• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 12:08
CET 18:08
KST 02:08
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
Weekly Cups (Dec 15-21): Classic wins big, MaxPax & Clem take weeklies2ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !10Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win4Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump1Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win2
StarCraft 2
General
Weekly Cups (Dec 15-21): Classic wins big, MaxPax & Clem take weeklies ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career ! Micro Lags When Playing SC2? When will we find out if there are more tournament Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win
Tourneys
$100 Prize Pool - Winter Warp Gate Masters Showdow $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Winter Warp Gate Amateur Showdown #1 RSL Offline Finals Info - Dec 13 and 14!
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 505 Rise From Ashes Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play Mutation # 502 Negative Reinforcement
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Anyone remember me from 2000s Bnet EAST server? soO on: FanTaSy's Potential Return to StarCraft Klaucher discontinued / in-game color settings How Rain Became ProGamer in Just 3 Months
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] LB QuarterFinals - Sunday 21:00 CET Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL21] WB SEMIFINALS - Saturday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason Path of Exile General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List TL+ Announced Where to ask questions and add stream?
Blogs
The (Hidden) Drug Problem in…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1163 users

EWC Starting Brackets Revealed - Page 6

Forum Index > SC2 General
115 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 4 5 6 All
njleslu2024
Profile Joined May 2024
57 Posts
August 08 2024 13:40 GMT
#101
On July 19 2024 16:58 radracer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 18 2024 20:27 Harris1st wrote:
On July 18 2024 07:08 radracer wrote:
All I wanna say is performing better or worse in one event doesn't mean that tournament is easier or harder. There are way more factors which affecting the result of any individual player other than "prep format or not". That's all.



You're not doing a very good job of that- you'd fail a debate 100 class the way you're going about it. Saying "Maru got SMASHED" in tournaments where he gets 2nd place is hyperbolic and hurts your argument. Maru getting #1 in GSL and #2 in big weekenders is less of a variance than Reynor getting 0-4'ed in GSL and doing whatever 5-8th in weekenders.


I'd be interested in this exercise: How many weekender champs have never won a GSL. (INCLUDING Koreans, since there aren't enough foreign entrants to GSL) vs how many GSL champs have won weekenders. I'm not going to do the work/research though, lol. My guess is advantage goes to more GSL champs have also been weekender champs.


With Serral winning like half of the weekenders and not participating in GSL, this exercise is doomed to fail

On July 17 2024 15:43 WombaT wrote:
I think Serral is in a different category entirely and could conceivably go and Royal Road it, he’s just so resilient and consistent. .


He'd do it with a ridiculous mapscore while at it.



It looks like most GSL champs have won weekenders, but not vice versa. Pretty good exercise to me. Also, Serral hasn't won half the weekenders in SC2, maybe he has since you've been watching? IDK


Chances Serral royal rotors it will get better the longer he delays going to GSL, but there's also a good chance he 0-4's out like Reynor, no one knows. So far his competitive drive hasn't taken him to Korea.

Keep lying to yourself “no no Serral will be knocked out in group stage” after seeing GSL winners getting smashed by Serral over and over again.
njleslu2024
Profile Joined May 2024
57 Posts
August 08 2024 13:43 GMT
#102
On August 07 2024 23:43 lokol4890 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2024 22:57 Blitzball04 wrote:
On July 19 2024 11:27 Gantz023 wrote:
On July 18 2024 07:08 radracer wrote:
All I wanna say is performing better or worse in one event doesn't mean that tournament is easier or harder. There are way more factors which affecting the result of any individual player other than "prep format or not". That's all.



You're not doing a very good job of that- you'd fail a debate 100 class the way you're going about it. Saying "Maru got SMASHED" in tournaments where he gets 2nd place is hyperbolic and hurts your argument. Maru getting #1 in GSL and #2 in big weekenders is less of a variance than Reynor getting 0-4'ed in GSL and doing whatever 5-8th in weekenders.


I'd be interested in this exercise: How many weekender champs have never won a GSL. (INCLUDING Koreans, since there aren't enough foreign entrants to GSL) vs how many GSL champs have won weekenders. I'm not going to do the work/research though, lol. My guess is advantage goes to more GSL champs have also been weekender champs.



I can tell you why Maru has won weekend tournaments and Serral has not won a GSL.

1.- Going on a weekend is not a big sacrifice to earn 30,000 dollars.

2.- go live for 2 months in a completely different country, far from your family, a language that you could not understand in 2 months of practice, where the cost of living is extremely expensive for a prize of 3,000 dollars for winning the entire event xd.

Anyone who can do the math realizes why Koreans go out to play on the weekends and "foreigners" don't go in large numbers to compete in GSL.

Can you imagine if the GSL were played in Europe? same prize money, same preparation times, how many Koreans would we see traveling???? I assure you... none... because IT IS NOT PROFITABLE.

We, as fans, ... would love to see Serral Go... but for him it means nothing at all... only financial losses and loss of valuable time with his family and his people. It is a healthy, mature and prudent decision.


Serral already has won 2 GSL with 100% win rate

Whereas Maru and some of the Koreans indeed has won weekender but after how many tries? Safe to assume less than 25% win rate. Not that impressive.

I know the Koreans fanboys like to clown reynor for choking in the GSL. as a sort of flex or meme. But it’s not that much as a flex as they think it is. What’s Maru win rate attending weekender? Around 10%. His GSL win rate? Around 20%.

Quite good if compare to his Korean peers. But quite weak when compare to Serral win rate. There are levels to this


There are also levels between glorified showmatches (gsl v. the world) and gsl proper, yet here we are...

There are also levels between GSL and EWC/IEM/WCS and Maru hasn’t won and a single of any of the latter.
njleslu2024
Profile Joined May 2024
57 Posts
August 08 2024 13:51 GMT
#103
On July 18 2024 15:15 radracer wrote:
Show nested quote +

Am I in a debating competition? you pick up fight with me regarding “ohh how dare you not including some key words and downplayed Maru’s achievement by mistake?” So funny!
And your Math teacher will be mad since you simply ignored the fact that GSL is the only choice to win in one set and “all weekenders” contains far more tournaments. The sample sizes are not even comparable so even if more people won weekenders but not GSL than the number who won GSL but not weekenders, doesn’t give you conclusion of GSL is harder, understand?
Also if you need example your idle Maru is just a perfect one, who never won global final or IEM Katowice (yes they are weekenders) but won a bunch of GSL



I didn't pick any fight nor did I originally bring up the argument, that was someone else. But I observed this, and you're in a discussion, so yeah. If you want to have a good one, that's a suggestion. It seems like you're taking it super personally, and are invested rather than just enjoying the discussion.

"My idle Maru" well He's not my idol or even my favorite player, I hate Terran in SC1, lol. I haven't had a favorite player for a while now, since probably HuK. Still a SC fan first and foremost, & always will be. Anyways clearly this is your assumption due to the aforementioned personal biases. Not everything is a Maru vs Serral Debate. That aside, Maru has won weekenders, high level / premiere ones at that. Regardless of the the "world championship" label the tournaments are of the same quality players. Would be sick to see if Serral could win a GSL even in the weaker korean scene due to lack of interest, but who knows if he will ever have that desire.


<edited out some flaming/trash talk, not really productive>

You can question Real Madrid for if this club can win a primier league or not. But you can’t question Real Madrid’s prestigiousness and rank by saying “it is not participating in premier league”. If RM defeat Liverpool (top 4), Arsenal (top 2) and swept Man City (champion) in champions league there’s no question RM is the best the world, and there’s no question RM is the best club in history for winning the most champion league.
Who cares if RM can win a premier league or not? Does it really matter?
bulldozer06701
Profile Joined July 2019
139 Posts
August 08 2024 18:25 GMT
#104
Now that everybody is trying their hand in Stormgate (even Clem i just learned!) I wonder how much it mixes up the levels of play and prep in EWC.
Balnazza
Profile Joined January 2018
Germany1247 Posts
August 08 2024 18:42 GMT
#105
On August 09 2024 03:25 bulldozer06701 wrote:
Now that everybody is trying their hand in Stormgate (even Clem i just learned!) I wonder how much it mixes up the levels of play and prep in EWC.


The winner of the next big announced Stormgate-tournament gets 800$...you would need to be batshit crazy to focus on Stormgate instead of the EWC... AoE 4 had much bigger prizemoney right off the bat and even that didn't particularly catch many SC2-players.
With Clem I assume he just played the Tasteless-Invitational because he was in Korea anyway? Or is he actually really focusing on Stormgate right now?
"Wenn die Zauberin runter geht, dann macht sie die Beine breit" - Khaldor, trying to cast WC3 German-only
JJH777
Profile Joined January 2011
United States4415 Posts
August 08 2024 19:51 GMT
#106
On August 08 2024 22:43 njleslu2024 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2024 23:43 lokol4890 wrote:
On August 07 2024 22:57 Blitzball04 wrote:
On July 19 2024 11:27 Gantz023 wrote:
On July 18 2024 07:08 radracer wrote:
All I wanna say is performing better or worse in one event doesn't mean that tournament is easier or harder. There are way more factors which affecting the result of any individual player other than "prep format or not". That's all.



You're not doing a very good job of that- you'd fail a debate 100 class the way you're going about it. Saying "Maru got SMASHED" in tournaments where he gets 2nd place is hyperbolic and hurts your argument. Maru getting #1 in GSL and #2 in big weekenders is less of a variance than Reynor getting 0-4'ed in GSL and doing whatever 5-8th in weekenders.


I'd be interested in this exercise: How many weekender champs have never won a GSL. (INCLUDING Koreans, since there aren't enough foreign entrants to GSL) vs how many GSL champs have won weekenders. I'm not going to do the work/research though, lol. My guess is advantage goes to more GSL champs have also been weekender champs.



I can tell you why Maru has won weekend tournaments and Serral has not won a GSL.

1.- Going on a weekend is not a big sacrifice to earn 30,000 dollars.

2.- go live for 2 months in a completely different country, far from your family, a language that you could not understand in 2 months of practice, where the cost of living is extremely expensive for a prize of 3,000 dollars for winning the entire event xd.

Anyone who can do the math realizes why Koreans go out to play on the weekends and "foreigners" don't go in large numbers to compete in GSL.

Can you imagine if the GSL were played in Europe? same prize money, same preparation times, how many Koreans would we see traveling???? I assure you... none... because IT IS NOT PROFITABLE.

We, as fans, ... would love to see Serral Go... but for him it means nothing at all... only financial losses and loss of valuable time with his family and his people. It is a healthy, mature and prudent decision.


Serral already has won 2 GSL with 100% win rate

Whereas Maru and some of the Koreans indeed has won weekender but after how many tries? Safe to assume less than 25% win rate. Not that impressive.

I know the Koreans fanboys like to clown reynor for choking in the GSL. as a sort of flex or meme. But it’s not that much as a flex as they think it is. What’s Maru win rate attending weekender? Around 10%. His GSL win rate? Around 20%.

Quite good if compare to his Korean peers. But quite weak when compare to Serral win rate. There are levels to this


There are also levels between glorified showmatches (gsl v. the world) and gsl proper, yet here we are...

There are also levels between GSL and EWC/IEM/WCS and Maru hasn’t won and a single of any of the latter.


Only recently. In 2013 an OSL(or GSL) was harder to win than Blizzcon. Even in 2018 I would rate GSL harder to win by format/player pool but Blizzcon equals it due to the prize pool increasing player effort.
Moonerz
Profile Joined March 2014
United States459 Posts
August 08 2024 20:13 GMT
#107
Clem doesn't even need to practice any RTS game, or any top sc pro for that matter, and will beat 99.9% of people. So I wouldn't worry that he's sinking a ton of hours into it lol.

I don't really follow aoe4 but werent a lot of the top players retired/older sc players. Ie marinelord demuslim beastyqt etc.
lokol4890
Profile Joined May 2023
114 Posts
August 08 2024 20:48 GMT
#108
On August 09 2024 03:42 Balnazza wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 09 2024 03:25 bulldozer06701 wrote:
Now that everybody is trying their hand in Stormgate (even Clem i just learned!) I wonder how much it mixes up the levels of play and prep in EWC.


The winner of the next big announced Stormgate-tournament gets 800$...you would need to be batshit crazy to focus on Stormgate instead of the EWC... AoE 4 had much bigger prizemoney right off the bat and even that didn't particularly catch many SC2-players.
With Clem I assume he just played the Tasteless-Invitational because he was in Korea anyway? Or is he actually really focusing on Stormgate right now?


No way clem is really focusing on stormgate. I view him playing stormgate in the same lens as maru, byun, and reynor playing the Wardi group tournament, an interesting and fun escape from the 1v1 grind in prep for ewc
njleslu2024
Profile Joined May 2024
57 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-08-09 15:05:52
August 09 2024 14:35 GMT
#109
On August 09 2024 04:51 JJH777 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 08 2024 22:43 njleslu2024 wrote:
On August 07 2024 23:43 lokol4890 wrote:
On August 07 2024 22:57 Blitzball04 wrote:
On July 19 2024 11:27 Gantz023 wrote:
On July 18 2024 07:08 radracer wrote:
All I wanna say is performing better or worse in one event doesn't mean that tournament is easier or harder. There are way more factors which affecting the result of any individual player other than "prep format or not". That's all.



You're not doing a very good job of that- you'd fail a debate 100 class the way you're going about it. Saying "Maru got SMASHED" in tournaments where he gets 2nd place is hyperbolic and hurts your argument. Maru getting #1 in GSL and #2 in big weekenders is less of a variance than Reynor getting 0-4'ed in GSL and doing whatever 5-8th in weekenders.


I'd be interested in this exercise: How many weekender champs have never won a GSL. (INCLUDING Koreans, since there aren't enough foreign entrants to GSL) vs how many GSL champs have won weekenders. I'm not going to do the work/research though, lol. My guess is advantage goes to more GSL champs have also been weekender champs.



I can tell you why Maru has won weekend tournaments and Serral has not won a GSL.

1.- Going on a weekend is not a big sacrifice to earn 30,000 dollars.

2.- go live for 2 months in a completely different country, far from your family, a language that you could not understand in 2 months of practice, where the cost of living is extremely expensive for a prize of 3,000 dollars for winning the entire event xd.

Anyone who can do the math realizes why Koreans go out to play on the weekends and "foreigners" don't go in large numbers to compete in GSL.

Can you imagine if the GSL were played in Europe? same prize money, same preparation times, how many Koreans would we see traveling???? I assure you... none... because IT IS NOT PROFITABLE.

We, as fans, ... would love to see Serral Go... but for him it means nothing at all... only financial losses and loss of valuable time with his family and his people. It is a healthy, mature and prudent decision.


Serral already has won 2 GSL with 100% win rate

Whereas Maru and some of the Koreans indeed has won weekender but after how many tries? Safe to assume less than 25% win rate. Not that impressive.

I know the Koreans fanboys like to clown reynor for choking in the GSL. as a sort of flex or meme. But it’s not that much as a flex as they think it is. What’s Maru win rate attending weekender? Around 10%. His GSL win rate? Around 20%.

Quite good if compare to his Korean peers. But quite weak when compare to Serral win rate. There are levels to this


There are also levels between glorified showmatches (gsl v. the world) and gsl proper, yet here we are...

There are also levels between GSL and EWC/IEM/WCS and Maru hasn’t won and a single of any of the latter.


Only recently. In 2013 an OSL(or GSL) was harder to win than Blizzcon. Even in 2018 I would rate GSL harder to win by format/player pool but Blizzcon equals it due to the prize pool increasing player effort.


Chinese national Table Tennis tournament is harder to win than Table Tennis in Olympic games, does it matter Olympics games are worth more than national prizes?
njleslu2024
Profile Joined May 2024
57 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-08-09 15:05:58
August 09 2024 15:04 GMT
#110
bulldozer06701
Profile Joined July 2019
139 Posts
August 12 2024 05:26 GMT
#111
On August 07 2024 16:52 Kreuger wrote:
I wonder when they are going to release the casters etc for the event.

Im sure it will mostly be the same, but still.

Only ones that im sure of atm is rotterdam and artosis

Announced now on liquipedia
Kreuger
Profile Joined October 2011
Sweden795 Posts
August 12 2024 07:45 GMT
#112
On August 12 2024 14:26 bulldozer06701 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2024 16:52 Kreuger wrote:
I wonder when they are going to release the casters etc for the event.

Im sure it will mostly be the same, but still.

Only ones that im sure of atm is rotterdam and artosis

Announced now on liquipedia



Yeah saw it on reddit a few dags ago. Looking solid

Wednesday cant come soon enough, perfect to end your vacation with this :D
Harris1st
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Germany7021 Posts
August 12 2024 08:04 GMT
#113
On August 12 2024 14:26 bulldozer06701 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2024 16:52 Kreuger wrote:
I wonder when they are going to release the casters etc for the event.

Im sure it will mostly be the same, but still.

Only ones that im sure of atm is rotterdam and artosis

Announced now on liquipedia


Looks awesome! Only thing I would change would probably be put Harstem together with Lambo as analysts. This is not meant as a slight against State, just that Harambo is awesome
Go Serral! GG EZ for Ence. Flashbang dance FTW
bulldozer06701
Profile Joined July 2019
139 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-08-12 09:03:11
August 12 2024 08:25 GMT
#114
On August 12 2024 17:04 Harris1st wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 12 2024 14:26 bulldozer06701 wrote:
On August 07 2024 16:52 Kreuger wrote:
I wonder when they are going to release the casters etc for the event.

Im sure it will mostly be the same, but still.

Only ones that im sure of atm is rotterdam and artosis

Announced now on liquipedia


Looks awesome! Only thing I would change would probably be put Harstem together with Lambo as analysts. This is not meant as a slight against State, just that Harambo is awesome

State-Lambo could be good, looking forward to this duo
johnnyh123
Profile Joined February 2023
124 Posts
August 14 2024 04:02 GMT
#115
Group B definitely seems harder with 4 of the top 6 contenders imo, for championship. Namely Serral, herO, Solar, Reynor. The other two being Maru and Dark.

Also, why is Group A so Terran-heavy, I guess this tournament is majority Terran. Like what someone said, Dark is gonna be eating Terran for breakfast, lunch, and dinner, and snack.
johnnyh123
Profile Joined February 2023
124 Posts
August 14 2024 04:03 GMT
#116
Given soju (alcohol) is illegal in the country, it's gonna be hard chugging down all those Terrans.
Prev 1 4 5 6 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 18h 53m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Liquid`VortiX 190
White-Ra 131
IndyStarCraft 131
BRAT_OK 100
trigger 97
DivinesiaTV 22
MindelVK 9
StarCraft: Brood War
EffOrt 743
actioN 223
ggaemo 102
Hyun 84
sorry 78
hero 75
Oya187 62
Snow 61
yabsab 43
Mind 41
[ Show more ]
soO 40
Yoon 36
ToSsGirL 27
910 21
HiyA 20
zelot 14
ivOry 8
Barracks 0
Dota 2
syndereN987
BananaSlamJamma444
League of Legends
Trikslyr57
Counter-Strike
allub138
Other Games
FrodaN2190
fl0m709
Beastyqt648
hiko601
Lowko409
Fuzer 369
DeMusliM236
XaKoH 100
QueenE89
Mew2King70
nookyyy 20
RushiSC15
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 52
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV1265
League of Legends
• Nemesis3399
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Invitational
18h 53m
Gerald vs YoungYakov
Spirit vs MaNa
SHIN vs Percival
Creator vs Scarlett
Replay Cast
1d 15h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 18h
ByuN vs Solar
Clem vs Classic
Cure vs herO
Reynor vs MaxPax
Replay Cast
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Krystianer vs TBD
TriGGeR vs SKillous
Percival vs TBD
ByuN vs Nicoract
Replay Cast
5 days
Wardi Open
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

YSL S2
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
CSL Season 19: Qualifier 2
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22

Upcoming

CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
Nations Cup 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.