EWC Starting Brackets Revealed

On July 11 2024 07:09 Die4Ever wrote:
wait where is SHIN??

"Knockout Bracket:
13 players from the Main Stage and 2 players from the Qualifiers"

ok so Shin and Showtime will be in the knockout bracket, I'm guessing top left and bottom left of the bracket

so the top 4 will be made up of the 1st place from each group, the winner between the 2nd place from each group (with the loser going to the knockout bracket), and the last slot is the winner of the knockout bracket

the 3rd place guy from each group has to play a ton of games to reach the top 4 lol

On July 11 2024 22:18 Balnazza wrote:


As with everything, Saudi-Arabia (and Qatar) are trying to push into Esports from the Team-side of things aswell, so any game where it is justifiable to do a MENA-qualifier, they did.
For SC2 though, it would have been way too much of a stretch. What's the last MENA-player who did something remotely noteworthy in SC2? Adonminus (not that Israel is usually part of the MENA-qualifiers...)? PandaTank from South Africa?
I think in WESG, the MENA-slots always went to Stephano because he can play from Algeria, right?

On July 12 2024 04:35 JJH777 wrote:
I can't find info on this anywhere. Are the groups bo3 or bo5? I like that it's basically all KR vs World besides Serral vs Coffee and herO vs Solar. Nice bracket. If it's bo5 it will really tell us where the world sans Serral stands against Korea.

On July 11 2024 12:15 bela.mervado wrote:


yeah
i think it's a bit too complicated

could have been 4 guys from open,
then group stage RR of 4x 5 guys, top 2 into
playoffs with KO bracket

or the top 3 advancing:
4x #1 goes to ro8 waiting for 4 guys:
4x #2-#3 (=8) into 'ro16' winners to play group #1 s
with double elim bracket


current bracket feels a bit weird
imagine
imagine a contest with 6 groups of 4 each
where top 2 advances
and additionally best 4 of the #3s also advances (4 out of the 6 #3s)
would be silly innit?

On July 12 2024 14:18 radracer wrote:



Aww it's ok little guy, you'll figure out the difference between a weekend tournament and a league one day!

In all seriousness, you have to dedicate prep for an entire bracket vs a small number of matches, or even one. No one thinks there is "Zero prep" for a weekender, it's a different kind of prep. But somehow people post and actually think that the argument is zero prep vs concentrated prep, then make silly premises like this, which is baffling. Even when we have so many examples of how hard it is for non GSL regulars to perform in GSL.

On July 13 2024 02:12 Blitzball04 wrote:


Lol GSL prep build is a myth. There has no prep build since 2017 every game is standard meta game. Once in a blue moon there might be a weird prep build.

No one cares for GSL for years now, cause those Korean pros cares fighting for that 3K first place prize lol.

The hardest tournaments to win are the ones with Serral

On July 13 2024 02:24 lokol4890 wrote:


Without caring they still keep kicking reynor out in the group stages, the same guy who's won plenty of tournaments that serral has attended

On July 13 2024 02:54 WombaT wrote:

Not massively because of prep though if memory serves, and it may not.

I think only Gumiho that I remember seemed to have much of a specific anti-Reynor plan last time around. herO just played his usual game and was the better player on the day.

Reynor being on a bit of a slump feels far more the reason he failed to make it out of groups in 2 attempts than him being sniped by superior preparation overall.

Any big international tournament where you know brackets week in advance will have just as much prep opportunities as a GSL group stage nowadays.

And as the Ro4 and finals are done in one go now, the prep now goes from 3 potential opponents rather than a laser focused window to hoodwink a singular player.

On July 13 2024 13:49 Gantz023 wrote:
Dont get me wrong... u prepare against someone knowing his weakness, as example they have mentioned Reynor has been very open in saying what are the things he has problems dealing with. Serral on the other hand (apparently) has no problem going to the Late game... or mech... no problem... how do you prepare against that? first u must find the weakness to prepare against. Can anyone tell how to prepare against that?

In the interview with Hero he said it clearly... when he thinks he can find a small Rift and take advantage to win a game... when he plays against Serral in a tournament he is simply another beast. He feels like he can't do anything.

In a game where 95% of the games are standard......the master of the standards will be the favorite.

Personally I LOVE Reynor but... he is far from achieving the consistency in his game, scout, even build preparation that Serral has.

On July 13 2024 14:03 tigera6 wrote:

I wouldnt say herO is an example of playing the prep build, he just decide on whatever build he feels like it at the moment. Having said that, the issue with prepped against Serral is that there is no Zerg playing like Serral at the moment, and I doubt any Zerg would switch their playstyle just to help other players to practice against Serral even if they were teammate. Dark is the closest one what can match certain aspect of Serral playstyle, but hes not on any team, and I doubt he would try to help any other players by practicing with them and also allow them to prep for Dark himself.

So basically to prep against Serral, you have to play a bunch of games against Serral himself. And thats why the 2 guys who have given Serral a good run for his money are Clem and Oliveira. Clem plays against Serral on ladder a bunch of time, so he got pretty used to it by now, and Oliveira has been Serral practice partner in recent time. Imo Maru has the mechanics to play even against Serral but his in-game decision making has been terrible, not just against Serral but also against Dark in the GSL Final. And its not helping that Maru teammate is Solar, playing the almost opposite Zerg style as Serral/Dark in ZvT.

On July 14 2024 01:02 tigera6 wrote:
I dont think herO prepping for any particular opponent, he likes to dictate the pace early and play his own aggressive style no matter who hes playing against. But herO has a good variety of build so he can just pick one at any moment in time and its probably looking good.

And like I said, if you want to prep against someone, you need to plan a specific strategy against that player base on his build and timing. Its not just about getting better overall, its about getting into the rhythm and be able to make the correct decision base on the plan. I am saying that if KR players want to beat Serral, they need to practice more against his style, which is virtually different from every other Zerg from the planet, outside of Dark who also doesnt want to practice much against his potential opponents neither.

Back in the StarLeague day, I think most teams have players that was specialized in playing the build from others and become practice partner for teammate. But I dont think we have seen that or heard about it in recent times for KR scene.

On July 14 2024 01:23 Gantz023 wrote:


And Which is that Style Serral that "that Diferent from the other zerg " ???..... BTW It is Serral that demonstrated Prep... the games between Oliveira-Serral and Maru-Serral... They were totally different and a masterclass on how to destroy Maru's style of play. and Maru on the other hand, the God of the GSL of preparation, without being able to adapt, without showing flexibility, without knowing how to read the attacks.

We are going to pray that we don't have such an overwhelming final and that it is a good show... Maru has had 6 months to study Serral's style. and EVERYONE KNOWS (and I think there is no debate at this point) that if they want to win the tournament they will have to beat Serral at one time or another.

On July 14 2024 06:52 b0lt wrote:
Is there a group of death, dismemberment, and dissolution in acid?

On July 14 2024 12:58 CicadaSC wrote:
I actually don't see serral as the favorite here. You can check his ladder account and he's been passed by Clem. Also some uncharacteristic losses recently. You can say it's just ladder but Serral doesn't meme or troll on ladder. I think it is a sign of things to come. herO or Classic have to be the tournament favorites.

On July 14 2024 12:58 CicadaSC wrote:
I actually don't see serral as the favorite here. You can check his ladder account and he's been passed by Clem. Also some uncharacteristic losses recently. You can say it's just ladder but Serral doesn't meme or troll on ladder. I think it is a sign of things to come. herO or Classic have to be the tournament favorites.

On July 16 2024 18:52 onPHYRE wrote:
I didn’t think there was much debate that Reynor is probably the closest approximation to playing versus Serral that there is.. Dark is far too aggressive and sadly Rogue, DRG, SHIN just don’t have the speed required to be at a championship level these days. Solar plays more similar to the other Korean Zergs while Reynor is the second best EU Zerg and has a lot of similar tendencies to Serral. He just lacks a bit on decision making in those intense moments compared to Serral (he still does it better than almost anyone in the world except maybe Clem, Maru, MaxPax and Serral still).

On July 13 2024 02:24 lokol4890 wrote:


Without caring they still keep kicking reynor out in the group stages, the same guy who's won plenty of tournaments that serral has attended

On July 16 2024 23:04 njleslu2024 wrote:

Maru who won plenty of GSLs was smashed in international tournaments where Serral attend.

On July 17 2024 04:13 Balnazza wrote:


Maru had pretty poor performances in the past. Reynor participated...how often in GSL? Two times? Three? One of these times he was in a big slump (this year). People always pretend like Reynor played the last five years non-stop GSL and never managed to go beyond the group stage...

On July 17 2024 06:40 Balnazza wrote:


Technically Reynor performed worse in IEM Katowice 2024 than in GSL (Top 20 vs. Top 16). And no, no one said his slump was over. GSL was literally the tournament for him to prove that it was.

And no, this wasn't about "GSL is harder because of the players", but "GSL is harder because of the format". But the format had little to do with Reynors performance this year. And honestly, probably not much to do with his former failures aswell.

On July 17 2024 13:19 radracer wrote:
That and a ton more pressure on him since he wants to prove he can do well at GSL- so he just choked it up despite him saying he felt super good and was practicing a bunch. you have to be in top form to win GSL + have the mental wherewithal if you want to win the historically greatest tournament the game has ever known. If you care about it, like Reynor does, it's that much added pressure. Which I think would be fair to say, anyone who enters that tournament, especially foreigners, will have that level of care to win, despite what internet people say.

On July 17 2024 02:37 lokol4890 wrote:


Maru has won plenty of tournaments that serral has attended, just fyi, also in what universe is getting back to back second places at iem and dallas getting "smashed." Do you really not see a difference between maru losing in the grandfinals and reynor getting kicked out in groups?

On July 18 2024 00:41 njleslu2024 wrote:

Are you just lying to yourself? In what universe do you think getting 4-0 twice in a back to back final is not equivalent to "being smashed"?
Also I'm just refuting your claim of "Reynor got knocked out in GSL but won many tournaments where Serral attened", do I need to remind you that Maru also got knocked out a lot of times in international tournaments. Does it mean GSL is a easier touenamernt? So funny your argument is.

On July 18 2024 00:49 tigera6 wrote:

Maru doesnt really get knocked out in the group stage of international tournament that much. Other than Serral, he has been the most consistent player in international tournament for the last 3-4 years. Trust me, if Maru got eliminated in a Ro16 of a tournament, we would be all over it.

On July 18 2024 01:04 njleslu2024 wrote:

I know he is one of the most consistent players. I'm just refuting the nonsense "Reynor get knocked out in GSL group stage, he USED TO win some tournaments where Serral participates so GSL is harder", Reynor also failed to advance in Starswar and IEM this year, and he was on fire when he won Gamers 8 last year, his GSL placement doesn't mean shit.

On July 18 2024 01:57 Fango wrote:

Saying 'getting smashed' and missing off the 'in the finals' part is kinda misleading. Losing in the finals still puts him at a top 2 contender.

If you think Maru got smashed then every other player except Serral did even worse.

On July 18 2024 03:30 Fango wrote:

Well you definitely need to include in the 'in the final part'. Otherwise you give the impression Maru does as badly overseas as Reynor does in GSL. Which isn't true, nowadays Maru makes the finals of most tournaments, Reynor lost in GSL group stages.

Losing in the finals is still an incredible achievement.

Additionally, in 2024 Maru didn't really do any worse in those overseas events than he did in GSL. He came second at Dreamhack and IEM and first in Starswar. Similarly he came first and second in the two GSL seasons.

On July 18 2024 11:33 Balnazza wrote:
Out of the 27 different GSL-winners according to Liquipedia (I excluded Serral, sOs and Trap since they didn't win Code S and Life because it's Life), 19 did win Premier-listed weekenders. Though I didn't particularly check what kind of weekenders, from WCS Global Finals over HomeStory Cups to RedBull Battlegrounds or even GSL vs. the World everything is an option. Therefore eight players (NesTea, Cure, GuMiho, FruitDealer, Jjkaji, RorO, Seed and Sniper) did not manage to win a "weekender". If you think SSL should be rated as Code S, then this list would need to include soO, I think every other SSL-winner also won a Code S at some point.

In reverse, if my count is correct (just expect a +/-1 here), 63 players have won a "weekender" (or in general a non-Code S), without ever winning a Code S.

Again, the definition what exactly a "Premier"-event is, is not consistent on Liquipedia, so all of this should be considered a rough estimation. But these are the raw stats:
19 GSL Champions have won a weekender Premier of any kind.
8 GSL Champions have not won a weekender Premier of any kind.
63 weekender Premier Champions of any kind have not won GSL.

I'm not sure how many GSL Code S there have been exactly (since the Medal-Ranking on Liquipedia mushes together Code S, vs. the World and Super Tournament), I think I did count 47, though feel free to check on that. In comparison, there are 311 Premier events in total (so 264 events that aren't Code S).
Just for the sake of easy numbers, lets pretend that there are five-times as many Weekenders than Code S. So just for fun, lets pretend that there are as many GSL Code S as there are Weekenders - and the distribution of champions in Code S stays the same as before. Meaning, if we take it times 5, 95 GSL Champs would have won a weekender, 40 would have not, while 63 Weekender Champs would not have won GSL.

So yes, if this construct, that I can only assume breaks atleast a few rules of statistics, would hold, we could say that more players win weekenders and not Code S than vice versa. Though just to point out one flaw, this of course ignores the amount of actual wins players get and the fact that not all players who won Weekenders also participated in Code S (Serral being of course the most noteworthy, but there are others).

So there are your numbers, maybe you can make better assumptions based on them than I did.

...also, Note to myself, great way to waste an hour...

On July 18 2024 07:08 radracer wrote:



You're not doing a very good job of that- you'd fail a debate 100 class the way you're going about it. Saying "Maru got SMASHED" in tournaments where he gets 2nd place is hyperbolic and hurts your argument. Maru getting #1 in GSL and #2 in big weekenders is less of a variance than Reynor getting 0-4'ed in GSL and doing whatever 5-8th in weekenders.


I'd be interested in this exercise: How many weekender champs have never won a GSL. (INCLUDING Koreans, since there aren't enough foreign entrants to GSL) vs how many GSL champs have won weekenders. I'm not going to do the work/research though, lol. My guess is advantage goes to more GSL champs have also been weekender champs.

On July 18 2024 21:08 jodljodl wrote:
let's make every thread about who's better, koreans or foreigners, who's the GOAT, maru or serral, what's more tasty, pasta or noodles, shall we?

"EWC starting brackets revealed"
Holy smokes. That looks like a big fat chunk of awesome sc2. gonna be an interesting tournament for certain. hooray for sc2. hooray for us.

Now back on topic, where was I? ah right. F*** everybody who cannot see the truth for what it is that serral is the GOAT. OBVIOUSLY. Them fools talk about maru when serral is b****slapping him every chance he gets. Also, f*** everyone who even dares to think serral is the GOAT. yea, sure, he's pretty good. but he didn't even win 1 singular GSL. not 1. ZERO. Didn't even attend one. But if you look at these stats and assume this and that and also stand upside down one can clearly see that my proof that tournament xyz and tournament types k,l and m are about as hard as gsl. if not even harder. and since grubby played orc back in the day and ud was super underpowered all his tournament wins don't really matter because fov was clearly the superior player. and fov liked his mum's food so much. that's why he's a bit chubby, he said. or was it MC? anyway, since MC's chubbyness is way cuter than fovs according to aligulac his mum is the better cook. obviously. last but not least. every cs iteration is way harder than bw or sc2 because you have to coordinate with your teammates. a skill which is way harder to learn than anything else in the world as recent studies have shown.

On July 18 2024 07:08 radracer wrote:



You're not doing a very good job of that- you'd fail a debate 100 class the way you're going about it. Saying "Maru got SMASHED" in tournaments where he gets 2nd place is hyperbolic and hurts your argument. Maru getting #1 in GSL and #2 in big weekenders is less of a variance than Reynor getting 0-4'ed in GSL and doing whatever 5-8th in weekenders.


I'd be interested in this exercise: How many weekender champs have never won a GSL. (INCLUDING Koreans, since there aren't enough foreign entrants to GSL) vs how many GSL champs have won weekenders. I'm not going to do the work/research though, lol. My guess is advantage goes to more GSL champs have also been weekender champs.

On July 19 2024 11:27 Gantz023 wrote:



I can tell you why Maru has won weekend tournaments and Serral has not won a GSL.

1.- Going on a weekend is not a big sacrifice to earn 30,000 dollars.

2.- go live for 2 months in a completely different country, far from your family, a language that you could not understand in 2 months of practice, where the cost of living is extremely expensive for a prize of 3,000 dollars for winning the entire event xd.

Anyone who can do the math realizes why Koreans go out to play on the weekends and "foreigners" don't go in large numbers to compete in GSL.

Can you imagine if the GSL were played in Europe? same prize money, same preparation times, how many Koreans would we see traveling???? I assure you... none... because IT IS NOT PROFITABLE.

We, as fans, ... would love to see Serral Go... but for him it means nothing at all... only financial losses and loss of valuable time with his family and his people. It is a healthy, mature and prudent decision.

On July 19 2024 16:55 radracer wrote:


This argument has been debunked so many times, someone already beat me to it. But I'd also like to add that competitors go play in the Olympics for no pay, it's a desire to compete. Why'd Reynor go? And why have so many other foreigners gone in the past? Coming up for real world excuses for the guy is so silly and fanboy-ish.

On July 19 2024 18:43 Harris1st wrote:


Since his uprising in 2018
I quickly counted 62 participations, 26 wins. 42%
Also the GSL / Weekenders thing has been chewed so many times. Obviously flying out somewhere for a week is easier than uprooting your whole life for 3 month+

"there's also a good chance he 0-4's out"
Whaaat? I'm not sure what you've been smoking... There is a very very very slim chance he's out 0-4. Like less than 1%
While there is at least a 20%+ chance he would be royal roading

On July 19 2024 23:08 WombaT wrote:

I guess we’ve few tournaments outside the GSL that use that format, so can’t really assess a direct comparison.

When is the last time Serral even went out at the group stage, or first stage of a tournament possible for him to exit?

Like I’ve scoured his record a few times for various stats, haven’t fully deep-dived but even from that bit of browsing I think it’s likely to be pre-2018

Him going 0-4 feels almost unfathomably unlikely. For him to exit at the group stage wouldn’t be impossible, but you’d probably need a ridiculously stacked group and even then he’s probably still winning at least one match, never mind a single set.

On July 19 2024 11:27 Gantz023 wrote:



I can tell you why Maru has won weekend tournaments and Serral has not won a GSL.

1.- Going on a weekend is not a big sacrifice to earn 30,000 dollars.

2.- go live for 2 months in a completely different country, far from your family, a language that you could not understand in 2 months of practice, where the cost of living is extremely expensive for a prize of 3,000 dollars for winning the entire event xd.

Anyone who can do the math realizes why Koreans go out to play on the weekends and "foreigners" don't go in large numbers to compete in GSL.

Can you imagine if the GSL were played in Europe? same prize money, same preparation times, how many Koreans would we see traveling???? I assure you... none... because IT IS NOT PROFITABLE.

We, as fans, ... would love to see Serral Go... but for him it means nothing at all... only financial losses and loss of valuable time with his family and his people. It is a healthy, mature and prudent decision.

On August 07 2024 22:57 Blitzball04 wrote:


Serral already has won 2 GSL with 100% win rate

Whereas Maru and some of the Koreans indeed has won weekender but after how many tries? Safe to assume less than 25% win rate. Not that impressive.

I know the Koreans fanboys like to clown reynor for choking in the GSL. as a sort of flex or meme. But it’s not that much as a flex as they think it is. What’s Maru win rate attending weekender? Around 10%. His GSL win rate? Around 20%.

Quite good if compare to his Korean peers. But quite weak when compare to Serral win rate. There are levels to this

On July 19 2024 16:58 radracer wrote:



It looks like most GSL champs have won weekenders, but not vice versa. Pretty good exercise to me. Also, Serral hasn't won half the weekenders in SC2, maybe he has since you've been watching? IDK


Chances Serral royal rotors it will get better the longer he delays going to GSL, but there's also a good chance he 0-4's out like Reynor, no one knows. So far his competitive drive hasn't taken him to Korea.

On August 07 2024 23:43 lokol4890 wrote:


There are also levels between glorified showmatches (gsl v. the world) and gsl proper, yet here we are...

On July 18 2024 15:15 radracer wrote:



I didn't pick any fight nor did I originally bring up the argument, that was someone else. But I observed this, and you're in a discussion, so yeah. If you want to have a good one, that's a suggestion. It seems like you're taking it super personally, and are invested rather than just enjoying the discussion.

"My idle Maru" well He's not my idol or even my favorite player, I hate Terran in SC1, lol. I haven't had a favorite player for a while now, since probably HuK. Still a SC fan first and foremost, & always will be. Anyways clearly this is your assumption due to the aforementioned personal biases. Not everything is a Maru vs Serral Debate. That aside, Maru has won weekenders, high level / premiere ones at that. Regardless of the the "world championship" label the tournaments are of the same quality players. Would be sick to see if Serral could win a GSL even in the weaker korean scene due to lack of interest, but who knows if he will ever have that desire.


<edited out some flaming/trash talk, not really productive>

On August 08 2024 22:43 njleslu2024 wrote:

There are also levels between GSL and EWC/IEM/WCS and Maru hasn’t won and a single of any of the latter.

On August 09 2024 03:42 Balnazza wrote:


The winner of the next big announced Stormgate-tournament gets 800$...you would need to be batshit crazy to focus on Stormgate instead of the EWC... AoE 4 had much bigger prizemoney right off the bat and even that didn't particularly catch many SC2-players.
With Clem I assume he just played the Tasteless-Invitational because he was in Korea anyway? Or is he actually really focusing on Stormgate right now?

On August 09 2024 04:51 JJH777 wrote:


Only recently. In 2013 an OSL(or GSL) was harder to win than Blizzcon. Even in 2018 I would rate GSL harder to win by format/player pool but Blizzcon equals it due to the prize pool increasing player effort.

On August 07 2024 16:52 Kreuger wrote:
I wonder when they are going to release the casters etc for the event.

Im sure it will mostly be the same, but still.

Only ones that im sure of atm is rotterdam and artosis

On August 12 2024 14:26 bulldozer06701 wrote:

Announced now on liquipedia

On August 12 2024 17:04 Harris1st wrote:


Looks awesome! Only thing I would change would probably be put Harstem together with Lambo as analysts. This is not meant as a slight against State, just that Harambo is awesome