWPIGWANG wrote: The only use I can imagine is that if the supply have significant hp, than it'd work as a insta wall that costs nothing and can be summoned quickly, especially if it is anywhere near cheap enough to be compared to normal supply. I don't think it works like that. You have to target already built supply depot. There is no room for creativity, you just decide which depot would you like to upgrade a then spend precious scan energy on making it provide 10 supply instead of 8. This abillity has "fail" written all over it. | ||
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lordmordor
United States209 Posts
On February 20 2009 14:50 PH wrote: I figured the kinds of mining boosts they gave to toss and terran would more likely have been given to zerg...even with the queen larva thing, zerg is stiiiill boned economically...): I think Zerg actually got a pretty good deal, free extra larva means being able to easily produce drones and armies at the same time. Top zergs have to walk a razors edge with not producing to many drones or not producing to much army, the extra larve gives them much more room to work with. I think of it more as a permanent econ boost rather than the temporary ones Terrans and protoss have to work with. Zerg are going to want Queens anyway since their other abilities are very useful. The abilities of the other races may seem better, but we still don't know things like how big the AoE for the mining bonus is, or how long its lasts. Sure you can spam dark pylons, but if the effect doesn't last long your going to be burning through energy pretty quickly. | ||
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paper
13196 Posts
lololol | ||
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naventus
United States1337 Posts
On February 20 2009 21:25 IdrA wrote: i think the fact that it draws on the same resource as scanning is gonna limit that severely. the really delicate timing pushes, where an extra 2 supply here and there would make a real difference, are almost always pretty early in the game, you're not likely to have a nighthawk for mobile detection by that point, so you're gonna need all the scans you can get with threats like burrowed banelings and dts. and for later game timings like a 2/1 push with a vessel tvp or something, things arent as precise supply wise since its alot longer buildup and theres more variables going into little things like supply, and you're still gonna want the scans for checking on your opponents timings, since again there are alot more variables you have to account for (how much is he expoing, is he teching, whats he teching, when did he add gates, etc) Another use though is for recovery from bad situations - like oops reaver drop killed those 2 clustered supply depots. | ||
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lordmordor
United States209 Posts
Terrans, they could give the mule the ability to construct buildings, maybe at a faster rate. you could scan an island, drop a mule, and suddenly have a hidden island expo and as far as your opponent knows you haven't even left your base. Or just mess with the Mules timer or energy cost. Zerg I still feel is alright as is, but if it turns out they need a little extra help. decrease the production time of units built with Queen produced larva, or give a discount on price of units (including the drone) nothing is balanced when its first revealed, give it a fair chance | ||
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