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WGT-Baal
France3558 Posts
Same boat, Korean casts all the time, every time. The raw passion is just hard to replicate plus I also grew up with it before english casts were a thing, the ogn and then gom casts at 5am at university. (i am old...) They were however amazing at WCG and DH and clearly a loss to the scene, especially for younger folks. If they can't do as many casts from videos, transitioning to a day9 style series would be amazing. Or maybe like "game of the month" or something with analysis, interviews etc... | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany16091 Posts
On October 20 2022 22:42 xsnac wrote: link an account then. I stand by what I say, artosis is clueless about the game because he never plays it. also, hello we talk about sc2. edit: link artosis ladder account and we shall see how good he was/is. Well, he literally played in the first season of GSL | ||
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Zambrah
United States7393 Posts
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AirbladeOrange
United States2574 Posts
On October 21 2022 00:17 Charoisaur wrote: Well, he literally played in the first season of GSL https://youtu.be/qYYGC2HET0w That was 12 years ago. I'm under the impression he basically stopped playing SC2 a while ago, let alone maintaining a high degree of skill. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany16091 Posts
On October 21 2022 03:01 AirbladeOrange wrote: That was 12 years ago. I'm under the impression he basically stopped playing SC2 a while ago, let alone maintaining a high degree of skill. Yes he did, nobody said he maintained a high skill level, the claim was just that he competed at close to the highest level at the start of WoL. Although I remember there was a caster tournament a few years back (maybe 2016-17?) and Artosis was one of the best in it, on a level with Rotterdam and ToD. edit:  EsportsEarnings Casters Invitational here it is. Maybe not on a level with ToD but he definitely still was very good in 2017 | ||
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moonsjde
48 Posts
while i don't like everything about artosis, he did maintain a good understanding of build interactions for a non pro player, so that part of his casting i always did like, and i don't really care what his MMR would be as long as he doesn't sound clueless. he was wrong/behind the times sometimes but i never thought he sounded totally lost | ||
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xsnac
Barbados1365 Posts
On October 21 2022 03:07 Charoisaur wrote: Yes he did, nobody said he maintained a high skill level, the claim was just that he competed at close to the highest level at the start of WoL. Although I remember there was a caster tournament a few years back (maybe 2016-17?) and Artosis was one of the best in it, on a level with Rotterdam and ToD. edit: EsportsEarnings Casters Invitational here it is. Maybe not on a level with ToD but he definitely still was very good in 2017 Again, don't wanna go too much off-topic here, but let us view this on a more critical note, Rotterdam that nowadays is GM and all the drill, but back then, aligulac says he was horse-shit (around 800 back then, now is 1800): http://aligulac.com/players/635-RotterdaM/ Again, in the quoted tournament, which is again meaningless without having artosis ladder account we can't make a claim, but based just on 1 tournament, he was around 800 rating (making it in the semi's just like rotty). We maybe should ask rotty his game knowledge with 800 aligulac rating and his gaming knowledge with 1800 rating. I doubt he will hide the truth. I would ask you, if he was playing the game why not post his account? What is there to hide? | ||
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Whatson
United States5357 Posts
On October 21 2022 05:01 xsnac wrote: Again, don't wanna go too much off-topic here, but let us view this on a more critical note, Rotterdam that nowadays is GM and all the drill, but back then, aligulac says he was horse-shit (around 800 back then, now is 1800): http://aligulac.com/players/635-RotterdaM/ Again, in the quoted tournament, which is again meaningless without having artosis ladder account we can't make a claim, but based just on 1 tournament, he was around 800 rating (making it in the semi's just like rotty). We maybe should ask rotty his game knowledge with 800 aligulac rating and his gaming knowledge with 1800 rating. I doubt he will hide the truth. I would ask you, if he was playing the game why not post his account? What is there to hide? You're all over the place. What are you trying to argue? That Artosis was never good at the game, that he wasn't good at the game in 2016/2017, or that he isn't good at the game now? Also, are we basing how good somebody is strictly on ladder points? | ||
Poopi
France13018 Posts
On October 21 2022 05:01 xsnac wrote: Again, don't wanna go too much off-topic here, but let us view this on a more critical note, Rotterdam that nowadays is GM and all the drill, but back then, aligulac says he was horse-shit (around 800 back then, now is 1800): http://aligulac.com/players/635-RotterdaM/ Again, in the quoted tournament, which is again meaningless without having artosis ladder account we can't make a claim, but based just on 1 tournament, he was around 800 rating (making it in the semi's just like rotty). We maybe should ask rotty his game knowledge with 800 aligulac rating and his gaming knowledge with 1800 rating. I doubt he will hide the truth. I would ask you, if he was playing the game why not post his account? What is there to hide? Aligulac rating is a bit useless for inactive players though? If you don’t play enough games the algorithm does not have time to adjust. Back then some players were high/ top masters and a few casters were low GM level, notably ToD, Rotti, YoGo. I was impressed back then at how decent Artosis / Tasteless were without much practice, so even without actively playing sc2 since a few years, they have decent knowledge. Their main issue is that they don’t really have time (because of work, timezone, lack of interest, idk) to watch a lot of international tournaments, so they are sometimes behind in the meta or will say « wow we have never seen this » despite the build being played at a big tournament three days ago or something. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany16091 Posts
On October 21 2022 05:01 xsnac wrote: Again, don't wanna go too much off-topic here, but let us view this on a more critical note, Rotterdam that nowadays is GM and all the drill, but back then, aligulac says he was horse-shit (around 800 back then, now is 1800): http://aligulac.com/players/635-RotterdaM/ Again, in the quoted tournament, which is again meaningless without having artosis ladder account we can't make a claim, but based just on 1 tournament, he was around 800 rating (making it in the semi's just like rotty). We maybe should ask rotty his game knowledge with 800 aligulac rating and his gaming knowledge with 1800 rating. I doubt he will hide the truth. I would ask you, if he was playing the game why not post his account? What is there to hide? I'm not acting like Artosis nowadays is a super high-level player but your claim was that he literally never played the game except in WoL beta which is clearly wrong as I proved. At the start of sc2 he was competing near the highest level and he still was at a fairly respectable level in 2017. | ||
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Kullosus1
1 Post
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27403 Posts
I thought Artosis and Scan/Special were also good combos and a little different in terms of blend in a good sense, something a little different. I’m way more concerned about the tournament itself. I know I’ve missed some good games, I’ve been busier than I would otherwise have been, but it’s really the increasing clear lack of top, top players duking it out and in shape that’s my biggest concern. Rag making the final two, even just one year ago is like wow great story, amazing, what a run! This time it feels more like some good shows and some decent bracket luck | ||
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DivinesiaTV
Finland58 Posts
Perhaps some of the korean players could join if they want to? For example Solar speaks rather fluent english. Add his game knowledge and Tasteless epicness and we do well. Perhaps you could invite some english casters there here and then? To my surprise Ive shared conversations with couple of people who actually said they stopped watching GSL as Artosis and Tasteless werent on top of the meta of sc2 anymore and it showed in some calls of inside the game. Never been too much of a problem to me though, Tastosis have been legendarily fun always. Not saying Artosis can be replaced, but we can still head up for something different and epic. | ||
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ApatheticSchizoid
Canada85 Posts
On October 20 2022 10:13 Fanatic-Templar wrote: No change from me, if they keep broadcasting I'll keep watching. I may be alone in this, but I think Artosis and Tasteless together were actually less enjoyable than apart, at least in the last few years. Like, imagine a television series on its twelfth season. I don't know that I'd say that they're worse than they were in 2010, I think I'm just too familiar with their material by now. I always thought the same. Even though they have been friends most of their life and casting together, I always felt they had no chemistry with each other as casters. They constantly talked over each other usually over non relevant off topic conversations while they ignored the game. It's probably due to their friendship that it's like that, but as casters it just didn't work for me. They are both mostly color commentators. Tasteless being one more so then artosis, but I felt like it always lacked a really in-depth commentary that could actually follow the game instead of just saying 'woah' whenever something really technical happened. | ||
Liquid`Ret
Netherlands4531 Posts
On October 21 2022 05:01 xsnac wrote: Again, don't wanna go too much off-topic here, but let us view this on a more critical note, Rotterdam that nowadays is GM and all the drill, but back then, aligulac says he was horse-shit (around 800 back then, now is 1800): http://aligulac.com/players/635-RotterdaM/ Again, in the quoted tournament, which is again meaningless without having artosis ladder account we can't make a claim, but based just on 1 tournament, he was around 800 rating (making it in the semi's just like rotty). We maybe should ask rotty his game knowledge with 800 aligulac rating and his gaming knowledge with 1800 rating. I doubt he will hide the truth. I would ask you, if he was playing the game why not post his account? What is there to hide? Rotterdam in 2017 had hit 6k mmr. I'm sure he has gotten better over time but I think relative to the rest of the player base, his level is probably roughly the same. 6k mmr was pretty good back then. Realistically Artosis could play sc2 at any time he wants for 2 weeks and hit at least gm. How far he can get in gm depends on how much time he wants to invest. He has a base level of skills obtained over years of playing sc2 & bw that would allow him to accomplish a decent rating pretty quickly. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27403 Posts
That’s playing the game at a high level. You can understand how the game works at a pretty damn high level, but not be able to remotely execute it yourself. It’s not a new game either, we’ve 10 years of in some cases a ton of watching and calling games. Outside of real technical build optimisations etc, and discounting actual newbies to the scene I don’t think you’d see a great amount of correlation in increased predictive ability moving up from non-active/lower level players and high level ones Certainly not always, but competitive, really active players do tend to develop certain biases regarding their race of choice more so than somebody who’s dipping their toes in but is primarily a caster | ||
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Agh
United States1105 Posts
Only other person to really fit that mold was day9. Artosis casts never really added any value for me for gsl. Not that he was detracting, but I actually thought State did a better job in terms of analysis and what he brought. I still watch both him and tasteless stream from time to time but as far as casting and gsl is concerned it won't effect my viewing habits at all. | ||
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washikie
United States752 Posts
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argonautdice
Canada2722 Posts
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Drfilip
Sweden592 Posts
The slow pace of GSL is what allows me to watch the games unspoiled while also check in on this site. But I am also happy to see some change in the GSL casting. The intermittent guest casters have always done something to the cast. Some people mixed well, like NoRegret and State, and I believe that they will restore some of the older expert commentary if they get the chance. As is, they are selectively knowledgeable. State especially got way better at game analysis the second go he had. The first one seemed mostly like genuine interest of learning more - something Tastosis lost long ago. Tastosis are working with broad platitudes while the guests have been concrete and detailed. Artosis used to do. He transitioned into Tasteless old habits while Tasteless went even further into the "commentator, not the expert" role. Most sport commentary I encounter have 1 general commentator and 1 expert that knows the details. I always - not using a hyperbole here, I mean always - enjoy it way more when the expert simplifies and explains the intricacies. I can watch roller derby, curling, 3,000 metre hurdles... It is the expert that makes it interesting while the other commentator acts as an intermediate between the three other thing: the sport, the expert, and the audience. GSL needs an expert again. They have been without for a few years now. Clarification: an expert doesn't need to play the game. Their knowledge is not mechanical skill and speed. It is builds, choices, statistics and other such things. They can get that skill by talking to players and coaches, and by analysing games. They collect knowledge and share it with the viewers. | ||
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