EPTHow will Artosis' departure from the GSL affect your viewi…
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TL.net Bot
TL.net131 Posts
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Harris1st
Germany6906 Posts
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BisuDagger
Bisutopia19230 Posts
If they do anything like they are doing with Brood War, then I'll be watching them a lot less. I'm happy that the duo still casts Brood War, but because of the delay in released vods, I'm unable to stay unspoiled from results for that long. If they do that with SC2, then I'll unfortunately be unable to watch them. Nothing will ever capture the magic of these two guys, so if an independent stream pops up, it will need to be immensely analytical. It's a huge reason why Scan and Nyoken are doing so well given the competition. | ||
Poopi
France12793 Posts
However if ESL deals go on but there is no more GSL (so probably no more KR scene at all) I will probably watch far less sc2, the KR scene is simply the best content imho. | ||
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Vision_
861 Posts
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Creager
Germany1893 Posts
On October 18 2022 23:17 Harris1st wrote: If GSL is continued the way it was I will still be watching as much as possible. Whoever will cast instead of Artosis has big shoes to fill but will do so without a doubt Whoever has to follow-up is gonna have a very tough time as the synergy between Artosis and Tasteless made for such an insanely unique casting experience I never even minded them going off-topic for longer periods because it just vibed perfectly with my sense of humor, so I highly doubt whatever comes next will be even close. | ||
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BisuDagger
Bisutopia19230 Posts
On October 19 2022 00:54 Creager wrote: Whoever has to follow-up is gonna have a very tough time as the synergy between Artosis and Tasteless made for such an insanely unique casting experience I never even minded them going off-topic for longer periods because it just vibed perfectly with my sense of humor, so I highly doubt whatever comes next will be even close. Sure, but my attitude will be super supportive no matter the combo that ends up on stage. Growth and practice time should be given. | ||
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QOGQOG
834 Posts
On October 19 2022 01:28 BisuDagger wrote: Sure, but my attitude will be super supportive no matter the combo that ends up on stage. Growth and practice time should be given. I'll definitely give the next duo a shot, but it'll depend on them finding their own dynamic. The reason I'd stop watching would be if military returnees stop and we end up with a tiny pool of top competitors, which is why I already don't watch much non Korean stuff. | ||
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Creager
Germany1893 Posts
On October 19 2022 01:28 BisuDagger wrote: Sure, but my attitude will be super supportive no matter the combo that ends up on stage. Growth and practice time should be given. Of course, being supportive should be a given, but while I don't exactly know if there's still any negotiating going on regarding Artosis continuing to cast online I still have a glimmer of hope left that this might not actually be the end of the casting archon in GSL. | ||
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swarminfestor
Malaysia2449 Posts
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swarminfestor
Malaysia2449 Posts
On October 18 2022 23:39 Poopi wrote: I will watch the same amount: I mostly watch GSL because it interests me and the casting is a nice bonus, the games are the main treat. However if ESL deals go on but there is no more GSL (so probably no more KR scene at all) I will probably watch far less sc2, the KR scene is simply the best content imho. True. I don't want to waste time watching honorable macro fight without any variation from both player. Also, doing cheesy things, making proxies and timing pushes make the series much more colorful. | ||
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Argonauta
Spain4906 Posts
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dbRic1203
Germany2655 Posts
I m not watching it that often anymore though | ||
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Zaros
United Kingdom3692 Posts
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CicadaSC
United States1628 Posts
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Vindicare605
United States16056 Posts
I just won't have the same desire to turn it on no matter who is playing anymore. If it's a group or a match up I don't want to see, if Tastetosis isn't there to make my night then I'll probably just turn the stream off. I'll give it an effort. But I just don't see it being the same. | ||
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catplanetcatplanet
3829 Posts
 at the very least I don't see myself waking up to watch matches live very much without Tastosis. I'll probably still seek out highlights but without them casting I feel much less incentive to risk sitting through a tepid set of matches | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15925 Posts
On October 19 2022 06:05 catplanetcatplanet wrote: Quite a bit less I think at the very least I don't see myself waking up to watch matches live very much without Tastosis. I'll probably still seek out highlights but without them casting I feel much less incentive to risk sitting through a tepid set of matchesSame, especially the lower level matches like for example Keen vs Armani (or similar) I honestly only watched because of Tastosis | ||
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Blargh
United States2102 Posts
At first I'm not sure it'd decrease much. I suppose it depends on who takes their place. But I can see it going down over time if the cast quality went down substantially. Sort of like how I often wait for the Tastosis recasts of ASL. Plus I can just watch whenever and not worry about watching live, like I often do with GSL. | ||
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Haku
Germany550 Posts
On October 18 2022 23:33 BisuDagger wrote: Been watching (Korean) Starcraft for 15+ years. There's nothing that will change that. If they do anything like they are doing with Brood War, then I'll be watching them a lot less. I'm happy that the duo still casts Brood War, but because of the delay in released vods, I'm unable to stay unspoiled from results for that long. If they do that with SC2, then I'll unfortunately be unable to watch them. Nothing will ever capture the magic of these two guys, so if an independent stream pops up, it will need to be immensely analytical. It's a huge reason why Scan and Nyoken are doing so well given the competition. Hard agree! | ||
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Captain Peabody
United States3099 Posts
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AirbladeOrange
United States2573 Posts
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moonsjde
48 Posts
state brought a lot of fresh life to the broadcast. if GSL continues ill be happy to see more of him. despite the fact that people worship tastosis out of nostalgia i think there's better out there | ||
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Beelzebub1
1004 Posts
Absolutely nothing but love for Artosis, he's got a wife and kids and you gotta do whats best for you and your family. Not everybody can be a sexy chunky bachelor forever like Tasteless. | ||
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Drahkn
190 Posts
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swarminfestor
Malaysia2449 Posts
On October 19 2022 10:51 Beelzebub1 wrote: Not much if at all, I think State is pretty tolerable with Tasteless and he'll probably just get better with time. The games are what matters to me more then the casters, obviously Tasteosis is untouchable but hey, I'm not going to stop watching high level Starcraft just because of one caster lol I mean, Starcraft is just too good for that. Absolutely nothing but love for Artosis, he's got a wife and kids and you gotta do whats best for you and your family. Not everybody can be a sexy chunky bachelor forever like Tasteless. The problem is Tasteless doesn't want to pair with anyone else except Artosis for the future project. I guess letting foreign talents to pair with State is tolerable but it depends whether they want to stay in Korea for at least one or two years ahead. Thinking Nate because he has good humour and may be suitable to replace Tasteless. Another one is ZG, | ||
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Kitai
United States873 Posts
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xsnac
Barbados1365 Posts
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112StaminaX
37 Posts
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SharkStarcraft
Austria2225 Posts
On October 19 2022 17:52 xsnac wrote: never liked artosis cast. he never played the game except maybe on the beta of wol. never had anything smart to say that I did not know apriori. that being said, I will miss tasteless, which even if he was not playing the game either (how do ppl end up casting top tournaments when they never play the game?), I always enjoyed listening to him. Artosis and to a lesser degree Tasteless literally competed at close to the highest level at the beginning of SC2 and at least Artosis remained incredibly knowledgeable about the game up to this date. He is the best analytical sc2 caster by far and this is pretty much commonly agreed upon so I really have to idea WTF you are talking about. Both would woop yo a$$ in a ladder match lmao. Tasteless lost his edge on game knowledge a while ago I'll agree but he's mostly there for the play-by-play and his personality anyway and most people are fine with this too. GOAT casting duo in esports history peroid sorry | ||
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lechatnoir
386 Posts
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True_Spike
Poland3421 Posts
On October 19 2022 18:57 lechatnoir wrote: I'll watch GSL whoever commentates (in English) but I'll certainly miss Tastosis if they can't find an arrangement. Same for me. I'll keep on watching it as long as the game is interesting to me. | ||
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t5Fab
183 Posts
However, Stateless was not bad at all either, fresh and more enthusiastic to my ears. On October 19 2022 18:39 SharkStarcraft wrote: Artosis remained incredibly knowledgeable about the game up to this date. He is the best analytical sc2 caster by far and this is pretty much commonly agreed upon so I really have to idea WTF you are talking about. Both would woop yo a$$ in a ladder match lmao. Simply not true. Even if we don't want to put Lambo and Harstem in the batch (which are definitely the top ones as analytical), I think Rotterdam is the best in analytical, PiG is also pretty good the few times he casts still. Anyway all of them surpass Artosis by a big amount. The number of wrong calls in GSL are super high. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States44255 Posts
On October 19 2022 17:52 xsnac wrote: never liked artosis cast. he never played the game except maybe on the beta of wol. never had anything smart to say that I did not know apriori. that being said, I will miss tasteless, which even if he was not playing the game either (how do ppl end up casting top tournaments when they never play the game?), I always enjoyed listening to him. You're wrong about Artosis and Tasteless not playing the game, which is probably why you're confused at why they're allowed to cast top tournaments. Anyways, I always appreciated Artosis's commentary and analysis, and he + Tasteless will always be my favorite casting archon. I'm glad to hear they'll continue to do projects together, and Tasteless is super versatile so I'm confident that he'll mesh well with just about any other caster (I'm being reminded of Day[9] Daily #100, where Day[9] talked about how Tasteless seamlessly took the "supporting" role of secondary commentator for his first cast ever, after losing in a BW tournament, even though the other caster didn't actually know what was going on). I'm excited to see who'll be working with Tasteless next! | ||
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Pentarp
219 Posts
The loss of Tastosis charisma will impact potential new audience - not that it's saying much at this point. | ||
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Whatson
United States5356 Posts
I also liked NoRegret's casting at times, especially when it came to Zerg matchups | ||
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ApatheticSchizoid
Canada85 Posts
I haven't watched gsl since then. I'd usually watch the finals of a season at least, but after I came back and the ladder was dead just killed my desire to watch it. | ||
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Fanatic-Templar
Canada5819 Posts
I may be alone in this, but I think Artosis and Tasteless together were actually less enjoyable than apart, at least in the last few years. Like, imagine a television series on its twelfth season. I don't know that I'd say that they're worse than they were in 2010, I think I'm just too familiar with their material by now. | ||
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meou2321
11 Posts
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xsnac
Barbados1365 Posts
On October 19 2022 18:39 SharkStarcraft wrote: Artosis and to a lesser degree Tasteless literally competed at close to the highest level at the beginning of SC2 and at least Artosis remained incredibly knowledgeable about the game up to this date. He is the best analytical sc2 caster by far and this is pretty much commonly agreed upon so I really have to idea WTF you are talking about. Both would woop yo a$$ in a ladder match lmao. Tasteless lost his edge on game knowledge a while ago I'll agree but he's mostly there for the play-by-play and his personality anyway and most people are fine with this too. GOAT casting duo in esports history peroid sorry link an account then. I stand by what I say, artosis is clueless about the game because he never plays it. also, hello we talk about sc2. edit: link artosis ladder account and we shall see how good he was/is. | ||
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WGT-Baal
France3357 Posts
Same boat, Korean casts all the time, every time. The raw passion is just hard to replicate plus I also grew up with it before english casts were a thing, the ogn and then gom casts at 5am at university. (i am old...) They were however amazing at WCG and DH and clearly a loss to the scene, especially for younger folks. If they can't do as many casts from videos, transitioning to a day9 style series would be amazing. Or maybe like "game of the month" or something with analysis, interviews etc... | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15925 Posts
On October 20 2022 22:42 xsnac wrote: link an account then. I stand by what I say, artosis is clueless about the game because he never plays it. also, hello we talk about sc2. edit: link artosis ladder account and we shall see how good he was/is. Well, he literally played in the first season of GSL | ||
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Zambrah
United States7291 Posts
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AirbladeOrange
United States2573 Posts
On October 21 2022 00:17 Charoisaur wrote: Well, he literally played in the first season of GSL https://youtu.be/qYYGC2HET0w That was 12 years ago. I'm under the impression he basically stopped playing SC2 a while ago, let alone maintaining a high degree of skill. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15925 Posts
On October 21 2022 03:01 AirbladeOrange wrote: That was 12 years ago. I'm under the impression he basically stopped playing SC2 a while ago, let alone maintaining a high degree of skill. Yes he did, nobody said he maintained a high skill level, the claim was just that he competed at close to the highest level at the start of WoL. Although I remember there was a caster tournament a few years back (maybe 2016-17?) and Artosis was one of the best in it, on a level with Rotterdam and ToD. edit:  EsportsEarnings Casters Invitational here it is. Maybe not on a level with ToD but he definitely still was very good in 2017 | ||
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moonsjde
48 Posts
while i don't like everything about artosis, he did maintain a good understanding of build interactions for a non pro player, so that part of his casting i always did like, and i don't really care what his MMR would be as long as he doesn't sound clueless. he was wrong/behind the times sometimes but i never thought he sounded totally lost | ||
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xsnac
Barbados1365 Posts
On October 21 2022 03:07 Charoisaur wrote: Yes he did, nobody said he maintained a high skill level, the claim was just that he competed at close to the highest level at the start of WoL. Although I remember there was a caster tournament a few years back (maybe 2016-17?) and Artosis was one of the best in it, on a level with Rotterdam and ToD. edit: EsportsEarnings Casters Invitational here it is. Maybe not on a level with ToD but he definitely still was very good in 2017 Again, don't wanna go too much off-topic here, but let us view this on a more critical note, Rotterdam that nowadays is GM and all the drill, but back then, aligulac says he was horse-shit (around 800 back then, now is 1800): http://aligulac.com/players/635-RotterdaM/ Again, in the quoted tournament, which is again meaningless without having artosis ladder account we can't make a claim, but based just on 1 tournament, he was around 800 rating (making it in the semi's just like rotty). We maybe should ask rotty his game knowledge with 800 aligulac rating and his gaming knowledge with 1800 rating. I doubt he will hide the truth. I would ask you, if he was playing the game why not post his account? What is there to hide? | ||
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Whatson
United States5356 Posts
On October 21 2022 05:01 xsnac wrote: Again, don't wanna go too much off-topic here, but let us view this on a more critical note, Rotterdam that nowadays is GM and all the drill, but back then, aligulac says he was horse-shit (around 800 back then, now is 1800): http://aligulac.com/players/635-RotterdaM/ Again, in the quoted tournament, which is again meaningless without having artosis ladder account we can't make a claim, but based just on 1 tournament, he was around 800 rating (making it in the semi's just like rotty). We maybe should ask rotty his game knowledge with 800 aligulac rating and his gaming knowledge with 1800 rating. I doubt he will hide the truth. I would ask you, if he was playing the game why not post his account? What is there to hide? You're all over the place. What are you trying to argue? That Artosis was never good at the game, that he wasn't good at the game in 2016/2017, or that he isn't good at the game now? Also, are we basing how good somebody is strictly on ladder points? | ||
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Poopi
France12793 Posts
On October 21 2022 05:01 xsnac wrote: Again, don't wanna go too much off-topic here, but let us view this on a more critical note, Rotterdam that nowadays is GM and all the drill, but back then, aligulac says he was horse-shit (around 800 back then, now is 1800): http://aligulac.com/players/635-RotterdaM/ Again, in the quoted tournament, which is again meaningless without having artosis ladder account we can't make a claim, but based just on 1 tournament, he was around 800 rating (making it in the semi's just like rotty). We maybe should ask rotty his game knowledge with 800 aligulac rating and his gaming knowledge with 1800 rating. I doubt he will hide the truth. I would ask you, if he was playing the game why not post his account? What is there to hide? Aligulac rating is a bit useless for inactive players though? If you don’t play enough games the algorithm does not have time to adjust. Back then some players were high/ top masters and a few casters were low GM level, notably ToD, Rotti, YoGo. I was impressed back then at how decent Artosis / Tasteless were without much practice, so even without actively playing sc2 since a few years, they have decent knowledge. Their main issue is that they don’t really have time (because of work, timezone, lack of interest, idk) to watch a lot of international tournaments, so they are sometimes behind in the meta or will say « wow we have never seen this » despite the build being played at a big tournament three days ago or something. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15925 Posts
On October 21 2022 05:01 xsnac wrote: Again, don't wanna go too much off-topic here, but let us view this on a more critical note, Rotterdam that nowadays is GM and all the drill, but back then, aligulac says he was horse-shit (around 800 back then, now is 1800): http://aligulac.com/players/635-RotterdaM/ Again, in the quoted tournament, which is again meaningless without having artosis ladder account we can't make a claim, but based just on 1 tournament, he was around 800 rating (making it in the semi's just like rotty). We maybe should ask rotty his game knowledge with 800 aligulac rating and his gaming knowledge with 1800 rating. I doubt he will hide the truth. I would ask you, if he was playing the game why not post his account? What is there to hide? I'm not acting like Artosis nowadays is a super high-level player but your claim was that he literally never played the game except in WoL beta which is clearly wrong as I proved. At the start of sc2 he was competing near the highest level and he still was at a fairly respectable level in 2017. | ||
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Kullosus1
1 Post
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25090 Posts
I thought Artosis and Scan/Special were also good combos and a little different in terms of blend in a good sense, something a little different. I’m way more concerned about the tournament itself. I know I’ve missed some good games, I’ve been busier than I would otherwise have been, but it’s really the increasing clear lack of top, top players duking it out and in shape that’s my biggest concern. Rag making the final two, even just one year ago is like wow great story, amazing, what a run! This time it feels more like some good shows and some decent bracket luck | ||
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DivinesiaTV
Finland58 Posts
Perhaps some of the korean players could join if they want to? For example Solar speaks rather fluent english. Add his game knowledge and Tasteless epicness and we do well. Perhaps you could invite some english casters there here and then? To my surprise Ive shared conversations with couple of people who actually said they stopped watching GSL as Artosis and Tasteless werent on top of the meta of sc2 anymore and it showed in some calls of inside the game. Never been too much of a problem to me though, Tastosis have been legendarily fun always. Not saying Artosis can be replaced, but we can still head up for something different and epic. | ||
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ApatheticSchizoid
Canada85 Posts
On October 20 2022 10:13 Fanatic-Templar wrote: No change from me, if they keep broadcasting I'll keep watching. I may be alone in this, but I think Artosis and Tasteless together were actually less enjoyable than apart, at least in the last few years. Like, imagine a television series on its twelfth season. I don't know that I'd say that they're worse than they were in 2010, I think I'm just too familiar with their material by now. I always thought the same. Even though they have been friends most of their life and casting together, I always felt they had no chemistry with each other as casters. They constantly talked over each other usually over non relevant off topic conversations while they ignored the game. It's probably due to their friendship that it's like that, but as casters it just didn't work for me. They are both mostly color commentators. Tasteless being one more so then artosis, but I felt like it always lacked a really in-depth commentary that could actually follow the game instead of just saying 'woah' whenever something really technical happened. | ||
Liquid`Ret
Netherlands4511 Posts
On October 21 2022 05:01 xsnac wrote: Again, don't wanna go too much off-topic here, but let us view this on a more critical note, Rotterdam that nowadays is GM and all the drill, but back then, aligulac says he was horse-shit (around 800 back then, now is 1800): http://aligulac.com/players/635-RotterdaM/ Again, in the quoted tournament, which is again meaningless without having artosis ladder account we can't make a claim, but based just on 1 tournament, he was around 800 rating (making it in the semi's just like rotty). We maybe should ask rotty his game knowledge with 800 aligulac rating and his gaming knowledge with 1800 rating. I doubt he will hide the truth. I would ask you, if he was playing the game why not post his account? What is there to hide? Rotterdam in 2017 had hit 6k mmr. I'm sure he has gotten better over time but I think relative to the rest of the player base, his level is probably roughly the same. 6k mmr was pretty good back then. Realistically Artosis could play sc2 at any time he wants for 2 weeks and hit at least gm. How far he can get in gm depends on how much time he wants to invest. He has a base level of skills obtained over years of playing sc2 & bw that would allow him to accomplish a decent rating pretty quickly. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25090 Posts
That’s playing the game at a high level. You can understand how the game works at a pretty damn high level, but not be able to remotely execute it yourself. It’s not a new game either, we’ve 10 years of in some cases a ton of watching and calling games. Outside of real technical build optimisations etc, and discounting actual newbies to the scene I don’t think you’d see a great amount of correlation in increased predictive ability moving up from non-active/lower level players and high level ones Certainly not always, but competitive, really active players do tend to develop certain biases regarding their race of choice more so than somebody who’s dipping their toes in but is primarily a caster | ||
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Agh
United States936 Posts
Only other person to really fit that mold was day9. Artosis casts never really added any value for me for gsl. Not that he was detracting, but I actually thought State did a better job in terms of analysis and what he brought. I still watch both him and tasteless stream from time to time but as far as casting and gsl is concerned it won't effect my viewing habits at all. | ||
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washikie
United States752 Posts
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argonautdice
Canada2718 Posts
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Drfilip
Sweden590 Posts
The slow pace of GSL is what allows me to watch the games unspoiled while also check in on this site. But I am also happy to see some change in the GSL casting. The intermittent guest casters have always done something to the cast. Some people mixed well, like NoRegret and State, and I believe that they will restore some of the older expert commentary if they get the chance. As is, they are selectively knowledgeable. State especially got way better at game analysis the second go he had. The first one seemed mostly like genuine interest of learning more - something Tastosis lost long ago. Tastosis are working with broad platitudes while the guests have been concrete and detailed. Artosis used to do. He transitioned into Tasteless old habits while Tasteless went even further into the "commentator, not the expert" role. Most sport commentary I encounter have 1 general commentator and 1 expert that knows the details. I always - not using a hyperbole here, I mean always - enjoy it way more when the expert simplifies and explains the intricacies. I can watch roller derby, curling, 3,000 metre hurdles... It is the expert that makes it interesting while the other commentator acts as an intermediate between the three other thing: the sport, the expert, and the audience. GSL needs an expert again. They have been without for a few years now. Clarification: an expert doesn't need to play the game. Their knowledge is not mechanical skill and speed. It is builds, choices, statistics and other such things. They can get that skill by talking to players and coaches, and by analysing games. They collect knowledge and share it with the viewers. | ||
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goody153
44115 Posts
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Riner1212
United States337 Posts
at the moment the only two players in GSL that are considered to be top dogs are maru and dark, apart from that no one else particularly stands out. | ||
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Ciaus_Dronu
South Africa1848 Posts
But, to be honest, I really like having people like State who have a bit more professional perspective and feel for where the game is at and what the players are doing. I think if the next casting duo is decent, particularly if they can get a former pro or someone very knowledgeable like that, I'll still be watching all the GSL available. | ||
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tigemo1
4 Posts
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SHODAN
United Kingdom1074 Posts
I hope that the new casting duo can offer the same comedy as Tastosis. it'll probably take some time to find the chemistry, but I'm sure they'll get there eventually tbh, I'm not bothered about GSL having an "expert" co-commentator who knows the metagame inside-out to an exacting degree. it's unnecessary. Arty had gaps in his knowledge and got confused at times, and I liked it. the metagame would reveal itself to him in GSL and he'd try and make sense of it in his entertaining style. this helped make every GSL cast seem fresh and colourful to me do we really need a commentator who watches every match of every ESL weekly cup to offer quality analysis of a 12 year old game?? no I don't think so. far more important is the co-commentator's sense of humour. sc2 can be very boring to watch if you take it too seriously statistics, trifling details, build order variations and infinitesimal intricacies of macromanagement......... *snore* let the grandmasters figure that stuff out by themselves if they want to. I prefer to hear about the bigger picture, which is what Artosis did so well. it's the observer's job to show those tiny details on screen, not the commentator's job to fixate and waffle on about them at maximum volume. Tastosis were the class clowns of GSL and that's what made it awesome. | ||
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figq
12519 Posts
Also, here are two photos of the place he's going to be raising his kids in now - which looks like straight out of a fairy tale. + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/q3k6qXR.jpg) ![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/YZ9Qxgb.jpg) | ||
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GauntletWizard
3 Posts
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tlnetuser108
83 Posts
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NoobSkills
United States1598 Posts
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SuperFanBoy
New Zealand1068 Posts
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